Sounds like another one to miss. Keep the impressions coming as you read more, thanks.

its on this website for a fiver http://kobobooks.com/eboo...page1.html

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ps..i just downloaded it from amazon for a fiver...dont mind paying that for a new prince book...i am also reading the other new prince book chaos disorder and revolution...half way through that one...its pretty straight forward...the odd fact wrong here and there but has covered most of the important events up to 88 so far.....

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thanks for the info bart...

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[Edited 5/5/11 8:17am]

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[Edited 5/5/11 8:17am]

Its a shame that no big hitter biographer has attempted Prince, both Madonna and MJ are well served by people such as J Randy Taraborelli.

DMSR was good but only does the first ten years and is a bit detail obsessed. The Alex Hahn book was OK despite some inaccuracies. The Liz Jones one was gossipy but interesting.

Really we need a full biography from then til now preferably with direct interviews with Prince.

Thanks for all the info so far. Please keep chiming in with further observations.

BartVanHemelen said:

wahclavinet said:

Actually the name on his birth certificate is Prince Roger Nelson, even though he was named for his dad's "Prince Rogers Trio". Usually the media gets this wrong, but you can see the birth certificate in Jon Bream's classic book.

No, his name is "Rogers". "Roger" was an error and this has been corrected.

Source, please?

BTW, has ANYONE actually read the rest of the e-book yet? So far no one has said a word about anything that's not in the free sample.

wahclavinet said:

BartVanHemelen said:

No, his name is "Rogers". "Roger" was an error and this has been corrected.

Source, please?

Go look at his signature on his WB contracts. He was named after his father's trio, the hospital simply made a mistake. Which happens all the time.

Pic here: http://prince.org/msg/7/88343

Look at the name on these court papers: http://misstilaomg.com/20...contracts/

20% in and they're talking about the sessions for his second album.

There's a bunch of quotes from the recording engineer Gary Brandt. This seems to be an interview he did, since it becomes rather technical when he's talking about the recording of "I Wanna Be Your Lover" (which the author shortens to "IWTBYL" twice -- I'm not kidding) about the kind of mic he used when recording the snare drum: Prince wanted an SM57, Brandt used a customized AKG 452. I don't think I've ever read that before.

It then continues with quotes from Bob Mockler, staff engineer at Hollywood Sound Recorders where they mixed Prince. These are also fairly technical and detailed, and could possibly be the result of an interview conducted by Jake Brown.

On the other hand, I don't see either name in the thanks at the beginning of the book:

Next, of course, I want to dearly thank the producers and engineers who contributed their time and memories to assisting the reconstruction of the recording of this majestic catalog of beautiful music, thank you for your contributions both to that legacy, and to this book’s study of it, specifically Susan Rogers, David Leonard, Michael Koppelman, Sylvia Massey, Ross Pallone, Steve Fontano, Chuck Zwicky, and an EXTRA SPECIAL THANK YOU to Eddie Miller for your interviews/pics.

Equally, I want to give MANY THANKS to Matt ‘Dr’ Fink for devoting the extensive lengths of time you did to fleshing out the aforementioned catalog from a band member’s intimate perspective, I was a big fan, and am an even bigger one now, thank you for your help bringing this book to life

(Heh, I just noticed that this thread is at the top of Google's search results when you search for "Jake Brown Prince In The Studio".)

BartVanHemelen said:

20% in and they're talking about the sessions for his second album.

There's a bunch of quotes from the recording engineer Gary Brandt. This seems to be an interview he did, since it becomes rather technical when he's talking about the recording of "I Wanna Be Your Lover" (which the author shortens to "IWTBYL" twice -- I'm not kidding) about the kind of mic he used when recording the snare drum: Prince wanted an SM57, Brandt used a customized AKG 452. I don't think I've ever read that before.

It then continues with quotes from Bob Mockler, staff engineer at Hollywood Sound Recorders where they mixed Prince. These are also fairly technical and detailed, and could possibly be the result of an interview conducted by Jake Brown.

On the other hand, I don't see either name in the thanks at the beginning of the book:

Next, of course, I want to dearly thank the producers and engineers who contributed their time and memories to assisting the reconstruction of the recording of this majestic catalog of beautiful music, thank you for your contributions both to that legacy, and to this book’s study of it, specifically Susan Rogers, David Leonard, Michael Koppelman, Sylvia Massey, Ross Pallone, Steve Fontano, Chuck Zwicky, and an EXTRA SPECIAL THANK YOU to Eddie Miller for your interviews/pics.

