I make sure I get solid eye contact from a woman before I approach meaning she's eyeballin' me as hard as I'm eyeballin' her, it always works for me

You "just" want to talk....

I will continue to reference the thread where you asked why people thought you were gay....

Of course men aren't always driven by sex, but I wouldn't approach a woman if I wasn't attracted to her on some level, and is attraction not driven by desire and lust?

It seems to me that you have the allure of a con-artist, and I'm sure women aren't going to buy your nice-guy act when it is combined with the high maintenance Zoolander style you run with.

+ "Reassuring" a stranger that you just wanted to talk is extremely weak game, and it is going to 'reassure' them that their initial assumptions were correct.

I think the general rule is that if the person shows some signs of being attracted to you too then it's okay to go talk to her. If there have been no looks or smiles exchanged then you're on your own.

I think a society's in a very sick condition when it's more acceptable to hit on drunk women in bars than to go introduce yourself in a public place. That's just the way it is over here and I am currently inclined to go with whatever the women are more comfortable with themselves.

[Edited 2/23/12 1:01am]

i've met lots of ppl this way but its not always about sex

Dave1992 said:

JustErin said:

but yeah, men are motivated by sex. Or at least getting a little attention by someone they find cute and or interesting.[/b]

The rest I completely understand and support, but this I find a bit offensive and, even though I know it will not make you change your opinion, I feel it is my obligation to tell you you're absolutely wrong. Men, just like women, can also simply enjoy affection and closeness without being motivated by sex or always needing attention. Actually, I never thought there was that much of a difference between men and women in general, but anyway. I guarantee you that many men I know, including myself, are not motivated by sex 24/7. I'd find that extremely hard to handle and to concentrate on. In between, I really do enjoy and need honest and platonic friendship. I also don't need "acknowledgement" and attention the way you described it. Sure, I like knowing that someone I look up to also respects me, but you make it sound as if everything men do is motivated by the satisfaction they get when someone pats them on the head. That's a bit cruel, don't you think?

This is not about some dude sitting next to you on the bus and making small chat due to circumstance. That guy might not have any motivation other than to be friendly and polite.

This is about a dude going out of his way to approach you and get a conversation going. That guy wants pussy.

Dave1992 said:

morningsong said:

Sounds like you approach them like a salesman. There are a lot of salemen out there, and I mean literally salesmen. All smiley and ultra friendly, asking questions. Personally, I feel I get boombarded by advertisements enough in my day for all that, so yeah, I'd be closed off until I know what they heck they want.

I see, I never thought about that possibility! But I've never heard about salesmen approaching people on the bus or train or in the park here, so I don't think it's that.

I often get the vibe that they are too insecure to believe that a stranger would simply want to talk and get to know you a bit, to broaden their mind and simply make a new friend, learn new things and teach new things and to enjoy the possibility of a positive surprise. Or that they are too "conventional" and close-minded in how they think people should approach each other; that they don't think it's even possible (or useful, or nice) that someone would simply want to make a new friend, learn new things and teach new things and enjoy the possibility of a positive surprise... Sad, actually.

I hear what you're saying, and it's idealistic and all, but in all sincerity Davey Boo,

*I got too much shit to do to be bothered by random strangers if and when something like that happens to me. Get to the point of what you want, and don't be surprised/ disappointed if I spit back the truth of whether or not it's my cup of tea.

*I'm not looking for anybody to broaden my mind at this stage in life: that's what books, family, my spiritual walk, pre-established friends and my life experience of 40+ years have been for. If want an addendnum to all of that, then I'll go look for it.

*It's a bit presumptuous to think your befriending someone automatically translates into you teaching them something new. But I know that youth does give one that sense of omniscience about themselves- so I'mma let you roll with that (no offense, Young Blood)

JustErin said:

Dave1992 said:

The rest I completely understand and support, but this I find a bit offensive and, even though I know it will not make you change your opinion, I feel it is my obligation to tell you you're absolutely wrong. Men, just like women, can also simply enjoy affection and closeness without being motivated by sex or always needing attention. Actually, I never thought there was that much of a difference between men and women in general, but anyway. I guarantee you that many men I know, including myself, are not motivated by sex 24/7. I'd find that extremely hard to handle and to concentrate on. In between, I really do enjoy and need honest and platonic friendship. I also don't need "acknowledgement" and attention the way you described it. Sure, I like knowing that someone I look up to also respects me, but you make it sound as if everything men do is motivated by the satisfaction they get when someone pats them on the head. That's a bit cruel, don't you think?

This is not about some dude sitting next to you on the bus and making small chat due to circumstance. That guy might not have any motivation other than to be friendly and polite.

This is about a dude going out of his way to approach you and get a conversation going. That guy wants pussy.

lemme ask you this Dave...

Have you ever approached a REALLY overweight woman in such a manner? Just to talk... The same way you do with something you find pretty?

