TrivialPursuit said:

Which one is better: Can't Slow Down or Dancing On The Ceiling?

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Can't Stop This Feeling I Got is better than both.

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And here you are again. Does this have anything to do with the topic or is it just that you can't stop?

The whole thread is about whether Prince got away with theft in the 1980s and would not now. The question by the OP was framed in terms of 2022.

i mean, sure, but at the same time, if prince was emerging today, to get the same kind of reaction, he would have be fairly different, and push different buttons, he would have to claim to be non binary for example, to be gender fluid, etc etc. he would also have to not just act effeminate, but claim to be fucking men and women, as well as non binary partners. the stakes are a bit different. and as you may have noticed, reactions to this sort of thing are not really benign. people get pretty fucking heated about this stuff. a 2022 prince would be a bit like the artst yves tumour.

https://gaycitynews.com/yves-tumors-latest-outstrips-past-successes/

Yves Tumor’s very identity is in constant flux. They started out as a chillwave artist in the early 2010s. They have also used the aliases Bekelé Berhanu, Yvesie, and Shanti to make deconstructed dance music. If Tumor began as an experimental noise artist, the queer, non-binary singer/ songwriter/ producer has evolved into a constantly mutating rock star in the vein of Bjork, Lady Gaga, David Bowie, and Prince.

Seemingly a love song between Tumor and Gordon, “Kerosene!” works on multiple levels. For an artist who has tried as hard as Tumor to remain mysterious, singing, “I can be anything you need… I can be your fantasy” feels like outreach to his audience. On a song that could be their mainstream breakthrough, Tumor and Gordon sing about fulfilling each other’s desires by modeling themselves on the other’s dreams. Isn’t that what pop music stardom has always been about? It takes on a queer twist by the fact that the song keeps explicitly bringing up gender in the context of such roleplay. “I can be your little girl” might go unnoticed in a typical love song sung by a heterosexual woman, but when the artist is non-binary, it stands out.

funkbabyandthebabysitters said:

The whole thread is about whether Prince got away with theft in the 1980s and would not now. The question by the OP was framed in terms of 2022.

i mean, sure, but at the same time, if prince was emerging today, to get the same kind of reaction, he would have be fairly different, and push different buttons, he would have to claim to be non binary for example, to be gender fluid, etc etc. he would also have to not just act effeminate, but claim to be fucking men and women, as well as non binary partners. the stakes are a bit different. and as you may have noticed, reactions to this sort of thing are not really benign. people get pretty fucking heated about this stuff. a 2022 prince would be a bit like the artst yves tumour.

https://gaycitynews.com/yves-tumors-latest-outstrips-past-successes/

Yves Tumor’s very identity is in constant flux. They started out as a chillwave artist in the early 2010s. They have also used the aliases Bekelé Berhanu, Yvesie, and Shanti to make deconstructed dance music. If Tumor began as an experimental noise artist, the queer, non-binary singer/ songwriter/ producer has evolved into a constantly mutating rock star in the vein of Bjork, Lady Gaga, David Bowie, and Prince.

Seemingly a love song between Tumor and Gordon, “Kerosene!” works on multiple levels. For an artist who has tried as hard as Tumor to remain mysterious, singing, “I can be anything you need… I can be your fantasy” feels like outreach to his audience. On a song that could be their mainstream breakthrough, Tumor and Gordon sing about fulfilling each other’s desires by modeling themselves on the other’s dreams. Isn’t that what pop music stardom has always been about? It takes on a queer twist by the fact that the song keeps explicitly bringing up gender in the context of such roleplay. “I can be your little girl” might go unnoticed in a typical love song sung by a heterosexual woman, but when the artist is non-binary, it stands out.

I wonder what he thought of non-binary people. Did this term exist in the 80's ? A lot of people believe that his symbol was an expression of that.

[Edited 9/6/22 14:37pm]

I'm doing some research on twitter and a lot of young gen-z are saying Prince is the reason they are non-binary. Interesting. I wonder how he would feel about it.

His death exposed him to Gen-Z and the reactions are interesting.

funkbabyandthebabysitters said:

The whole thread is about whether Prince got away with theft in the 1980s and would not now. The question by the OP was framed in terms of 2022.

i mean, sure, but at the same time, if prince was emerging today, to get the same kind of reaction, he would have be fairly different, and push different buttons, he would have to claim to be non binary for example, to be gender fluid, etc etc. he would also have to not just act effeminate, but claim to be fucking men and women, as well as non binary partners. the stakes are a bit different. and as you may have noticed, reactions to this sort of thing are not really benign. people get pretty fucking heated about this stuff. a 2022 prince would be a bit like the artst yves tumour.

https://gaycitynews.com/yves-tumors-latest-outstrips-past-successes/

Yves Tumor’s very identity is in constant flux. They started out as a chillwave artist in the early 2010s. They have also used the aliases Bekelé Berhanu, Yvesie, and Shanti to make deconstructed dance music. If Tumor began as an experimental noise artist, the queer, non-binary singer/ songwriter/ producer has evolved into a constantly mutating rock star in the vein of Bjork, Lady Gaga, David Bowie, and Prince.

