ernestsewell said:

Serena said:

Bart's opinion does not equal truth.

But facts are facts. You call up WB and say "I want to use Prince's 'When Doves Cry' and Motley Crue's 'Dr. Feelgood' in a TV show - how much?" And when they quote you a ridiculously high price for Prince, and the average price for the Crue song, remember this moment.

But, the only "fact" is that Prince charges more for his publishing. Yours and Bart "opinions" that Prince misses every commercial opportunity and, in fact, earns $0 because nobody will pay his prices are not "facts" at all.

Another "fact" is that the Beatles charge more for their publishing than most. So do Pink Floyd. So do many other legendary artists - so what? What is odd is that anyone other than the artists that own the music would give a damn about how much is earned out of any piece of music!

Now, who's the loon?!

Mindflux said:

But, the only "fact" is that Prince charges more for his publishing. Yours and Bart "opinions" that Prince misses every commercial opportunity and, in fact, earns $0 because nobody will pay his prices are not "facts" at all.

Another "fact" is that the Beatles charge more for their publishing than most. So do Pink Floyd. So do many other legendary artists - so what? What is odd is that anyone other than the artists that own the music would give a damn about how much is earned out of any piece of music!

Now, who's the loon?!

Yes, and how often do you hear Pink Floyd songs in a Keebler or Clorox commercial? Doesn't mean you won't hear them, you'll just hear them a lot less.

The FACT is that people aren't going to pay an exorbitant amount of money for a :30 commerical. Pay the going rate, sure, but to pay something 2 or 3 or 4 times the going rate (industry standard) isn't logical, or desired. As I FACTLY stated before, you can price yourself right out of the market - while at the same time bitching because you're ignored.

When Janet used part of "I Can't Get No Satisfaction" for "What'll I Do", she paid a LOT for that. The Stones weren't fucking around, and put a huge price tag on their music, and that song. However, she was willing to do that for the song. But for a commercial - not so much. Sure companies spend a lot on advertising, but there's a limit. And if Prince is charing a gaggle of dollars for a slice of his song, most people are rightly going to say "Fuck him, we'll find another". The Stones have flat out said "NO" to damn near all of their music being used for anything, sans a few expections. Prince could do that, instead of putting a self-absorbed price on his music.

I also never said he misses "every commercial opportunity". Perhaps you're reading someone else's post, not mine. What I said was, "He's missed every opportunity to have his music played wherever by whoever." I didn't say commercial. He prices his shit too high for anyone to touch it. Prince's catalog is vast, and varied, and great, but it's not golden and untouchable. Music is here to be enjoyed by all, whether it's a cover song, or used in a movie. Uh, PS: If people aren't paying for his outrageous pricing on a song, then yeah, he's getting NOTHING because people ARE NOT BUYING IT, and paying the fee.

Prince has bought a bit too much into his own celebrity, esp at age 52. Prince could take care of his music, and use it to make himself some money, and I'm not talking commercials. But he doesn't. He ignores anything from his past, doesn't take care of it, and has yet to really put effort into doing something with his WB catalog. If he doesn't care about it, why should anyone else? He can price himself to the moon - no one making a commercial is really going to give a shit about it anyway.

I for one wish Prince songs were used in all commercials. Boy that'd be great. And for the opening of all TV dramas. Yup Bart that's whay the fans and Prince desperately want. To turn him music into advertising. Oh wait.

Maybe that wouldn't be such a great idea. Maybe that'd be a lame idea and Prince doesn't want that.

sro100 said:

I for one wish Prince songs were used in all commercials. Boy that'd be great. And for the opening of all TV dramas. Yup Bart that's whay the fans and Prince desperately want. To turn him music into advertising. Oh wait.

Maybe that wouldn't be such a great idea. Maybe that'd be a lame idea and Prince doesn't want that.

As soon as he did allow someone to use it, these two would be the first ones out there bitching about him selling out for the almighty dollar.

sro100 said:

I for one wish Prince songs were used in all commercials. Boy that'd be great. And for the opening of all TV dramas. Yup Bart that's whay the fans and Prince desperately want. To turn him music into advertising. Oh wait.

Maybe that wouldn't be such a great idea. Maybe that'd be a lame idea and Prince doesn't want that.

See reply #44

ernestsewell said:

sro100 said:

I for one wish Prince songs were used in all commercials. Boy that'd be great. And for the opening of all TV dramas. Yup Bart that's whay the fans and Prince desperately want. To turn him music into advertising. Oh wait.

Maybe that wouldn't be such a great idea. Maybe that'd be a lame idea and Prince doesn't want that.

See reply #44

Yeah, and many of those were to promote himself, so that isn't the same thing.

greed huh? things that u go hmmmmmmmm!

Serena said:

ernestsewell said:

See reply #44

Yeah, and many of those were to promote himself, so that isn't the same thing.

