The Estate Discussion - Part 6

PurpleDiamonds1 said:

ISaidLifeIsJustAGame said:

laurarichardson said:

jtfolden said:

Actually, Tidal has produced no clear proof of the alleged deal. The only thing settled currently is that Tidal was denied withholding documents from the non-excluded heirs. If they had something legit, they really wouldn't have been so against the family seeing what they do have, imo.

--Tidal is saying that have an equity term agreement with Prince Rogers Nelson and they claim they made four payments to Prince Rogers Nelson with the last two being in April and May of 2016. The time for filing claims has passed but the court let their stand. I am just going to take wild guess that Tidal furnished the equity term agreement and a proof of monies paid. You cannot have a contract without a mutual exchange. Now I would be very surprised if they have anything in writing saying that they can stop the music from going to other platforms but the estate may have to provide those two CDs and refund the payments.

The court documents said the Equity Term Agreement was NOT signed.

lol

Well there ya go...
Tidal has no real deal

Seems they are acting like bullies

---Are any of you reading about the letter of intent and the money they say they sent. eek

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Reply #931 posted 02/11/17 11:15am

PennyPurple

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laurarichardson said:
PurpleDiamonds1 said:
Well there ya go... Tidal has no real Seems they are acting like bullies
---Are any of you reading about the letter of intent and the money they say they sent.

Where did those payments go in April and May? And howcome the Estate doesn't know about them?

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Reply #932 posted 02/11/17 12:03pm

PurpleDiamonds
1

PennyPurple said:

laurarichardson said:

PurpleDiamonds1 said:
Well there ya go... Tidal has no real Seems they are acting like bullies

---Are any of you reading about the letter of intent and the money they say they sent.

Where did those payments go in April and May? And howcome the Estate doesn't know about them?

Who's signature is on the letter of intent?
Anyway it is possible P was not wanting any part of a contract with Tidal. After all he did tell his fans to go to the record store to purchase his last CD Hit and Run II.

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Reply #933 posted 02/11/17 12:06pm

laurarichardson said:

rogifan said:

But Funk hasn't ripped this deal, in fact on his latest podcast he seemed pretty positive about it. Who knows why Prince made some of the decisions he made. He was definitely an in the moment guy. Maybe at that time he was fed up with Universal for whatever reason. Doesn't mean he would never do a deal with them again. Every time I go out to YouTube more Prince stuff has been removed. I can understand removing studio work or full length live shows but a lot of what they're removing is ridiculous. And since none of this live stuff is available for purchase it's not like the estate is being deprived of $$ because a 10 minute clip of Montreux is on YouTube. All it's doing is making it harder for people who aren't die hard fans to experience what a great live performer he was.

Sometimes I swear the things being done are like cutting off your nose to spite your face. And as I've said before the whole what would Prince do crowd is forgetting the most important thing: he's no longer here! The reason Prince could be totally independent when he was alive was because of live performances. It wasn't studio albums that were paying the bills. He can't call people up and say let's go on the road. He can't perform at a Russian billionaire's New Year's Eve party or a corporate sponsored event at SXSW for millions. He can't do 21 nights in London or residencies in Vegas or LA. I would love to know what all these people would do to pay the taxes and keep Paisley Park in the hands of the estate. Album sales on Tidal isn't going to do it.

-/We know one reason he got rid of Universal they caused a lawsuit with YouTube baby case. I am sure his ex manager knows more than we do. I still see stuff up from April and I know that it is Universal's job to get this stuff down. Prince felt he had to hire Web Sheriff to do instead tells you a little something about what he may have been unhappy about. Universal has to get this stuff off of YouTube if they want to make money out of this deal. People don't buy when they can look and hear for free. I would love to buy some of this material not rent or just look. I want to own.

The majority of stuff on YouTube is LIVE performances that you can't buy anywhere! The estate is not losing money because 2 minutes of Dreamer from a show in Belgium in 2011 is posted on YouTube. rolleyes

Paisley Park is in your heart
#PrinceForever 💜

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Reply #934 posted 02/11/17 12:09pm

ISaidLifeIsJustAGame said:

laurarichardson said:

ISaidLifeIsJustAGame said:

The court documents said the Equity Term Agreement was NOT signed.

Looks like that is what Comerica bank is saying. Tidal is saying they have a signed letter of intent along with the equity term sheet. They are also asking and it appears to have been granted that the document be sealed and all parties sign a non-disclosure agreement before viewing. Is the court allowing a claim and sealing of docs for a document that is not signed? What about money? If Tidal shows they paid money to Prince they are showing an exchange. I find it hard to believe that Tidal is filing these claims and documents with no proof. At this point document or no document I doubt Tidal will get an injunction but I do not believe the parent company would take this so far along if they had nothing.

