JorisE73 said:

Well said.

ShellyMcG said:

JorisE73 said:

Teh fans here don't care about Prince or his legacy and only want 'stuff' they can later complain about, just like when Prince was alive. The Estate only cares about Prince and his legacy and asked us to help out as fans to support the legacy, being Prince.org it all falls on deaf ears because there no fans here and the ones that do call themeselfs fans don't care about Prince and his legacy and only care for whatever he hid from us in his vault, so it is what it is.
There are other places where fans are trying to engage more seriously with the Estate with ideas for supporting the legacy and future plans regarding releases and whatever else, Prince.org isn't the place for this.
Nobody here wants to do anything to support Prince, simple things like enagaging the Estate is too much work it seems and the people here expect to sit back and that the Estate to come here and browse through all the spam, troll posts and other nonsense to find some halfassed attempt of proposing a SDE release
Good luck here

I give you a lot more credit than the other guy. I don't agree with you on many things but at least I know you're not a troll and you generally back up what you say. But I think you've gotten it wrong here. Not entirely wrong though, in fairness. You're right about some things. A lot of the fans don't really care about Prince's legacy. They just want new music. But if the estate were to appease these fans by actually releasing some new music, then wouldn't his legacy kind of take care of itself? This current estate has quickly built itself an awful reputation among not only Prince fans (for being too slow with releasing stuff from the vault) but also the wider press (for cancelling the documentary in favour of a puff piece doc to be released at a later date). So, at the moment, the Prince estate have two main problems. An unhappy fanbase and a bad reputation. Obviously, they are not happy with these things. Unless they're grotesquely stupid, they will be aware of this. Which is probably why they're asking for fans input. The problem with that is that the fans have already been very vocal about what they want over the last 9 years. They want to hear what's in the vault. I know I do. And I'm pretty sure you'd like to hear that stuff too. That's something we can all agree on. Where the fans are divided is when it comes to what form these releases take. Some fans want SDEs. Some fans want the entire Vault to be uploaded to streaming services or whatever. Others want smaller, more consistent releases. Prince fans will never agree to what form they want these releases to take. It's just never going to happen. His fanbase is just too diverse. So when you say that fans just want stuff they can later complain about, you're not wrong. Fans will complain. So you could look at that and say that the estate can't win no matter what they do. However, I would look at it the other way. I would say that they can't lose. Ultimately, something is better than nothing. And so far, they've given us nothing. Unless you count a couple of b sides from Musicology or the re-release of the full version of America as something. So if we go back to their two main problems of an unhappy fanbase and a bad reputation, I believe both of these things could be solved lickety split (always wanted to use that phrase in a sentence). Basically, they just need to release something. A compilation of unreleased recordings. Another SDE. Hit'n'Run Phase Three. Black Is The New Black. 3rdEyeGirl Part 2. Whatever. Any of the above. Something different. Literally anything. They can put any random 12-15 songs together and call it Vault Vol 1. Anything will do. This will immediately solve their first problem of an unhappy fanbase. At least temporarily. In the meantime, they can be working on something else behind the scenes to insure Prince's legacy. A bigger project like a documentary or whatever. Eventually, this will take care of their second problem and improve their reputation among not only Prince fans, but also the wider media. But it all starts with releasing something from the vault. Something to say "yes, we're listening". But asking people what they want when the people have been telling them for the past 9 years is no way to run a business. It screams incompetence. And it's not a good look. Because how can they be trusted to look after Prince's legacy when they can't even get the basics right.

But that's just it, the only complaints i hear arwe from the vocal minority on here.
At other places with alot more fans than on here there's little complaining and more info being spread regarding the going ons at the Estate and teh willingness to engage with them and figure out how to uphold and expand the legacy in cooperation with the fans (which seems to be priority 1 and that is alot more important than given a loud minority some half assed release) and build from there.
regarding the doc, you don't seem to know that alot of relevant to Prince/Paisley Park people complained about it to the Estate and had it canceled (about the narative, being forced to confess he abused people mentally and/or fysically, bullshit stories about peole claiming they crewated so and so that could be debunked etc.) the only people praising it were irrelevant fans like Questlove and friends of the director, the people that mattered and who actually were there when it mattered so have facts said it was a hit piece and the narrative was to make him seem like a abuser, when the people who were interviewed and wewre there when PRince was around said it was bullshit and he wasn't abusing.
Anyway, releases will come we just have to be more patient, not that big of a deal when there's more than enough to listen to from Prince while we wait.

