How does this happen. I want the best for this person but this person is extremely selfish and self-centered and aggorant in every way. This person cannot get a job due to his self-centered ways which has caused him troubles with the LAW. How do I try to kindly break through and try to reach him.

Maybe the better question is when he has finally reached his personal rock bottom what can I say to him to make a difference. If I can at all, He has a familial history of cronic porn which has lead him in all the wrong directions regarding women

like this

"YOU ARE TOXIC"

butterfli25 said:

like this

"YOU ARE TOXIC"

*

Yep, the straight up TRUTH.

Like this: "Son, you need to get your shit together, reassess your attitude and make some changes if you want to crawl out of that hole you're in." But there is only so much you can do. This person has to want to be a success. Maybe what he needs is to hit rock bottom to jar him into that wakeup mode. Good luck with that.

butterfli25 said:

like this

"YOU ARE TOXIC"

In all seriousness...I don't think there's any EASY way to confront someone like that.

FIRSTLY, people don't like to hear the truth.
SECONDLY, people have to come to certain realizations on their own.

THIRDLY, they have to WANT to change.

I know a couple in a toxic relationship. Bad.
No matter how much advice people give them, they pretty much keep going back to their destructive behavior because it's what they WANT.

But certainly you as a friend or family are entitled to point out what you believe to be his toxic behavior and suggest how he should tone it down...but be ready to be told to take a hike if it's not what he wants to hear.

Speaking the truth is crucial. Yep, sometimes people have to be left in their vomit before they have an awakening. Enabling doesn't help anything. In fact, it's very destructive. Many times people never have an awakening but that's not your problem or your fault. It's theirs. You have your own life to live to the best of your ability. Sometimes you just need to speak the truth & walk away because some people are self destructive & toxic.

*

It doesn't matter if people want to hear the truth, the truth needs to be spoken nonetheless because it sets certain spiritual forces in place. The truth is very supernatural. I've seen it in action many, many, many times. God has asked me to boldy speak the truth into various situations and I'm always AMAZED at the spirtual ping pong that takes place once I do. Truth is powerful! It doesn't matter what their response is, the important thing is being obedient to confront evil & destruction when called to do so.

*

It's my duty to live my life before God to the best of my ability. I need to run my race. I can't drag a host of other dysfunctional people with me while I'm trying to run a race. It's their decision to get in the race or stay on the sidelines being a mess. One day when I stand before God, there will be no excuse for me trying to drag self destructive people along the course. I'm only responsible for the race I run. Not theirs. God will not allow me to say, "But Lord, so and so needed me to help and that's why I couldn't do such and such for you when you called me to do so. They needed my help." Disobedience is disobedience no matter how you slice it and dice it. You may think you're doing a "good thing" when you're enabling people and dragging them along but that's NOT THE CASE. It's actually disobedience to God.

*

It's always my hope that dysfunctional people will wake up and smell the coffee but it's not my responsibility to ensure that they do. It's their choice and they have to answer for it one day.

*

[Edited 11/7/13 5:53am]

tinaz said:

^WOOOOWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWW.......

*

Shake your head in unbelief all you want. I've been dealing with narcissists, sociopaths and other levels of serious dysfunction all my life. God has taught me a lot of things over the years. Obedience to Him is everything to me.

Scripture for the day. . . . all of Matthew chapter 10. EXCELLENT READ.

*

And another excellent read, Ezekiel 3 (the whole chapter but especially verses 16 - 19).

*

Also, there are a lot of good reads out there from people who specialize in helping people deal with (and walk away from) narcissists & sociopaths. GOOGLE THEM!

*

http://www.mindbodygreen....-Away.html

*

[Edited 11/7/13 7:27am]

PurpleJedi said:

In all seriousness...I don't think there's any EASY way to confront someone like that.

FIRSTLY, people don't like to hear the truth.
SECONDLY, people have to come to certain realizations on their own.

THIRDLY, they have to WANT to change.

I know a couple in a toxic relationship. Bad.
No matter how much advice people give them, they pretty much keep going back to their destructive behavior because it's what they WANT.

But certainly you as a friend or family are entitled to point out what you believe to be his toxic behavior and suggest how he should tone it down...but be ready to be told to take a hike if it's not what he wants to hear.

