GoldDolphin said:

Scorp said:

Gold Dolphin

you would lose all of your money bettin on this one, and it ain't even fair to you

you would have a better chance betting your money betting as to whether or not 1+1=3

yes, many of Michael's brothers fathered biracial children, but you see resemblance among Tito son's, Jermaine's sons to their father

Jermaine's first set of kids he had with his first wife Hazel who's black

and they fathered their children naturally

Tito's sons look strikingly like their father even though they are biracial

Michael Jackson went so far as to dyed the hair color of that oldest kid, bleach blond hair, and he did it when the kid was a baby

this is what it comes down to,

Michael Jackson bought 3 kids, 2 white, one mexican, used 2 surrogate mothers to bring forth those children and paid them, posed them to the world and said "I'm the king of pop, these kids are mine and because I'm the king of pop, this is true"

his fans believed it with open arms, and wouldn't have it any other way

and when 6/25/09 hit, the world, the commercial media, and to some extent, the greater public at large who have grown up during the age of political correctness favored those 3 kids, and pushed the other Jackson family kids out the window, because the oldest two are white, the youngest is mexican, and that's what led to teh chaos with the fake stun gun incident, which led to a SWAT team flying above the roof of the family home in Encino, which led to Katherine being forced to have all of her other grandchildren (real grandchildren) move out of the house after they had been living their for years becuase the majority of MJ fans DID NOT want anyone else around those 3 kids, because they were put on pedastals from jump street.

when he announced he was having his first child, I said to myself it wouldn't surprised me if he posed a white child, and sure enough he did....

[Edited 1/23/13 5:28am]

You know what? This post shows more of your insecurity and your fear of what black and mixed people are supposed to look like. You base your assumptions on thoughts made by white racists who believe that a biracial child MUST look like a 50 % mixture of both parents, since genetic teaches us that we are of different races (which of course is bogus - we are all Homo Sapiens Sapiens). These people don't comprehend that african-americans, Latin-americans, Native Americans (and other people of the americas post colonial times) are of mixed heritage and are not longer 100 % of one specific genetic group, hence you see more diversity of colored people of the Americas vs people who are isolated and haven't mixed at all.

I think you have me confused with someone else

the point about mixed people and different lineage ain't the problem

insecurities are rooted in lies.......

I don't have to post pictures to try and prove a point, taking one picture and comparing it to the next pic.....I don't have to role like that

it's just like a number of his fast post-Thriller that is who have posted pics on the internet, particularly youtube trying to prove he had vitiligo by taking photos and distorting them from the original take, photoshopping superimposed marks in a vain attempt

like this whack clip

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i_0zxCCGQ6Y&list=PLRlZmKA86qE2kVsOo3j6LH3mK3XzYt1nO&index=64

I want you to dabble and check out the period from 0:20-0:43

I want you to feed on how low this person stooped to prove a point that has no point

now you're talking a man who received the OFF THE WALL album as a gift when he was 8 years old

you're talking to a man who use to look at this album all the time to read the lyrics and the song credits....

this album cover has existed since 1979, I'm talking about the original album version, not the special edition that was released during the beginning of the past decade

I've seen this album countess times, this person post this crap up on youtube and out the box, after all these years, the album cover shows Michael Jackson with discoloration/spots on his hands

then this person had the nerve to circle the area of his hand and magnify the image to give an up close shot

if this person who posted this crap was a man, I would say he should have gone to jail

but sense she was a woman, she needs shock therapy

because what she posted was a load of bullshit, pardon my french

what this person posted, upholding this lie, is an insult to everyone who was a part of the black experience who grew up buying J5 records up until the point he released OFF THE WALL...

this man sold 20 million copies of OFF THE WALL, and nobody NOBODY...NOOOOOOOOOOBODY has a copy of that album showing spots on his hand.......

and u wanna know why, because it wasn't true

lieeesssssss...unadulturated, no holds barred

you think I have an agenda, well, that was the epidemy of what an agenda entails, to uphold the lie and make it go viral and she knows what she said was a lie because she superimposed the image to her liking...

you wanna talk about agenda

remember that documentary LIFE OF AN ICON released a couple of years ago

halfway into the special the special,

A black man involved in the music industry during the 70’s who I believe was associated with Motown said with clarity quote unquote “MICHAEL WAS UNDER TREMENDOUS PRESSURE, HERE’S A BLACK GUY, FROM THE INNER CITY WHO WAS THE DARLING OF WHITE SOCIETY…..HE HAD TO CHANGE”.

this is what he said of Michael back in 1975, as J5 was in the process of leaving Motown for Epic Records....

let me repeat what he said

“MICHAEL WAS UNDER TREMENDOUS PRESSURE, HERE’S A BLACK GUY, FROM THE INNER CITY WHO WAS THE DARLING OF WHITE SOCIETY…..HE HAD TO CHANGE”.

what did he mean when he said Michael Jackson had to change....exactly that, he had to change his physical being beyond what he was meant to be

so this man knew what was going to be of Michael Jackson's life before it actually happened

He was picked and prodded....he was chosen for it.......

Social conditioning while living in the superficial world of Hollywood produced this inclination TO CHANGE.

tell me who exercises greater agendas than Hollywood

what we saw taking place with this man for the greater part of the past quarter century is a manifestation of what was brewing underneath the surface the entire time, and plastic surgery became the crucible, and the transformation became pandora's box

THIS is what happened to this brilliant black entertainer, and that's why he made that plea beginning in 1987 when he said "for have mercy on me, I've been bleeding a long time now"...

for this is why he began to dawn on "the mask"

so you tell me who has the real agenda

the problem is everyone complicit in this situation don't want the truth to be known

and when I say white society, I'm not referring to all white people, not the good ones with a heart, I'm talking about those functioning within the realm of and brought forth by the establishment, those who held the keys to privilige and validation.....THOSE are the body of people who carried the real agenda all along

those are the real agenda seekers, because they saw how profitable black music could be if the presentation was altered and repackaged, but in the process, as they "refined" the presentation, the essence of what made the person targeted was destroyed

and this is what Michael alluded to in the song STRANGER IN MOSCOW when he said

"Swift and sudden fall from grace, happy days seem far away, Kremlin's shadow belittlin' me
Stalin's tomb won't let me be"

"Armageddon of the brain, all abandon in my fame, KGB (commercial media, the establishment) be stalking me, just take my name and let me be.....

he acknowledged to the world that he had been robbed of his essential goodness....... and that he had been left to dry to cope with the madness all by himself

and when that realization was reached, it hit him hard

and to show you that he realized it, what did he do 5 years latter as he was preparing to release his follow up..he attempted to return back to his ROOTS as he released INVINCIBLE, as the songs that were released as singles were r&b oriented

don't ever think he didn't know because he knew

that's what the HISTORY album was all about.....that was Michael's response of anger towards the establishment and how it led him to alter himself physically and how he was seperated from the community...that was the central theme

this aint about mixed kids, and bloodlines, or dominant vs recessive genes,

this is about how a dysfunctional system took this black man and led him on a path to ruin

and see the thing is Gold Dolphin, I have nothing against u or anyone else

I despise this situation because something that was once so good turned into tragedy, and if it can happen to this man, it can happen again to somebody else, and that's one person too many

but we all gone learn one day......that I have no doubts of.....

