Listening to the First Ave '84 birthday show, and am delighted to hear the NASTY funk bass of Brownmark, finally audible in the mix. I had no idea a lot of these slap parts were there. Now going back and comparing these live versions to the studio takes -- these nasty parts were there all along but we could barely hear them!

Which songs can you barely hear some cool BrownMark bass? I'd like to check that out.

P has had some great bassists in his bands, but Brownmark is probably my favorite. He pretty much played P's studio bass lines note for note and held it down live. Definitely from the Larry Graham school of bass. His live playing on the breakdown in "Head" was killer.

I dont think Mark was mistreated simply because bass is the main instrument in funk

and Prince always had bass prominent in the mix unless we talk about bassless songs

Number23 said:

Welcome to the org, Mark.

that isn't Mark ...

OldFriends4Sale said:

Number23 said:

Welcome to the org, Mark.

that isn't Mark ...

Well my name is Marko so u missed only by 1 letter

OldFriends4Sale said:

Number23 said:

OldFriends4Sale said:

that isn't Mark ...

I’m quite aware of that. It was a joke about the hubris and ego of faded stars like former Prince band members who fail to come to terms with their plummet from the plinth of a youthful blazing yesterday and seek warmth in praise earned though mischievous misdirection and reflected glory of a God, like Icarus himself, cast out, frazzled, doomed and plummeting, the rest of his miserable existence haunted by the phantom nutrients of memory, of walking in glory, now anchored to grim monotonous reality with his wings fried by the heat of a star whose presence burned so brightly they no-one could stay flying in the vicinity without getting burned up, burned out and fucking fried. FFS.

too many adjectives, didn't read

thebanishedone said:

OldFriends4Sale said:

that isn't Mark ...

Well my name is Marko so u missed only by 1 letter

He was joking about CBLU

I caught The Revolution show in Cinci in, I think, 2017 and Mark KILLED it! I was so impressed! The guy is a badass on the bass!

OldFriends4Sale said:

tab32792 said:

He’s not on much studio material that’s why.

he's on enough though

and I love hearing the rehearsal and soundchecks

thebanishedone said:

I dont think Mark was mistreated simply because bass is the main instrument in funk

and Prince always had bass prominent in the mix unless we talk about bassless songs

I disagree.

Prince seemed to be pretty open to other musicians about his distaste for prominent bass in the 80s, let alone the lack of prominent bass on his actual 80s albums. Miles Davis mentions it numerous times in his autobiography.

Miles Davis also shares an anecdote about Prince writing with a de-emphasis on basslines in this interview on YouTube:

"When were out in Minneapolis for his New Year's Eve party, I was there, and I said um, 'Prince where's the bass player?'

He said, 'Did you hear him?'

I said 'No, I can't hear him.'

He said 'If you heard him I'mma fire him.'"

once I developed my own bass style that fit with what we were doing it was all over
and I think a lot of the Revolution sound from say 80/83 onward I mean we, you could hear those types of bass rhythms , rhythmic pattern of bass playing, very percussion driven, that I had developed with the help of Prince, dude himself is an amazing bass player, and um I was able to mold the style together and it became a part of the Revolution

and once we could see his direction, we would jam so much, we would sometimes jam from 10 o'clock in the morning to 10 o'clock at night. I remember sometimes eating lunch while I'm still playing. I would walk to the lunchroom with my bass because it was on a wireless rig and then I would go into the refrigerator grab food and come back and I'd still be playing with one hand while eating.

It was a very interesting time period, but I think I think a lot of music came from that type of grooving and jamming together

2.1.2015 BrownMark

Shouldn't this thread about Brownmark be in associate artists topic?

Mark was Prince's best bass player hands down. Ida was #2 probably, but Prince didn't use Ida to the same effect. The Revolution was just an exciting band. Prince wanted Mark for the SOTT band, and that would have also been amazing. Marks and Shelia E! Get out of here!

Number23 said:

OldFriends4Sale said:

that isn't Mark ...

I’m quite aware of that. It was a joke about the hubris and ego of faded stars like former Prince band members who fail to come to terms with their plummet from the plinth of a youthful blazing yesterday and seek warmth in praise earned though mischievous misdirection and reflected glory of a God, like Icarus himself, cast out, frazzled, doomed and plummeting, the rest of his miserable existence haunted by the phantom nutrients of memory, of walking in glory, now anchored to grim monotonous reality with his wings fried by the heat of a star whose presence burned so brightly they no-one could stay flying in the vicinity without getting burned up, burned out and fucking fried. FFS.

Literally obsessed with this response omg

Number23 said:

OldFriends4Sale said:

that isn't Mark ...

