The other thread locked itself ............ Continuing with a new one.

Please use this thread to discuss everything and anything MJ.

Any created threads will automatically get the and be directed to this sticky.

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wow,

I was driving my car today, and was about to pull out my Dangerous CD to play WILL YOU BE THERE, I have all my music stored in my arm rest compartment, and I pulled out the CD to place in the player...

but after choosing track 11, the CD kept catching and the song wouldn't play

I pulled it out and noticed a crack on the surface side

wow, that really hit....

I owned the original cd version of Dangerous from the time the album was actually released

still had the original cd casing...never bought the special edition version

21 years and now I have to get another copy

[Edited 1/19/13 21:10pm]

[Edited 1/19/13 21:11pm]

[img:$uid]http://images.christianpost.com/full/57753/arnold-klein-and-prince-michael-jackson.jpg?w=262[/img:$uid]

Though Michael Jackson claimed he fathered all three of his children, there have always been rumors that he used a sperm donor.

Now, the late pop star's former dermatologist, Dr. Arnold Klein, appears to be hinting that he's the biological father of Jackson's 15-year-old son, Prince Michael.

TMZ reports that Klein po...on Jan. 17, showing a side-by-side comparison of Prince Michael and Klein when he was younger, and wrote "hmmmmm."

The resemblance between Klein and Prince Michael is almost uncanny, and if that's not a hint of admission, we don't know what is -- but we're torn since Klein went on record denying that he wasn't the father. Shortly after Jackson's death, Klein told Diane Sawyer i...nterview:

"To the best of my knowledge, I am not the father of these children. I can't answer it in any other way. I don't want to feed any of this insanity that is going around."

Klein was rumored to have fathered Jackson's eldest son and his daughter Paris, because Jackson met his ex-wife Debbie Rowe (who would give birth to his two oldest children) when she worked for Klein at his office.

So why would MJ need a surrogate sperm doner ???? If this is true would that mean MJ was shooting blanks or possibly MJ has never had sex with any woman

But this can only be cleared up with a simple DNA test.

luv4u said:

So why would MJ need a surrogate sperm doner ???? If this is true would that mean MJ was shooting blanks or possibly MJ has never had sex with any woman

But this can only be cleared up with a simple DNA test.

You may have missed this sentence. ""To the best of my knowledge, I am not the father of these children. I can't answer it in any other way. I don't want to feed any of this insanity that is going around." Anyways, Klein is crazy. Didn't some authority require his sanity test recently or something like that?

I can't see how anyone on this planet,

regardless of race, creed, or color can believe Michael Jackson fathered those 3 kids

that's absolutely mindboggling to me

I can't see how anyone can take it seriously and defend it

I love Mike, I god honestly do, his musical message has meant so much to me in my life

but it's going to be a great day when word finally comes out he didn't father them kids because I want to see the reaction of those who believe this when the truth comes out

but the truth is already out, all one has to do is look at them, and then look at Michael Jackson in his natural state before he began his plastic surgery odyssey...

Scorp said:

I can't see how anyone on this planet,

regardless of race, creed, or color can believe Michael Jackson fathered those 3 kids

that's absolutely mindboggling to me

I can't see how anyone can take it seriously and defend it

I love Mike, I god honestly do, his musical message has meant so much to me in my life

but it's going to be a great day when word finally comes out he didn't father them kids because I want to see the reaction of those who believe this when the truth comes out

but the truth is already out, all one has to do is look at them, and then look at Michael Jackson in his natural state before he began his plastic surgery odyssey...

All that's out is some tabloid rubbish. It's been discussed million times over here, so I won't get into that. Believe what you wanna believe, but stop pretending you have some proof to your "truth".

Scorp said:

I can't see how anyone on this planet,

regardless of race, creed, or color can believe Michael Jackson fathered those 3 kids

that's absolutely mindboggling to me

for me it is also a mystery ....

especially on the first two children.

LiLi1992 said:

Scorp said:

I can't see how anyone on this planet,

regardless of race, creed, or color can believe Michael Jackson fathered those 3 kids

that's absolutely mindboggling to me

for me it is also a mystery ....

especially on the first two children.