[Edited 1/25/13 4:45am]

Free2BMe said:

This is the very reason why NOTHING that Scorp says means shit. His agenda is cyrstal clear and anyone with a brain should know what he is doing. He uses his "old school black knowledge" of Michael when he was a part of the Jacksons to justify his attacks on Michael. That is ignorance of the worst level. It is also this kind of ignorance that this family is using to basically give COnrad Murray a pass for MURDERING their son/brother. Scorp is a fake who thinks that people will fall for his crap. He wouldn't last 30 minutes in an actual face-to-face debate.

To me, that poster is nothing but a fraud. If he was as militant as he tries to act, he would be up in arms about how Katherine is being set up to look like a clueless puppet regularly by these white z-listers. Everywhere you look this family is being laughed at over their stupidity and cluelessness, but these pre Thriller fans amazingly don't say shit about it.

Let Priscilla Presley associate with these same set of people the Jacksons contiuously associate with, these white rock fans would loose their shit. But these family lovers say nothing?

This is why anyone is unable to now complain about black icons not getting their due. The actions of this "black family" and the Hou a ston family will always now be thrown in your face.

But he and other old schoolers want to get all preachy about MJ and his "white kids"? Just how out of touch

[Edited 1/23/13 14:37pm]may be a little over dramatic and rely too much on the tabloids for his information but that doesn't mean he is a fraud and he didn't love Michael
Hh
. Like Scorp I just do not think his life in the last 20 years should have been such a ridicule if MJ and his PR team did think a little differently. He did do too much plast ic surgery, his mother admitted that much. Yes, he did have vitiligo, I doubt a Pathlogist is going to lie about such a thing, it is not in his interest, but that did not mean MJ did not bleach his skin. Infact we know he did, Murray court case gave us an eyeful of all his medication including the bleaching cream, without it he probably would not look white all over. However, wouldn't it have been wiser to tell the world back in the 80s when it became so noticeable that his skin colour and his features were looking radically different to the MJ we grew up with and loved instead of actually making people believe you can not stand being black.

His relationship with children may seem innocent, but anyone and their mama would know if you are in viting children into your bedroom out of habit something sooner or later was going to happen, and it did twice.

His relationship with Debbie Rowe is also a little, btw I believe Debbie is the biological mother of Prince and Paris, Paris looks like her a little too much. MJ obviously wanted her to carry the babies thats why he married her and not because he wanted to grow old with her and bring up children with her. I can not believe Lisa Marie would agree to such an arrangement.

The thing is MJ made crazy decisions and he left people to interpret his life anyway they wanted, and that to me has nothing to do with his family but all to with how he decided to handle his life.

I just cant get over the Jackson Family supporters especially the Janet stans who think its okay to call a 14 year old girl a bitch and other hateful things about children mine you these are grown adults even older than me who do this.

How could you possibly blame a 14 year old for the actions of their grown aunts and uncles in their late 40s, 50s etc?

Not to mention, the adults were the ones that released tweets and statements that started the whole fiasco in the first place.

Anybody with logic and common sense would shake their head at the behavior of the family since MJs passing even the Houstons who have only exploited and threw their desceased relative under the bus because they are no longer here to defend themselves.

If its not music related .... I'm done with them.

[Edited 1/25/13 10:20am]

mjscarousal said:

I just cant get over the Jackson Family supporters especially the Janet stans who think its okay to call a 14 year old girl a bitch and other hateful things about children mine you these are grown adults even older than me who do this.

How could you possibly blame a 14 year old for the actions of their grown aunts and uncles in their late 40s, 50s etc?

Not to mention, the adults were the ones that released tweets and statements that started the whole fiasco in the first place.

Anybody with logic and common sense would shake their head at the behavior of the family since MJs passing even the Houstons who have only exploited and threw their desceased relative under the bus because they are no longer here to defend themselves.

If its not music related .... I'm done with them.

[Edited 1/25/13 10:20am]

Two words: sour grapes.

That is what all this nastiness towards MJ, his kids, his fans and his affairs is about.

These loopy family lovers are pissed that it's Paris and her brothers that are getting everything and not the deadbeat relatives and their kids. Which IMO is one of the most batshit crazy things I see on the net. It's so batshit crazy, you can't help but cringe when you read the shit they say. Plus the fact that Paris made all those involved in grannygate look stupid. And then you had all these cheap shots about Janet and her career.

So it's no surprise these stans have to resort to attacking this kid.

Is there something known about the Queen compilation featuring the MJ duets ?

And when is there going to be another compliation like "michael ?

Theatre news

[img:$uid]http://www.indielondon.co.uk/images/39437.jpg[/img:$uid]

THRILLER – Live, the concert show that celebrates the music of Michael Jackson and the Jackson 5, is celebrating selling 1,000,000 tickets in the West End and starting its fifth amazing year at the Lyric Theatre.

And for one lucky Thriller – Live fan attending the show on Tuesday, January 29, 2013, it will be a night they will never forget.

They will meet the cast on stage and be presented with a millionth customer golden ticket. They will also receive a copy of the stunning, sold-out limited edition, The Official Michael Jackson Opus, plus a fantastic collection of Thriller – Live merchandise and Michael Jackson CDS, courtesy of Sony.

Worth more than £450 and weighing in at 12kg, beautifully hand-bound in black leather, The Official Michael Jackson Opus is the only new publication approved and endorsed by the Estate of Michael Jackson and has more than 400 pages of never-before-seen photographs plus personal, heartfelt essays written exclusively by those who knew Michael best.

Thriller – Live opened in the West End in January 2009 after three acclaimed UK tours. It is currently booking at the Lyric Theatre until Sunday, September 15, 2013.

Several world tours have seen the show play to acclaim in 32 countries, including Germany, Italy, Poland, Denmark, Holland, Belgium, Switzerland, France, Singapore, South Africa, China, Sweden, Finland and Norway. Just returned from a four-month run in Japan and opening in February for a five-month run in Brazil, Thriller – Live has now been seen by more than 2,500,000 people worldwide. And transporting the show worldwide has clocked up 1,000,000 truck miles.

Unlike other West End productions, Thriller – Live is not a rigid book musical with set songs, but is a constantly evolving music concert celebration. It brings to life on stage the distinctive high-energy dancing and pulsating sound of many of pop’s greatest hits, blending eye-popping video footage and effects together with dazzling choreography by the show’s award-winning director Gary Lloyd.

When Michael Jackson died, the Lyric Theatre became a focus for fans from all over the world, who created a massive shrine of flowers, candles and tributes. More than 40 books of condolence were signed in the foyer then sent to the Jackson family. A year after his death, a permanent West End memorial to Michael was unveiled in the theatre foyer.

To date, more than 30 young boys have sung the hits of the young Michael Jackson in the West End and around the world. The need to have six available at any one time has led the producers of Thriller – Live to launch an in-house training academy to train young boys. The MJ Academy opened its doors for the first time on Friday, November 9. Would-be MJs get classes in singing and dancing every Friday between 5pm and 8pm, with terms lasting three months .

