MoBetterBliss said:

XxAxX said:

it's because she's chosen to slut her way to the top instead of relying on actual musical talent or skill, she's gone for the old i'm naked approach. such a shame that in this day and age women feel they must be nude to sell their talent. this is the exact opposite of female empowerment

[Edited 10/4/13 13:01pm]

and what about prince wearing undies and a coat on stage... or assless pants... or jacking his guitar off and having it shoot stuff out the end?

there's no proof she feels she has to do anything... maybe she just wants to... maybe she's horny as hell and wants to put it out there

I know that, for me, I liked Prince despite all of that stuff, not because of it. If that was all Prince had to hang a career on, I definitely would not be here.

NDRU said:

MoBetterBliss said:

and what about prince wearing undies and a coat on stage... or assless pants... or jacking his guitar off and having it shoot stuff out the end?

there's no proof she feels she has to do anything... maybe she just wants to... maybe she's horny as hell and wants to put it out there

I know that, for me, I liked Prince despite all of that stuff, not because of it. If that was all Prince had to hang a career on, I definitely would not be here.

tinaz said:

babynoz said:Some people are just tired of bullshit gimmicks and the notion that Miley is carrying the banner to make some type of social statement for female sexuality is nonsense. It was yet another dumb gimmick that backfired...end of story. ...........................................................................................................................................................................................................

I don't know if it totally backfired-Night line had a reporter that said essentially that you alarm the parents and please the teenagers by doing so.

In the end it was a crappy performance.

aardvark15 posted this in non-prince music:

Annie Lennox on Recent Sexual Performances

JustErin said:

MoBetterBliss said:

and what about prince wearing undies and a coat on stage... or assless pants... or jacking his guitar off and having it shoot stuff out the end?

there's no proof she feels she has to do anything... maybe she just wants to... maybe she's horny as hell and wants to put it out there

Exactly, total double standard. And yes, there is an orger that was a definite Miley fans singing her praises but now apparently she is a whore.

Difference being that Prince had the talent to back up his antics.

dJJ said:

JustErin said:

It's so funny to see people who championed Miley so hard now completely shun her because she has a few so called provocative pictures and dances...what...inappropriately?

Especially on a Prince site!

Typical backlash against what some think is an overt display of female sexuality. Woman aren't supposed to sexual outside the bedroom, remember?

I agree.

Miley sure shows how hypocrite people are about female sexuality. I hope Miley is in control though. And I'm not so sure about that anymore.

Possibly. But I'm not so certain that it's a matter of female sexuality at this point. It's certainly one of (over)exposure... in more ways than one.

NDRU said:

MoBetterBliss said:

and what about prince wearing undies and a coat on stage... or assless pants... or jacking his guitar off and having it shoot stuff out the end?

there's no proof she feels she has to do anything... maybe she just wants to... maybe she's horny as hell and wants to put it out there

I know that, for me, I liked Prince despite all of that stuff, not because of it. If that was all Prince had to hang a career on, I definitely would not be here.

we don't know that it's all she has to hang a career on... time will tell

for the record... i'm no miley fan ... i just see blatant hypocrisy when a woman really puts her sexuality out there

MoBetterBliss said:

NDRU said:

I know that, for me, I liked Prince despite all of that stuff, not because of it. If that was all Prince had to hang a career on, I definitely would not be here.

we don't know that it's all she has to hang a career on... time will tell

for the record... i'm no miley fan ... i just see blatant hypocrisy when a woman really puts her sexuality out there

Oh she ain't plotting it. Trust me.

Miley's alright vocally but she really doesn't bring nothing to the table. She's a former child star. Unless she has prodigal talent like Aretha Franklin (14), Whitney Houston (14-ish) or Stevie Wonder (12-ish), she's gonna do what every other child star especially modern day ones do once they stop being cute and start adjusting to adult age.

And if she wants to "express herself" sexually and subtletly, she's not even close to doing that because they got her dancing and posing like an idiot. It's not really sexual.

[Edited 10/5/13 16:36pm]

MoBetterBliss said:

NDRU said:

I know that, for me, I liked Prince despite all of that stuff, not because of it. If that was all Prince had to hang a career on, I definitely would not be here.

we don't know that it's all she has to hang a career on... time will tell

for the record... i'm no miley fan ... i just see blatant hypocrisy when a woman really puts her sexuality out there

She might have a great career, true, but I don't really hear anyone talking about her material the way they did when they heard the new Prince song.

And there is definitely a double standard--women, in fact, can and do do make their whole careers off of sexuality. Men have to make decent music! Prince didn't exactly get universal accolades for wearing undies onstage

You know shit is getting serious when Annie Lennox has something to say about it. Fortunately, it's thoughtful, intelligent and well written (not that I would expect anything else).