LOL You're hysterically blind.

Serena said:

ernestsewell said:

You keep proving my point. Thank you.

Anytime, Ernie!

It's a good thing that some of you are not in charge of protecting Prince's musical legacy. There is nothing worse than hearing a classic Bill Withers or Rick James song shilling some ridiculous consumer piece of shit. And if I hear another great R&B song ruined in a lame Hollywood comedy or brainless action crap I will sue as a victim of collateral damage. These hack directors are pure lazy when they throw in a known classic song to move the plot in a way their horrible movies can't.

Prince should be very particular and conservative in how his music is used. It ruins the soul of the song and waters down the impact of the live performance. There are plenty of unique and brilliant artists who protect their craft by not exploiting it in every commercial crevice.

ernestsewell said:

Mindflux said:

But, the only "fact" is that Prince charges more for his publishing. Yours and Bart "opinions" that Prince misses every commercial opportunity and, in fact, earns $0 because nobody will pay his prices are not "facts" at all.

Another "fact" is that the Beatles charge more for their publishing than most. So do Pink Floyd. So do many other legendary artists - so what? What is odd is that anyone other than the artists that own the music would give a damn about how much is earned out of any piece of music!

Now, who's the loon?!

Yes, and how often do you hear Pink Floyd songs in a Keebler or Clorox commercial? Doesn't mean you won't hear them, you'll just hear them a lot less.

The FACT is that people aren't going to pay an exorbitant amount of money for a :30 commerical. Pay the going rate, sure, but to pay something 2 or 3 or 4 times the going rate (industry standard) isn't logical, or desired. As I FACTLY stated before, you can price yourself right out of the market - while at the same time bitching because you're ignored.

When Janet used part of "I Can't Get No Satisfaction" for "What'll I Do", she paid a LOT for that. The Stones weren't fucking around, and put a huge price tag on their music, and that song. However, she was willing to do that for the song. But for a commercial - not so much. Sure companies spend a lot on advertising, but there's a limit. And if Prince is charing a gaggle of dollars for a slice of his song, most people are rightly going to say "Fuck him, we'll find another". The Stones have flat out said "NO" to damn near all of their music being used for anything, sans a few expections. Prince could do that, instead of putting a self-absorbed price on his music.

I also never said he misses "every commercial opportunity". Perhaps you're reading someone else's post, not mine. What I said was, "He's missed every opportunity to have his music played wherever by whoever." I didn't say commercial. He prices his shit too high for anyone to touch it. Prince's catalog is vast, and varied, and great, but it's not golden and untouchable. Music is here to be enjoyed by all, whether it's a cover song, or used in a movie. Uh, PS: If people aren't paying for his outrageous pricing on a song, then yeah, he's getting NOTHING because people ARE NOT BUYING IT, and paying the fee.

Prince has bought a bit too much into his own celebrity, esp at age 52. Prince could take care of his music, and use it to make himself some money, and I'm not talking commercials. But he doesn't. He ignores anything from his past, doesn't take care of it, and has yet to really put effort into doing something with his WB catalog. If he doesn't care about it, why should anyone else? He can price himself to the moon - no one making a commercial is really going to give a shit about it anyway.

Did you even THINK before posting that diatribe, Ernest? I have to say, I was expecting better! ?You've proven you don't really know what you are talking about, or even able to put a cohesive argument together.

Yes, most advertisers are not going to pay the highest rates. Most will do it as cheaply as possible. That's not to say that people NEVER pay the highest rate - if they want their product to really sell, they will "speculate to accumulate" - take a risk on paying a vast sum on a hugely popular piece of music because they hope it will add to sales. You say you "FACTLY stated before, you can price yourself right out of the market - while at the same time bitching because you're ignored. " - well, duh!! Firstly, its FACTUALLY and I don't hear Prince bitching that he's not in commercials!! Do you? Does anyone? Have you got one single quote of Prince bemoaning the fact that he's not in commericials?! Of course you don't. So, what are you talking about?!

The next paragraph, about the Stones, is laughable - it just proves my point and is quite contradictory. Prince does EXACTLY what the Stones do - puts a very high price on his music, so that most people aren't interested in using it. Hence, not CHEAPENING the music or helping commercialise it further. Why do you think the Stones do that? Why is what they do any different to Prince. Yes, the Stones had some exceptions (Janet - and a few commericals) - Prince is exactly the same - he's allowed samples of his work to be used (JayZ/Beyoncé which, from what I know, he was paid on a royalty basis (and others)) and has been known to have music featured in a few commercials. So, this quote of yours "The Stones have flat out said "NO" to damn near all of their music being used for anything, sans a few expections. Prince could do that, instead of putting a self-absorbed price on his music." is not at all thought out - cos it IS exactly what Prince and the Stones do! In fact, almost all the "legends" of music behave the same in this way - so, why pick on Prince for it?

