Well, that cleared everything up, Prince. Having a blogger with his own problematic grasp of the english language cut-and-paste a Babblefish'd version of the same conversation may not have been the best way to go on this.

But shit... since you're not recording music anymore, why are we having this little back-and-forth?

Cravens said:

XNY said:

Not sure why this makes him nuts. Because you don't understand his perspective? Jackie Chan made the same point several years ago about China and he was ridiculed for it. Why can't they have a different point of view? While the United States is widely considered one of the best examples of a "free" society, it is hardly a poster child for democracy: The highest drug use per capita, one of the highest crime rates per capita, the highest rate of incarceration, one of the lowest scoring public education systems among industrialized nations, and a corrupt political system that favors the rich over the middle class and poor.

Like British Empire before us, the American Empire is on a steep decline with no brakes.

[..]

Sure it makes him a bafoon. You immediately jump to the topic of "Democracy", totally over looking the core value in his views: Freedom of choice. In most of the western world the core value is that people should have the freedom to choose to live as they like, to express their opinions, to get educations, what kind of job they'd like, who they want to marry ect. ect.. Prince, in this interview, disagrees with that, mainly because, "people will always complain regardless", and it's apparently more "fun" in oppressed countries.

And of course you can criticize democracy .. I mean .. that's the whole point of democracy. But democracy is merely a sympthom, a logical result of western human views: freedom of thought and free will. Democracy is merely a system applied as the result of that conviction, a system that we find to be the closest to allow the freedoms we believe in.

And what you're actually criticizing is not democracy itself, but the application of it, it's workings and the theory of government we use when we want people to be the "most" free.

Prince however, seems to believe that free will for human kind is a problem that needs to be fixed before society can be perfect. Now that IS rather nuts.

Just your opinion, not necessarily fact. As you state, in using the US as an example of the perils of democracy I am only describing the application of democracy, not democracy itself. I can say the same thing about communism or socialism. The people or nation states who apply it are to blame for their flaws not the system right?

And just because I can criticize or debate democracy hardly make it a better political system. Many people who live in socialist countries are able to debate the merits of socialism.

But the truth is, there is no perfect political system, nor one better than another. Regardless of the philosophy, any political system can be oppressive. Any political system no matter how well intended can be corrupted by money and power. It really depends who applies it and how it is carried out.

I guess what I'm saying is, we can debate the merits of democracy or socialism or even totalitarianism all we want but Prince's perspective on these subjects is no less valid than our own, and shouldn't be dismissed simply because you disagree with him or favor one over the other.

WaterInYourBath said:

bellanoche said:

I think his comment is related to recording the music not performing it live. Also, why would one boo an artist for covering a song at a concert? That is juvenile. He is entitled to his beliefs about other people recording his music. Why should we boo or jeer an artist we paid money to see perform live? If someone feels so strongly about this opinion, they should just stay at home.

You can assume that, but that is NOT what he explicitly stated. And yes, people do need to deride this man for doing exactly what he always preaches against. He's booing other artists for doing what he does himself all the time, therefore, why shouldn't he be booed as well? What puts him above anyone else? So, what, he's exempt from adhering to his own so-called principles? Whether he's referring to studio covers or not, either way, no one outside of his circle can perform his music without him insulting them, but he can stand up with entitlement somewhere and randomly cover songs like Which Way Is Up during his shows, or go in his recording booth and "ruin" La-La (Means I Love You)?

I really can't believe you can still support his constant hypocrisy regarding this topic. And my comment is juvenile? Yeah, no, it's not. It's just an example of treating him the way he treats others.

