Wall said:

It must be a nice feeling to always agree with the media/critics. It never happened that they called mediocre something that you loved?

Wall said:

"educated"? I don't know if I would use that word.
There have been more than a handfull of reviews that gave tepid praise for MPLSOUND, would you call them educated? Edna Gunderson of the USA TODAY?

I may give a little more weight to the opinions of a hand full of music and movie critics when they recommend something, but educated? from where? a communications course?
Its all a matter of taste, and who's taste you agree with.

Sure its fun to read what is supposed to be an unbiased opinion from someone who isn't a fam, but I read a lot of reviewers that seem a little "un-educated" too.

LiveToTell86 said:

Educated or not, critics are also, if it benefits them, revisionists. My point isn't that since the majority of critics are lukewarm to Prince's latest flop(s) that they're the final word on the matter, but that it's their reaction to the music, nothing more or less.

Suggesting that there's a sort of old boys network in the media that wouldn't dare write a negative word against acts like Springsteen or U2 while poor Prince is picked on, is a just another case of fans huddling together and playing the part of persecuted victims. It reminds me of religious zealots. When someone questions or doubts their dogma with say scientific or empirical data, they become conspiracy minded, believing everyone is out to get them. No doubt if Prince's albums were receiving rave reviews (outside of about.com) such nonsense wouldn't be floated. Deal with it -- everyone outside of the Purple Kingdom finds the music average, at best. Which is because the music is average at best.
[Edited 4/1/09 5:40am]

Ugot2shakesumthin said:

She's been in Prince's back pocket for years. If I recall correctly, and I might be wrong, she was invited to one of his listening parties.



I already addressed this. But I'd be willing to wager the majority of music critics hold degrees and have a wide breadth of popular music knowledge. And if their opinions didn't matter, we wouldn't have a whole thread dedicated to them, would we? They only don't matter when they don't rave about Prince.

Wall said:

They matter of course, they are the ones who in a way officially shape what the public sees.
I was just talking about the word "eduacted"
.....and likewise, will they matter to you when they DO like an album like MNPLSOUND which beyond me IS getting positive feedback from the "educated" reviewers.
[Edited 4/1/09 5:53am]

Wall said:

So I see those who disagree with the reviews and say that it's unfair Bruce or U2 got more stars are "religious zealots" but those who happen to agree with them (i.e. you) are speaking the eternal truth, because it is definitely a FACT that the music is average at best.

I'm still waiting for your answer to my question, whether there was anything in the past that was panned by most of the critics but you loved it and were defending it.

LiveToTell86 said:

I said people who believe there's a bias for certain artists but a bias against Prince are akin to religious believers who create a false reality where they are persecuted victims. Deal with reality. People don't find the work remarkable beyond a handful of tracks, simple as that.

I don't recall saying anyone who agrees with me is speaking 'eternal truth' but thanks for the compliment.



Sorry, this is the first time I saw the question. I can't think of anything off the top of my head but I'm sure there's any number of things I've enjoyed or disliked that a media or art critic didn't.

'under the cherry moon' and 'graffiti bridge' spring to mind.

Wall said:

I think that’s a fair comment.

As much as the fans on this site enjoy the tracks …they do not have the universal appeal as his ‘greatest hits’.

Here's one not on the list: http://www.nytimes.com/20....html?_r=1

ThiefInTheTemple said:

wtf ??? 5 stars each?????

and Prince only gets 3 stars... hmm strange , very strange...

I didn't see this posted

http://www.washingtonpost...03668.html

By J. Freedom du Lac
Washington Post Staff Writer
Saturday, March 28, 2009; Page C01

It isn't always easy loving Prince -- which seems to be just how the brilliant but occasionally baffling musician wants it.

