3000 said:

You all keep saying Janet was bigger, but have no factual reciepts to back the claim At her peak Janet sold 20 million copies of her self-titled, that same year Mariah sold 25 million of Music box, she would later sell 32 million of Day Dreaming, both are diamond albums, a feat Janet has not completed. Where are youre reciepts proving Janet was bigger, ill wait... [Edited 9/2/14 7:13am]

Where are your receipts that show that Mariah has made a significant contribution to the music industry with innovation? Where is your receipts that show Mariah made a HUGE groundbreaking impact? What innovative things did Mariah bring to the industry? We all want to know. Just because a singer sells a bunch of albums does not mean they made a significant impact especially if you go outside and the average person can not even name half your number one hits. I am still confuse as to why you are trying to make this about Janet vs. Mariah instead of answering the question.

3000 said:

You all keep saying Janet was bigger, but have no factual reciepts to back the claim At her peak Janet sold 20 million copies of her self-titled, that same year Mariah sold 25 million of Music box, she would later sell 32 million of Day Dreaming, both are diamond albums, a feat Janet has not completed. Where are youre reciepts proving Janet was bigger, ill wait... [Edited 9/2/14 7:13am]

Still using album sales as the ruler of an artist's impact... SMH

[Edited 9/2/14 7:42am]

mjscarousal said:

3000 said:

You all keep saying Janet was bigger, but have no factual reciepts to back the claim At her peak Janet sold 20 million copies of her self-titled, that same year Mariah sold 25 million of Music box, she would later sell 32 million of Day Dreaming, both are diamond albums, a feat Janet has not completed. Where are youre reciepts proving Janet was bigger, ill wait... [Edited 9/2/14 7:13am]

Where are your receipts that show that Mariah has made a significant contribution to the music industry with innovation? Where is your receipts that show Mariah made a HUGE groundbreaking impact? What innovative things did Mariah bring to the industry? We all want to know. Just because a singer sells a bunch of albums does not mean they made a significant impact especially if you go outside and the average person can not even name half your number one hits. I am still confuse as to why you are trying to make this about Janet vs. Mariah instead of answering the question.

THANK YOU.

*HUGS*

3000 said:

Excuse me, I used album sales to show Mariah was bigger, charts and sales are the only objective way to measure the "biggness" of an artists, thanks. As for impact, how are you measuring it, how do you measure it objectively [Edited 9/2/14 9:00am]

No, it was unnessessary to bring up because I never asked you about who was bigger between Mariah or Janet. I asked you to explain why you think Mariah made this huge groundbreaking impact on music which you have yet to explain with receipts. If you do not even know how impact is measured how can you make such a claim about Mariah? @ Motown

[Edited 9/2/14 9:32am]

,

3000 said:

Excuse me, I used album sales to show Mariah was bigger, charts and sales are the only objective way to measure the "biggness" of an artists, thanks. As for impact, how are you measuring it, how do you measure it objectively [Edited 9/2/14 9:00am]

Album sales and chart success are monetary accomplishments compared to actual influence on artists and music as a whole. An artist's success in those areas has zero, zero, zero, zero, ZERO bearing on the influence an artist has and it makes no sense to use that as a means to say someone is the greatest of all time. Look at all the people who have sold less than her (James Brown, Stevie Wonder, Marvin Gaye, Whitney Houston, Motown artists, Nirvana, The Rolling Stones, even the various 80s British Invasion artists, most of which were one hit wonders) yet who's music do you hear on the radio more? Who's music gets covered? Who's music gets sampled? Who's names are more frequently cited as influences to this very day? Not Mariah's. Using album sales and charting songs is quite frankly a shallow way to prove an artist's influence on music.

There was nobody and nobody is and nobody will ever be as popular as Michael Jackson, Elvis and The Beatles. These 3 share the number one spot. Mariah Carey barely cracks the top 25...

