RKJCNE said:

Rihanna has mastered the are of reinvention like Madonna, but no way is her music on the same level.

Reinvention (partially thanks to Maddona and Janet) has become standard practice in the music industry. Almost all female pop stars reinvent themselves at some point these days.

Madonna was a MASTER at it and she made it her thing. Rihanna is just a product of it. Madonna was at the helm of her reinventions. For the most part, they were reflections of some aspects of her personality. Rihanna's team is following a manuscript and we don't see a lot of the looks and styles that they impose on Rihanna in her personality. At first we did, with the Island girl-themes, but now its just "whatever it takes" to get attention. Madonna had a huge degree of control over her image. If something didn't fit - she would just say NO. I can't imagine Rihanna saying no to anything the label tells her. She is a puppet. Actually, she's more like a mannequin.

PFFT. Madonna is a legend. Nuff said.

BlaqueKnight said:

RKJCNE said:

Rihanna has mastered the are of reinvention like Madonna, but no way is her music on the same level.

Reinvention (partially thanks to Maddona and Janet) has become standard practice in the music industry. Almost all female pop stars reinvent themselves at some point these days.

Madonna was a MASTER at it and she made it her thing. Rihanna is just a product of it. Madonna was at the helm of her reinventions. For the most part, they were reflections of some aspects of her personality. Rihanna's team is following a manuscript and we don't see a lot of the looks and styles that they impose on Rihanna in her personality. At first we did, with the Island girl-themes, but now its just "whatever it takes" to get attention. Madonna had a huge degree of control over her image. If something didn't fit - she would just say NO. I can't imagine Rihanna saying no to anything the label tells her. She is a puppet. Actually, she's more like a mannequin.

Ok, I'm not quite sure why you are convinced she is a puppet, but I don't care to discuss that.

What I was saying is unlike Beyonce, Gaga or Britney, Rihanna actually goes through a reinvention for each album. Each of her album's come with a distinct new look for her that reminds me of Madonna's reinventions in the 80s.

RKJCNE said:

SeventeenDayze said:

Is it me or does this chick always have an evil look in her eyes---I dunno, there's something about this chick that seems less than angelic....I dunno, she just seems like a puppet and mindless...

Baphomet!

RKJCNE said:

Ok, I'm not quite sure why you are convinced she is a puppet, but I don't care to discuss that.

What I was saying is unlike Beyonce, Gaga or Britney, Rihanna actually goes through a reinvention for each album. Each of her album's come with a distinct new look for her that reminds me of Madonna's reinventions in the 80s.

Rihanna's reinventions are textbook. There is a lot of money invested in her. Its a matter of "If you want to be the black Madonna, do what Madonna did" rather than being a genuine entertainer. Madonna reinvented herself with every record because that is part of who she was. I see more of Madonna in Nicki Minaj's personality than I do in Rihanna. She is like a mannequin that Def Jam is dressing up rather than an entertainer who actually changes.

While you might let Rihanna's singing slide, you gotta know that a great deal of people find her voice sub-par. Its no big secret. She is very mediocre vocally. Her image is about 75% of her appeal. To be a pop star these days, you don't have to be exceptionally talented. What I was saying about her being a puppet is you don't see all of those reinventions in Rihanna. She doesn't come off as a person who is constantly changing - just a person who is constantly changing clothes that someone laid out for her.

BlaqueKnight said:

RKJCNE said:

Ok, I'm not quite sure why you are convinced she is a puppet, but I don't care to discuss that.

What I was saying is unlike Beyonce, Gaga or Britney, Rihanna actually goes through a reinvention for each album. Each of her album's come with a distinct new look for her that reminds me of Madonna's reinventions in the 80s.

Rihanna's reinventions are textbook. There is a lot of money invested in her. Its a matter of "If you want to be the black Madonna, do what Madonna did" rather than being a genuine entertainer. Madonna reinvented herself with every record because that is part of who she was. I see more of Madonna in Nicki Minaj's personality than I do in Rihanna. She is like a mannequin that Def Jam is dressing up rather than an entertainer who actually changes.

Beyonce doesn't have to reinvent herself every record because SHE CAN SING. Gaga also relys on her skills. She is left of center as far as image is concerned and she also has people in her camp who are helping her stay as "fringe" as possible. That is her thing, like Bjork.

While you might let Rihanna's singing slide, you gotta know that a great deal of people find her voice sub-par. Its no big secret. She is very mediocre vocally. Her image is about 75% of her appeal. To be a pop star these days, you don't have to be exceptionally talented. What I was saying about her being a puppet is you don't see all of those reinventions in Rihanna. She doesn't come off as a person who is constantly changing - just a person who is constantly changing clothes that someone laid out for her.

