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Thread started 01/27/20 4:05am

MattyJam

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MJ "Heaven Can Wait"

One of the dopest tracks on Invincible:

[Edited 1/27/20 4:14am]

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Reply #1 posted 01/27/20 8:41am

AvocadosMax

I feel it lingers on a bit like most of MJ’s ballads/slow rnb jams in his later career. But i do like the song

Unbreakable is awesome. I still don’t have a hq copy of ‘Shout’. Maybe I’ll make out what he’s saying if its in good sound quality lol

Oh and Threatened is so cool.
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Reply #2 posted 01/27/20 9:34am

alphastreet

It’s a pretty song, it even charted at the bottom of the r&b/hip hop singles chart cause it got airplay
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Reply #3 posted 01/27/20 11:22am

CoolMF

Good tune and a solid album. I always felt that it shoulda been placed somewhere different on the album as it comes right after Break Of Dawn- which is a similiar sounding but better tune (in my extremely humble opinion).

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Reply #4 posted 01/27/20 11:39am

alphastreet

CoolMF said:

Good tune and a solid album. I always felt that it shoulda been placed somewhere different on the album as it comes right after Break Of Dawn- which is a similiar sounding but better tune (in my extremely humble opinion).



I also like break of dawn slightly better
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Reply #5 posted 01/28/20 8:13pm

RODSERLING

With a music video and a live performance, it would have been a bit in the USA for sure.
One of its greatest vocal performance ever.
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Reply #6 posted 01/28/20 8:43pm

alphastreet

It’s a shame he didn’t want to tour for invincible, it would have been a hit for sure
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Reply #7 posted 01/29/20 11:21am

nextedition

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There is something off with the tracks of Invinceble. I can no really put my finger on it, but it doesnt sound fresh. Maybe there are too many layers, not enough real intruments.

Its a good song struture, but compare this to Human Nature for example. Human Nataure is timeles, with Haven can wait the production is so full, its lacks emotion, its actually dull.

Just my opinion....

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Reply #8 posted 01/29/20 11:59am

StrangeButTrue

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nextedition said:

There is something off with the tracks of Invinceble. I can no really put my finger on it, but it doesnt sound fresh. Maybe there are too many layers, not enough real intruments.

Its a good song struture, but compare this to Human Nature for example. Human Nataure is timeles, with Haven can wait the production is so full, its lacks emotion, its actually dull.

Just my opinion....

.

Rodney Jerkins stuff is so dated now, its like new jack swing productions it sorta is stuck in time, incompatible with modern sound but critical to its development. I know Teddy Riley produced Heaven Can Wait but the non-Darkchild Invincible stuff is superior IMHO.

if it was just a dream, call me a dreamer 2
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Reply #9 posted 01/29/20 4:54pm

rdhull

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Ive always thought MJ should have done an unplugged during this era. The songs from Invincible seemed ready made for that setting to accentuate his voice/grace with an aoustic setting.

"Climb in my fur."
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Reply #10 posted 01/29/20 5:56pm

alphastreet

rdhull said:

Ive always thought MJ should have done an unplugged during this era. The songs from Invincible seemed ready made for that setting to accentuate his voice/grace with an aoustic setting.



I agree he should have promoted the new work better, too bad about the Sony mess
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Reply #11 posted 01/31/20 1:49pm

SoulAlive

it's a great song music on this album,I think the slower tracks are superior to the uptempo stuff

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Reply #12 posted 01/31/20 2:57pm

alphastreet

The slow songs definitely are the strong point of the album though the fast ones are ok but not as good as the fast ones on Dangerous
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Reply #13 posted 02/01/20 3:48am

RODSERLING

rdhull said:

Ive always thought MJ should have done an unplugged during this era. The songs from Invincible seemed ready made for that setting to accentuate his voice/grace with an aoustic setting.