This week, Prince launched a splashy intergalactic Web site, LOtUSFLOW3R.com, offering his most obsessive fans a year's worth of access to various manifestations of his creative genius -- including an early crack at his new, at-times-terrific triple-titled triple album -- for $77. But before they could sign up, they had to figure out how to get past the site's instruction-free front page, a task that required the unearthing of two clues stashed like Easter eggs on the page.

Once the user registered, the Prince treasure hunt continued, with three new albums ("LOtUSFLOW3R" and "MPLSoUND," plus a new protege's project, "Elixer," co-written and co-produced by Prince) stashed in different sections of the Flash-heavy site. To access "MPLSoUND," for instance, one had to triple-click the strings of the powder-blue Fender Stratocaster that popped onto the screen only after one clicked on the white swan with a headphone jack for a head. And no, I was not dreaming when I wrote this.

This is how Prince treats his most devoted fans?

After running the digital gantlet, though, there was a real reward, not just in the archival videos and other extras that were pulled from Prince's vaults and splashed throughout the site, but also in some of the new music, too.

The guitar-heavy "LOtUSFLOW3R" and the funked-up "MPLSoUND" are not exactly all-time Prince classics, but they're filled with enough standout musical moments to keep discerning musicologists happy. (As always, they're also filled with titles that look like typos -- further evidence that the unspoken life's mission of His Royal Badness is to drive copy editors crazy.) The generally strong quality comes as something of a relief, given some of his earlier, execrable efforts, from "The Rainbow Children" to "Come."

The sprawling three-album set will be available exclusively at Target stores and on the company's no-Easter-eggs-required Web site beginning tomorrow for $11.98. Including the tracks from "Elixer" -- a limpid, fairly generic set of airy, cooing soul by Bria Valente, who is Prince's new Tamar (who was supposed to be his new Apollonia) -- that works out to roughly 4 cents per song.

Call it the Prince stimulus package! And don't bother with the double-entendre: The formerly freak-nasty singer scraped his dirty mind -- and music -- out of the gutter when he became a Jehovah's Witness. One reminder comes on "Love Like Jazz," a snoozy "LOtUSFLOW3R" song on which Prince, now 50, sounds downright tame as he sings about the female form over some Esquivel-style lounge music.

Prince could have easily cut this and several other duds (helter-skelter surf-pop song "No More Candy 4 U," the cranky hip-hop rant "Ol' Skool Company") to make a single, superlative disc out of the project. But he'd apparently rather leave the editing to others. That, and he opted to keep his musical personalities separate.

"LOtUSFLOW3R" is a moody, meandering, esoteric psychedelic-rock album on which the little purple polyglot gets in touch with his inner "Purple Haze" and pays homage to Jimi Hendrix via liberal use of Hendrix's sonic signatures, from the wah-wah that opens "Dreamer" to the driving fuzztone chords of the explosive workout "Wall of Berlin."

It's one guitar virtuoso feting another, with Prince turning in dazzling instrumental performances on track (the simmering statement song "Colonized Mind") after track (the tender but blistering "Boom"). Occasionally, though, the instrumental prowess simply sounds self-indulgent, as on the New Age almost-instrumental "Back 2 the Lotus," whose shifty, spacey jazz chords suggest Prince trying out for Phish.

Prince turns his funkier side loose on "MPLSoUND" (short for Minneapolis Sound), which is full of frisky club songs that tend to blend the musician's vintage synth-and-drums sound with some modern twists, most notably the Auto-Tune vocal effect. Whereas Auto-Tune can be a dangerous weapon in the hands of some artists, Prince uses it sparingly to add to the giddy feel of club jams such as the boastful "(There'll Never B) Another Like Me" and the high-octane standout "Chocolate Box." It's thrilling stuff that serves as a reminder of why we loved Prince in the first place.

The set has a rocky critical reception, but one thing I notice is that there's a tendency to say one of the albums is almost -- almost -- great, except it keeps changing. Some give their 3 stars/3 stars and a half to lotusflow3r and others to MPLSound.

