http://sports.yahoo.com/n...nba-323404

The Basketball Hall of Fame turns its back on Reggie Miller

Reggie Miller was never a strong defender. Even for shooting guards, his rebounding and assist totals were poor. He averaged over 22 points per game just twice in an 18-year career, 17 of those seasons which were spent starting and playing heavy minutes. His career Player Efficiency Rating was an 18.4, around what Brook Lopez(notes) is averaging this season, and his high-water mark in PER saw him finish the year with a 21.4 PER, which is around where the Los Angeles Clippers' Eric Gordon(notes) was at before he injured himself a few weeks back.

There are legitimate concerns as to whether or not Reggie Miller, for all his celebrity and playoff contributions, is a Basketball Hall of Famer.

But for the guy to be left off the ballot? The Basketball Hall of Fame, in a half-century of low points, has hit another new low.

Marc J. Spears reported t...sday night:

Miller was considered this year's most heralded nominee, but apparently did not receive the necessary votes to become a finalist in his first year of eligibility. The list of finalists will be officially announced Friday.

Miller was a nominee in the Hall's North American group, which requires him to appear on seven of nine ballots to become a finalist. Finalists then need to receive at least 18 of 24 votes from a different panel to be inducted. The inductees will be announced at the NCAA Final Four in April with enshrinement ceremonies likely scheduled for September.

This is just astonishing. If the voting committee behind this brand of voting can't bother to recognize Reggie Miller, who YOUR GRANDMOTHER knows about, than what hope does North American pro basketball have in this embarrassment of an institution?

Again, Reggie was a shoot-first guy who really didn't contribute much outside of hitting jumper after jumper, so it's perfectly reasonable to question whether or not he deserves a trip to the Hall in comparison to other NBA players of his era. But there shouldn't be any real qualms with voting him in. Discuss it, sure, and be mindful about his place among his peers from the era, but don't overreact.

Overreact about the ballot embarrassment, though. React accordingly, yell a lot, and then overreact on top of this. The NBA needs its own Hall of Fame. David Stern has sold out to that nebulous group of Eddie Haskell-types from the NCAA, and it's a joke that NBA players consistently have to be regarded as second-class citizens to NCAA coaches who just managed to hang around for a while.

In closing, I'll leave you with this. Among NBAniks, it is common knowledge that just approximating your regular-season stats in the playoffs is quite the accomplishment. Because the pace slows so much, teams have hours of game tape to use in anticipation of defending you, and because the competition is so enhanced, just coming close to those regular-season per-game averages that were trumpeted up by a few visits to Clipperville is worth a standing ovation.

Reggie Miller, for all his bluster, brought it in the postseason. He averaged 20.6 points over 144 career postseason games, as compared with 18.2 points in the regular season. And a 60 percent True Shooting mark, which takes into account 3-pointers and free throws, done mostly with a Knick or Bull in his sternum.

It's hard to believe that the last straw regarding the Basketball Hall of Fame has to come in the person who seems tailor-made for their supposed prominence-first, game-second criteria, but here it is. What a joke.

uPtoWnNY said:

Sources: Nets, Nuggets reach agreement; now it's up to Carmelo Anthony to say yes;

http://www.northjersey.com/sports/021811_Nets_Nuggets_reach_agreement_now_its_up_to_Carmelo_Anthony_to_say_yes.html

If the Knicks, sit back and let this happen, then they deserve what they get. In everything that you do, you have to put in, in order to get back. I thought the would have realized this by now...

But that deal hinges on Carmelo signing an extension with the Nets, and I don't see that happening. He wants to play for one team - the Knicks.

LittleBLUECorvette said:

http://sports.yahoo.com/n...nba-323404

The Basketball Hall of Fame turns its back on Reggie Miller

Reggie Miller was never a strong defender. Even for shooting guards, his rebounding and assist totals were poor. He averaged over 22 points per game just twice in an 18-year career, 17 of those seasons which were spent starting and playing heavy minutes. His career Player Efficiency Rating was an 18.4, around what Brook Lopez(notes) is averaging this season, and his high-water mark in PER saw him finish the year with a 21.4 PER, which is around where the Los Angeles Clippers' Eric Gordon(notes) was at before he injured himself a few weeks back.