Its really sad that society is this way, But for most woman, rape is something we are TERRIFIED about... And its not a womans fault for feeling this way... men do that to us, because obviously they are the raper's... Please dont get all upset guys, im not calling EVERY guy a raper... But in a womans eyes, that potential is always there, and when you put us outside our "comfort" zone by doing something unusual, your gonna get the cold shoulder...

One day I was running in the park and this guy approached me.... He was wearing a hoodie with the hood up, and jeans... WTF was he doing on a running trail was my 1st thought... So I ran past him, gave him the nod and went along my way... I had to stop at this street crossing and at that moment my song had ended... I heard yelling behind me so I turned to look... here comes this guy, and by guy he couldnt of been more than early 20s... He caught up to me, he was running at that point to catch me... he started to ask me ALL SORTS of questions... At this point im getting freaked as fuck, noone else was around, he kept his hands in his sweatshirt pockets and kept walking with me... Then at one point shit was falling out of his pocket, it looked like a brush but was wooden and round... At that point I could tell he wasnt going to let up so I said I had to get back to running and SPRINTED home as fast as I could! He was nice, yes... But wth was he thinking?

My question is... Was I wrong in feeling freaked out...

minneapolisFunq said:

You "just" want to talk....

I will continue to reference the thread where you asked why people thought you were gay....

Of course men aren't always driven by sex, but I wouldn't approach a woman if I wasn't attracted to her on some level, and is attraction not driven by desire and lust?

It seems to me that you have the allure of a con-artist, and I'm sure women aren't going to buy your nice-guy act when it is combined with the high maintenance Zoolander style you run with.

+ "Reassuring" a stranger that you just wanted to talk is extremely weak game, and it is going to 'reassure' them that their initial assumptions were correct.

First of all, I never asked why people thought I was gay. I really don't care about what people think about me regarding my sexuality.

I actually said that I approach women because I am attracted to them, in the first place. Why would you want to talk someone you don't feel attracted to?

I think you are confusing "attraction" with the imminent goal of laying her, which, to me, are two completely different things. I can find women attractive and spend the rest of my life just talking to them and I'll be happy. And that doesn't make me homosexual at all.

You are implying I am play acting - "[they] aren't going to buy your nice-guy act", when I'm saying I am actually not.

The question is not whether they "buy" anything, the question is rather whether they can understand and trust.

And actually, you're also implying I am dismissed every day by your generalisations, even though I said that I actually found most of my friends (male AND female, but mostly female) this way.

It is not a weak game, because after that I will leave them alone forever. They won't have any reason to think their initial assumptions were correct and they'll have enough time to think about it.

JustErin said:

Dave1992 said:

The rest I completely understand and support, but this I find a bit offensive and, even though I know it will not make you change your opinion, I feel it is my obligation to tell you you're absolutely wrong. Men, just like women, can also simply enjoy affection and closeness without being motivated by sex or always needing attention. Actually, I never thought there was that much of a difference between men and women in general, but anyway. I guarantee you that many men I know, including myself, are not motivated by sex 24/7. I'd find that extremely hard to handle and to concentrate on. In between, I really do enjoy and need honest and platonic friendship. I also don't need "acknowledgement" and attention the way you described it. Sure, I like knowing that someone I look up to also respects me, but you make it sound as if everything men do is motivated by the satisfaction they get when someone pats them on the head. That's a bit cruel, don't you think?

This is not about some dude sitting next to you on the bus and making small chat due to circumstance. That guy might not have any motivation other than to be friendly and polite.

This is about a dude going out of his way to approach you and get a conversation going. That guy wants pussy.

The one time I talked to a stranger on the train, I walked over to talk to them and didn't even ask them if I could sit down next to them. I was standing at least two metres away and simply talking. I met this person again and we exchanged numbers. We meet about once a month and talk about God, music, the world, friends, uni, everything. We would have had multiple chances to fuck, but we never did. Maybe it will happen one day, maybe it won't. I'm happy either way and thankful for having found such a nice friend.

So, no, that guy doesn't want pussy. Your perception is simply wrong.

tinaz said:

One day I was running in the park and this guy approached me.... He was wearing a hoodie with the hood up, and jeans... WTF was he doing on a running trail was my 1st thought... So I ran past him, gave him the nod and went along my way... I had to stop at this street crossing and at that moment my song had ended... I heard yelling behind me so I turned to look... here comes this guy, and by guy he couldnt of been more than early 20s... He caught up to me, he was running at that point to catch me... he started to ask me ALL SORTS of questions... At this point im getting freaked as fuck, noone else was around, he kept his hands in his sweatshirt pockets and kept walking with me... Then at one point shit was falling out of his pocket, it looked like a brush but was wooden and round... At that point I could tell he wasnt going to let up so I said I had to get back to running and SPRINTED home as fast as I could! He was nice, yes... But wth was he thinking?

My question is... Was I wrong in feeling freaked out...

