I dont totally agree, Im sure the same things been said about other artists and there have been black artists that have played music that some dont asscociate with what they think black people should play, look at the band Badbrains,that wasnt conforming they just wanted to be a punk band, I think Prince always just did what he wanted to do plus he's a Gemini so he's naturally got like 4 different personas, and he absorbs all different types things and influences.

DynamicSavior said:

I agree, I became a fan in 83 Im still a fan but there was a certain energy in those early years

OskarKristio said:

Offer better wording to this viewpoint. What is "seeing no colorlines" supposed to mean? Sounds like self-delusion. Better to be self deluded? Perhaps you mean he should see colorlines then reject them etc.

GoldenGlove said:

. Children.

Prince is working up a Black Sweat ya'll.
It's about funk smelling like fish but tastin' like KFC.

Morningstar said:

Uh I don't think so. The only thing Mani better watch out for is them twins sisters cuz they are LIGHTER than her. Tamar is not a threat. Prince ain't changed that much.

Graycap23 said:

You're right about his enviroment, being from Minneapolis and all.

* Can anyone post pictures of his mother Mattie. I have only seen 2 pictures of her, one of them was the Purple Rain premiere. Last time I saw her she looked like a black woman and she was heavy set.

SpecialEd said:

Thank the lord somebody said it. At the time I remember seeing Under the Cherry Moon and being amazed at the lack of black faces in the movie, not to mention the leading lady. I just remember finding it all interesting considering the power he had in the filming of the movie.

I also remember those old interviews, his black fans noticing the lack of black women in his camp, black radio stations complaining they were left off of the list for concert tickets when he came to town, and a number of other things. And to top it off, these things were happening at the height of his career. At the time, VERY FEW, if any, white artist used black women in their videos, especially as leads, and then to have a black man write and produce a movie and the majority of the cast is white? (Please don't think with today's mind where things are more integrated) At that time those of us who had a black consciousness noticed those things.

That's why today when I hear people say things like "Prince has been working with a lot of black people in recent years", or I witness a BLACK WOMAN in Houston during the Musicology Tour complain that Prince didn't choose enough white people to go on stage ( I obviously still haven't gotten over that one ), I say good for him. He is making up ground.

Besides, Is it all that off the wall that a black artist work with majority black people?

Graycap23 said:

Yeah, Prince grew up in Minneapolis but so did Morris Day and the Time, Jimmy and Terry, and Alexander O'Neil.

I know Prince had to "play the game" like most Black Americans have to to a degree, I'm just glad he realized game time was over.
[Edited 3/1/06 13:54pm]

He never really left it. Although Prince favours multi racial players in his groups, dosent mean hes unconscious to being black. Musicology s one of the blackest and funkiest things hes done in years along with Black Sweat.
I think People confused Prince as white concious as he had a light changeable skin colour, especially Parade and Slave eras, where he looks more Polynesian than black, and the fact he could write, play and produce what was essentially white/ white friendly rock/pop.
Prince has always been there, the slave era was a stance at White (Mostly Jewish) owned record companies cheating black artists and ripping them off. But like Hendrix Prince wasnt black power though, I think Prince wanted to be accepted for wwho he was (Color of skin didnt mean much to him, but he wasnt blind to blatant discrimination. Hes always had black conciousness songs on his albums.
What u may find is world fans such as myself are not so concerned about race in Princes music but more the quality and scope of his music.
Prince has and always will be black and a citizen of the world.

I'm sorry but I have to add one more thing.

This may sound bad but I just don't know how else to put it. I think Prince also realized that black people have a special love for him. We were with him from the very very beginning. And even during the height of his carrer, when there seemed to be so few black women in his camp, the total left field direction his music went to, black people, particularly black women continued to be his back bone and continued to respect and love Prince like never before.

None of this is to say that other communities do not adore Prince, it's just with black people I feel it is a little different.

IMO, black people have a special type of love relationship with certain people. Black folk love Denzel, Halle, Luther Vandross, Frankie Beverly and Maze, Bill Clinton, and Prince. I can't quite explain the type of love it is, but it's a love and respect that seems like only black folk understand, and I think Prince realized that. I mean of course his consciousness of blackness could be because of a million other things but I think what I stated above is also one of them.

VelvetJ said:

I agree. That's why I'm not in corporate America right now. It's played out. -Mg

VelvetJ said:

Hummm don't get me started. We need more Jamie Foxx types in this world. have you checked out his crew? Prince is way over due for this IMHO. -Mg

VelvetJ said:

Yeah it's all very well for those selfish "I liked him best when he didn't see colorlines" folk. He was their boy, while others went ignored.

