We know they were both on the same Label in the 80s and both of their minds I think worked very similarly (P in regard to music in general, and EVH more specifically tailored to guitar) Both of them sought to expand the pallette and create new avenues of sound. Just wondering if they ever met or jammed and if there is any footage of that? (omg that would be to epic)

Dirty Mind = Jump. That's where they met.

rdhull said:

Dirty Mind = Jump. That's where they met.

rdhull said:

Dirty Mind = Jump. That's where they met.

yup, back when everyone copied the man, everyone. there was a reason prince went back to calling the 80's "the good old days".

Doubt it. Eddie Van Halen is famously racist.

eugenius said:

Doubt it. Eddie Van Halen is famously racist.

Is it the Pat Smear incident?

eugenius said:

Doubt it. Eddie Van Halen is famously racist.

Famously, yet this is the first I've heard of it.

TheBigBang said:

eugenius said:

Doubt it. Eddie Van Halen is famously racist.

Famously, yet this is the first I've heard of it.

I wonder if Michael and Quncy knew.

rdhull said:

TheBigBang said:

Famously, yet this is the first I've heard of it.

I wonder if Michael and Quncy knew.

eddie was half polynesian himself. I wonder if there's any truth to this. Of course he (Prince too) never gave props to jimi like they should have but that's only because of boneheaded competitiveness.

rdhull said:

eugenius said:

Doubt it. Eddie Van Halen is famously racist.

Is it the Pat Smear incident?

now now, we don't need to be bringing gynecological terms into it.

TheBigBang said:

eugenius said:

Doubt it. Eddie Van Halen is famously racist.

Famously, yet this is the first I've heard of it.

Get out -- read more.

rdhull said:

eugenius said:

Doubt it. Eddie Van Halen is famously racist.

Is it the Pat Smear incident?

That's the first one that came to mind.

eugenius said:

TheBigBang said:

Famously, yet this is the first I've heard of it.

Get out -- read more.

not everyone digs buttrock, i love some of VH's music but was never a superfan and never heard this myself.

he called him a 'dirty mexican' huh? wonder why. i'm reading he was drunk, hardly counts as being a hardcore racist as drunks do a lot of stupid shit.

[Edited 2/13/19 14:56pm]

PeteSilas said:

he called him a 'dirty mexican' huh? wonder why.

No, I "thin" that was Def Leppards Joe Elliott I believe. He stated in his 1983 concert that he was glad to be where he was instead of "El Paso with all those dirty Mexicans" to the concert crowd. The VH one was Eddie making racists comments in drunken stupor to Pat Smear about Smears background.

I remember reading an interview with Eddie (years ago) about the struggles he and his brother (Alex) had when they came to the States. He said he and Alex used to get into fights with the white kids because they were different (and didn't speak the language)....He also said that he and his brother hung out (and felt comfortable) with the black people around his neighborhood. According to Eddie they were cool with him and he said he (sort of) understood what they went through.....I've read about the Pat Smear incident and that was when Eddie was blitzed out of his mind...not defending Eddie because that was a stupid thing to say.. drunk or not.

Prince and Van Halen had virtually the same album release schedule during the 80's while at Warner Brothers. I've heard stories they would at times cross paths at the main offices at times and give each other a respectful head nod, but never spoke to each other.

Eddie was indeed drunk and all he said to Cobain was "could I borrow the Mexican's guitar", nothing more.

As for P, he preferred to jam with inferior souls like Maroon 5, that travesty of a band. He never entered a situation out of his league, too bad, he could've learned and alot.

This goes back to Michael Jackson upstaging him at the James Brown concert, completely embarrassed himself. Like Quincy said, Prince had 6 years of experience versus Michael's 25 or so. He neither danced nor played the guitar, just looked out of place and unable to improvise. From that moment on he never shared the stage unless it was a controolled environment or uber-rehearsed. Other so-called lesser talents do it off the cuff all the time, jam with their heroes without missing a note, although he did once jam with a no name band in an LA hotel lobby.

fun fact: Eddie laid down the Beat It solo in 20 minutes, got paid with a 6 pack, turned down credit, and lost millions in royalties or at least getting paid for the session. Then Thriller prevents 1984 from going number 1 on the album charts.

woogiebear said:

rdhull said:

Dirty Mind = Jump. That's where they met.

riiight......

let's review -- one has a sophisticated chord structure with a prog rock middle eight, an unduplicable guitar solo and a great synth solo to boot, was a number 1 single, and is and has been played at nearly every American sports event over the past 30 years, and the other is none of those things...

your turn...