Your next paragraph is also confusing - you seem to be mixing up being used for a commericial and general radio play. Prince can charge what he likes when it comes to someone asking him to use his music in a commericial or some other money-making venture. When it comes to normal broadcast and performance, Prince gets the same as everyone else - its a standard fee. And, by the way, I wasn't "quoting" you when I said that, I was paraphrasing yours and Bart's stance - saying that Prince misses "commercial tricks" is something you two bleat on about constantly - in spinte of the fact that I'll bet neither of you earn more than $100k a year, whilst you apparently know better than a man who's earned 100s of millions!! lol

People have used his music before (covers/samples) - it has featured in commercials and he gets plenty of royalties and earns much from his music, as is his right. Yet you will sit there and blab on about how "nobody's buying it" cos he prices himself out of the market. Firstly, your wrong, but why do you even care? Why does it matter to you what he earns and when? Would you be happier to hear his music all over shitty commercials? Will you sleep better knowing he's earned an extra $1million selling his music to all and sundry?

[Edited 6/29/10 3:50am]

[Edited 6/29/10 3:54am]

jdcxc said:

It's a good thing that some of you are not in charge of protecting Prince's musical legacy. There is nothing worse than hearing a classic Bill Withers or Rick James song shilling some ridiculous consumer piece of shit. And if I hear another great R&B song ruined in a lame Hollywood comedy or brainless action crap I will sue as a victim of collateral damage. These hack directors are pure lazy when they throw in a known classic song to move the plot in a way their horrible movies can't.

Prince should be very particular and conservative in how his music is used. It ruins the soul of the song and waters down the impact of the live performance. There are plenty of unique and brilliant artists who protect their craft by not exploiting it in every commercial crevice.

robinhood said:

jdcxc said:

It's a good thing that some of you are not in charge of protecting Prince's musical legacy. There is nothing worse than hearing a classic Bill Withers or Rick James song shilling some ridiculous consumer piece of shit. And if I hear another great R&B song ruined in a lame Hollywood comedy or brainless action crap I will sue as a victim of collateral damage. These hack directors are pure lazy when they throw in a known classic song to move the plot in a way their horrible movies can't.

Prince should be very particular and conservative in how his music is used. It ruins the soul of the song and waters down the impact of the live performance. There are plenty of unique and brilliant artists who protect their craft by not exploiting it in every commercial crevice.

I totally agree, but that doesn't help Bart with his sensationalist headlines now, does it? Bart has become like the org's own National Enquirer

Mindflux said:

robinhood said:

I totally agree, but that doesn't help Bart with his sensationalist headlines now, does it? Bart has become like the org's own National Enquirer

we dont need to go to the OP for sensationalist headlines. we can just go buy a copy of the Daily Mirror and other UK newspapers for that.

Mindflux said:

ernestsewell said:

Yes, and how often do you hear Pink Floyd songs in a Keebler or Clorox commercial? Doesn't mean you won't hear them, you'll just hear them a lot less.

The FACT is that people aren't going to pay an exorbitant amount of money for a :30 commerical. Pay the going rate, sure, but to pay something 2 or 3 or 4 times the going rate (industry standard) isn't logical, or desired. As I FACTLY stated before, you can price yourself right out of the market - while at the same time bitching because you're ignored.

When Janet used part of "I Can't Get No Satisfaction" for "What'll I Do", she paid a LOT for that. The Stones weren't fucking around, and put a huge price tag on their music, and that song. However, she was willing to do that for the song. But for a commercial - not so much. Sure companies spend a lot on advertising, but there's a limit. And if Prince is charing a gaggle of dollars for a slice of his song, most people are rightly going to say "Fuck him, we'll find another". The Stones have flat out said "NO" to damn near all of their music being used for anything, sans a few expections. Prince could do that, instead of putting a self-absorbed price on his music.

I also never said he misses "every commercial opportunity". Perhaps you're reading someone else's post, not mine. What I said was, "He's missed every opportunity to have his music played wherever by whoever." I didn't say commercial. He prices his shit too high for anyone to touch it. Prince's catalog is vast, and varied, and great, but it's not golden and untouchable. Music is here to be enjoyed by all, whether it's a cover song, or used in a movie. Uh, PS: If people aren't paying for his outrageous pricing on a song, then yeah, he's getting NOTHING because people ARE NOT BUYING IT, and paying the fee.

Prince has bought a bit too much into his own celebrity, esp at age 52. Prince could take care of his music, and use it to make himself some money, and I'm not talking commercials. But he doesn't. He ignores anything from his past, doesn't take care of it, and has yet to really put effort into doing something with his WB catalog. If he doesn't care about it, why should anyone else? He can price himself to the moon - no one making a commercial is really going to give a shit about it anyway.