In full, this is what she posted to her Facebook (which I of course copied from some other website :lol)...

"I have to say that I'm disturbed and dismayed by the recent spate of overtly sexualised performances and videos.

You know the ones I'm talking about. It seems obvious that certain record companies are peddling highly styled pornography with musical accompaniment.

As if the tidal wave of sexualised imagery wasn't already bombarding impressionable young girls enough. I believe in freedom of speech and expression, but the market forces don't give a toss about the notion of boundaries.

As long as there's booty to make money out of, it will be bought and sold.

It's depressing to see how these performers are so eager to push this new level of low. Their assumption seems to be that misogyny - utilised and displayed through oneself is totally fine, as long as you are the one creating it.

As if it's all justified by how many millions of dollars and U tube hits you get from behaving like pimp and prostitute at the same time.

It's a glorified and monetized form of self harm."

just got back from paisley park, totally awesome party. just thought i'd say, prince did NOT twerk, even once, and he kept his clothes on the whole time

*

but he could have been wearing fried jellybeans and still have been the funkiest thing on earth. he has what miley lacks and is trying to imitate. prince can wear lace, he can wear buttless pants, he can wear ladies clothing and the thing is he's so dang talented and charismatic his clothing will always be secondary to what he brings to the show. he's... prince

NDRU said:

MoBetterBliss said:

we don't know that it's all she has to hang a career on... time will tell

for the record... i'm no miley fan ... i just see blatant hypocrisy when a woman really puts her sexuality out there

She might have a great career, true, but I don't really hear anyone talking about her material the way they did when they heard the new Prince song.

And there is definitely a double standard--women, in fact, can and do do make their whole careers off of sexuality. Men have to make decent music! Prince didn't exactly get universal accolades for wearing undies onstage

prince is sexy, naked. miley, for some reason, just not so much... it comes down to that indefinable something, you either have it, or you don't.

*

i feel sorry for miley right now. she's young, has talent, and works hard. i think this is a marketing ploy going horribly wrong. or, maybe right, depending on your perspective

^^ If it's a marketing ploy then, trust me, it's going very well lol...and the more "seasoned" female artists speak out against Miley's antics the more likely the pendulum is gonna start swinging the other way. People will start feeling like she's being attacked for daring to be sexual, regardless of how well she pulls it off. That'll morph into "Miley Cyrus can't be Miley Cyrus" articles, "Are we pigeon-holing Miley?", etc, etc, blah blah.

Meanwhile, sites like Prince.org are churning out the multi-page Miley threads like there's no tomorrow lol...so yeah, I'd say it's probably working at least a little bit.

Byron said:

^^ If it's a marketing ploy then, trust me, it's going very well lol...and the more "seasoned" female artists speak out against Miley's antics the more likely the pendulum is gonna start swinging the other way. People will start feeling like she's being attacked for daring to be sexual, regardless of how well she pulls it off. That'll morph into "Miley Cyrus can't be Miley Cyrus" articles, "Are we pigeon-holing Miley?", etc, etc, blah blah.

Meanwhile, sites like Prince.org are churning out the multi-page Miley threads like there's no tomorrow lol...so yeah, I'd say it's probably working at least a little bit.

Remember when people were going on and on and on and on about Madonna. It not only bolstered her popularity but in turn she turned it up. Only when it became "too much" did she tone down (a little).

Timmy84 said:

Byron said:

^^ If it's a marketing ploy then, trust me, it's going very well lol...and the more "seasoned" female artists speak out against Miley's antics the more likely the pendulum is gonna start swinging the other way. People will start feeling like she's being attacked for daring to be sexual, regardless of how well she pulls it off. That'll morph into "Miley Cyrus can't be Miley Cyrus" articles, "Are we pigeon-holing Miley?", etc, etc, blah blah.

Meanwhile, sites like Prince.org are churning out the multi-page Miley threads like there's no tomorrow lol...so yeah, I'd say it's probably working at least a little bit.

Remember when people were going on and on and on and on about Madonna. It not only bolstered her popularity but in turn she turned it up. Only when it became "too much" did she tone down (a little).

r3member her book, 'sex'?? talk about turning it up.

*

i actually think it's pretty amazing that miley managed to turn the spotlight on herself. lady gaga's comeback has not garnered anywhere near as much media attention.

*

by criticizing miley, i know i'm skirting the edge of a double standard. i think it's there because i grew up listening to joni mitchell, joan baez, aretha franklin, annie lennox, and other great talents who were usually fully clothed, yet managed to be entertaining onstage.