And that's why all these people should also question whether they are truly biologically related.

http://thestudyofracialism.org/viewtopic.php?t=1567

Michael naturally was very dark, he had at least 6 "dark" allele out of 8.
Even if Debbie has all 8 "light" allele (although this is rare, 99% of white people have 1-2 "dark" allele), the chance that these children could be born from Michael - 0.01%.
Yes, sometimes there are genetic failures, but two times in a row - fiction.

fans are so fond of using these rare photographs, when black parents gave born completely white children. but there are very, very exceptional cases, in which are usually one parent at least a bi-racial, with not more than 4-5 "dark" alleles, and other - white.

maybe I'll post pictures of children who were born from the union of a white mother and a black father, and 99.9% of them have obvious external signs of both races.

come on here.

LiLi1992 said:

Michael naturally was very dark, he had at least 6 "dark" allele out of 8.
Even if Debbie has all 8 "light" allele (although this is rare, 99% of white people have 1-2 "dark" allele), the chance that these children could be born from Michael - 0.01%.
Yes, sometimes there are genetic failures, but two times in a row - fiction.

fans are so fond of using these rare photographs, when black parents gave born completely white children. but there are very, very exceptional cases, in which are usually one parent at least a bi-racial, with not more than 4-5 "dark" alleles, and other - white.

maybe I'll post pictures of children who were born from the union of a white mother and a black father, and 99.9% of them have obvious external signs of both races.

come on here.

Blah blah blah

It doesnt matter if they are biologically his or not.

He fathered them, raised them and they were his period...

mjscarousal said:

It doesnt matter if they are biologically his or not.

He fathered them, raised them and they were his period...

absolutely.
You can become a father because of the love and care of the child, it is more important than biology.

I come into this thread to look at this animation

back and forth, back and forth ... it's hypnosis

LiLi1992 said:

back and forth, back and forth ... it's hypnosis

Isn't it??

dag said:

Scorp said:

I can't see how anyone on this planet,

regardless of race, creed, or color can believe Michael Jackson fathered those 3 kids

that's absolutely mindboggling to me

I can't see how anyone can take it seriously and defend it

I love Mike, I god honestly do, his musical message has meant so much to me in my life

but it's going to be a great day when word finally comes out he didn't father them kids because I want to see the reaction of those who believe this when the truth comes out

but the truth is already out, all one has to do is look at them, and then look at Michael Jackson in his natural state before he began his plastic surgery odyssey...

All that's out is some tabloid rubbish. It's been discussed million times over here, so I won't get into that. Believe what you wanna believe, but stop pretending you have some proof to your "truth".

it aint my truth...truth has no respect of persons

he didn't father either one of those kids, who will so be grown, and then we'll see what's up then

and HE was the person who brought attention to it bring attention to himself to remain in the public eye......

it's really a terrible situation, especially for the youngest kid, he doesn't have a clue who his real parents are, mother or father....

he was the person who first said he didn't know the biological mother of the youngest kid personaly but then 30 seconds later said he not only knew the mother but that she was black

whereas one time, the fans defiantly defended this entire situtation and said w/out doubt he fathered them, but now, many are saying even if he's not the father, he raised (which the nanny was really raising them) them, because they know deep down in their heart, he didn't father either one of them.....

if someone put their paycheck up as a bet, they wallet would be as empty as the air flowing thru it....

[Edited 1/21/13 18:21pm]

dag said:

All that's out is some tabloid rubbish. It's been discussed million times over here, so I won't get into that. Believe what you wanna believe, but stop pretending you have some proof to your "truth".

Truth my ass. Those that throw that up always post the most baseless nonsense.

And it's one thing if you express you don't think they're his kids. But to go on and on and on and post essays about it is just wacky, IMO.

I've been on the net since 97 and never have I posted anything really about the kids paternity. I just don't care. I'm just grateful that these kids brought some happiness to MJ in his later years.

LiLi1992 said:

Michael naturally was very dark, he had at least 6 "dark" allele out of 8.
Even if Debbie has all 8 "light" allele (although this is rare, 99% of white people have 1-2 "dark" allele), the chance that these children could be born from Michael - 0.01%.
Yes, sometimes there are genetic failures, but two times in a row - fiction.

fans are so fond of using these rare photographs, when black parents gave born completely white children. but there are very, very exceptional cases, in which are usually one parent at least a bi-racial, with not more than 4-5 "dark" alleles, and other - white.

maybe I'll post pictures of children who were born from the union of a white mother and a black father, and 99.9% of them have obvious external signs of both races.

come on here.