Yep, people have to WANT to change. And, far too often, they don't want to change. You have to draw your own boundaries and decide whether or not you want to put up with their abusive behavior (towards you) & / or their self destructive behavior or decide to walk away. I'm not into abuse. Been there too often and refuse to walk that forest again. Life's too short.

You don't tell them they're "toxic" - because that makes it about you and doesn't address their problems. The way to handle things that are toxic is to not partake of them (ie, don't drink the poison).

i'm so sensitive...

in answer to the qwestion at hand,

when tellin anyone anything that may not

be somethin they wanna hear, the best approach

is to use 'I' statements. by usin 'you' statements

one puts themselves in the position of judgement

over the other person.

maybe, because they are toxic, a person

tellin then they are toxic, may feel

that there is no need to be a reasonable person.

in a case like that the toxicity has already claimed

yet another. AT WHICH POINT the toxic person

can rightly proclaim "WHO YOU CALLIN TOXIC,

YOU TOXIC ASS BITCH???"

i do have a qwestion though...

how does one become TOXIC???

the way i see it, if they're toxic,

they were toxic from the jump.

I'm the Most Toxic mothafucka

I've ever seen and only because

i was born in a toxic society and chose

to live in it and do well...

THEY DON'T HAVE TO CALL ME KING FOR NAUGHT!!!

iknowy'allNEEDclarificationEDITs

[Edited 11/7/13 20:49pm]

[Edited 11/7/13 20:53pm]

Speaking as one who used to be toxic, just tell the person the truth. I had people avoiding me and ones that stopped speaking to me because I was not good for anyone including myself.

I had a toxic friend and I finally sent him a letter saying he was very negative, and I have never heard from him again. Sometimes I see him on the street and just give him a nod, but he just looks away and says nothing to me. And I don't miss him. You have to do what's best for YOU and not let a person drag you down.

Tempest said:

Speaking the truth is crucial. Yep, sometimes people have to be left in their vomit before they have an awakening. Enabling doesn't help anything. In fact, it's very destructive. Many times people never have an awakening but that's not your problem or your fault. It's theirs. You have your own life to live to the best of your ability. Sometimes you just need to speak the truth & walk away because some people are self destructive & toxic.

*

It doesn't matter if people want to hear the truth, the truth needs to be spoken nonetheless because it sets certain spiritual forces in place. The truth is very supernatural. I've seen it in action many, many, many times. God has asked me to boldy speak the truth into various situations and I'm always AMAZED at the spirtual ping pong that takes place once I do. Truth is powerful! It doesn't matter what their response is, the important thing is being obedient to confront evil & destruction when called to do so.

*

It's my duty to live my life before God to the best of my ability. I need to run my race. I can't drag a host of other dysfunctional people with me while I'm trying to run a race. It's their decision to get in the race or stay on the sidelines being a mess. One day when I stand before God, there will be no excuse for me trying to drag self destructive people along the course. I'm only responsible for the race I run. Not theirs. God will not allow me to say, "But Lord, so and so needed me to help and that's why I couldn't do such and such for you when you called me to do so. They needed my help." Disobedience is disobedience no matter how you slice it and dice it. You may think you're doing a "good thing" when you're enabling people and dragging them along but that's NOT THE CASE. It's actually disobedience to God.

*

It's always my hope that dysfunctional people will wake up and smell the coffee but it's not my responsibility to ensure that they do. It's their choice and they have to answer for it one day.

*

[Edited 11/7/13 5:53am]

Very good post. I agree with you.


At the moment I have the best friends ever around me. They don't try to save me or change me. They will ask me out and we'll have a good time. They give me advice if they ask them, but they don't feel the need to help me.

And that makes them true friends. They know and trust me that I will pick myself up again. And that makes me so happy to be around them.

They love me for who I am. Not for how they would want me to be.


And I treat them the same way. If they need me, I'm there for them. I'll listen to them, give them practical support if they ask for it, or when I have asked them if they need it. My best friend is an alcoholic and has a drug habit. I make jokes about it, and when I think he's in bad shape, I'll tell him. But I love him dearly for who he is, including his unhealthy life-style.

