Wall said:

And it's been years since I've seen it, but Return of the Jedi was as big a piece of shit as the Phantom Menance.

Dude, you cray cray.

Skywalker, I'm getting shit from other orgers who don't want to see this thread on the top of the list anymore. Please Private message me and I will be more then happy to continue spanking you on all debatable star warts subjects

Wildboy, I've only read an 1/8th of this shitty thread, but Skywalker schooled you back on page 1 and you've been looking for a ride home ever since. You might just wanna pack it in and call it day, buddy. Either you're the worst troll on the internet or in dire need of a life.

And Return of the Jedi was boring as hell, even when I saw it at 8 years old I was rolling my eyes at the laughable puppets and Ewoks. Even without having seen 2 or 3, I'll put the dialogue between Han Solo and Princess Leia in Jedi against anything in the prequels.

even tho the prequels made billions they were definately a failure ..

A FAILURE OF HUMANITY

of all the starving diseased war ravaged things to spend money on .. and this crap fest made billions .. yay

it should at least be a good movie .. but no .. a complete and utter failure of humanity to be worthwhile in its existance

empire strikes back on the other hand is pure redemption .. by far the best of the saga ..

the fact is ... i am pretty sure that both prince and george lucas are aliens .. they just both don't look human .. search your feelings you know it is true .. wendy? .. yes lisa .. does that mean everything prince and lucas sing and write about is true too? .. yes lisa ... shall we begin?

Wildboy said:

Wall said:

And it's been years since I've seen it, but Return of the Jedi was as big a piece of shit as the Phantom Menance.

Dude, you cray cray.

Skywalker, I'm getting shit from other orgers who don't want to see this thread on the top of the list anymore. Please Private message me and I will be more then happy to continue spanking you on all debatable star warts subjects

Wildboy, if other orgers have a problem with it, they know where the mods are. You thought someone with my avatar/user name wouldn't nerd it up for pages on a George Lucas thread?

You wanna tap out to me on the public thread. That's fine. Please answer the Empire Strikes Back questions first. In case you missed it:

Why did Empire, with the enormous marketing behind it, only make approx half of the original Star Wars? Why did it not receive similar critical acclaim, or awards/nominations? You use these as criteria for your harsh judgment of the prequels, yet you give Empire Strikes Back a free pass? Why?

TrevorAyer said:

even tho the prequels made billions they were definately a failure ..

A FAILURE OF HUMANITY

of all the starving diseased war ravaged things to spend money on .. and this crap fest made billions .. yay

it should at least be a good movie .. but no .. a complete and utter failure of humanity to be worthwhile in its existance

empire strikes back on the other hand is pure redemption .. by far the best of the saga ..

the fact is ... i am pretty sure that both prince and george lucas are aliens .. they just both don't look human .. search your feelings you know it is true .. wendy? .. yes lisa .. does that mean everything prince and lucas sing and write about is true too? .. yes lisa ... shall we begin?

My friend pointed out to me that Prince looks like a giraffe (especially the eyes). It is scarily true. She may have wrecked Prince and giraffes for me.

Skywalker, I'll tap you out ANYTIME bro.

And the truth comes out, EGO. You want to 'Beat me" this has nothing to do with what's right or wrong. Also, answered the Empire thing ages ago.

By your own words the Preuels were popular because people went to see them. Well, as many people went to see empire as went to see Aotc and RotS, so by your own logic that movie was a hit twice as big as those movies BAM

People on other threads are making noise. PM me if you wanna talk star wars

Wildboy said:

Skywalker, I'll tap you out ANYTIME bro.

And the truth comes out, EGO. You want to 'Beat me" this has nothing to do with what's right or wrong. Also, answered the Empire thing ages ago.

This was not about beating you. This was a chance to be nerdy about Star Wars at prince.org

I was just debating you on your bullshit.

Like when you were border line abusive in talking about (your own?) students/kids that preferred The Prequels.

Wildboy said:

to be honest, the kids who are sort of stupid (love to hear themselves talk, drink lots of mountain dew, drown their hotdogs in WAY too much ketchup) are always the ones who love phantom menace, they kids who excell in school and sports usually perfer the Original Trilogy, sort of speaks for itself.

Nobody went to see episode 1 twice in a row.

Or at least no one who doesn't suffer from boarder line retardation.

Or when you offered up wonderfully detailed critiques of movies you claimed never to have seen.

Wildboy said:

(Phantom Menace) is the only one I've seen in (it's entirety).

