War's album 'The World Is A Ghetto' was the biggest-selling album of 1973.Their impact was HUGE! Their music combined funk,jazz,rock,latin rhythms,R&B,pop,etc.They should have been a shoo-in for induction

Musicslave said:

TonyVanDam said:

ABBA & Madonna didn't deserved to be bitched on neither. But hot damn it, we can never overlook the fact that the longer KISS is denied a place in the R&RHOF, the far more of a joke the R&RHOF will continue to be.

Surely you're not basing the R&RHOF's credibility on one act are you? Even if you add them to the list for this year's class, they still would be a joke. Their list of omissions is something criminal.

It doesn't matter anyway because of the commercialization of all of these awards induces vomit

I agree, but there's a difference.

Awards allegedly recognize the best in a given field.

The Hall of Fame chronicles famous acts. In an entertainment Hall of Fame, it's impossible NOT to consider FAME as a factor.

And in a way, you can't tell the story of rock and roll without including the acts that were selling at the time, if only to allow future music lovers to say, "THAT'S the music people loved 20/30 years ago?"

Gonna listen to some WAR today

Cerebus said:

lowkey said:

ok i will take your word for it. i dont know any of their music except for the annoying loud nasal wannabe rap stuff they did, which like i said seemed more like parody to me.

Ehhh, none of their rap stuff was parody as far as I'm concerned. The way they rapped on License To Ill is who they were at that time. They were hard partying, loud-mouthed, prankster punk kids (as in the music, which they started playing in 79 and releasing in 82, four years before LTI) from Brooklyn. They got inspired by the music going on around them and made one joke-like track called Cooky Puss (which was actually popular in NYC dance clubs). Eventually they made the (initial) full switch from punk to rap, hired Rick Rubin as their DJ and the rest is history (for them AND Rick Rubin).

Nothing they released was ever meant to make fun of hip-hop/rap, though. In fact, they've always been well-liked by a lot of the hip-hop crowd. Toured with RUN-DMC way back in the day. Q-Tip and Nas have guested on their albums.

Ad Rock has a nasally voice - not much to do about that. But as he got older and more mature, their sound grew and evolved and he did stop emphasizing it.

I think it's Fight for Your Right to Party (song & video) that made people like me think they were a joke.

Brass Monkey & Paul Revere had decent rapping, but Fight was misleading IMO. They came across like twisted sister or some other gimmick band. It wasn't good metal or good rap. It also wasn't very funny and didn't seem particularly clever, and the Beasties have always been funny & clever.

SoulAlive said:

War's album 'The World Is A Ghetto' was the biggest-selling album of 1973.Their impact was HUGE! Their music combined funk,jazz,rock,latin rhythms,R&B,pop,etc.They should have been a shoo-in for induction

Well, you're right, they definitely deserve to be there

NDRU said:

Cerebus said:

Ehhh, none of their rap stuff was parody as far as I'm concerned. The way they rapped on License To Ill is who they were at that time. They were hard partying, loud-mouthed, prankster punk kids (as in the music, which they started playing in 79 and releasing in 82, four years before LTI) from Brooklyn. They got inspired by the music going on around them and made one joke-like track called Cooky Puss (which was actually popular in NYC dance clubs). Eventually they made the (initial) full switch from punk to rap, hired Rick Rubin as their DJ and the rest is history (for them AND Rick Rubin).

Nothing they released was ever meant to make fun of hip-hop/rap, though. In fact, they've always been well-liked by a lot of the hip-hop crowd. Toured with RUN-DMC way back in the day. Q-Tip and Nas have guested on their albums.

Ad Rock has a nasally voice - not much to do about that. But as he got older and more mature, their sound grew and evolved and he did stop emphasizing it.

I think it's Fight for Your Right to Party (song & video) that made people like me think they were a joke.

Brass Monkey & Paul Revere had decent rapping, but Fight was misleading IMO. They came across like twisted sister or some other gimmick band. It wasn't good metal or good rap. It also wasn't very funny and didn't seem particularly clever, and the Beasties have always been funny & clever.

Ready for a bomb?

The Beastie Boys hate that song.

Timmy84 said:

NDRU said:

I think it's Fight for Your Right to Party (song & video) that made people like me think they were a joke.