With all due respect, I don't think you've seen very many black people if you believe MJ was "very" dark, even in his younger days. And the reason this is a very passionate issue for a lot of people is because they DO have mixed-race families whose colors range from very dark to very light, without adoption. Sure, it would be pretty unusual for that to have happened 3 times, but the arguments I see on this thread are always really ignorant and phrased in a way that's kind of offensive to people from mixed race families, where a huge variety of shades is common. A lot of you are essentially erasing others' reality with the way you make your arguments, and I'm guessing those who are doing it have very little familiarity with mixed race families.

I've noticed that when this topic comes up, the people who say the kids could biologically be MJ's cite the range of shades within their own families. So, this is clearly coming from a place of personal experience and sometimes personal pain due to the ignorance a lot of folks still have regarding mixed families. Despite knowing this about other posters, some of you still make absolutist statements like, "There's NO WAY those kids are biologically his." Um, yes, there is. Sure, the odds aren't great that they are (since it's happened three times) but stop it with the absolutist statements. That's what I think people who get defensive are objecting to. Unless you come from a mixed race family, you really don't know what you're talking about or how it feels to have your family's reality erased like that. It's not just this one scenario, it's a lifetime of people saying things like that over and over again about YOUR OWN FAMILY.

[Edited 1/22/13 0:08am]

I am making subtitles into my mother tongue. Could you please help me with certain lines?

What does Mike mean at 4:50 when he says "I've had a few/flu"?

And here at the very beginning, does he say that nobody is or was interested in Billie Jean?

At 0:36? What does the man say "All you gotta do ??? "

And at 0:46 Geraldo says something to Randy about being in studio? And then at 0:53 something about "bro"? And what about at 1:02?

And what does Michael say at 1:17? Thanks a lot.

[Edited 1/22/13 0:45am]

LiLi1992 said: Michael naturally was very dark, he had at least 6 "dark" allele out of 8.

Even if Debbie has all 8 "light" allele (although this is rare, 99% of white people have 1-2 "dark" allele), the chance that these children could be born from Michael - 0.01%.
Yes, sometimes there are genetic failures, but two times in a row - fiction.

I thought skin color is not just linked to or affected by a single gene but rather a polygenic trait. So I don't really understand what you meant by dark/light alleles?

LiLi1992 said: maybe I'll post pictures of children who were born from the union of a white mother and a black father, and 99.9% of them have obvious external signs of both races.

Extremely vague statement with a made-up number.

Emancipation89 said:

Scorp said:

it aint my truth...truth has no respect of persons

he didn't father either one of those kids, who will so be grown, and then we'll see what's up then

You're saying what you t.h.i.n.k. based on mere observations (...from google image results?) is the absolute truth.

"They are ALL MJ's biological kids because Michael said so."

"None of them are MJ's biological kids because they DON'T look like him."

"There's no way he/she's black because he or she doesn't LOOK black"

These are all equally stupid statements if you ask me. Are you really that arrogant that you can never agree to keep your mind open about the possibility of at least one of them being MJ's biological child?

I thought skin color is not just linked to or affected by a single gene but rather a polygenic trait. So I don't really understand what you meant by dark/light alleles?

I don't need google to formulate conclusion

this situation occured before Google was even founded

this has nothing to do w/arrogance....if anyone was arrogant, unfortunately it was him for thinking the greater public would go along w/this publicity seeking grab

that's why he posed these 3 kids, because unfortunately, he figured if he had children of his own, they would have been born visibly black, and that wouldn't garner the attention someone of his stature grew accustomed to receiving

and in a warped way, due to the racial conflict that still exists to this very day, but has taken on a different context, he was right

because for the past 16 years, conversions continue as to whether he fathered those 3 kids

the youngest kid, the man said in that documentary, he didn't have a clue who the mother was, or what the race of the mother was, then 30 seconds later, when he knew that wasn't going to fly (and it was 30 seconds on the dot), he switches tune and said the mother was black KNOWING he was being forthright, even had this sly look on his face,

that youngest kid, conceived intravenously, was given birth by a mexican nurse

so if that's the case, the mother wasn't black, and the only reason he responded like that was because Bashir said "it's probably safe to say the child's mother isn't black"

and considering the lies this man told to the public for the better part of his life after reaching his career pinnacle, how can anyone believe he fathered those 3 kids

