Apologies - i am sure this has been debated to death BUT it just popped into my head & so I wanted to share!

I just can't get my head around this. When you sit back & compare the sheer volume & the different styles of song writing he came up with compared to the truly great song writers of all time. The greatest song writers wrote mostly in one style. This older Rolling Stone list puts P in at 18 with Bob Dylan at number 1 !

https://www.rollingstone....ongwriters

Appreciate its all a matter of opinion BUT lets take the subject of Love..seriously how many ways did he describe every aspect of love from the sensual to the sexual at every tempo & in every style.

Again, there's not a single writer on that incredible list that I would put ahead of Prince & that includes Lennon & McCartney.

[Edited 6/24/19 7:11am]

[Edited 6/24/19 7:11am]

You need to broaden your horizons.

Genesia said:

You need to broaden your horizons.

I have to agree with Genesia on this.

While I also agree that Prince was a great songwriter with many different styles and hundreds of amazing songs, I would never in a million years put him ahead of the great Bob Dylan. I will include Leonard Cohen as well.

Empress said:

Genesia said:

You need to broaden your horizons.

I have to agree with Genesia on this.

While I also agree that Prince was a great songwriter with many different styles and hundreds of amazing songs, I would never in a million years put him ahead of the great Bob Dylan. I will include Leonard Cohen as well.

All opinions valid, will respectfully disagree.

If I'm workin' at my jobba
I'm the victim, you're the robba

Doesn't help.

Genesia said:

You need to broaden your horizons.

It seems trollish for the OP to make a post that Prince was the all-time greatest lyricist, especially above people like Dylan, Lennon & McCartney, and the numerous songwriters behind famous singer's music. It's ignorance, which is defined as lack of knowledge (opposed to just being stupid).

So I'd agree - listen to more music, read my lyric sheets, and take off your purple tinted glasses. There's a world of music out there before, during, and after Prince.

TrivialPursuit said:

Genesia said:

You need to broaden your horizons.

It seems trollish for the OP to make a post that Prince was the all-time greatest lyricist, especially above people like Dylan, Lennon & McCartney, and the numerous songwriters behind famous singer's music. It's ignorance, which is defined as lack of knowledge (opposed to just being stupid).

So I'd agree - listen to more music, read my lyric sheets, and take off your purple tinted glasses. There's a world of music out there before, during, and after Prince.

When John Lennon says he and Paul McCartney were trying to be "the British King and Goffen," and Bob Dylan says he considers Hank Williams to be the best songwriter of all time, they've probably earned their spots on the list.

I suspect the OP's knowledge of music is about as deep as a kiddie pool.

Prince isn't even in the songwriters Hall of Fame. (Now THAT is outrageous!!)

Genesia said:

When John Lennon says he and Paul McCartney were trying to be "the British King and Goffen," and Bob Dylan says he considers Hank Williams to be the best songwriter of all time, they've probably earned their spots on the list.

I suspect the OP's knowledge of music is about as deep as a kiddie pool.

Country music, and blues, has great stories behind it all. They wrote about what they knew, as did Prince. To listen to Gershwin or Rodgers and Hammerstein turn a phrase and create a beautiful melody would do anyone good.

He's my FAVORITE songwriter, which is all I really need to know.

TrivialPursuit said:

Genesia said:

When John Lennon says he and Paul McCartney were trying to be "the British King and Goffen," and Bob Dylan says he considers Hank Williams to be the best songwriter of all time, they've probably earned their spots on the list.

I suspect the OP's knowledge of music is about as deep as a kiddie pool.

Country music, and blues, has great stories behind it all. They wrote about what they knew, as did Prince. To listen to Gershwin or Rodgers and Hammerstein turn a phrase and create a beautiful melody would do anyone good.

That's another thing: this list only included writers of popular music. It completely ignored writers like the ones you mention. (I guess they're too "old.") But think about the impact of people like Henry Mancini, Marvin Hamlisch, the Gershwins, and Rodgers and Hammerstein/Hart had on Broadway and film (not to mention popular music). Hamlisch and Rodgers are the only two people ever to have won Emmy, Grammy, Oscar and Tony awards, PLUS the Pulitzer Prize.