Dont matter.

Tidal is out of luck.

blunt

Does anyone really think UMG, Koppelman and McMillan are so stupid that they'd enter into a major agreement with press release and all if Tidal had something in place that could stop it from happening.

Paisley Park is in your heart
#PrinceForever 💜

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Reply #935 posted 02/11/17 12:27pm

PurpleDiamonds
1

rogifan said:

laurarichardson said:

Agree. I understood his reasoning at times with youtube cuz he wanted us to go see him live not just watch videos.
Now that Prince is no longer here how else are people going to get to see him and youtube let's his great live shows live on for new people to discover how talented he was.

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Reply #936 posted 02/11/17 1:03pm

ISaidLifeIsJus
tAGame

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Roc Nation's basis for filing for a Restraining Order (Injunction) against the Estate is

based on the "Artist Equity Term Sheet."

The Estate stated the Term Sheet was not signed by P, and was not performed by

either party and was superseded by the August 1, 2015 Letter of Intent which was

terminated by Bremer.

The Estate argues that even assuming the Term Sheet was valid (which they do not concede)

it did not prevent P from entering into contracts with other streaming services.

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Reply #937 posted 02/11/17 1:11pm

rogifan said:

ISaidLifeIsJustAGame said:

laurarichardson said:

ISaidLifeIsJustAGame said:

The court documents said the Equity Term Agreement was NOT signed.

Looks like that is what Comerica bank is saying. Tidal is saying they have a signed letter of intent along with the equity term sheet. They are also asking and it appears to have been granted that the document be sealed and all parties sign a non-disclosure agreement before viewing. Is the court allowing a claim and sealing of docs for a document that is not signed? What about money? If Tidal shows they paid money to Prince they are showing an exchange. I find it hard to believe that Tidal is filing these claims and documents with no proof. At this point document or no document I doubt Tidal will get an injunction but I do not believe the parent company would take this so far along if they had nothing.

Dont matter.

Tidal is out of luck.

blunt

Do you think Tidal is so stupid to put a claim against a estate have the claim validated without proof of payment.
[Edited 2/11/17 13:11pm]

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Reply #938 posted 02/11/17 1:15pm

PurpleDiamonds1 said:

rogifan said:

-The Univesal will be putting this stuff out to purchase so it will have to come down. It is interesting that they are taking down stuff when they have a full vested interest and did not do so when they were the admin. People are going to have discover it by buying it. Just like you pay money to see Star Wars movies because the Disney peopje don't give out free passes to a movie franchise that they paid 4 million.

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Reply #939 posted 02/11/17 1:24pm

ISaidLifeIsJustAGame said:

Roc Nation's basis for filing for a Restraining Order (Injunction) against the Estate is

based on the "Artist Equity Term Sheet."

The Estate stated the Term Sheet was not signed by P, and was not performed by

either party and was superseded by the August 1, 2015 Letter of Intent which was

terminated by Bremer.

The Estate argues that even assuming the Term Sheet was valid (which they do not concede)

it did not prevent P from entering into contracts with other streaming services.

We know that whatever he signed and I belived he signed that letter of intent did not include exclusively because Hit and Run is on Apple. I do not think Tidal cannot stop the music from going on other sites. I am confused as to how Tidal was allowed to go forward with their claim concerning the money they paid Prince and the two albums they were promised. I also noticed that Prince's music s still on Tidal. Tidal takes things off and puts stuff back but the bulk of the catalogue is still up in the site. How is that possible if copyright infringement is occuring. You can get material yanked off YouTube with a takedown notice immediatly.

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Reply #940 posted 02/11/17 1:27pm

jtfolden

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laurarichardson said:

--Tidal is saying that have an equity term agreement with Prince Rogers Nelson and they claim they made four payments to Prince Rogers Nelson with the last two being in April and May of 2016. The time for filing claims has passed but the court let their stand. I am just going to take wild guess that Tidal furnished the equity term agreement and a proof of monies paid. You cannot have a contract without a mutual exchange. Now I would be very surprised if they have anything in writing saying that they can stop the music from going to other platforms but the estate may have to provide those two CDs and refund the payments.

From what I understand, the Artist Equity Term sheet was not signed and therefore not legal. Additionally, I believe it's been stated in court that later documentation between Tidal and Prince/NPG contradicts the proposed term sheet.

The only part of the business dealings that both Tidal and estate reps seem to agree on is that Tidal had legitimate short term exclusive rights to two new releases (the HnR albums). Anything beyond that, which Tidal can provide ZERO legal proof of, is truly at issue here. If anything, Tidal will owe more for streaming/continued streaming of Prince's entire catalog. No one owes Tidal anything at this point.