*

maybe our expectation of what comprised a *good show* back then was more chaste than now? has a more sexually permissive society and aggressive marketing by sexualizing resulted in the boundaries of so-called good taste being blurred to an extreme degree?

*

this is a youtube culture, where getting the most hits counts for most everything. i really do not know who is steering the boat these days

*

judging from the photos on richardson's blog, she's making a trademark for herself. that tongue thing. i applaud her for sticking to her vision!!

[Edited 10/6/13 10:31am]

XxAxX said:

Timmy84 said:

Remember when people were going on and on and on and on about Madonna. It not only bolstered her popularity but in turn she turned it up. Only when it became "too much" did she tone down (a little).

r3member her book, 'sex'?? talk about turning it up.

*

i actually think it's pretty amazing that miley managed to turn the spotlight on herself. lady gaga's comeback has not garnered anywhere near as much media attention.

*

by criticizing miley, i know i'm skirting the edge of a double standard. i think it's there because i grew up listening to joni mitchell, joan baez, aretha franklin, annie lennox, and other great talents who were usually fully clothed, yet managed to be entertaining onstage.

*

maybe our expectation of what comprised a *good show* back then was more chaste than now? has a more sexually permissive society and aggressive marketing by sexualizing resulted in the boundaries of so-called good taste being blurred to an extreme degree?

*

this is a youtube culture, where getting the most hits counts for most everything. i really do not know who is steering the boat these days

*

judging from the photos on richardson's blog, she's making a trademark for herself. that tongue thing. i applaud her for sticking to her vision!!

[Edited 10/6/13 10:31am]

Yup. I remember when she came out one time at a fashion runway with Jean Paul Gaultier I believe wearing a bra-less halter and her nipples were out, then Erotica, then Body of Evidence, it was too much. But Madonna basically literally wrote the road map that many female acts have since picked up with Miley being the latest student.

XxAxX said:

NDRU said:

She might have a great career, true, but I don't really hear anyone talking about her material the way they did when they heard the new Prince song.

And there is definitely a double standard--women, in fact, can and do do make their whole careers off of sexuality. Men have to make decent music! Prince didn't exactly get universal accolades for wearing undies onstage

prince is sexy, naked. miley, for some reason, just not so much...

after having watched you post for years... i have to say...i'm a bit shocked by this response

MoBetterBliss said:

XxAxX said:

prince is sexy, naked. miley, for some reason, just not so much...

after having watched you post for years... i have to say...i'm a bit shocked by this response

please read all of my posts for context and further explanation. that should help, if not, sorry. to clarify further: 1) as mentioned above, prince's studied nakedness was not my favorite aspect of his performance, ever; and 2) when prince does the overtly sexual gestures onstage, his moves look real. he exudes talent (which is the quality i find most sexy about a guy) and he works what he does into the music. i do not feel that way about miley's performance. to me her moves seemed stilted and forced, and somewhat contrived for effect.

[Edited 10/6/13 13:31pm]

Byron said:

^^ If it's a marketing ploy then, trust me, it's going very well lol...and the more "seasoned" female artists speak out against Miley's antics the more likely the pendulum is gonna start swinging the other way. People will start feeling like she's being attacked for daring to be sexual, regardless of how well she pulls it off. That'll morph into "Miley Cyrus can't be Miley Cyrus" articles, "Are we pigeon-holing Miley?", etc, etc, blah blah.

Meanwhile, sites like Prince.org are churning out the multi-page Miley threads like there's no tomorrow lol...so yeah, I'd say it's probably working at least a little bit.

I am one of those.

She is not submissive sexual, and that is something a girl is not allowed to do.

Nah half of those talking about her are sick of her trying to twerk. Twerking is annoying. What ever happened to just straight PUSSY POPPIN'!?





No but seriously, this whole "twerking" thing has actually been in the mainstream in a while. I do remember people going on about "whistle while you twerk" or whatever.

Miley thinks what she's doing is sexual but it's just...AWKWARD!

Timmy84 said:

Nah half of those talking about her are sick of her trying to twerk. Twerking is annoying. What ever happened to just straight PUSSY POPPIN'!?





No but seriously, this whole "twerking" thing has actually been in the mainstream in a while. I do remember people going on about "whistle while you twerk" or whatever.

Miley thinks what she's doing is sexual but it's just...AWKWARD!

On another note... thanks for posting that tune

XxAxX said:

*

judging from the photos on richardson's blog, she's making a trademark for herself. that tongue thing. i applaud her for sticking to her vision!!

Me too.


The hypocrocy and double standards I find way more shocking than Miley's awkard dance moves.