Prince is definitely listed among the greats - and deservedly so. But there are other greats who weren't even mentioned.

jaawwnn said:

Wolfie87 said:

Sooooo, who did it better from 1980-1989 in contemporary pop then?

.

You're moving the goalposts, which basically confirms that you agree that the original claim is bunk.

Not another GOAT thread...

PURPLEIZED3121 said:

Apologies - i am sure this has been debated to death BUT it just popped into my head & so I wanted to share!

I just can't get my head around this. When you sit back & compare the sheer volume & the different styles of song writing he came up with compared to the truly great song writers of all time. The greatest song writers wrote mostly in one style. This older Rolling Stone list puts P in at 18 with Bob Dylan at number 1 !

https://www.rollingstone....ongwriters

Appreciate its all a matter of opinion BUT lets take the subject of Love..seriously how many ways did he describe every aspect of love from the sensual to the sexual at every tempo & in every style.

Again, there's not a single writer on that incredible list that I would put ahead of Prince & that includes Lennon & McCartney.

[Edited 6/24/19 7:11am]

[Edited 6/24/19 7:11am]

log off

Genesia said:

That's another thing: this list only included writers of popular music. It completely ignored writers like the ones you mention. (I guess they're too "old.") But think about the impact of people like Henry Mancini, Marvin Hamlisch, the Gershwins, and Rodgers and Hammerstein/Hart had on Broadway and film (not to mention popular music). Hamlisch and Rodgers are the only two people ever to have won Emmy, Grammy, Oscar and Tony awards, PLUS the Pulitzer Prize.

Prince is definitely listed among the greats - and deservedly so. But there are other greats who weren't even mentioned.

And it stands to be mentioned that Broadway-type music and crooner music was pop music in its day. People think of pop as some dancy radio stuff, but shit - they only had radio back then, and they played everything popular, and a bit not-yet-popular. I'd also suggest Sondheim. The stories in his songs are indispensable.

i wouldn't count the rolling stones' type of journalism too much, they always put the usual guys on top in everything. I love a lot of music outside of Prince but I also am indifferent to a lot of guys like Dylan who have a rep. Dylan had a few songs I liked a lot, the one I liked the most, all along the watchtower, was redone better by hendrix. Joni Mitchell recently derided bob ferociously, saying he'd created a character that wasn't real and that bob had said something to her like "i haven't really written a song in years" meaning he was just rehashing his devices or something. If he said that, and I could believe it, then how do I put him above a guy who I consider was always trying? Of course Prince is just one of many great writers, artists and composers throughout time, he's unique in many ways. A dylan wasn't even a great guitarist (as joni mitchell said) and I don't know how much of the arranging he did in his studio/band work, I've always meant to get around to listening to more dylan but he's always c ome across as joni said, a character. Of course they all play a role to a degree but when you're from bumfuck minnesota and you talk like you're from oklahoma, it's kinda transparent. Springsteen, one of my faves does that bullshit too with the fake twang when he's from jersey but i still like so much of what he's done.

Wolfie87 said:

jaawwnn said:

If I'm workin' at my jobba
I'm the victim, you're the robba

Doesn't help.

"If I was your one and only friend Would you run to me if somebody hurt you even if that somebody was me, yeah" Does help however. Sooooo, who did it better from 1980-1989 in contemporary pop then?

I was kidding, ranking songwriters is for chumps. Prince wrote lots of great phrases and occasionally some fantastic lyrics but i'd argue that his strength was in his ability to seamlessly mix the melody, lyrics, the rhythms and the performance all together. His lyrics rarely stand up on their own, which is fine by me.

jaawwnn said:

jaawwnn said:

rdhull said:

PURPLEIZED3121 said:

Apologies - i am sure this has been debated to death BUT it just popped into my head & so I wanted to share!

I just can't get my head around this. When you sit back & compare the sheer volume & the different styles of song writing he came up with compared to the truly great song writers of all time. The greatest song writers wrote mostly in one style. This older Rolling Stone list puts P in at 18 with Bob Dylan at number 1 !

https://www.rollingstone....ongwriters

Appreciate its all a matter of opinion BUT lets take the subject of Love..seriously how many ways did he describe every aspect of love from the sensual to the sexual at every tempo & in every style.