Produced by Paul Walden and Derek Nicol for Flying Music in association with Adrian Grant for Key Concerts, Thriller – Live was originally conceived and created by Executive Director of the show, Adrian Grant, a long time associate of Michael Jackson, and author of Michael Jackson – The Visual Documentary.

http://www.indielondon.co...ets-in-w-e

Scorp said:

it's just like a number of his fast post-Thriller that is who have posted pics on the internet, particularly youtube trying to prove he had vitiligo by taking photos and distorting them from the original take, photoshopping superimposed marks in a vain attempt

like this whack clip

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i_0zxCCGQ6Y&list=PLRlZmKA86qE2kVsOo3j6LH3mK3XzYt1nO&index=64

I want you to dabble and check out the period from 0:20-0:43

I want you to feed on how low this person stooped to prove a point that has no point

now you're talking a man who received the OFF THE WALL album as a gift when he was 8 years old

you're talking to a man who use to look at this album all the time to read the lyrics and the song credits....

this album cover has existed since 1979, I'm talking about the original album version, not the special edition that was released during the beginning of the past decade

I've seen this album countess times, this person post this crap up on youtube and out the box, after all these years, the album cover shows Michael Jackson with discoloration/spots on his hands

then this person had the nerve to circle the area of his hand and magnify the image to give an up close shot

if this person who posted this crap was a man, I would say he should have gone to jail

but sense she was a woman, she needs shock therapy

because what she posted was a load of bullshit, pardon my french

what this person posted, upholding this lie, is an insult to everyone who was a part of the black experience who grew up buying J5 records up until the point he released OFF THE WALL...

this man sold 20 million copies of OFF THE WALL, and nobody NOBODY...NOOOOOOOOOOBODY has a copy of that album showing spots on his hand.......

and u wanna know why, because it wasn't true

lieeesssssss...unadulturated, no holds barred

Really?? No one does?? Well, I do not own the original '79 issued LP, but I do on an LP issued in the '80s, when Epic was still owned by CBS (probably issued in '87, judging by the "Nice Price" albums advertised on the inner sleeve) and that copy has the exact "discoloration" (or whatever it is) as shown on that Youtube clip. So whatever you try to insinuate here, that poster did not doctor the picture to proof a point. Maybe you should take another closer look at your copy or just take your meds.

Seriously dude, you should stop claiming your interpretations and opinions and assumptions to be the valid truth and fact. It's not. It's just your interpretations and opinions and assumptions and really, your insistence on that being the truth (without even considering that you might be wrong) makes you look like a nut and a fool.

@whatsgoingon

Duh, so he made mistakes. Well, that's life. People do make mistakes and in hindsight they might have handled some things differently.

Edit: I hate this fucking forum, I have no clue why the above sentence is bold and not changeable to normal.

[Edited 1/25/13 16:14pm]

Keep sexybad coming, I'm loving the tour pics!

PatrickS77 said:

Really?? No one does?? Well, I do not own the original '79 issued LP, but I do on an LP issued in the '80s, when Epic was still owned by CBS (probably issued in '87, judging by the "Nice Price" albums advertised on the inner sleeve) and that copy has the exact "discoloration" (or whatever it is) as shown on that Youtube clip. So whatever you try to insinuate here, that poster did not doctor the picture to proof a point. Maybe you should take another closer look at your copy or just take your meds.

Seriously dude, you should stop claiming your interpretations and opinions and assumptions to be the valid truth and fact. It's not. It's just your interpretations and opinions and assumptions and really, your insistence on that being the truth (without even considering that you might be wrong) makes you look like a nut and a fool.

[Edited 1/25/13 16:14pm]

put your money where your mouth is and post it..........take a picture of it w/out doing anything to it and post a pic of that album cover

that person lied, right outta of the box....and whoever insinuates that lie was the truth needs to spend time n in jail

I don't have time to hurl insults, that goes by the way of squibble

I'd be careful who you would suggest is a fool or who needs to check their vision

considering the fact the world never got to witness the real Michael Jackson beyond 1985, they havn't witness that person in 25 years

fortunately, I was born during a time where I had the opportunity to do so

and that distorted, fake, doctured up, souped up, manipulated photo goes by the wasteside considering the fact I got a chance to witness Michael Jackson and his brothers perform live during the Triumph tour in 1981, and there was absolutely no discoloration anywhere on that guy, the thought didn't even exist in the conscious of those who followed him during that time, and that was 2 YEARS after OFF THE WALL was released

the only reason that person posted that clip suggesting he acquired it during that time because she came across that Oprah interview in 1993 where Michael claimed he acquired "a skin disorder" during the years of Off The Wall and Thriller

then, they tagged the disease during Thriller by suggesting that the reason Michael Jackson started wearing the single glove was because vitiligo attacked his hand, and that's probably where that lady came up w/the idea showing "souped up spots" on his hand on that OFF THE WALL cover

see, lies gotta come up w/more lies to support the original lie

we do it often when we're kids trying to get out of getting in trouble w/our parent(s)

but the truth of the matter is, as this came right from Michael's mouth in his autobiography MOONWALK that the reason he started wearing one glove while performing was simply because one glove would stand out more than wearing two, which he was right about

oh, and another thing, when he wore the glove on stage performing, particularly BILLIE JEAN during his solo tours, especially the BAD TOUR, when he did perform that song, he didn't always wear the single glove on one hand continously, there were times where he wore the glove on the left hand and other times where he did so on the right hand......

[Edited 1/25/13 18:37pm]

Scorp said:

whatsgoingon said:

Scorp said:

put your money where your mouth is and post it..........take a picture of it w/out doing anything to it and post a pic of that album cover

that person lied, right outta of the box....and whoever insinuates that lie was the truth needs to spend time n in jail

I don't have time to hurl insults, that goes by the way of squibble

I'd be careful who you would suggest is a fool or who needs to check their vision

considering the fact the world never got to witness the real Michael Jackson beyond 1985, they havn't witness that person in 25 years

fortunately, I was born during a time where I had the opportunity to do so

and that distorted, fake, doctured up, souped up, manipulated photo goes by the wasteside considering the fact I got a chance to witness Michael Jackson and his brothers perform live during the Triumph tour in 1981, and there was absolutely no discoloration anywhere on that guy, the thought didn't even exist in the conscious of those who followed him during that time, and that was 2 was released

the only reason that person posted that clip suggesting he acquired it during that time because she came across that Oprah interview in 1993 where Michael claimed he acquired "a skin disorder" during the ye

then, they tagged thesduring Thriller by suggesting that the reason Michael Jackson started wearing the single glove was because vitiligo attacked his hand, and that's probably where that lady came up w/the idea showing "souped up spots" on his hand on that OFF THE WALL cover

see, lies gotta come up w/more lies to support the original lie

we do it often when we're kids trying to get out of getting in trouble w/our parent(s)

but the truth of the matter is, as this came right from Michael's mouth in his autobiography MOONWALK that the reason he started wearing one glove while performing was simply because one glove would stand out more than wearing two, which he was right about

oh, and another thing, when he wore the glove on stage performing, particularly BILLIE JEAN during his solo tours, especially the BAD TOUR, when he did perform that song, he didn't always wear the single glove on one hand continously, there were times where he wore the glove on the left hand and other times where he did so on the right hand......