I will say this a million times. I don't think she is Aretha Franklin. I think she is Rihanna and her voice is good enough for the music she makes.

And I don't see it as corprate clothing at all, this interview with her creative director suggests that she has plenty of imput in her image.

And I'm aware plenty of appeal is in her looks, but I don't see her when I listen to her music on my morning jogs.

Interviews are usually fluff pieces. They have been for years. Most are scripted and standard. Nobody who is part of a machine is going to throw a wrench in it. Most artists have other people giving them credit because that is standard operation but when it comes to pop stars, these days very little is actually controlled by the artist. Those articles are made for people like you who believe that sort of thing. People who work in the industry; people behind the curtain know better. Its all part of the illusion. If it wasn't, nobody would make any money. Rest assured that Def Jam would NEVER leave their investments in the hands of a 20-something year old girl. REST ASSURED. They might lead her to THINK that she thought of it so she can sell it better but they are not gambling with millions over her ideas. They didn't blow her up because they thought she was smart.

Rihanna can't sing very well or dance but has some great videos and songs.

Sounds like the new Madonna to me.

BlaqueKnight said:

RKJCNE said:

Ok, I'm not quite sure why you are convinced she is a puppet, but I don't care to discuss that.

What I was saying is unlike Beyonce, Gaga or Britney, Rihanna actually goes through a reinvention for each album. Each of her album's come with a distinct new look for her that reminds me of Madonna's reinventions in the 80s.

Rihanna's reinventions are textbook. There is a lot of money invested in her. Its a matter of "If you want to be the black Madonna, do what Madonna did" rather than being a genuine entertainer. Madonna reinvented herself with every record because that is part of who she was. I see more of Madonna in Nicki Minaj's personality than I do in Rihanna. She is like a mannequin that Def Jam is dressing up rather than an entertainer who actually changes.

Beyonce doesn't have to reinvent herself every record because SHE CAN SING. Gaga also relys on her skills. She is left of center as far as image is concerned and she also has people in her camp who are helping her stay as "fringe" as possible. That is her thing, like Bjork.

While you might let Rihanna's singing slide, you gotta know that a great deal of people find her voice sub-par. Its no big secret. She is very mediocre vocally. Her image is about 75% of her appeal. To be a pop star these days, you don't have to be exceptionally talented. What I was saying about her being a puppet is you don't see all of those reinventions in Rihanna. She doesn't come off as a person who is constantly changing - just a person who is constantly changing clothes that someone laid out for her.

Ha! Are you kidding me? Madonna's career moves were and still are very calculated. You can't be a sex crazed bi-sexual one day and then change into a spiritual hippy who has found enlightenment for the next video.

BlaqueKnight said:

RKJCNE said:

Rihanna has mastered the are of reinvention like Madonna, but no way is her music on the same level.

Reinvention (partially thanks to Maddona and Janet) has become standard practice in the music industry. Almost all female pop stars reinvent themselves at some point these days.

Madonna was a MASTER at it and she made it her thing. Rihanna is just a product of it. Madonna was at the helm of her reinventions. For the most part, they were reflections of some aspects of her personality. Rihanna's team is following a manuscript and we don't see a lot of the looks and styles that they impose on Rihanna in her personality. At first we did, with the Island girl-themes, but now its just "whatever it takes" to get attention. Madonna had a huge degree of control over her image. If something didn't fit - she would just say NO. I can't imagine Rihanna saying no to anything the label tells her. She is a puppet. Actually, she's more like a mannequin.

You've hit the nail on the head, Madonna was the trendsetter, she took the risks, the flack and criticism and being called names etc that the female artists today don't have to because she took it for them. None of them really put themselves out there like Madonna did, which is why she's earned herself the label of icon.

mancabdriver said:

BlaqueKnight said:

Rihanna's reinventions are textbook. There is a lot of money invested in her. Its a matter of "If you want to be the black Madonna, do what Madonna did" rather than being a genuine entertainer. Madonna reinvented herself with every record because that is part of who she was. I see more of Madonna in Nicki Minaj's personality than I do in Rihanna. She is like a mannequin that Def Jam is dressing up rather than an entertainer who actually changes.

Beyonce doesn't have to reinvent herself every record because SHE CAN SING. Gaga also relys on her skills. She is left of center as far as image is concerned and she also has people in her camp who are helping her stay as "fringe" as possible. That is her thing, like Bjork.

While you might let Rihanna's singing slide, you gotta know that a great deal of people find her voice sub-par. Its no big secret. She is very mediocre vocally. Her image is about 75% of her appeal. To be a pop star these days, you don't have to be exceptionally talented. What I was saying about her being a puppet is you don't see all of those reinventions in Rihanna. She doesn't come off as a person who is constantly changing - just a person who is constantly changing clothes that someone laid out for her.

