herb4 said:

Who posted that "Prince was embarrassed by the film"? I can't find it. Might have been in the "Mountains" thread but either way, I've never read that and would be interested in a citation to that effect.

Near as I can tell, he just got bored with it like he did most things and wanted to move on to something else. I've never read where he said he didn't like it or even where he had bad things to say about it. Most of what I've read was him saying it was a learning experience, etc., not that he was ashamed of it.

He has nothing to be ashamed or embarrassed about.

Even though I hate the movie, at least he DID it and he was, what, 28 when it came out? I hadn't accomplishe shit at that age and he was already an established genius.

In the DMSR book,it says that Prince broke down and cried when he saw the finished film Susannah (his fiance at the time) tried to console him,but Prince was on the floor,crying....saying that the film "didn't turn out the way I wanted it to".

SoulAlive said:

Artists cry over their work all the time, that is nothing unusual. Some people don't seem to understand what it takes to make art - any kind of art - in the first place.

One way to understand the movie might be what Miles Davis said about Prince. “His concept on the stage,” Davis said, “is like Charlie Chaplin.”

RJOrion said:

color films were introduced in 1939...so 47 years later, Prince decides to burn up 12 million dollars making an ashy-ass black and white movie amongst beautiful scenery, whilst he and his cast are adorned with the finest of clothing, cars and accesories..if i were Prince, id have cried too.

There are many great modern black and white films like Raging Bull, The Artist, Roma, even She's Gotta Have It. My favorite movie of 2019 was in black and white, The Lighthouse. If this story is true, Prince's disappointment was because the final product looked to him amateurish, not because it was in black and white.

sexton said:

sexton said:

Phase3 said:

Never heard of those except for the Lighthouse but "Clerks" was in black and white.So was the marvel movie "Logan" although it was a special feature in B & W

You've never heard of Raging Bull? Directed by Martin Scorsese? Starring Robert De Niro? It's from 1980.

sexton said:

poppys said:

Artists cry over their work all the time, that is nothing unusual. Some people don't seem to understand what it takes to make art - any kind of art - in the first place.

He wasn't crying tears of joy he was crying because he knew the movie was a dud but at that point,there was no turning back.

SoulAlive said:

poppys said:

Artists cry over their work all the time, that is nothing unusual. Some people don't seem to understand what it takes to make art - any kind of art - in the first place.

He wasn't crying tears of joy he was crying because he knew the movie was a dud but at that point,there was no turning back.

What makes you think I said he was crying tears of joy? Anyway, what I did say is - people don't seem to understand the process of making art. You can go from tears of joy to tears of pain in an instant. Then wake up the next day, look at it again and fall in love. This bad/good stuff for posterity is not for the artist themselves.There are many great artists that have destroyed entire swaths of their work. Personally, I liked the movie.

poppys said:

heartpeacesheart said:

poppys said:

What makes you think I said he was crying tears of joy? Anyway, what I did say is - people don't seem to understand the process of making art. You can go from tears of joy to tears of pain in an instant. Then wake up the next day, look at it again and fall in love. This bad/good stuff for posterity is not for the artist themselves.There are many great artists that have destroyed entire swaths of their work. Personally, I liked the movie.

:eyesball:. FIX THAT (wtf) I cry EVERY DAY so don't add a button to a blazer if it's not adding any flare style. SMH

I'm sorry, not to be impolite, but I have no idea what your post means.

poppys said:

alphastreet said:

alphastreet said:

I’m a bad fan, I haven’t seen it in full but love the wrecka stow scene so much

sexton said:

RJOrion said:

color films were introduced in 1939...so 47 years later, Prince decides to burn up 12 million dollars making an ashy-ass black and white movie amongst beautiful scenery, whilst he and his cast are adorned with the finest of clothing, cars and accesories..if i were Prince, id have cried too.

There are many great modern black and white films like Raging Bull, The Artist, Roma, even She's Gotta Have It. My favorite movie of 2019 was in black and white, The Lighthouse. If this story is true, Prince's disappointment was because the final product looked to him amateurish, not because it was in black and white.