[Edited 1/25/13 18:37pm]

But Scorp, he must of vitilogo, it says that in an offical document, the had autopsy. The autopsy was done when he was dead, so you can not say he paid the pathlogist to say that. The autopsy so states he had an extra rib, he had a polyp on his bowel and had arthritis. This is the pathlogist report, not something gotten ese which says things as they are, things that MJ would not gave probably wa nted the world to know, so lets stop saying everything was a lie. Having said all that MJ did depigmentize his skin, to make it look white all over. All those bleaching cream s and medications at the Murray trial illustated that. I personally belive MJ vitiligo was initially mild and maybe he could have covered it up with makeup but decided to use bleaching cream to even it up from the beginning. Because has we know there are other remedies for vitiligo such as repigmentation. Also vitiligo is a fluid condition, it is alway changing, sometimes the skin repigments itself. In the end I do not think it was the vitiligo that made him look so white all over, I think it was the cream he was using that gave him an overall white look. And if he decided not to use any cream, his skin would have looked probably more uneven but less wholly white. [Edited 1/25/13 20:29pm]

I disagree with this post.

My father has Vitiligo on his hands, arms and partially on his lips. My father uses creams prescibed by his doctor but ther not bleaching creams.

I dont beleve MJ bleached his skin. I believe he had Vitiligo which was already proven in the autospy. All that other stuff is irrelevant and is not backed by facts.

There are millions of people who look like Michael and have Vitiligo on their entire body without the usage of bleaching products or enhancements.

Futhernmore, if someone wants to call an autospy report a lie, than thats their ignorant problem.

Thats my 2 cents and Im not going back and forth.

[Edited 1/25/13 20:36pm]

alphastreet said:

Keep sexybad coming, I'm loving the tour pics!

Not from the Bad era, but hot anyways

mjscarousal said:

I'm just agreeing to disagree on most things if not all being said here, but it seems like you're just really angry with michael, more than I remember. A lot of these topics have come up over and over, but there is so much hostility and redundancy in your statements, and I think michael has very little to do with it if at all.

So what is the real issue at hand? Why are you angry with him now more than before though he's been gone for 4 years?

[Edited 1/25/13 21:13pm]

whatsgoingon said:

But Scorp, he must of had vitilogo, it says that in an offical document, the had autopsy. The autopsy was done when he was dead, so you can not say he paid the pathlogist to say that. The autopsy also so states s he had an extra rib, he had a polyp on his bowel and had arthritis. This is the pathlogist report, things that MJ would not have probably wanted the world to know, so lets stop saying everything was a lie. Having said all that MJ did depigmentize his skin, to make it look white all over. All those bleaching cream s and medications at the Murray trial illustated that. I personally belive MJ vitiligo was initially mild and maybe he could have covered it up with makeup but decided to use bleaching cream to even it up from the beginning. Because has we know there are other remedies for vitiligo such as repigmentation. Also vitiligo is a fluid condition, it is alway changing, sometimes the skin repigments itself. In the end I do not think it was the vitiligo that made him look so white all over, I think it was the cream he was using that gave him an overall white look. And if he decided not to use any cream, his skin would have looked probably more uneven but less wholly white. [Edited 1/25/13 20:29pm] [Edited 1/25/13 20:35pm]

I know it's disturbing and heartbreaking but please U really need to look at his autopsy photo. It's pretty obvious the discoloration that was caused by vitiligo was spread all over his body. If it's possible to "bleach" your skin and make it all even, please help me understand, why DIDN'T Michael, who had more money than any other celebs and who apparently according to some of y'all, desired not to look black so badly, just bleach his entire body and decide to leave all these noticeable spots and unevenness?? Or never mind his body but even his face is of few different colors. I'm sure he was using recommended treatments for vitiligo but people need to realize he didn't look white all over because of some kind of chemical procedure that made it possible to depigmentize his skin, he looked one color because he was wearing makeup

[Edited 1/25/13 21:44pm]

alphastreet said:

I'm just agreeing to disagree on most things if not all being said here, but it seems like you're just really angry with michael, more than I remember. A lot of these topics have come up over and over, but there is so much hostility and redundancy in your statements, and I think michael has very little to do with it if at all.

So what is the real issue at hand? Why are you angry with him now more than before though he's been gone for 4 years?

[Edited 1/25/13 21:13pm]

are u sure you want the answer

because I can only give it 150% w/out cuttin corners

do you really want the real issue?

because I will expound on the root rather than the result

whatsgoingon said:

mjscarousal said:

I disagree with this post.

My father has Vitiligo on his hands, arms and partially on his lips. My father uses creams prescibed by his doctor but ther not bleaching creams.

I dont beleve MJ bleached his skin. I believe he had Vitiligo which was already proven in the autospy. All that other stuff is irrelevant and is not backed by facts.

There are millions of people who look like Michael and have Vitiligo on their entire body without the usage of bleaching products or enhancements.

Futhernmore, if someone wants to call an autospy report a lie, than thats their ignorant problem.

Thats my 2 cents and Im not going back and forth.

[Edited 1/25/13 20:36pm]

Well considering the creams as well as the other medication were on display at the murray trial, he obviously was using bleaching cream, unless you are goung to say the creams were not his but the nanny or the cook. Those were his things and he was obviously using them, otherwise there would have been no point the prosecution showing them to the world. [Edited 1/25/13 20:48pm]

Unless, I missed something, and I watched EVERY SECOND of the murder trial, there was only ONE bottle of "bleach" cream that was displayed. "Bleach cream" can NOT turn you WHITE. It can lighten your skin; however, it can NOT take ALL of the PIGMENTATION from your skin. When it comes to Michael some people lose all sense of rationality. You don't have to be a brain surgeon to know these things. I have seen many people use "bleach creams" and it only lightens a persons skin. In Michael's case, it should be obvious, even to people who want to believe otherwise that Michael had vitiligo. This man couldn't even be out in the sun. He had to protect his skin because he had no melanin. Btw, these "bleach creams" basically EVEN OUT your skin. I don't know of anyone who used "bleach cream" and was as white as Michael. Sometimes, you just have to use common sense and when it comes to Michael,some people don't use common sense or don't have the ability to use it.

Free2BMe said:

Scorp said:

alphastreet said:

I'm just agreeing to disagree on most things if not all being said here, but it seems like you're just really angry with michael, more than I remember. A lot of these topics have come up over and over, but there is so much hostility and redundancy in your statements, and I think michael has very little to do with it if at all.

So what is the real issue at hand? Why are you angry with him now more than before though he's been gone for 4 years?