There are legitimate concerns as to whether or not Reggie Miller, for all his celebrity and playoff contributions, is a Basketball Hall of Famer.

But for the guy to be left off the ballot? The Basketball Hall of Fame, in a half-century of low points, has hit another new low.

Marc J. Spears reported t...sday night:

Miller was considered this year's most heralded nominee, but apparently did not receive the necessary votes to become a finalist in his first year of eligibility. The list of finalists will be officially announced Friday.

Miller was a nominee in the Hall's North American group, which requires him to appear on seven of nine ballots to become a finalist. Finalists then need to receive at least 18 of 24 votes from a different panel to be inducted. The inductees will be announced at the NCAA Final Four in April with enshrinement ceremonies likely scheduled for September.

This is just astonishing. If the voting committee behind this brand of voting can't bother to recognize Reggie Miller, who YOUR GRANDMOTHER knows about, than what hope does North American pro basketball have in this embarrassment of an institution?

Again, Reggie was a shoot-first guy who really didn't contribute much outside of hitting jumper after jumper, so it's perfectly reasonable to question whether or not he deserves a trip to the Hall in comparison to other NBA players of his era. But there shouldn't be any real qualms with voting him in. Discuss it, sure, and be mindful about his place among his peers from the era, but don't overreact.

Overreact about the ballot embarrassment, though. React accordingly, yell a lot, and then overreact on top of this. The NBA needs its own Hall of Fame. David Stern has sold out to that nebulous group of Eddie Haskell-types from the NCAA, and it's a joke that NBA players consistently have to be regarded as second-class citizens to NCAA coaches who just managed to hang around for a while.

In closing, I'll leave you with this. Among NBAniks, it is common knowledge that just approximating your regular-season stats in the playoffs is quite the accomplishment. Because the pace slows so much, teams have hours of game tape to use in anticipation of defending you, and because the competition is so enhanced, just coming close to those regular-season per-game averages that were trumpeted up by a few visits to Clipperville is worth a standing ovation.

Reggie Miller, for all his bluster, brought it in the postseason. He averaged 20.6 points over 144 career postseason games, as compared with 18.2 points in the regular season. And a 60 percent True Shooting mark, which takes into account 3-pointers and free throws, done mostly with a Knick or Bull in his sternum.

It's hard to believe that the last straw regarding the Basketball Hall of Fame has to come in the person who seems tailor-made for their supposed prominence-first, game-second criteria, but here it is. What a joke.

Interesting.........after all of that, I've never really considered Reggie as a HOF. Go figure.

Graycap23 said:

LittleBLUECorvette said:

http://sports.yahoo.com/n...nba-323404

The Basketball Hall of Fame turns its back on Reggie Miller

Reggie Miller was never a strong defender. Even for shooting guards, his rebounding and assist totals were poor. He averaged over 22 points per game just twice in an 18-year career, 17 of those seasons which were spent starting and playing heavy minutes. His career Player Efficiency Rating was an 18.4, around what Brook Lopez(notes) is averaging this season, and his high-water mark in PER saw him finish the year with a 21.4 PER, which is around where the Los Angeles Clippers' Eric Gordon(notes) was at before he injured himself a few weeks back.

There are legitimate concerns as to whether or not Reggie Miller, for all his celebrity and playoff contributions, is a Basketball Hall of Famer.

But for the guy to be left off the ballot? The Basketball Hall of Fame, in a half-century of low points, has hit another new low.

Marc J. Spears reported t...sday night:

This is just astonishing. If the voting committee behind this brand of voting can't bother to recognize Reggie Miller, who YOUR GRANDMOTHER knows about, than what hope does North American pro basketball have in this embarrassment of an institution?