You were absolutely not wrong to feel freaked out! Your instincts told you that something was not right about the situation - someone jogging but not wearing appropriate clothing, asking too many questions, not taking "no" for an answer. You might want to turn down your music a little bit, though, so you can better hear what's going on around you.

jone70 said:

tinaz said:

One day I was running in the park and this guy approached me.... He was wearing a hoodie with the hood up, and jeans... WTF was he doing on a running trail was my 1st thought... So I ran past him, gave him the nod and went along my way... I had to stop at this street crossing and at that moment my song had ended... I heard yelling behind me so I turned to look... here comes this guy, and by guy he couldnt of been more than early 20s... He caught up to me, he was running at that point to catch me... he started to ask me ALL SORTS of questions... At this point im getting freaked as fuck, noone else was around, he kept his hands in his sweatshirt pockets and kept walking with me... Then at one point shit was falling out of his pocket, it looked like a brush but was wooden and round... At that point I could tell he wasnt going to let up so I said I had to get back to running and SPRINTED home as fast as I could! He was nice, yes... But wth was he thinking?

My question is... Was I wrong in feeling freaked out...

You were absolutely not wrong to feel freaked out! Your instincts told you that something was not right about the situation - someone jogging but not wearing appropriate clothing, asking too many questions, not taking "no" for an answer. You might want to turn down your music a little bit, though, so you can better hear what's going on around you.

Thanks! My husband gets mad at me because I am pretty trusting for the most part... Heck, he got mad at me In Chicago cuz I high fived a homeless guy who came up to me and was being silly, and he was harmless!!! ... But that instance at the park scared me... I made sure to always bring my pepper spray after that!

Ottensen said:

Dave1992 said:

I see, I never thought about that possibility! But I've never heard about salesmen approaching people on the bus or train or in the park here, so I don't think it's that.

I often get the vibe that they are too insecure to believe that a stranger would simply want to talk and get to know you a bit, to broaden their mind and simply make a new friend, learn new things and teach new things and to enjoy the possibility of a positive surprise. Or that they are too "conventional" and close-minded in how they think people should approach each other; that they don't think it's even possible (or useful, or nice) that someone would simply want to make a new friend, learn new things and teach new things and enjoy the possibility of a positive surprise... Sad, actually.

I hear what you're saying, and it's idealistic and all, but in all sincerity Davey Boo,

*I got too much shit to do to be bothered by random strangers if and when something like that happens to me. Get to the point of what you want, and don't be surprised/ disappointed if I spit back the truth of whether or not it's my cup of tea.

*I'm not looking for anybody to broaden my mind at this stage in life: that's what books, family, my spiritual walk, pre-established friends and my life experience of 40+ years have been for. If want an addendnum to all of that, then I'll go look for it.

*It's a bit presumptuous to think your befriending someone automatically translates into you teaching them something new. But I know that youth does give one that sense of omniscience about themselves- so I'mma let you roll with that (no offense, Young Blood)

One by one:

- Most of the time, it's the same here. But it's part of showing mutual respect to honestly tell people that you simply don't want to talk (I would understand that, respect that, apologise, wish them a nice day and back off). If they want me to get to the point of what I want, I will probably be completely honest and say "I thought you might be an interesting person to talk to, because you have some kind of appealing charisma. That's all."

- Again, that's completely understandable and acceptable. I'd again apologise and back off. I'd probably find it sad that someone doesn't look for the feeling of connecting with a stranger from time to time, but I won't judge that person because of that.

- You're taking it too literally. Please, people, stop thinking I'm a self-absorbed, narcissistic fool. I was merely talking about the experience of getting to know someone. It's nothing personal, not about me or them, it's only about the experience of talking to a stranger. I have found that this experience will teach someone a lot about themselves. So this "youth" and "omniscience" stuff should be solved too.

In all seriousness, please: I'm trying to use good English and be clear in what I say, I'm trying to use the best words possible to describe my thoughts and make my point. Maybe my English as a non-native isn't good enough and maybe there's some minor cultural barrier that sometimes makes it difficult to interpret what I say correctly, but I often get the feeling that people are looking for tiny details in the things I post and try to make me look like a smart-aleck asshole and expose me. I know that you can't know, but you'll simply have to trust me on this: none of my friends or people who have spent some time with me would ever say that about me. In real life, I'm probably completely different to how you imagine me being. It's a bit exhausting having to deal with all those accusations on a daily basis and re-explaining things a thousand times when I just want to have a healthy, tolerant discussion.

No drama intended (before you people start accusing me of being a drama-queen and telling me to chill), but I just really start to find some of those things I am "accused" of and how the things I say are so often easily dismissed (mainly because of my age?) terribly annoying and unnecessary. Please try to be less prejudiced. Thank you!

tinaz said:

JustErin said:

This is not about some dude sitting next to you on the bus and making small chat due to circumstance. That guy might not have any motivation other than to be friendly and polite.

This is about a dude going out of his way to approach you and get a conversation going. That guy wants pussy.

lemme ask you this Dave...