[Edited 1/25/13 21:13pm]

are u sure you want the answer

because I can only give it 150% w/out cuttin corners

do you really want the real issue?

because I will expound on the root rather than the result

You DON'T know the "answer". All you do is lie, "beat round the bush", act as if you are an authority on things ( and know shit about nothing). You are the biggest FRAUD that I have ever encountered. Your hang-ups are all about YOU; however, you don't have the decency, or COURAGE to admit that. You are much like other cowards who want to put their own problems on other people. I have read your psycho babble, dribble, sqibble or whatever you call it, and there is NOTHING that you have said which is based on reality. Your anger issues toward Michael say much more about you than they do him. Your AGENDA is very clear. The question is did Michael do anything to you personally?

You never address the topic at hand. You ramble aimlessly about things that basically have nothing to do with Michael, but about the entertainment industry, in general. It is embarrassing, to you, for you to constantly throw up "old school black fans" AS IF you are the final authority. I can assure you you are not. Your agenda is based on pure ignorance, innuendo, gossip, hypocrisy, bias, etc. You CONVENIENTLY ignore things (like photos of Marlon Jackson's WHITE grandchildren) because it doesn't fit into your agenda against Michael. Sadly, it is your kind of ignorance that has spread through our community and you are a like a "cancer" that continues to spread. Maybe it helps you get your jollies by pretending to be an authority of what you are not. I truly feel sorry for anyone who is weak-minded enough to be exposed to your ramblings and believe anything that you say.

Stay in your comfort zone and try to persuade people who don't have any knowledge. You are out of your realm when TRYING to persuade people who know more than you do.

Finally, stop trying to act as if you are the only one who supported Michael when he was with his brothers. I and milliions of other fans did, also. However, in my case, and millions of other fans, my support became a thousand times more when he went solo and I am from the community that first bought his music when he was with the Jackson 5. You don't speak for AWARE, long time fans in our community.

whatsgoingon said:

Free2BMe said:

Unless, I missed something, and I watched EVERY SECOND of the murdesr trial, there was only ONE bottle of "bleach" cream that was displayed. "Bleach cream" can NOT turn you WHITE. It can lightenS your skin; however, it can NOT take ALL of the PIGMENTATION from S your skin. When it comes to Michael some people lose all sense of rationality. You don't have to be a brain surgeon to know these things. I have seen many people use "bleach creams" and it only lightens a persons skin. In Michael's case, it should be obvious, even to people who want to believe otherwise that Michael had vitiligo. This man couldn't even be out in the sun. He had to protect his skin because he had no melanin. Btw, these "bleach creams" basically EVEN OUT your skin. I don't know of anyone who used "bleach cream" and was as white as Michael. Sometimes, you just have to use common sense and when it comes to Michael,some people don't use common sense or don't have the ability to use it.

So are you saying the bleach cream was not his? Why put it on display in a court room if it had nothing to do with him? I mean what was is he using it for if not to depigmentate his skin, which is a permanent bleaching effect.

Again, "bleaching cream" does NOT permanently depigmentate your skin. It lightens and evens it out. I know plenty of people who have used these creams and NONE of them have lost their melanin or have turned basically alabaster "white". Bleaching creams can be bought over the counter at any pharmacy or grocery store. White AND black people use those creams, therefore, let's not act as if "bleach cream" was exclusive to this one black man. You would be surprised at how much these type of creams are prevalent in homes.

Free2BMe said:

Free2BMe said:

whatsgoingon said:

Free2BMe said:

So you tell me what was the bleaching cream doing in his possession? Unless you are trying to say it was not his or he was using it for something else. I do believe he had vitiligo but the dacfact is bleaching cream was in his possession and it was there for a reason, either to even out his skin as much as possible or lighten up the darker parts of his skin. And by the way there are different types of bleaching cream, we are not talking about behind the counter bleaching cream here.

If you believe that Michael had vitiligo, then why are you wondering why "bleach cream" was there? Doesn't that answer your own question? "Bleach creams" are used to EVEN out your color. It should be obvious for a person with vitiligo. Btw, this cream was brought in by the defense because the MURDERER, Conrad Murray, pretended that he was trying to protect Michael by "hiding" this cream. This fucking bastard didn't have the decency to call 911 and yet he wants people to believe that he was worried about some "bleach cream". That was the ONLY reference to bleach cream that I saw and the defence and the murderer only used this to try and slander Michael and turn the jury against him. Something that the scum did during the 2005 trial when Diane Dimond conveniently found a jar of "bleaching cream" in Michael's belongings when going through his things illegally. Just like in 2005, the "bleach cream" was ONLY brought out to slander Michael and had shit to do with why the murderer killed Michael.

Free2BMe said:

Free2BMe said:

Scorp said:

are u sure you want the answer

because I can only give it 150% w/out cuttin corners

do you really want the real issue?

because I will expound on the root rather than the result

You DON'T know the "answer". All you do is lie, "beat round the bush", act as if you are an authority on things ( and know shit about nothing). You are the biggest FRAUD that I have ever encountered. Your hang-ups are all about YOU; however, you don't have the decency, or COURAGE to admit that. You are much like other cowards who want to put their own problems on other people. I have read your psycho babble, dribble, sqibble or whatever you call it, and there is NOTHING that you have said which is based on reality. Your anger issues toward Michael say much more about you than they do him. Your AGENDA is very clear. The question is did Michael do anything to you personally?

You never address the topic at hand. You ramble aimlessly about things that basically have nothing to do with Michael, but about the entertainment industry, in general. It is embarrassing, to you, for you to constantly throw up "old school black fans" AS IF you are the final authority. I can assure you you are not. Your agenda is based on pure ignorance, innuendo, gossip, hypocrisy, bias, etc. You CONVENIENTLY ignore things (like photos of Marlon Jackson's WHITE grandchildren) because it doesn't fit into your agenda against Michael. Sadly, it is your kind of ignorance that has spread through our community and you are a like a "cancer" that continues to spread. Maybe it helps you get your jollies by pretending to be an authority of what you are not. I truly feel sorry for anyone who is weak-minded enough to be exposed to your ramblings and believe anything that you say.

Stay in your comfort zone and try to persuade people who don't have any knowledge. You are out of your realm when TRYING to persuade people who know more than you do.

Finally, stop trying to act as if you are the only one who supported Michael when he was with his brothers. I and milliions of other fans did, also. However, in my case, and millions of other fans, my support became a thousand times more when he went solo and I am from the community that first bought his music when he was with the Jackson 5. You don't speak for AWARE, long time fans in our community.

I was gone let this role tonight......and I know those who uphold the lies will give you a standing ovation for the squibble you just wrote

and throughout this entire experience online for like the past 10 years......at least 95% percent of the vile, hate-filled comments that continue to brew, those words are uttered from post-THRILLER MJ FANS........that's been the consistent theme throughout

but I'll break your rant down to its basic nuance......

1.) I've never said I represented anyone

2.) I never said I was the only person who supported music back in the day, and supported this musical act all alone.....see, you're castigating and generalizing because you choose to uphold the lies....

3.) I bet if someone recited your exact words this week, all that squibble, recited it on radio in upholding the lies and then follow that up with the thoughts I expressed discussing the full gamut and what caused this man's self destruction and why the music industry is shot to all hell, and how the seed of that deterioration was planted some 50 years ago when culture was at its richest, and do so w/out resorting to base level, bootleg profanity laced tirades......I'm pretty sure whose words would draw more interest........

