Nope, not interested. I want to listen to real music created by real human beings with real emotions, not some approximation created by a trained algorithm.

When there is so much real music left in the Vault to hear, why do we need fake music?

One day in the distance furture when everthing in the vault has been released and we're left with literally no possiblity of hearing anything new, I'll still probably be opposed to listening to definitionally inauthentic music. But at that point, at least I'd understand the question and the point of view of people more tolerant of AI. But as long as we still have real music to discover, I honestly can't see any perspective from which your question makes sense.

lurker316 said:

When there is so much real music left in the Vault to hear, why do we need fake music?

One day in the distance furture when everthing in the vault has been released and we're left with literally no possiblity of hearing anything new, I'll still probably be opposed to listening to definitionally inauthentic music. But at that point, at least I'd understand the question and the point of view of people more tolerant of AI. But as long as we still have real music to discover, I honestly can't see any perspective from which your question makes sense.

And even if we did somehow run out of Prince music to discover, I'd rather go back and relisten to it all, or listen to any one of countless albums made by real human artists than turn to technology for some meaningless piece of artificial entertainment. Are we really that unimaginitive that we have to rely on computers to churn out "content" for our amusement?

bozojones said:

Nope, not interested. I want to listen to real music created by real human beings with real emotions, not some approximation created by a trained algorithm.

Preach!

"It's cool to get on the computer, but don't let the computer get on you." It's cool to use a computer but don't let the computer use you!"

- Prince

https://www.youtube.com/w...y7i9ru7HB8

This will happen. This will happen for Prince music. But this will also happen for everything else.

This will be the biggest crisis of meaning humanity will ever face. We're not ready.

Only possible aspect that I'm slightly interested in this regard is the possibility of cleaning up audience recordings. Can't see that happening anytime soon, and even if feasible I'm sure it will have it's limitations, but go figure, the trove of shows making the rounds in awful sound quality suddenly listenable.

psyche2 said:

Only possible aspect that I'm slightly interested in this regard is the possibility of cleaning up audience recordings. Can't see that happening anytime soon, and even if feasible I'm sure it will have it's limitations, but go figure, the trove of shows making the rounds in awful sound quality suddenly listenable.

I have a bunch of audience recordings I've cleaned up using AI - They are out there

You're right, they do have limitations - If the quality of the underlying music is rubbish, then that will remain... however this has opened up a lot of shows for me that I would never have listened to before

Also, I am very contrary to the rest of this group - AI will soon be smarter than us - in some ways it already is... in some ways it will never be....

No human could digest all the millions of tracks that exist on spotify... AI can!!!

If they let it loose, I'm sure it could create some amazing music......In any case, Prince is no longer with us, so what's there to lose? It won't affect him..... the only people that would lose out are the money grabbing estate...

Also, if you don't want to hear AI Prince... you don't need to.. ever!! - Just dont't go there... (can't we all just get along?)


I'm not trying to be trolly here - I swear... I'm just laying out my personal opinion which is very contrary to most... and I do respect your opinions. I just feel.... differently

*delete*

[Edited 3/3/25 13:14pm]

I think we'll grow tired very quickly of AI Prince clones. Once the floodgates open, I imagine the novelty will wear off very quickly.

And then, at last, people might start looking for something new again. And it will be about time!

(Same in films, I imagine: how many Star Wars remakes will they be able to produce using AI princess Leias and Han Solos before the thrill fades, and people will stop being interested. 2? 3?)

Once the rehashing stops, AI will probably become a tool that will allow new forms of creativeness, way beyond repeating the past.

mclihah2 said:

psyche2 said:

Only possible aspect that I'm slightly interested in this regard is the possibility of cleaning up audience recordings. Can't see that happening anytime soon, and even if feasible I'm sure it will have it's limitations, but go figure, the trove of shows making the rounds in awful sound quality suddenly listenable.

I have a bunch of audience recordings I've cleaned up using AI - They are out there

You're right, they do have limitations - If the quality of the underlying music is rubbish, then that will remain... however this has opened up a lot of shows for me that I would never have listened to before

Also, I am very contrary to the rest of this group - AI will soon be smarter than us - in some ways it already is... in some ways it will never be....

No human could digest all the millions of tracks that exist on spotify... AI can!!!

If they let it loose, I'm sure it could create some amazing music......In any case, Prince is no longer with us, so what's there to lose? It won't affect him..... the only people that would lose out are the money grabbing estate...

Also, if you don't want to hear AI Prince... you don't need to.. ever!! - Just dont't go there... (can't we all just get along?)


I'm not trying to be trolly here - I swear... I'm just laying out my personal opinion which is very contrary to most... and I do respect your opinions. I just feel.... differently

Just because a technological advancement can exist doesn't necessary mean that it should. Music is an inherently human art form - even if it has evolved over the decades with the rise of digital recording and digital effects, it's still created by real human beings at its core. As far as I'm concern, something created by machine learning is *not* human and it is *not* art. It's a cheap replacement that undercuts living, breathing artists who are already struggling to survive off of their work. The more that people like you embrace AI generated music, the more that real musicians will be pushed out of the industry and relegated to the sidelines.