Ha! Are you kidding me? Madonna's career moves were and still are very calculated. You can't be a sex crazed bi-sexual one day and then change into a spiritual hippy who has found enlightenment for the next video.

Says who? From what I can see,Madonna has had no problems reinventing herself all these years.I'm not just talking about image,either.I'm talking about trying new sounds,growing and evolving (musically).

lezama said:

Madonna was the trendsetter, she took the risks, the flack and criticism and being called names etc that the female artists today don't have to because she took it for them. None of them really put themselves out there like Madonna did, which is why she's earned herself the label of icon.

The idea that someone can't be both sexual and spiritual is ludacris.

[Edited 10/23/11 16:23pm]

BlaqueKnight said:

Reinvention (partially thanks to Madonna and Janet) has become standard practice in the music industry. Almost all female pop stars reinvent themselves at some point these days.

Madonna was a MASTER at it and she made it her thing. Rihanna is just a product of it. Madonna was at the helm of her reinventions. For the most part, they were reflections of some aspects of her personality. Rihanna's team is following a manuscript and we don't see a lot of the looks and styles that they impose on Rihanna in her personality. At first we did, with the Island girl-themes, but now its just "whatever it takes" to get attention. Madonna had a huge degree of control over her image. If something didn't fit - she would just say NO. I can't imagine Rihanna saying no to anything the label tells her. She is a puppet. Actually, she's more like a mannequin.

CORRECTION: All thanks to THE original master of reinvention...........

[img:$uid]http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_NGgy4WmOLdk/Sc7s7k52_qI/AAAAAAAALAE/-PFc23XJSSE/s400/david_bowie_10.jpg[/img:$uid]

Mr. David Bowie

BlaqueKnight said:

RKJCNE said:

Ok, I'm not quite sure why you are convinced she is a puppet, but I don't care to discuss that.

What I was saying is unlike Beyonce, Gaga or Britney, Rihanna actually goes through a reinvention for each album. Each of her album's come with a distinct new look for her that reminds me of Madonna's reinventions in the 80s.

Rihanna's reinventions are textbook. There is a lot of money invested in her. Its a matter of "If you want to be the black Madonna, do what Madonna did" rather than being a genuine entertainer. Madonna reinvented herself with every record because that is part of who she was. I see more of Madonna in Nicki Minaj's personality than I do in Rihanna. She is like a mannequin that Def Jam is dressing up rather than an entertainer who actually changes.

Beyonce doesn't have to reinvent herself every record because SHE CAN SING. Gaga also relys on her skills. She is left of center as far as image is concerned and she also has people in her camp who are helping her stay as "fringe" as possible. That is her thing, like Bjork.

While you might let Rihanna's singing slide, you gotta know that a great deal of people find her voice sub-par. Its no big secret. She is very mediocre vocally. Her image is about 75% of her appeal. To be a pop star these days, you don't have to be exceptionally talented. What I was saying about her being a puppet is you don't see all of those reinventions in Rihanna. She doesn't come off as a person who is constantly changing - just a person who is constantly changing clothes that someone laid out for her.

VERY well said. Their IS no sense in going back and forth with pop tart stans ...

MOST pop stars NOWADAYS anyway have no control and just sell a product which primarily consists of looks. You dont have to belt like Whitney or even a Toni to get a record deal just as long as you SELL which is the number one motto of record companies.

RKJCNE said:

SeventeenDayze said:

Is it me or does this chick always have an evil look in her eyes---I dunno, there's something about this chick that seems less than angelic....I dunno, she just seems like a puppet and mindless...

Baphomet!

[img:$uid]http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/a/a4/Baphomet.png/220px-Baphomet.png[/img:$uid]

SoulAlive said:

mancabdriver said:

Ha! Are you kidding me? Madonna's career moves were and still are very calculated. You can't be a sex crazed bi-sexual one day and then change into a spiritual hippy who has found enlightenment for the next video.

Says who? From what I can see,Madonna has had no problems reinventing herself all these years.I'm not just talking about image,either.I'm talking about trying new sounds,growing and evolving (musically).

............and if we (especially Mancabdriver) want to get technical, Madonna is still very bisexual. All of this Kabbalah enlightenment has not change her sexuality by a long shot.

I think a lot of Rihanna tunes are catchy, but she is nothing special, and what she's done has been done a million times by others with way more talent. They are just trying to make us forget them by overexposing her everywhere.

I know she gets credit for the red hair and other hairstyles, but it's so weird how Madonna is getting credit, when people who were old enough to remember keeping saying people were copying Janet Jackson's hair, and I remember when Janet went red, people I know thought it was weird, but then for the next few years, everyone was going red.

alphastreet said:

I think a lot of Rihanna tunes are catchy, but she is nothing special, and what she's done has been done a million times by others with way more talent. They are just trying to make us forget them by overexposing her everywhere.