4.) you wanna talk about convenience, you CONVENIENTLY overooked the lies current fans pose to the world, tagging lies w/even more lies to cover up and protect the original lie.......I bet you won't shoot off at the mouth and admit that OFF THE WALL album cover, remember when the album was released in 1979 never featured any discoloration of a supposed case of vitiligo w/splotches on that man's hand like current fans try to desperately suggest, and i bet if they did try to suggest that in a live interview on radio or whatever form of communication media, they would be run right outta dodge......

5.) I bet you will CONVENIENTLY overlooked the words of forewarning when during the documentary special LIFE OF AN ICON, released in 2011, when that black musician working at MOTOWN said of Michael Jackson back in 1975 that and these are his words now "MICHAEL WAS UNDER TREMENDOUS PRESSURE, HERE’S A BLACK GUY, FROM THE INNER CITY WHO WAS THE DARLING OF WHITE SOCIETY…..HE HAD TO CHANGE”. let me repeat what that man said MICHAEL WAS UNDER TREMENDOUS PRESSURE, HERE’S A BLACK GUY, FROM THE INNER CITY WHO WAS THE DARLING OF WHITE SOCIETY…..HE HAD TO CHANGE”........

.................yeah, he was telling the stone cold truth, but those who discussed the documentary on tv chose to overlook that, and purposely did so......you see, this is why Michael Jackson had the plastic surgery, not because of what his father supposedly said about him, or his brothers teasing him ....it because of what that man said in that documentary.......

but those complicit aint got the guts to admit it....so don't come at me w/that wave of squibble

oh, and let me not forget, Michael Jackson admitted that too, and do you know when he made that admission?...during that 1993 interview with OPRAH

remember when Oprah asked him "so did you start having plastic surgery because you didn't like the way you looked during those teenage years"?......

and before you stoop and try and twist and turn words......I'm not referring to white people w/a heart, I'm referring those who function w/in the establishment and brought forth by it after this guy reached the pinnacle of his career

remember what Michael said after she asked him that?....he said NO NOT REALLY, one of the rare instances where he was being truthful regarding his plastic surgery journey....see, this stuff has a root...

out of all the conversations people have had about that interview....nobody has ever, eeeeeeeeeeeever mentioned that

he had it because he was groomed for it

the real FRAUD was how the sytem convinced this man that he could move beyond his original state and become more successful than he already was (which entailed reliinquishing well being, his family, his people, his culture) and that god awful, evil advice turned out to be the greatest miscalculation in the history of showbizness.......

Sadly, your illconceived notion about me spreading cancer throughout our community is the worst squibble yet, you wasted minutes of your time coming up w/that crap.....

damage has been inflicted years before I was even born

I have nothing to do with what's going on in regards to the deteriorating of any community, and especially this entertainers self destruction...all I did was buy the records...he don't know me fron adam.....I accept any artist in their natural state..I don't believe in killing souls

maybe if someone had the guts to tell him what was up while he began surrounding himself with criminals and sociopaths and syncophants (because by that time, his family had been totally phased out of the equation)...Michael Jackson would not have internalized the racial conflict in the manner that he did, and never would have had to relinquish his livelihood because he received the worst god awful advice there is

the REAL FRAUD is how a system predicated on racial ambivalence turned this man into a shell of what he once was, and then when all the cards were stacked on the table, those responsible for this treachery bailed out and left him fending for himself, but pimped him while they did it, and now the establishment owns his name, his likeness, his music, the entire nine...it's all gone

you take that squibble and you point that towards the ones who stuck their chest out with fake pride and uttered on these fan community forums and youtube and throughout the web they never would have accepted Michael in his natural state and preferred his transformational look

for those are the ones he wound up destroying himself for

and then you take the rest of that squibble and direct that towards a great portion of his fanbase who creamed away at this man's 80 some year old mother on these social media websites, fan forums calling her the NWORD, and bitches and calling Rebbie sluts and whores then when her husband passed, they have the nerve to send condolescences.......for they need to be rounded up and sent away too

if somebody else had become the greatest star on the planet and destroyed themselves, and born of a different ethnicity, I would be just as adamant......this aint about attacking him, this is about attacking the system and body of people who led him down the path of self destruction

and you still stuck on what you think Marlon's grandchildren are?

STICKS AND STONES GO BREAKING BONES

BUT THE ONE WHO SEEKS IS THE ONE WHO OWNS

[Edited 1/26/13 0:25am]

whatsgoingon said:

Scorp said:

Free2BMe said:

You DON'T know the "answer". All you do is lie, "beat round the bush", act as if you are an authority on things ( and know shit about nothing). You are the biggest FRAUD that I have ever encountered. Your hang-ups are all about YOU; however, you don't have the decency, or COURAGE to admit that. You are much like other cowards who want to put their own problems on other people. I have read your psycho babble, dribble, sqibble or whatever you call it, and there is NOTHING that you have said which is based on reality. Your anger issues toward Michael say much more about you than they do him. Your AGENDA is very clear. The question is did Michael do anything to you personally?

You never address the topic at hand. You ramble aimlessly about things that basically have nothing to do with Michael, but about the entertainment industry, in general. It is embarrassing, to you, for you to constantly throw up "old school black fans" AS IF you are the final authority. I can assure you you are not. Your agenda is based on pure ignorance, innuendo, gossip, hypocrisy, bias, etc. You CONVENIENTLY ignore things (like photos of Marlon Jackson's WHITE grandchildren) because it doesn't fit into your agenda against Michael. Sadly, it is your kind of ignorance that has spread through our community and you are a like a "cancer" that continues to spread. Maybe it helps you get your jollies by pretending to be an authority of what you are not. I truly feel sorry for anyone who is weak-minded enough to be exposed to your ramblings and believe anything that you say.

Stay in your comfort zone and try to persuade people who don't have any knowledge. You are out of your realm when TRYING to persuade people who know more than you do.

Finally, stop trying to act as if you are the only one who supported Michael when he was with his brothers. I and milliions of other fans did, also. However, in my case, and millions of other fans, my support became a thousand times more when he went solo and I am from the community that first bought his music when he was with the Jackson 5. You don't speak for AWARE, long time fans in our community.

I was gone let this role tonight......and I know those who uphold the lies will give you a standing ovation for the squibble you just wrote

and throughout this entire experience online for like the past 10 years......at least 95% percent of the vile, hate-filled comments that continue to brew, those words are uttered from post-THRILLER MJ FANS........that's been the consistent theme throughout

but I'll break your rant down to its basic nuance......

1.) I've never said I represented anyone

You are always talking about the "black community" and that the "black community" was the one who first bought Michael and J5 records. You are not speaking rocket science. Everyone who is a long time fan knows this. You try and act as if Michael forgot that community. He NEVER did. In fact, Michael did more than ANY OTHER BLACK artist, to keep that community relevant. Michael NEVER did interviews with white magazines BEFORE he did it with BLACK magazines. Michael made sure that his videos were played on BET at the same time as MTV, VH-1 or he wouldn't release it. When other stars were kissing ass and bowing down to the "white man",Michael NEVER did that. He didm't whore himself out to the media. He could have, they would have done ANYTHING to get him to do interviews and DID offer him whatever he wanted. He didn't do it. His first major TV interview was with a BLACK woman. ALL of magazine interviews were either exclusively with BLACK magazines or he didn't do them. Therefore, you have basically been LYING with your insinuations and allegations that Michael abandoned his "black fanbase".