Wildboy said:

Episode 3 dark? The stuff on the walls in Jabba's palace is darker then anything in Ep3. Yeah, it was really dark when Vader said "NNOOOOOOOO!!" ha ha ah ha That was what was SOOO wrong with the movie, it was supposed to be all dark and bad ass but Vader came off as a whining Pansy. That movie is such a piece of shit.

Now you don't want to discuss anymore. Cool with me.

Say, did you ever find out if I was, in fact, tampering with wikipedia to help my claim that Empire Strikes Back received mixed reviews? Or did you just believe me once I posted examples of actual mixed reviews?

[Edited 5/23/12 14:51pm]

I want to discuss this, just not as the top thread of a Prince site. I'll PM you when I'm not at work, but I won't be responding to this thread anymore

Wildboy said:

I want to discuss this, just not as the top thread of a Prince site. I'll PM you when I'm not at work, but I won't be responding to this thread anymore

Cool. Please do.

Bump

Wall said:

Bump

Well played.

For the record, I saw each of those prequels in the theatre at least three times. Because they're the best movies ever? Nope! But because they're fun to watch, and because that kind of spectacle and adventure is what I go out to the movies for! For that kind of money, I want giant monsters and spaceships and shit. I can watch Black Swan quite happily at home in the dark, tyvm.

I wonder what Prince thought of them.

skywalker said:

I know that there is a huge portion of the population (maybe a larger portion on the internet) that thinks the prequels severely pale in comparison to the originals. My argument is (and has been) that there is also a large portion of the population that loves the prequels as well. It is too easy just to say the movies were shit and that no one liked them. The box office numbers clearly indicate otherwise. Movies don't have the box office numbers that the prequels did, if someone wasn't into them. In my experience, many people don't draw a huge line of distinction between the two trilogies.

As I have said, it has also been my experience that many younger people prefer the prequels....a fact that is much to my chagrin. I am a teacher, and I find myself constantly on the opposite end of this discussion with them. When it comes to my students and the Star Wars movies they grew up with, I am often having to defend the original trilogy.

You mistake me. I am not trying to show/prove what the masses think. I know what popular opinion is on Prince and Star Wars. I am just saying that popular opinion doesn't equate to actual quality.

Do you think Prince's most popular album is his best? You think the movie that won best picture, or made the most at the box office is, in fact, the one of best quality?

You're being sneaky again. Just looking at the Prince thing, you've completely misrepresented the dispute. The dispute was not about whether Prince's new music was as good as his 80s stuff - that's a matter of opinion. The dispute was about whether his new stuff was as respected (and popular) as his 80s stuff, and that is not a matter of opinion - that's a matter of objective fact. It's a FACT that most people think the 80s were his golden years. That means critics, fans, peers, former associates, the whole lot. You were refusing to accept that this was true. I think it's very telling that you've had to misrepresent the substance of that dispute.

As for the prequels it's also dishonest to pretend that there is anything like an even split on popular opinion there. You keep saying the box office figures "prove" that people loved them, but they do no such thing. The box office figures tell you that people went into the theaters; they tell you nothing about what they thought after they left. For that you have to use your nose, and the stench of negative comment on those films - both on the street and in the media - was so overwhelming that one has to question the self-awareness of anyone who would deny it.

You yourself admitted under pressure that the prequels were less respected than the original trilogy, but after that brief slip into honesty you've reverted back into denial. Why don't you tell us why you think they're less respected? If you did that then this conversation might actually go somewhere.

midnightmover said:

skywalker said:

I know that there is a huge portion of the population (maybe a larger portion on the internet) that thinks the prequels severely pale in comparison to the originals. My argument is (and has been) that there is also a large portion of the population that loves the prequels as well. It is too easy just to say the movies were shit and that no one liked them. The box office numbers clearly indicate otherwise. Movies don't have the box office numbers that the prequels did, if someone wasn't into them. In my experience, many people don't draw a huge line of distinction between the two trilogies.

As I have said, it has also been my experience that many younger people prefer the prequels....a fact that is much to my chagrin. I am a teacher, and I find myself constantly on the opposite end of this discussion with them. When it comes to my students and the Star Wars movies they grew up with, I am often having to defend the original trilogy.

You mistake me. I am not trying to show/prove what the masses think. I know what popular opinion is on Prince and Star Wars. I am just saying that popular opinion doesn't equate to actual quality.

Do you think Prince's most popular album is his best? You think the movie that won best picture, or made the most at the box office is, in fact, the one of best quality?

You're being sneaky again. Just looking at the Prince thing, you've completely misrepresented the dispute. The dispute was not about whether Prince's new music was as good as his 80s stuff - that's a matter of opinion. The dispute was about whether his new stuff was as respected (and popular) as his 80s stuff, and that is not a matter of opinion - that's a matter of objective fact. It's a FACT that most people think the 80s were his golden years. That means critics, fans, peers, former associates, the whole lot. You were refusing to accept that this was true. I think it's very telling that you've had to misrepresent the substance of that dispute.

Wait a minute. Reread my original comments that I bolded. Not sure how I misrepresented the dispute. I know the masses think the 80's were Prince's golden era. As I said, I know what popular opinion is on Prince and Star Wars. I just think it's too easy to buy into group think mentality and accept popular opinion as fact.

As I said, a popular opinion is that Purple Rain is Prince's best album/song. I bet you don't think this is true.

A popular opinion is that the prequels are horrible. You just accept it? Wildboy on this thread admitted that he hadn't even seen 2 of the 3 Star Wars prequels and that he was mostly basing his strong opinion simply what "he had heard".

Do you think that's a good way for people to make judgments or informed decisions?

As for the prequels it's also dishonest to pretend that there is anything like an even split on popular opinion there. You keep saying the box office figures "prove" that people loved them, but they do no such thing. The box office figures tell you that people went into the theaters; they tell you nothing about what they thought after they left. For that you have to use your nose, and the stench of negative comment on those films - both on the street and in the media - was so overwhelming that one has to question the self-awareness of anyone who would deny it.

The main reason that I point to box office numbers is because universally hated movies don't do the kind of business that the prequels did at the box office. I have acknowledged that the prequels aren't as universally loved or as respected as the originals. My intent is to show that they aren't universally hated either. Again, movies that are nothing but despised don't have the kind of box office that Star Wars prequels had. It just makes no sense for people to keep seeing them or paying money for each subsequent film. There are many that don't draw a line of distinction between the two.

You yourself admitted under pressure that the prequels were less respected than the original trilogy, but after that brief slip into honesty you've reverted back into denial. Why don't you tell us why you think they're less respected? If you did that then this conversation might actually go somewhere.

I think they are less respected because

A. The target audience that grew up on the originals (in the theaters/or on VHS) in their youth had grown up. The prequels (maybe mistakenly) weren't catered to the them as much as they were to a newer generation of kids.

B. They delved more into Star Wars mythos that many people didn't care to delve into (demystification of mysterious characters and the demysitfication of mysterious worlds and events).

C. They lacked a Han Solo archetype that could give some levity and humanity and wise ass commentary to all the Jedi/Sith Republic/Empire mythology.

D. There was too long of a gap between trilogies. The expectations built up over the years were too varied/high. The movies were always going to have a rough go living up to 20 years of fanboy anticipation.

E. They were not the first. Roger Ebert has a quote about this in his review of The Phantom Menace, and I really think it is on point:

"If it were the first "Star Wars" movie, "The Phantom Menace" would be hailed as a visionary breakthrough. But this is the fourth movie of the famous series, and we think we know the territory; many of the early reviews have been blase, paying lip service to the visuals and wondering why the characters aren't better developed. How quickly do we grow accustomed to wonders. I am reminded of the Isaac Asimov story "Nightfall," about the planet where the stars were visible only once in a thousand years. So awesome was the sight that it drove men mad. We who can see the stars every night glance up casually at the cosmos and then quickly down again, searching for a Dairy Queen."

[Edited 5/24/12 9:17am]

Universally hated sums things up.

Now DROP this thread and let it die. This is a Prince forum for god sake.

I'm sure I had a million and one terrible things to say about the Phantom Menace when it was out, but people have definitely spun its initial reception.

I saw it in London and had to buy tickets for a show that was like 8 hours later then I wanted because people were so mental for tickets. And when it was over, people applauded, which still baffles me. Not just because it was a Star Wars movie, I don't get why people do that for films.

Phantom Menace also has the best lightsaber duel from the 4 I've seen. Liam Neeson was pretty good in it too.

And re: the kids argument, my shitty nephews are mad for Star Wars, especially the new films, which quite frankly, is a reason I've never bothered to see 2 and 3. They're for kids.

Wildboy said:

I won't be responding to this thread anymore

What happened?

[Edited 5/24/12 8:54am]

Wildboy said:

Universally hated sums things up.

Now DROP this thread and let it die. This is a Prince forum for god sake.

Says the person who was only going to PM me.