I respect the way she deals with the whole drama. I think she is very strong and much more together than most people think.

And I'm very glad she said that coke is a horrible drug. That was my big fear, but if she smokes some weed now and then or pops a xtc once in a while, she will not get addicted.


I read she did a great parody last saturday with her own song and about the shutdown.

She is the one who is laughing now.

What I also really dig, is that she never apologized.

She did what she did, and she just goes on. Ignoring all the critics.

Love that lady!




Reminds me of the early days of Anouk, a Dutch singer.

At a festival, Pinkpop, she got thrown rotten eggs at her.

I guess all these guys did not like a blond girl on stage.

Anouk did not stop singing, she took of her shirt and just went on in her bra!!

She gained a lot of respect for that perseverance. Rightly so:

Anouk is the one who is still performing and has a sound fan base. She did not let anybody stop her. Same seems to go for Miley now. I like that.

[Edited 10/7/13 4:43am]

Cerebus said:

JustErin said:

It's so funny to see people who championed Miley so hard now completely shun her because she has a few so called provocative pictures and dances...what...inappropriately?

Especially on a Prince site!

Typical backlash against what some think is an overt display of female sexuality. Woman aren't supposed to sexual outside the bedroom, remember?

I don't disagree with you, and I'm pretty sure you know I don't disagree with you, but I think there are two issues at hand that are affecting people so strongly...

First, she was a Disney kid. For tens of millions of kids AND their parents she was Hannah Montana. She was the squeaky clean image of how to behave well as a child. And she released three albums before her Disney contract expired that showed no signs of the sudden change that was coming around the bend. I mean really, it's been, what? A year? Less? So while someone like Prince or Madonna were ALWAYS that person/artist, Miley was not, and that makes it appear contrived and disingenuous.

Still, who cares, right? I mean it IS clearly a double standard. So what gives? Well, in my opinion anyway, it's that she's done a bad job of being bad. The outfits she's wearing look ridiculous. The Mtv performance was ridiculous AND awful (I even posted videos of her ACTUALLY singing in the thread about it). The poses in those Terry Richardson pics are uncomfortably bad (not to mention the pointless nudity in the wrecking ball video - because it's actually a damn good song). And the tongue always wagging out her mouth is just freakin' strange. Prince, Madonna, even Lady Gaga (who I absolutely HATE!), have the benefit of their sexuality being perceived as part of their "art", but with Miley it's just coming across as calculated trashiness.

So what I think is happening is the combination of the sudden use of sex (and drugs) as part of her image, in combination with how poorly it's been executed, is sending people into a general head-spinning state of "WTF?!?"

In the very first thread after her VMA performance I said it was a horrible performance and explained why. But that's not the reason why most are criticizing her.

tinaz said:

JustErin said: Cerebus said: I don't disagree with you, and I'm pretty sure you know I don't disagree with you, but I think there are two issues at hand that are affecting people so strongly... First, she was a Disney kid. For tens of millions of kids AND their parents she was Hannah Montana. She was the squeaky clean image of how to behave well as a child. And she released three albums before her Disney contract expired that showed no signs of the sudden change that was coming around the bend. I mean really, it's been, what? A year? Less? So while someone like Prince or Madonna were ALWAYS that person/artist, Miley was not, and that makes it appear contrived and disingenuous. Still, who cares, right? I mean it IS clearly a double standard. So what gives? Well, in my opinion anyway, it's that she's done a bad job of being bad. The outfits she's wearing look ridiculous. The Mtv performance was ridiculous AND awful (I even posted videos of her ACTUALLY singing in the thread about it). The poses in those Terry Richardson pics are uncomfortably bad (not to mention the pointless nudity in the wrecking ball video - because it's actually a damn good song). And the tongue always wagging out her mouth is just freakin' strange. Prince, Madonna, even Lady Gaga (who I absolutely HATE!), have the benefit of their sexuality being perceived as part of their "art", but with Miley it's just coming across as calculated trashiness. So what I think is happening is the combination of the sudden use of sex (and drugs) as part of her image, in combination with how poorly it's been executed, is sending people into a general head-spinning state of "WTF?!?" In the very first thread after her VMA performance I said it was a horrible performance and explained why. But that's not the reason why most are criticizing her. ................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................ When you say "most" who are you refering to? because we all know how much you hate when people group you into a "most" category....... I have not one problem with her trying to be "sexy", but thats just the thing... None of what she has done is sexy, or hot, or even looks good... Shes akward at it and it comes off as trying too hard to be something she just isnt going to be good at....

It is so freaking hard to read your posts!!

I don't hate general terms. And when I say most I am talking about everyone, not just thoses here on the org.