I never believed Michael was guilty of molesting children, I never felt that for a second...

the reason that whole accusation surfaced was because those opportunists who led this man to undergo racial neutralizing plastic surgery realized the nature of his surgery was on the verge of being revealed in 1993 and they didn't want that to happen, because what happened to this guy physically (even if he thought he wanted that) was criminal

those two oldest kids are white, from direct european continental lineage, you know it, and I know it

and if a person has to "open their mind" to consider that he MAY be the biological father of one of those kids, that should be a red flag right there

mookie said:

dag said:

All that's out is some tabloid rubbish. It's been discussed million times over here, so I won't get into that. Believe what you wanna believe, but stop pretending you have some proof to your "truth".

Truth my ass. Those that throw that up always post the most baseless nonsense.

And it's one thing if you express you don't think they're his kids. But to go on and on and on and post essays about it is just wacky, IMO.

I've been on the net since 97 and never have I posted anything really about the kids paternity. I just don't care. I'm just grateful that these kids brought some happiness to MJ in his later years.

Great Post.

This is pretty much it in a nutshell.

Scorp said:

Emancipation89 said:

I don't need google to formulate conclusion

this situation occured before Google was even founded

this has nothing to do w/arrogance....if anyone was arrogant, unfortunately it was him for thinking the greater public would go along w/this publicity seeking grab

that's why he posed these 3 kids, because unfortunately, he figured if he had children of his own, they would have been born visibly black, and that wouldn't garner the attention someone of his stature grew accustomed to receiving

and in a warped way, due to the racial conflict that still exists to this very day, but has taken on a different context, he was right

because for the past 16 years, conversions continue as to whether he fathered those 3 kids

the youngest kid, the man said in that documentary, he didn't have a clue who the mother was, or what the race of the mother was, then 30 seconds later, when he knew that wasn't going to fly (and it was 30 seconds on the dot), he switches tune and said the mother was black KNOWING he was being forthright, even had this sly look on his face,

that youngest kid, conceived intravenously, was given birth by a mexican nurse

so if that's the case, the mother wasn't black, and the only reason he responded like that was because Bashir said "it's probably safe to say the child's mother isn't black"

and considering the lies this man told to the public for the better part of his life after reaching his career pinnacle, how can anyone believe he fathered those 3 kids

I never believed Michael was guilty of molesting children, I never felt that for a second...

the reason that whole accusation surfaced was because those opportunists who led this man to undergo racial neutralizing plastic surgery realized the nature of his surgery was on the verge of being revealed in 1993 and they didn't want that to happen, because what happened to this guy physically (even if he thought he wanted that) was criminal

those two oldest kids are white, from direct european continental lineage, you know it, and I know it

and if a person has to "open their mind" to consider that he MAY be the biological father of one of those kids, that should be a red flag right there

He said many things in that documentary. He also said that the first kids were concieved naturally, but Bashit cut that out. Remember Take Two? And it always amazes me how everyone keeps on forgetting that he also said that the mother was his exgirlfriend who did not want any publicity, so they even signed a contract to make sure her identity would never be revealed. The rest is just my opinion, but the fact that he went later on with that surrogate story could also mean he was only trying to further protect her becuase he knew how easily the public would accept this version because most people don't believe he had sex with women which also proves the fact that LMP has been asked about it in almost every interview she's done. The public and press was happy with this explanation and don't bother to search for her true identity. And also let's not forget that Mike did have a habbit of keeping those thing secret. We found out about his LMP marriage several months later, about Debbie late in her pregnancy and about Blanket's existence when he was already several months old when he dangled him on that balcony. Till his death we didn't even know what his kids looked like which is also pretty amazing accomplishment considering his fame.