From an orchestra in Poland :
.

https://youtu.be/3UHbyt9DgfU
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Reply #14 posted 02/01/20 9:53am

Free2BMe

MattyJam said:

One of the dopest tracks on Invincible:




[Edited 1/27/20 4:14am]



I agree that it is ONE of the dopest tracks on Invincible. I also LOVE “Butterflies”, “Break Of Dawn”, “Whatever Happens” and “You Rock My World”. R & B radio absolutely loved those songs, especially Butterflies. Sony f*#@$* up this album by not promoting it at all and basically did everything to sabotage it. A former Sony executive admitted what Sony did, after Michael’s murder/death.
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Reply #15 posted 02/01/20 10:49am

alphastreet

Butterflies was a hit on r&b radio and had potential to become an even bigger hit. Even whatever happens has potential, my coworker was playing it on his phone the other day
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Reply #16 posted 02/01/20 2:07pm

RODSERLING

Butterflies was a hit in the US thanks to Sony's payola and Eve's remix, and against MJ's bad faith who didn't want to shoot a music video for it. Preventing the song to be a biggest hit than it was already.

.
Whatever happens would have been a worldwide #1 hit, but neither Sony nor Michael thought about releasing it on single.
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Reply #17 posted 02/01/20 2:22pm

alphastreet

RODSERLING said:

Butterflies was a hit in the US thanks to Sony's payola and Eve's remix, and against MJ's bad faith who didn't want to shoot a music video for it. Preventing the song to be a biggest hit than it was already.

.
Whatever happens would have been a worldwide #1 hit, but neither Sony nor Michael thought about releasing it on single.


So sony did do payola for butterflies? Mj should have just gone ahead with the video cause it was stalled at #14. It was like a new remember the time for the 00s decade
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Reply #18 posted 02/02/20 2:56pm

RODSERLING

alphastreet said:

RODSERLING said:

Butterflies was a hit in the US thanks to Sony's payola and Eve's remix, and against MJ's bad faith who didn't want to shoot a music video for it. Preventing the song to be a biggest hit than it was already.

.
Whatever happens would have been a worldwide #1 hit, but neither Sony nor Michael thought about releasing it on single.


So sony did do payola for butterflies? Mj should have just gone ahead with the video cause it was stalled at #14. It was like a new remember the time for the 00s decade


I wish that too.
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Reply #19 posted 02/02/20 3:31pm

alphastreet

RODSERLING said:

alphastreet said:



So sony did do payola for butterflies? Mj should have just gone ahead with the video cause it was stalled at #14. It was like a new remember the time for the 00s decade


I wish that too.


I can’t imagine what kind of video it would have been but he may have pleasantly surprised us
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Reply #20 posted 02/02/20 4:14pm

Doalwa

The slow jams on Invincible were all amazing.

The uptempo tracks sound pretty dated nowadays unfortunately.
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Reply #21 posted 02/02/20 5:20pm

MattyJam

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Doalwa said:

The slow jams on Invincible were all amazing.

The uptempo tracks sound pretty dated nowadays unfortunately.


The only uptempos which I would say sound dated would be Privacy and the title track. I think YRMW, Unbreakable and Threatened have all held up pretty well over the years. 2000 Watts and Heartbreaker were going for uber-futuristic in 2001, and don't sound dated today, but perhaps not quite as fresh as they were 19 years ago.
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Reply #22 posted 02/02/20 5:31pm

alphastreet

MattyJam said:

Doalwa said:

The slow jams on Invincible were all amazing.

The uptempo tracks sound pretty dated nowadays unfortunately.


The only uptempos which I would say sound dated would be Privacy and the title track. I think YRMW, Unbreakable and Threatened have all held up pretty well over the years. 2000 Watts and Heartbreaker were going for uber-futuristic in 2001, and don't sound dated today, but perhaps not quite as fresh as they were 19 years ago.


2000 watts aged well but Heartbreaker sounds like many 90s r&b songs though I also like it
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Reply #23 posted 02/03/20 9:18am

RODSERLING

alphastreet said:

RODSERLING said:



I wish that too.


I can’t imagine what kind of video it would have been but he may have pleasantly surprised us


The Cry music video cost one million dollars. Sony really felt cheated, because MJ was supposed to be in it...But he refused to take a plane shortly after 9/11 to shoot his sequence ( he was to appear in the last choruses in the middle of the crowd)
.
CRY was supposed to be an international single, hence the 1 million budget.
BTFLS was only an American single, so it s fair to say the budget offered to MJ for the music video was about half a million dollars ( much more than Alicia Keys or Usher budget).
.
MJ felt offended. Moreover, the music video was supposed to be the more hype remix with Eve, whereas MJ wanted to highlight the original track.
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Reply #24 posted 02/03/20 9:28am

RODSERLING

Doalwa said:

The slow jams on Invincible were all amazing.