Brass Monkey & Paul Revere had decent rapping, but Fight was misleading IMO. They came across like twisted sister or some other gimmick band. It wasn't good metal or good rap. It also wasn't very funny and didn't seem particularly clever, and the Beasties have always been funny & clever.

Ready for a bomb?

The Beastie Boys hate that song.

Nah I am not too surprised. They probably played it a million times, and it probably gave them fans who did not really understand what they were about.

Even now, knowing who they are, I don't really like it either

NDRU said:

Timmy84 said:

Ready for a bomb?

The Beastie Boys hate that song.

Nah I am not too surprised. They probably played it a million times, and it probably gave them fans who did not really understand what they were about.

Even now, knowing who they are, I don't really like it either

They had way better songs anyway. "Sabotage" is the shit to this day...

whether either band is more influential than the other doesn't matter. it's unquantifiable...they're both great bands and they both deserve to be in the hall of fame by any reasonable estimation. war will get there, no doubt. just because they aren't yet shouldn't detract from the beasties. they deserve to be there.

i don't think these things are determined by any sort of chronology, or sales, or disciples; but probably by what makes the hall of fame itself more marketable. in this case, i'd have to say the beastie boys are a bigger draw.

incidentally, i recall an interview on npr when terry gross asked adrock how he accounts for the beasties shift in style between license to ill and paul's boutique. his response, 'we switched from beer to weed'. that always cracks me up...it's too true.

Gunsnhalen said:

TheResistor said:

I have NEVER understood the "respect" the Red Hot Chilli Peppers and The Beastie Boys get in the press.

The Rock and Roll Hall of Fame is as biased/ridiculous as the Grammy's. Fucking high school popularity contest.

I literally just posed this on the last page but i will say it again

Wow another white hate response thread. Look war is great! But so is the beastie boys & red hot chilli peppers. Yes they where inspired by african american music and? I also ate a pickle today! Wanna talk about more shit that doesn't matter? This is about the music, they all have made great music. War is a killer funk band and they deserve there place! No doubt, the beastie boys mixed punk & rap and made it something unique. And they used samples in a very clever way and some groundbreaking videos. The chilli peppers are kings of alternative, also my aunt is a dj... said rhcp is the only group she played on every stationshe worked at. They appeal to rockers, funksters, heavy metal, even r&b. And make unique music by fantastic, respected musicians. The r&r hall of fame is a joke anyway....

But really the RHCP they where the first to play the rock & the funk like they did from an all white band. Not even the greats like The Stones, Led Zeppelin, The Beatles. Played the funk rock by mainstrem rock artists. And they brought a lot of humor along with great ballads.

[Edited 12/8/11 18:40pm]

How in the hell did you perceive my post to be a 'white hate' response?

Cerebus said:

mjscarousal said:

So many enslaved and bondage minds I read.. smh

[img:$uid]http://i903.photobucket.com/albums/ac231/mjscarousal/fight-the-power-o.gif[/img:$uid]

Fight the power!

Even Chuck D knows how dope the Beastie Boys are...

Chuck D Talks About Honoring Beastie Boys With Video Vanguard Award

When the Beastie Boys enter into the Video Vanguard at Thursday night's Video Music Awards, they will be introduced by another of rap's pioneering figures.

Public Enemy MC will do the honors Thursday night when the Beastie Boys are honored for their achievements in music and video over the course of their 17-year career. Speaking with the MTV Radio Network during rehearsals for the VMAs, Chuck said that he was proud to able to mark the rise of rap, and the rise of the Beasties, at Thursday's awards show.

"I think this is a benchmark for rap," Chuck told the MTV Radio Network during VMA rehearsals in Los Angeles on Wednesday.

The accolades will no doubt continue to flow when Chuck steps to the podium Thursday night to present the Beastie Boys with the 1998 Video Vanguard Award.

_______________________________

For Public Enemy strongman Chuck D, this week's MTV Video Music Awards offered the rapper not only the chance to honor the Beastie Boys, but also to erase one of his memories of his VMA past.

The PE leader was on hand Thursday night to present the Beastie Boys with the Video Vanguard award, and wrote his own speech for the occasion, which allowed him to redeem himself for flubbing one at the VMAs a few years ago.