Schindler's List, The Elephant Man, Dr. Strangelove, The Man Who Wasn't There, Manhattan, Nosteratu...or even Sin City for that matter.

Let's not confuse UTCM with any of those films (not saying you are).

I think Prince, at that time, naively and simply thought that making it B&W made it more "artistic" and "serious" and that's really all there was to it.

A lot of his art was color centric; Purple Rain, ATWIAD (Rainbows), SoTT (Peach and Black), The Black Album, The Gold Experience, Lovesexy (Pastels), Batman, Come (B&W again), Rave UN2 the Joy Fantastic (Blue)...he seemed to define his themes and separate his work into chapters that way fairly often.

But his ego was fucking out of control during this particular time - more so than usual - and I don't mean that in a bad way since, utimately, that same unchecked strong ego and singular vision was what allowed him to accomplish so much, which made him what he was and he never really checked it at the door, probably for the good overall. However, just making a movie in B&W (especaily after filming it in color) doesn't make it The Serious Art he seemed to want it to be and, I'm sorry, but all the color filters in the world can't save that god awful script.

I mean...I'm surprised he didn't push to make it a silent film and add fucking subtitiles for crying out loud.

It's a bad movie that can't be salvaged but I can see where it has a certain charm for hardcocre fans. I liked it well enough in the theater but only because I loved him and the album.

Parts of it are really pretty to look at, the cinematography is not terrible and seeing it in color would be fun since the stills are so flashy and vibrant. But let's not call it "great" because come on.

[Edited 6/18/20 14:50pm]

alphastreet said:

I’m a bad fan, I haven’t seen it in full but love the wrecka stow scene so much

See...

Here's why I find a divide.

It's a funny enough play on words sort of joke, but the over acting kills it.

Prince and Jerome act like they just landed the All Time Zinger to end all Class Divide One Liners and double over like it's The Sickest Burn of All Time. It's a cute little scene but it goes on too long.

And speaking of class division, which seems to be what this film is trying to assert as an overall theme, it would work a LOT better if Prince and Tricky were shown to actually be, you know, poor and destitute. Struggling.

My guys are living in this crazy sweet chateau, dropping rose petals in bathtubs, driving a big white thunderbird, dressed to the nines, tossing money to street kids who mob him, made up like..well...Prince..., flashing cash, splashing cologne, and fucking turning tricks. It would have been more effective if Prince was shown as a hard luck street musician or club player, struggling to get himself noticed and collecting dollars in a guitar case while he played Sometimes it Snows in April or Alexa De Paris on a practice amp. The title track on a Casio. This would have ADDED MORE MUSIC for one thing, which the movie really needs and what we all want to see/hear. Give him an acoustic guitar and have Jerome banging buckets on New Position. Show us his struggle and his talent. Separate his motives from those of the Eeeeeeevil Father.

Show us Prince pulling off his (many) fashion statements by assembling things he found in thrift stores instead of all these custom made sequined outfits; cobbling something flashy together on a shoestring budget to crash that party. Have him WORRY about needing something to wear, OR, show us him doing the sequins himself.

He's not sympathetic here. He's just an arogant asshole that we're presupposed to like simply because he's PRINCE and We All Just Love Him So Much. Which I do/did.

If I were Mary's dad, I wouldn't want Christopher anywhere near my daughter either, tbh, because he's kind of a creep here and doesn't win our affection nor, most importantly, our sympathy.

If he were a down on his luck artist and musician, struggling to make his way but with real talent that was known to people on the street and who just couldn't catch a break, the whole "Love or $" and class envy theme would resonate a lot more. He was an asshole in PR too but we're at least SHOWN his struggle and the reasons WHY.