Early Prince didn't give a fuck about color or much else. He purposely
created his band with a mixture of black and white, male and female people.
It was like he was saying he creates great MUSIC, it doesn't matter who's in
his band. His early songs were great, partly because everyone could relate, regardless of race. It's well documented that Prince created The Time as
an avenue to release his RnB songs.

Someone said that his "consciousness" about his race started during his WB battles. I think that is about right. A few afro-centric releases since:

Avalanche
Dear Mr Man
Black Sweat
When Will We B Paid?
Family Name

What does this mean? Probably nothing. Merely coincidence that his latest
work doesn't catch my fancy like his early work. That probably would have
happened with any artist.
The fact that Prince is happy about his race is great...great for him, great
for his race. There is absolutely nothing wrong with that, he's growing as
an individual. Hell, I love my race much more today than I did 25 years ago too.

zsazsa said:

You know you might be on to something. Prince is very intelligent and VERY savvy when it comes to self promotion. I always felt like during Sign of the Times and the Tony M years....actually even the Rave era he was trying to reach out to black people and intergrate more of into black culture. I wouldn't put it past him to consider it a marketing ploy...that is not to say he doesn't like being a black man (only he knows what he feels like deep down inside and his fans shouldn't bash him for it...if he has issues you can think whatever you want about it but he's the one that has to live with his feelings about how he feels about himself) or dislikes being with black people but that music critic Nelson George said back in the eighties that he just has a different way of relating or expressing his "blackness" because he has grown up intergrated.

Ok flame on!

pepper7 said:

First of all, you need to slow your roll 'cause you don't know me like that. Secondly, you may be having an argument but I'm having a discussion so I don't see the need here to vent your spleen on me. Third, simplistic questions get simplistic answers.

Would you ask the same of a gay person or a Jewish person?

Consciousness and acceptance of any aspect of one's self is an important ingredient in the emotional well being of anyone. The inability to acknowledge certain aspects of yourself is what produces the Michael Jacksons of the world. Should Prince become a characature of himself to keep from embracing a part of who he is?

It's disturbing how folks get mighty peeved up in here at the thought of a black man expressing too much of his "blackness". Like it or not, a "black consciosness if a part of who you are if you happen to be "black". No amount of "let's just pretend we're colorblind" delusional thinking will nurture that consciousness.

Evolution is not advanced by such pretense. It is advanced by acknowledging and accepting ourselves and one another for who we are and what we bring to the table and those that want others to suppress any portion of their identity and just assimilate are seeking their own comfort without regard to the well being of the other person. "Thinking like the keys on Prince's piano, we'll be just fine".

If prince has grown more comfortable expressing more of himself as he sees himself then he is dealing from a position of strengh and maybe that's what instills such fear and loathing in individuals such as yourself. I'm not getting the impression that you really want to know what "black consciosness" is. Perhaps you simply want it to go away.

It may rattle a whole lotta folks but Prince ain't gonna do the buck dance for nobody...just ask WB.

As a black woman who has loved, supported and followed Prine for more than 20 years - and I am only 30 - I have to say that I love the fact that Prince does not shy away from his blackness. One thing that I have always loved about him is his "brothaness." Even when there weren't any dark skinned women in his camp, he was always a brotha - his mannerisms, talk, everything. Too many black artists try to ingratiate themselves to the white mainstream. The problem with most of them is that they never wake up. There are countless people who I could name here.

In the early days, Prince was all about controversy, mystery and shattering taboos. This was all about marketing and making himself stand out during a time where the majority of acts were actually talented. Without all the controversy he couldn't have penned Controversy. The white women were all about taboos to me. So many black men go through that. However, His tastes tend to lean more toward fair skinned or mixed black women and Latinas. I am just happy that he doesn't feel the need to challenge taboos or create mystery anymore.

It is funny that we are talking about the lack of dark skinned women in Prince videos 20 years ago, because when you look at most black male artists' videos today, you are hard pressed to find a dark skinned black woman. The video girls are usually fair skinned, mixed, Latina or Asian.

Prince started noticeably "embracing" his blackness around Sign O The Times in my opinion. The addition of Cat and more black musicians not only showed an increased black awareness, it also improved his live sound.

bellanoche said:

bellanoche said:

What an interesting perspective. I love reading what is said here on the org cuz sometimes you get some really thought provoking reads like this!