2.) I never said I was the only person who supported music back in the day, and supported this musical act all alone.....see, you're castigating and generalizing because you choose to uphold the lies....

Of course, you didn't specify that YOU was the ONLY person who supported music, specifically Michael (remember,that is what this conversation is about and who YOU want to blame for EVERTHING). You act as if people are not aware of the black community's support of the Jackson 5. What does this have to do with your PERSONAL AGENDA against Michael?

3.) I bet if someone recited your exact words this week, all that squibble, recited it on radio in upholding the lies and then follow that up with the thoughts I expressed discussing the full gamut and what caused this man's self destruction and why the music industry is shot to all hell, and how the seed of that deterioration was planted some 50 years ago when culture was at its richest, and do so w/out resorting to base level, bootleg profanity laced tirades......I'm pretty sure whose words would draw more interest........

Your dribble, ramblings about music are always wrapped around your PERSONAL agenda to degrade or dismiss Michael and his achievements. In your mind, you want to completely dismiss the legacy that Michael built for HIMSELF. That doesn't and should not negate the fact that he was with his brothers or that his success was a MILLION times more when he went solo. YOU, not me, continue to bring up the "old school black community" as if this justifies YOUR agenda. Btw, there are people like you all over the radio, who have no knowledge of things; however, continue to spew their ignorance as "fact". So you don't have to worry. There are others who subscribe to your type of "tabloid" mentality.

4.) you wanna talk about convenience, you CONVENIENTLY overooked the lies current fans pose to the world, tagging lies w/even more lies to cover up and protect the original lie.......I bet you won't shoot off at the mouth and admit that OFF THE WALL album cover, remember when the album was released in 1979 never featured any discoloration of a supposed case of vitiligo w/splotches on that man's hand like current fans try to desperately suggest, and i bet if they did try to suggest that in a live interview on radio or whatever form of communication media, they would be run right outta dodge......

Speaking of generalization, that is what you are doing. Don't try and paint all MJ fans with the same brush. There are some "newbie" fans that are pretty much in your category-Don't know shit. I don't subscribe to everything that some of these fans do. Look at you, I don't agree with ANYTHING that you say and I certainly wouldn't put you in the same general category as all fans. Don't look now, but your hypocrisy is showing. You put ALL Michael fans in the same category.

5.) I bet you will CONVENIENTLY overlooked the words of forewarning when during the documentary special LIFE OF AN ICON, released in 2011, when that black musician working at MOTOWN said of Michael Jackson back in 1975 that and these are his words now "MICHAEL WAS UNDER TREMENDOUS PRESSURE, HERE’S A BLACK GUY, FROM THE INNER CITY WHO WAS THE DARLING OF WHITE SOCIETY…..HE HAD TO CHANGE”. let me repeat what that man said MICHAEL WAS UNDER TREMENDOUS PRESSURE, HERE’S A BLACK GUY, FROM THE INNER CITY WHO WAS THE DARLING OF WHITE SOCIETY…..HE HAD TO CHANGE”........

Was the "black musician" speaking of change in Michael's appearance of that Michael's music changed. Btw, wasn't this "Life of an Icon" a tabloid mess? Strange, that you would quote from this? You do know that this "black musicia" was giving his OPINION. Nothing that he said was based on any facts, research or anything else. This person, like you, knows nothing, yet gave HIS opinion.

.................yeah, he was telling the stone cold truth, but those who discussed the documentary on tv chose to overlook that, and purposely did so......you see, this is why Michael Jackson had the plastic surgery, not because of what his father supposedly said about him, or his brothers teasing him ....it because of what that man said in that documentary.......

So, YOU believe what YOU want to because it fits into your warped AGENDA. Michael had surgery on his NOSE and a CLEFT put in his CHIN because he WANTED to. HE has never given any other reason. OTHERS, people like yourself who, have given their opinion with no basis in fact. Michael has never given ANY other reason for the surgery on his nose and the cleft, other than he WANTED to do. Give me a FACTUAL example of ever hearing Michael HIMSELF say otherwise. I am not speaking of what OTHERS said.

but those complicit aint got the guts to admit it....so don't come at me w/that wave of squibble

Do you have the guts to admit that you are using the words of OTHERS and not Michael?

oh, and let me not forget, Michael Jackson admitted that too, and do you know when he made that admission?...during that 1993 interview with OPRAH

remember when Oprah asked him "so did you start having plastic surgery because you didn't like the way you looked during those teenage years"?......

You forgot to say that Michael said that he had his nose done and a cleft put in his chin. He said that he had not had his lips done or other things that the media claimed. This was also when he revealed about his "skin condition"-vitiligo. Therefore, what "admission" are you speaking of?

and before you stoop and try and twist and turn words......I'm not referring to white people w/a heart, I'm referring those who function w/in the establishment and brought forth by it after this guy reached the pinnacle of his career

remember what Michael said after she asked him that?....he said NO NOT REALLY, one of the rare instances where he was being truthful regarding his plastic surgery journey....see, this stuff has a root...I don't have time for small talk

Michael ALWAYS admitted that he had his NOSE done and the cleft put in his chin, so what's your point?

out of all the conversations people have had about that interview....nobody has ever, eeeeeeeeeeeever mentioned that

You mean that people like you and others with an agenda don't mention that. Michael opened his soul during that interview and I believed him. Others took his words and twisted them.

he had it because he was groomed for it

++

the real FRAUD was how the sytem convinced this man that he could move beyond his original state and become more successful than he already was (which entailed reliinquishing well being, his family, his people, his culture) and that god awful, evil advice turned out to be the greatest miscalculation in the history of showbizness.......

No, the real FRAUD is people like you who try to diminish what Michael worked his ass off for and what he achieved. What Michael achieved with his solo career took talent, HARD WORK, determination, perserverance, etc. It had SHIT to do with his vitiligo That's YOUR hang-up. Again, Michael never relinquished his culture. He embraced it as much or MORE than anyother BLACK entertainer. Again, you and others like you are still hung-up on this man's "white"(vitiligo) skin. Does your intelligence allow you to look at the FACTS of this man's actions in the music industry or are you going to continue this "old school black" thing? It's insulting to the black community and to MJ fans who have been around for OVER 30 years.

Sadly, your illconceived notion about me spreading cancer throughout our community is the worst squibble yet, you wasted minutes of your time coming up w/that crap.....

damage has been inflicted years before I was even born

You are a purveyor of the tabloid gossip, lies, inuendo, etc. Of course, you didn't start it, but you are doing your damnest to SPREAD it. There are people who are weak-minded enough to believe your rantings without question because when it comes to Michael Jackson, ALL reasoning and rationale goes out the window. You come into this forum acting as if you are an AUTHORITY on Michael Jackson when you have nothing to offer but bullshit. What makes it even more pathetic, you try and wrap this bullshit with musings about the entertainment industry. AS IF that give you credibility.