Did you even THINK before posting that diatribe, Ernest? I have to say, I was expecting better! ?You've proven you don't really know what you are talking about, or even able to put a cohesive argument together.

Yes, most advertisers are not going to pay the highest rates. Most will do it as cheaply as possible. That's not to say that people NEVER pay the highest rate - if they want their product to really sell, they will "speculate to accumulate" - take a risk on paying a vast sum on a hugely popular piece of music because they hope it will add to sales. You say you "FACTLY stated before, you can price yourself right out of the market - while at the same time bitching because you're ignored. " - well, duh!! Firstly, its FACTUALLY and I don't hear Prince bitching that he's not in commercials!! Do you? Does anyone? Have you got one single quote of Prince bemoaning the fact that he's not in commericials?! Of course you don't. So, what are you talking about?!

The next paragraph, about the Stones, is laughable - it just proves my point and is quite contradictory. Prince does EXACTLY what the Stones do - puts a very high price on his music, so that most people aren't interested in using it. Hence, not CHEAPENING the music or helping commercialise it further. Why do you think the Stones do that? Why is what they do any different to Prince. Yes, the Stones had some exceptions (Janet - and a few commericals) - Prince is exactly the same - he's allowed samples of his work to be used (JayZ/Beyoncé which, from what I know, he was paid on a royalty basis (and others)) and has been known to have music featured in a few commercials. So, this quote of yours "The Stones have flat out said "NO" to damn near all of their music being used for anything, sans a few expections. Prince could do that, instead of putting a self-absorbed price on his music." is not at all thought out - cos it IS exactly what Prince and the Stones do! In fact, almost all the "legends" of music behave the same in this way - so, why pick on Prince for it?

Your next paragraph is also confusing - you seem to be mixing up being used for a commericial and general radio play. Prince can charge what he likes when it comes to someone asking him to use his music in a commericial or some other money-making venture. When it comes to normal broadcast and performance, Prince gets the same as everyone else - its a standard fee. And, by the way, I wasn't "quoting" you when I said that, I was paraphrasing yours and Bart's stance - saying that Prince misses "commercial tricks" is something you two bleat on about constantly - in spinte of the fact that I'll bet neither of you earn more than $100k a year, whilst you apparently know better than a man who's earned 100s of millions!! lol

People have used his music before (covers/samples) - it has featured in commercials and he gets plenty of royalties and earns much from his music, as is his right. Yet you will sit there and blab on about how "nobody's buying it" cos he prices himself out of the market. Firstly, your wrong, but why do you even care? Why does it matter to you what he earns and when? Would you be happier to hear his music all over shitty commercials? Will you sleep better knowing he's earned an extra $1million selling his music to all and sundry?

[Edited 6/29/10 3:50am]

[Edited 6/29/10 3:54am]

Yeah...ummm...Ernest, guess you're forgetting the Stones' biggest SELLOUT of all time when they let Micro$oft use Start Me Up. I don't care how much was paid for it, letting fucking Bill Gates use a classic like that for a piece of shitty software was horrible!

Ok, so i was kinda against Bart on this one, and then I just saw the Glee "funk" episode, which opened with JB and ended with Pfunk and with the purple one not rating a mention (although there was purple featured prominently every time they played what they considered a "funk number")

(Oh and they totally annihilated Give up tha Funk - not in a good way... but it was cute)

Last lines:

"We've never been able to pull off a funk number"

"That's becuase we're soulless auttomatons"

In fact, I think I'm gonna make that my new sig...

wasitgood4u said:

Ok, so i was kinda against Bart on this one, and then I just saw the Glee "funk" episode, which opened with JB and ended with Pfunk and with the purple one not rating a mention (although there was purple featured prominently every time they played what they considered a "funk number")

(Oh and they totally annihilated Give up tha Funk - not in a good way... but it was cute)

Last lines:

"We've never been able to pull off a funk number"

"That's becuase we're soulless auttomatons"

In fact, I think I'm gonna make that my new sig...

Oh god, please don't mean that you WANT Prince's music on Glee?!? So they annihilated a Pfunk song and you'd like the same for a Prince one, just because it's 'cute'?!?

Serena said:

wasitgood4u said:

Ok, so i was kinda against Bart on this one, and then I just saw the Glee "funk" episode, which opened with JB and ended with Pfunk and with the purple one not rating a mention (although there was purple featured prominently every time they played what they considered a "funk number")

(Oh and they totally annihilated Give up tha Funk - not in a good way... but it was cute)

Last lines:

"We've never been able to pull off a funk number"

"That's becuase we're soulless auttomatons"

In fact, I think I'm gonna make that my new sig...

Oh god, please don't mean that you WANT Prince's music on Glee?!? So they annihilated a Pfunk song and you'd like the same for a Prince one, just because it's 'cute'?!?