Here is Rolling Stone's review, pretty typical of the syndrome :

http://www.rollingstone.c...otusflow3r

ThiefInTheTemple said:

really, who cares what they say about music? now how big are the tits of the cover girl in this edition?

myloveis4ever said:

Exactly

Could it be that the mixed reviews from the media are because this album isn't affiliated with a label. Didn't 3121 get mostly good reviews?

I personally think the reviewers have got this one wrong. LF is some of his best work in ages.

DelaFunk said:

In your opinion, of course.

I don't think the mixed reviews are down to label affiliation or otherwise, more down to the quality of the records (and quality vs. quantity) especially when compared to what he's done previously and therefore the standards we know he's capable of. For many, his music over the last few years has exuded rather a "will this do?" quality, and that's why he's lost fans and the respect of reviewers, regardless of how great a live performer he is. Notice that his shows get rave reviews, yet his records don't anymore. That should tell you something.

Nasalhair said:

I just love your handle.

Aerogram said:

Great call on the "syndrome"...Very astute...


But...I think all of this talk on the org about the project receiving rocky criticism has been overstated...On metacritic which tracks various reviews of movies and music, the Lotus has gotten a 69 (which equates to: "generally favorable reviews") It's getting pretty good reviews considering its a three album package complete with a newcomer that is dwarfed by you know who...

http://www.metacritic.com...otusflow3r

Anxiety said:

Here's another from San Jose Mercury News

http://www.mercurynews.co...source=rss

Prince's new three-album set includes some winners
By J. Freedom du Lac


Washington Post

Posted: 04/03/2009 12:00:00 AM PDT


It isn't always easy loving Prince — which seems to be just how the brilliant but occasionally baffling musician wants it.

Late last month, Prince launched a splashy intergalactic Web site, LOtUSFLOW3R.com, offering his most obsessive fans a year's worth of access to various manifestations of his creative genius — including an early crack at his new, at-times-terrific triple-titled triple album — for $77.

But before they could sign up, they had to figure out how to get past the site's instruction-free front page, a task that required the unearthing of two clues stashed like Easter eggs on the page.

Once the user registered, the Prince treasure hunt continued, with three new albums ("LOtUSFLOW3R" and "MPLSoUND," plus a new protege's project, "Elixer," co-written and co-produced by Prince) stashed in different sections of the Flash-heavy site.

To access "MPLSoUND," for instance, one had to triple-click the strings of the powder-blue Fender Stratocaster that popped onto the screen only after one clicked on the white swan with a headphone jack for a head. And no, I was not dreaming when I wrote this.

This is how Prince treats his most devoted fans?

After running the digital gauntlet, though, there was a real reward, not just in the archival videos and other extras that were pulled from Prince's vaults and splashed throughout the site, but also in some of the new music
too.

The guitar-heavy "LOtUSFLOW3R" and the funked-up "MPLSoUND" are not exactly all-time Prince classics, but they're filled with enough standout musical moments to keep discerning musicologists happy. (As always, they're also filled with titles that look like typos — further evidence that the unspoken life's mission of His Royal Badness is to drive copy editors crazy.)

The generally strong quality comes as something of a relief, given some of his earlier, execrable efforts, from "The Rainbow Children" to "Come."

The sprawling three-album set is now available exclusively at Target stores and on the company's no-Easter-eggs-required Web site for $11.98. Including the tracks from "Elixer" — a limpid, fairly generic set of airy, cooing soul by Bria Valente, who is Prince's new Tamar (who was supposed to be his new Apollonia) — that works out to roughly 4 cents per song.

Call it the Prince stimulus package! And don't bother with the double-entendre: The formerly freak-nasty singer scraped his dirty mind — and music — out of the gutter when he became a Jehovah's Witness. One reminder comes on "Love Like Jazz," a snoozy "LOtUSFLOW3R" song on which Prince, now 50, sounds downright tame as he sings about the female form over some Esquivel-style lounge music.