Have you ever approached a REALLY overweight woman in such a manner? Just to talk... The same way you do with something you find pretty?

Its really sad that society is this way, But for most woman, rape is something we are TERRIFIED about... And its not a womans fault for feeling this way... men do that to us, because obviously they are the raper's... Please dont get all upset guys, im not calling EVERY guy a raper... But in a womans eyes, that potential is always there, and when you put us outside our "comfort" zone by doing something unusual, your gonna get the cold shoulder...

One day I was running in the park and this guy approached me.... He was wearing a hoodie with the hood up, and jeans... WTF was he doing on a running trail was my 1st thought... So I ran past him, gave him the nod and went along my way... I had to stop at this street crossing and at that moment my song had ended... I heard yelling behind me so I turned to look... here comes this guy, and by guy he couldnt of been more than early 20s... He caught up to me, he was running at that point to catch me... he started to ask me ALL SORTS of questions... At this point im getting freaked as fuck, noone else was around, he kept his hands in his sweatshirt pockets and kept walking with me... Then at one point shit was falling out of his pocket, it looked like a brush but was wooden and round... At that point I could tell he wasnt going to let up so I said I had to get back to running and SPRINTED home as fast as I could! He was nice, yes... But wth was he thinking?

My question is... Was I wrong in feeling freaked out...

I have an idea of what you're getting at and I have to say, no, I haven't ever approached a really over-weight woman in this way. You wanna know why? It's the same as if someone said "oh, he's got such inviting green eyes!" - they don't know that person, yet, because of some physical features and their personal preferences they automatically assume they'll get along with that person better. And because they subconsicously assume this it will be this way in reality too.

I can't force myself to find over-weight people attractive and that's why I find it harder to think I will be able to trust them more and make them trust me more. It may be a bit unfair, yes, but, thinking about it, it's completely natural. I think.

That said, I have a lot of over-weight friends and, like I said, when I approach someone it is not because my ultimate goal is to fuck them. I just feel more comfortable in the vicinity of people I find attractive and therefore find it easier to talk to them. Is that kind of understandable?

No, I don't think you were wrong. Especially because you actually ackowledged that he was nice. It's his fault and he is an idiot for not doing his best to make a friendly and approachable impression. I really don't know the details about how to do it, but I guess I automatically don't hide my hands when I talk to strangers and I think my wardrobe may be "weird" sometimes, but definitely not sleazy or anything you would associate with criminal intent or abusive behaviour .

Sure, any rapist could get a book about how to look approachable, but I fucking don't want rapists to shape the person people think I am!

Dave1992 said:

Ottensen said:

I hear what you're saying, and it's idealistic and all, but in all sincerity Davey Boo,

*I got too much shit to do to be bothered by random strangers if and when something like that happens to me. Get to the point of what you want, and don't be surprised/ disappointed if I spit back the truth of whether or not it's my cup of tea.

*I'm not looking for anybody to broaden my mind at this stage in life: that's what books, family, my spiritual walk, pre-established friends and my life experience of 40+ years have been for. If want an addendnum to all of that, then I'll go look for it.

*It's a bit presumptuous to think your befriending someone automatically translates into you teaching them something new. But I know that youth does give one that sense of omniscience about themselves- so I'mma let you roll with that (no offense, Young Blood)

One by one:

- Most of the time, it's the same here. But it's part of showing mutual respect to honestly tell people that you simply don't want to talk (I would understand that, respect that, apologise, wish them a nice day and back off). If they want me to get to the point of what I want, I will probably be completely honest and say "I thought you might be an interesting person to talk to, because you have some kind of appealing charisma. That's all."

- Again, that's completely understandable and acceptable. I'd again apologise and back off. I'd probably find it sad that someone doesn't look for the feeling of connecting with a stranger from time to time, but I won't judge that person because of that.

- You're taking it too literally. Please, people, stop thinking I'm a self-absorbed, narcissistic fool. I was merely talking about the experience of getting to know someone. It's nothing personal, not about me or them, it's only about the experience of talking to a stranger. I have found that this experience will teach someone a lot about themselves. So this "youth" and "omniscience" stuff should be solved too.

In all seriousness, please: I'm trying to use good English and be clear in what I say, I'm trying to use the best words possible to describe my thoughts and make my point. Maybe my English as a non-native isn't good enough and maybe there's some minor cultural barrier that sometimes makes it difficult to interpret what I say correctly, but I often get the feeling that people are looking for tiny details in the things I post and try to make me look like a smart-aleck asshole and expose me. I know that you can't know, but you'll simply have to trust me on this: none of my friends or people who have spent some time with me would ever say that about me. In real life, I'm probably completely different to how you imagine me being. It's a bit exhausting having to deal with all those accusations on a daily basis and re-explaining things a thousand times when I just want to have a healthy, tolerant discussion.