Again, there's not a single writer on that incredible list that I would put ahead of Prince & that includes Lennon & McCartney.

[Edited 6/24/19 7:11am]

[Edited 6/24/19 7:11am]

log off

bog off!

TrivialPursuit said:

Genesia said:

You need to broaden your horizons.

It seems trollish for the OP to make a post that Prince was the all-time greatest lyricist, especially above people like Dylan, Lennon & McCartney, and the numerous songwriters behind famous singer's music. It's ignorance, which is defined as lack of knowledge (opposed to just being stupid).

So I'd agree - listen to more music, read my lyric sheets, and take off your purple tinted glasses. There's a world of music out there before, during, and after Prince.

wow, how incredibly patronising ! FYI I usually go to c 4 gigs per month exploring newer & established artists mostly in smaller venues - often try to chat to them post gig too. Likewise my music collection is huge as I am sure yours is too, also having seen PRINCE c40+ times live I think I am relatively well placed to have a highly informed opinion on the matter...hence the point of threat to open up thye debate on a Prince site that is sorely lacking in well informed content & threads!

Noted that BVH has been posting some incredibly good threads recently & is really putting in the effort.

Enjoy the rest of your day!!

purplethunder3121 said:

Not another GOAT thread...

well errrr why bother contibuting to a thread you have no interest in?..what was the last thread you started that was of any interest?

PURPLEIZED3121 said:

rdhull said:

log off

bog off!

gett off surely would have been better

I don't know if there's another songwriter (lyricist) with such a huge chasm between their best and worst work. I mean, on the one hand - WDC. On the other - yeah, those Lemon Crush lyrics...

Prince isn't even close to either.

PURPLEIZED3121 said:

Apologies - i am sure this has been debated to death BUT it just popped into my head & so I wanted to share!

I just can't get my head around this. When you sit back & compare the sheer volume & the different styles of song writing he came up with compared to the truly great song writers of all time. The greatest song writers wrote mostly in one style. This older Rolling Stone list puts P in at 18 with Bob Dylan at number 1 !

https://www.rollingstone....ongwriters

Appreciate its all a matter of opinion BUT lets take the subject of Love..seriously how many ways did he describe every aspect of love from the sensual to the sexual at every tempo & in every style.

Again, there's not a single writer on that incredible list that I would put ahead of Prince & that includes Lennon & McCartney.

[Edited 6/24/19 7:11am]

[Edited 6/24/19 7:11am]

That's because Bob Dylan is closer to deserving number 1 than Prince. Easy. Quantity is not quality. Not by a long shot. That argument reminds me of Garth Marenghi from Garth Marenghi's Darkplace when he said he's the only author who has written more books than he's read. It's comedy, but the point is the same. If you look at all the Prince songs that are widely agreed to be classics the list isn't very long.

that's subjective and it's your opinion, dylan never spoke to or for me and I never was crazy about many of his tunes, hurricane, all along the watchtower, if he had a catalogue full of those then I'd agree, I've never heard enough good stuff to make me want to hear more like i do with other artists. I can think of many who I personally like more, the stones, the beatles, paul simon etc.., etc..,

steakfinger said:

PURPLEIZED3121 said:

Apologies - i am sure this has been debated to death BUT it just popped into my head & so I wanted to share!

I just can't get my head around this. When you sit back & compare the sheer volume & the different styles of song writing he came up with compared to the truly great song writers of all time. The greatest song writers wrote mostly in one style. This older Rolling Stone list puts P in at 18 with Bob Dylan at number 1 !

https://www.rollingstone....ongwriters

Appreciate its all a matter of opinion BUT lets take the subject of Love..seriously how many ways did he describe every aspect of love from the sensual to the sexual at every tempo & in every style.

Again, there's not a single writer on that incredible list that I would put ahead of Prince & that includes Lennon & McCartney.

[Edited 6/24/19 7:11am]

[Edited 6/24/19 7:11am]

That's because Bob Dylan is closer to deserving number 1 than Prince. Easy. Quantity is not quality. Not by a long shot. That argument reminds me of Garth Marenghi from Garth Marenghi's Darkplace when he said he's the only author who has written more books than he's read. It's comedy, but the point is the same. If you look at all the Prince songs that are widely agreed to be classics the list isn't very long.

steakfinger said: