I would guess that if Prince is to release his vault material, he will do it in around 7-10 years time +. The reason being that by then he probably won't be touring as much or making as much new music.

It also means his music gets released in his lifetime, I bet he would rather do it in his lifetime, as otherwise WB will be the main beneficiaries and he won't want that.

I think at the moment he feels he still has a lot of juice in him and wants to 'save' the vault material for a time when he doesn't have so much raw energy...

I don't think he would want it left or bequethed to anyone as that would mean record companies or unknown relatives/3rd parties could exploit and profit from his work...he has seen that happen with James Brown and MJ's estate...

Anyway, just my 2 cents.....

[Edited 11/25/11 16:49pm]

totally agree. we want it now. but Prince knows it's better to wait it out for leaner times!

problem is, how long should he wait for optimum pay-back?

Dandroppedadime said:

totally agree. we want it now. but Prince knows it's better to wait it out for leaner times!

problem is, how long should he wait for optimum pay-back?

That window has closed.

The 12th of Never...

yeah its already too late. Plus he cant release most of it due to his religious beliefs. I don't think we will ever hear the majority of it(or maybe we already have)

I highly doubt it. maybe after he passes. but since he takes care of himself he'll live to be at least 80

rdhull said:

Dandroppedadime said:

totally agree. we want it now. but Prince knows it's better to wait it out for leaner times!

problem is, how long should he wait for optimum pay-back?

That window has closed.

With dust on it.

dandeeland said:

yeah its already too late. Plus he cant release most of it due to his religious beliefs. I don't think we will ever hear the majority of it(or maybe we already have)

i think he would release the unrealeased material, in several interviews he says things like if he had the chance to change the way he did things he wouldnt change it one bit..because its part of the experience.

so i think we will get it all... eventually....

MarquessMarq said:

rdhull said:

That window has closed.

With dust on it.

...and then painted shut.

jtfolden said:

MarquessMarq said:

With dust on it.

...and then painted shut.

And then the demolition crew (Led by Prince? Really? ) showed up, tore the whole motherfucking structure down and erected a Kwik E Mart upon it's hallowed ground!!!

.

[Edited 11/25/11 22:43pm]

dm3857 said:

dandeeland said:

yeah its already too late. Plus he cant release most of it due to his religious beliefs. I don't think we will ever hear the majority of it(or maybe we already have)

i think he would release the unrealeased material, in several interviews he says things like if he had the chance to change the way he did things he wouldnt change it one bit..because its part of the experience.

so i think we will get it all... eventually....

thats a pretty different thought process than saying hes going to release all his old dirty songs. i appreciate the mistakes ive made in my life for learning purposes and what not, but i wouldn't want to repeat them

uuhson said:

dm3857 said:

i think he would release the unrealeased material, in several interviews he says things like if he had the chance to change the way he did things he wouldnt change it one bit..because its part of the experience.

so i think we will get it all... eventually....

thats a pretty different thought process than saying hes going to release all his old dirty songs. i appreciate the mistakes ive made in my life for learning purposes and what not, but i wouldn't want to repeat them

i know what you meant, but i dont know.. i may just be to hopeful.. but i think that as an artist he would want us to hear the unrealsed art that he created, even though his religion/morals have changed.

rdhull said:

Dandroppedadime said:

totally agree. we want it now. but Prince knows it's better to wait it out for leaner times!

problem is, how long should he wait for optimum pay-back?

That window has closed.

Disagree - there will always be demand for his quality material....good music never dies...

TheFreakerFantastic said:

rdhull said:

That window has closed.

Disagree - there will always be demand for his quality material....good music never dies...

Damn straight it doesn't. It reigns forever in memories of the way it used to be!

TheFreakerFantastic said:

rdhull said:

That window has closed.

Disagree - there will always be demand for his quality material....good music never dies...

The window for "optimum payback" as the op stated HAS closed and been closed for some time now. If he wanted "optimum payout" of his beloved vault mateiral, it would have been over a decade ago. Now, the lust for vault material appears to be only from die hards rather than his once larger pop audience.