[Edited 6/18/20 15:01pm]

The movie is farcical. It's supposed to be a farce. It's not trying to be anything else. Or a historically accurate drama. I'm Prince's age, ALL the old TV shows and movies were black & white when we were kids. Marx Brothers, 3 Stooges, Our Gang, tons of B&W movies that are "Classics" now. It was a hipster sensibility in the '80s that a lot of artist types were into revisiting & sending up. Maybe it's dated for some, movies are time capsules.

As far as Christopher & Tricky "acting better" - that's the whole point. No wonder you dislke the movie if you take issue with that. I don't want to feel sympathy for them. I want to watch them tromp all over "high society", it's fun. Nothing Christopher did would probably ever be good enough for Mary's dad anyway. Wrong color.

[Edited 6/19/20 6:29am]

Germanegro said:

P.S. I would buy a color version of the film all over again!

Oh yeah...that'l be cool

poppys said:

Germanegro said:

Thank U poppys, for expressing this thought--exactly every logical reason why we who enjoy this show actually like the thing, beside the "crazy fan"reasons.

>
I could see Herb4's revised plot--as someone else's character in somebody else's film.

poppys said:

The movie is farcical. It's supposed to be a farce. It's not trying to be anything else. Or a historically accurate drama. I'm Prince's age, ALL the old TV shows and movies were black & white when we were kids. Marx Brothers, 3 Stooges, Our Gang, tons of B&W movies that are "Classics" now. It was a hipster sensibility in the '80s that a lot of artist types were into revisiting & sending up. Maybe it's dated for some, movies are time capsules.

As far as Christopher & Tricky "acting better" - that's the whole point. No wonder you dislke the movie if you take issue with that. I don't want to feel sympathy for them. I want to watch them tromp all over "high society", it's fun. Nothing Christopher did would probably ever be good enough for Mary's dad anyway. Wrong color.

[Edited 6/19/20 6:29am]

Phase3 said:

Germanegro said:

Thank U poppys, for expressing this thought--exactly every logical reason why we who enjoy this show actually like the thing, beside the "crazy fan"reasons. > I could see Herb4's revised plot--as someone else's character in somebody else's film.

Mary's dad Isaac just wanted Mary to marry Jonathan because it would mean more money and name value.He said combined fortunes.

Right, lol the color Prince didn't have was green

herb4 said:

alphastreet said:

I’m a bad fan, I haven’t seen it in full but love the wrecka stow scene so much

See...

Here's why I find a divide.

It's a funny enough play on words sort of joke, but the over acting kills it.

Prince and Jerome act like they just landed the All Time Zinger to end all Class Divide One Liners and double over like it's The Sickest Burn of All Time. It's a cute little scene but it goes on too long.

And speaking of class division, which seems to be what this film is trying to assert as an overall theme, it would work a LOT better if Prince and Tricky were shown to actually be, you know, poor and destitute. Struggling.

My guys are living in this crazy sweet chateau, dropping rose petals in bathtubs, driving a big white thunderbird, dressed to the nines, tossing money to street kids who mob him, made up like..well...Prince..., flashing cash, splashing cologne, and fucking turning tricks. It would have been more effective if Prince was shown as a hard luck street musician or club player, struggling to get himself noticed and collecting dollars in a guitar case while he played Sometimes it Snows in April or Alexa De Paris on a practice amp. The title track on a Casio. This would have ADDED MORE MUSIC for one thing, which the movie really needs and what we all want to see/hear. Give him an acoustic guitar and have Jerome banging buckets on New Position. Show us his struggle and his talent. Separate his motives from those of the Eeeeeeevil Father.

Show us Prince pulling off his (many) fashion statements by assembling things he found in thrift stores instead of all these custom made sequined outfits; cobbling something flashy together on a shoestring budget to crash that party. Have him WORRY about needing something to wear, OR, show us him doing the sequins himself.

He's not sympathetic here. He's just an arogant asshole that we're presupposed to like simply because he's PRINCE and We All Just Love Him So Much. Which I do/did.

If I were Mary's dad, I wouldn't want Christopher anywhere near my daughter either, tbh, because he's kind of a creep here and doesn't win our affection nor, most importantly, our sympathy.