Musician9 said:

woogiebear said:

riiight......

let's review -- one has a sophisticated chord structure with a prog rock middle eight, an unduplicable guitar solo and a great synth solo to boot, was a number 1 single, and is and has been played at nearly every American sports event over the past 30 years, and the other is none of those things...

your turn...

jumps a great song, better than the song that inspired it in my mind but it still was lifted off of that. Everyone stole from prince in those years, even the mighty MJ took 1999 into the studio and asked for Thriller's opening to be based off of it. Eddie took to playing keys because he could see that it was the hot thing in the business at that time, had he stuck with buttrock he probably would have fallen off earlier than he did. Grunge of course (along with hip hop) was an affront to all the previous rock bands so smartassed cobain who i never liked anyway, who cares what he had to say, his idiotic, self-appointed responsibility was to kill rock. He did his job though, guns and roses and poison and all the buttrockers and makeup boys with the big hair surrounded by big titted women were a thing of the past for a few years. Kinda ironic because talent wise, the grunge shit was not even close to being as polished as rock music became, maybe that's why it cycled the way it did.

Musician9 said:

woogiebear said:

riiight......

let's review -- one has a sophisticated chord structure with a prog rock middle eight, an unduplicable guitar solo and a great synth solo to boot, was a number 1 single, and is and has been played at nearly every American sports event over the past 30 years, and the other is none of those things...

your turn...

A number 1 single, a prog middle eight, and being played at sports events means they hadn't copped the main melody from the song Dirty Mind.

Ok chief

I've been a Prince fan since 1983 and a Van Halen fan for maybe even longer than that (obviously more of a Prince fan though!)

I have never, not even once, thought that Jump sounded like Dirty Mind, or for that matter even sounded like Prince at all.

Se7en said:

I've been a Prince fan since 1983 and a Van Halen fan for maybe even longer than that (obviously more of a Prince fan though!)

I have never, not even once, thought that Jump sounded like Dirty Mind, or for that matter even sounded like Prince at all.

i heard jump way before i bought dirty mind, as soon as i heard it I knew who copied who, just use your ears. Just like phil collins/sussudio, he didn't have to admit copying the man, it was obvious, and he did admit it.

drfunkentstein said:

We know they were both on the same Label in the 80s and both of their minds I think worked very similarly (P in regard to music in general, and EVH more specifically tailored to guitar) Both of them sought to expand the pallette and create new avenues of sound. Just wondering if they ever met or jammed and if there is any footage of that? (omg that would be to epic)

yes they did prince invited eddie to paisley park to jam

Steve Vai, not Eddie, jammed at Paisley Park and of course not with P, it was Michael B. and a couple of others. P prefers jamming with Maroon 5 and The Bangles and never once sat in with high-calibre players, only those within his little sphere.

and sorry, but precisely how would P even begin to keep up? This has been discussed before and it's crazy talk, the levels between their skills is immense and Eddie would have to play far slower and less complex than he's used to.

I imagine Eddie expanding upon any P song like Mozart did in that scene in the movie using Salierei's simple composition whereby Mozart added to it on the fly making it more complex and sophisticated and ultimately far superior to what it was.

Prince was a good pop/r and b player, but Eddie is recognized as the greatest of all time by anybody who can speak -- it's Hendrix (solely for his innovation) then EVH, both changed the way a guitar is even played. He influenced literally any player in any signed band that came after 1978, that is fact. Prince influenced no one with his playing, name one that's good, or even famous. Even his sycophant Lenny Kravitz doesn't call him an influence on his shitty abilities.

And this is nothng against P, it's just his fans think he's some god of guitar and I just don't see or hear it. His stuff is insanely simple and basic and I have heard everything, from the bootlegs to live shows and it's good, but nothing more. It could be learned in minutes, that doesn't mean it doesn't sound good, but it's just not difficult and any guitarist, myself included, wishes to get better on every level all the time.

And cue the Steve Vai quote where he's being overly generous about P's ability, which I've never seen documented, I believe it's fabricated. But if that's the case how do you explain this quote by Vai on EVH?:

Speaking exclusively about his deep appreciation of Edward Van Halen in the new issue of Rock Candy magazine, Vai told editor Howard Johnson, “There are so many guitar heroes I love, and maybe even prefer over Edward in a sense. But the two guitar players who really created a paradigm shift in my opinion were Jimi Hendrix and Edward Van Halen. Everybody else has contributed wonderfully to the art form. But when you look at scope of their individual contributions and how they became pivotal turning points for guitar playing, those two guys were the most effective.”

or this one...

