Prince was not your typical Jehovah witness.

so what things that Prince did after converting to Jehova witness surprised you.

for me

Singing Dirty Mind on pino mic tour

singing Shhh

lyrics like Wet circles around the toy while you bring yourself to joy

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Keep this topic on topic according to what the OP is asking
Do not bash other peoples beliefs, do not go into preaching against religion

Plus the whole BS about trying to get Wendy and Lisa to renounce their homosexuality. As much as I love the music, I'll always be pissed at him for that shit.

SNIP - of4$ -off topic

I kind of got the feeling P was moving away from JW towards the end of his life, like in the last 2 or 3 years. He seemed to be looking for religious direction his entire life, and while I think he found it in JWs initially, it's ultimate negative pronoucements and restrictions, along with all of it's other BS left him diillusioned once more.

lust said:

Prince changing his mind, dirty or otherwise never surprised me. He was a smart guy. Hopefully he figured out that it was all bollix in the end.

He did, and not just in the end. He realized much earlier that organized religion was not for him. He also didn't agree with everything that Larry was talking about. He just didn't let him know that.

embmmusic said:

Plus the whole BS about trying to get Wendy and Lisa to renounce their homosexuality. As much as I love the music, I'll always be pissed at him for that shit.

And good for Wendy for telling Prince she wasn't going to put up his controlness like she had when she worked for him. It wasn't the 80s anymore and Wendy and Lisa were older and wasn't about that life with him anymore and I think Wendy was getting ready to cut ties with Prince for good. But I guess they made up in 2004 when they were both on Tavis Smiley did Reflection and plus Wendy performed with Prince at 2006 and 2007 concerts with him. But still their relationship was never the same nevertheless WL remained forgiving until the end.

Unsual action I would say wearing makeup and JWs do frown on men wearing makeup but I don't think the Bible condemn it but I haven't read the Bible in a long time so I don't know. I am not JW but I had relatives and friends who practice that religion.

SNIP - of4$ -off topic

CatB said:

lust said:

Prince changing his mind, dirty or otherwise never surprised me. He was a smart guy. Hopefully he figured out that it was all bollix in the end.

He did, and not just in the end. He realized much earlier that organized religion was not for him. He also didn't agree with everything that Larry was talking about. He just didn't let him know that.

I agree too. I think Prince continue to go to the Hall just to please Larry Graham as Prince looked him up as a father figure. He lived one image with LG and even LG said he didn't know too much about Prince outside JW as I believed he kept Larry and his wife away from his non-JW side.

I think Prince was leaning into Eastern Philosphy/Metaphysics though learrning more. I read some JWs weren't too happy of Prince and his teaching and mentioned about 3rd eye. Wasn't rumor Bria distanced herself from Prince because he wasn't serious about the religion as she was?

I read a blind item around 2014 from someone who claimed was Prince's employee was shocked that Prince was still swearing as Prince declared he doesn't swear anymore. Not sure how true it is.

So yeah he wasn't that serious toward the end.

Romar71 said:

I kind of got the feeling P was moving away from JW towards the end of his life, like in the last 2 or 3 years. He seemed to be looking for religious direction his entire life, and while I think he found it in JWs initially, it's ultimate negative pronoucements and restrictions, along with all of it's other BS left him diillusioned once more.

I've said this years ago and not a lot of people believed me or paid attention.

Prince, by 2009-2010, was already on his way out of the JW faith. That led to the breakup between him and Bria. Guilt, fear of disfellowship, and probably most of all, his relationship with Larry prevented him from fully walking away so he became what is known as an "inactive member" in the same way that Selena's father was and MJ was.

He went to Kingdom Hall when he felt like it, even going as far as saying that he hadn't gone regularly anymore during a Livestream with Dr. Funk and 3EG, but he wasn't as active as he was before, going as far as studying other religions and spiritual/metaphysical practices and outlooks that would have been forbidden from the JW anyway. His money kept them from disfellowshipping him.

Kim Berry all but confirmed in her book, which gave pretty close details as to what was going on.