No drama intended (before you people start accusing me of being a drama-queen and telling me to chill), but I just really start to find some of those things I am "accused" of and how the things I say are so often easily dismissed (mainly because of my age?) terribly annoying and unnecessary. Please try to be less prejudiced. Thank you!

Awww this made me kinda sad...

The thing is Dave... Germans (yes your Austrian, same thing! ) are for the most part VERY blunt matter of fact people... There is no playing around with words, you say what you say, how you say it, but the rest of the world is left going I think you are right that its cultural difference's... We as Americans are usually a bit more humble, so we see it as bragging, or being snotty, when in actuality this is just how the German people are...

The only thing I do have to say about you that bothers me is.... Stop bashing Americans... Stop talking about us as though we are inferior to you or any European nation... We dont do that to you... Thanks!

Dave1992 said:

tinaz said:

lemme ask you this Dave...

Have you ever approached a REALLY overweight woman in such a manner? Just to talk... The same way you do with something you find pretty?

Its really sad that society is this way, But for most woman, rape is something we are TERRIFIED about... And its not a womans fault for feeling this way... men do that to us, because obviously they are the raper's... Please dont get all upset guys, im not calling EVERY guy a raper... But in a womans eyes, that potential is always there, and when you put us outside our "comfort" zone by doing something unusual, your gonna get the cold shoulder...

One day I was running in the park and this guy approached me.... He was wearing a hoodie with the hood up, and jeans... WTF was he doing on a running trail was my 1st thought... So I ran past him, gave him the nod and went along my way... I had to stop at this street crossing and at that moment my song had ended... I heard yelling behind me so I turned to look... here comes this guy, and by guy he couldnt of been more than early 20s... He caught up to me, he was running at that point to catch me... he started to ask me ALL SORTS of questions... At this point im getting freaked as fuck, noone else was around, he kept his hands in his sweatshirt pockets and kept walking with me... Then at one point shit was falling out of his pocket, it looked like a brush but was wooden and round... At that point I could tell he wasnt going to let up so I said I had to get back to running and SPRINTED home as fast as I could! He was nice, yes... But wth was he thinking?

My question is... Was I wrong in feeling freaked out...

I have an idea of what you're getting at and I have to say, no, I haven't ever approached a really over-weight woman in this way. You wanna know why? It's the same as if someone said "oh, he's got such inviting green eyes!" - they don't know that person, yet, because of some physical features and their personal preferences they automatically assume they'll get along with that person better. And because they subconsicously assume this it will be this way in reality too.

I can't force myself to find over-weight people attractive and that's why I find it harder to think I will be able to trust them more and make them trust me more. It may be a bit unfair, yes, but, thinking about it, it's completely natural. I think.

That said, I have a lot of over-weight friends and, like I said, when I approach someone it is not because my ultimate goal is to fuck them. I just feel more comfortable in the vicinity of people I find attractive and therefore find it easier to talk to them. Is that kind of understandable?

No, I don't think you were wrong. Especially because you actually ackowledged that he was nice. It's his fault and he is an idiot for not doing his best to make a friendly and approachable impression. I really don't know the details about how to do it, but I guess I automatically don't hide my hands when I talk to strangers and I think my wardrobe may be "weird" sometimes, but definitely not sleazy or anything you would associate with criminal intent or abusive behaviour .

Sure, any rapist could get a book about how to look approachable, but I fucking don't want rapists to shape the person people think I am!

Dave1992 said:

I can't force myself to find over-weight people attractive and that's why I find it harder to think I will be able to trust them more and make them trust me more. It may be a bit unfair, yes, but, thinking about it, it's completely natural. I think.

That said, I have a lot of over-weight friends and, like I said, when I approach someone it is not because my ultimate goal is to fuck them. I just feel more comfortable in the vicinity of people I find attractive and therefore find it easier to talk to them. Is that kind of understandable?

Dave, I think that something was lost in the translation.

You wouldn't approach an overweight lady because you don't find her attractive and therefore untrustworthy????

I don't get it, especially since in the next paragraph you indicate that you DON'T approach someone with the ultimate goal of sex.

tinaz said:

Dave1992 said:

One by one:

- Most of the time, it's the same here. But it's part of showing mutual respect to honestly tell people that you simply don't want to talk (I would understand that, respect that, apologise, wish them a nice day and back off). If they want me to get to the point of what I want, I will probably be completely honest and say "I thought you might be an interesting person to talk to, because you have some kind of appealing charisma. That's all."

- Again, that's completely understandable and acceptable. I'd again apologise and back off. I'd probably find it sad that someone doesn't look for the feeling of connecting with a stranger from time to time, but I won't judge that person because of that.

- You're taking it too literally. Please, people, stop thinking I'm a self-absorbed, narcissistic fool. I was merely talking about the experience of getting to know someone. It's nothing personal, not about me or them, it's only about the experience of talking to a stranger. I have found that this experience will teach someone a lot about themselves. So this "youth" and "omniscience" stuff should be solved too.

