PennyPurple said:

206Michelle said:

disch said: 5’4 and 109...that is underweight! But I thought he was 5’2.

I thought the autopsy showed 5'2 and 112 pounds.?

Prince probably told the doctor that he was 5'4". They don't usually measure your height, but ask you how tall you are. As for the weight, scales are often off by a pound or 2, so 3 lbs difference is not a big deal.

tmo1965 said:

MMJas said:

Strawberrylova123, his pulse was perfect? I actually though that was increadibly high, but perhaps the measures are different in the States (as compared to Europe).

I'm in the US and I thought the pulse was high also. I've always been that an idle pulse is in the 70s.

you are correat tmo....it appears he was drinking a lot of those 5 hour energy drinks ...I was at the drugstore yesterday and read that one should never exceed 2 per day and hours apart ...they have a high dose of caffeine in them which would make ones heart race

ChocolateBox3121 said:

jtfolden said:

People seem to be ignoring the fact that the Fire Chief seems to indicate it was much WARMER in the elevator itself. Also, his stomach was full of Fentanyl... this spray nonsense is just that.

I always wondered was the elevator door opened or closed when Kirk(who was the first to find him) found him? if the door was closed did his body travel from a different floor before the elevator door opened up?

I'm sorry I've thought of EVERY single detail about this tragic scenerio.

Paisley Park is hotter than He**. Every time I've been in there, I remind myself to wear short sleeves!!! I'm VERY curious about the elevator stuff too. Like, did they have to open the doors to find him? Or were they for some reason left open. And was he coming down, or going up? ( I know, doesn't matter). I just have always wondered if he was upstairs, coming down...maybe trying to get/find help. We'll never know I guess.

HatrinaHaterwitz said:

Lovejunky said:

I caught that too...

Very strange...Difficult to accidentally send a Picture to some one UNLESS you are

deliberately sending a picture to some one and you acccidentally send it to the wrong number ?

So why was Kirk sending a picture of the stairs to ANYONE at that time...?

It feels creepy to me escpecially since the last time anyone heard frm Prince was 10.03

5 minutes after this picture was taken...

And where exactly is the staircase that is a picture of? Is it in PP?

Those stairs look like the ones towards the back of the NPG room. we sat right under them in a booth. They lead up to the 2nd floor.

disch said:

One thing I’ve learned through this is that what I thought I knew about prince — such as him being meticulous — was wrong, or at least complicated. He was meticulous about some things (music production), less so about others, the evidence shows. His public persona while carefully crafted didn’t tell the whole story. 1Sasha said:

For someone as meticulous as Prince was, I cannot see him living in a space as was shown in the visuals from the investigation. However, I think his decline started at least three or four years before his death. Definitely two - because the Rolling Stone reporter who interviewed him in 2014 said PP was showing signs of inattention. He either didn't care anymore, or his personal life was spiraling out of control. One other thing about Fentanyl: there was a New York Times article on drug use and the opioid crisis in America in which it was stated that users know the risk associated with Fentanyl, and they in a way want tainted pills for a bigger high. I don't think Prince used to get high - I still don't - but he was too smart not to know the risks of illegal drugs. JMO

yes, I've never thought of Prince as meticulous in every area of his life. he could be surprisingly cheap and slapdash about some things - eg some of his videos, or his art work. Even his music production - in terms of not worrying about distortion and happy accidents. Feels like it was all about being in the moment with him - and the pictures inside PP reflect that.

.

The other thing i've been thinking about a lot is how the huge volume of material from the investigation give a snapshot of a tiny moment in Prince's incredibly rich and varied life, and is quite misleading in terms of how narrow the focus is... how we're getting so much (too much) detail about one specific moment (day) in his 57 years... the state his house was in / his health / his associates and business arrangements... it was, obviously, at a real low point - and what a different picture would be painted if all this information had been gathered at some other point in the past (or, if only, the future).

.

I suppose what I'm saying is that it might feel like we're getting to know more about him and how he lived than we ever thought we would, but in fact - by giving us so much detail about April 2016, when we know next to nothing about his daily life up to that point - it's an entirely misleading representation

good points -- what was true about his life at the very end (and what the investigation focused on) wasn't necessarily reflective of his life as a whole.

