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Reply #30 posted 08/02/19 1:51am

BartVanHemelen

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RODSERLING said:

Gett Off was released way too soon before the album to make impact on the charts, etc.

.

Or you could, I don't know, go to PV and learn about "Gett Off" and it's relation to D&P.

© Bart Van Hemelen
This posting is provided AS IS with no warranties, and confers no rights.
It is not authorized by Prince or the NPG Music Club. You assume all risk for
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Reply #31 posted 08/02/19 4:04am

RODSERLING

BartVanHemelen said:



RODSERLING said:


Gett Off was released way too soon before the album to make impact on the charts, etc.

.


Or you could, I don't know, go to PV and learn about "Gett Off" and it's relation to D&P.



Gett off was released like 4 months before the album.
Same thing for Sexy MF with Love Symbol.
That is commercial suicide and this strategy never works, and it didn't work for Prince, since Diamonds and Pearls didn't sell that well despite the numbers of worldwide hits there was on the album.
.
Sexy MF was one of its biggest hits in Europe, and there was no album at the time of its promotion to sell.
So Sexy MF didn't sell nor Diamonds and Pearls, neither Lovesymbol. Commercial nonsense, as always with Prince
[Edited 8/2/19 4:05am]
[Edited 8/2/19 4:15am]
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Reply #32 posted 08/02/19 4:08am

RODSERLING

Freek99999 said:



RODSERLING said:


WhisperingDandelions said:

"The Cross", a hit?? Over "Hot Thing"?????



Well over Hot Thing, yes, which wasn't radio friendly at all. Beside, Hot Thing was a flop even in the USA and never could chart anywhere Whereas The Cross would have been, especially in Europe, where he doesn't have much hits. . The Cross is a beautiful and meaning song that, for non Prince s fan, is catchy at first hear. A bit like a U2 song.


Hot Thing didn't chart because it wasn't an a-side



Hot Thing charted as #63 in the Hot 100, and #14 rnb
The Cross would have been top 20 in the US and top ten in Europe.
The single SOTT peaked at #47 in France, and it was the only single to chart there. The Cross had better chance than any other tracks off the album
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Reply #33 posted 08/02/19 5:42am

Cloudbuster

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CherryMoon57 said:

What are you talking about?
Cream was released only 3 weeks before the album.
The album got to #2 in the UK (#1 in the US).


#3 in the US.

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Reply #34 posted 08/02/19 5:52am

RODSERLING

Cloudbuster said:



CherryMoon57 said:



What are you talking about?
Cream was released only 3 weeks before the album.
The album got to #2 in the UK (#1 in the US).




#3 in the US.



Cream wasn't the first single of Diamonds and Pearls.
Gett Off was a single promoting nothing, neither Graffiti Bridge, nor Diamonds and Pearls.
There were 3 months of huge promotion lost in the process that could have benefited to Diamonds and Pearls.
.
That explains partially why D&P sold only 7 millions worldwide despite 4 worldwide hits.
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Reply #35 posted 08/02/19 6:24am

feeluupp

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RODSERLING said:

Cloudbuster said:


#3 in the US.

Cream wasn't the first single of Diamonds and Pearls. Gett Off was a single promoting nothing, neither Graffiti Bridge, nor Diamonds and Pearls. There were 3 months of huge promotion lost in the process that could have benefited to Diamonds and Pearls. . That explains partially why D&P sold only 7 millions worldwide despite 4 worldwide hits.

Could've sold alot more, but tbh this was one of his biggest marketing campaigns in his whole career, everything was preplanned methodically by MJ's former manager, Frank Dileo...

It was a shapeshifting time though for music, grundge and gangster rap was literally outselling everyone during that time, even the short lived new jack swing movement started to quickly fade away.

Don't forget MJ's Dangerous lost momentum quickly in the U.S. and even though it's huge sales for many artists, it only sold around 7 million in the U.S. at the time...

