independent and unofficial
Prince fan community site
Tue 25th Feb 2020 1:03am
Welcome! Sign up or enter username and password to remember me
Forum jump
Forums > Prince: Music and More > unusual actions by Jehovah Witness
« Previous topic  Next topic »
Page 7 of 9 <123456789>
  New topic   Printable     (Log in to 'subscribe' to this topic)
Reply #180 posted 05/22/19 9:34pm

ISaidLifeIsJus
tAGame

avatar

  - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #181 posted 05/22/19 9:49pm

Mumio

avatar

lol lol falloff

ISaidLifeIsJustAGame said:

Welcome to "the org", Mumio…they can have you, but I'll have your love in the end nod
  - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #182 posted 05/23/19 6:32am

PennyPurple

avatar

lol Perfect

ISaidLifeIsJustAGame said:

COME BACK RODEO COME BACK!
  - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #183 posted 05/23/19 6:55am

violetcrush

^^^ That’s a good one biggrin
  - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #184 posted 05/23/19 8:16am

rdhull

avatar

He's been clowned for decades, but thank God for Larry Graham. He made Prince grow up. Or else we would have him still acting childish in concert at 40 plus years trying to be some overthehill sex symbol act caricature of his former self. Even Jagger stopped that mess in later years (after becoming said caricature) and focused more on the music and musicianship. Madonna grew up too. Not saying that Prince (and Jagger/Madonna etc) gave up sexuality in the art, but it was matured and not so primary lascivious or forced. Larry brought us The Truth, TRC, Xenophobia, C-Note, Musicology, SST etc eras. God knows we would have had to hear Pussy Control or some embarrassing shit from a middle aged genius instead of the some of the other inspired works in the new millenium.

.

[Edited 5/23/19 8:32am]

"Climb in my fur."
  - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #185 posted 05/23/19 9:42am

roxy831

avatar

rdhull said:

He's been clowned for decades, but thank God for Larry Graham. He made Prince grow up. Or else we would have him still acting childish in concert at 40 plus years trying to be some overthehill sex symbol act caricature of his former self. Even Jagger stopped that mess in later years (after becoming said caricature) and focused more on the music and musicianship. Madonna grew up too. Not saying that Prince (and Jagger/Madonna etc) gave up sexuality in the art, but it was matured and not so primary lascivious or forced. Larry brought us The Truth, TRC, Xenophobia, C-Note, Musicology, SST etc eras. God knows we would have had to hear Pussy Control or some embarrassing shit from a middle aged genius instead of the some of the other inspired works in the new millenium.

.

[Edited 5/23/19 8:32am]

I have to disagree. That's quite unfair to give Larry that much credit. After P suffered as much loss as he did between late 90 to early 2000, it's very possible everything he was meant to become was already there with or without Larry, jmo.

Welcome home class. We've come a long way. - RIP Prince
  - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #186 posted 05/23/19 10:02am

PennyPurple

avatar

Larry took advantage of Prince's delicate state of mind at that time.

COME BACK RODEO COME BACK!
  - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #187 posted 05/23/19 10:02am

rdhull

avatar

roxy831 said:

rdhull said:

He's been clowned for decades, but thank God for Larry Graham. He made Prince grow up. Or else we would have him still acting childish in concert at 40 plus years trying to be some overthehill sex symbol act caricature of his former self. Even Jagger stopped that mess in later years (after becoming said caricature) and focused more on the music and musicianship. Madonna grew up too. Not saying that Prince (and Jagger/Madonna etc) gave up sexuality in the art, but it was matured and not so primary lascivious or forced. Larry brought us The Truth, TRC, Xenophobia, C-Note, Musicology, SST etc eras. God knows we would have had to hear Pussy Control or some embarrassing shit from a middle aged genius instead of the some of the other inspired works in the new millenium.

.

[Edited 5/23/19 8:32am]

I have to disagree. That's quite unfair to give Larry that much credit. After P suffered as much loss as he did between late 90 to early 2000, it's very possible everything he was meant to become was already there with or without Larry, jmo.

