Cinny said:

I don't think other years of the Grammys support this, but I agree there needs to be less emphasis on sales and popularity at the Grammys. Otherwise, you mightas well be watching the Billboard awards, American Music Awards, MTV Video awards, Youtube awards...

As long as the Grammys are televised on a major network (cable or traditional), they will continue to emphasize popularity. Though they don't always. There will more situations like Steely Dan, which won in 2001 over Eminem. Even when Arcade Fire won, they weren't the biggest sellers.

namepeace said:

Cinny said:

I don't think other years of the Grammys support this, but I agree there needs to be less emphasis on sales and popularity at the Grammys. Otherwise, you mightas well be watching the Billboard awards, American Music Awards, MTV Video awards, Youtube awards...

As long as the Grammys are televised on a major network (cable or traditional), they will continue to emphasize popularity. Though they don't always. There will more situations like Steely Dan, which won in 2001 over Eminem. Even when Arcade Fire won, they weren't the biggest sellers.

True! Although... Steely Dan, Eminem, Arcade Fire, Daft Punk.. I am starting to see India.Arie's point

Cinny said:

namepeace said:

As long as the Grammys are televised on a major network (cable or traditional), they will continue to emphasize popularity. Though they don't always. There will more situations like Steely Dan, which won in 2001 over Eminem. Even when Arcade Fire won, they weren't the biggest sellers.

True! Although... Steely Dan, Eminem, Arcade Fire, Daft Punk.. I am starting to see India.Arie's point

Well, from a cynical view, these types of awards always try to "cover" themselves. Whenever one "segment" gets neglected, it compensates. Steely Dan won when the older listeners started feeling left out. Arcade Fire won to validate the indie scene. As for hip-hop, Digable Planets, Lauryn Hill, OutKast, Jay-Z, et al. have won over the years. Grammy doesn't leave any "box" unchecked for long.

[Edited 1/29/14 15:22pm]

I remember when Dj Jazzy & Jeff & the Fresh PRINCE won the first Best Rap Performance Grammy in 1989. They wouldn't even air it! That got so much controversy.Will & Jeff led a boycott in protest of the award not being televised.

[Edited 1/29/14 17:33pm]

Speaking of Black musicians/artists who did win grammys this year, Nile Rodgers winning a grammy this year, I was very happy about that, but surprised that someone said he never won any prior to that with all his contributions to the music industry, and hits back in the day. Don't know how true that his 3 grammys this year was the first time he won any. About Indie Arie's comments, I believe she is basically saying that many Black artists that make quality music, whether rnb or not, are not being sought after, picked up, promoted or valued by the music industry, as much as they were years ago. I was surprised that Janelle Monae was not nominated for her album, which was pretty good, yet ignored by the industry. She is basically in a category of her own. I was also surprised when my young niece told me she doesn't watch the grammys anymore, because she doesn't care much for the music of today's younger artists, and says it all sounds the same now and too much duplication. She said she's more into 'old school' music of the late 60s and all of the 70s/80s and even some 90s music, when radio was playing a treasure of various music from many artists, with various sounds, and where there was more creativity in the music, and the great soul sounds of those eras, that is so missing from the industry today. Shame though, because there are some very, good Black artists whose music don't get recognized at all. The music industry is in such a sad state, and there hasn't been a musical revolution (musical revolution, such is the term referenced by artist 'Esthero' a while back), pretty much since the 80s to be honest. Everything sounds the same now.

SoulAlive said:

Big difference from 1987 to 2014, is that Whitney won on her voice talent and song quality, whereas Bey's example of winning a grammy is showing young girls that they have to strip down to pair of panties 2 sizes smaller than your azz cheeks to win one, and damn near have your jewels hanging out.

[Edited 1/29/14 19:09pm]

SoulAlive said:

like night and day........

this is how far the mighty have fallen

laurarichardson said:

jackson35 said:

COULD U LIST THEM PLEASE.

----- I only came up with 19 but these artist had singles or cd out this year. And if they did not have anything out it would not matter since we just saw a horde of artist on the Grammies who have not put out anything this year at all. We have talent the mainstream just does not want you to see it.