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Reply #941 posted 02/11/17 1:28pm

ISaidLifeIsJus
tAGame

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Its fascinating that Roc Nation didnt give the Estate a copy of the

Equity Term Sheet until January 3, 2017.

eek eek

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Reply #942 posted 02/11/17 1:29pm

jtfolden

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ISaidLifeIsJustAGame said:

Its fascinating that Roc Nation didnt give the Estate a copy of the

Equity Term Sheet until January 3, 2017.

They didn't even want the family seeing it... because it's not signed and has no legal standing. lol

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Reply #943 posted 02/11/17 1:36pm

ISaidLifeIsJus
tAGame

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The Judge said after further "Discovery" is completed between Roc Nation and the Estate

the Court will determine whether the Estate is indebted to Roc Nation for some or all repayment of

album advancements.

After re-reading some of these voluminous filings, it may be P signed the Equity Term Sheet

as P personally and not on behalf of NPG Records, and NPG Music Publishing.

This is hurting my head.

err

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Reply #944 posted 02/11/17 1:41pm

laurarichardson said:

PurpleDiamonds1 said:

It's going to be a long time before we see releases of live concerts, and even when we do it's not going to be all of them. Again, a minute video of Prince and Sheila E. messing around on percussion from a Welcome 2 show isn't hurting the estate financially. Perhaps that's why some of the stuff is still on YouTube.

Paisley Park is in your heart
#PrinceForever 💜

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Reply #945 posted 02/11/17 1:43pm

jtfolden said:

laurarichardson said:

--Tidal is saying that have an equity term agreement with Prince Rogers Nelson and they claim they made four payments to Prince Rogers Nelson with the last two being in April and May of 2016. The time for filing claims has passed but the court let their stand. I am just going to take wild guess that Tidal furnished the equity term agreement and a proof of monies paid. You cannot have a contract without a mutual exchange. Now I would be very surprised if they have anything in writing saying that they can stop the music from going to other platforms but the estate may have to provide those two CDs and refund the payments.

How did Hit N Run Phase 2 end up on Apple Music srteaming service? Prince must have approved that, yes?

Paisley Park is in your heart
#PrinceForever 💜

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Reply #946 posted 02/11/17 4:50pm

PurpleDiamonds 1	jtfolden said: ISaidLifeIsJustAGame said: Its fascinating that Roc Nation didnt give the Estate a copy of the Equity Term Sheet until January 3, 2017. They didn't even want the family seeing it... because it's not signed and has no legal standing. Was Phaedra involved with this too??
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Reply #947 posted 02/12/17 6:12am

OK this article is interesting...gives the impression that Van, not Londell saw urgency in getting Prince's music in front of a younger audience. And that Londell would have been more active in removing unauthorized Prince music from the internet. Since there's only quotes from Londell it could just be spin on his part.

http://www.theaustralian....ee00d7265d

“Prince did not rush to put all of his music on streaming — why should we?” said Mr McMillan, in an interview, having helped negotiate the latest licensing deals on the estate’s behalf as one of the two court-appointed advisers to the estate’s interim administrator, Bremer Trust. He no longer has that title with Bremer’s replacement, Comerica Bank & Trust, which took over in January.

Mr McMillan added that if he had been in control from the get-go, he would have more aggressively policed the videos of Prince’s music that popped up without the estate’s permission after his death, enlisting help from fans, even though “it would have cost a lot.”

“I’m here to make sure the legacy of Prince does not go afoul from how he lived his life,” he said. Prince hadn’t wanted to license his music to most streaming services — save Jay Z’s Tidal — during his life, Mr McMillan and others close to him said.

Mr Jones, on the other hand, has seen more urgency in introducing Prince’s music to new fans to keep his legacy alive, especially as the anniversary of his death approaches, people familiar with the matter said. He could also parlay his own current fame as a pundit and documentarian into opportunities for the estate, these people added.

Paisley Park is in your heart
#PrinceForever 💜

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Reply #948 posted 02/12/17 6:45am

rogifan said:

//More bull from Londell. Prince hired Websheriff to pull his music off if Youtube. He was very aggressive about without any of Londell's guidance. Notice how web sheriff could have continued to be paid up until Universal came in the admin but that did not happen. It is possible that Prince may have been planning to set up his own channel maybe on YouTube Red so people would actually have to pay.

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Reply #949 posted 02/12/17 6:47am

rogifan said:

laurarichardson said:

There is no reason for it to take a long time. The deal is place for Universal to admin vault material.

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Reply #950 posted 02/12/17 7:57am

ISaidLifeIsJustAGame said:

The Judge said after further "Discovery" is completed between Roc Nation and the Estate

the Court will determine whether the Estate is indebted to Roc Nation for some or all repayment of

album advancements.

