I'm sitting here listening to the all of the love for how great A.I. was as an NBA player.

I've always thought he had a lot of talent but he never moved me as a player.

The guy took 23,289 shots and missed 13,763 of those. Anyone could average what he averaged taking that many shots. He never won anything in the NBA, Olympics or College. I don't get it.

What do you think of A.I.?

Graycap23 said:

I'm sitting here listening to the all of the love for how great A.I. was as an NBA player.

I've always thought he had a lot of talent but he never moved me as a player.

The guy took 23,289 shots and missed 13,763 of those. Anyone could average what he averaged taking that many shots. He never won anything in the NBA, Olympics or College. I don't get it.

What do you think of A.I.?

Love him.

According to Basketball Reference, a website I access often in sporting debates, it has him hitting
8467 shots out of 19906 attempts so his field goal percentage was 43%, which is a good point
on your part to highlight. He shot about 31% from beyond the arc and was a 78% three throw
shooter, which so-so for a guard. He was not a great shooter and I don't think he was a great
defender and probably too much of an iso-player. But 27 points a game with 6 assists a game and
2 steals a game at barely 6 feet and under 170 lbs, maybe he is deserving of the accolades.

But boy he had heart; and I loved him for it. And although I don't find this affirming of his career
as a Black American man, isn't he solely responsible for the "thug-life" presentation of most
players in the league? Not that this means that we can judge a book by its cover, but most ballers
looked like hoodlums and it didn't do much to break the stereotype that Black men are menacing.

One of the toughest dudes ever, and probably would have had much better percentages if he'd played on a better team. A lot of the time, he was the 76'ers entire offense and took shots he probably wouldn't have taken if he had some help.

duccichucka said:

Graycap23 said:

I'm sitting here listening to the all of the love for how great A.I. was as an NBA player.

I've always thought he had a lot of talent but he never moved me as a player.

The guy took 23,289 shots and missed 13,763 of those. Anyone could average what he averaged taking that many shots. He never won anything in the NBA, Olympics or College. I don't get it.

What do you think of A.I.?

Love him.

According to Basketball Reference, a website I access often in sporting debates, it has him hitting
8467 shots out of 19906 attempts so his field goal percentage was 43%, which is a good point
on your part to highlight. He shot about 31% from beyond the arc and was a 78% three throw
shooter, which so-so for a guard. He was not a great shooter and I don't think he was a great
defender and probably too much of an iso-player. But 27 points a game with 6 assists a game and
2 steals a game at barely 6 feet and under 170 lbs, maybe he is deserving of the accolades.

But boy he had heart; and I loved him for it. And although I don't find this affirming of his career
as a Black American man, isn't he solely responsible for the "thug-life" presentation of most
players in the league? Not that this means that we can judge a book by its cover, but most ballers
looked like hoodlums and it didn't do much to break the stereotype that Black men are menacing.

I was counting his 2 & 3 shot attempts in my total.

I hear your perspective on A.I. from a lot of people.

To me the guy played like we used to play in the street.

He was always a me 1st player and I think it played a role in why he never won anything.

Graycap23 said:

duccichucka said:

Love him.

According to Basketball Reference, a website I access often in sporting debates, it has him hitting
8467 shots out of 19906 attempts so his field goal percentage was 43%, which is a good point
on your part to highlight. He shot about 31% from beyond the arc and was a 78% three throw
shooter, which so-so for a guard. He was not a great shooter and I don't think he was a great
defender and probably too much of an iso-player. But 27 points a game with 6 assists a game and
2 steals a game at barely 6 feet and under 170 lbs, maybe he is deserving of the accolades.

But boy he had heart; and I loved him for it. And although I don't find this affirming of his career
as a Black American man, isn't he solely responsible for the "thug-life" presentation of most
players in the league? Not that this means that we can judge a book by its cover, but most ballers
looked like hoodlums and it didn't do much to break the stereotype that Black men are menacing.

I was counting his 2 & 3 shot attempts in my total.

I hear your perspective on A.I. from a lot of people.

To me the guy played like we used to play in the street.

He was always a me 1st player and I think it played a role in why he never won anything.

Yes; he was probably a direct link from streetball-style of b'ball to the NBA which is another reason
why Black kids adored him maybe more than they did Jordan. But I think Rodeo's point is well taken:
had AI been on a better team (I'm talking '76ers years) instead of Coach Brown's game plan to soley
build a defensive team around a supremely talented iso-ball scorer, then he wouldn't have had to
take so many shots and maybe have a legitimate chance at winning a 'chip.