Again, Reggie was a shoot-first guy who really didn't contribute much outside of hitting jumper after jumper, so it's perfectly reasonable to question whether or not he deserves a trip to the Hall in comparison to other NBA players of his era. But there shouldn't be any real qualms with voting him in. Discuss it, sure, and be mindful about his place among his peers from the era, but don't overreact.

Overreact about the ballot embarrassment, though. React accordingly, yell a lot, and then overreact on top of this. The NBA needs its own Hall of Fame. David Stern has sold out to that nebulous group of Eddie Haskell-types from the NCAA, and it's a joke that NBA players consistently have to be regarded as second-class citizens to NCAA coaches who just managed to hang around for a while.

In closing, I'll leave you with this. Among NBAniks, it is common knowledge that just approximating your regular-season stats in the playoffs is quite the accomplishment. Because the pace slows so much, teams have hours of game tape to use in anticipation of defending you, and because the competition is so enhanced, just coming close to those regular-season per-game averages that were trumpeted up by a few visits to Clipperville is worth a standing ovation.

Reggie Miller, for all his bluster, brought it in the postseason. He averaged 20.6 points over 144 career postseason games, as compared with 18.2 points in the regular season. And a 60 percent True Shooting mark, which takes into account 3-pointers and free throws, done mostly with a Knick or Bull in his sternum.

It's hard to believe that the last straw regarding the Basketball Hall of Fame has to come in the person who seems tailor-made for their supposed prominence-first, game-second criteria, but here it is. What a joke.

Interesting.........after all of that, I've never really considered Reggie as a HOF. Go figure.

He might not be a hall of famer, but damn, he shoud at least be put on the ballot.

Carmelo is a Knick.

LittleBLUECorvette said:

Carmelo is a Knick.

Yes indeed. What do you think about the trade? Do you think the Knicks gave up too much?

shorttrini said:

LittleBLUECorvette said:

Carmelo is a Knick.

Yes indeed. What do you think about the trade? Do you think the Knicks gave up too much?

YEs, but you gotta give to recieve. Melo is no doubt the best player in the deal.

And in the summer, Chris Paul or Deron Williams.

LittleBLUECorvette said:

And in the summer, Chris Paul or Deron Williams.

That's not for another two years.

shorttrini said:

LittleBLUECorvette said:

Carmelo is a Knick.

Yes indeed. What do you think about the trade? Do you think the Knicks gave up too much?

I work with a native new yorker and knicks fan. He didn't want to give up Felton and

Billups has 2 years max left in the gas tank. It should give them enough time to

groom a younger point guard though.

uPtoWnNY said:

LittleBLUECorvette said:

And in the summer, Chris Paul or Deron Williams.

That's not for another two years.

How ya feeling big dawg?

Always thought GP would have made a great stand up comic.

Graycap23 said:

uPtoWnNY said:

That's not for another two years.

How ya feeling big dawg?

I'm glad we finally got another star, but there's no height on this team - forget about defense and rebounding.

And it looks like Brain-Dead Dolan won't give Donnie Walsh an extension. That means the lowlife scumbag Isiah is coming back. I'll revolt if that happens.

At least Isiah's boy Eddy Curry is gone. He and Randolph were shipped to Minnesota for Corey Brewer.

Denver could have lost their star player with nothing in return, so they did good by making the trade and brought in Felton, Gallinari & Chandler, which is something decent to start with when they will be in a rebuilding process. Plus they've got Mozgov and the draft picks too. If they can keep ahold of JR Smith, Kenyon Martin & Nene then Denver will no doubt still be a team challenging for a playoff spot.

I think the Knicks did give up too much (4 players plus draft picks), when they could have waited to sign Melo in the summer as a free agent and kept their current starters together, but maybe they can trade a few players in the summer they got in the trade for some big guys to give the team some height as they'll need it to match the Celtics & Lakers if they want to become a team challenging for the NBA championship. The T'wolves got Randolph & Curry in the trade too and along with Love & Beasley they've got a decent team coming together.

LittleBLUECorvette said:

Always thought GP would have made a great stand up comic.