Well, with how most people have theorized in making Larry the pariah that created a so called downfall of the lascivious, free thinking, creative,\ Prince, he must have been the facilitator.

"Climb in my fur."
  - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #188 posted 05/23/19 10:27am

violetcrush

rdhull said:



roxy831 said:




rdhull said:


He's been clowned for decades, but thank God for Larry Graham. He made Prince grow up. Or else we would have him still acting childish in concert at 40 plus years trying to be some overthehill sex symbol act caricature of his former self. Even Jagger stopped that mess in later years (after becoming said caricature) and focused more on the music and musicianship. Madonna grew up too. Not saying that Prince (and Jagger/Madonna etc) gave up sexuality in the art, but it was matured and not so primary lascivious or forced. Larry brought us The Truth, TRC, Xenophobia, C-Note, Musicology, SST etc eras. God knows we would have had to hear Pussy Control or some embarrassing shit from a middle aged genius instead of the some of the other inspired works in the new millenium.

.


[Edited 5/23/19 8:32am]



I have to disagree. That's quite unfair to give Larry that much credit. After P suffered as much loss as he did between late 90 to early 2000, it's very possible everything he was meant to become was already there with or without Larry, jmo.



Well, with how most people have theorized in making Larry the pariah that created a so called downfall of the lascivious, free thinking, creative,\ Prince, he must have been the facilitator.


I don’t think it was necessarily a calculated move on Larry’s part. They met when they were both performing in TN (Nashville I think?) and Prince invited him to his after show. Prince told the story of Larry’s wife carrying his guitar pedal in her purse and she pulled it out for him. Prince said, “now THAT’S love” smile I think their conversations about faith and religion happened organically, but at a certain point Larry would have begun “witnessing” to Prince about JW. The members are conditioned and required to do this in order to recruit new members. Converting someone like Prince would be huge for the JW group. It took quite awhile though. Larry moved to MN not long after he began touring with Prince, so probably sometime in 1998, however, I believe Prince did not officially join JW until 2000-2001. Lots of changes btw ‘97-2000 though - “preachy” interviews and performances, no more cursing, lyric changes to older songs, Mayte “banished”, and then TRC record. Prince had a mind of his own for sure, but Larry’s influence was huge.
  - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #189 posted 05/23/19 10:35am

rdhull

avatar

violetcrush said:

rdhull said:

Well, with how most people have theorized in making Larry the pariah that created a so called downfall of the lascivious, free thinking, creative,\ Prince, he must have been the facilitator.

I don’t think it was necessarily a calculated move on Larry’s part.

I dont either, others do. And thanks for the history lesson I already knew.

"Climb in my fur."
  - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #190 posted 05/23/19 11:43am

violetcrush

rdhull said:



violetcrush said:


rdhull said:


Well, with how most people have theorized in making Larry the pariah that created a so called downfall of the lascivious, free thinking, creative,\ Prince, he must have been the facilitator.



I don’t think it was necessarily a calculated move on Larry’s part.

I dont either, others do. And thanks for the history lesson I already knew.


I disagree though, with your thought that Prince needed Larry to help him “grow up” and act more maturely. If you look at Emancipation (pre Larry) Prince was already moving away from the angry/overtly sexual songs and sharing a more mature side. I think his expecting a child changed his perspective on life, age and growing up. He talked about it during interviews. I think what Larry did was influence him to take things to the extreme in his life and with his music. He probably would have decided on his own not to continue doing P Control or Darling Nikki, but he would not have been preaching in his songs or changing lyrics to classics like DMSR.
  - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #191 posted 05/23/19 12:59pm

rdhull

avatar

violetcrush said:

rdhull said:

I dont either, others do. And thanks for the history lesson I already knew.