Robbajobba said:

disch said:

One thing I’ve learned through this is that what I thought I knew about prince — such as him being meticulous — was wrong, or at least complicated. He was meticulous about some things (music production), less so about others, the evidence shows. His public persona while carefully crafted didn’t tell the whole story. 1Sasha said:

yes, I've never thought of Prince as meticulous in every area of his life. he could be surprisingly cheap and slapdash about some things - eg some of his videos, or his art work. Even his music production - in terms of not worrying about distortion and happy accidents. Feels like it was all about being in the moment with him - and the pictures inside PP reflect that.

.

The other thing i've been thinking about a lot is how the huge volume of material from the investigation give a snapshot of a tiny moment in Prince's incredibly rich and varied life, and is quite misleading in terms of how narrow the focus is... how we're getting so much (too much) detail about one specific moment (day) in his 57 years... the state his house was in / his health / his associates and business arrangements... it was, obviously, at a real low point - and what a different picture would be painted if all this information had been gathered at some other point in the past (or, if only, the future).

.

I suppose what I'm saying is that it might feel like we're getting to know more about him and how he lived than we ever thought we would, but in fact - by giving us so much detail about April 2016, when we know next to nothing about his daily life up to that point - it's an entirely misleading representation

LOVESYMBOLNUMBER2 said:

Prince HatrinaHaterwitz said:

And where exactly is the staircase that is a picture of? Is it in PP?

Those look like the stairs in the NPG music club in paisley. I am pretty sure they are, they look the same and the number of risers are the same in both photos before you get to the first landing where the stairs turn. I remember seeing a picture of prince standing on the stairs looking down over the space. I wonder where those stairs are located on the second level. I am still to stupid to post a picture, but if you google inside paisley park npg music club the picture come right up...who did Kirk accidentally send that photo too? The time of the photo and the fact that it is an inconspicuous way to enter the upstairs at paisley is ......a little omg

Yes, it is in the NPG music club. The stairs lead to a bedroom upstairs. Why would Kirk want to send a close up picture of just these stairs to someone (accidently to the Dr Schulenberg)? At to whom wanted he to send it?

[Edited 4/25/18 6:57am]

gerson said:

Rebeljuice said:

If you presume that Prince knew that he had fentanyl laced pills, then it would be safe to assume that he had gone as far as you can really go with opioid addiction. Fentanyl is the big beast in the opioid world. I'm sure there may be synthetic drugs that are stronger, but in terms of what is generally available on the street, fentanyl is the last stop. If you presume that Prince had been hooked on opioids for many years then it stands to reason that as his tolerances increased, he would gravitate to something stronger. Once you have gravitated to fentanyl, there isn't really anywhere else to gravitate to unless you start smoking patches and getting the needles out.


If Prince really was that deep into it, then a lot of things make sense.

1) someone that deep in is going to deny it uncategorically to anyone and everyone around them.

2) The fucked up thought processes and rewiring of their brain will probably mean they are also denying any problem to themselves.

3) The reason why he took that lethal pill instead of the prescribed ones he obtained from Kirk is because the Percocet just don't work anymore. It was the tough stuff or the withdrawal demons, nothing else helped.

4) The reason he asked KJ to get that prescription in the first place is Prince playing smoke and mirrors with KJ. By agreeing to KJ's percocet prescription he is saying to KJ that the problem isn't as bad as it really is. His intentions of using the "weak" Percocet were nill. His denial was still strong, even after agreeing to seek help.

5) Severe illness, vomiting, diarhea, loss of appetite, dehydration, weight loss - all signs of someone trying to get themselves off the drug without supervision.

6) Pills halved and quartered are signs of someone either trying a self weaning program OR someone slowly increasing their dosage in order to get the same relief as the last dose.

7) Blaming anything other than the problem itself for his illness (the narcan, bad food etc) is another sign of denial, not naivety.

8) No one really knows to what extent an addict is trapped. The addict will always lie about the severity. KJ and those around him (past and present) may well have known of an issue, but they would never have known how deep that issue ran. I believe KJ when he said he didn't realise the gravity of the situation. He thought he was getting some percocet to take the edge off. Little did he know that Percocet to a fentanyl user is like water to an alcoholic.

9) With tolerances so high he would not obtaining any kind of high from the drugs and would be taking them just to function normally. The drugs bring a feeling of balance and normalcy to life. Without them all hell breaks loose.

10) the strength of the drug does not translate to the "higher" the user. A hit of fentanyl to a seasoned addict would be like taking something much milder for someone with less tolerance. So appearing normal and functioning easily whilst under the influence does not translate to "well, he can't be on much because he appears so normal". Hence why no one suspected the gravity of the situation.