In all seriousness, please: I'm trying to use good English and be clear in what I say, I'm trying to use the best words possible to describe my thoughts and make my point. Maybe my English as a non-native isn't good enough and maybe there's some minor cultural barrier that sometimes makes it difficult to interpret what I say correctly, but I often get the feeling that people are looking for tiny details in the things I post and try to make me look like a smart-aleck asshole and expose me. I know that you can't know, but you'll simply have to trust me on this: none of my friends or people who have spent some time with me would ever say that about me. In real life, I'm probably completely different to how you imagine me being. It's a bit exhausting having to deal with all those accusations on a daily basis and re-explaining things a thousand times when I just want to have a healthy, tolerant discussion.

No drama intended (before you people start accusing me of being a drama-queen and telling me to chill), but I just really start to find some of those things I am "accused" of and how the things I say are so often easily dismissed (mainly because of my age?) terribly annoying and unnecessary. Please try to be less prejudiced. Thank you!

Awww this made me kinda sad...

The thing is Dave... Germans (yes your Austrian, same thing! ) are for the most part VERY blunt matter of fact people... There is no playing around with words, you say what you say, how you say it, but the rest of the world is left going I think you are right that its cultural difference's... We as Americans are usually a bit more humble, so we see it as bragging, or being snotty, when in actuality this is just how the German people are...

The only thing I do have to say about you that bothers me is.... Stop bashing Americans... Stop talking about us as though we are inferior to you or any European nation... We dont do that to you... Thanks!

Yeah, I think that might be true... Although even people in Austria say how arrogant Germans often are/sound.

Yes, I may often be very direct. But I'm really doing my best to assure people that my intentions are never bad and that I'm quite sure I know the international defintion of "arrogance", "narcissism" and what not and that I promise you, if you asked any of the people who really know me, all of them would say I am everything but that...

The thing about "bashing Americans": I apologised for the jokes I made back then - I really didn't mean to hurt anyone personally (one thing I have learned is that Americans are usually way more patriotic or at least identify themselves with their country way more than most Western Europeans do. Here, you laugh and joke about every stereotype, even your own country's). I have stopped to joke about "over-weight Americans", "electric-chair-loving Texans", "plastic-boobed Californians", the "old, rich, boring, huge car driving retirees" in Florida and all the rest. The reason I joked about these stereotypes so openly is because I know that they're not true and laughable. I didn't know some people would take it so seriously and I'm sorry for that.

As regards my serious attitude towards America: I know some lovely, lovely people from there - tolerant, intelligent, funny, broad-minded, nice, simply great people. I also know idiots from America (just like I know idiots from Europe). But due to social, economic, environmental and cultural reasons I'd rather live in Europe and am of the opinion that, for me, Europe is the better place. I hope you don't call the "bashing Americans", because it's simply a personal preference. It doesn't mean I judge the people of America because of that!

PurpleJedi said:

Dave1992 said:

I can't force myself to find over-weight people attractive and that's why I find it harder to think I will be able to trust them more and make them trust me more. It may be a bit unfair, yes, but, thinking about it, it's completely natural. I think.

That said, I have a lot of over-weight friends and, like I said, when I approach someone it is not because my ultimate goal is to fuck them. I just feel more comfortable in the vicinity of people I find attractive and therefore find it easier to talk to them. Is that kind of understandable?

Dave, I think that something was lost in the translation.

You wouldn't approach an overweight lady because you don't find her attractive and therefore untrustworthy????

I don't get it, especially since in the next paragraph you indicate that you DON'T approach someone with the ultimate goal of sex.

I think so too.

I exactly know that the chance of someone being trustworthy is not determined by their weight. What I meant is that, subconsciously, I find it easier to talk to (~"trust") people who I also feel have a more inviting physical appearance.

A better example would probably be a male person. I am heterosexual, so the possibility of me wanting to lay him is quite low. Still, I'd feel more comfortable talking to him if he looked healthy, neat and if he basically has a convincing charisma.

Is it clearer now?

tinaz said:

Dave1992 said:

I have an idea of what you're getting at and I have to say, no, I haven't ever approached a really over-weight woman in this way. You wanna know why? It's the same as if someone said "oh, he's got such inviting green eyes!" - they don't know that person, yet, because of some physical features and their personal preferences they automatically assume they'll get along with that person better. And because they subconsicously assume this it will be this way in reality too.

I can't force myself to find over-weight people attractive and that's why I find it harder to think I will be able to trust them more and make them trust me more. It may be a bit unfair, yes, but, thinking about it, it's completely natural. I think.

That said, I have a lot of over-weight friends and, like I said, when I approach someone it is not because my ultimate goal is to fuck them. I just feel more comfortable in the vicinity of people I find attractive and therefore find it easier to talk to them. Is that kind of understandable?