I’m quite aware of that. It was a joke about the hubris and ego of faded stars like former Prince band members who fail to come to terms with their plummet from the plinth of a youthful blazing yesterday and seek warmth in praise earned though mischievous misdirection and reflected glory of a God, like Icarus himself, cast out, frazzled, doomed and plummeting, the rest of his miserable existence haunted by the phantom nutrients of memory, of walking in glory, now anchored to grim monotonous reality with his wings fried by the heat of a star whose presence burned so brightly they no-one could stay flying in the vicinity without getting burned up, burned out and fucking fried. FFS.

Welcome back to the Org, Laura

So, Ida as number 2 when he had Ronda Smith and Larry Graham with him as bass players as well? Wow.. talk about different assessments of talent..

.

And do we have Prince himself in that list too?

Not treated unfairly, just unlucky to be playing bass in a period where Prince was removing bass from half his tracks. Hearing him live (both then and now) you do hear how good he is, and it's a pity that we didn't get to hear more of him but, well, When Doves Cry sounds good to my ears as it is.

P also wanted to work with Brownmark again (twice) in the 2000's too. Due to P's negligence, it never happened.

From countless interviews i have seen of musicians over the years spanning way back, in the studio, side musicians have to take a back seat in the recordings and make their contributions. The artist calls the shots.

Fairly or unfairly that is the part of the story they are hired to play. Many great musical contributions have been spontaneously created on the spot by the talented musicians that have played in many of the most cherished recordings. Elements which may have made a clear diffrence in whether a song was a hit nor not.

There is a great series on Youtube that has many of these stories and is fun to listened to regardless. https://www.youtube.com/c...halloffame

.

But above all that, all of these taleneted musicians have had every opportunity to do something on their own. Actually more than most becasue they could use the clout of their pedigree toget a bump in the line.

We have seen Jimmy Jam and Terry Lewis go on to become legends in their own right. Wendy and Lisa have become veterans in the movie and television side of music. Even Carmen Electra built a lengthy careeer own post Prince.

I feel for everyone who feels under appreciated, especially financially That brings us to the most openly bitter one in Jesse Jhonson, who as talented as he is and who had success on his own, became increasingly bitter as he hit a wall and never lived up to his hopes and dreams and became a side note.

[Edited 9/2/20 8:29am]

OldFriends4Sale said:

mediumdry said:

So, Ida as number 2 when he had Ronda Smith and Larry Graham with him as bass players as well? Wow.. talk about different assessments of talent..

.

And do we have Prince himself in that list too?

Definitely better than Rhonda. Larry Graham... That's hard to measure. I mean Larry is the CREATOR. But boy can Mark Brown pull that shit off.

Different band entirely, but there's similiar issue with the band Slayer. Dave Lombardo created a style of drumming for an entire genre. He's incredible, but the guy who replaced him, Paul Bostoph, has such amazing feel, he was arguably better for the band.

How do you know the reasons?

Who was Prince referring to when he stated towards the end of his life that he hired Ida because unlike the old bassist of his he was thinking of rehiring, she knew all his songs throughout his career? The timeline of her being hired actually matches up with Mark's claims. Of course, if it is Mark, I doubt he would be quick to admit that his negliglence lost him an opportunity.

SPYZFAN1 said:

P also wanted to work with Brownmark again (twice) in the 2000's too. Due to P's negligence, it never happened.

Exactly. Less bass was an artistic choice. It happens. I don't think Prince would deliberately weaken his songs just to be mean to Mark.

jaawwnn said:

Not treated unfairly, just unlucky to be playing bass in a period where Prince was removing bass from half his tracks. Hearing him live (both then and now) you do hear how good he is, and it's a pity that we didn't get to hear more of him but, well, When Doves Cry sounds good to my ears as it is.

Listen to Brownmark's recent lengthy and informative interview on the "Prince Podcast". He discusses the entire story (or stories).

I listened to one in which he stated that Prince didn't hire him a year before he died due to needing a female bassist because he was getting ready to form an all girl band. . I hope you know 3rdeyegirl was formed in 2012 and ended in early 2015. Ida was hired at least two years before that. Prince was getting ready to do the piano and microphone tour in 2015. I am sorry but it sounds like Mark was saving face there.

Also, Prince said in 2015, that he originally hired Ida because the old bassist who used to work for him that he was thinking of re-hiring didn't know nearly as much of his catalogue as she did. hmmm. I always wondered whom he was talking about. Prince not coming to the hotel room or forgetting about him was Mark's story from 2008. 2008 was a not a year for working with Prince...he barely performed, didn't release an album, didn't tour (was sued by Irish promoters) and according to Ruth Arzate was in pain due to his hips and trying to keep it on the down-low.. So, maybe things were complicated on Prince's side.

SPYZFAN1 said:

Listen to Brownmark's recent lengthy and informative interview on the "Prince Podcast". He discusses the entire story (or stories).