I disagree though, with your thought that Prince needed Larry to help him “grow up” and act more maturely. If you look at Emancipation (pre Larry) Prince was already moving away from the angry/overtly sexual songs and sharing a more mature side. I think his expecting a child changed his perspective on life, age and growing up. He talked about it during interviews. I think what Larry did was influence him to take things to the extreme in his life and with his music. He probably would have decided on his own not to continue doing P Control or Darling Nikki, but he would not have been preaching in his songs or changing lyrics to classics like DMSR.

copy, print, and save

"Climb in my fur."
  - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #192 posted 05/23/19 1:21pm

PliablyPurple

The feminist anthem, Pussy Control, would sound great in today's climate. P was so far ahead of the game, fools still ain't caught up.

  - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #193 posted 05/23/19 5:06pm

violetcrush

PliablyPurple said:

The feminist anthem, Pussy Control, would sound great in today's climate. P was so far ahead of the game, fools still ain't caught up.


Yes and no. Depends on what you believe to he feminism. The way Prince portrayed women on stage (Vanity 6, Diamond & Pearl, Mayte) often contradicted the traditional feminist message, which is that women should not have to be objectified or use their sexuality/looks to get ahead or to persuade a man to do something for them. It was always a sexual thing with Prince and women on stage.
  - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #194 posted 05/23/19 5:23pm

PliablyPurple

violetcrush said:

PliablyPurple said:

The feminist anthem, Pussy Control, would sound great in today's climate. P was so far ahead of the game, fools still ain't caught up.

Yes and no. Depends on what you believe to he feminism. The way Prince portrayed women on stage (Vanity 6, Diamond & Pearl, Mayte) often contradicted the traditional feminist message, which is that women should not have to be objectified or use their sexuality/looks to get ahead or to persuade a man to do something for them. It was always a sexual thing with Prince and women on stage.

Well, let's first recognize, like Pussy Control did, that feminism was born to address gender imbalance in how women were treated by society at large. Evolving, sexuality most certainly becomes a part of the feminist movement. With that in mind, I will say that "tradition," often times has ugly faults of its own and I would never align myself with a "feminist" movement that crosses into slut shaming, usually because that pov does not recognize agency in situations in which the woman possesses it - which in itself I find ironic since I thought that's what we were fighting for in the first fucking place.

  - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #195 posted 05/23/19 5:33pm

violetcrush

PliablyPurple said:



violetcrush said:


PliablyPurple said:

The feminist anthem, Pussy Control, would sound great in today's climate. P was so far ahead of the game, fools still ain't caught up.



Yes and no. Depends on what you believe to he feminism. The way Prince portrayed women on stage (Vanity 6, Diamond & Pearl, Mayte) often contradicted the traditional feminist message, which is that women should not have to be objectified or use their sexuality/looks to get ahead or to persuade a man to do something for them. It was always a sexual thing with Prince and women on stage.

Well, let's first recognize, like Pussy Control did, that feminism was born to address gender imbalance in how women were treated by society at large. Evolving, sexuality most certainly becomes a part of the feminist movement. With that in mind, I will say that "tradition," often times has ugly faults of its own and I would never align myself with a "feminist" movement that crosses into slut shaming, usually because that pov does not recognize agency in situations in which the woman possesses it - which in itself I find ironic since I thought that's what we were fighting for in the first fucking place.



Yes, but we’ve also been fighting for women to be taken seriously for years - recognized for their intellect and ideas and not just their physical attributes. It’s a long and complex discussion because there are varying viewpoints on what empowers women vs what sets them back in terms of equality with men.
  - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #196 posted 05/23/19 5:52pm

PliablyPurple

violetcrush said:

PliablyPurple said:

Well, let's first recognize, like Pussy Control did, that feminism was born to address gender imbalance in how women were treated by society at large. Evolving, sexuality most certainly becomes a part of the feminist movement. With that in mind, I will say that "tradition," often times has ugly faults of its own and I would never align myself with a "feminist" movement that crosses into slut shaming, usually because that pov does not recognize agency in situations in which the woman possesses it - which in itself I find ironic since I thought that's what we were fighting for in the first fucking place.

Yes, but we’ve also been fighting for women to be taken seriously for years - recognized for their intellect and ideas and not just their physical attributes. It’s a long and complex discussion because there are varying viewpoints on what empowers women vs what sets them back in terms of equality with men.