JorisE73 said:

Asking us what we want at this point seems like nothing but a stalling tactic. They'll never get everybody to agree on one thing except that something, anything, is better than nothing. Even another Purple Rain rehash- it would be lazy but it's still something.

It's too bad about the documentary. The man led an interesting life and it would make for a great story. I never viewed Prince as an angel or role-model even, so what some might call a hit piece I'd likely see as a version of the unvarnished truth as long as it was a balanced look at his life. Even though he was a private man we already know a lot of the bad. He was a controlling person and he certainly had questionable relationships with underage girls. We know about his drug problems and as he got older he seemed quite set in his ways- a lot more preachy and less open to opinions other than his. Then on the other hand we also know he had a big heart and had a great sense of humor. He could also be very sensitive and thoughtful. As he liked to say it was all in the music.

Anyway, I've tried to give the Estate the benefit of the doubt but my expectations are extremely low. I won't belittle them or disrespect them because I'm more disappointed than angry. I suppose I'm not as avid a fan as others. I'm sure there are things behind the scenes we aren't aware of but at this point it's pretty clear that the Estate is being grossly mismanaged. It's one thing for Prince to be cryptic, mercurial and whimsical-- it's part of his appeal-- it's another for Londell and Co. to act that way.

whodknee said:

Asking us what we want at this point seems like nothing but a stalling tactic. They'll never get everybody to agree on one thing except that something, anything, is better than nothing.

THIS.

Besides, WHY would the fans do THEIR job in the first place ? Who's getting paid at the end of the day ? Not me, not you.

Hire a professionnal archivist and let him do the job. There was one in place by the way and they let him go.

I'm not optimistic at all of the current state of affairs. In fact, I wouldn't be surprised if the commented ATWIAD "deluxe" or "super deluxe" expected next ain't more than the remastered album plus 12" versions and B-Sides. Sure, available in Dolby Atmos and with a glossy packaging. IF coming out at all after all. Sigh...

.

It's like they are avoiding by any means to touch anything previously unreleased from the vault.

.

Hope to be proven wrong, but at this stage I'm more optimistic for any new bootleg release than an official one.

fredmagnus said:

whodknee said:

Asking us what we want at this point seems like nothing but a stalling tactic. They'll never get everybody to agree on one thing except that something, anything, is better than nothing.

THIS.

Besides, WHY would the fans do THEIR job in the first place ? Who's getting paid at the end of the day ? Not me, not you.

Hire a professionnal archivist and let him do the job. There was one in place by the way and they let him go.

It's not there job to release anything, it's there job to uphold and take care of Prince's legacy.
If they want to do releases then the releases should be good enough to have Prince's name on it and not some half ass release just to please a handful of toxic vocal fans.
The releases will come we just need to be patient. I woul d better that they take there time to prepare a respectful release instead of getting another half ass Piano and Microphone 83 release or Originals with some outside moron getting 'creative' with Prince's work.
at least that is how I understand it

[Edited 7/9/25 7:54am]

psyche2 said:

psyche2 said:

happyshopper said:

JorisE73 said:

fredmagnus said:

THIS.

Besides, WHY would the fans do THEIR job in the first place ? Who's getting paid at the end of the day ? Not me, not you.

Hire a professionnal archivist and let him do the job. There was one in place by the way and they let him go.

It's not there job to release anything, it's there job to uphold and take care of Prince's legacy.
If they want to do releases then the releases should be good enough to have Prince's name on it and not some half ass release just to please a handful of toxic vocal fans.
The releases will come we just need to be patient. I woul d better that they take there time to prepare a respectful release instead of getting another half ass Piano and Microphone 83 release or Originals with some outside moron getting 'creative' with Prince's work.
at least that is how I understand it

[Edited 7/9/25 7:54am]

*Their.

bozojones said:

JorisE73 said:

It's not there job to release anything, it's there job to uphold and take care of Prince's legacy.
If they want to do releases then the releases should be good enough to have Prince's name on it and not some half ass release just to please a handful of toxic vocal fans.
The releases will come we just need to be patient. I woul d better that they take there time to prepare a respectful release instead of getting another half ass Piano and Microphone 83 release or Originals with some outside moron getting 'creative' with Prince's work.
at least that is how I understand it

[Edited 7/9/25 7:54am]

*Their.