ReverendHubert said:

Speaking as a non-black person with barely any real-life contact or experience with black people (the Org ? It's pretty far removed from the real world. )
I'm really not sure what to think. It's great that he's showing more pride than he used to, but the labelling he's made a point of in recent years seems a bit, I dunno. I won't say necessarily exclusionary, but it's interesting. I mean, I'm not sure I understand why now, after decades of an all-inclusionary Uptown vibe, he'd make a point of highlighting his race and sexuality.

He is what he is obviously, but I kinda liked it better when it was a non-issue. I don't care what colour you are, Prince. If it made a difference to me, I wouldn't be a fan in the first place.

tane1976 said:

U know, Hendrix is rumoured to have supported the Black Panthers. Check this out if u have the time:

http://blogcritics.org/ar...201823.php

about Jimi & the Black Panthers. (these r not my views, just sharing)

It seems Hendrix was supportive of the Black Panthers when they were rising up to create a stir in America. The government did not want rich rock stars funneling money to a group that threatened the status quo and the sovereignty of our nation (or so it was perceived at the time), thus the CIA made their ties with the Mafia's drug cartel to learn more about Jimi's habits and created an ongoing profile of his daily life. Not one person has stepped forward in over 35 years since Jimi's death to claim that they were with him when he died; therefore, the conclusion reached in a series of interviews with people that knew Jimi is that he was murdered in order to squelch the Black Panthers rise to power.

Source >>> http://blogcritics.org/ar...201823.php

ReverendHubert said:

In Electric Gypsy by Glebbek and Shapiro, it mentions Jimi Hendrix bought a copy of a Black Panther newspaper with Buddy Girl and Juma Sultan when he was in band of gypsys (Hendrix and Guy). Someone asked why he did, and Jimi said, because I thought I was supposed too, as opposed to him buying the Black Panther paper out of fascination. Black Power never really appealed to Jimi Much, he knew he was black like Prince but it never dominated his life. There may have been some conciousness in his music, but if others picked it up, Jimi barely noticed, if anything he was more interested in his Cherokee heritage, Songs like Red House and I don't live today for instance.

[quote]



Yes I would.



Michael Jackson is screwed up because his father was a strict disciplinarian and Michael has struggled to accept himself on all types of levels. Even as a man. He's like a little child because he can't accept himself. But there are many factors for this. Maybe being hugely famous and living in a make believe bubble. Michael believes he can buy anything. He has a disillusional view of reality.





Every individual is free to express themselves how they want regardless of the colour of there skin. Expressing your "blackness" sounds as rascist as saying to express your "whiteness". People don't need to be stereotyped by the colour of their skin.



That is only IF you aspire to that belief system. Religion and race are man made structures to some people. Some people don't feel a connection to their race or the religion they were born into. If you are born into a Catholic family does that mean YOU will have the same beliefs??





I actually DON'T believe Prince is MORE comfortable expressing himself these days. He comes across as confused and unsure of himself. It think that he is trying to live upto this term of being "black" rather than just allow himself to be free and to be himself.





I think Prince split with WB for all kinds of reasons.

[/quote]

Really , Did people really see it that way , Wow I always thought music was for everyone I didnt know it worked that way

Does that mean Carlos Santana can only be appreciated by Mexican People,

I dont understand Your attitude man, Ofcourse Prince is black, thats Great and why would anyone say otherwise , But why must music always be looked at Politically I believe music should be for everybody, Prince is a fantastic African American Songwriter,Muscician,Dancer, etc etc but why should he be any ones boy, Prince is Prince.

interesting discussion!

Should he reject his heritage ? of course not, Prince grew up in a particuliar environment and was influenced by particuliar things, I think what he did early in his career was kinda natural for him to do, I mean he was pretty young his hormones were raging he had a certain fascination with sexual energy his music reflected that and he had certain fashion sense etc, so what if he wasnt coming off like Public Enemy or Ice Cube or whatever, that wouldnt of been natural for him he didnt come from that type of environment I think he just did what he did that interested him at the time, actually its pretty weird he gets called by some people unblack, look at his major influences "James Brown", "Jimi Hendrix" and
"Sly & The Family Stone", Prince always struck me as an original even though he wasnt really an originall he was able to take all his influences add to them and somehow have his own kinda vibe to the whole thang, to me this was Prince, I dont think he made music that was restricted by racial boudaries maybe thats the connection to that line about "seeing no colorlines"

[/quote]


My thoughts too

pepper7 said:[quote]

Hes Black. His family and many friends are Black. He grew up Black. Hes probably more comfortable being himself not a marketing strategy.