At some point around "20Ten", he became frustrated. He later, and repeatedly for a few years, went to the head elders in Brooklyn with very valid questions about their beliefs, most specifically their "new light" regarding only elders being allowed into Paradise, and all of the restrictions regarding his health (don't believe that upcoming "investigative book" as the truth won't really be revealed for about 30 years), among other things. They were unable to satisfactorily and convincingly address his concers, so he walked.

Kim's book was wildly off in regard to exact times of certain things (including her time working with him) but there were certain thing in that book, especially the part about his leaving the JW, that were spot on. There were other things deliberately left ambiguous or unanswered.

[Edited 4/24/19 9:46am]

[Edited 4/24/19 9:57am]

ladygirl99 said:

CatB said:

He did, and not just in the end. He realized much earlier that organized religion was not for him. He also didn't agree with everything that Larry was talking about. He just didn't let him know that.

I agree too. I think Prince continue to go to the Hall just to please Larry Graham as Prince looked him up as a father figure. He lived one image with LG and even LG said he didn't know too much about Prince outside JW as I believed he kept Larry and his wife away from his non-JW side.

I think Prince was leaning into Eastern Philosphy/Metaphysics though learrning more. I read some JWs weren't too happy of Prince and his teaching and mentioned about 3rd eye. Wasn't rumor Bria distanced herself from Prince because he wasn't serious about the religion as she was?

I read a blind item around 2014 from someone who claimed was Prince's employee was shocked that Prince was still swearing as Prince declared he doesn't swear anymore. Not sure how true it is.

So yeah he wasn't that serious toward the end.

He was out by then, just not publicly. He swore... "ass, damn" but generally tried not to around Josh and Hannah. Mild stuff, but I don't think he let any f-bombs fly unless he was a little tipsy. It was said that if you got him drunk enough, the "old Prince" would come out to play.

TrcikyChristopher said:

ladygirl99 said:

I agree too. I think Prince continue to go to the Hall just to please Larry Graham as Prince looked him up as a father figure. He lived one image with LG and even LG said he didn't know too much about Prince outside JW as I believed he kept Larry and his wife away from his non-JW side.

I think Prince was leaning into Eastern Philosphy/Metaphysics though learrning more. I read some JWs weren't too happy of Prince and his teaching and mentioned about 3rd eye. Wasn't rumor Bria distanced herself from Prince because he wasn't serious about the religion as she was?

I read a blind item around 2014 from someone who claimed was Prince's employee was shocked that Prince was still swearing as Prince declared he doesn't swear anymore. Not sure how true it is.

So yeah he wasn't that serious toward the end.

He was out by then, just not publicly. He swore... "ass, damn" but generally tried not to around Josh and Hannah. Mild stuff, but I don't think he let any f-bombs fly unless he was a little tipsy. It was said that if you got him drunk enough, the "old Prince" would come out to play.

I knew it. LOL. I love reading your posts you seem in the know types.

I can't stand regilous gobbledegook, but none of Prince's JW lyrics bother me because, frankly, I don't much pay attention to the words. I listen to Prince songs for the music, not for the lyrics.

embmmusic said:

Plus the whole BS about trying to get Wendy and Lisa to renounce their homosexuality. As much as I love the music, I'll always be pissed at him for that shit.

Also love P, but considering his entire persona from 1980 - till about the time he met Mayte I find that EXTREMELY RICH coming from him.

thebanishedone said:

Unusual actions by a Jehovah Witness is to write a song titled "When She Comes."

OperatingThetan said:

Listening to 'Art Official Age', in particular 'Way Back Home', was enough to convince me that Prince had distanced himself from the faith. The highly spiritual themes and concepts presented are in direct conflict with JW tenets. And I state this as someone with personal experience of the religion. Prince however, behaved in ways that would not have been tolerated by a regular 'rank and file' JW from the very beginning. Even some of the lyrics on 'The Rainbow Children' are highly problematic and are more a Princely blend or interpretation than an accurate reflection of JW beliefs. A regular JW would not be able to openly talk positively about the 'akashic records', energy fields, the third eye or female masturbation for example, without facing disciplinary action.