I never said anything about a demand ..or that his music was not quality etc.....

^ I don't know, I think you underestimate the spending power of the core audience.

Even back in his hey-day, you wouldn't have got that many people buying the CB vault set apart from the die hards.

I always felt Prince should have released a lot of vault material as new (i.e don't announce it was recorded in 1986 just say it is new material) ...that really would get attention

[Edited 11/26/11 13:28pm]

the last living thing he'll do while on his death bed is press a big red button then 'BOOM' pp will be a pile of rubble along with the vault. then he'll smile and mutter, clean that fucker up!

^ Oh, don't! LOL

TheFreakerFantastic said:

^ I don't know, I think you underestimate the spending power of the core audience.

Even back in his hey-day, you wouldn't have got that many people buying the CB vault set apart from the die hards.

In his hey-day, the unreleased Black Album quickly became one of the most bootlegged albums in history. CB would have sold like hotcakes with the right treatment. People were very curious, fan and fanatic alike.

Into the mid and late 90's there was a sizable hunger for vault material. ...but I think you greatly over-estimate his "core audience" today.

I always felt Prince should have released a lot of vault material as new (i.e don't announce it was recorded in 1986 just say it is new material) ...that really would get attention

[Edited 11/26/11 13:28pm]

Why would that get attention? Despite the wealth of vault material there's not a huge amount of it that strikes me as attention getting music.

Additionally, I believe he HAS been releasing vault material as new for some time. He's always mixed older tracks into new projects.

TheFreakerFantastic said:

rdhull said:

That window has closed.

Disagree - there will always be demand for his quality material....good music never dies...

From who? His hardcore fanbase? Joe public is certainly not demanding Prince's vault cast offs and they never will. In fact they're hardly after his new music either. Hence, we are where we are. Prince on rinse and repeat. Touring all the hits, all the time.

Maybe we'll see another Crystal Ball or Vault series, but I think one of the things he should do with the back catalog is make them "director cut", meaning the songs he had originally wanted on those albums but couldn't do it due to limitations of vinyl.

There's not a huge demand for the unreleased songs themselves except from hardcore fans. To me, it should be part of bonus material. Blu Ray would be the best way to put it out. The audio copy would be as good as you could possibly have it short of listening to the actual master tapes in P's studio... then you'd get videos, tons of room for unreleased songs, demos, an interactive menu, and a mini documentary on the making of, a digital copy of the album for your iPod, plus promotional & live footage from that period.

He might also have to compromise a bit with Warners, because they own the movies. If he wanted to put a deluxe CD/DVD out, would be pretty tricky, esp. in the case of Batman. But he'd have to talk to Tim Burton on that one, who has a better (and lucrative) relationship with Warners.

As far as religious beliefs being a reason not to release something, maybe, but that would be like Dave Mustaine taking songs off his Megadeth albums because they were Satanic. He just chooses not to perform them,but "what's done is done". It's part of history. It's no different than an artist going through a phase of painting sexually graphic content, then all of a sudden, get a burst of enlightenment and paint more spiritually themed content.

Does the artist throw acid at his old artwork or take a lighter to it, even though thousands of people have seen it, and it's been photographed for years? Same thing - even if he doesn't release it, it's going to be out there. It doesn't just disappear. He can make it hard to access, that's about it.

Maybe P would put some sort of disclaimer in the liner notes about it not reflecting his current belief and put some JW links up. Some people have to live with having a porn movie past, but it doesn't have to reflect who they currently are as a parent.

He could put all of the Vault out in a 10 Blu Ray box set if he wanted, in "as is" condition, and still have plenty of room left over.

Marrk said:

TheFreakerFantastic said:

Disagree - there will always be demand for his quality material....good music never dies...

From who? His hardcore fanbase? Joe public is certainly not demanding Prince's vault cast offs and they never will. In fact they're hardly after his new music either.

Which was my point.

Besides, most artists who release box sets etc are not really expecting them to be oh so profitable and million sellers. They are basically for the die-hards, collectors and such (unless we are talking about the Beatles or Zep, then you're going to have huge sales. I don't think U2 and Radioheads sets are making much).