1. liam neisen is crap .. eg. see battleship .. he should not be allowed in movies EVER!!!

2. popular opinion was that the new star wars movies were good except so many people thought it sucked that popular opinion is now that they suck .. but this opinion is based upon thought and opinions changing .. not on a twitter trend or anything instant and utterly irrelivant .. like advertising .. which is what made the prequels fake popular in the first place .. even babies are turning this turd off .. we as humanity have evolved to the point where even children can't stomach jar jar and qui gone

3. purple rain is a fucking great record .. it is perfectly valid to think its prince best or close to it .. prequels are not even watchable .. they are that bad .. even as mindless entertainment .. studies and polls have shown that people who watch the prequels get dumber by the minute

4. i have personally seen all the movies several times in theatre and out .. wildboy would have more cred if he actually watched the movies but fortunately for him, he is still right .. even if its a lucky guess .. or maybe his shit detector is just that good

5. people who don't like this thread can read something else .. this thread is far more interesting than most of the other prince threads .. if people are complaining go post on the "c" word thread or list your favorite prince songs or something like that .. there are plenty of threads here for everyone .. prince and george wouldn't stop when the public told them to .. so why should we .. this thread is grade a rainbowprince and prequelucas level genius here .. this thread is too big to fail .. this thread is for the fans and if you don't like it, its because you are stuck in the 80's and feeling nostalgic for the ole prince org days when the music was good enough to bother talking about

[Edited 5/24/12 9:23am]

TrevorAyer said:

1. liam neisen is crap .. eg. see battleship .. he should not be allowed in movies EVER!!!

Wow. What else is there to say? Not even Schindler's List?

2. popular opinion was that the new star wars movies were good except so many people thought it sucked that popular opinion is now that they suck .. but this opinion is based upon thought and opinions changing .. not on a twitter trend or anything instant and utterly irrelivant .. like advertising .. which is what made the prequels fake popular in the first place .. even babies are turning this turd off .. we as humanity have evolved to the point where even children can't stomach jar jar and qui gone

3. purple rain is a fucking great record .. it is perfectly valid to think its prince best or close to it .. prequels are not even watchable .. they are that bad .. even as mindless entertainment .. studies and polls have shown that people who watch the prequels get dumber by the minute

4. i have personally seen all the movies several times in theatre and out .. wildboy would have more cred if he actually watched the movies but fortunately for him, he is still right .. even if its a lucky guess .. or maybe his shit detector is just that good

You say: "prequels are not even watchable .. they are that bad .. even as mindless entertainment .. studies and polls have shown that people who watch the prequels get dumber by the minute"

yet you "have seen all of the movies several times in the theatre and out." What? Why?

5. people who don't like this thread can read something else .. this thread is far more interesting than most of the other prince threads .. if people are complaining go post on the "c" word thread or list your favorite prince songs or something like that .. there are plenty of threads here for everyone .. prince and george wouldn't stop when the public told them to .. so why should we .. this thread is grade a rainbowprince and prequelucas level genius here .. this thread is too big to fail .. this thread is for the fans and if you don't like it, its because you are stuck in the 80's and feeling nostalgic ..

Agreed. I am sorry that I am majorly contributing to a giant thread if people hate it. That said, this is what the forums are for. No?

[Edited 5/24/12 9:31am]

I thought Neeson and Ewan McGregor were great. Of course I've not seen the Phantom Menace since it was released. The Emperor also gives a good performance. I'd wager ultimately the acting in the prequels is on par with the originals. As I already noted, even as a kid I cringed watching Han Solo and Princess Leia. And Luke Skywaler is just barely likeable, mainly because Mark Hamill sucks as an actor. And wasn't Sir Alec Guiness completely embarrassed by the films?

I'd say you're right on popular opinion, which was my point--when the Phantom Menace was out, people were mental for it, as Skywalker noted, look at its box-office, but popular opinion has now shifted. I'd wager there'll be a re-evaluation of the prequels in a decade or so. No doubt by the younger generation as they start throwing their worthless opinions around.

Wall said:

I thought Neeson and Ewan McGregor were great. Of course I've not seen the Phantom Menace since it was released. The Emperor also gives a good performance. I'd wager ultimately the acting in the prequels is on par with the originals. As I already noted, even as a kid I cringed watching Han Solo and Princess Leia. And Luke Skywaler is just barely likeable, mainly because Mark Hamill sucks as an actor. And wasn't Sir Alec Guiness completely embarrassed by the films?