[Edited 4/25/18 2:43am]

This does make some sense, that KJ didn't really know the extent to it. But, do people buy Watson 853 knowingly laced with Fent?? Aren't they intending to buy Hydro/Vicodin? And did Prince know he was taking Fentanyl? If so, how does one end up with 67.8 MCG of Fent per liter of blood when a cancer patient with Fent patches has a blood level of 3 - 5 MCG per liter?

gerson said:

kmama07 said:

PeteSilas said:

laura could take it with the best of them, that's why i loved her and she didn't hold it against you, i'd flat insult her and she'd be cool. My first real response directly to laura was about 10 years ago when i was criticizing Prince over something, forget exactly what, but I said to her "laura, your amazing, i knew you'd pop up on me, Prince could piss right on my head and you'd defend him" "well, you shouldn't have been in the way of the piss".

"You shouldn't have been in the way of the piss"... That's hilarious [Edited 4/25/18 5:35am]

Sorta . With her, it was always someone else who was wrong, somebody else's fault. However, it is wrong of me to speak ill of the dead...

fortuneandserendipity said:

kmama07 said:

PeteSilas said: "You shouldn't have been in the way of the piss"... That's hilarious [Edited 4/25/18 5:35am]

Sorta . With her, it was always someone else who was wrong, somebody else's fault. However, it is wrong of me to speak ill of the dead...

Sorry to be off topic..but are we talking about the "Laura" that used to post on here a lot. Im just on here sportically and can't remember the user name I'm thinking of. Did something happen to her? I just remember a "Laura"- something ...that posted quite a bit

jtfolden said:

disch said:

i found the blood pressure info -- page 140 of the report:

"In reading the Doctors notes from the 04-20-16 appointment with Prince I observed, Dr. Schulenberg obtained Prince's vitals. Prince's blood pressure was 158/80. Prince's pulse was 93, temp was 98.5F, weight was 109 and his height was 5' 4" "

Which is not honestly evidence Prince had high BP. He could have been, and certainly was, very stressed at that point in time. He also seemed to shy away from doctors for anything beyond B12 shots, too, so he could have had "white coat syndrome". I have it... my BP is a LOT higher at the beginning of a doctor's visit than it is if they check it at the end.

Correct. I think of the systolic measure (higher number) as the psychosomatic reading. And the diastolic measure as the true indicator of heart health. Trust me. I'm a doctor. Prince's diastolic number was fine.

Strawberrylova123 said:

Can we all squash that prince had an illness because the doctor said nothing significant was found in his blood besides slight anemia

Check. Mumio (), laurarichardson, precioux...

fortuneandserendipity said:

Strawberrylova123 said:

Can we all squash that prince had an illness because the doctor said nothing significant was found in his blood besides slight anemia

Check. Mumio (), laurarichardson, precioux...

disch said:

good points -- what was true about his life at the very end (and what the investigation focused on) wasn't necessarily reflective of his life as a whole.

Robbajobba said:

yes, I've never thought of Prince as meticulous in every area of his life. he could be surprisingly cheap and slapdash about some things - eg some of his videos, or his art work. Even his music production - in terms of not worrying about distortion and happy accidents. Feels like it was all about being in the moment with him - and the pictures inside PP reflect that.

.

The other thing i've been thinking about a lot is how the huge volume of material from the investigation give a snapshot of a tiny moment in Prince's incredibly rich and varied life, and is quite misleading in terms of how narrow the focus is... how we're getting so much (too much) detail about one specific moment (day) in his 57 years... the state his house was in / his health / his associates and business arrangements... it was, obviously, at a real low point - and what a different picture would be painted if all this information had been gathered at some other point in the past (or, if only, the future).

.

I suppose what I'm saying is that it might feel like we're getting to know more about him and how he lived than we ever thought we would, but in fact - by giving us so much detail about April 2016, when we know next to nothing about his daily life up to that point - it's an entirely misleading representation

and Thank God it wasn't. I mean there is a thin line between an Asshole Control Freak,
and a somewhat diligent worker, dig if you will this euphemism for Prince.
We know Prince may have been the former from time to time,
but he sure was being the latter most of the time. And humbled by his task.

For the rest, let's all give him a break,
as we do with ourselves.

jtfolden said:

XxAxX said:

i might have missed it but i do not see any evidence at all that the pill bottles were fingerprinted. it looks like the investigators just asumed that the pills all belonged to Prince. even if Prince was known to use pills, that part of the investigation feels a little sloppy to me.