Equally, I want to give MANY THANKS to Matt ‘Dr’ Fink for devoting the extensive lengths of time you did to fleshing out the aforementioned catalog from a band member’s intimate perspective, I was a big fan, and am an even bigger one now, thank you for your help bringing this book to life

(Heh, I just noticed that this thread is at the top of Google's search results when you search for "Jake Brown Prince In The Studio".)

just had a look at the opening page of this book and there are numerous mistakes ...looks like a direct lift from some other article...its annoying when authors dont check their facts first before they put these books out....hopefully the actual 'in the studio' part will throw up some interesting stuff..

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[Edited 5/5/11 13:28pm]

BartVanHemelen said:

There's a bunch of quotes from the recording engineer Gary Brandt. This seems to be an interview he did, since it becomes rather technical when he's talking about the recording of "I Wanna Be Your Lover" (which the author shortens to "IWTBYL" twice -- I'm not kidding) about the kind of mic he used when recording the snare drum: Prince wanted an SM57, Brandt used a customized AKG 452. I don't think I've ever read that before.

It then continues with quotes from Bob Mockler, staff engineer at Hollywood Sound Recorders where they mixed Prince. These are also fairly technical and detailed, and could possibly be the result of an interview conducted by Jake Brown.

(Heh, I just noticed that this thread is at the top of Google's search results when you search for "Jake Brown Prince In The Studio".)

Thanks for the details Bart! There was a great HQ interview with Gary and he has also been interviewed by people like Per in the past, but you're right - I don't remember anything about those specific mic choices.

Thanks for the links about the name. They only show how a person who is trying to sue Prince spells his legal name, not how he signs it personally. I haven't ever seen any quotes from any person directly connected to Prince that a correction was made to the name on the birth certificate.

Here are some links to the name listed as Roger:

http://blogs.findlaw.com/celebrity_justice/2011/03/prince-sued-by-his-former-lawyers.html

http://www.houstondivorceblog.com/2011/03/prince-owes-divorce-lawyers-700000-lawsuit-alleges/

http://www.findagrave.com/cgi-bin/fg.cgi?page=gr&GSmpid=47024598&GRid=39382275&

http://cocatalog.loc.gov/cgi-bin/Pwebrecon.cgi?v1=5&ti=1,5&SC=Author&SA=Nelson%2C%20Prince&PID=2toVKGGdN4qu_olsmIGXlx9Egf&SEQ=20110505173650&SID=15

http://cocatalog.loc.gov/cgi-bin/Pwebrecon.cgi?v1=3&ti=1,3&SC=Author&SA=Nelson%2C%20Prince&PID=GM_cCQUCqzY7aJrMrD-lFWHIJU&SEQ=20110505173645&SID=15

(A page linking to the registration above lists "Rogers" as a pseudonym: http://cocatalog.loc.gov/...amp;SID=15 )

It is listed as Rogers in this copyright document from 1995 (but it just says Prince is "known" by that name, which would be true regardless): http://cocatalog.loc.gov/...4mPgRforUJ

Squirrelgrease posted on the org: "A fairly safe bet would be that the hospital screwed up the birth certificate and put the familiar "Roger" on it, even though they were probably told Rogers. Birth certificates didn't show up right away, and were a bitch to change(and usually a financial burden), so plenty of folks let a simple middle name glitch slide. Coincidently, my brother was born at the same hospital in Minneapolis that Prince was and his middle name was, and still is incorrect on his birth certificate."

Carver County property notices appear under "R." Most copyright records just say Prince Nelson. Dawnation says "Prince Roger Nelson (later Prince Rogers Nelson)" in the bio, but there's no source given to add any credibility to it.

... actually the mic thing was from the HQ Jan 2006 interview: "We had one conversation about snare mics once after I recorded IWTBYL where he wanted an SM57. On IWTBYL I used a customized AKG 452 and it sounded great, He was very opinionated and really should have left well enough alone but I did as he asked as the rest of the tracks sounded less snappy. We did use his drums though. We recorded the album 16 track 2" at his request."

I hope the whole book isn't just reused quotes!

wahclavinet said:

Thanks for the links about the name. They only show how a person who is trying to sue Prince spells his legal name, not how he signs it personally. I haven't ever seen any quotes from any person directly connected to Prince that a correction was made to the name on the birth certificate.