1.Eric Benet,

2. Anthony Hamilton,

3.Ron Isley, ,

4.Charlie Wilson,

5.India Arie,

6.Miguel,

7.Drake,

8Tamar Braxton,

9Avant,

10Keke Wyatt,

11Chrisette Michele,

12Marsha Ambrosius,

13 Daly

14. Robert Glasper

15. Jill Scott

16. Kem

17. Janelle Monáe

18. Toni Braxton

19 Babyface

MOST OF THESE ARTIST HAVE WON GRAMMYS, BUT THEY ARE NOT PUTTING OUT QUALITY WORK IN A WHILE. ALSO MANANGMENT HAS A LOT TO DO WITH WHAT'S GET NOMINATED ON THE GRAMMYS. A LOT OF BLACK ARTIST HAVE SHITTY MANANGERS.

jackson35 said:

MOST OF THESE ARTIST HAVE WON GRAMMYS, BUT THEY ARE NOT PUTTING OUT QUALITY WORK IN A WHILE.

You must be out of your damn mind.

Your opinion is null and void.

Robert Glasper, Jill scott, JANELLE MONAE not putting out quality work?

Admit it, you don't know shit about R&B, do you? I don't believe you do.

This discussion ain't for you.

namepeace said:

TonyVanDam said:

Mr. Scarface predict a while back that within the next 25 years that mainstream hip-hop/rap was going to suffer the same fate as rock & roll: it will be mostly white.

Some of us, including myself, may not like the way he said it. But he's definitely telling the truth.

But as with jazz and blues, white audiences will also (help) play the role of curators for underground hip-hop. It's happening already.

[Edited 1/29/14 14:15pm]

e.g. Cinny.

[Edited 1/30/14 0:43am]

BlaqueKnight said:

BlaqueKnight said:

jackson35 said:

MOST OF THESE ARTIST HAVE WON GRAMMYS, BUT THEY ARE NOT PUTTING OUT QUALITY WORK IN A WHILE.

You must be out of your damn mind.

Your opinion is null and void.

Robert Glasper, Jill scott, JANELLE MONAE not putting out quality work?

Admit it, you don't know shit about R&B, do you? I don't believe you do.

This discussion ain't for you.

kendrick lamar winning nothing in the rap categories and the lack of janelle monae's nominations were enough as a proof that yes black artists are kinda excluded at the moment...

jackson35 said:

Lammastide said:

namepeace said:

But as with jazz and blues, white audiences will also (help) play the role of curators for underground hip-hop. It's happening already.

[Edited 1/29/14 14:15pm]

e.g. Cinny.

Oh, I am QUITE AWARE of my role there

There was TONS wrong with the Grammys this year, but India has to remember that the committe that votes and put these things together, dont know many artists at all, their idea of "Black America" is Jay Z, now YES he is a major star but he is FAR from a positive role model or what should be shown off. Mainstream knows Beyonce and Jay and Rhianna and so do radio and labels and all that shit is in the same bed. There is alot of music that is left out and that is why honestly the ratings are up, this year thank Paul McCartney and Ringo for your ratings, cause during those times thats when it peaked, but there was alot wrong with this show, for the second year in a row they ran credits over performers and even this time cut them off the air, last year their host LL got the shaft of that, and the network got shit for it and did nothing this year but did it worse. I get India's issues and we have all said this for years, but to be honest WHERE ARE THE NETWORKS on this? Why cant BET put together something like VH1 classic did and now all of a sudden a show like "that metal show" has fucking revived a genre of music in SALES and RESPECT for alot of older artists. India has to look at those things too, cause alot of those at BET sold their SOUL.

laurarichardson said:

savagedreams said:

im kind of confused. i dvdr'd the show just to see the performances i wanted to, but was i mistaken or did i not see black artists accepting awards, AND black artists performing? now if shes just mad because artists of no substance are the ones on the show thats the same for black or white.

Most of the RnB awards were given out before the televised awards and this has happend a lot over the last couple of years. The only African-American artist that are allowed to perform are usually rappers and maybe someone like John Legend. A Stevie Wonder might make the cut and that is about it.