"I was given the speech yesterday,"Chuck D told the MTV Radio Network,"but I was like 'uhhh' ... It just didn't nail things. The worst thing someone can do is write for me. So, I wrote some pretty good copy, tied some things together, said it strong, and nailed it."

___________________________________

Chuck also wrote the forward to Dennis Abrams 2007 book, Beastie Boys: Hip-Hop Stars.

I bet you Chuck will be as happy as anyone that someone as NYC hip-hop as the Beastie Boys are going to be in the RRHOF.

That doesnt JUSTIFY them getting in BEFORE WAR. Thats like saying that since Drake did a song with Stevie Wonder that I should take him seriosly now??

OF COURSE Chuck D would say this. Most rap acts dont make it in .. him being a influential rapper

But its funny that they even got in BEFORE PUBLIC ENEMY LOL

So much irony in that post

I dont take this shit seriously at all...

TheResistor said:

Gunsnhalen said:

I literally just posed this on the last page but i will say it again

Wow another white hate response thread. Look war is great! But so is the beastie boys & red hot chilli peppers. Yes they where inspired by african american music and? I also ate a pickle today! Wanna talk about more shit that doesn't matter? This is about the music, they all have made great music. War is a killer funk band and they deserve there place! No doubt, the beastie boys mixed punk & rap and made it something unique. And they used samples in a very clever way and some groundbreaking videos. The chilli peppers are kings of alternative, also my aunt is a dj... said rhcp is the only group she played on every stationshe worked at. They appeal to rockers, funksters, heavy metal, even r&b. And make unique music by fantastic, respected musicians. The r&r hall of fame is a joke anyway....

But really the RHCP they where the first to play the rock & the funk like they did from an all white band. Not even the greats like The Stones, Led Zeppelin, The Beatles. Played the funk rock by mainstrem rock artists. And they brought a lot of humor along with great ballads.

[Edited 12/8/11 18:40pm]

How in the hell did you perceive my post to be a 'white hate' response?

sorry that wasn't aimed towards you.

It was aimed towards some people who say it's a shame RHCP & BB got in because there white artists inspired African Roots. To me who cares? good music is good music no matter who inspire dor who play's it... if your good your good

mjscarousal said:

Cerebus said:

Even Chuck D knows how dope the Beastie Boys are...

Chuck D Talks About Honoring Beastie Boys With Video Vanguard Award

When the Beastie Boys enter into the Video Vanguard at Thursday night's Video Music Awards, they will be introduced by another of rap's pioneering figures.

Public Enemy MC will do the honors Thursday night when the Beastie Boys are honored for their achievements in music and video over the course of their 17-year career. Speaking with the MTV Radio Network during rehearsals for the VMAs, Chuck said that he was proud to able to mark the rise of rap, and the rise of the Beasties, at Thursday's awards show.

"I think this is a benchmark for rap," Chuck told the MTV Radio Network during VMA rehearsals in Los Angeles on Wednesday.

The accolades will no doubt continue to flow when Chuck steps to the podium Thursday night to present the Beastie Boys with the 1998 Video Vanguard Award.

_______________________________

For Public Enemy strongman Chuck D, this week's MTV Video Music Awards offered the rapper not only the chance to honor the Beastie Boys, but also to erase one of his memories of his VMA past.

The PE leader was on hand Thursday night to present the Beastie Boys with the Video Vanguard award, and wrote his own speech for the occasion, which allowed him to redeem himself for flubbing one at the VMAs a few years ago.

"I was given the speech yesterday,"Chuck D told the MTV Radio Network,"but I was like 'uhhh' ... It just didn't nail things. The worst thing someone can do is write for me. So, I wrote some pretty good copy, tied some things together, said it strong, and nailed it."

___________________________________

Chuck also wrote the forward to Dennis Abrams 2007 book, Beastie Boys: Hip-Hop Stars.

I bet you Chuck will be as happy as anyone that someone as NYC hip-hop as the Beastie Boys are going to be in the RRHOF.

That doesnt JUSTIFY them getting in BEFORE WAR. Thats like saying that since Drake did a song with Stevie Wonder that I should take him seriosly now??