Who cares clown? people know what I mean. Besides let me see you type Dutch, German, French, Latin, Greek, Spanish flawlessly without using a translation app. LOL English isn't even my third language

JorisE73 said:

JorisE73 said:

ShellyMcG said:

JorisE73 said:

It's not there job to release anything, it's there job to uphold and take care of Prince's legacy.
If they want to do releases then the releases should be good enough to have Prince's name on it and not some half ass release just to please a handful of toxic vocal fans.
The releases will come we just need to be patient. I woul d better that they take there time to prepare a respectful release instead of getting another half ass Piano and Microphone 83 release or Originals with some outside moron getting 'creative' with Prince's work.
at least that is how I understand it

[Edited 7/9/25 7:54am]

How else do they uphold his legacy other than releasing stuff from the vault though? Prince's whole thing was that he was all about the music. He dedicated his life to it. He worked himself into an early grave because of this dedication. The man IS music. There is no better way to protect his legacy than opening up the vault and revealing his music to the world. And yeah, obviously we would all agree with you that it would be better for them to take their time and put out something that is worthy of the man. But seriously, how much time do they need? There's asking fans to be patient and then there's just taking the piss. I'm kind of lucky in that I'm a lot younger than most Prince fans so I have the time to wait. But, not to be morbid, a lot of Prince's fans are old. Will there even be an audience left to hear whatever the estate puts out when they eventually get their thumb out of their ass and release something?

You can't please everyone and the 'old' fans shouldnb't be a focus. Teh 'old' had the chance to witness it all when Prince was alive. NOw the Estate shgould just focus on 'Prince' and his legacy (which was sooo much more than only his music).
Besides old fans or new fans, the money is the same.

JorisE73 said:

JorisE73 said:

MIRvmn1 said:

JorisE73 said:

You can't please everyone and the 'old' fans shouldnb't be a focus. Teh 'old' had the chance to witness it all when Prince was alive. NOw the Estate shgould just focus on 'Prince' and his legacy (which was sooo much more than only his music).
Besides old fans or new fans, the money is the same.

But it’s the older fans who are actually interested in and buying the vault material and box sets. It sounds like u think the estate should focus more on the casual fans who are only interested in Purple Rain and merchandise. [Edited 7/10/25 12:47pm]

That's not what I'm saying tho. Teh focus should be on teaching the world about Prince because he was much more tahn 'only' his work in a studio or on stage. This could create new fans instead of rehashing the old albums with new tracks that mostly only the old fans will buy.
thwere focus hould be creating new fans by teaching what Prince was about instead of only his music.
Whenever I see a article on Prince it almost always starts with 'teh Purple Rain singer', that should stop and I think most of his old fans would agree. To me it seems that 'the world' only knows prince for Purple Rain and that;s it and teh media isn't hel[poing either, so the Estate should focus on that.

[Edited 7/10/25 12:55pm]

JorisE73 said:

MIRvmn1 said:

JorisE73 said: But it’s the older fans who are actually interested in and buying the vault material and box sets. It sounds like u think the estate should focus more on the casual fans who are only interested in Purple Rain and merchandise. [Edited 7/10/25 12:47pm]

That's not what I'm saying tho. Teh focus should be on teaching the world about Prince because he was much more tahn 'only' his work in a studio or on stage. This could create new fans instead of rehashing the old albums with new tracks that mostly only the old fans will buy.
thwere focus hould be creating new fans by teaching what Prince was about instead of only his music.
Whenever I see a article on Prince it almost always starts with 'teh Purple Rain singer', that should stop and I think most of his old fans would agree. To me it seems that 'the world' only knows prince for Purple Rain and that;s it and teh media isn't hel[poing either, so the Estate should focus on that.