I made this argument every year for ages especially in the ROCK category, not only was it totally blind it seemed like if you werent Lenny Kravitz or Bruce you had no chance of even getting a vote, forget about performing. Yes there was Rock on the show, but again the Grammys like she said are focusing on SALES, all those years where BOB DYLAN was winning and people called this show the GRANNYS the show changed its look its producers etc... Honestly, sheis right on every point, though i would go further and apply it to radio to video and to labels, BUT again blame things like SOUNDSCAN which was a HUGE thing in the 90s to early 2000's when peeps were touting first week sales and LOTS were in RB and POP.

KCOOLMUZIQ said:

BlaqueKnight said:

You must be out of your damn mind.

Your opinion is null and void.

Robert Glasper, Jill scott, JANELLE MONAE not putting out quality work?

Admit it, you don't know shit about R&B, do you? I don't believe you do.

This discussion ain't for you.

ROBERT GLASPER SOUNDS LIKE ROY AYERS AND HE HAS A GRAMMY. JILL SCOTT LAST GOOD SONG WAS BLESSED, THE REST OF THE ALBUM NEEDED SOME WORK. JANELLE LATEST ALBUM IS NOT RADIO FRIENDLY. I'M OLDER THEN YOU AND I'VE BEEN AROUND WHEN BLACK MUSIC WAS QUALITY AND TODAY'S MUSIC IS NOT IT. I THINK YOU NEED TO GETS SOME FACTS BEFORE YOU DISMISS MY THEORY.

Robert Glasper Experiment is AWESOME!!!!!!!!!!!

jackson35 said:

KCOOLMUZIQ said:

ROBERT GLASPER SOUNDS LIKE ROY AYERS AND HE HAS A GRAMMY. JILL SCOTT LAST GOOD SONG WAS BLESSED, THE REST OF THE ALBUM NEEDED SOME WORK. JANELLE LATEST ALBUM IS NOT RADIO FRIENDLY. I'M OLDER THEN YOU AND I'VE BEEN AROUND WHEN BLACK MUSIC WAS QUALITY AND TODAY'S MUSIC IS NOT IT. I THINK YOU NEED TO GETS SOME FACTS BEFORE YOU DISMISS MY THEORY.

-

-

So you're going to just dismiss Robert Glasper because he sounds like Roy Ayers to you? Wasn't "Blessed" the last single from Ms. Scott anyway? Janelle isn't the one with the problem. If she was to conform to more commercial radio friendly singles I'm sure you'd be the first to call her a sell out.

-

As many have already said, and as you already know. There's plenty of options out there for quality R&B, Hip Hop, Jazz, or "Black Music" as you put it (you must be older than the most of us referring to it as that) Instead of digging in the crates of old record stores, now you have the luxury of "digging in the crates" online via the internet. Have fun....

Cinny said:

Robert Glasper Experiment is AWESOME!!!!!!!!!!!

No doubt

Musicslave said:

jackson35 said:

ROBERT GLASPER SOUNDS LIKE ROY AYERS AND HE HAS A GRAMMY. JILL SCOTT LAST GOOD SONG WAS BLESSED, THE REST OF THE ALBUM NEEDED SOME WORK. JANELLE LATEST ALBUM IS NOT RADIO FRIENDLY. I'M OLDER THEN YOU AND I'VE BEEN AROUND WHEN BLACK MUSIC WAS QUALITY AND TODAY'S MUSIC IS NOT IT. I THINK YOU NEED TO GETS SOME FACTS BEFORE YOU DISMISS MY THEORY.

-

-

So you're going to just dismiss Robert Glasper because he sounds like Roy Ayers to you? Wasn't "Blessed" the last single from Ms. Scott anyway? Janelle isn't the one with the problem. If she was to conform to more commercial radio friendly singles I'm sure you'd be the first to call her a sell out.

-

As many have already said, and as you already know. There's plenty of options out there for quality R&B, Hip Hop, Jazz, or "Black Music" as you put it (you must be older than the most of us referring to it as that) Instead of digging in the crates of old record stores, now you have the luxury of "digging in the crates" online via the internet. Have fun....