Graycap23 said:

I'm sitting here listening to the all of the love for how great A.I. was as an NBA player.

I've always thought he had a lot of talent but he never moved me as a player.

The guy took 23,289 shots and missed 13,763 of those. Anyone could average what he averaged taking that many shots. He never won anything in the NBA, Olympics or College. I don't get it.

What do you think of A.I.?

Allen Iverson should've had to same kind of success that Stephen Curry is having right now.

Although Iverson was a natural shooting guard and was NEVER taught or trained to be a true point guard, I think his biggest drawback was he was only 6' tall. Remember, the best shooting guards in 1990s era & 2000s era NBA were 6'6" [Michael Jordan] to 6'7" [Reggie Miller, Kobe Bryant]. Even the then-normal height of shooting guard in 1980s era NBA were no smaller than 6'3" [Joe Dumars].

As an athlete, Iverson was too reckless with his small body. I remember seeing some game where Iverson took it to the basket at the expense of banging his body to to point that it kind of shorten his career a piece at a time. AFAIC, Iverson set a terrible example for Derrick Rose; but he's another story for another thread!

RodeoSchro said:

One of the toughest dudes ever, and probably would have had much better percentages if he'd played on a better team. A lot of the time, he was the 76'ers entire offense and took shots he probably wouldn't have taken if he had some help.

Exactly. He had more heart than dudes twice his size. One of my all-time favorites and deserving of the HOF.

The folks who got on him because of his so-called 'thug appearance' are haters with should get a life.

uPtoWnNY said:

RodeoSchro said:

One of the toughest dudes ever, and probably would have had much better percentages if he'd played on a better team. A lot of the time, he was the 76'ers entire offense and took shots he probably wouldn't have taken if he had some help.

Exactly. He had more heart than dudes twice his size. One of my all-time favorites and deserving of the HOF.

The folks who got on him because of his so-called 'thug appearance' are haters with should get a life.

Heart...............and won NOTHING at the NBA level, college level, or Olympic level.

He never met a ball..............that he couldn't hog.

[Edited 4/11/16 6:24am]

TonyVanDam said:

Graycap23 said:

I'm sitting here listening to the all of the love for how great A.I. was as an NBA player.

I've always thought he had a lot of talent but he never moved me as a player.

The guy took 23,289 shots and missed 13,763 of those. Anyone could average what he averaged taking that many shots. He never won anything in the NBA, Olympics or College. I don't get it.

What do you think of A.I.?

Allen Iverson should've had to same kind of success that Stephen Curry is having right now.

WHAT?!

Iverson had a spotty jumper. He was too streaky to be compared with Curry. Did you see the
stats I provided for him? He had a 43% field goal percentage and shot 31% from beyond the
arc. He is not on Curry's level at all.

TonyVanDam said:

Graycap23 said:

I'm sitting here listening to the all of the love for how great A.I. was as an NBA player.

I've always thought he had a lot of talent but he never moved me as a player.

The guy took 23,289 shots and missed 13,763 of those. Anyone could average what he averaged taking that many shots. He never won anything in the NBA, Olympics or College. I don't get it.

What do you think of A.I.?

Allen Iverson should've had to same kind of success that Stephen Curry is having right now.

In his dream.

Graycap23 said:

uPtoWnNY said:

Exactly. He had more heart than dudes twice his size. One of my all-time favorites and deserving of the HOF.

The folks who got on him because of his so-called 'thug appearance' are haters with should get a life.

Heart...............and won NOTHING at the NBA level, college level, or Olympic level.

He never met a ball..............that he couldn't hog.

[Edited 4/11/16 6:24am]

But he never met a team that complemented his style and was competent and/or talented
enough to win a championship. You aren't going to win a ring with Eric Fucking Snow and
Aaon Whodat McKie. I mean, who on that NBA finals team was really good?

uPtoWnNY said:

RodeoSchro said:

One of the toughest dudes ever, and probably would have had much better percentages if he'd played on a better team. A lot of the time, he was the 76'ers entire offense and took shots he probably wouldn't have taken if he had some help.

The folks who got on him because of his so-called 'thug appearance' are haters with should get a life.

There's a valid argument that AI introduced a level of individualism that the NBA
had never seen before with his jewelry, corn rows, throwbacks, and sweat suits.
But there is also an argument that he not only popularized a look that continued to
propagate certain stereotypes regarding Black American males, he also popularized
the current iso-ball that has major influence in the game. Not all of the folks who
criticized AI are haters who need to "get a life" even though some of them were
definitely prejudiced.

duccichucka said:

Graycap23 said:

Heart...............and won NOTHING at the NBA level, college level, or Olympic level.