One of the threads Bart linked to had a picture of his signature on the WB contract - http://prince.org/msg/7/88343

I'm hoping it's kosher just to post the image sourced from that thread here (no doubt someone will tell me if not):

[img:$uid]http://img47.photobucket.com/albums/v143/Kecess07/purplenessonnews16.jpg[/img:$uid]

There is even a quote from Rolling Stone directly above the chapter title that states how he was named after his father's trio, so it's just a little bizarre that the Roger/Rogers confusion isn't at least mentioned. On one hand, ok, he went with the birth certificate, but surely the discrepancy made him wonder - the above thread is one of the first things that comes up when you search on Prince's birth name.

I haven't had much of a chance to get properly into the book, though I don't think I could offer much insight, as I'm not generally well-versed in Prince literature (eg. I'd have no idea whether or not a particular mic discussion had been previously reported, etc...) To that end, $8 for a book that may well be a rehash of other books still suits me fine, though a lack of new info unfortunately doesn't seem to be the only problem here.

That said, skipping ahead briefly, I noticed some of the discussion with Matt Fink emerge, as well as some of the engineers - he only specifically thanks Eddie Miller, as well as Matt, for interviews though, so I take it that means that the rest of the producer and engineer info is second or third hand.

In any case, I'm hoping that, as most of the info from Fink and Miller emerge later in the book, that this is where the majority of new information comes in (which begs the question, why did he spend 8 chapters just to get to For You, but anyway...)

BartVanHemelen said:

wahclavinet said:

Source, please?

Go look at his signature on his WB contracts. He was named after his father's trio, the hospital simply made a mistake. Which happens all the time.

Pic here: http://prince.org/msg/7/88343

Look at the name on these court papers: http://misstilaomg.com/20...contracts/

So your "source" is the signature of a guy who spent 8 years signing with a symbol??

If its "Roger" on the BC then its Roger legally unless he or his guardians filed and confirmed an affidavit of change, regardless of whether he or his dad wanted an "s". I've seen the BC, but so far, I haven't seen the affidavit. That will be the only source. There may well be one.

Feel free to dig it up. Until then, stop spread bullcrap. I might have to report you.

Have you got any further in the book? Has it improved?

wahclavinet said:

... actually the mic thing was from the HQ Jan 2006 interview: "We had one conversation about snare mics once after I recorded IWTBYL where he wanted an SM57. On IWTBYL I used a customized AKG 452 and it sounded great, He was very opinionated and really should have left well enough alone but I did as he asked as the rest of the tracks sounded less snappy. We did use his drums though. We recorded the album 16 track 2" at his request."

Hmmm...that looks like it was written by Gary Brandt himself (as opposed to transcribed from an interview), which suggests that he actually used IWTBYL...

Even so, I'd be tempted to throw in a [sic] even if it was Gary's choice of acronym.

Already there are so many sentences (usually quotes) that I've been able to put into Google and trace to another source, be it another book, a magazine article or another online source (like the one above).

I'm surprised that these aren't cited - I would have thought it good practice to cite any quotes that you didn't get directly from a person, though that of course would have posed a significant problem for the author, given how many footnotes that would take. Am I being overly fussy? Is it generally accepted practice that if a quote exists in the public domain (via magazine or internet article, even another book, etc...) it can be used uncited?

SquirrelMeat said:

So your "source" is the signature of a guy who spent 8 years signing with a symbol??

The source is the very person whose name is the focus of the discussion.

If its "Roger" on the BC then its Roger legally unless he or his guardians filed and confirmed an affidavit of change, regardless of whether he or his dad wanted an "s". I've seen the BC, but so far, I haven't seen the affidavit. That will be the only source. There may well be one.

So if the birth certificate had a less contentious typo, such as "Rogetrs", would it be right to title the chapter "Prince Rogetrs Nelson", despite the fact that Prince signs his name "Rogers" and has always been known as "Rogers" and it's common knowledge that he was named after his father's trio, the Prince Rogers Trio?

If no one in a position to do so changed the birth certificate (or offered proof of this change to the public) on the basis that a typo in the middle name on a birth certificate is not such a big deal, does that mean everyone has to stick to what's on that certificate, despite almost overwhelming evidence that it wasn't the intention of his parents for his middle name to be spelled that way, nor does Prince himself spell it that way in his signature?

Regardless, to name the first chapter this way without as much as a reference as to why the author is going against what most fans would understand his name to be is a quick way to alienate a good percentage of your readers from the get-go.

Chiquetet said:

wahclavinet said:

Thanks for the links about the name. They only show how a person who is trying to sue Prince spells his legal name, not how he signs it personally. I haven't ever seen any quotes from any person directly connected to Prince that a correction was made to the name on the birth certificate.

One of the threads Bart linked to had a picture of his signature on the WB contract - http://prince.org/msg/7/88343

This is helpful to see. The link Bart posted above doesn't lead to this photo of the signature.

Looking forward to hearing more about the book and the Eddie Miller / Matt Fink interviews as people read more!

Chiquetet said:

Hmmm...that looks like it was written by Gary Brandt himself (as opposed to transcribed from an interview), which suggests that he actually used IWTBYL...

Even so, I'd be tempted to throw in a [sic] even if it was Gary's choice of acronym.

This interview was done by Cameron (Groovement) for HQ a few years ago. Cameron, are you on the org??? It doesn't say whether Gary emailed his answers or if they talked by phone. I always thought of these long acronyms as being things that only appeared on Prince fan sites though.

[Edited 5/5/11 21:18pm]

SquirrelMeat said:

BartVanHemelen said:

Go look at his signature on his WB contracts. He was named after his father's trio, the hospital simply made a mistake. Which happens all the time.

Pic here: http://prince.org/msg/7/88343

Look at the name on these court papers: http://misstilaomg.com/20...contracts/

So your "source" is the signature of a guy who spent 8 years signing with a symbol??

If its "Roger" on the BC then its Roger legally unless he or his guardians filed and confirmed an affidavit of change, regardless of whether he or his dad wanted an "s". I've seen the BC, but so far, I haven't seen the affidavit. That will be the only source. There may well be one.

Feel free to dig it up. Until then, stop spread bullcrap. I might have to report you.

Have you got any further in the book? Has it improved?

In what world did Prince sign contracts with the symbol?

That middle name always confused. For years, I thought it was Rogers, then I come to visit Prince sites, and there's a discussion if it's Roger or Rogers. Maybe it was a clerical error that his name was Prince Roger Nelson, rather than Rogers... but yeah that's confusing but it's known he was named after his father's band though.

[Edited 5/5/11 22:40pm]

Chiquetet said:

SquirrelMeat said:

So your "source" is the signature of a guy who spent 8 years signing with a symbol??

The source is the very person whose name is the focus of the discussion.

If its "Roger" on the BC then its Roger legally unless he or his guardians filed and confirmed an affidavit of change, regardless of whether he or his dad wanted an "s". I've seen the BC, but so far, I haven't seen the affidavit. That will be the only source. There may well be one.

So if the birth certificate had a less contentious typo, such as "Rogetrs", would it be right to title the chapter "Prince Rogetrs Nelson", despite the fact that Prince signs his name "Rogers" and has always been known as "Rogers" and it's common knowledge that he was named after his father's trio, the Prince Rogers Trio?

Prince as a reliable source??

Which ever way you look at it, unless there is an affidavit, then the birth certificate is the legal standing. Typo or not. I'm not trying to be clever here, I'm just helping establish the facts as they stand. There are already enough Prince "facts" being lost or twisted over time.

We don't know for a fact whether the trio was "Prince Rogers" or "Prince Roger's". If Prince was named after "Prince Roger's Trio", then it would stand that the birth certificate is correct and he would be named "Prince Roger".

My guess (and this is only a guess) is that Prince played the whole "s" thing to be different, and that in his generation "Roger" was not a cool name. He was just hiding the truth, like he has done many times about his clildhood and parentage.

Spinlight said:

SquirrelMeat said:

So your "source" is the signature of a guy who spent 8 years signing with a symbol??

If its "Roger" on the BC then its Roger legally unless he or his guardians filed and confirmed an affidavit of change, regardless of whether he or his dad wanted an "s". I've seen the BC, but so far, I haven't seen the affidavit. That will be the only source. There may well be one.

Feel free to dig it up. Until then, stop spread bullcrap. I might have to report you.

Have you got any further in the book? Has it improved?

In what world did Prince sign contracts with the symbol?

He put it on contracts too?? I would doubt it, but who knows. I've only seen the many items he signed only with a symbol in the time period he claimed to have changed his name. In fact, he was signing memorabilia pre 1993 with just the symbol. The earliest I have was 1991.

Hoping to keep this thread alive ... what are you guys finding as you get further into the book? Any new interviews? Any good stuff?

All this talk over an "S" huh....

They are probably enjoying it so much they haven't been back to update this forum!!

I think that means go and buy it LOL

SquirrelMeat said:

Chiquetet said:

So if the birth certificate had a less contentious typo, such as "Rogetrs", would it be right to title the chapter "Prince Rogetrs Nelson", despite the fact that Prince signs his name "Rogers" and has always been known as "Rogers" and it's common knowledge that he was named after his father's trio, the Prince Rogers Trio?

Prince as a reliable source??

Which ever way you look at it, unless there is an affidavit, then the birth certificate is the legal standing. Typo or not. I'm not trying to be clever here, I'm just helping establish the facts as they stand. There are already enough Prince "facts" being lost or twisted over time.

We don't know for a fact whether the trio was "Prince Rogers" or "Prince Roger's". If Prince was named after "Prince Roger's Trio", then it would stand that the birth certificate is correct and he would be named "Prince Roger".

My guess (and this is only a guess) is that Prince played the whole "s" thing to be different, and that in his generation "Roger" was not a cool name. He was just hiding the truth, like he has done many times about his clildhood and parentage.

Indeed, as the birth announcement that was sold recently on ebay also said Prince Roger Nelson !!

If the birth certificate said "Prince Roger", then it's Prince Roger. End of story.

Timmy84 said:

If the birth certificate said "Prince Roger", then it's Prince Roger. End of story.

Yes, its much more likely that 'Rogers' is incorrect as there's no evidence to support that, whilst there seems to be plenty of evidence to suggest it's Roger.

TheFreakerFantastic said:

Timmy84 said:

If the birth certificate said "Prince Roger", then it's Prince Roger. End of story.

Yes, its much more likely that 'Rogers' is incorrect as there's no evidence to support that, whilst there seems to be plenty of evidence to suggest it's Roger.

Right.

Has anyone read more of the book yet? How about the chapter on Parade? That would definitely be an album it would be cool to hear more details about besides what we already know from DMSR / The Vault.

wahclavinet said:

... actually the mic thing was from the HQ Jan 2006 interview: "We had one conversation about snare mics once after I recorded IWTBYL where he wanted an SM57. On IWTBYL I used a customized AKG 452 and it sounded great, He was very opinionated and really should have left well enough alone but I did as he asked as the rest of the tracks sounded less snappy. We did use his drums though. We recorded the album 16 track 2" at his request."

I hope the whole book isn't just reused quotes!

I'm into the Purple Rain-chapter now (35%-40% intot he book), and so far it looks like the author has simply compiled all quotes where people talk about Prince's studio habits, with very little investigation of his own. I can't shake the feeling this book needs an editor, to weed out the contradictions and inconsistencies (album titles are in italics, or in italics and quotes, or just in quotes etcetera...) and repeated statements (just read a line where he uses the word "majority" twice in one sentence!).

I do like that someone has done this much work in collecting all these sources, but IMHO he should be crediting the sources each time so readers would know when he's brining in new information. So far I haven't read anything revealing.

Quite frankly, if Prince hadn't waged war on his fans from 1996 on, I bet that this book would have never been written since all of this info would be available in one kick-ass Wiki or something alike. But now he has a potential market since a lot of this info is spread all over the web and in not easily obtainable books and on websites that are now gone etcetera. I just wish he was clearer about where it all comes from.

(And the quotes from Rolling Stone reviews of Prince albums are seriously annoying me.)

IMHO the book is also flawed in looking at each album as a seperate chapter, and virtually ignorign the side projects etc. Per Nilsen has demonstrated that plenty of times album tracks get pulled from various sessions, get reworked, etcetera. His approach works for numerous artists who actually have "album sessions", but Prince has abandoned this early on in his career and gone for a more fluid way of working.

I am surprised by how Prince et al had access to expensive state of the art hardware already early on, before Purple Rain became a monster hit.

BartVanHemelen said:

I am surprised by how Prince et al had access to expensive state of the art hardware already early on, before Purple Rain became a monster hit.

Bart, you got to remember that Prince was already a big star then and his most recent album had been 1999 which sold millions, so I'm not surprised he had all this expensive hardware. WB would have invested in him especially as they wanted PR to be a big hit.

They weren't tight on investing in general I mean hell they even let him build Paisley Park in 1987 - which other artist gets given the funding to build their own big studio!

[Edited 5/9/11 10:27am]

[Edited 5/9/11 10:30am]