The uptempo tracks sound pretty dated nowadays unfortunately.


Clearly, Sony wanted to position MJ in the US as a slow jam singer.

Sony informed the rnb radio that played BTFLS that the next single would be Heaven Can Wait, with a single promo supposed to be released in April of 2002.
So by April, many rnb radios played "the new single" Heaven Can Wait, but Sony cancelled the promo release and never payed payola, so the song went off the air without having peaked at its potential.
.
The 4th American single was to be Break Of Dawn. That was still the plan when Sony released Number Ones in 2003, hence its presence on the greatest hits.
.
Sadly, this plan was scrapped because of the accusations of pedophily.
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Reply #25 posted 02/03/20 10:25am

alphastreet

RODSERLING said:

alphastreet said:



I can’t imagine what kind of video it would have been but he may have pleasantly surprised us


The Cry music video cost one million dollars. Sony really felt cheated, because MJ was supposed to be in it...But he refused to take a plane shortly after 9/11 to shoot his sequence ( he was to appear in the last choruses in the middle of the crowd)
.
CRY was supposed to be an international single, hence the 1 million budget.
BTFLS was only an American single, so it s fair to say the budget offered to MJ for the music video was about half a million dollars ( much more than Alicia Keys or Usher budget).
.
MJ felt offended. Moreover, the music video was supposed to be the more hype remix with Eve, whereas MJ wanted to highlight the original track.


Didn’t know that about wanting the eve version to be a video. The original is so much nicer and well produced. Also didn’t know he was supposed to be in Cry. That was a great song as well
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Reply #26 posted 02/03/20 10:42am

PatrickS77

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rdhull said:

Ive always thought MJ should have done an unplugged during this era. The songs from Invincible seemed ready made for that setting to accentuate his voice/grace with an aoustic setting.

Excatly. Don't walk away, Whatever happens, Butterfly, Heaven can wait, Speechless, Break of dawn... through in some classics and it would have been perfect. Especially considering he didn't want to tour.

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Reply #27 posted 02/03/20 10:44am

PatrickS77

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alphastreet said:

RODSERLING said:
I wish that too.
I can’t imagine what kind of video it would have been but he may have pleasantly surprised us

Nah. Considering he looked like shit in that era ('01/'02), it's probably best there weren't any more videos.

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Reply #28 posted 02/03/20 10:57am

alphastreet

PatrickS77 said:



alphastreet said:


RODSERLING said:
I wish that too.

I can’t imagine what kind of video it would have been but he may have pleasantly surprised us


Nah. Considering he looked like shit in that era ('01/'02), it's probably best there weren't any more videos.



I agree it was distracting that he wasn’t able to smile anymore. It was disheartening to watch cause he had an amazing smile

This thread inspired me to put on Invincible and I’m still enjoying it
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Reply #29 posted 02/03/20 3:59pm

RODSERLING

PatrickS77 said:



alphastreet said:


RODSERLING said:
I wish that too.

I can’t imagine what kind of video it would have been but he may have pleasantly surprised us


Nah. Considering he looked like shit in that era ('01/'02), it's probably best there weren't any more videos.



That's the very key to this whole Invincible era failure.
.
MJ tried to figure out ways and ways to cover his face for the music videos. In YRMW, there is a digitalised shadow on his face, in the MSG concert he wanted to make his skin less pale Compared to his brothers, which was ridiculous, and the Unbreakable video was supposed to cover and distract from his face and skin with millions dollars special effects.
.
MJ fired two directors in the spring of 2001 for Unbreakable. The project was too ambitious, MJ needed more time, then MJ accused Mottola to give him shit concepts for the music video.
If Sony listened to MJ, Invincible would have been pushed back to the spring of 2002, by the least.

The sad truth is that MJ didn't need big budgets at all to impress a worldwide audience. He just had to show up, dancing and singing with stylised background to make a music video.

Just like that :
https://youtu.be/1optV11VTTU
.
People just wanted to see MJ at the time to connect with him. But he didn't have the confidence to do so. He thought it wasn't enough.
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Forums > Music: Non-Prince > MJ "Heaven Can Wait"