Another friend is struggling with a gambling addiction. I'm very glad she will tell me when she has a relapse. And the first time she told me, was a huge step for her. Of course, I felt sorry for her, but I really did not feel the need to change her. She is in therapy now, but I still think the only solution to any addiction is the 12-step program. But I don't tell her to go there, I made it clear that I am convinced that is the only way. And she heard me, however, does not want to go there. So, end of discussion. And if she has another relapse, I will be there for her again. I will not loan her money, but I will make her a cup of tea and do groceries for her, so she has no worries about having food, when she has gabled again.


If you feel you want to change your friend, ask yourself why you are friends with that person?

Are you really a true friend to that person as he/she is?
Or are you trying to help him/her in a way you think is neccesary, so he/she will be thankfull for you and love you in return??

nammie said:

How does this happen. I want the best for this person but this person is extremely selfish and self-centered and aggorant in every way. This person cannot get a job due to his self-centered ways which has caused him troubles with the LAW. How do I try to kindly break through and try to reach him.

Maybe the better question is when he has finally reached his personal rock bottom what can I say to him to make a difference. If I can at all, He has a familial history of cronic porn which has lead him in all the wrong directions regarding women

I advice you to read "Women who love to much" from Robin Norwood.

You might also like to read 'Confessions of a sociopath'....or Stalking the Soul ... and of course the Alice Miller's: The drama of the gifted child. Or maybe that book might be a good present for that person.


It's my experience that people might want to change if they have reached rock bottom hard enough.

So, please, stop your Florence Nightingale thing, focus on yourself.

If you really want to help this person, you will allow him to hit rock bottom several times, without helping him out. Just make him a nice cup of tea and sit down next to him on the bottom. Listen to him, and wish him good luck when you go to your own house again.

Everybody is entitled to their own mistakes and misfortunes in life. If other's solve his problem, he will never be able to learn from his mistakes and form his own identity.

[Edited 11/8/13 15:43pm]

PurpleJedi said:

In all seriousness...I don't think there's any EASY way to confront someone like that.

FIRSTLY, people don't like to hear the truth.
SECONDLY, people have to come to certain realizations on their own.

THIRDLY, they have to WANT to change.

I know a couple in a toxic relationship. Bad.
No matter how much advice people give them, they pretty much keep going back to their destructive behavior because it's what they WANT.

But certainly you as a friend or family are entitled to point out what you believe to be his toxic behavior and suggest how he should tone it down...but be ready to be told to take a hike if it's not what he wants to hear.

Only after hitting ones head a few times very hard, one might learn.

Tempest said:

Speaking the truth is crucial. Yep, sometimes people have to be left in their vomit before they have an awakening. Enabling doesn't help anything. In fact, it's very destructive. Many times people never have an awakening but that's not your problem or your fault. It's theirs. You have your own life to live to the best of your ability. Sometimes you just need to speak the truth & walk away because some people are self destructive & toxic.

*

It's always my hope that dysfunctional people will wake up and smell the coffee but it's not my responsibility to ensure that they do. It's their choice and they have to answer for it one day.

*

[Edited 11/7/13 5:53am]

Thank you Tempest, your post was both disturbing and on-point at the same time LOL; but brings a fresh perspective to the situation. I will now have the visual of leaving him in his own vomit, (in a good way), when he calls with another sob story and I thank you for that LOL.

dJJ said

I advice you to read "Women who love to much" from Robin Norwood.

You might also like to read 'Confessions of a sociopath'....or Stalking the Soul ... and of course the Alice Miller's: The drama of the gifted child. Or maybe that book might be a good present for that person.

*
Please, stop your Florence Nightingale thing, focus on yourself.

*

If you feel you want to change your friend, ask yourself why you are friends with that person?

*

Are you really a true friend to that person as he/she is?
Or are you trying to help him/her in a way you think is neccesary, so he/she will be thankfull for you and love you in return??

[Edited 11/8/13 15:43pm]

DJJ I thank you for the loving "tough love" I believe there was a part of me that wanted to be appreciated, and thanked in return so the fake Florence Nightingale act ends from this point forward. You've given me a lot to think about regarding my friendship with him.

*

I ordered all four books as an early B-Day present to myself.

KingBAD said:

i'm so sensitive...

in answer to the qwestion at hand,

when tellin anyone anything that may not

be somethin they wanna hear, the best approach

is to use 'I' statements. by usin 'you' statements

one puts themselves in the position of judgement

over the other person.