Seemingly a love song between Tumor and Gordon, “Kerosene!” works on multiple levels. For an artist who has tried as hard as Tumor to remain mysterious, singing, “I can be anything you need… I can be your fantasy” feels like outreach to his audience. On a song that could be their mainstream breakthrough, Tumor and Gordon sing about fulfilling each other’s desires by modeling themselves on the other’s dreams. Isn’t that what pop music stardom has always been about? It takes on a queer twist by the fact that the song keeps explicitly bringing up gender in the context of such roleplay. “I can be your little girl” might go unnoticed in a typical love song sung by a heterosexual woman, but when the artist is non-binary, it stands out.

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This assumes that Prince deliberately pretended to be gay to stand out. It is good that it is not just you repeating yourself over and over this time.

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Sure he would be different if he was starting now - He would have had different influences and experiences. Prince was always a mix of seeking to do what the girls loved and seeking to stand out, but also always seeking to be himself. He did not ever claim to be gay to get an audience when others did in the 1970s, so I do not see Prince2022 claiming they were non binary if they did not feel non binary, but given what he later called his "gemini" nature, they certainly could genuinely express that they had a non-binary/gender fluid identity. Non-Binary/gender fluidity is an identity issue, not a sexual preference issue. I don't think Prince2022 would have to have sex with people he was not attracted to just for the image, streams and likes - this is a creepy stretch but just think about how much wishful thinking there would on Prince2022.org in 2062 in all directions.

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I don't know if Prince2022 would be like Yves Tumor because he was not like an early day Tumor - Prince melded what he was really like with his brand to stand out, not be like someone else. But, sure, he may get influenced by people like Tumor.

IanRG said:

I came here to fuck spiders, mate.

I wonder what he thought of non-binary people. Did this term exist in the 80's ? A lot of people believe that his symbol was an expression of that.

the thing about prince is he loved to mislead and confuse and obscure. so im sure he would love the idea of people taking something of his and having multiple readings of it - that would be a compliment to him. however, idk where mid 10s prince stood on things like gender or sexuality. he did sing 'im not a woman, im not a man, i am something you will never understand' though, which has got to be one of his most famous lyrics next to 'am i black or white am i straight or gay?'

I'm doing some research on twitter and a lot of young gen-z are saying Prince is the reason they are non-binary. Interesting. I wonder how he would feel about it.

really? id have thought this generation have plenty of other public figures to fulfill that role already.

Sure he would be different if he was starting now - He would have had different influences and experiences. Prince was always a mix of seeking to do what the girls loved and seeking to stand out, but also always seeking to be himself. He did not ever claim to be gay to get an audience when others did in the 1970s, so I do not see Prince2022 claiming they were non binary if they did not feel non binary, but given what he later called his "gemini" nature, they certainly could genuinely express that they had a non-binary/gender fluid identity. Non-Binary/gender fluidity is an identity issue, not a sexual preference issue. I don't think Prince2022 would have to have sex with people he was not attracted to just for the image, streams and likes - this is a creepy stretch but just think about how much wishful thinking there would on Prince2022.org in 2062 in all directions.

ian ian ian, looking at things 100% literally once more. yes non binary is a gender issue, the point is that in terms of sexuality and gender, concepts which prince was very much invested in and wrote about, each generation has new battle lines, and i listed some which are hot button topics these days. who cares that he didnt SAY he was gay. he was ALLUDING TO IT, SUGGESTING IT, IMPLYING IT, HINTING AT IT, etc etc. i know at this point you will tell me that he always denied it in interviews. well he said a lot of stuff in interviews. at the risk of a poor taste example, he also said his child was still alive in 96 which we all know was false. why wouldnt a 2022prince say they were non binary when the man himself wrote IM NOT A WOMAN IM NOT A MAN? he was basically declaring it (however falsely) in 1984. i never said prince would have to have sex, but he would likely have to indicate it was a possibility (whether acting on it or not).

funkbabyandthebabysitters said:

I wonder what he thought of non-binary people. Did this term exist in the 80's ? A lot of people believe that his symbol was an expression of that.

the thing about prince is he loved to mislead and confuse and obscure. so im sure he would love the idea of people taking something of his and having multiple readings of it - that would be a compliment to him. however, idk where mid 10s prince stood on things like gender or sexuality. he did sing 'im not a woman, im not a man, i am something you will never understand' though, which has got to be one of his most famous lyrics next to 'am i black or white am i straight or gay?'