Prince could have easily cut this and several other duds (helter-skelter surf-pop song "No More Candy 4 U," the cranky hip-hop rant "Ol' Skool Company") to make a single, superlative disc out of the project. But he'd apparently rather leave the editing to others. That, and he opted to keep his musical personalities separate.

"LOtUSFLOW3R" is a moody, meandering, esoteric psychedelic-rock album on which the little purple polyglot gets in touch with his inner "Purple Haze" and pays homage to Jimi Hendrix via liberal use of Hendrix's sonic signatures, from the wah-wah that opens "Dreamer" to the driving fuzztone chords of the explosive workout "Wall of Berlin."

It's one guitar virtuoso feting another, with Prince turning in dazzling instrumental performances on track (the simmering statement song "Colonized Mind") after track (the tender but blistering "Boom"). Occasionally, though, the instrumental prowess simply sounds self-indulgent, as on the New Age almost-instrumental "Back 2 the Lotus," whose shifty, spacey jazz chords suggest Prince trying out for Phish.

Prince turns his funkier side loose on "MPLSoUND" (short for Minneapolis Sound), which is full of frisky club songs that tend to blend the musician's vintage synth and drums with some modern twists, most notably the Auto-Tune vocal effect.

Whereas Auto-Tune can be a dangerous weapon in the hands of some artists, Prince uses it sparingly to add to the giddy feel of club jams such as the boastful "(There'll Never B) Another Like Me" and the high-octane standout "Chocolate Box." It's thrilling stuff that serves as a reminder of why we loved Prince in the first place.

Smittyrock70 said:

Two of my very favourites. Execrable? If I was psychotic I'd murder this silly man.

http://www.tampabay.com/f...989674.ece

As the father of two young daughters, I naturally spend great chunks of time thinking about Prince. Not because he might someday date my girls or because he's roughly their height. No, I ponder the Purple One because he once bragged about needing only two hours of sleep per night. He shuns shut-eye and writes When Doves Cry. I miss sleep and inadvertently diaper my kid's head. A subtle distinction, but a telling one.

My point, if it's not incredibly clear by now, is that Prince is a wee freak of nature. There aren't many minutes in the day when the Minneapolis mite isn't making music, the midnight hour included. And this super­heroic sleeplessness leads us perfectly to his new incredibly ambitious, altogether odd album — or albums. The three-disc Lotusflow3r, available exclusively at Target for $11.98, sounds as if it were recorded in one long REM-free night, a sexy first-take spin through distinct parts of the 50-year-old's paisley psyche.

Prince's three-headed experiment is not without its bumps; an entire disc is dedicated to new protege Bria Valente, with Prince producing, playing, drooling, etc. And all three discs could use some xxxtra booty-bumping bass. But with the exception of Bria, the three-pronged package makes for good make-out music … and, if you're feelin' lucky, maybe a little bit more, too.

The album breakdown goes like this: There's the funky, boot-knocking MPLSound, a nine-track disc of synth-frisky funk and Rick James squirm. Prince can rip this stuff out in a hurry, and he probably did. But it's still tasty, especially the crazy-kinky double entendre of Chocolate Box and straight groover Dance 4 Me. If you wanna slow-jam with your lovah, try U're Gonna C Me, which reminds me of his sprawling Scandalous on 1989's Batman soundtrack. For a dude who has seen more thighs than Colonel Sanders, Prince has always played the unsure lover well, and here he's either wounded or woozy from love. MPLSound loses velocity late in the game, but it's the comp's strongest disc.

Much more organic — jazzy time-changes, Hendrixian guitar moans, lyrics that long to inspire rather than seduce — is the 12-track Lotusflow3r. From the grinding rock squelch of Boom to a cover of Crimson and Clover made with the same ingredients in Purple Rain, the disc is one steady guitar jam, Prince proving that he picks as well as parties. Much of it plays like self-indulgent noodling (Love Like Jazz is unintended elevator music), but the hard-nosed Dreamer puts Prince firmly in Electric Lady Land, reminding us that he bows to Jimi just as well as he does to James Brown.