Well, a little context is in order. A little t and a in rock n roll is (should be) nothing, but sure, you don't want to go to the board meeting in lingerie. Which, by the way, - it shouldn't be on women to have to hide who they want to be (again, in the appropriate context - we are talking about rock music here) because men can't act civilized. That is one shitty barometer to use for defining progress. How about making it an empowerment v/s man's shitty reaction to women thing instead of "what sets women back in terms of equality with men"?

  - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #197 posted 05/23/19 6:12pm

violetcrush

PliablyPurple said:



violetcrush said:


PliablyPurple said:


Well, let's first recognize, like Pussy Control did, that feminism was born to address gender imbalance in how women were treated by society at large. Evolving, sexuality most certainly becomes a part of the feminist movement. With that in mind, I will say that "tradition," often times has ugly faults of its own and I would never align myself with a "feminist" movement that crosses into slut shaming, usually because that pov does not recognize agency in situations in which the woman possesses it - which in itself I find ironic since I thought that's what we were fighting for in the first fucking place.




Yes, but we’ve also been fighting for women to be taken seriously for years - recognized for their intellect and ideas and not just their physical attributes. It’s a long and complex discussion because there are varying viewpoints on what empowers women vs what sets them back in terms of equality with men.

Well, a little context is in order. A little t and a in rock n roll is (should be) nothing, but sure, you don't want to go to the board meeting in lingerie. Which, by the way, - it shouldn't be on women to have to hide who they want to be (again, in the appropriate context - we are talking about rock music here) because men can't act civilized. That is one shitty barometer to use for defining progress. How about making it an empowerment v/s man's shitty reaction to women thing instead of "what sets women back in terms of equality with men"?


But men are human, so when they see a woman on stage half dressed, gyrating, and bending over above them on stage (a la Mayte with Prince) what reaction are they supposed to have other than a smile and an erection??
*
Wendy & Lisa have talked about this in interviews. They wanted to be taken seriously for their talent and music but the record execs wanted them to be the Mary Jane Girls. Wendy said recently the execs were happy when she brought Susannah into the mix because she was considered “fuckable”.
  - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #198 posted 05/23/19 6:22pm

PliablyPurple

violetcrush said:

PliablyPurple said:

Well, a little context is in order. A little t and a in rock n roll is (should be) nothing, but sure, you don't want to go to the board meeting in lingerie. Which, by the way, - it shouldn't be on women to have to hide who they want to be (again, in the appropriate context - we are talking about rock music here) because men can't act civilized. That is one shitty barometer to use for defining progress. How about making it an empowerment v/s man's shitty reaction to women thing instead of "what sets women back in terms of equality with men"?

But men are human, so when they see a woman on stage half dressed, gyrating, and bending over above them on stage (a la Mayte with Prince) what reaction are they supposed to have other than a smile and an erection??

Jesus, that's one low bar for your expectations on what it means to be a man. A man can't see a beautiful woman onstage @ a rock show without getting an erection? I say again, "feminists" of a certain persuasion - ask more of your men.

Re: your Wendy anecdote: And that's a worthy fight. Fighting against mistreatment of women in the workplace is a noble battle.

  - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #199 posted 05/23/19 8:42pm

violetcrush

PliablyPurple said:



violetcrush said:


PliablyPurple said:


Well, a little context is in order. A little t and a in rock n roll is (should be) nothing, but sure, you don't want to go to the board meeting in lingerie. Which, by the way, - it shouldn't be on women to have to hide who they want to be (again, in the appropriate context - we are talking about rock music here) because men can't act civilized. That is one shitty barometer to use for defining progress. How about making it an empowerment v/s man's shitty reaction to women thing instead of "what sets women back in terms of equality with men"?



But men are human, so when they see a woman on stage half dressed, gyrating, and bending over above them on stage (a la Mayte with Prince) what reaction are they supposed to have other than a smile and an erection??

Jesus, that's one low bar for your expectations on what it means to be a man. A man can't see a beautiful woman onstage @ a rock show without getting an erection? I say again, "feminists" of a certain persuasion - ask more of your men.