I didn't say that I supported his position. Quite frankly, I do not even care. However, what kills me is that people like you on one hand lambaste him for your perception of what he says then deride anyone who does not perceive what he says the same way as you. As you stated, he did not explicitly state that he was referring to recorded music nor did he explcitly state that he wasn't. Based on previous conversations, I assumed that he meant recorded music. However, some of you are so glued to your seats on the anti-Prince bandwagon that everything he says is automatically filed in the he's a hypocrite, idiot or lunatic cabinet. Prince is not the only artist who feels that way about recorded cover music. Many artists cut their teeth covering music live. They also use it to introduce their audiences at concerts to artists they admire. However, that doesn't mean that they are going to go out and record a version of it or be happy when other people do it. Chaka Khan has also voiced this opinion about recorded covers of her music, yet she has recorded covers herself. It's the nature of the beast and it often comes down to who is actually covering the music.

In my opinion, yes the idea of buying a ticket to a concert and booing or jeering over a song choice is juvenile. What is the point? How are you treating him the way he treats others? Whose concert has he gone to and booed or jeered. He has the right to dictate what he wants done with his music the same way Stargard or The Stylistics can complain about him covering their music.

Instead of booing him at a concert someone can opt to save their money and stay home. I don't understand some of the posts here. It is fine to disagree with the man, but some of the people who post here would be better off logging onto a site for someone they actually like instead of wasting time and energy bashing Prince whenever he says or does something they don't like. If you like the music, listen to it. Separate the man from the music. He is not a marionette. He is a person with opinions, flaws, etc. just like the next man. Folks need to stop trying to make Prince the man squeeze into their myopic fantasy of what they want him to be based on the music that Prince the musician has created.

WaterInYourBath said:

Spinlight said:

What part are you unclear about? Prince does not like people covering his music period - recorded or live. The end of it. He doesn't like people giving out covers of his music for free and he doesn't like artists to pay tribute to his legacy.

He does, however, feel compelled to carry on the legacy of his predecessors. And that reflects poorly on both him and his idols.

And thus, he needs to stick to his own catalog when performing, and never record another cover again.

I don't completely agree with this. As I said before, I think it has more to do with who is doing the cover than anything. Are you saying that he didn't like Alicia, Esperanza, Patti and Janelle covering his music live during the tribute to his legacy at the BET Awards? Now, Trey Songz covering Purple Rain is a different story. As I recall, he picked those ladies for the performance. At the end of the day, Prince is a control freak and I think his issue about covers is one of him having control over who does what with his music.

Timmy84 said:

purplethunder3121 said:

Why so pissy Prince?

he truly looks pissed here.

is that a halo..?

thedance said:

Timmy84 said:

Why so pissy Prince?

he truly looks pissed here.

is that a halo..?

You'll have to ask the folks in Montreal. That pic is from his concert there going on right now.

NuPwrSoul said:

sweething said:

You may have a point about Prince being "vague"

I doubt he was "vague" at all. He was probably very clear about his views. But his refusal to allow his interviews to be recorded allows him the chance to backtrack from the crazy shit he DOES say.

Neil Strauss made mention in his book that Prince will let video cameras in a room, but journalists have to rely on pen, paper and memory.

This is from a different interview that he did, one that was unpublished, but gave to the Ask Men folks:

http://www.askmen.com/cel...rince.html

XNY said:

Cravens said:

Sure it makes him a bafoon. You immediately jump to the topic of "Democracy", totally over looking the core value in his views: Freedom of choice. In most of the western world the core value is that people should have the freedom to choose to live as they like, to express their opinions, to get educations, what kind of job they'd like, who they want to marry ect. ect.. Prince, in this interview, disagrees with that, mainly because, "people will always complain regardless", and it's apparently more "fun" in oppressed countries.

And of course you can criticize democracy .. I mean .. that's the whole point of democracy. But democracy is merely a sympthom, a logical result of western human views: freedom of thought and free will. Democracy is merely a system applied as the result of that conviction, a system that we find to be the closest to allow the freedoms we believe in.

And what you're actually criticizing is not democracy itself, but the application of it, it's workings and the theory of government we use when we want people to be the "most" free.

Prince however, seems to believe that free will for human kind is a problem that needs to be fixed before society can be perfect. Now that IS rather nuts.