I DIDN'T DIMISS MR GLASPER, I SAID THE GRAMMYS DID NOT FOCUS ON HIM BECAUSE THEY WERE NOT RADIO FREINDLY ALBUMS I WOULD NOT CALL JANELLE A SELLOUT BECAUSE U ARE SUPPOSE TO MAKE THESE KIND OF ALBUMS TO GET NOTICED.

jackson35 said:

This isn't the first time that India Arie got pissed at the Grammys Remember when she got all those nominations for her debut album,but Alicia Keyes ended up winning all the awards? India complained (loudly) about that...lol...one thing about her is,she's never been afriad to speak out.

OldFriends4Sale said:

Gunsnhalen said:

I was with her till she said we need the BET awards. We don't... we really don't

lol true, a lot of people are just getting acknowledged because they are black or the new chocolate of the month.

.

And Patti LaBelle sings and gets an award at every show even the one where she messed up Purple Rain. I just don't know what Patti is doing for all this recognition. She can SANG but a mediocre performer, in my opinion.

.

Even when Prince gets an award, is it because he is an ICON or is it because his album was just killer.

that's your opinion but Patti is one of the few veteran R&B acts still around who have a reputation for always putting on one hell of a show. Even during the points in her career when she wasn't selling records, she sold a lot of tickets for her shows because she has a rep of always giving 100%. When she was in Detroit last week, people were talking about it, as they do every time she does a show here. Other veteran R&B acts (especially female) can come and go and I won't even know they were performing locally because no one spread the word about the shows. But, when Patti is here, I always know because people are saying, "Patti's going to be performing at such-and-such!" Word of mouth gets people out to her shows in droves. In the black community, Patti Labelle is an Icon.

OK here is the deal, and people cant refuse to accept it but its the way it is. Musicianship has changed now, as Dave Grohl said in the "Grammy Winning" film "SOund City" you can make an album on your laptop in your living room now, and send it out to millions by touching a key on that same laptop and your a star. The net has made stars of people that have no business in music, but again times have changed the day of you have to be able to play LIVE doesnt really matter to most today, it doesnt, it may matter to us and many here, but "OVERALL" if you took a poll, i can say that probably 20% of people care about that, and about 5% care who even plays on a record now, and that is the problem with the way music is made and distributed, plain and simple people have to accept this, U wanted things this way and you clearly got it.

Also what India is missing is the fact that the Grammys LONG got blasted because they were nominating Bob Dylan, Eric Clapton, Paul McCartney for albums of the year when maybe they werent SELLING the amount of records that top acts were, this was a HUGE issue because of Soundscan, which sorry to say, is YOUR ERA India Arie. As the 90's went on and the 2000's began, albums by U2 and the Soundtrack to "o brother where art thou" getting awards was pissing off MANY, the grammys were labeled the Grannies. AND were blasted because they were trying to be an equivalent to the Oscars, where your film can win regardless of Box Office.

Now what is the thinking? I can recall Eddie Murphy saying back in the late 80's that he would rather his films make $$ than win an oscar, he would rather people see the film than him standing with an oscar and 3 people saying "we liked you Ed". So basically you arent going to please everyone, the ROCK awards this year got blasted because who won, acts that are almost 50 years old, Black Sabbath, Zep, McCartney, granted all worthy, but again the Grammys cant win. So i have my own complaints but i feel that way every year to a point now where i dont even really care, like the Bilboard Music Awards this show is nothing more than a HYPEFEST, and then a letdown, duets dreamt up that end up really really sucking ass, and not memorable to say the least, so India all i can say is, dont watch, dont care, just do you, thats the best you can do.

I have seen recent interviews with India that demonstrate she still holds a great grudge against the Grammy's from her debut experience, so I take her anger with a grain of salt.

I've never known the Grammy's to award music that suited my definition of quality, or my definition of diverse music-and that has not changed. I'm sure it's frustrating for an artist to feel slighted, but these issues are so subjective, no one will ever be "right" about who deserves recognition or spotlight.

For instance, while I don't care for the music of popular black artists like Beyonce or Kendrick Lamar, I don't care for darlings like Jill Scott or Janelle Monae, either. I think the Robert Glasper Experiment was plain awful. Gasp. But someone thinks they all deserve(d) grammys. Shrug. It's very subjective and not worth getting upset about.

[Edited 2/1/14 14:19pm]