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Reply #36 posted 08/02/19 6:27am

Cloudbuster

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RODSERLING said:


Cream wasn't the first single of Diamonds and Pearls. Gett Off was a single promoting nothing, neither Graffiti Bridge, nor Diamonds and Pearls. There were 3 months of huge promotion lost in the process that could have benefited to Diamonds and Pearls. . That explains partially why D&P sold only 7 millions worldwide despite 4 worldwide hits.


Nothing wrong with that, it's one of his biggest sellers. Only Purple Rain and Batman sold more.

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Reply #37 posted 08/02/19 6:50am

BartVanHemelen

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RODSERLING said:

BartVanHemelen said:

.

Or you could, I don't know, go to PV and learn about "Gett Off" and it's relation to D&P.

Gett off was released like 4 months before the album.

.

So you didn't bother to read it.

© Bart Van Hemelen
This posting is provided AS IS with no warranties, and confers no rights.
It is not authorized by Prince or the NPG Music Club. You assume all risk for
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Reply #38 posted 08/02/19 6:51am

BartVanHemelen

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Cloudbuster said:

RODSERLING said:


Cream wasn't the first single of Diamonds and Pearls. Gett Off was a single promoting nothing, neither Graffiti Bridge, nor Diamonds and Pearls. There were 3 months of huge promotion lost in the process that could have benefited to Diamonds and Pearls. . That explains partially why D&P sold only 7 millions worldwide despite 4 worldwide hits.


Nothing wrong with that, it's one of his biggest sellers. Only Purple Rain and Batman sold more.

.

But it's peanuts compared to what the likes of Madonna et al were selling. And D&P had a MASSIVE campaign.

© Bart Van Hemelen
This posting is provided AS IS with no warranties, and confers no rights.
It is not authorized by Prince or the NPG Music Club. You assume all risk for
your use. All rights reserved.
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Reply #39 posted 08/02/19 6:57am

Cloudbuster

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BartVanHemelen said:

Cloudbuster said:


Nothing wrong with that, it's one of his biggest sellers. Only Purple Rain and Batman sold more.

.

But it's peanuts compared to what the likes of Madonna et al were selling. And D&P had a MASSIVE campaign.


I think the sales of Madonna's albums from that era (I'm Breathless + Erotica) were roughly the same as Prince's.

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Reply #40 posted 08/02/19 7:01am

Cloudbuster

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Also the D&P campaign didn't really reach UK shores. The album was just there. No fuss but it sold well, it was still in the UK top 20 in the summer of '92.

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Reply #41 posted 08/02/19 12:43pm

TheFman

This is why you dont have a career in music: the 4 biggest turds of their albums

RODSERLING said:

Why they didn't release the more memorable Sometimes It Snows in April? It would have been an all time classic and a huge hit. . The Cross was the more radio friendly song off the album, it would have been a hit, especially in Europe. .AnnaStesia was an obvious choice. . And God created woman was also very radio friendly.

[Edited 8/2/19 12:45pm]

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Reply #42 posted 08/02/19 5:17pm

RODSERLING

feeluupp said:



RODSERLING said:


Cloudbuster said:



#3 in the US.



Cream wasn't the first single of Diamonds and Pearls. Gett Off was a single promoting nothing, neither Graffiti Bridge, nor Diamonds and Pearls. There were 3 months of huge promotion lost in the process that could have benefited to Diamonds and Pearls. . That explains partially why D&P sold only 7 millions worldwide despite 4 worldwide hits.


Could've sold alot more, but tbh this was one of his biggest marketing campaigns in his whole career, everything was preplanned methodically by MJ's former manager, Frank Dileo...



It was a shapeshifting time though for music, grundge and gangster rap was literally outselling everyone during that time, even the short lived new jack swing movement started to quickly fade away.



Don't forget MJ's Dangerous lost momentum quickly in the U.S. and even though it's huge sales for many artists, it only sold around 7 million in the U.S. at the time...