LOL, the Rockets/Sonics battles of the early 90's were EPIC.

thetimefan said:

What do you think about the trade? Do you think the Knicks gave up too much?

Denver could have lost their star player with nothing in return, so they did good by making the trade and brought in Felton, Gallinari & Chandler, which is something decent to start with when they will be in a rebuilding process. Plus they've got Mozgov and the draft picks too. If they can keep ahold of JR Smith, Kenyon Martin & Nene then Denver will no doubt still be a team challenging for a playoff spot.

I think the Knicks did give up too much (4 players plus draft picks), when they could have waited to sign Melo in the summer as a free agent and kept their current starters together, but maybe they can trade a few players in the summer they got in the trade for some big guys to give the team some height as they'll need it to match the Celtics & Lakers if they want to become a team challenging for the NBA championship. The T'wolves got Randolph & Curry in the trade too and along with Love & Beasley they've got a decent team coming together.

Seemed like a better option.

phunkdaddy said:

thetimefan said:

Denver could have lost their star player with nothing in return, so they did good by making the trade and brought in Felton, Gallinari & Chandler, which is something decent to start with when they will be in a rebuilding process. Plus they've got Mozgov and the draft picks too. If they can keep ahold of JR Smith, Kenyon Martin & Nene then Denver will no doubt still be a team challenging for a playoff spot.

I think the Knicks did give up too much (4 players plus draft picks), when they could have waited to sign Melo in the summer as a free agent and kept their current starters together, but maybe they can trade a few players in the summer they got in the trade for some big guys to give the team some height as they'll need it to match the Celtics & Lakers if they want to become a team challenging for the NBA championship. The T'wolves got Randolph & Curry in the trade too and along with Love & Beasley they've got a decent team coming together.

Seemed like a better option.

Not true. All bets are off after the season because of the CBA and the lowering of future salaries.

I feel bad for Donnie Walsh. He spent two years cleaning up Isiah's mess. Now his legs are being cut from under him, courtesy of Isiah whispering in Dolan's ear.

[Edited 2/22/11 6:48am]

thetimefan said:

What do you think about the trade? Do you think the Knicks gave up too much?

Denver could have lost their star player with nothing in return, so they did good by making the trade and brought in Felton, Gallinari & Chandler, which is something decent to start with when they will be in a rebuilding process. Plus they've got Mozgov and the draft picks too. If they can keep ahold of JR Smith, Kenyon Martin & Nene then Denver will no doubt still be a team challenging for a playoff spot.

I think the Knicks did give up too much (4 players plus draft picks), when they could have waited to sign Melo in the summer as a free agent and kept their current starters together, but maybe they can trade a few players in the summer they got in the trade for some big guys to give the team some height as they'll need it to match the Celtics & Lakers if they want to become a team challenging for the NBA championship. The T'wolves got Randolph & Curry in the trade too and along with Love & Beasley they've got a decent team coming together.

uPtoWnNY said:

Graycap23 said:

How ya feeling big dawg?

I'm glad we finally got another star, but there's no height on this team - forget about defense and rebounding.

And it looks like Brain-Dead Dolan won't give Donnie Walsh an extension. That means the lowlife scumbag Isiah is coming back. I'll revolt if that happens.

At least Isiah's boy Eddy Curry is gone. He and Randolph were shipped to Minnesota for Corey Brewer.

The best forward tandem in the NBA in a LONG time.

I'd go with Billups, Fields, Carmelo, Amar'e and Turiaf as my starting five.

Knicks are supposedly looking at Earl Barron and/or Jeff Foster.

That's a good point, however the new CBA will be dependent upon the players and the teams GMs/NBA management agreeing upon a collective bargain agreement which is beneficial to both parties. If they don't agree, there will be a lock out again like there was back in the late 90's and/or possibly a shortened season.

IMO, the Knicks are now in quite a similar position to what the Heat are. Miami have got three quality players in LeBron, D-Wade and Chris Bosh but because of their salaries and the salary cap, they can't bring in anyone else of a similar quality, therefore they had to patch together a team for this season.