MotownSubdivision said:

,

3000 said:

Excuse me, I used album sales to show Mariah was bigger, charts and sales are the only objective way to measure the "biggness" of an artists, thanks. As for impact, how are you measuring it, how do you measure it objectively [Edited 9/2/14 9:00am]

Album sales and chart success are monetary accomplishments compared to actual influence on artists and music as a whole. An artist's success in those areas has zero, zero, zero, zero, ZERO bearing on the influence an artist has and it makes no sense to use that as a means to say someone is the greatest of all time. Look at all the people who have sold less than her (James Brown, Stevie Wonder, Marvin Gaye, Whitney Houston, Motown artists, Nirvana, The Rolling Stones, even the various 80s British Invasion artists, most of which were one hit wonders) yet who's music do you hear on the radio more? Who's music gets covered? Who's music gets sampled? Who's names are more frequently cited as influences to this very day? Not Mariah's. Using album sales and charting songs is quite frankly a shallow way to prove an artist's influence on music.

Exactly!!! I like Mariah but it is what it is. People think awards, sells and chart positions make you impactful or a legend and it does not. What makes someone great and a legend is the impact of their music. If it is timeless and people still talk about it then they are great. The fact that Marvin and Stevie's music still causes a hysteria is impressive being its been almost 40 years since their hey day. That shows that their music made a big cultural impact.

3000 said:

So when someone claims Janet is bigger, and I prove them wrong impact is now the question? [Edited 9/2/14 11:18am]

You clearly haven't been paying attention if you think we were talking about anything other than impact. You haven't proved anything other than that you're insistent on album sales and hits being all that make an artist.

[Edited 9/2/14 11:37am]

MotownSubdivision said:

3000 said:

So when someone claims Janet is bigger, and I prove them wrong impact is now the question? [Edited 9/2/14 11:18am]

Are you serious? I asked you before you even mentioned Janet to explain with receipts how Mariah made this big groundbreaking impact on the music industry (as you claim) which you have yet to prove and instead have discredited Janet with meaningless things.

3000 said:

MotownSubdivision said:

Objectively speaking, Mariah was never bigger than The Beatles, Michael, Janet, Whitney, or Madonna. This list is objective however it subjectively uses a objective variable that has no bearing on what is being asked. It isn't a poll where fans voted on who they think is the biggest star of all time, it's an analysis that uses a variable that is objectively wrong to use for what is being determined. Yes, the list means nothing and holds as much weight as a wet paper bag but it's pretty sad seeing an established periodical like Time being responsible for such a one dimensional analysis of what makes a star.

Do you see where you're wrong now?

3000 said:

We how "ground-breaking" was janet?

She did more for music in 2 albums (there are more than that but you get the idea) than Mariah has in her entire discography.

MotownSubdivision said:

Are you going to answer the question? Deflecting this discussion on Janet is not going to change the fact that you have not provided any receipts.

Both Mariah and Janet are such fuck ups in my opinion. Janet literally jacked her brother's art with her videos but it's nice that she went to a more urban sound, more soul-ish, Mariah was the type of singer who had a very soft voice, sang about love and had people buying her records, pure success... Still, both of them weren't groundbreaking or innovative, Janet stole MJ's formula and added a bit of 90's R&B, Mariah was instrumental in popularizing slow soul r&b music that many followed back in thge day (Boyz II Men, R Kelly).. It's all the same, Janet was bad, Mariah was cute, none was genius.

mjscarousal said:

3000 said:

MotownSubdivision said:

She did more for music in 2 albums (there are more than that but you get the idea) than Mariah has in her entire discography.

Sure, but I'll need you to specify

Control was Janet's breakout album. It was sonically different and a lot more attractive than the alleged blandness of her first 2 oft-forgotten albums and set the stage for the peak of her career and establishing her famous bad girl image that almost every female artist has tried to incorporate since. Then there's Rhythm Nation which many consider her magna opus in which she combined socially conscious themes with catchy, sonically interesting sounds. Both are milestone albums which display Janet's emotional vocals and adept dancing skills in her music videos.