OF COURSE Chuck D would say this. Most rap acts dont make it in .. him being a influential rapper

But its funny that they even got in BEFORE PUBLIC ENEMY LOL

So much irony in that post

I dont take this shit seriously at all...

Public Enemy got in a few years ago

I never got the Beastie Boys hype but I also never took the time to really listen to them except for a few songs. But they made an impact so I guess they deserve it.

Gunsnhalen said:

mjscarousal said:

That doesnt JUSTIFY them getting in BEFORE WAR. Thats like saying that since Drake did a song with Stevie Wonder that I should take him seriosly now??

OF COURSE Chuck D would say this. Most rap acts dont make it in .. him being a influential rapper

But its funny that they even got in BEFORE PUBLIC ENEMY LOL

So much irony in that post

I dont take this shit seriously at all...

Public Enemy got in a few years ago

Fixed

BB still should not have gotten in before WAR

mjscarousal said:

Cerebus said:

Even Chuck D knows how dope the Beastie Boys are...

Chuck D Talks About Honoring Beastie Boys With Video Vanguard Award

When the Beastie Boys enter into the Video Vanguard at Thursday night's Video Music Awards, they will be introduced by another of rap's pioneering figures.

Public Enemy MC will do the honors Thursday night when the Beastie Boys are honored for their achievements in music and video over the course of their 17-year career. Speaking with the MTV Radio Network during rehearsals for the VMAs, Chuck said that he was proud to able to mark the rise of rap, and the rise of the Beasties, at Thursday's awards show.

"I think this is a benchmark for rap," Chuck told the MTV Radio Network during VMA rehearsals in Los Angeles on Wednesday.

The accolades will no doubt continue to flow when Chuck steps to the podium Thursday night to present the Beastie Boys with the 1998 Video Vanguard Award.

_______________________________

For Public Enemy strongman Chuck D, this week's MTV Video Music Awards offered the rapper not only the chance to honor the Beastie Boys, but also to erase one of his memories of his VMA past.

The PE leader was on hand Thursday night to present the Beastie Boys with the Video Vanguard award, and wrote his own speech for the occasion, which allowed him to redeem himself for flubbing one at the VMAs a few years ago.

"I was given the speech yesterday,"Chuck D told the MTV Radio Network,"but I was like 'uhhh' ... It just didn't nail things. The worst thing someone can do is write for me. So, I wrote some pretty good copy, tied some things together, said it strong, and nailed it."

___________________________________

Chuck also wrote the forward to Dennis Abrams 2007 book, Beastie Boys: Hip-Hop Stars.

I bet you Chuck will be as happy as anyone that someone as NYC hip-hop as the Beastie Boys are going to be in the RRHOF.

That doesnt JUSTIFY them getting in BEFORE WAR. Thats like saying that since Drake did a song with Stevie Wonder that I should take him seriosly now??

OF COURSE Chuck D would say this. Most rap acts dont make it in .. him being a influential rapper

But its funny that they even got in BEFORE PUBLIC ENEMY LOL

So much irony in that post

I dont take this shit seriously at all...

But the Beasties' debut career album was within 2 years befor Public Enemy's. Technically speaking, it's fair for the Beasties to be in the HOF ahead of Public Enemy.

The reason irony is that the Beasties are in the HOF ahead of LL Cool J!

Gunsnhalen said:

mjscarousal said:

That doesnt JUSTIFY them getting in BEFORE WAR. Thats like saying that since Drake did a song with Stevie Wonder that I should take him seriosly now??

OF COURSE Chuck D would say this. Most rap acts dont make it in .. him being a influential rapper

But its funny that they even got in BEFORE PUBLIC ENEMY LOL

So much irony in that post

I dont take this shit seriously at all...

Public Enemy got in a few years ago

Public Enemy are not in the R&RHOF yet. Before the Beasties Boys, Grandmaster Flash/The Furious Five & RUN DMC were THE only hip-hop/rap acts in the the R&RHOF up to this point.

TonyVanDam said:

Gunsnhalen said:

Public Enemy got in a few years ago

Public Enemy are not in the R&RHOF yet. Before the Beasties Boys, Grandmaster Flash/The Furious Five & RUN DMC were THE only hip-hop/rap acts in the the R&RHOF up to this point.