[Edited 1/22/13 8:31am]

Scorp said:

Emancipation89 said:

I don't need google to formulate conclusion

this situation occured before Google was even founded

this has nothing to do w/arrogance....if anyone was arrogant, unfortunately it was him for thinking the greater public would go along w/this publicity seeking grab

that's why he posed these 3 kids, because unfortunately, he figured if he had children of his own, they would have been born visibly black, and that wouldn't garner the attention someone of his stature grew accustomed to receiving

and in a warped way, due to the racial conflict that still exists to this very day, but has taken on a different context, he was right

because for the past 16 years, conversions continue as to whether he fathered those 3 kids

the youngest kid, the man said in that documentary, he didn't have a clue who the mother was, or what the race of the mother was, then 30 seconds later, when he knew that wasn't going to fly (and it was 30 seconds on the dot), he switches tune and said the mother was black KNOWING he was being forthright, even had this sly look on his face,

that youngest kid, conceived intravenously, was given birth by a mexican nurse

so if that's the case, the mother wasn't black, and the only reason he responded like that was because Bashir said "it's probably safe to say the child's mother isn't black"

and considering the lies this man told to the public for the better part of his life after reaching his career pinnacle, how can anyone believe he fathered those 3 kids

I never believed Michael was guilty of molesting children, I never felt that for a second...

the reason that whole accusation surfaced was because those opportunists who led this man to undergo racial neutralizing plastic surgery realized the nature of his surgery was on the verge of being revealed in 1993 and they didn't want that to happen, because what happened to this guy physically (even if he thought he wanted that) was criminal

those two oldest kids are white, from direct european continental lineage, you know it, and I know it

and if a person has to "open their mind" to consider that he MAY be the biological father of one of those kids, that should be a red flag right there

You do realize that Arnie Klein is not a good source right? He has mental issues and needs money, he is also a person that can't be trusted. He claimed MJ was gay or something like that in 2010, in which one of his fav clients/confidents Liz Taylor (one of MJs best friends) got insulted and stopped being his "friend". So if a person that knows him personally for a long period of time got offended, why should anyone else believe anything this man says?

None of us really know nothing about MJ except the little things we have heard, read or seen in interviews. We don't know if his older children are white either, head over to racist sites (that discuss the pureness of white celebrities) and most of them don't think they look white either. They are mixed, because I doubt Arnie and Debbie genes would produce a child like Paris or Prince, Arnie being jewish from german heritage and Debbie having some polish/russian ancestry I believe they wouldn't produce children so tanned or with such facial features, I could see this being true if one of the parents were from southern europe (greek, spanish, italian, portuguese, romanian, french) because while many of these populations are ethnically white, some are darker than other european whites of germanic or slavic heritage. So no sir, we don't for know certain if they are of european lineage. He is their father nontheless though.

Also what about Blanket? Where did he get those eyes from? That nose and that curly hair of his, that they always straighten? He looks like Michael and he resembles his latino/colombian cousins (his cousins are of amerindian ancestry (their mother Alexandra) hence they are a bit tanner than Blanket).

[Edited 1/22/13 10:36am]

GoldDolphin said:

Scorp said:

I don't need google to formulate conclusion

this situation occured before Google was even founded

this has nothing to do w/arrogance....if anyone was arrogant, unfortunately it was him for thinking the greater public would go along w/this publicity seeking grab

that's why he posed these 3 kids, because unfortunately, he figured if he had children of his own, they would have been born visibly black, and that wouldn't garner the attention someone of his stature grew accustomed to receiving

and in a warped way, due to the racial conflict that still exists to this very day, but has taken on a different context, he was right

because for the past 16 years, conversions continue as to whether he fathered those 3 kids

the youngest kid, the man said in that documentary, he didn't have a clue who the mother was, or what the race of the mother was, then 30 seconds later, when he knew that wasn't going to fly (and it was 30 seconds on the dot), he switches tune and said the mother was black KNOWING he was being forthright, even had this sly look on his face,

that youngest kid, conceived intravenously, was given birth by a mexican nurse

so if that's the case, the mother wasn't black, and the only reason he responded like that was because Bashir said "it's probably safe to say the child's mother isn't black"

and considering the lies this man told to the public for the better part of his life after reaching his career pinnacle, how can anyone believe he fathered those 3 kids