There are potential benefits to AI technology in more practical applications, but I don't like this rush to replace real human artists with artificiality. It's kind of terrifying how eager some people are to give up the humanity of art and music.

I am interested.

bozojones said:

mclihah2 said:

I have a bunch of audience recordings I've cleaned up using AI - They are out there

You're right, they do have limitations - If the quality of the underlying music is rubbish, then that will remain... however this has opened up a lot of shows for me that I would never have listened to before

Also, I am very contrary to the rest of this group - AI will soon be smarter than us - in some ways it already is... in some ways it will never be....

No human could digest all the millions of tracks that exist on spotify... AI can!!!

If they let it loose, I'm sure it could create some amazing music......In any case, Prince is no longer with us, so what's there to lose? It won't affect him..... the only people that would lose out are the money grabbing estate...

Also, if you don't want to hear AI Prince... you don't need to.. ever!! - Just dont't go there... (can't we all just get along?)


I'm not trying to be trolly here - I swear... I'm just laying out my personal opinion which is very contrary to most... and I do respect your opinions. I just feel.... differently

Just because a technological advancement can exist doesn't necessary mean that it should. Music is an inherently human art form - even if it has evolved over the decades with the rise of digital recording and digital effects, it's still created by real human beings at its core. As far as I'm concern, something created by machine learning is *not* human and it is *not* art. It's a cheap replacement that undercuts living, breathing artists who are already struggling to survive off of their work. The more that people like you embrace AI generated music, the more that real musicians will be pushed out of the industry and relegated to the sidelines.

There are potential benefits to AI technology in more practical applications, but I don't like this rush to replace real human artists with artificiality. It's kind of terrifying how eager some people are to give up the humanity of art and music.

Without that there is no art and music.

bozojones said:

.....Music is an inherently human art form - even if it has evolved over the decades with the rise of digital recording and digital effects, it's still created by real human beings at its core. As far as I'm concern, something created by machine learning is *not* human and it is *not* art. It's a cheap replacement that undercuts living, breathing artists who are already struggling to survive off of their work. The more that people like you embrace AI generated music, the more that real musicians will be pushed out of the industry and relegated to the sidelines.

I understand the sentiment, and respect your opinion.

When you say 'Music is an inherently human art form'... I would slightly disagree, and say... where we are heading, is..... 'Music was, historically, a human-only art form'

The reality is that this technology juggernaut is chugging away at an incredible speed - We have governments throwing away AI safeguard regulations and trillion dollar tech companies asking their staff to work overtime to chase this thing - Not to mention the East vs West dynamic on this.

... and at the core of this, is a technology that simulates the way human neurons works - In many ways, AI works like the human brain (rewarded pathways etc)... we don't know *how* they are connecting the dots.... they just do..... Just like the human brain..

Imagine, if you could get a human, who is able to consume *every* track on Spotify, every piece of literature, every news article, and every online debate..... It's not possible

and yet, with AI, we are creating such a mind... forget creating music as *good* as Prince.... The way this thing is going, it's going to have to dumb itself down to create music as *simple* as Prince.


For me, I'll just enjoy the ride, and embrace our new overlords.... Until they decide to 'kill all humans'

bozojones said:

It's kind of terrifying how eager some people are to give up the humanity of art and music.

Indeed.

I find the whole AI thing inherently vapid.

And all of its proponents always have this drone-like fevency that A.I. is going to be like sliced bread-meets-the creation of fire, but all of it exudes this cheap, plastic quality.

luv2tha99s said:

Maybe in a thousand years or more.

Nope. Way, way sooner.

lurker316 said:

When there is so much real music left in the Vault to hear,

why do we need fake music?

One day in the distance furture when everthing in the vault has been released and we're left with literally no possiblity of hearing anything new, I'll still probably be opposed to listening to definitionally inauthentic music. But at that point, at least I'd understand the question and the point of view of people more tolerant of AI. But as long as we still have real music to discover, I honestly can't see any perspective from which your question makes sense.

Exactly. We need MORE real music, but it's not coming the way we lik, right?

Take it or leave it. We can't change that.

Then again, this is besides the point.

I am interested in all kinds of creativity, being man made or computer generated.

I don't need all of Prince's music to be out there before i'm going to listen to some AI generated tests. Because that's what they are. Nothing else.

Probably, the kind of computer generated music based on behalf of Prince's 'know and (un)released' legacy, it probably would sound like a copy of a copy. "Possibly" I say, I don't know for sure... yet.

I'll keep my opinion for later, after seeying or hearing it.

I'm not too old to care. I like new challenges.