Re: your Wendy anecdote: And that's a worthy fight. Fighting against mistreatment of women in the workplace is a noble battle.


From Q Magazine May 1995 - describing Mayte on stage:
*
“What it really is, is a huge tease. When O(+>requests Mayte (who errs on the side of gorgeous) to come to the lip of the stage, bend over, grip her heels and, in his words, “shake your moneymaker for the interest of the audience,not only does she do it, but she smiles while she’s doing it. “It’s terrible,” says one industry insider the following day. “You leave with an erection.” “
*
Also, watch the “18 & Over” video...
[Edited 5/23/19 20:44pm]
  - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #200 posted 05/23/19 9:36pm

ISaidLifeIsJus
tAGame

avatar

violetcrush said:

PliablyPurple said:

Jesus, that's one low bar for your expectations on what it means to be a man. A man can't see a beautiful woman onstage @ a rock show without getting an erection? I say again, "feminists" of a certain persuasion - ask more of your men.

Re: your Wendy anecdote: And that's a worthy fight. Fighting against mistreatment of women in the workplace is a noble battle.

From Q Magazine May 1995 - describing Mayte on stage: * “What it really is, is a huge tease. When O(+>requests Mayte (who errs on the side of gorgeous) to come to the lip of the stage, bend over, grip her heels and, in his words, “shake your moneymaker for the interest of the audience,not only does she do it, but she smiles while she’s doing it. “It’s terrible,” says one industry insider the following day. “You leave with an erection.” “ * Also, watch the “18 & Over” video... [Edited 5/23/19 20:44pm]



You need to quit.

  - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #201 posted 05/24/19 4:49am

violetcrush

ISaidLifeIsJustAGame said:



violetcrush said:


PliablyPurple said:


Jesus, that's one low bar for your expectations on what it means to be a man. A man can't see a beautiful woman onstage @ a rock show without getting an erection? I say again, "feminists" of a certain persuasion - ask more of your men.

Re: your Wendy anecdote: And that's a worthy fight. Fighting against mistreatment of women in the workplace is a noble battle.



From Q Magazine May 1995 - describing Mayte on stage: * “What it really is, is a huge tease. When O(+>requests Mayte (who errs on the side of gorgeous) to come to the lip of the stage, bend over, grip her heels and, in his words, “shake your moneymaker for the interest of the audience,not only does she do it, but she smiles while she’s doing it. “It’s terrible,” says one industry insider the following day. “You leave with an erection.” “ * Also, watch the “18 & Over” video... [Edited 5/23/19 20:44pm]



You need to quit.


Nah, nothing wrong with quoting articles that seem to support my point. Very common here, especially when referring to historical events with Prince.
  - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #202 posted 05/24/19 8:07am

PliablyPurple

Slut shaming hyperbole from an insider whose gender is not specified. It's like I don't even have to respond and you make my argument for me, thanks.

  - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #203 posted 05/25/19 6:22am

violetcrush

PliablyPurple said:

Slut shaming hyperbole from an insider whose gender is not specified. It's like I don't even have to respond and you make my argument for me, thanks.


I think the gender is pretty clear as he’s specifying leaving with an “erection”, which would be physiologically impossible for a female.
*
No “slut-shaming” here. Just straight up facts about what was happening on stage at that time. The videos are out there. Take a look.
  - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #204 posted 05/25/19 7:39am

barnswallow

avatar

PeteSilas said:

people are funny, i learned growing up to take people's faith with a grain of salt, i still remember church women calling me to do work at their house and asking me to take off my shirt and shit. It used to confuse and intrigue me, still does but it's like you're dealing with more than one person when you're dealing with a religious person. Maybe that's how we all are, we all have different personalities that gnash and fight each other. Prince was a perfect example of that even before he went jw. He didn't change all that much, you go back to 1985 and there he is onstage being admonished by god for showing his ass and acting pimpish. Howard Bloom had an interesting take; that by the end of the eighties, the god voice, which he said was his father's voice, won and prince went to that side over the wild, young kid he was.