"I'm not a woman I'm not a man", I've always thought it referred to the concept of being a messiah "I would die 4 u", since all his songs had a religious component.

In the rest of his songs he always referred to himself as a man. I don't remember the interview but he also said that he was a "Strong man".

paisleyparkgirl said:

Yes, that song is Prince singing from the perspective of Jesus. Didn't he never sang it that way during the tours, opting for "He" instead of I?
[Edited 9/6/22 17:13pm]

funkbabyandthebabysitters said:

I wonder what he thought of non-binary people. Did this term exist in the 80's ? A lot of people believe that his symbol was an expression of that.

the thing about prince is he loved to mislead and confuse and obscure. so im sure he would love the idea of people taking something of his and having multiple readings of it - that would be a compliment to him. however, idk where mid 10s prince stood on things like gender or sexuality. he did sing 'im not a woman, im not a man, i am something you will never understand' though, which has got to be one of his most famous lyrics next to 'am i black or white am i straight or gay?'

really? id have thought this generation have plenty of other public figures to fulfill that role already.

Sure he would be different if he was starting now - He would have had different influences and experiences. Prince was always a mix of seeking to do what the girls loved and seeking to stand out, but also always seeking to be himself. He did not ever claim to be gay to get an audience when others did in the 1970s, so I do not see Prince2022 claiming they were non binary if they did not feel non binary, but given what he later called his "gemini" nature, they certainly could genuinely express that they had a non-binary/gender fluid identity. Non-Binary/gender fluidity is an identity issue, not a sexual preference issue. I don't think Prince2022 would have to have sex with people he was not attracted to just for the image, streams and likes - this is a creepy stretch but just think about how much wishful thinking there would on Prince2022.org in 2062 in all directions.

ian ian ian, looking at things 100% literally once more. yes non binary is a gender issue, the point is that in terms of sexuality and gender, concepts which prince was very much invested in and wrote about, each generation has new battle lines, and i listed some which are hot button topics these days. who cares that he didnt SAY he was gay. he was ALLUDING TO IT, SUGGESTING IT, IMPLYING IT, HINTING AT IT, etc etc. i know at this point you will tell me that he always denied it in interviews. well he said a lot of stuff in interviews. at the risk of a poor taste example, he also said his child was still alive in 96 which we all know was false. why wouldnt a 2022prince say they were non binary when the man himself wrote IM NOT A WOMAN IM NOT A MAN? he was basically declaring it (however falsely) in 1984. i never said prince would have to have sex, but he would likely have to indicate it was a possibility (whether acting on it or not).

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Baby, baby, baby, everytime you literally say something your words will taken as written and not just by me.

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What I will tell you is go back and read my reply without trying to be one peanut gallery - Again we are mostly in agreement. The only area of disagreement is I don't think Prince2022 as a future version of Prince would have sex with someone he is not attracted to just for the image, streams and likes. And that as Prince found his own way to stand out (albeit based on influences of the day), Prince2022 would also find his own way and not just copy someone.

paisleyparkgirl said:

funkbabyandthebabysitters said:

the thing about prince is he loved to mislead and confuse and obscure. so im sure he would love the idea of people taking something of his and having multiple readings of it - that would be a compliment to him. however, idk where mid 10s prince stood on things like gender or sexuality. he did sing 'im not a woman, im not a man, i am something you will never understand' though, which has got to be one of his most famous lyrics next to 'am i black or white am i straight or gay?'

"I'm not a woman I'm not a man", I've always thought it referred to the concept of being a messiah "I would die 4 u", since all his songs had a religious component.

In the rest of his songs he always referred to himself as a man. I don't remember the interview but he also said that he was a "Strong man".

.

Exactly - But he did refer to his gemini nature in interviews and this could be taken as a form of non-binary/gender fluidity.

LoveGalore said:

paisleyparkgirl said:

"I'm not a woman I'm not a man", I've always thought it referred to the concept of being a messiah "I would die 4 u", since all his songs had a religious component.

In the rest of his songs he always referred to himself as a man. I don't remember the interview but he also said that he was a "Strong man".

Yes, that song is Prince singing from the perspective of Jesus. Didn't he never sang it that way during the tours, opting for "He" instead of I? [Edited 9/6/22 17:13pm]

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WooHoo: A positive contribution and I agree.

LoveGalore said:

IanRG said:

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Once again offtopic with an attack.

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You can't help yourself but reply

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Let's see how you go now ...

I came here to fuck spiders, mate.

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I am not your mate, not even in Australian parlance.

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Australian spiders make US spiders look "gay".

IanRG said:

paisleyparkgirl said:

"I'm not a woman I'm not a man", I've always thought it referred to the concept of being a messiah "I would die 4 u", since all his songs had a religious component.