[Edited 7/10/25 12:55pm]

All the more reason to release music other than Purple Rain. And I'm not sure that you can establish Prince's legacy without regard to his music or his performances. The man was his music: he lived for it, all day and all night. I find Prince to be an interesting (if somewhat frustrating) character, and certainly he had a tremendous influence on style and culture, but at the end of the day, I only really care about his music and his performances -- those are the things that motivate me to keep coming back, to search for more material, and to find out more about the man himself. Indeed, I don't quite agree that Prince was much more than his work in a studio or on stage, at least to the extent that anyone would find very interesting (or that is anyone's business). So I can't imagine trying to establish Prince's legacy without putting the music front and center. I could never think of it as "only his music," because his music was so much.

happyshopper said:

I’ve just been looking at the Bowie box sets. They’re quite a nice way of rereleasing batches of remastered albums. 4 or 5 at a time, covering certain periods. (Also 1 a year is too slow for artists with big catalogs)

.
This series of Bowie box sets started before his passing, so obviously he gave his blessings for them – still, it took 10 years for the 6th (final) box to come out this fall, even though they don't contain a ton of unreleased masters, just concerts and some rarities.
(Just for comparison: when Rykodisc licensed the Bowie-catalog in 1990, they released the new remasters – with bonus tracks – at a 3 albums per month speed. They were also fast with rereleasing the Zappa catalog earlier.)
.
But they are excellent sets, no doubt – and in addition to these album-collections, the Bowie Estate also released some era-specific, separate collections that dig far deeper into his archives.

JorisE73 said:

ShellyMcG said:

JorisE73 said: How else do they uphold his legacy other than releasing stuff from the vault though? Prince's whole thing was that he was all about the music. He dedicated his life to it. He worked himself into an early grave because of this dedication. The man IS music. There is no better way to protect his legacy than opening up the vault and revealing his music to the world. And yeah, obviously we would all agree with you that it would be better for them to take their time and put out something that is worthy of the man. But seriously, how much time do they need? There's asking fans to be patient and then there's just taking the piss. I'm kind of lucky in that I'm a lot younger than most Prince fans so I have the time to wait. But, not to be morbid, a lot of Prince's fans are old. Will there even be an audience left to hear whatever the estate puts out when they eventually get their thumb out of their ass and release something?

You can't please everyone and the 'old' fans shouldnb't be a focus. Teh 'old' had the chance to witness it all when Prince was alive. NOw the Estate shgould just focus on 'Prince' and his legacy (which was sooo much more than only his music).
Besides old fans or new fans, the money is the same.

The Estate should def focus on Prince and his legacy, which is his music. Ofcourse there are many other things, but music should be the main thing.

So in that regards there should be something for old and new fans.

.

IMO old fans are the "cash cow" they will buy almost everything music related.

The Estate can use this cash to also invest in attracting new fans.

.

I would love to see some dance/house versions of P's music.

Amsterdam Dance Event is coming up, would be great to hear some P mixes.

JorisE73 said:

MIRvmn1 said:

JorisE73 said: But it’s the older fans who are actually interested in and buying the vault material and box sets. It sounds like u think the estate should focus more on the casual fans who are only interested in Purple Rain and merchandise. [Edited 7/10/25 12:47pm]

That's not what I'm saying tho. Teh focus should be on teaching the world about Prince because he was much more tahn 'only' his work in a studio or on stage. This could create new fans instead of rehashing the old albums with new tracks that mostly only the old fans will buy.
thwere focus hould be creating new fans by teaching what Prince was about instead of only his music.
Whenever I see a article on Prince it almost always starts with 'teh Purple Rain singer', that should stop and I think most of his old fans would agree. To me it seems that 'the world' only knows prince for Purple Rain and that;s it and teh media isn't hel[poing either, so the Estate should focus on that.

[Edited 7/10/25 12:55pm]

As much as I respect you, JorisE73, and most of the times agree or share your points of view, I don't really see it your way on this. Prince, you either got it or you don't. It's been always this way, even at his peak of commercial success. I appreciate the idea of schooling about him, even more now that he's gone, but that's like the opposite of his whole career. A huge part of his charm (musically, personally, whatever) was the determination of his fan base to find out what it really was. It was never easy, but most of the times it was rewarding.

JorisE73 said:

ShellyMcG said:

JorisE73 said:

That's not what I'm saying tho. Teh focus should be on teaching the world about Prince because he was much more tahn 'only' his work in a studio or on stage. This could create new fans instead of rehashing the old albums with new tracks that mostly only the old fans will buy.
thwere focus hould be creating new fans by teaching what Prince was about instead of only his music.
Whenever I see a article on Prince it almost always starts with 'teh Purple Rain singer', that should stop and I think most of his old fans would agree. To me it seems that 'the world' only knows prince for Purple Rain and that;s it and teh media isn't hel[poing either, so the Estate should focus on that.