If Prince was still alive, I'm sure he would be curious, possibly use it, and surpisingly got away with it.

He always surrounded himself with new 'kids'. To stay relevant.

He was always in for something new.

He even gave production away on one of his last albums. Which was unheard of!

(but didn't turn out all that well imho. anyways...)

This video by this great French YouTuber, which I just watched last night, addresses it: https://www.youtube.com/w...JE2qkP0Gk4

(He also made a whole series of very insightful videos about AIs. I believe you can watch most, if not all of them with English subtitles: https://www.youtube.com/w...qyfivFqJd)

.

In a nutshell, he takes 2 examples: first, he explains that if you google painter Hieronymus Bosch, you already find more AI generated images than pictures of his real works. Then, since he's running a philosophy channel, he takes the example of YT videos addressing (or claiming to address) Stoicism: the VAST majority of what you will find is (really poor quality) AI generated videos.

.

He concludes by addressing the Dead Internet Theory (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dead_Internet_theory), originally a conspiracy theory, now becoming a reality: we're getting closer each month to reaching the point when the majority of online content will be generated by bots and AIs, as opposed to humans.

.

One huge issue with that, besides the absurd amount of resources (servers) required to host all this AI content, is that people will find it harder and harder to distinguish real content from AI content. Many people will google Bosch and simply assume what they see is the painter's work. This is also true for news items of course, which can have disatrous political and societal results. This will also soon be true for most scientific content and works of arts.

.

What's ironic is that for YEARS I've been warning our specific community about why fanmade Prince mixes, now replaced by AI Prince mixes (and soon by entirely fake AI Prince songs) are wrong because casual listeners (sometimes even hardcore fans, it's already happened many times on this very board) will not be able to differentiate the real thing from fake content, and that it would hurt Prince's legacy on the long run, and most of the community kept laughing at my warnings, saying it doesn't matter (or even embracing said fake contents). Well, admitedly the issue is now much bigger than just Prince, but there we are, and it's just the begining...

.

[Edited 3/11/25 16:46pm]

olb99 said:

luv2tha99s said:

Maybe in a thousand years or more.

Nope. Way, way sooner.

I agree. It's a matter of years, a decade at best. The mix of naivety and arrogance displayed here is all the more concerning because it shows how much many people don't realize what's coming, thus won't be ready (if there's any way to be ready anyway). We already have so many cases of people, even AI experts, claiming that AIs won't be able to do this or that, then proven wrong in a matter of years, sometimes months. But no, people cherish the ancient illusion that there's something unique to humans capacities. There isn't.

.

The only way we'll have to know whether future leaks are genuine is though research, and in this regard the Estate would be better off putting an end to their policy of opacity, make a public inventory of what's in the vault (even if they don't release the material) and allow people like Duane to research and write about it. But they, too, I guess, believe the world will always be as it is...

databank said:

This video by this great French YouTubers, which I just watched last night, addresses it: https://www.youtube.com/w...JE2qkP0Gk4

(He also made a whole series of very insightful videos about AIs. I believe you can watch most, if not all of them with English subtitles: https://www.youtube.com/w...qyfivFqJd)

.

In a nutshell, he takes 2 examples: first, he explains that if you google painter Hieronymus Bosch, you already find more AI generated images than pictures of his real works. Then, since he's running a philosophy channel, he takes the example of YT videos addressing (or claiming to address) Stoicism: the VAST majority of what you will find is (really poor quality) AI generated videos.

.

He concludes by addressing the Dead Internet Theory (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dead_Internet_theory), originally a conspiracy theory, now becoming a reality: we're getting closer each month to reaching the point when the majority of online content will be generated by bots and AIs, as opposed to humans.

.

One huge issue with that, besides the absurd amount of resources (servers) required to host all this AI content, is that people will find it harder and harder to distinguish real content from AI content. Many people will google Bosch and simply assume what they see is the painter's work. This is also true for news items of course, which can have disatrous political and societal results. This will also soon be true for most scientific content and works of arts.

.

What's ironic is that for YEARS I've been warning our specific community about why fanmade Prince mixes, now replaced by AI Prince mixes (and soon by entirely fake AI Prince songs) are wrong because casual listeners will not be able to differentiate the real thing from fake content, and that it would hurt Prince's legacy on the long run, and most of the community kept laughing at my warnings, saying it doesn't matter (or even embracing said fake contents. Well, admitedly the issue is now much bigger than just Prince, but there we are, and it's just the begining...

.
The other day I was browsing Etsy and most of my searches for Basquiat resulted in fake (AI generated) graphics in his style, so yeah, it is happening already.
.
But I have a feeling (or hope) that our machines will soon have automatic filters/gateways etc that will flag AI-stuff for us so we won't end up being flooded with fake art and fake news. Not that our governments worry about fake Prince songs, but I'm sure they are worried about fake news sparking international conflicts, quite possibly wars. So developing such filters must be top priority, at least I would assume so.