It only feels sloppy because you missed the data about it. They didn't just fingerprint items; They performed FULL DNA testing not only on the pill bottles but even went into the trash to dna test the USED enema bottles in case he was using drugs that way.

i get that and i apologize if i missed the point where prints were taken. my point is i am wondering who else touched the bottles?

DNA works well only if you have an individual's profile on file.

fingerprints would have worked better if counterfeit, illegal pills were suspected - the dealer's prints would have been on file with the police possibly and a match might have been made. again if i simply missed this my apologies for time wasting.

[Edited 4/25/18 8:29am]

80tomato said:

Oh, and he pointed the abuse of the entertainment industry contracts.
A good decade before Radiohead even think about it.

Single-handedly — Aye aye, SKipper.


Not bad for a "sloppy organized" eighties vault filler and
who knows how many pristine-digital-live-shows-from-the-soundboard
(probably two decades full of them) maker.

I still read this "addicted for decades" bullshit,
I don't buy any of it, especially when "Pizza, hamburgers, hot dogs" were never on Prince's menu.
The story of a man he was not, for decades.
His bolognese was tomato only.

When the pain came...
He took just enough not to get high.
He controlled it but he was high on air and did not feed himself.

His carefully concocted cocktail was shooting up his liver,
where a simple call to Denise would have warned him, and maybe it did.
Still, this shit cuts your body's appetite.

Prince was in control. He got fucked by counterfeited Vicodin.

Prince was in control. Only this can explain Atlanta and all the performances up to, well, Atlanta.
A man not in control would show up in the recording. It does oh so not.

Prince passes back from Atlanta.
Moline makes it public. SKipper is self-medicating and has accidents from it.

Prince is self-medicating and got a hold of the Dark Web pretty well.
Delivered at your front door with discrecy.

Prince stops a tour, pretty unusual. Prince goes to the doctor.
Pretty unusual too.

Prince tweets: "fuck, just when I thought I was safe I got withdrawal panick",
and "pray for me in a few days when they try to make me go to rehab, I heard it's the shits".

Prince just takes his regular go-to-sleep dose.
But there's this fucking bitcoin-paid counterfeited pill in his hand.

[Edited 4/25/18 8:43am]

Did anyone listen to the audio files for the interviews? I just listened to Debra Johnson's. OMG.

MMJas said:

Did anyone listen to the audio files for the interviews? I just listened to Debra Johnson's. OMG.

What about it?

MiPans said:

ISaidLifeIsJustAGame said:

Leave what pills?

I only skimmed, but I recall Kirk indicating that he cleaned out PP so Prn would be okay that night. It sounded like Kirk thought he had done the necessary thing to keep P safe. However, perhaps he really did not know the true extent of what P was holding. That is another horrible aspect - what if Kirk had left all the meds with Prince. Perhaps he would not have felt the need to reach for something else .... I was just skimming, so I may be messed up on this interpretation.

I'm highly suspecious of Kirk. I don't believe that he had just realized that Prince had a problem in Moline. I don't fully believe anything he's saying. It's about taking the blame from himself.

bonatoc said:

Oh, and he pointed the abuse of the entertainment industry contracts.
A good decade before Radiohead even think about it.

Single-handedly — Aye aye, SKipper.


Not bad for a "sloppy organized" eighties vault filler and
who knows how many pristine-digital-live-shows-from-the-soundboard
(probably two decades full of them) maker.

I still read this "addicted for decades" bullshit,
I don't buy any of it, especially when "Pizza, hamburgers, hot dogs" were never on Prince's menu.
The story of a man he was not, for decades.
His bolognese was tomato only.

When the pain came...
He took just enough not to get high.
He controlled it but he was high on air and did not feed himself.

His carefully concocted cocktail was shooting up his liver,
where a simple call to Denise would have warned him, and maybe it did.
Still, this shit cuts your body's appetite.

Prince was in control. He got fucked by counterfeited Vicodin.

Prince was in control. Only this can explain Atlanta and all the performances up to, well, Atlanta.
A man not in control would show up in the recording. It does oh so not.

Prince passes back from Atlanta.
Moline makes it public. SKipper is self-medicating and has accidents from it.
Prince stops a tour, pretty unusual. Prince goes to the doctor.
Pretty unusual too.

Prince tweets: "fuck, I thought I was safe and I hot withdrawal panick",
and "pray for when I'm getting in rehab, I heard it's the shits".