Right now the Knicks have Melo, Billups, Fields and Stoudamire which I agree is a squad they can build on. But Billups is towards the end of his career and Landry Fields is a rookie so they can't expect too much out of him yet. I'm assuming NY will be trading the guys they got in the Melo trade (maybe keeping Corey Brewer) or having them as bench players. Like I said they've traded away four big guys (Gallinari's 6ft 10, Mozgov is 7ft 1, Randolph is 6ft 11 and Curry is 7ft) and when you're competing against the Lakers who have Gasol, Bynum and Odom and the Celtics with Davis, Shaq, Garnett, Perkins and Jermaine O'Neal, they'll be at a disadvantage and they need that presence if they want to compete for the championship.

However if they kept the players I mentioned and signed Melo in the summer you'd have Felton at Point Guard, Landy Fields at Shooting Guard, Turiaf at Center, Melo at Small Forward and Stoudamire at Power Forward - or maybe interchanging Gallinari at PF and Stoudamire playing at center which IMO is a solid team. Plus you'd have Mozgov as a backup center, Chandler as a backup forward too. Now the Knicks are kinda limited with a starting line up (Billups at PG, Fields as a SG, Turiaf at Center, Melo at SF and Stoudamire as PF) which is still good, but overall on paper the Knicks would have been stronger without losing the guys they did in the trade.

I agree that without Melo that the Knicks would probably not be contending for the championship in the next two seasons, however they could have brought in maybe Deron Williams or Chris Paul as free agents in the near future to team up with Stoudamire with their existing unit they did have (Felton, Gallinari et al). Although the Knicks in the summer have the option of bringing in guys like Zach Randolph, Shannon Brown, Kenyon Martin, Nene, Glen Davis & Jason Richardson who are unrestricted free agents in the summer. Tim Duncan and Tony Parker are too but I'm assuming they will be signing again with the Spurs. But again this would be dependent on the players salaries and who they can sign within the salary cap.

I'm hearing the Clippers are interested in Gallinari.

The Knicks will be a far better team with 'Melo than they were without him, but they're not championship material yet. However, pending the CBA negotiatons, they are in line to land maybe one more impact player and contend for the NBA title. But they have to improve their defense, and they still have to contend with the Celtics, Heat, Bulls, and Magic.

728huey said:

The Knicks will be a far better team with 'Melo than they were without him, but they're not championship material yet. However, pending the CBA negotiatons, they are in line to land maybe one more impact player and contend for the NBA title. But they have to improve their defense, and they still have to contend with the Celtics, Heat, Bulls, and Magic.

This is a two, three-year project.

Deron Williams is heading to the Nets.

[Edited 2/23/11 8:04am]

uPtoWnNY said:

Deron Williams is heading to the Nets.

Utah has agreed to trade All-Star point guard Deron Williams to Nets in multi-player package, Yahoo! Sports has learned. Deal is done.

Favors will go to Jazz wi...c to Nets.

[Edited 2/23/11 8:04am]

Stupid move by the Nets. Williams has given them no assurances he'll stay once his contract is up. Shit, he could go across the Hudson.

Cavs trade Mo Williams and Jamario Moon to the Clippers for Baron Davis and a pick.

Hawks trade Mike Bibby, Maurice Evans, Jordan Crawford and a pick to the Wizards for Kirk Hinrich and Hilton Armstrong.

More moves;

Kendrick Perkins and Nate Robinson to OKC for Green and Krstic
Thabeet and a MEM 1st Rounder to HOU for Battier
Aaron Brooks to Suns for Dragic and 1st Rounder
Gerald Wallace to POR for Joel Przybilla and a 2nd round pick
Nazr Mohammed to OKC for DJ White and Mo Pete
Marquis Daniels to SAC for cash

Celtics' Harangody and Erden for a CLE 2nd Rounder

OJ Mayo to IND for Josh McRoberts and a 1st Rounder