These (Prrince box sets, etc.) should be done for legacy and artistic reasons imo, not specifically for profit wise issues. I mean damn. If he or others had this reasoning, there would be no issues of 'holding out for a better deal, as a trump card" and such. What the focus should be is on who and what are going to make it as best a set as possible regarding content, quality, and such.

But that's just my opinion.

^

Why couldn't Prince make money with a box set/remasters?

What everybody always seems to forget is that the production costs are lower with a box set than with an ordinary release, because the music has been produced and paid for already. It's exploiting a work you have already exploited and profited from, but then do it again, with better sound quality and bonus discs consisting of vault and live material. And make even more on it.

This makes the investement a company has to make in the release of a box set release less than is the case with an original release.

What's really needed is that everybody involved and owning or entitled (in the future) to any rights, is on board with it. And that simply doesn't seem to the case, not in the least when it comes to Prince himself.

But maybe things will start to change in 2013. Why couldn't Prince re-issue 'For You' then, remastered and all, including 2 discs of outtakes and live material? Do it again a year later with 'Prince', etc..?

Sell it on Amazon and other online retailers as a CD box set and digitally on itunes etc. Sell it on your own site too for less and cash.

[Edited 11/27/11 12:26pm]

He would make loads of money off any type of box set, there are a lot of hardcore fans with cash about...

I think he's going to look at what happened with MJ and what was released (all those collabs with people after his death and This Is It) and think 'I'm not gonna let them do that to me' and so he'll release it himself.

My big worry is that he'll butcher it like he did Extraloveable....i just don't want him reworking any of that older stuff!

TheFreakerFantastic said:

He would make loads of money off any type of box set, there are a lot of hardcore fans with cash about...

I think he's going to look at what happened with MJ and what was released (all those collabs with people after his death and This Is It) and think 'I'm not gonna let them do that to me' and so he'll release it himself.

My big worry is that he'll butcher it like he did Extraloveable....i just don't want him reworking any of that older stuff!

Don't forget the horrific rework of "Old Friends 4 Sale" from "The Vault" CD.

I did like the strings on it though.

TheFreakerFantastic said:

He would make loads of money off any type of box set, there are a lot of hardcore fans with cash about...

I think he's going to look at what happened with MJ and what was released (all those collabs with people after his death and This Is It) and think 'I'm not gonna let them do that to me' and so he'll release it himself.

My big worry is that he'll butcher it like he did Extraloveable....i just don't want him reworking any of that older stuff!

I don't know what he thinks, but I do know he could make money with it and make his fans happy.

Of course most would not be so happy and willing to buy if he only re-records his vault material.

I could be totally wrong, but my guess is that it mostly has to do with the lack of a deal with WB and some associated artists.

Box sets dont generally generate a lot of revenue. Out of the past recent releases of U2, Stones, Pink Floyd, Floyd is the only break out of 10,000 or so.

Now 10 grand of someting going for lets say $100 is not exactly hitting the jackpot. Especially notbing of note to sit and wait for an optimal time to release. Again" Princes window for otpimal rewards for them has passed, a long time ago.

again: box sets require much less investment than regular releases. This means that if you play it smart, you could make more on a box set selling less, than on a ordinary release selling more.

^ Rdhull...do u remember how much Prince made out of CB set?? Even though the sales weren't massive he made loads as he financed most of it himself...

Tremolina said:

again: box sets require much less investment than regular releases. This means that if you play it smart, you could make more on a box set selling less, than on a ordinary release selling more.

it doesnt matter even if the investment was free..what is the most he wll make? One millionNow that is a lot ot the ordinary joe but to HIM? PLEASE.

It may seem to us like these would be big sellers (Prince remasters/box sets) but I hardly think many fans outside of those who post here on the org are going to go out and get them.

This is why I stated that he should still do them but for legacy and artistic reasons. To put a profit tag on as a reason is just going to screw us the fans as we will be waiting forever for him or a company to wait until the 12th of never for it seem prime profit time to finally get busy with boxset projects. As well as taint musical works as soley profit driven as well.