Warning: this has nothing to do with JW. Well. Your post caught my eye. Amused to think of religious women asking you to take your shirt off while you're mowing the lawn! Brought me back around to Prince and his mum and something about him reading pornographic books/mags she had and then, all the while that she was 7thDayAdventist. And my thoughts swung to someone's comment above about the rigid/strict demands of 7thDayAdventists, which I know not a whit about, but assume it has some restrictions regarding sexuality. Then, back around to PRN, his sexuality on stage, his appeal to women. Anyway. I've been enjoying this whole thread. And, I'm only on page 3 or so. smile

I wanna top the rose petals that whisper sweet
  - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #205 posted 05/25/19 9:13am

itsjustaroundt
hecorner

Which actions by Jehovah Witness are 'Unusual Actions'?

Every Single One.

  - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #206 posted 05/25/19 10:22am

Morgaine

violetcrush said:

PliablyPurple said:

Slut shaming hyperbole from an insider whose gender is not specified. It's like I don't even have to respond and you make my argument for me, thanks.


I think the gender is pretty clear as he’s specifying leaving with an “erection”, which would be physiologically impossible for a female.
*
No “slut-shaming” here. Just straight up facts about what was happening on stage at that time. The videos are out there. Take a look.


You didn't quote facts. You quoted a reporter's POV about Mayte who we all know you don't like. Huge difference. Stating an opinion like you posted is one thing but stating it's fact is not only incorrect but obnoxious & obtuse.

Peace & Be Wild
The kind of love that takes over your body, mind, & soul
  - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #207 posted 05/25/19 11:05am

violetcrush

Morgaine said:

violetcrush said:


I think the gender is pretty clear as he’s specifying leaving with an “erection”, which would be physiologically impossible for a female.
*
No “slut-shaming” here. Just straight up facts about what was happening on stage at that time. The videos are out there. Take a look.


You didn't quote facts. You quoted a reporter's POV about Mayte who we all know you don't like. Huge difference. Stating an opinion like you posted is one thing but stating it's fact is not only incorrect but obnoxious & obtuse.

Peace & Be Wild

I’ve never stated I don’t like Mayte. I have, however, stated what I think the dynamic of that relationship was, and also my opinion of many of her behaviors and actions related to Prince after he left her. I think she’s “cashed in” more than anyone since his death, and she attempted to before he died. Bad form all around.
*
What I posted was just one journalist’s take on her stage antics. There are many others if you go back and read the articles from that time - not to mention videos such as 18 & Over where she’s doing a full on crutch bend at the camera and others where she’s basically mimicking a Playboy Playmate video with slightly more clothing.
  - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #208 posted 05/25/19 12:07pm

PliablyPurple

Lol @ "and she smiles while she's doing it...it's terrible." What ya gonna do about peeps stuck in an Andy Griffith world tryin' to appreciate Prince? It is kinda cute, though, to see the struggle, the lack of recognition. It's too bad it's such a dangerous precedent to set for society.

  - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #209 posted 05/25/19 2:00pm

RJP1205

itsjustaroundthecorner said:

Which actions by Jehovah Witness are 'Unusual Actions'?



Every Single One.




Yup! I grew up JW, the elders had a meltdown when I got my ears double pierced (I'm female BTW)...a man wearing makeup would never be tolerated. Men are to be men and women are to be wholesome. I remember a girl being sent home from an assembly because her dress was too sexy. I was nominated for Homecoming Queen at school. My Dad (an elder) made me tell the teacher in charge that I had to turn it down. JW's are not allowed to make themselves seem important. To play a concert with tons of fans?!? And I couldn't be HC Queen in a small town?? I was also "reproved" for dating outside the faith...one step below disfellowshipping. But Prince was able to do that. Of course, men are held on high in that organization and can get away with more but still..sorry, I adore Prince but he got away with A LOT that other JW's would not be able to do and stay in the church.
  - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Page 7 of 9 <123456789>
  New topic   Printable     (Log in to 'subscribe' to this topic)
« Previous topic  Next topic »
Forums > Prince: Music and More > unusual actions by Jehovah Witness