I know she gets credit for the red hair and other hairstyles, but it's so weird how Madonna is getting credit, when people who were old enough to remember keeping saying people were copying Janet Jackson's hair, and I remember when Janet went red, people I know thought it was weird, but then for the next few years, everyone was going red.

All TODAYS pop stars copy and do things that have been done already. Rihanna isnt the ONLY one and she is not in control of her image to know the difference. She isnt the first nor the last folks.

What kills me is that some of yall take them really seriously. LOL

The pop world of 00's is very different from how it use to be. We are not dealing with thought provoking all around talented artists who make authentic quality music . These discussions are very tired. So what the media gives them a title? It doesnt mean anything. Its just to sell and get fans mad like it is doing now..

I know it's not news and she's not the first I just think it's silly actual publications would write stuff like this, cause people will believe it. She would be the next Madonna if she was being Rihanna.

[Edited 10/23/11 20:37pm]

That makes...

Chris Brown this generations Ike Turner

Justin Bieber this generations Rick Astley

Miley Cyrus this generations Stacey Q

[Edited 10/23/11 22:34pm]

Agree with this, except I don't think Chris is kicking the bucket anytime soon...

Okay, Let's see......

Madonna - weak singer, catchy songs, slutty behavior, Sexy as hell [in the 80's ]

Rihanna - weak singer, catchy songs, slutty behavior, Sexy as hell

The verdict: I'd have sex with the both of them!

btw, stop with the "legend" talk & overanalyzation of everything....

Tittypants said:

Okay, Let's see......

Madonna - weak singer, catchy songs, slutty behavior, Sexy as hell [in the 80's ]

Rihanna - weak singer, catchy songs, slutty behavior, Sexy as hell

The verdict: I'd have sex with the both of them!

btw, stop with the "legend" talk & overanalyzation of everything....

But, my thing is, Madonna's singing, songs and slutty behavior is only part of the reason why she is considered an Icon. She was the Queen of the media for years. She controlled what was out there. She knew exactly what to do in order to garner attention from the media. She was also a a major force for female and gay empowerment. Who has Rhianna helped to empower?

kitbradley said:

Tittypants said:

Okay, Let's see......

Madonna - weak singer, catchy songs, slutty behavior, Sexy as hell [in the 80's ]

Rihanna - weak singer, catchy songs, slutty behavior, Sexy as hell

The verdict: I'd have sex with the both of them!

btw, stop with the "legend" talk & overanalyzation of everything....

But, my thing is, Madonna's singing, songs and slutty behavior is only part of the reason why she is considered an Icon. She was the Queen of the media for years. She controlled what was out there. She knew exactly what to do in order to garner attention from the media. She was also a a major force for female and gay empowerment. Who has Rhianna helped to empower?

Ha Kit, you got it all wrong, Rihanna has empowered many talentless hacks to think they can land a big career in the industry as long as they sell their soul to the devil/jay-z!

Dewrede said:

It's really hysterical to see you stans defending that talentless old hag

Rihanna sings better , that's for sure

Get lost!

Haahahahahahahahahaaahhahahahahaaa

I'll add Rihanna to the long list of "Next Madonnas" :-

Debbie Gibson

Belinda Carlisle

Kylie

Janet Jackson

Pink

Gwen Stefani

Britney

Christina

Beyonce

Lady Gaga

Kay Perry

Some came closer than others but none of them really had a shot at the title....next!!!

I just noticed their names rhyme, she must be the next Madonna

DaveT said:

Haahahahahahahahahaaahhahahahahaaa

I'll add Rihanna to the long list of "Next Madonnas" :-

Debbie Gibson

Belinda Carlisle

Kylie

Janet Jackson

Pink

Gwen Stefani

Britney

Christina

Beyonce

Lady Gaga

Kay Perry

Some came closer than others but none of them really had a shot at the title....next!!!

You did not just go there! *looks at avatar* never mind....

aardvark15 said:

DaveT said:

Haahahahahahahahahaaahhahahahahaaa

I'll add Rihanna to the long list of "Next Madonnas" :-

Debbie Gibson

Belinda Carlisle

Kylie

Janet Jackson

Pink

Gwen Stefani

Britney

Christina

Beyonce

Lady Gaga

Kay Perry

Some came closer than others but none of them really had a shot at the title....next!!!

You did not just go there! *looks at avatar* never mind....

Hahaha yeah I was suprised to see janet on this list.....hopefully everyone will ignore that, otherwise this thread will turn into those debates on if Elvis was really the King of Rock n Roll (even though we all know it's Little Richard!)