In the rest of his songs he always referred to himself as a man. I don't remember the interview but he also said that he was a "Strong man".

.

Exactly - But he did refer to his gemini nature in interviews and this could be taken as a form of non-binary/gender fluidity.

Only through his art was he exploring both masculine and feminine energies. If you read Mayte's book, it's clear that he shows her that he is the man in the relationship. There was never any ambiguity in his personal relationships. That's why I separate the artist from the person.

paisleyparkgirl said:

IanRG said:

.

Exactly - But he did refer to his gemini nature in interviews and this could be taken as a form of non-binary/gender fluidity.

Only through his art was he exploring both masculine and feminine energies. If you read Mayte's book, it's clear that he shows her that he is the man in the relationship. There was never any ambiguity in his personal relationships. That's why I separate the artist from the person.

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Agreed - Careful, the peanut gallery is watching.

IanRG said:

Lmao, that was actually funny, Ian!

But to say I'm not your mate is a pretty serious rebuffing. I'm hurt. I wore these garter belts 4 U?

paisleyparkgirl said:

By taking her clothes to wear?

PJMcGee said:

paisleyparkgirl said:

Only through his art was he exploring both masculine and feminine energies. If you read Mayte's book, it's clear that he shows her that he is the man in the relationship. There was never any ambiguity in his personal relationships. That's why I separate the artist from the person.

By taking her clothes to wear?

He had them tailored to fit his figure. You do realize that he was a petite man. He had no say when it came to his stature/body. I personally think his androginous clothes fit him perfectly. I cannot imagine him wearing regular guy clothes, he's a bit too small, it'd look awkard.

Take the video for the Morning Papers, he's wearing a blazer but it eats him up and he ends up looking like a boy and he was like what 30 something.

Even the suits he wore during his JW era looked like they could be worn by women as well.

[Edited 9/6/22 20:04pm]

Yeah he was the one who wore the culottes in that relationship.

I actually liked the sleeveless flannel he wore in The Morning Papers. Kinda butch.

I kept wishing he would wear capris some day. Perhaps during the Rave era? With his pigtails.

LoveGalore said:

I kept wishing he would wear capris some day. Perhaps during the Rave era? With his pigtails.

I just realized that he never showed his full legs/ankles and even when he wore his bikini bottoms he always paired them with high boots.

[Edited 9/6/22 22:41pm]

[Edited 9/6/22 22:42pm]

paisleyparkgirl said:

Was Prince a bisexual amputee?

LoveGalore said:

I kept wishing he would wear capris some day. Perhaps during the Rave era? With his pigtails.

Are they fashioned out of ski pants, and cinched it with a cord from the drape? Cuz that would be the revolutionary costume for today.

paisleyparkgirl said:

funkbabyandthebabysitters said:

the thing about prince is he loved to mislead and confuse and obscure. so im sure he would love the idea of people taking something of his and having multiple readings of it - that would be a compliment to him. however, idk where mid 10s prince stood on things like gender or sexuality. he did sing 'im not a woman, im not a man, i am something you will never understand' though, which has got to be one of his most famous lyrics next to 'am i black or white am i straight or gay?'

"I'm not a woman I'm not a man", I've always thought it referred to the concept of being a messiah "I would die 4 u", since all his songs had a religious component.

In the rest of his songs he always referred to himself as a man. I don't remember the interview but he also said that he was a "Strong man".

he def was singing as god, rather than himself, but he could have sung as 'he' like he did on the song God from the same era, but he sung it as 'i', which might have been a way to sneak a song on jesus into the charts, or it might also be to do with his own messianic pretensions/delusions (or just provocations). either way, im pretty sure he knew what most people would take a line like that as meaning. and many ppl to this day see it as being about gender identity.

funkbabyandthebabysitters said:

paisleyparkgirl said:

"I'm not a woman I'm not a man", I've always thought it referred to the concept of being a messiah "I would die 4 u", since all his songs had a religious component.

In the rest of his songs he always referred to himself as a man. I don't remember the interview but he also said that he was a "Strong man".

he def was singing as god, rather than himself, but he could have sung as 'he' like he did on the song God from the same era, but he sung it as 'i', which might have been a way to sneak a song on jesus into the charts, or it might also be to do with his own messianic pretensions/delusions (or just provocations). either way, im pretty sure he knew what most people would take a line like that as meaning. and many ppl to this day see it as being about gender identity.

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And Prince would laugh at how easy it was to fool them, just as he did with IWYGF.

TrivialPursuit said:

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I was thinking more like:

Two old theater queens. How appropriate.

Y’all need to put this thread to bed. It’s going nowhere fast. A bunch of what if and aboutism crap. No way anyone is going to agree on anything.