MPLSound and Lotusflow3r are huge improvements over Prince's 2007 output, the execrable Planet Earth. As for the final disc, well, it's a "bonus" at best, a drink coaster at worst. Called Elixer, it's the quiet-storm debut of Prince's newest vanity project (or, for that matter, Apollonia project). There's nothing particularly interesting about Bria Valente; she sounds like Janet Jackson, but without the nasty or the Jackson. Prince himself writes, produces, drops in guitar solos. But compared to the rest of the disc, Elixer is a parking brake on a good time. Then again, at the very least, Bria Valente will help me sleep at night. And Lord knows I could use some.

Sean Daly can be reached at sdaly@sptimes.com or (727) 893-8467. His Pop Life blog is at blogs.tampabay.com/popmusic.



Prince, Lotusflow3r (NPG) GRADE: B-



Let's go crazy … and back again

For a good chunk of the 1990s, Prince was a symbol, that symbol, an erotic squiggle that was better as a punch line than a form of protest against his record label.

While we're glad that madness is over, Prince's doodle-pad art makes for a good demarcation point in his career. So here are three favorite pre-symbol albums, plus two later (read: sane, brilliant) ones.

Pre-Symbol Albums

1. Purple Rain (1984) Every note inspired, awesome — yes, especially Darling Nikki.

2. Around the World in a Day (1985) Raspberry Beret is the hit, but the funky, angry America is the jaw dropper.

3. Sign o' the Times (1987) Prince's slow descent into Loonyville had already commenced, but the

lucid moments here — Housequake, If I Was Your Girlfriend — are among his underrated best.

Post-Symbol Albums

1. Musicology (2004) After a long layoff, partytime Prince returned with this brassy, funky tribute to James Brown. One of his best … of any period.

2. 3121 (2006) Whereas Musicology was the sound of an R&B jam session, 3121 was strictly the sound of Prince's libido. Boom, boom, boom. Turn up the bass, turn down the sheets.

Sean Daly, Times pop music critic

Allmusic guide fives LOtUSFLOW3R 3 stars out of 5.

http://www.allmusic.com/c...foxz80ldde

Left to his own devices, Prince will indulge in his peculiar vice of releasing triple-albums. He celebrated his freedom from Warner with Emancipation, following that with another triple-disc in Crystal Ball, which just happened to be the provisional title of the scrapped three-LP iteration of 1987's Sign o' the Times, he had a triple-live set in 2002, and now he's navigating the rough waters of online distribution and exclusive contracts with big box retailers in 2009 with another triple-disc set called LotusFlow3r. Technically, one of the three discs here isn't a Prince album: Elixer is the debut of Bria Valente, the latest in a long line of sultry soul protégés. Many of Prince's hand-picked singers have been largely ignored even by his loyalists since about 1987, so Prince pushes Bria by bundling her record with his own LotusFlow3r and MPLSound, even going so far as to list Elixer first among the three on the back of the CD's slim cardboard sleeve. This attempt at old-fashioned star-making might have worked if Bria Valente had a smidgeon of star charisma, but she's merely a pleasantly breathy crooner, slipping easily into Prince's shimmering, quiet storm production. Her slight personality shifts the spotlight to Prince's versatility, which is part of the point of the whole set. Each album serves a different function: Elixer is his smooth soul exercise, LotusFlow3r his guitar showcase, and MPLSound a revival of his '80s funk. By its very nature, the Bria Valente disc winds up as the most consistent and least interesting of the three, never straying from its seductive template, but that doesn't mean it's the worst; it just lacks the highs of the other two, but it also lacks the lows. Of the three, MPLSound winds up with the greatest number of both highs and lows, while LotusFlow3r is constrained by its guitar-heavy concept, offering great moments instead of great whole songs. This suggests that LotusFlow3r has moments of fury akin to the closing solo of "Let's Go Crazy" or the glorious passion of "Purple Rain," but apart from the Hendrixian "Dreamer," the album is nearly as smooth as Elixer, with even the clenched, pumping riff of "Feel Good, Feel Better, Feel Wonderful" soon giving way to an amiable funk work-out. Amiably pretty much defines all of LotusFlow3r, which winds up being all about groove and fleeting bits of six-string color which may be enough for the faithful, but not many others. Those less-dedicated listeners — i.e., those who prefer tightly written songs and varied production — will be drawn to MPLSound, where Prince takes his retro-mission seriously enough to offer up a few songs nervy enough to be singles, even if the synthesized thrill of this handful of tunes is undercut by a bunch of slow-burning ballads that do their best to rival "The Arms of Orion." It's best to focus on such tight, funky electro grooves as "(There'll Never B) Another Like Me" and "Ol' Skool Company," two songs that spotlight Prince's impish humor, a quality that's largely absent on the rest of the triple-disc set (it's not entirely a coincidence that these are the only cuts that address the modern digital world, either). But as good as these two cuts are, they're not as imaginative or as vigorous as the best of 3121 or Musicology, a flaw that illustrates yet another strange fact about Prince: after all these years, he's now far weirder when he knows people are paying attention than when he's off pursuing his own surprisingly earth-bound flights of fancy.