After re-reading some of these voluminous filings, it may be P signed the Equity Term Sheet

as P personally and not on behalf of NPG Records, and NPG Music Publishing.

This is hurting my head.

err

-/The documents are hard to pick thought but yes from reading the docs Prince singed a deal with Tidal and received four payments the last being in November of 2016. Tidal is saying the money was an advance with a portion being able to be recouped through royalties or within 3 years whichever came first. Also there was a promise of two more albums from Prince. Tidal wants the two albums and their money back if the music gets pulled off. I do not see how the court would have let Tidal claim stand if they did not have anything in writing or a proof payment to Prince.

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Reply #951 posted 02/12/17 8:02am

rogifan said:

jtfolden said:

laurarichardson said:

--Tidal is saying that have an equity term agreement with Prince Rogers Nelson and they claim they made four payments to Prince Rogers Nelson with the last two being in April and May of 2016. The time for filing claims has passed but the court let their stand. I am just going to take wild guess that Tidal furnished the equity term agreement and a proof of monies paid. You cannot have a contract without a mutual exchange. Now I would be very surprised if they have anything in writing saying that they can stop the music from going to other platforms but the estate may have to provide those two CDs and refund the payments.

How did Hit N Run Phase 2 end up on Apple Music srteaming service? Prince must have approved that, yes?

We already know that was know exclusivity because of HnR2 being on Apple and being sold peer to peer and at other retail outlets. Tidal as no chance of keeping the music off of other platforms.

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Reply #952 posted 02/12/17 8:21am

laurarichardson said:

rogifan said:

There is no reason for it to take a long time. The deal is place for Universal to admin vault material.

Well Prince didn't release much live stuff when he was alive so how much of a priority will it be?
[Edited 2/12/17 8:21am]

Paisley Park is in your heart
#PrinceForever 💜

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Reply #953 posted 02/12/17 8:26am

laurarichardson said:

rogifan said:

How did Hit N Run Phase 2 end up on Apple Music srteaming service? Prince must have approved that, yes?

We already know that was know exclusivity because of HnR2 being on Apple and being sold peer to peer and at other retail outlets. Tidal as no chance of keeping the music off of other platforms.

Bottom line is it's on a streaming service right now. I just hope Universal gets his 95-13 work out there asap. If his music is going to be on streaming services it should all be there.

Paisley Park is in your heart
#PrinceForever 💜

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Reply #954 posted 02/12/17 8:27am

rogifan said:

laurarichardson said:

There is no reason for it to take a long time. The deal is place for Universal to admin vault material.

Well Prince didn't release much live stuff when he was alive so how much of a priority will it be?
[Edited 2/12/17 8:21am]

He put some live stuff on Tidal. You realize it takes time to comb through it so I have thought rather then spend time on stuff that was I the past he just put his time into current projects. Universal has the time and money to put into this project.

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Reply #955 posted 02/12/17 8:30am

1Sasha	I don't if kids today would want to watch videos of a deceased pop star. Listen to the music? Maybe. Who is buying music from The Beatles and Michael Jackson? I think that would be Prince's audience as well, in terms of age. IMO the songs have to get out into commercials, films, television in order to be heard by the younger crowd.
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Reply #956 posted 02/12/17 8:36am

PennyPurple said:

laurarichardson said:

PurpleDiamonds1 said:
Well there ya go... Tidal has no real Seems they are acting like bullies

---Are any of you reading about the letter of intent and the money they say they sent.

Where did those payments go in April and May? And howcome the Estate doesn't know about them?

--I think Prince had accounts the Estate knows nothing about. Just the fact that Tidal wants parties to this case to sign NDAs and has concerns about the IRS makes me wonder was Tidal and Prince doing something off the books?

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Reply #957 posted 02/12/17 8:38am

1Sasha said:

I don't if kids today would want to watch videos of a deceased pop star. Listen to the music? Maybe. Who is buying music from The Beatles and Michael Jackson? I think that would be Prince's audience as well, in terms of age. IMO the songs have to get out into commercials, films, television in order to be heard by the younger crowd.

--I don't think the market for vault material is young people. They hardly buy any music and streaming is not buying. I think the peer to peer option might be the way to go with the vault material.

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Reply #958 posted 02/12/17 9:51am

laurarichardson said:

1Sasha said:

--I don't think the market for vault material is young people. They hardly buy any music and streaming is not buying. I think the peer to peer option might be the way to go with the vault material.

How much money could they possibly make off that? Only a fraction of die hard fans would get involved with Peer 2 Peer. Most people probably don't even know what the hell it is.

Paisley Park is in your heart
#PrinceForever 💜

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