I have nothing to do with what's going on in regards to the deteriorating of any community, and especially this entertainers self destruction...all I did was buy the records...he don't know me fron adam.....I accept any artist in their natural state..I don't believe in killing souls

Again, your HYPOCRISY is showing. You say that you don't have anything to do with the deterioation of the black community; YET, you CONTINUE to throw up Michael when you speak of this in your rantings about the entertainment community. From reading your rantings, you seem to be holding Michael responsible for the lack of success of other black artist, as well as his brothers.

maybe if someone had the guts to tell him what was up while he began surrounding himself with criminals and sociopaths and syncophants (because by that time, his family had been totally phased out of the equation)...Michael Jackson would not have internalized the racial conflict in the manner that he did, and never would have had to relinquish his livelihood because he received the worst god awful advice there is

Maybe if his brothers/family had done what they now HAVE to do-go on tour by themselves- and not BADGER Michael about touring with them, he wouldn't have had insomnia. Maybe if his family had REALLY been concerned about HIM instead of his MONEY, he wouldn't have shut them out. Maybe if their so-called "interventions" had not been about MONEY and touring, Michael wouldn't have tuned them out. If you can't TRUST and be around your own family, then who can you trust. FTR, I have no love for the scum that was arouind Michael before his death. However, his family was not much better. All he was to them was a MONEY MACHINE. That is OBVIOUS in their actions since his death.

the REAL FRAUD is how a system predicated on racial ambivalence turned this man into a shell of what he once was, and then when all the cards were stacked on the table, those responsible for this treachery bailed out and left him fending for himself, but pimped him while they did it, and now the establishment owns his name, his likeness, his music, the entire nine...it's all gone

The bottomline is that Michael Jackson STILL owns HALF of Sony/ATV. They tried to take that from him when he was alive and couldn't. His OWN brother, Randy, tried to convince him to sell when Michael was at his most vulnerable, during the scam 2005 trial. Michael Jackson STILL owned HIS music, His NAME, His LIKENESS, the ENTIRE nine when he was alive. Even with all of this talk of debts, Michael NEVER filed for bankruptcy. Like other billionaires(Donald Trump), Michael COULD have filed for bankruptcy. He didn't. I guess you are one of those Jackson family supporters who think that they should be handling Michael's money. BULLSHIT! All of Michael's money would be gone because these leeches would have spent it and not given ANY to his LEGAL HEIRS, his own children. This family basically squandered their money and looked to MICHAEL, not Janet, ALL of these years for HANDOUTS. He took care of his parents, his broke-ass brothers, their wives, their-ex-wives, his neices, nephews, and every other person surrounding these people. Yet, you have the gall to say that this SUPPORT of these people should continue since Michael's murder. HIS CHILDREN are the ONLY ones that should be benefitting from his money. He continues to take care of his mother because he knew that she would still try to support her GROWN-ASS children with the money he left her.

The bottomline is that Michael's ESTATE still owns his name, his music, his publishing company, Neverland, etc. NONE of that (unlike Elvis' name, merchandising, etc.) has been sold YET. Of courrse, if his family had access to his estate ALL of that would be sold.

you take that squibble and you point that towards the ones who stuck their chest out with fake pride and uttered on these fan community forums and youtube and throughout the web they never would have accepted Michael in his natural state and preferred his transformational look

Who cares about what SOME fans said? Again, you GENERALIZE. Again, you show your hypocrisy.

for those are the ones he wound up destroying himself for

if somebody else had become the greatest star on the planet and destroyed themselves, and born of a different ethnicity, I would be just as adamant......this aint about attacking him, this is about attacking the system and body of people who led him down the path of self destruction

ONE man KILLED Michael and that was Conrad Murray. The media, industry did everything in their power to destroy Michael because he was a BLACK MAN( a FACT that you try to diminish) who achieved more than ANY OTHER PERSON or GROUP in history. THAT's the fact that you so conveniently IGNORE. As James Baldwin said, THEY will not forgive Michael for what he did(achieved). Baldwin was correct. THEY are still not forgiving Michael for what he achieved. Michael KNEW this and sstated it in his words and music. In spite of your tripe, Michael was NEVER down and out. He never gave up. He was still strong, determined and ABLE to come back. Just look at the 50 shows that he SOLD OUT with NO NEW ABLUM, no promotion, etc. Just becuase he was Michael Jackson. Do you know of ANY other entertainer who could do what Michael did and be off of the music scene for 10 years? The answer is nobody, yet, you want to act as if he some washed-up has-been when he was MURDERED. Michael was at the TOP when he was murdered. There is no doubt in my mind that he had not been killed, he would have still been touring,released a new album, etc.

and you still stuck on what you think Marlon's grandchildren are?

Your hypocrisy makes you conveniently ignore what Marlon's grandchildren are. Your hypocrisy makes you use DOUBLE STANDARDS when it comes to Michael's children. Your hypocrisy shows you for what you are- A FRAUD.

[Edited 1/26/13 1:23am]

[Edited 1/26/13 1:44am]

whatsgoingon said:

whatsgoingon said: The fact of the matter MJ was going through some of bleaching/depigmentation process, regardless of what you think of Murray or Diamond. What I would like to know when did he start this process? Was it after the vitilgo had become extensive or did he make a conscious decision from the beginning once he was diagnoised with vitiligo, because the lightening of the skin coincided with the plastic surgery, which had nothing to do with vitiligo.

After he revealed that he had vitiligo during the Oprah interview, it was revealed by several doctors on TV that there were two choices for Michael: de-pigmentation or a "tanning of the skin. They had several patients who show the results of each process. The man who decided to "re-tan" his skin, looked as if his skin had turned to leather and that he had been burned. The doctors said that this was the more dangerous or risky of the two procedures. The lady who decided on the de-pigmentation process looked "white". She said that she got a LOT of flak from her community because she turned "white".

I think one of the doctors said that Michael used make-up for as long as he could and then when the vitiligo became extentive, he probably decided that the de-pigmentaion would be the best alternative. It is completely left up to the individual. I wonder what people would have said if Michael had done what the guy did and re-tanned himself with the leather-like skin. Would that have made people feel better? The important thing was would it have made Michael feel better? The answer is that Michael did what he thought would make him be able to proceed with his life and career. I would have done the SAME thing, if given the alternative and it has shit to do with wanting to be "white" or wanting to look white.

[Edited 1/26/13 1:40am]

I really must say that any of you arguing [or trying to compare pics, or any other bullshit like that] to make it seem as if MJ's children are his [by way of DNA] really needs to snap out of whatever denial cloud you live in. MJ is my favorite artist, & I can even admit that his kids aren't his by DNA. I strongly feel that MJ was A-sexual anyway, so it's not far-fetched by any stretch that donors were chosen [btw, what straight man, who is adored by so many ladies, would ever have to bust nuts into a cup in a lab to have babies? Shit, straight men usually do it the easily way...it's not hard. Unless, that is, MJ had a low sperm count or something was just wrong with his ding-ding ]. I just can't help but see the obvious lunacy that some of you possess on this topic. Wake the fuck up.