I never believed Michael was guilty of molesting children, I never felt that for a second...

the reason that whole accusation surfaced was because those opportunists who led this man to undergo racial neutralizing plastic surgery realized the nature of his surgery was on the verge of being revealed in 1993 and they didn't want that to happen, because what happened to this guy physically (even if he thought he wanted that) was criminal

those two oldest kids are white, from direct european continental lineage, you know it, and I know it

and if a person has to "open their mind" to consider that he MAY be the biological father of one of those kids, that should be a red flag right there

You do realize that Arnie Klein is not a good source right? He has mental issues and needs money, he is also a person that can't be trusted. He claimed MJ was gay or something like that in 2010, in which one of his fav clients/confidents Liz Taylor (one of MJs best friends) got insulted and stopped being his "friend". So if a person that knows him personally for a long period of time got offended, why should anyone else believe anything this man says?

None of us really know nothing about MJ except the little things we have heard, read or seen in interviews. We don't know if his older children are white either, head over to racist sites (that discuss the pureness of white celebrities) and most of them don't think they look white either. They are mixed, because I doubt Arnie and Debbie genes would produce a child like Paris or Prince, Arnie being jewish from german heritage and Debbie having some polish/russian ancestry I believe they wouldn't produce children so tanned or with such facial features, I could see this being true if one of the parents were from southern europe (greek, spanish, italian, portuguese, romanian, french) because while many of these populations are ethnically white, some are darker than other european whites of germanic or slavic heritage. So no sir, we don't for know certain if they are of european lineage. He is their father nontheless though.

Also what about Blanket? Where did he get those eyes from? That nose and that curly hair of his, that they always straighten? He looks like Michael and he resembles his latino/colombian cousins (his cousins are of amerindian ancestry (their mother Alexandra) hence they are a bit tanner than Blanket).

[Edited 1/22/13 10:36am]

see, I never mentioned Dr. Klein's name once.......

that's the thing, I don't need testimony from individuals who participated in this man's self destruction

I'm not going to get into hair texture and all that stuff about physical characteristics

the bottom line is this.....Michael Jackson, the king of pop, whoever you want to call him, the man who related Off the Wall, Thriller, Bad, Dangerous, History, and Invincible, that man did not father those 3 kids....cut and dry

see, you're answering your own question w/out categorically answering it

there's even been hints that Debbie Rowe is NOT biologically tied to those first two children and that she only served as a stone cold surrogate, to where the embryo was planted into her body

and if that's true, THAT means those first two kids were conceived thru vitro fertilization (aka test tube), and if that's the case, then THAT means, their real biological mother and father are floating around somewhere.....

you're dealing with a man who evolved into becoming the media manipulator we've ever seen, the cream of the crop w/it comes to media manipulation....he earned a PH.D in it, and he reveled in it to remain the subject of conversation as his career waned throughout after reaching the very pinnacle from 1983-1985

and he manipulated all the way to the day of 6/25/09.......

because from day one, the moment he signed with Motown, a label that preached crossover ambition, Michael was taught how to "lie" in order to enhance his public image as he was taught how to define it

if you had 50,000 bucks and someone asked you to bet it all, at 3 to 1 odds in favor of believing Michael fathered those kids, to where you stood a chance of losing it all or tripling your stash.....

would u do it?

[Edited 1/22/13 19:52pm]

Paris looks a LOT like a young Latoya.

Blanket definitely has MJ's features.

Priceless

http://www.the-michael-jackson-archives.com/main_content.html

Off The Wall Era

MJ Bad album commercial-Original not Bad 25

Scorp said:

And I actually would bet that money that MJ was the fathe of those Children. I'm from a mixed background myself and Ive always been interested in genetics and facial features. I find it quite amusing, that you completely ignore the similarity of hair and facial structure of blanket Jackson and his cousin Jermajesty (I don't know if I'm spelling the name correctly lol)... Remember That MJ is the only Jackson who had children with a white woman, the other siblings had children with Latinas (Afro-Latina/black&white/native) (Italian& mexican) (Arabian) (black/Asian) (colombian/meztisa). Also you say that those children might not even be Debbie rowes? Seriously? Look at Paris, she's a tanned version of her mother. But whatever, people are going to believe what they want.