To me, McGregor owns the Prequels as Obi Wan. The Emperor is fucking great in the prequels too. Maybe the best. Especially in Episode 3. Although Luke Skywalker is my fav character...I didn't actually like Mark Hamill's acting much in the first film. I think he got better as the series went on.

I'd say you're right on popular opinion, which was my point--when the Phantom Menace was out, people were mental for it, as Skywalker noted, look at its box-office, but popular opinion has now shifted. I'd wager there'll be a re-evaluation of the prequels in a decade or so. No doubt by the younger generation as they start throwing their worthless opinions around.

I totally agree with the underlined part. When I was a kid, very few adults loved/respected the originals trilogy or would consider them much more than kid's films. Once my generation grew up (later 90's) is when the original Trilogy started being called "classics".

[Edited 5/24/12 9:41am]

skywalker said:

yet you "have seen all of the movies several times in the theatre and out." What? Why?

cuz i was hoping if i watched them again i might change my mind about how bad they are .. maybe i was hoping it would grow on me .. maybe i would find some secret element that makes it all worthwhile .. i have kids who i have watched them with .. lots of reasons to watch them again .. none of them resulted in me feeling any less dumbed down too

original trilogy was great as a sum of all the parts .. thats why hammil gets a slide

prequels parts dont add up to a good movie at all .. and yes emperor was probably the only character with any emotions in that whole movie .. except darth .. nooooooooooooooooo

thats the sound of darth being born and realizing how bad george fucked up the whole saga ... noooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo

repeated watches do not equal quality movie .. just like repeatedly listens dont make that song laydown make anymore sense .. what the fuck is that song about anyway?

particularly this line

first of all saying everybody wants to be prince is like saying everybody loves the phantom menace .. nobody wants to wear bea arthurs golden disco suit or put out embarassing records for 20 years .. and nobody wants to sit thru phantom menace EVER AGAIN EVER!!!!!!

and what does surgery have to do with being funky on the guitar?

and even if there is some convoluted retarded explaination for his stupid fucking lyrics

they still suck

just like phantom menace still sucks .. NO MATTER HOW YOU DRESS IT UP WITH UR PRETTY COMPUTER PAINTS AND SHIT!!!

a movie is more than special effects and a star wars title

and a song is more than a beat and any ole lyrics

lets face it .. lucas and prince both turned art into comercial art

records and movies designed advertise toys and tshirts and concert tickets

why did lucas and prince make more "art" after it started being bad

is it all ego? i don't think either need the money

i think prince writes a new song just to try out new gear .. like auto tune .. not because he has a new song in him

lucas makes movies just to try out new gear .. not because he has a story in him to tell

The problem with men-children is they think those hammy old movies were more than dressed up b-films. They aren't. They're kids films. The puppets and stop motion in them is laughable. What's the big monster Luke fights in Jedi? That's another scene as a child that I just rolled my eyes at. It looked about as real as Prince's hair.

TrevorAyer said:

skywalker said:

yet you "have seen all of the movies several times in the theatre and out." What? Why?

cuz i was hoping if i watched them again i might change my mind about how bad they are .. maybe i was hoping it would grow on me .. maybe i would find some secret element that makes it all worthwhile .. i have kids who i have watched them with .. lots of reasons to watch them again .. none of them resulted in me feeling any less dumbed down too

original trilogy was great as a sum of all the parts .. thats why hammil gets a slide

prequels parts dont add up to a good movie at all .. and yes emperor was probably the only character with any emotions in that whole movie .. except darth .. nooooooooooooooooo

thats the sound of darth being born and realizing how bad george fucked up the whole saga ... noooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo

repeated watches do not equal quality movie .. just like repeatedly listens dont make that song laydown make anymore sense .. what the fuck is that song about anyway?

particularly this line

To say this name borders on blasphemy
Everybody wanna be me
If your girlfriend didn't have the surgery
Maybe she could see what I see

first of all saying everybody wants to be prince is like saying everybody loves the phantom menace .. nobody wants to wear bea arthurs golden disco suit or put out embarassing records for 20 years .. and nobody wants to sit thru phantom menace EVER AGAIN EVER!!!!!!

and what does surgery have to do with being funky on the guitar?

and even if there is some convoluted retarded explaination for his stupid fucking lyrics

they still suck

just like phantom menace still sucks .. NO MATTER HOW YOU DRESS IT UP WITH UR PRETTY COMPUTER PAINTS AND SHIT!!!