Damn i could have sworn they got in?? i gues they haven't that's a damn shame.

Gunsnhalen said:

TonyVanDam said:

Public Enemy are not in the R&RHOF yet. Before the Beasties Boys, Grandmaster Flash/The Furious Five & RUN DMC were THE only hip-hop/rap acts in the the R&RHOF up to this point.

Damn i could have sworn they got in?? i gues they haven't that's a damn shame.

has it been 25 years? their first album was '87.

peedub said:

Gunsnhalen said:

Damn i could have sworn they got in?? i gues they haven't that's a damn shame.

has it been 25 years? their first album was '87.

This new year!

I was thinking of the hip hop awards! idk why i was thinking RRHOF

I was in 8th grade in high school when the hip hop awards came on & just started to get into Public Enemy. And that show made me love them more... now tehre my fav Hip Hop group

BigAudio said:

I wonder if WAR getting passed over has something to do with the rift between Lonnie Jordan (founding memeber), who is currently a member of WAR and Howard and the rest of the original members together with their group the Lowrider Band.

As Howard and the guys are not allowed to use the WAR name for anything. As Lonnie feels those guys are not members of WAR and are probably not welcome when it comes to anything WAR.

I have a feeling the current members of WAR feel their the ones deserving of the honor ahead of the original guys. Being that some of them have been with WAR now at least 20 years.

Maybe the Hall does not want to deal with that. Just a theory.

That's it in a nutshell. They were passed over in '09 too. There is ongoing litigation because the thief, Goldstein fraudulently claims ownership of the name WAR and owes the original members millions of dollars in royalties. Goldstein did the same thing to Sly Stone.

The HOF wants no part of the drama.

The way I see it, Lonnie Jordan's b*tch ass sold out because 1. He was always jealous of Howard Scott as the band leader, and 2. For $$$

The current members will never be anything more than a tribute/cover band IMO no matter how long they impersonate the real WAR.

So GNR got in cause while they hate each other they aren't suing. How Blondie.

lazycrockett said:

So GNR got in cause while they hate each other they aren't suing. How Blondie.

Pretty much. And if it's true that's that's what's going on with WAR than FUCK Lonnie Jordan. I don't care how influential you are, you don't fuck over your band members LIKE that. Fuck that. But I doubt half of GNR will show up lol

Timmy84 said:

lazycrockett said:

So GNR got in cause while they hate each other they aren't suing. How Blondie.

Pretty much. And if it's true that's that's what's going on with WAR than FUCK Lonnie Jordan. I don't care how influential you are, you don't fuck over your band members LIKE that. Fuck that. But I doubt half of GNR will show up lol

I'm pretty sure whoever Axl wants to be onstage is who will be onstage. As far as him showing up, he said he's down for it last month on his big ol' '"That Metal Show" interview. He also said who he plays with will depend on what the RRHOF asks him to do.

As far as the original band goes; Duff and Izzy have sat in with the new band very recently, Steven Adler has already said he wants to play and that he just had lunch with Slash, who holds no grudges against Axl what-so-ever. Apparantly the only issue is one that Axl has against Slash, and nobody really seems to understand exactly what that is. But I still got the impression from the interview that Axl would consider playing with him if they were inducted. So we'll just have to wait and see, I guess.

As a random aside, this recent round of touring - the one that's going on right now - is actually producing some really great shows. Best Gn'R live I've seen since they starting touring Chinese Democracy, like, four years ago. Seems like people are actually starting to pay attention to this version of the band and hoping they put out a new album soon.

Cerebus said:

Timmy84 said:

Pretty much. And if it's true that's that's what's going on with WAR than FUCK Lonnie Jordan. I don't care how influential you are, you don't fuck over your band members LIKE that. Fuck that. But I doubt half of GNR will show up lol

I'm pretty sure whoever Axl wants to be onstage is who will be onstage. As far as him showing up, he said he's down for it last month on his big ol' '"That Metal Show" interview. He also said who he plays with will depend on what the RRHOF asks him to do.