[Edited 7/10/25 12:55pm]

Interesting. Just curious though. What, aside from music, do you think could turn someone into a Prince fan? I know you say "teaching people what Prince was about" but could you expand on that? Like, his charitable contributions? Things like that?

Nothing except a well done balanced documentary like the one ther Estate just destroyed.

ShellyMcG said:

JorisE73 said:

It's not there job to release anything, it's there job to uphold and take care of Prince's legacy.
If they want to do releases then the releases should be good enough to have Prince's name on it and not some half ass release just to please a handful of toxic vocal fans.
The releases will come we just need to be patient. I woul d better that they take there time to prepare a respectful release instead of getting another half ass Piano and Microphone 83 release or Originals with some outside moron getting 'creative' with Prince's work.
at least that is how I understand it

[Edited 7/9/25 7:54am]

How else do they uphold his legacy other than releasing stuff from the vault though? Prince's whole thing was that he was all about the music. He dedicated his life to it. He worked himself into an early grave because of this dedication. The man IS music. There is no better way to protect his legacy than opening up the vault and revealing his music to the world. And yeah, obviously we would all agree with you that it would be better for them to take their time and put out something that is worthy of the man. But seriously, how much time do they need? There's asking fans to be patient and then there's just taking the piss. I'm kind of lucky in that I'm a lot younger than most Prince fans so I have the time to wait. But, not to be morbid, a lot of Prince's fans are old. Will there even be an audience left to hear whatever the estate puts out when they eventually get their thumb out of their ass and release something?

Nobody wants to see more vault stuff released than I do. Nothing would make me happier than to see every note of music and every pixel of video from the vault released.

But the truth is this will do NOTHING to 'uphold his legacy'. The vault stuff ONLY appeals to the diehard fans who loved his work when he was alive so much that we want to hear every note. And most of us are on the downside trajectory of life.

I have a 17 year old daughter who knows who Prince is, knows he was cool and important, and even has a "Purple Rain" t-shirt she wears. But I doubt she could name a single Prince song. Why? Because virtually no effort has been put towards upholding his legacy with younger generations. Kids her age know more Connie Francis songs right now than they do Prince songs.

What upheld ABBA's legacy? (And my 17 year old can sing for you a dozen ABBA songs) Not releasing vault tracks and Super Deluxe Editions of old albums that only the diehard fans would care about, but "Mamma Mia". While fans here have constantly mocked and derided the upcoming "Purple Rain" musical, the fact is that should is be successful (which, sadly, my instincts tell me it will not for a number of reasons, but hopefully I'm wrong) that will do FAR MORE to uphold his legacy than will any multi-disc boxed set of a re-released album with vault tracks.

[Edited 7/13/25 4:13am]

Gooddoctor23 said:

ShellyMcG said:

JorisE73 said: Interesting. Just curious though. What, aside from music, do you think could turn someone into a Prince fan? I know you say "teaching people what Prince was about" but could you expand on that? Like, his charitable contributions? Things like that?

Nothing except a well done balanced documentary like the one ther Estate just destroyed.

Also wrong. No one cares about documentaries, well balanced or otherwise, except diehard fans.

Far more people would be interested in a well done (if perhaps imperfect and the diehard fans pick apart for the imperfections) biopic, like "Bohemian Rhapsody" or "A Complete Unknown" than a documentary.

And Prince's lifestory -- even if it's to take just a small slice of it, like "A Complete Unknown" did -- would make a great movie if presented well.

keywiz said:

Gooddoctor23 said:

Nothing except a well done balanced documentary like the one ther Estate just destroyed.

Also wrong. No one cares about documentaries, well balanced or otherwise, except diehard fans.

Far more people would be interested in a well done (if perhaps imperfect and the diehard fans pick apart for the imperfections) biopic, like "Bohemian Rhapsody" or "A Complete Unknown" than a documentary.

And Prince's lifestory -- even if it's to take just a small slice of it, like "A Complete Unknown" did -- would make a great movie if presented well.

I'm thinking more along the lines of the OJ movie/doc. Not only was it great, it won awards.