You don't like laydown and you don't want to sit through phantom menace ever again. I suppose if you subjected yourself to something you dislike over and over again you would start TYPING IN ALL CAPS!!!!!!

a movie is more than special effects and a star wars title

and a song is more than a beat and any ole lyrics

lets face it .. lucas and prince both turned art into comercial art

Star Wars was commercial from the get go. Prince's has been (various degrees of) commercial since at least Purple Rain.

records and movies designed advertise toys and tshirts and concert tickets

why did lucas and prince make more "art" after it started being bad

is it all ego? i don't think either need the money

i think prince writes a new song just to try out new gear .. like auto tune .. not because he has a new song in him

Maybe. I thought Prince stayed fairly traditional with his instruments/music gear.

lucas makes movies just to try out new gear ..

You might be right. However, this has always been the case with him.

no way .. star wars was an homage ..

kiddie film .. nah .. that film has references to almost every religion on the planet ..

the prequels especially are NOT made for kids .. they are so fucking boring and full of political dialog even an adult cant sit thru

much like the revolution put their heart and soul into purple rain .. numerous artists put their heart and soul in to star wars .. the result was ART

and yes the rancor effects blow .. return of jedi has some bad parts .. which is why its the least of the trilogy .. but the story is neccessary and important to the whole .. the prequels are not

Thought thread would dry up. Not happening so I'm throwing my hat back in the ring.

Wall,

Skywalker is delusional about the success and mass appeal of the prequel trilogy, but to say that the acting and dialog in the prequels is better, and to bash the Leia/Han script and performance....I just don't even know what to say... like, are you HIGH? Seriously, are you on Drugs? I mean, even Skywalker wouldn't make a claim that outlandish. The fact that you think Christianson and Portman bumbling their way through the prequels with zero chemistry and some of the worst love dialog put to film was better then the clever and subtle romance of Ford/Fisher makes you lose pretty much ALL credibility in any argument you make from this point on ever. That just blows my mind.

Also, the stop motion used for the Rancor was flawless and a throwback to Ray Harryhausen, and if you guys want to talk about someone who actually revolutionized the special effects industry, You literally CAN'T get any better then him.

Also, Skywalker still hasn't put up a defense for the Mariah Carey argument (and this is after i answered his half baked attacks a number of times) or the poor dvd vs VHS showing of the original trilogy vs the prequel trilogy (available to anyone who can GOOGLE Nilsen SoundScan)

TrevorA, my friend, there is one fatal flaw in your and my argument. We're are trying to use LOGIC and BASIC KNOWLEDGE in a debate against crazy, delusional people

No matter how many times you or I use common sense, or facts, or basic problem solving, Skywalker/JoeTyler/Wall will ignore us and come back with an even crazier statement then they did last time. Believe me, I figured this out the hard way. You can't use intelligent arguments with these people, they either don't care or won't let themselves see the truth. It's like you said, "Hamburgers taste better then rat piss" and then Skywalker says "I happen to LOVE rat piss! and that's YOUR OPINION that hamburgers are better!" there's no real arguing with that. Obviously hamburgers are better and everyone with a brain knows it, but you can't convince someone of even an obvious, basic truth if they intend upon sticking their heads in the sand like an ostrich.

TrevorA, do you think that me taking the time to watch the prequels would strengthen my argument? Or is it as much of a waste of time as I think it is?

[Edited 5/24/12 12:38pm]

Wildboy, I knew you wouldn't stick to your guns.

Anyway, I've not actually seen Episode 2 and 3, so I can't judge the acting in them, but from your frantic responses here, I'll wager they aren't that bad. Plus, Ewan McGregor is in them and he's always dynamite.

And I don't know what to tell you about Return of the Jedi other than when I saw it as a kid the puppets and stop motion were blatantly fake and took me out of the film. I don't care if Jesus Christ was in charge of the stop motion, it didn't fool me for a second. The only way I'd watch Return of the Jedi, or any Star Wars film is if I'm stuck somewhere and it's on. But you're easier to wind up than a pound toy with this stuff, so I'm gonna keep going.

As for the rest of your post, I didn't read it, so pardon me if I didn't bat back another one of your recycled points.

While I agree that betting on the acting prowess of both Ewan McGregor and Natalie Portman seems like a very safe bet. They have managed to turn in the WORST performance of both of their careers. In interviews, McGregor likened working in the Second two prequels to being stuck on a "sinking ship" and it shows with his sub par performance. I liked EM in almost every other film I've ever seen him in, and he usually lights up the screen (all this can be said for portman as well), but in this, there's no bang, they fizzle.