If he were a down on his luck artist and musician, struggling to make his way but with real talent that was known to people on the street and who just couldn't catch a break, the whole "Love or $" and class envy theme would resonate a lot more. He was an asshole in PR too but we're at least SHOWN his struggle and the reasons WHY.

[Edited 6/18/20 15:01pm]

I too, felt if Christopher was a serious pianist in France, mingling with the bourgeoisie

with some fun parts it would have been a film more believable.
.
What rich household holds a part where 2 strangers can just show up and gain entrance.
But if Christopher (and his band) were hired to play Mary's birthday party, that would be on a whole different level. I liked that Prince wanted to showcase his piano playing. But being a gigalo via Morris Day cheapened it. Hearing him play (Condition of the Heart) in this movie as a special tribute from the avant garde artist and band at her birthday would have been powerful.
.
Even if all the band scenes were not like in Purple Rain, but background at the Venus de Milo club, having the Revolution set up playing, Mary comes in, the band takes over on Alexis de Paris
.
Christopher and band bring Uptown to Mary Sharon, with Girls & Boys
.
having the Revolution plus Eric Atlanta Eddie M Sheila E Juan, and the Family could easily have been in there. I can see Christophers alcove like a bohemian musicians setting, creating art A government of love and music boundless in its unifying power
A nation of alms, the production, sharing ideas, a shower of flowers
.
I do think Prince was about to take the expression of music to a different seriousness, but the inclusion of Gregory Wally and Jerome, brought in too much playfulness and distraction.
If the Family did not split, we would have seen a different Parade tour(as much as I love it)

OldFriends4Sale said:

herb4 said:

See...

Here's why I find a divide.

It's a funny enough play on words sort of joke, but the over acting kills it.

Prince and Jerome act like they just landed the All Time Zinger to end all Class Divide One Liners and double over like it's The Sickest Burn of All Time. It's a cute little scene but it goes on too long.

And speaking of class division, which seems to be what this film is trying to assert as an overall theme, it would work a LOT better if Prince and Tricky were shown to actually be, you know, poor and destitute. Struggling.

My guys are living in this crazy sweet chateau, dropping rose petals in bathtubs, driving a big white thunderbird, dressed to the nines, tossing money to street kids who mob him, made up like..well...Prince..., flashing cash, splashing cologne, and fucking turning tricks. It would have been more effective if Prince was shown as a hard luck street musician or club player, struggling to get himself noticed and collecting dollars in a guitar case while he played Sometimes it Snows in April or Alexa De Paris on a practice amp. The title track on a Casio. This would have ADDED MORE MUSIC for one thing, which the movie really needs and what we all want to see/hear. Give him an acoustic guitar and have Jerome banging buckets on New Position. Show us his struggle and his talent. Separate his motives from those of the Eeeeeeevil Father.

Show us Prince pulling off his (many) fashion statements by assembling things he found in thrift stores instead of all these custom made sequined outfits; cobbling something flashy together on a shoestring budget to crash that party. Have him WORRY about needing something to wear, OR, show us him doing the sequins himself.

He's not sympathetic here. He's just an arogant asshole that we're presupposed to like simply because he's PRINCE and We All Just Love Him So Much. Which I do/did.

If I were Mary's dad, I wouldn't want Christopher anywhere near my daughter either, tbh, because he's kind of a creep here and doesn't win our affection nor, most importantly, our sympathy.

If he were a down on his luck artist and musician, struggling to make his way but with real talent that was known to people on the street and who just couldn't catch a break, the whole "Love or $" and class envy theme would resonate a lot more. He was an asshole in PR too but we're at least SHOWN his struggle and the reasons WHY.

[Edited 6/18/20 15:01pm]

This is a good take.

I agree..that is a good take. Seeing Christopher as a struggling musician. Didn't Biz Markie sample one of his bassline beats from the "Planet Rock"/Mary on drums scene?