that's a very lame review especially coming from Allmusic!

Entertainment Weekly can eat my butt... I subscribe, but I was PO'ed when they said on their bullseye page, "We H8 it...3 discs and not enough good songs to fill one." or whatever the H they said. After all, they gave Planet Earth a B. I agree Planet Earth was one that had to grow on me, but to say that this new set sucks compared to Planet Earth. What planet are EW on?

Papaj said:[quote]Allmusic guide fives LOtUSFLOW3R 3 stars out of 5.

http://www.allmusic.com/c...foxz80ldde



I STILL find it minbogling that so many reviews cite M-Sound as the better disk.
Oh well, such is life, I'm not giving M-sound any more spins to try and figure this out.
[Edited 4/5/09 20:13pm]

Great review from "Billboard":

http://www.billboard.com/...8659.story

Lotusflow3r:

Prince has given away albums with concert tickets and (in the United Kingdom) with Sunday newspapers, but the $11.98 price for this three-CD bundle exclusive to Target compares very favorably to free. One disc, "Elixer," features newcomer Bria Valente, and it's about average for albums from Prince protégés. The other two are peak Prince. "Lotusflow3r" has Prince channeling his Hendrix spirit guide on a cover of "Crimson & Clover" shot through with riffs from "Wild Thing"; on "Wall of Berlin" and "Dreamer," he squeezes the Jimi out of his guitar until you can almost see the hologram. Other strong tracks include the conscious funk of "Colonized Mind," which evokes Gil Scott-Heron; "Love Like Jazz," which could be an eroticized Steely Dan tune circa "The Royal Scam"; and "Feel Good, Feel Better, Feel Wonderful," with James Brown horns and squealing guitars. "Mplsound" is sometimes stronger still, with the party whoop of "(There'll Never B) Another Like Me," the delicious dirty mind of "Chocolate Box" and "Ol' Skool Company," which will have you partying like its 1985. -- Wayne Robins

livewire said:

Bwahahahaha. LotusFlow3r et al will be forgotten by year's end, except for the odd critic who will put it on his list just because he/she wants to be "special".

I think the AllMusic review is decent, it brings up some fair points.

I do like "The Arms Of Orion" reference, such a cool track!
[Edited 4/6/09 11:15am]

Just simply put, Loving my Lotus Flow3r Experience.

Haven't stopped listening since I first heard "Dreamer" live on Leno. A couple of songs go on repeat and these albums just give a feel from back in the day.

Thanks Prince & Bria