Prince just takes his regular go-to-sleep dose.
But there's the fucking counterfeited pill in his hand.

[Edited 4/25/18 8:35am]

Yep, this. Did not know they were counterfeit pills. Took from this same batch in Atlanta and would have died without the medical help. Thought he was taking the hydrocodone. Did not know he was taking Fent.........I don't think when buying pills on the street one asks if they can get those extremely dangerous ones with different strengths of Fent laced into them.

Prince's people get Kornfeld involved after the Atlanta incident (nobody knowing about the Fentanyl, including Prince).......but enough is enough and seeking help for him.

[Edited 4/25/18 9:01am]

fortuneandserendipity said:

Strawberrylova123 said:

Can we all squash that prince had an illness because the doctor said nothing significant was found in his blood besides slight anemia

Check. Mumio (), laurarichardson, precioux...

it's best you keep my name out of your mouth, "Doc"...especially when everyone here knows that was not what my thought on the situation was. LR is no longer here to ask, and if I'm not mistaken, Muimo has handed your ass to you before. So step away from the keyboard before sarcastically inserting usernames in your post.

P.S.- congratulations on learning how to spell my username the way I set it up....literacy suits you when the repercussion for maliciously/deliberately editing my username in a former post got you banned.

tmo1965 said:

MiPans said:

I only skimmed, but I recall Kirk indicating that he cleaned out PP so Prn would be okay that night. It sounded like Kirk thought he had done the necessary thing to keep P safe. However, perhaps he really did not know the true extent of what P was holding. That is another horrible aspect - what if Kirk had left all the meds with Prince. Perhaps he would not have felt the need to reach for something else .... I was just skimming, so I may be messed up on this interpretation.

I'm highly suspecious of Kirk. I don't believe that he had just realized that Prince had a problem in Moline. I don't fully believe anything he's saying. It's about taking the blame from himself.

My guess is KJ has bought Vicodin on the street for awhile now. It's just the latest batch were the counterfeit pills with Fent and what Prince took in Atlanta and on April 21. No blood test in Moline so nobody knows about the Fent.

Strawberrylova123 said:

80tomato said:

you are correat tmo....it appears he was drinking a lot of those 5 hour energy drinks ...I was at the drugstore yesterday and read that one should never exceed 2 per day and hours apart ...they have a high dose of caffeine in them which would make ones heart race

Or he was very nervous, i think prince had a phobia towards doctors

thank you

LOVESYMBOLNUMBER2 said:

Prince HatrinaHaterwitz said:

And where exactly is the staircase that is a picture of? Is it in PP?

Those look like the stairs in the NPG music club in paisley. I am pretty sure they are, they look the same and the number of risers are the same in both photos before you get to the first landing where the stairs turn. I remember seeing a picture of prince standing on the stairs looking down over the space. I wonder where those stairs are located on the second level. I am still to stupid to post a picture, but if you google inside paisley park npg music club the picture come right up...who did Kirk accidentally send that photo too? The time of the photo and the fact that it is an inconspicuous way to enter the upstairs at paisley is ......a little omg

He "accidentally" sent the photo to Dr. Schulenberg. It was sent the eve of 4/20.

KiowaTrl said:

tmo1965 said:

I'm highly suspecious of Kirk. I don't believe that he had just realized that Prince had a problem in Moline. I don't fully believe anything he's saying. It's about taking the blame from himself.

My guess is KJ has bought Vicodin on the street for awhile now. It's just the latest batch were the counterfeit pills with Fent and what Prince took in Atlanta and on April 21. No blood test in Moline so nobody knows about the Fent.

I have a feeling with being a trainer at Lifetime, he probably had access to get allll sorts of things. I'm sure he knew one or two people to go to for street stuff

MMJas said:

Did anyone listen to the audio files for the interviews? I just listened to Debra Johnson's. OMG.

Yeah, they're amazing. Was listening to LG's and then Mariah Brown's. Man, she is not a fan of Phaedra's. Not sure what she was driving at, saying that Phaedra was really pushing P back towards WB...

Robbajobba said:

MMJas said:

Did anyone listen to the audio files for the interviews? I just listened to Debra Johnson's. OMG.

Yeah, they're amazing. Was listening to LG's and then Mariah Brown's. Man, she is not a fan of Phaedra's. Not sure what she was driving at, saying that Phaedra was really pushing P back towards WB...

Are you going through the primary site or alternative site? I'm still having difficulty downloading.