Yeah all that. With the Study Bible and Strong's Concordance in his offices,it appears he was still holding on to Christian beliefs but was mixing them with New Age/Buddhist imagery/beliefs. I think one of the Bibles photographed was a copy of the JW's New World Translation though.

Along with all of the "preaching" he did while performing from the late 90's through the early 2000's, to me the worst thing was changing many of his lyrics to avoid any profane language. I cringed when he played DMSR..."work that body like you want some more??" Uh

OperatingThetan said:

Listening to 'Art Official Age', in particular 'Way Back Home', was enough to convince me that Prince had distanced himself from the faith. The highly spiritual themes and concepts presented are in direct conflict with JW tenets. And I state this as someone with personal experience of the religion. Prince however, behaved in ways that would not have been tolerated by a regular 'rank and file' JW from the very beginning. Even some of the lyrics on 'The Rainbow Children' are highly problematic and are more a Princely blend or interpretation than an accurate reflection of JW beliefs. A regular JW would not be able to openly talk positively about the 'akashic records', energy fields, the third eye or female masturbation for example, without facing disciplinary action.

Yes, seems he was given many "passes", however, I have no doubt the recruiting exposure he gave them was invaluable. No way they were going to oust him.

*

violetcrush said:

OperatingThetan said:

Listening to 'Art Official Age', in particular 'Way Back Home', was enough to convince me that Prince had distanced himself from the faith. The highly spiritual themes and concepts presented are in direct conflict with JW tenets. And I state this as someone with personal experience of the religion. Prince however, behaved in ways that would not have been tolerated by a regular 'rank and file' JW from the very beginning. Even some of the lyrics on 'The Rainbow Children' are highly problematic and are more a Princely blend or interpretation than an accurate reflection of JW beliefs. A regular JW would not be able to openly talk positively about the 'akashic records', energy fields, the third eye or female masturbation for example, without facing disciplinary action.

Yes, seems he was given many "passes", however, I have no doubt the recruiting exposure he gave them was invaluable. No way they were going to oust him.

*

^^^^Good point....very good point.

Romar71 said:

I kind of got the feeling P was moving away from JW towards the end of his life, like in the last 2 or 3 years. He seemed to be looking for religious direction his entire life, and while I think he found it in JWs initially, it's ultimate negative pronoucements and restrictions, along with all of it's other BS left him diillusioned once more.

While he seemed to be moving away from organized religion, in some respects he seemed to be moving closer to a personal spirituality of his own...

Prince was a weird guy. He openly talked about 'augmenting' his faith from other sources, which is very frowned upon by the Witnesses. He still showed up to Memorial Of Jesus' Death ceremony they do yearly and (probably) still wrote big checks to The Watch Tower. He seemingly had no connection to his local congregation outside of Graham. The only service he did was so it could be publicized.

There's alot of misconceptions against the Witnesses in this thread, which isn't worth going into, but it's a shame that Prince couldn't fully give himself over to that life. I can empathize with his struggle, especially since it seemed like he couldn't (or wouldn't) accept counsel from his brothers and sisters.

TrcikyChristopher said:

I've said this years ago and not a lot of people believed me or paid attention.

He also brought it up on Lavaux

Come take me to an assembly in New York
To speak of the brand new everlasting wonder war
To win or lose is so absurd
And the only casualty is the word, the word

Strive said:

Prince was a weird guy. He openly talked about 'augmenting' his faith from other sources, which is very frowned upon by the Witnesses. He still showed up to Memorial Of Jesus' Death ceremony they do yearly and (probably) still wrote big checks to The Watch Tower. He seemingly had no connection to his local congregation outside of Graham. The only service he did was so it could be publicized.

There's alot of misconceptions against the Witnesses in this thread, which isn't worth going into, but it's a shame that Prince couldn't fully give himself over to that life. I can empathize with his struggle, especially since it seemed like he couldn't (or wouldn't) accept counsel from his brothers and sisters.

I do not believe there are misconceptions on this thread about JWs.

If you think there are, you need to educate us and tell us about the misconceptions.