No, I don't think you were wrong. Especially because you actually ackowledged that he was nice. It's his fault and he is an idiot for not doing his best to make a friendly and approachable impression. I really don't know the details about how to do it, but I guess I automatically don't hide my hands when I talk to strangers and I think my wardrobe may be "weird" sometimes, but definitely not sleazy or anything you would associate with criminal intent or abusive behaviour .

Sure, any rapist could get a book about how to look approachable, but I fucking don't want rapists to shape the person people think I am!

It was an idealistic statement again... It should basically just mean that I find it extremely sad that there's so many bad and untrustworthy people running around (and therefore limiting the chance of finding someone who might be happy about being approached by a stranger).

tinaz said:

jone70 said:

You were absolutely not wrong to feel freaked out! Your instincts told you that something was not right about the situation - someone jogging but not wearing appropriate clothing, asking too many questions, not taking "no" for an answer. You might want to turn down your music a little bit, though, so you can better hear what's going on around you.

Thanks! My husband gets mad at me because I am pretty trusting for the most part... Heck, he got mad at me In Chicago cuz I high fived a homeless guy who came up to me and was being silly, and he was harmless!!! ... But that instance at the park scared me... I made sure to always bring my pepper spray after that!

I used to be kind of like that, too. I grew up in a rural area of northwestern Iowa, where people take one another at face value and, for the most part, everyone does have good intentions. I used to always assume people were telling me the truth and were sincere, had good intentions. But after living in southern France, Chicago, and New York, (or maybe just from getting older), I have become much less trusting, especially of strangers. As a female in a large city, one has to constantly be aware of their surroundings and alert to people trying to hustle you! When I go back to visit my parents, the niceness is somewhat disconcerting to me - now I'm always skeptical whether people could genuinely be *that* nice without some sort of ulterior motive. I'm jaded.

People have an energy about them.

You can sense hostility or warmth or that "certain something creepy" no matter how clean or dirty, pretty or ugly they are.

I genuinely trust my insticts with people for the most part.

This is especially true if they suddenly approach me.

Dave1992 said:

PurpleJedi said:

Dave, I think that something was lost in the translation.

You wouldn't approach an overweight lady because you don't find her attractive and therefore untrustworthy????

I don't get it, especially since in the next paragraph you indicate that you DON'T approach someone with the ultimate goal of sex.

I think so too.

I exactly know that the chance of someone being trustworthy is not determined by their weight. What I meant is that, subconsciously, I find it easier to talk to (~"trust") people who I also feel have a more inviting physical appearance.

A better example would probably be a male person. I am heterosexual, so the possibility of me wanting to lay him is quite low. Still, I'd feel more comfortable talking to him if he looked healthy, neat and if he basically has a convincing charisma.

Is it clearer now?

No...not really "clearer".

Basically it sounds like you are not likely to start up a conversation with an unattractive person simply because they are unattractive.

Dude...if that's the case...

Dave1992 said:

PurpleJedi said:

Dave, I think that something was lost in the translation.

You wouldn't approach an overweight lady because you don't find her attractive and therefore untrustworthy????

I don't get it, especially since in the next paragraph you indicate that you DON'T approach someone with the ultimate goal of sex.

I think so too.

I exactly know that the chance of someone being trustworthy is not determined by their weight. What I meant is that, subconsciously, I find it easier to talk to (~"trust") people who I also feel have a more inviting physical appearance.

A better example would probably be a male person. I am heterosexual, so the possibility of me wanting to lay him is quite low. Still, I'd feel more comfortable talking to him if he looked healthy, neat and if he basically has a convincing charisma.

Is it clearer now?

yes. much clearer

PurpleJedi said:

Dave1992 said:

I think so too.

I exactly know that the chance of someone being trustworthy is not determined by their weight. What I meant is that, subconsciously, I find it easier to talk to (~"trust") people who I also feel have a more inviting physical appearance.

A better example would probably be a male person. I am heterosexual, so the possibility of me wanting to lay him is quite low. Still, I'd feel more comfortable talking to him if he looked healthy, neat and if he basically has a convincing charisma.

Is it clearer now?

No...not really "clearer".

Basically it sounds like you are not likely to start up a conversation with an unattractive person simply because they are unattractive.

Dude...if that's the case...

But...but...he likes pretty things!

Genesia said:

PurpleJedi said:

No...not really "clearer".

Basically it sounds like you are not likely to start up a conversation with an unattractive person simply because they are unattractive.

Dude...if that's the case...

But...but...he likes pretty things!

If Jedi doesn't know that by nooooooowwww!!!! to him.

Dave1992 said:

JustErin said:

This is not about some dude sitting next to you on the bus and making small chat due to circumstance. That guy might not have any motivation other than to be friendly and polite.

This is about a dude going out of his way to approach you and get a conversation going. That guy wants pussy.