He never met a ball..............that he couldn't hog.

[Edited 4/11/16 6:24am]

But he never met a team that complemented his style and was competent and/or talented
enough to win a championship. You aren't going to win a ring with Eric Fucking Snow and
Aaon Whodat McKie. I mean, who on that NBA finals team was really good?

True.......but what is his excuse in the Olympics? College?

phunkdaddy said:

Bullshit aside. A.I deserves his selection. How many other NBA players are Hall of Famers without a ring? We can start with Charles Barkley, Karl Malone, Patrick Ewing, Reggie Miller, etc. A.I was one of those players during his era that could single handedly dominate a game. The epic 7 game series between the Sixers and Raptors in 2001 and the game where Iverson scored 54 and Vince Carter scored 48 was one of those epic performances that goes alongside Bird-Wilkins, Bird-Jordan, One legged Isaiah vs the Lakers in 87 playoffs. You may not like A.I but you can't deny his heart and talent. My only criticism of A.I is that he probably didn't work as hard off the court to extend his career. He seemed to only rely on his natural talent. Steve Nash played until he was 40. Vince Carter is still playing. Iverson allowed himself to wash out at 34.

2 each his own.

Not my type of player.

Did u read my 1st post?

[Edited 4/11/16 13:59pm]

duccichucka said:

TonyVanDam said:

Allen Iverson should've had to same kind of success that Stephen Curry is having right now.

WHAT?!

Iverson had a spotty jumper. He was too streaky to be compared with Curry. Did you see the
stats I provided for him? He had a 43% field goal percentage and shot 31% from beyond the
arc. He is not on Curry's level at all.

I agree. But I still stand by my words in the previous post. I'm convince that Iverson would have a better career for a litle guy if he had taken basketball practices more seriously. I dare to say that Curry has definitely taken practices seriously his whole life and it's paying off. You notice that Curry is a deadly 3-point shooter, right? Well that should've been Iverson years ago.

phunkdaddy said:

Bullshit aside. A.I deserves his selection. How many other NBA players are Hall of Famers without a ring? We can start with Charles Barkley, Karl Malone, Patrick Ewing, Reggie Miller, etc. A.I was one of those players during his era that could single handedly dominate a game. The epic 7 game series between the Sixers and Raptors in 2001 and the game where Iverson scored 54 and Vince Carter scored 48 was one of those epic performances that goes alongside Bird-Wilkins, Bird-Jordan, One legged Isaiah vs the Lakers in 87 playoffs. You may not like A.I but you can't deny his heart and talent. My only criticism of A.I is that he probably didn't work as hard off the court to extend his career. He seemed to only rely on his natural talent. Steve Nash played until he was 40. Vince Carter is still playing. Iverson allowed himself to wash out at 34.

ANSWER: "The Pistol" Pete Maravich!

Never mind the fact that he never won a NBA championship. Pete Maravich never been to the NBA playoffs. And yet, he is still one of the top 50 best players in NBA history due to being an excellent ball handler and shooter. By 2010s NBA standards, Pete would have been great for "small ball" plays.

TonyVanDam said:

phunkdaddy said:

Bullshit aside. A.I deserves his selection. How many other NBA players are Hall of Famers without a ring? We can start with Charles Barkley, Karl Malone, Patrick Ewing, Reggie Miller, etc. A.I was one of those players during his era that could single handedly dominate a game. The epic 7 game series between the Sixers and Raptors in 2001 and the game where Iverson scored 54 and Vince Carter scored 48 was one of those epic performances that goes alongside Bird-Wilkins, Bird-Jordan, One legged Isaiah vs the Lakers in 87 playoffs. You may not like A.I but you can't deny his heart and talent. My only criticism of A.I is that he probably didn't work as hard off the court to extend his career. He seemed to only rely on his natural talent. Steve Nash played until he was 40. Vince Carter is still playing. Iverson allowed himself to wash out at 34.

ANSWER: "The Pistol" Pete Maravich!

Never mind the fact that he never won a NBA championship. Pete Maravich never been to the NBA playoffs. And yet, he is still one of the top 50 best players in NBA history due to being an excellent ball handler and shooter. By 2010s NBA standards, Pete would have been great for "small ball" plays.