Once again, D&P sold " only 3 millions in the US while Dangerous sold " only " 7 millions ( but 3 times more outside the US).
.
Give In To Me, MJ s biggest hit ever in Oceania, was never released in the USA, while it could have been even a great follow up to Black Or White ( same pop/ rock vibe)
.
When you think about it, these two albums were too eclectic to please, and they both benefited from a huge promotion, especially Dangerous.
.
I already explained, Gett Off was hip hop, Cream was pop rock, Insatiable bubble soul, D&P rnb, Money DM2N...soul. Too hard too sell.
While most of the artist of this era sold 10 millions with only 2 top ten singles.
.
Most of the consumers wants to buy an album with tracks from the same genre.
.
But the worst was SexyMF ( one of his 10 biggest hit in Europe ever). It didn't benefit from D&P, Lovesymbol wasn't released...
.
That is commercial suicide, and only Prince did that.
.
You wouldn't imagine MJ releasing Black Or White 4 months before Dangerous, that's beyond absurd.

.
Nobody would have released a lead single 4 months before the album. That's commercial suicide in term of selling an album.
.


But Diamonds and Pearls ( and Lovesymbol) could have benefited from more sales if their respective lead singles were released just weeks before the album...as everybody did/does /will do.
[Edited 8/2/19 17:18pm]
[Edited 8/2/19 17:20pm]
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Reply #43 posted 08/02/19 5:20pm

Marrk

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Prince is one of the greatest B-side artists ever. Everything in the 80s was A+. I already owned the albums, was looking forward to the maxi singles and a new song on the B-side. Was routine i was excited. When remixes became the norm, it disappeared early 90s. Was sad that went.

Yeah, we'll, we'll try to imagine what silence looks like.
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Reply #44 posted 08/02/19 5:23pm

RODSERLING

BartVanHemelen said:



RODSERLING said:


BartVanHemelen said:


.


Or you could, I don't know, go to PV and learn about "Gett Off" and it's relation to D&P.




Gett off was released like 4 months before the album.

.


So you didn't bother to read it.



No, you didn't bother to understand.
But I m reassured when one post later you confess that D&P didn't sell that much compared to its huge promotion ( especially in the US,)
.
So we are on the same opinion overall.
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Reply #45 posted 08/02/19 5:25pm

RODSERLING

TheFman said:

This is why you dont have a career in music: the 4 biggest turds of their albums



RODSERLING said:


Why they didn't release the more memorable Sometimes It Snows in April? It would have been an all time classic and a huge hit. . The Cross was the more radio friendly song off the album, it would have been a hit, especially in Europe. .AnnaStesia was an obvious choice. . And God created woman was also very radio friendly.

[Edited 8/2/19 12:45pm]



Troll?
Or even if you thought so, it never prevented a turd from being an obvious hit.
[Edited 8/2/19 17:26pm]
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Reply #46 posted 08/02/19 5:48pm

feeluupp

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RODSERLING said:

BartVanHemelen said:

.

So you didn't bother to read it.

No, you didn't bother to understand. But I m reassured when one post later you confess that D&P didn't sell that much compared to its huge promotion ( especially in the US,) . So we are on the same opinion overall.

But that is the paradox of Prince's sale...

For his average sales for a Prince album, D&P was a huge seller. It had a massive campaign headed by MJ's manager Frank Dileo, which is why I personally believe that is why it is Prince's second biggest selling album ever with over 7 million sold worldwide, (alothough I believe 1999 has surpassed the sales of D&P of over 7 million world wide as well...) Could it have sold more, ofc it could have, but that was the paradox with Prince, artistic integrity vs. commercial value, which is why his "peers" MJ and Madonna always outsold him, because they promoted it by the book.

In terms of D&P it sold what is should have sold, like I stated, the music industry was in a dramatic change with grundge and gangster rap, new jack swing only lasted 2 years max, before house and techno started to take over. D&P was more a success do to it's promotion and marketing by Frank, the music was merely average, and was not at all groundbreaking for the acts and new genres that were emerging during that time period.