SNIP - of4$ (this is about Prince and the JW)

ISaidLifeIsJustAGame said:

I do not believe there are misconceptions on this thread about JWs.

If you think there are, you need to educate us and tell us about the misconceptions.

Do I? I'm open to discussing but I don't think you have discussion on your mind.

.

Did you know that in the 1940s the big thing against the Witnesses (besides, believe it or not, them being a million times more annoying than they are today) was the fact they wouldn't salute the flag or serve in the military? A number of Americans actually thought that they were members of the Fifth Column because of that decision. A decision that happened because Judge Rutherford saw German brothers being persecuted by Hitler for refusing to sieg heil. He thought that act was so great that he applied the same bibically sourced logic to the closest parallel in our American society. (Another fun fact, the Pledge Of Allieance originally used a Bellmany salute instead of a hand over the heart https://en.wikipedia.org/...amy_salute)

.

It may seem like I'm rambling but my point is that there's always something that naysayers will latch onto. In times of war, it's their neutrality. In modern times, it's their beliefs with blood transfusions. Regardless of what the genesis of the belief was - JWs will point to the bible, others will point to man's flawed interpretation of the bible - they believe what they believe and they draw a line in the sand over certain sections. That's their prerogative.

.

Outside of that, TrcikyChristopher is mistaken about what he was saying about only the governing body or elders being allowed in paradise. I can onlly find mention of that sort of thing on anti-JW websties but, even if they're 100% correct, the 144,000 foretold in Revelation aren't recieving paradise. They're serving at Jehovah's side in heaven while Jesus Christ heads God's Kingdom on Earth. Everybody gets the opportunity for paradise on Earth with the resurrection unless they recieve direct judgment during the Apocalypse. But everybody will also have to live under God's law while in the new world. There's no social change. There's no original sin. There's no scapegoats to fall back on.

.

You will or you won't.

.

(Also I realize I write with a level of force but I'm not a bible scholar. I could be wrong about certain things but what I wrote is to the best of my knowledge)

[Edited 4/27/19 19:44pm]

Why isn't this in the Politics and Religion Forum? We've hashed this out years ago.

(Please don't beat me up for askin')

Strive said:

Prince was a weird guy. He openly talked about 'augmenting' his faith from other sources, which is very frowned upon by the Witnesses. He still showed up to Memorial Of Jesus' Death ceremony they do yearly and (probably) still wrote big checks to The Watch Tower. He seemingly had no connection to his local congregation outside of Graham. The only service he did was so it could be publicized.

There's alot of misconceptions against the Witnesses in this thread, which isn't worth going into, but it's a shame that Prince couldn't fully give himself over to that life. I can empathize with his struggle, especially since it seemed like he couldn't (or wouldn't) accept counsel from his brothers and sisters.

TrcikyChristopher said:

I've said this years ago and not a lot of people believed me or paid attention.

He also brought it up on Lavaux

Come take me to an assembly in New York
To speak of the brand new everlasting wonder war
To win or lose is so absurd
And the only casualty is the word, the word

I may be delving a little too deep, but it's not as cut and dry as anyone is portraying it to be. Prince had issues not only with the "new light" about Paradise which was divulged sometime after Lotus (not exactly sure), but he had more pressing health issues with his hips and other problems.

The JW forbade him from a full hip replacement, so he settled with a "repair" that didn't fix the issue but made it a little more bareable. Add that with other issues later, he was relying more and more on pain medication, listening to not only JW's who forbade other procedures, but because he was so spiritually minded, he listened to people who were somewhat of the same mind but lacked basic common sense and gave him very unsage advice. hm. He asked for clarification from the JW elders regarding their beliefs and they gave him none. By the time everything got worse, he started slowly pulling away from those same spiritually minded folks altogether, including JW's because he became severely disillusioned due to what was happening. It was too late. There was more going on - allegedly.

[Edited 4/29/19 21:18pm]

TrcikyChristopher said:

I've said this years ago and not a lot of people believed me or paid attention.

[Edited 4/24/19 9:46am]

[Edited 4/24/19 9:57am]

I believed you and I paid attention. I remember all of it.