Just your opinion, not necessarily fact. As you state, in using the US as an example of the perils of democracy I am only describing the application of democracy, not democracy itself. I can say the same thing about communism or socialism. The people or nation states who apply it are to blame for their flaws not the system right?

And just because I can criticize or debate democracy hardly make it a better political system. Many people who live in socialist countries are able to debate the merits of socialism.

But the truth is, there is no perfect political system, nor one better than another. Regardless of the philosophy, any political system can be oppressive. Any political system no matter how well intended can be corrupted by money and power. It really depends who applies it and how it is carried out.

I guess what I'm saying is, we can debate the merits of democracy or socialism or even totalitarianism all we want but Prince's perspective on these subjects is no less valid than our own, and shouldn't be dismissed simply because you disagree with him or favor one over the other.

Very well stated. Your post is exactly what I have been saying in my posts. The lack of respect for opposing viewpoints on this thread is alarming considering the people bashing Prince's perspective seem to fashion themselves as foot soldiers in the army of democracy.

thedance said:

Timmy84 said:

Why so pissy Prince?

he truly looks pissed here.

is that a halo..?

He looked to his right and saw the org comments

Posted this in GD but I think it also fits with this discussion.

Can't have it both ways--either all people should be allowed to express themselves as they see fit whether discussing or wearing saggin pants, bikinis or burqas, or not.

US Airways lets man fly wearing women's panties

This is a June 9, 2011 photo provided by airline passenger Jill Tarlow.

THE ASSOCIATED PRESS

Sym said:

Why all the negativity??
Prince is my idol, always has been..... And the soundtrack to my life, is this an anti-Prince forum?
Cause it sure hell feels like it is.

Got my Hop Farm Festival Ticket, and can't wait to see Prince do his thing!

Morris: " your lips would make a lollipop too happy"

Sym said:

Why all the negativity?? Prince is my idol, always has been...... And the soundtrack to my life, is this an anti-Prince forum? Cause it sure hell feels like it is. Got my Hop Farm Festival Ticket, and can't wait to see Prince do his thing! Morris: " your lips would make a lollipop too happy"

It will always seem negative to you if you have made Prince an idol.

purpleparty3000 said:

Sym said:

Why all the negativity?? Prince is my idol, always has been...... And the soundtrack to my life, is this an anti-Prince forum? Cause it sure hell feels like it is. Got my Hop Farm Festival Ticket, and can't wait to see Prince do his thing! Morris: " your lips would make a lollipop too happy"

I agree, more love on the MJ forums than here. Change the name of the org to THE HATE ORG! No wonder Prince won't give the fans what they want! Most people that log in here why bother??It just such a negative site at times!

What about the comments Prince made?

How about addressing them, rather than knocking the responses.

Spinlight said:

I guess everyone knew this is how it'd end up - with Prince a lonely old miser, hoarding his music away because no one gives him what he feels its worth.

Fuck that guy. There's too much good music still being released (and having been released while he spent 10 years on autopilot) to worry about his drama. When he says nobody is getting paid or making money - who is he talking about? Who are these mysterious artists. Tons of people make money.

Maybe its just him.

Well if he would start paying his bills on time so he wouldn't get sued later and have to give all away in huge lump sums. I mean, damn!

babynoz said:

Cerebus said:

Nearly 25 pages. You would ALMOST think that people still cared what they guy has to say.

On the org, yeah, in the general public...not so much,

I was amused to hear a blurb about it just now on the local news, but they only reported the part about him not releasing any more music and blaming the internet. They said he just needs a "Kiss".

They seemed quite pleased with their attempt at being witty.

Well... ... I actually laughed.