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Reply #47 posted 08/02/19 5:49pm

feeluupp

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PURPLE RAIN - 25 MILLION

1999 - 7 MILLION

DIAMONDS & PEARLS - 7 MILLION

all the other albums after that were 4 million or less... If he marketed every album like he did D&P most albums would be a 5 million plus seller.

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Reply #48 posted 08/02/19 6:15pm

PeteSilas

feeluupp said:

PURPLE RAIN - 25 MILLION

1999 - 7 MILLION

DIAMONDS & PEARLS - 7 MILLION

all the other albums after that were 4 million or less... If he marketed every album like he did D&P most albums would be a 5 million plus seller.

ya, but that fucker couldn't listen to anyone enough to do that.

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Reply #49 posted 08/02/19 6:19pm

feeluupp

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PeteSilas said:

feeluupp said:

PURPLE RAIN - 25 MILLION

1999 - 7 MILLION

DIAMONDS & PEARLS - 7 MILLION

all the other albums after that were 4 million or less... If he marketed every album like he did D&P most albums would be a 5 million plus seller.

ya, but that fucker couldn't listen to anyone enough to do that.

Which is why on some albums and eras, ex: Rave, Musicology, he tried to CHASE the commercialism with the songs and the promotion strategy.

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Reply #50 posted 08/02/19 10:17pm

BartVanHemelen

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RODSERLING said:

BartVanHemelen said:

.

So you didn't bother to read it.

No, you didn't bother to understand.

.

Dude, read the PV page. Go do it. Then apologize here.

© Bart Van Hemelen
This posting is provided AS IS with no warranties, and confers no rights.
It is not authorized by Prince or the NPG Music Club. You assume all risk for
your use. All rights reserved.
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Reply #51 posted 08/03/19 12:27am

RODSERLING

feeluupp said:



RODSERLING said:


BartVanHemelen said:


.


So you didn't bother to read it.



No, you didn't bother to understand. But I m reassured when one post later you confess that D&P didn't sell that much compared to its huge promotion ( especially in the US,) . So we are on the same opinion overall.


But that is the paradox of Prince's sale...



For his average sales for a Prince album, D&P was a huge seller. It had a massive campaign headed by MJ's manager Frank Dileo, which is why I personally believe that is why it is Prince's second biggest selling album ever with over 7 million sold worldwide, (alothough I believe 1999 has surpassed the sales of D&P of over 7 million world wide as well...) Could it have sold more, ofc it could have, but that was the paradox with Prince, artistic integrity vs. commercial value, which is why his "peers" MJ and Madonna always outsold him, because they promoted it by the book.



In terms of D&P it sold what is should have sold, like I stated, the music industry was in a dramatic change with grundge and gangster rap, new jack swing only lasted 2 years max, before house and techno started to take over. D&P was more a success do to it's promotion and marketing by Frank, the music was merely average, and was not at all groundbreaking for the acts and new genres that were emerging during that time period.



The point is that even a potato, with such promotion that benefited D&P and the strong musical material that is on it, could have sold 7 millions.
.
If the lead single wasn't released months in advance, it could have sold let's say 1.5 millions more.
That's an example behind so many others.
.
And while D&P was still on the charts, he released SexyMF out of nowhere.
.
So in fact D& P had, what, 7 months of promotion (November 91 to June 1992) without a summer hit.
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Reply #52 posted 08/03/19 3:07am

CherryMoon57

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'Gett Off
was the first single to be released from the album Diamonds And Pearls, by Prince and the New Power Generation, released worldwide. It was the first musical release to be credited to Prince and the New Power Generation(the first time Prince had given his band co-credit since the disbanding of The Revolution in 1986).

Initially released to DJs as a promo on Prince's 33rd birthday, 7 June 1991, there was no plan to release the single commercially (or to include the track on the album Diamonds And Pearls), and only 1,500 copies of the one-sided 12" promo were made [...].