3000 said:

You all keep saying Janet was bigger, but have no factual reciepts to back the claim At her peak Janet sold 20 million copies of her self-titled, that same year Mariah sold 25 million of Music box, she would later sell 32 million of Day Dreaming, both are diamond albums, a feat Janet has not completed. Where are youre reciepts proving Janet was bigger, ill wait... [Edited 9/2/14 7:13am]

sorry but mariah does not have a diamond album, billboard recently put out a list of the top selling albums of the soundscan era, the only black artist with a diamond album was usher. mariah's biggest selling album in the us was in the 7 million range.everybody has said she was successful,she has been the biggest benefactor of payola and other manipulations over the last 30 years. janet's impact and influence far surpasses mariah's. the only thing i ever hear anybody talk about with mariah is her chart hits and sales.if you like we can revisit the wonderful 90s and compare the impact of eras by janet and whitney compared to mariah.

3000 said:

mjscarousal said:

Are you going to answer the question? Deflecting this discussion on Janet is not going to change the fact that you have not provided any receipts.

And you have

Actually I have. I have stayed on topic and have not used irrelevant things outside this discussion to prove my opiniion. So I think at this point it is fair to say that you have no receipts. You can continue to randomly bash Janet all you want. You have failed to prove your argument.

MotownSubdivision said:

3000 said:

MotownSubdivision said: Sure, but I'll need you to specify

Control was Janet's breakout album. It was sonically different and a lot more attractive than the alleged blandness of her first 2 oft-forgotten albums and set the stage for the peak of her career and establishing her famous bad girl image that almost every female artist has tried to incorporate since. Then there's Rhythm Nation which many consider her magna opus in which she combined socially conscious themes with catchy, sonically interesting sounds. Both are milestone albums which display Janet's emotional vocals and adept dancing skills in her music videos.

journalists still write articles on those albums in 2014,i dont even know the names of most mariah albums. janet's impact on music,video,performing,and style has far outweighed anything mariah has ever done. im not gonna even talk about janet anymore, i can argue that mary j blige had a bigger impact than mariah

[Edited 9/2/14 13:16pm]

3000 said:

Mariah has 2 diamond albums, look it up

if those albums were released during the soundscan era, no she does not. you look it up, billboard released the list of the top selling albums since soundscan, diamond is 10 million sold in the us,mariah was not among the artists who sold 10 million copies of a single album.like i said usher was the only black, i believe whitney was credited for the bodyguard.

3000 said:

Mariah has 2 diamond albums, look it up

if those albums were released during the soundscan era, no she does not. you look it up, billboard released the list of the top selling albums since soundscan, diamond is 10 million sold in the us,mariah was not among the artists who sold 10 million copies of a single album.like i said usher was the only black, i believe whitney was credited for the bodyguard.

mjscarousal said:

3000 said:

lowkey said:

3000 said:

Mariah has 2 diamond albums, look it up

if those albums were released during the soundscan era, no she does not. you look it up, billboard released the list of the top selling albums since soundscan, diamond is 10 million sold in the us,mariah was not among the artists who sold 10 million copies of a single album.like i said usher was the only black, i believe whitney was credited for the bodyguard.

[/ quote] The only Black TF? look up the certifications, 2 of her albums are diamond, sorry

look it up where? my info comes from billboard magazine, you know, the same source you are using for mariah stats. the only artist since 2001 with 2 diamond albums is eminim, celine and brittney came close,they each have 1 diamond and another albumthat sold over 9 million, i guess that makes them both bigger than mariah huh. mariah has 2 albums in the top 100, daydream sold like 7.6 and music box 7.2.its not hard to find this list, just type in billboard's top selling albums since soundscan. now if mariah has 2 diamond albums she got them before march 1991.