I'm not talking about rings really. A.I. seemed to play for himself.......not the team.

Graycap23 said:

TonyVanDam said:

ANSWER: "The Pistol" Pete Maravich!

Never mind the fact that he never won a NBA championship. Pete Maravich never been to the NBA playoffs. And yet, he is still one of the top 50 best players in NBA history due to being an excellent ball handler and shooter. By 2010s NBA standards, Pete would have been great for "small ball" plays.

I'm not talking about rings really. A.I. seemed to play for himself.......not the team.

Remember the infamous 2004 Summer Olympics games? Remember the line-up for USA Basketball?

If you want to make a fair case of why Iverson should not go into the basketball HOF so soon, show everyone what happen to Iverson against Italy. He got smoked!

TonyVanDam said:

Graycap23 said:

I'm not talking about rings really. A.I. seemed to play for himself.......not the team.

Remember the infamous 2004 Summer Olympics games? Remember the line-up for USA Basketball?

If you want to make a fair case of why Iverson should not go into the basketball HOF so soon, show everyone what happen to Iverson against Italy. He got smoked!

Yep.

Graycap23 said:

TonyVanDam said:

ANSWER: "The Pistol" Pete Maravich!

Never mind the fact that he never won a NBA championship. Pete Maravich never been to the NBA playoffs. And yet, he is still one of the top 50 best players in NBA history due to being an excellent ball handler and shooter. By 2010s NBA standards, Pete would have been great for "small ball" plays.

I'm not talking about rings really. A.I. seemed to play for himself.......not the team.

Total bs

phunkdaddy said:

Graycap23 said:

I'm not talking about rings really. A.I. seemed to play for himself.......not the team.

Total bs

In your opinion.

I have eyes and I see results.......Dude never won a single thing.

That says it all.

[Edited 4/12/16 8:01am]

I'm still scratching my head over why Yao Ming, Mutombo, & the Bulls owner (one of the worst on pro sports) are all going into the Hall of Fame.

Graycap23 said:

phunkdaddy said:

Total bs

In your opinion.

I have eyes and I see results.......Dude never won a single thing.

That says it all.

[Edited 4/12/16 8:01am]

Well time to get corrective lens bro.

As I said in my previous post there is a list of All Pros and

Hall of Famers that never won championships. I don't think people would'

say Karl Malone, Barkley, or Ewing didn't deserve to be in the Hall of Fame

because they never won an NBA title. Basketball is a team sport as noted here

by others in this post, A.I never had another top tier player to team up with

him during his career. Continue to feel the way you feel but your opinion is

short sighted as it comes. There is even a video out there with MJ congratulating

Iverson for his selection while they were riding an airplane.

Graycap23 said:

phunkdaddy said:

Total bs

In your opinion.

I have eyes and I see results.......Dude never won a single thing.

That says it all.

[Edited 4/12/16 8:01am]

In fairness, Iverson was an NBA Eastern Conference champion.

Since I was never a Laker fan, I really wanted the Iverson era 76ers to win the NBA Finals. But the Shaq & Kobe era Lakers were too good on a playoff level at the time.

Graycap23 said:

I'm still scratching my head over why Yao Ming, Mutombo, & the Bulls owner (one of the worst on pro sports) are all going into the Hall of Fame.

Yao Ming deserves it based upon what he did in China in his pre-NBA years. Mutombo deserves it for being one of the best shot blockers ever and he did have 2 NBA Final appearences (76ers & Nets).

It's not the NBA Hall of Fame, but the Basketball Hall of Fame.

uPtoWnNY said:

It's not the NBA Hall of Fame, but the Basketball Hall of Fame.

That is correct. And its amazing that Bill Laimbeer & Robert Horry are not in the Basketball HOF yet.

phunkdaddy said:

Graycap23 said:

In your opinion.

I have eyes and I see results.......Dude never won a single thing.

That says it all.

[Edited 4/12/16 8:01am]

Well time to get corrective lens bro.

As I said in my previous post there is a list of All Pros and

Hall of Famers that never won championships. I don't think people would'

say Karl Malone, Barkley, or Ewing didn't deserve to be in the Hall of Fame

because they never won an NBA title. Basketball is a team sport as noted here

by others in this post, A.I never had another top tier player to team up with

him during his career. Continue to feel the way you feel but your opinion is

short sighted as it comes. There is even a video out there with MJ congratulating

Iverson for his selection while they were riding an airplane.

I'm not mad. Congrats to A.I.......but he still isn't my type of player.