In the last few sentances he says "The fans love it",Surely he wouldn't say that.

bellanoche said:

WaterInYourBath said:

You can assume that, but that is NOT what he explicitly stated. And yes, people do need to deride this man for doing exactly what he always preaches against. He's booing other artists for doing what he does himself all the time, therefore, why shouldn't he be booed as well? What puts him above anyone else? So, what, he's exempt from adhering to his own so-called principles? Whether he's referring to studio covers or not, either way, no one outside of his circle can perform his music without him insulting them, but he can stand up with entitlement somewhere and randomly cover songs like Which Way Is Up during his shows, or go in his recording booth and "ruin" La-La (Means I Love You)?

I really can't believe you can still support his constant hypocrisy regarding this topic. And my comment is juvenile? Yeah, no, it's not. It's just an example of treating him the way he treats others.

I didn't say that I supported his position. Quite frankly, I do not even care. However, what kills me is that people like you on one hand lambaste him for your perception of what he says then deride anyone who does not perceive what he says the same way as you. As you stated, he did not explicitly state that he was referring to recorded music nor did he explcitly state that he wasn't. Based on previous conversations, I assumed that he meant recorded music. However, some of you are so glued to your seats on the anti-Prince bandwagon that everything he says is automatically filed in the he's a hypocrite, idiot or lunatic cabinet. Prince is not the only artist who feels that way about recorded cover music. Many artists cut their teeth covering music live. They also use it to introduce their audiences at concerts to artists they admire. However, that doesn't mean that they are going to go out and record a version of it or be happy when other people do it. Chaka Khan has also voiced this opinion about recorded covers of her music, yet she has recorded covers herself. It's the nature of the beast and it often comes down to who is actually covering the music.

In my opinion, yes the idea of buying a ticket to a concert and booing or jeering over a song choice is juvenile. What is the point? How are you treating him the way he treats others? Whose concert has he gone to and booed or jeered. He has the right to dictate what he wants done with his music the same way Stargard or The Stylistics can complain about him covering their music.

Instead of booing him at a concert someone can opt to save their money and stay home. I don't understand some of the posts here. It is fine to disagree with the man, but some of the people who post here would be better off logging onto a site for someone they actually like instead of wasting time and energy bashing Prince whenever he says or does something they don't like. If you like the music, listen to it. Separate the man from the music. He is not a marionette. He is a person with opinions, flaws, etc. just like the next man. Folks need to stop trying to make Prince the man squeeze into their myopic fantasy of what they want him to be based on the music that Prince the musician has created.

...... What? Again, that is INTRINSICALLY hypocritical! Plus, as said here numerous times, it doesn't bother Prince in any way to cover anyone else. Another recent example: He happily and voluntarily recorded, released, made a full video for, and performed Crimson and Clover without flinching and with a huge grin on his face (and most likely without any direct permission or concern about the original group). So what was that? And "who has he jeered?" Really? You did read what he said, once again, about people [outside of his realm/control] covering his songs live or in studio, right? It's always a derisive statement, or in other words, a figurative "boo." So there is no "myopic fantasy" here. I wish the tables would turn and someone from Tommy James and the Shondells, The Stylistics, etc, would come out and say the same thing against him. But that will never happen. They apparently appreciate the royalties, lol, and don't have the same "myopic" view that he maintains.

If you don't get the logic behind my sentiment, like he wouldn't, then, well, I can't convince you, or anyone else. You understand his implications or whatever, and "separate the man from the music." I do not, especially since he himself claims they are one and the same. And I'm not on any bandwagon. I loathe bandwagons. This isn't about anything like that. I'm justing stating reality. Besides, while I stick by my position, my initial comment was somewhat facetious anyway. I mean, during his live covers, how could he even hear the warranted boos over all the screams of zealots/unaware casual fans in the audience who don't care about any of this, LOL?

Orionforever said:

I totally agree.... I would gladly go to the Store and buy a Prince CD or a Prince DVD... Always did. Never really liked the "Down load" concept any way ,. I like the cool CD holder and the neat inserts.. but recently Prince never does anything like this.. He never released his latest work in America.. so we had to either down load it, or get it off ebay.. that is not OUR fault. I mean we are fans, we love his music.. if he dangles stuff in front of us, sure we are gonna want it.
I seriously think he could make a mint if he would release some of his "vault stuff".. or make some of his shows available on DVD and Cd.. People would go nuts..