The one time I talked to a stranger on the train, I walked over to talk to them and didn't even ask them if I could sit down next to them. I was standing at least two metres away and simply talking. I met this person again and we exchanged numbers. We meet about once a month and talk about God, music, the world, friends, uni, everything. We would have had multiple chances to fuck, but we never did. Maybe it will happen one day, maybe it won't. I'm happy either way and thankful for having found such a nice friend.

So, no, that guy doesn't want pussy. Your perception is simply wrong.

Actually, you just proved I was right.

No dude says "maybe it will happen one day" (even if they say it also might not) if they actually do not want it at all.

Deadflow3r said:

Genesia said:

But...but...he likes pretty things!

If Jedi doesn't know that by nooooooowwww!!!! to him.

My english teacher told me this before i graduated high school,

"Justice, no matter how good of friends you are with a guy, and he may love you like he would his sister, but remember this. You're NOT his sister. There will always be a small portion of him saying "there might be a chance for us to fuck". Make no mistake. He will always have that small bit of hope lingering in the back of his mind. It may not be initially on his mind, but it's always there."

Dave1992 said:

Ottensen said:

I hear what you're saying, and it's idealistic and all, but in all sincerity Davey Boo,

*I got too much shit to do to be bothered by random strangers if and when something like that happens to me. Get to the point of what you want, and don't be surprised/ disappointed if I spit back the truth of whether or not it's my cup of tea.

*I'm not looking for anybody to broaden my mind at this stage in life: that's what books, family, my spiritual walk, pre-established friends and my life experience of 40+ years have been for. If want an addendnum to all of that, then I'll go look for it.

*It's a bit presumptuous to think your befriending someone automatically translates into you teaching them something new. But I know that youth does give one that sense of omniscience about themselves- so I'mma let you roll with that (no offense, Young Blood)

One by one:

- Most of the time, it's the same here. But it's part of showing mutual respect to honestly tell people that you simply don't want to talk (I would understand that, respect that, apologise, wish them a nice day and back off). If they want me to get to the point of what I want, I will probably be completely honest and say "I thought you might be an interesting person to talk to, because you have some kind of appealing charisma. That's all."

- Again, that's completely understandable and acceptable. I'd again apologise and back off. I'd probably find it sad that someone doesn't look for the feeling of connecting with a stranger from time to time, but I won't judge that person because of that.

- You're taking it too literally. Please, people, stop thinking I'm a self-absorbed, narcissistic fool. I was merely talking about the experience of getting to know someone. It's nothing personal, not about me or them, it's only about the experience of talking to a stranger. I have found that this experience will teach someone a lot about themselves. So this "youth" and "omniscience" stuff should be solved too.

In all seriousness, please: I'm trying to use good English and be clear in what I say, I'm trying to use the best words possible to describe my thoughts and make my point. Maybe my English as a non-native isn't good enough and maybe there's some minor cultural barrier that sometimes makes it difficult to interpret what I say correctly, but I often get the feeling that people are looking for tiny details in the things I post and try to make me look like a smart-aleck asshole and expose me. I know that you can't know, but you'll simply have to trust me on this: none of my friends or people who have spent some time with me would ever say that about me. In real life, I'm probably completely different to how you imagine me being. It's a bit exhausting having to deal with all those accusations on a daily basis and re-explaining things a thousand times when I just want to have a healthy, tolerant discussion.

No drama intended (before you people start accusing me of being a drama-queen and telling me to chill), but I just really start to find some of those things I am "accused" of and how the things I say are so often easily dismissed (mainly because of my age?) terribly annoying and unnecessary. Please try to be less prejudiced. Thank you!

No one is looking for details to expose you as anything, at least not me; if I feel I don't have time to engage people who start random conversations with me, I'm certainly not going to engage in that kind of behavor here . For what? In all sincerity it simply doesn't interest me in the least. I also do not imagine you being this way, or that way . No offense, but I've never taken that deep of an interest, not because of anything personal, I'm just like that with anyone I encounter here unless we have established a relationship. I am sorry to hear that you feel you are being accused of being something you are not, though; that most certainly is not a good feeling, no matter where the accusation stems from be it on the Net or in real life.

You're clearly a smart young man who does possess some wisdom beyond his years, but try not to be mad if some of us might see it as coming off from time to time as precocious (altklug oder früreif- see how crappy my German is? ) . Chances are we just recognize it from seeing it in ourselves when we were your age . It's not meant to be harmful or accusatory. I think that it just takes some of us back down memory lane bit, and a few years of life experience on our belts makes us a little less idealistic when we are in scenarios like you describe in your orginal post.

I certainly don't think anyone here would think you're a fool, & I don't even think anyone would think you are self-absorbed or narcissistic. Try not be be annoyed at what you see as misinterpretation here on the board. In a place like this, unfortunately that's going to happen a lot, particularly as we all hail from different locales, cultures and formative experiences that influence how we individually see the world and express ourselves. But you know what? Here's the good news: the more you continue to engage others here and express yourself in a clear, heartfelt manner, I think it becomes very easy for people to eventually understand your intentions and what's truly in your heart.