As far as the original band goes; Duff and Izzy have sat in with the new band very recently, Steven Adler has already said he wants to play and that he just had lunch with Slash, who holds no grudges against Axl what-so-ever. Apparantly the only issue is one that Axl has against Slash, and nobody really seems to understand exactly what that is. But I still got the impression from the interview that Axl would consider playing with him if they were inducted. So we'll just have to wait and see, I guess.

As a random aside, this recent round of touring - the one that's going on right now - is actually producing some really great shows. Best Gn'R live I've seen since they starting touring Chinese Democracy, like, four years ago. Seems like people are actually starting to pay attention to this version of the band and hoping they put out a new album soon.

That is interesting...

Cerebus said:

Timmy84 said:

Pretty much. And if it's true that's that's what's going on with WAR than FUCK Lonnie Jordan. I don't care how influential you are, you don't fuck over your band members LIKE that. Fuck that. But I doubt half of GNR will show up lol

I'm pretty sure whoever Axl wants to be onstage is who will be onstage. As far as him showing up, he said he's down for it last month on his big ol' '"That Metal Show" interview. He also said who he plays with will depend on what the RRHOF asks him to do.

As far as the original band goes; Duff and Izzy have sat in with the new band very recently, Steven Adler has already said he wants to play and that he just had lunch with Slash, who holds no grudges against Axl what-so-ever. Apparantly the only issue is one that Axl has against Slash, and nobody really seems to understand exactly what that is. But I still got the impression from the interview that Axl would consider playing with him if they were inducted. So we'll just have to wait and see, I guess.

As a random aside, this recent round of touring - the one that's going on right now - is actually producing some really great shows. Best Gn'R live I've seen since they starting touring Chinese Democracy, like, four years ago. Seems like people are actually starting to pay attention to this version of the band and hoping they put out a new album soon.

Even if personal differences are put aside (which will not happen anytime soon!), there will NEVER be a true GNR reunion because the musical creative differences between Axl & Slash are too great, plain and simple.

Both men have their strong differences of opinions concerning what kind of band GNR was suppose to be. Slash thinks hard rock & metal only. Axl thinks hard rock mix with classic ideas taken from Elton John, Queen, & Nine Inch Nails.

TonyVanDam said:

Cerebus said:

I'm pretty sure whoever Axl wants to be onstage is who will be onstage. As far as him showing up, he said he's down for it last month on his big ol' '"That Metal Show" interview. He also said who he plays with will depend on what the RRHOF asks him to do.

As far as the original band goes; Duff and Izzy have sat in with the new band very recently, Steven Adler has already said he wants to play and that he just had lunch with Slash, who holds no grudges against Axl what-so-ever. Apparantly the only issue is one that Axl has against Slash, and nobody really seems to understand exactly what that is. But I still got the impression from the interview that Axl would consider playing with him if they were inducted. So we'll just have to wait and see, I guess.

As a random aside, this recent round of touring - the one that's going on right now - is actually producing some really great shows. Best Gn'R live I've seen since they starting touring Chinese Democracy, like, four years ago. Seems like people are actually starting to pay attention to this version of the band and hoping they put out a new album soon.

Even if personal differences are put aside (which will not happen anytime soon!), there will NEVER be a true GNR reunion because the musical creative differences between Axl & Slash are too great, plain and simple.

Both men have their strong differences of opinions concerning what kind of band GNR was suppose to be. Slash thinks hard rock & metal only. Axl thinks hard rock mix with classic ideas taken from Elton John, Queen, & Nine Inch Nails.

Playing together for the RRHOF induction is something completely different. We're not talking about a reunion - we're talking about a couple songs. Even one song. That kind of thing is not unprecedented for this ceremony. An actual reunion, where they make music or tour togther - I totally agree with you.

I'd like to throw The Cure into this "not in the RRHOF, do they deserve to be" conversation as well.

Formed in 1973

First album released in 1979

Released more than 20 albums

Released countless EPs and singles with non-album tracks

Had a huge impact on modern rock/alternative/college radio

Influenced at least two generations, maybe three, of musicians who came after them in the alternative world

Still playing sold out THREE HOUR shows all around the world (like, three shows at The Beacon in NYC a couple weeks ago)

Yet something tells me they'll forever fall into the same area Rush and KISS occupy that the HOF seems to ignore.

[Edited 12/9/11 22:53pm]