Based on the positive reaction, however, it was decided that Gett Off would be included on the album and released as the lead-off single.'

http://www.princevault.com/index.php?title=Single:_Gett_Off


'Response to the song was so high, that
Prince decided to place Gett Off on Diamonds And Pearls, removing Horny Pony to do so. Gett Off then received a standard commercial release as a single. The Gett Off maxi-single contains various remixes and three new tracks which are largely based on Gett Off itself (Violet The Organ Grinder, Gangster Glam, and Clockin' The Jizz (Instrumental)). These tracks receive their own song entry pages, separate from this song.'

http://www.princevault.co...e=Gett_Off



Get Off was released between July 29th (US) and 19th August (UK).
The album D&P was subsequently released on October 1st (US) - approximately one and a half months later.

I personally don't see any 'commercial suicide' (as Rodserling claims) in all of this.

And, to get back on topic, I think his b-sides are great, I mean, they even have their own fantastic album which charted very well. But in any case, I don't think Prince was ever as obsessed with the commercial side of music, as he was with the artistic aspect of it.

And that is one big part of why we love him and his music so much.

[Edited 8/3/19 7:34am]

Open your heart open your mind
A train is leaving all day
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Reply #53 posted 08/05/19 9:21am

Vannormal

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PeteSilas said:

SoulAlive said:

I like “La,La,La,He,He,Hee” smile it’s one of his best B-sides!

yup, along with shockadelica, my faves.

-

...that layered second part of that 12"

isn't that the bomb ?

Also,

he proved to Sheena that he could whatever he wanted

with just a simple lyric idea.

-

that song makes your head spin, when headphones on,

goosebumps even !

-

I can hardly imagine this song is created layer upon layer in a studio...

with all these chants, ideas, mixings...

Same for the Mountains 12", second part.

Hardly to imagine he did most of it all by himself...

still up to this day.

-

Shame we don't have foutage of Prince creating a song in the studio all by himself

doing it all.

from scratch to finish...

-

It's a wish we'll never be able to see or experience, on video...

-

"...no matter what, all will be fine, always."
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Reply #54 posted 08/05/19 10:10am

Genesia

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Se7en said:

Most of his 80s B-sides were as good or better than the album songs!

17 Days, Erotic City and God from Purple Rain alone were album-worthy.

She's Always In My Hair, Girl and Hello . . . pretty much the same! Probably not Hello, but it's a damn good song especially knowing what prompted it.

I think he lost interest in B-sides in the 90s in favor of just releasing more albums whenever possible. If you notice, he also lost interest in "side projects" compared to what he was doing in the 80s.


I don't think he lost interest. I think he didn't have a major label supporting his more dilettante-ish tendencies, anymore.

Let's be honest, Warner Brothers supported a lot of things for Prince that they wouldn't have for any other artist. You know that saying, "Happy wife, happy life"? Substitute Prince for wife and you get the general idea.

We don’t mourn artists because we knew them. We mourn them because they helped us know ourselves.
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Reply #55 posted 08/05/19 3:56pm

PeteSilas

or the eradication of vinyl could have had something to do with it.

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Reply #56 posted 08/05/19 3:59pm

PeteSilas

that might be a reason that people don't think highly of it, hee hee hee, laalaa laa, it's gibberish, but i loved when the horns come in, i love the dog sample, it's probably an early sample before everyone and their brother started using them that sticks in my mind, used as a rhythmic device, nutty as fuck.

Vannormal said:

PeteSilas said:

yup, along with shockadelica, my faves.

-

...that layered second part of that 12"

isn't that the bomb ?

Also,

he proved to Sheena that he could whatever he wanted

with just a simple lyric idea.

-

that song makes your head spin, when headphones on,

goosebumps even !

-

I can hardly imagine this song is created layer upon layer in a studio...

with all these chants, ideas, mixings...

Same for the Mountains 12", second part.

Hardly to imagine he did most of it all by himself...

still up to this day.

-

Shame we don't have foutage of Prince creating a song in the studio all by himself

doing it all.

from scratch to finish...

-

It's a wish we'll never be able to see or experience, on video...

-

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