I love Prince, always will...... but I really don't understand his way of thinking some times.. :O(

oh yeah definately but that would also mean that he would have to pay someone else to release it, and he don't like doing that. he likes to make 100% profit. I think 75% of us here would buy whatever he releases from the vault be it cd or dvd live or studio. either way he would make a fuckin mint. but he won't.

[Edited 6/25/11 2:27am]

SoulAlive said:

armpit said:

...You really think that's gonna happen?

No,but we can dream

This is happening, we have to wait and see if it will see daylight as we know more projects didn't.

Listen to an exciting podcast from peachandblack (here http://prince.org/msg/7/346229?pr or http://peachandblack.podb...ck-in-nyc/). These guys got to meet Prince and talk about his masters and more.....he already remastered the first 6 albums if i recall correctly.

Have to react on Prince quote : Prince said: "It's fun being in Islamic countries, to know there's only one religion. There's order. You wear a burqa. There's no choice. People are happy with that."

Man, what is he meaning or studying. Moslim women who are not allowed to : show their face, show their body, get a job, drive a car. Who are hidding there wounds from beating and being raped. These women have had no freedom or choice in life for decades. Don't think they are happy with an ordered easy life without having the possibility to choose. If they make a choice, the could be killed, without someone being punished for that.

Hope he is misquote on that, otherwise, Prince is insane.

Sticking to his music, really enjoying last 2 years in which he is playing his ass off. Don't miss the internet anymore as long as he is bringing it live, which is the best format for his music.

So leaving the internet doesn't bother me. Hope he will keep releasing studio albums, and in the classic way; recordstores worldwide, don't like his morning paper deals in one country. America and rest of the world should have had the official 20ten album in a decent cd-case.

[Edited 6/25/11 2:38am]

alexnvrmnd777 said:

Oh, and about those Purple Rain shows he got tired of doing...I'd rather hear/see his out-of-this world performances of "Baby, I'm A Star" than an ENTIRE Welcome 2 America show. He may have been bored to death doing those shows, but they were loads better than anything he's doing now

It's sad, but true.

sweething said:

Damn, that Apollonia 6 reunion isn't going as well as expected is it....

Prince gets all his power from his believes, he would be nothing without them, so you really don't know him. He's a truly nuts for believing there is a god, and everybody else who believes that way.

God does not exist, music does, but his lyrical content in his music is so religious these days that most of his "fans" can't really relate to him in anyway. So prince will continue to make biblical lyrics and all the amazing talent will go to waste because he's chosen the path of a nutcase. But the early work of prince is amazing and so is almost everything in music he does, the lyrics are just fucked up after he became jehova's witness.

LOVEVERY1 said:

Actually Prince (has) met in person, face to face,

numerous Muslim women, men and children.

WOW!... He's actually met REAL muslims?!

JudasSmile said:

There is an excerpt from an interview with Prince here:

Prince said: "It's fun being in Islamic countries, to know there's only one religion. There's order. You wear a burqa. There's no choice. People are happy with that." When asked about the fate of those unhappy with having no choice, he replied: "There are people who are unhappy with everything. There's a dark side to everything."

Well, a few things are cleared up now:

1. No new album in the near future

2. No Glastonbury Festival performance

3. Prince is nuts

[Edited 6/23/11 4:29am]

1.YEA!!!

2. WHO CARES????

3. oh my yes.

NouveauDance said:

"It's fun being in Islamic countries, to know there's only one religion. There's order. You wear a burqa. There's no choice. People are happy with that."

That is probably the most pathetic and disheartening thing I've ever read from Prince.

What a fucking cretin.

Got to agree with you there. Disgustingly ignorant comment.