*

maybe, because they are toxic, a person

tellin then they are toxic, may feel

that there is no need to be a reasonable person.

in a case like that the toxicity has already claimed

yet another. AT WHICH POINT the toxic person

can rightly proclaim "WHO YOU CALLIN TOXIC,

YOU TOXIC ASS BITCH???"

*

i do have a qwestion though...

how does one become TOXIC???

the way i see it, if they're toxic,

they were toxic from the jump.

I'm the Most Toxic mothafucka

I've ever seen and only because

i was born in a toxic society and chose

to live in it and do well...

KingBad, this so true to my experience with this man and thanks to you now I can see why in a much better light.

*

I need to stay in my lane and support at a distance because that's what's best for him and for me! It's his life, his journey, and his business.

[Edited 11/8/13 19:37pm]

nammie said:

KingBAD said:

i'm so sensitive...

in answer to the qwestion at hand,

when tellin anyone anything that may not

be somethin they wanna hear, the best approach

is to use 'I' statements. by usin 'you' statements

one puts themselves in the position of judgement

over the other person.

*

maybe, because they are toxic, a person

tellin then they are toxic, may feel

that there is no need to be a reasonable person.

in a case like that the toxicity has already claimed

yet another. AT WHICH POINT the toxic person

can rightly proclaim "WHO YOU CALLIN TOXIC,

YOU TOXIC ASS BITCH???"

*

i do have a qwestion though...

how does one become TOXIC???

the way i see it, if they're toxic,

they were toxic from the jump.

I'm the Most Toxic mothafucka

I've ever seen and only because

i was born in a toxic society and chose

to live in it and do well...

KingBad, this so true to my experience with this man and thanks to you now I can see why in a much better light.

*

I need to stay in my lane and support at a distance because that's what's best for him and for me! It's his life, his journey, and his business.

[Edited 11/8/13 19:37pm]

nammie said:

dJJ said

I advice you to read "Women who love to much" from Robin Norwood.

You might also like to read 'Confessions of a sociopath'....or Stalking the Soul ... and of course the Alice Miller's: The drama of the gifted child. Or maybe that book might be a good present for that person.

*
Please, stop your Florence Nightingale thing, focus on yourself.

*

If you feel you want to change your friend, ask yourself why you are friends with that person?

*

Are you really a true friend to that person as he/she is?
Or are you trying to help him/her in a way you think is neccesary, so he/she will be thankfull for you and love you in return??

[Edited 11/8/13 15:43pm]

DJJ I thank you for the loving "tough love" I believe there was a part of me that wanted to be appreciated, and thanked in return so the fake Florence Nightingale act ends from this point forward. You've given me a lot to think about regarding my friendship with him.

*

I ordered all four books as an early B-Day present to myself.

Investing in yourself will serve you, and the rest of the world, so much better.

Tempest said:

Speaking the truth is crucial. Yep, sometimes people have to be left in their vomit before they have an awakening. Enabling doesn't help anything. In fact, it's very destructive. Many times people never have an awakening but that's not your problem or your fault. It's theirs. You have your own life to live to the best of your ability. Sometimes you just need to speak the truth & walk away because some people are self destructive & toxic.

*

It doesn't matter if people want to hear the truth, the truth needs to be spoken nonetheless because it sets certain spiritual forces in place. The truth is very supernatural. I've seen it in action many, many, many times. God has asked me to boldy speak the truth into various situations and I'm always AMAZED at the spirtual ping pong that takes place once I do. Truth is powerful! It doesn't matter what their response is, the important thing is being obedient to confront evil & destruction when called to do so.

*

It's my duty to live my life before God to the best of my ability. I need to run my race. I can't drag a host of other dysfunctional people with me while I'm trying to run a race. It's their decision to get in the race or stay on the sidelines being a mess. One day when I stand before God, there will be no excuse for me trying to drag self destructive people along the course. I'm only responsible for the race I run. Not theirs. God will not allow me to say, "But Lord, so and so needed me to help and that's why I couldn't do such and such for you when you called me to do so. They needed my help." Disobedience is disobedience no matter how you slice it and dice it. You may think you're doing a "good thing" when you're enabling people and dragging them along but that's NOT THE CASE. It's actually disobedience to God.

*

It's always my hope that dysfunctional people will wake up and smell the coffee but it's not my responsibility to ensure that they do. It's their choice and they have to answer for it one day.

*

[Edited 11/7/13 5:53am]