“Playing Van Halen songs is such a hoot,” he told Rock Candy. “Especially when you’ve got David Lee Roth singing them! ‘Panama’ is just great. ‘Unchained’ and ‘Ain’t Talkin’ ‘Bout Love’ too. We’d play a whole lot of Van Halen tunes and they were always wonderful. The parts were constructed perfectly, because Edward has real completeness as a guitar player.”

i don't know much about guitar playing but he made all the stars on the r and r show look like clowns. I know they all hated him in that moment.

and yingie mamsteen is better than both put together. and i'm listening to eruption live right now, it's fast as fuck but it sounds like pussy shit to me. He should have played for the backstreet boys.

[Edited 2/16/19 13:50pm]

Musician9 said:

Steve Vai, not Eddie, jammed at Paisley Park and of course not with P, it was Michael B. and a couple of others. P prefers jamming with Maroon 5 and The Bangles and never once sat in with high-calibre players, only those within his little sphere.

and sorry, but precisely how would P even begin to keep up? This has been discussed before and it's crazy talk, the levels between their skills is immense and Eddie would have to play far slower and less complex than he's used to.(...)

.

I LOVE Eddie and he and Hendrix were the most influential EVER, but honestly, I dont see no point in trying to compare Eddie with Prince. Both geniuses, for different reasons.

.

And I agree that Prince avoided jamming with top musicians. He preferred people he could teach and influence.

.
And I strongly disagree about the ´slower and less complex´. Ok, Eddie could play faster than Prince, but his phrasing wasnt THAT sophisticated. Mostly pentatonic stuff with some tapping. Prince was more versatile. He could play funky stuff, bluesy and even some jazzy stuff (ok, not pure jazz). And on several instruments.

.

It´s interesting that they never seemed to meet, given the fact that they made huge success in the same era, and were in the same record label.

[Edited 2/16/19 19:03pm]

Musician9 said:

Steve Vai, not Eddie, jammed at Paisley Park and of course not with P, it was Michael B. and a couple of others. P prefers jamming with Maroon 5 and The Bangles and never once sat in with high-calibre players, only those within his little sphere.

and sorry, but precisely how would P even begin to keep up? This has been discussed before and it's crazy talk, the levels between their skills is immense and Eddie would have to play far slower and less complex than he's used to.

I imagine Eddie expanding upon any P song like Mozart did in that scene in the movie using Salierei's simple composition whereby Mozart added to it on the fly making it more complex and sophisticated and ultimately far superior to what it was.

Prince was a good pop/r and b player, but Eddie is recognized as the greatest of all time by anybody who can speak -- it's Hendrix (solely for his innovation) then EVH, both changed the way a guitar is even played. He influenced literally any player in any signed band that came after 1978, that is fact. Prince influenced no one with his playing, name one that's good, or even famous. Even his sycophant Lenny Kravitz doesn't call him an influence on his shitty abilities.

And this is nothng against P, it's just his fans think he's some god of guitar and I just don't see or hear it. His stuff is insanely simple and basic and I have heard everything, from the bootlegs to live shows and it's good, but nothing more. It could be learned in minutes, that doesn't mean it doesn't sound good, but it's just not difficult and any guitarist, myself included, wishes to get better on every level all the time.

And cue the Steve Vai quote where he's being overly generous about P's ability, which I've never seen documented, I believe it's fabricated. But if that's the case how do you explain this quote by Vai on EVH?:

Speaking exclusively about his deep appreciation of Edward Van Halen in the new issue of Rock Candy magazine, Vai told editor Howard Johnson, “There are so many guitar heroes I love, and maybe even prefer over Edward in a sense. But the two guitar players who really created a paradigm shift in my opinion were Jimi Hendrix and Edward Van Halen. Everybody else has contributed wonderfully to the art form. But when you look at scope of their individual contributions and how they became pivotal turning points for guitar playing, those two guys were the most effective.”

or this one...

“Playing Van Halen songs is such a hoot,” he told Rock Candy. “Especially when you’ve got David Lee Roth singing them! ‘Panama’ is just great. ‘Unchained’ and ‘Ain’t Talkin’ ‘Bout Love’ too. We’d play a whole lot of Van Halen tunes and they were always wonderful. The parts were constructed perfectly, because Edward has real completeness as a guitar player.”

..and STILL copped the Dirty Moind melody

all that other shit written...why? nobody said Prince was better, worse, or even with Van Halen.

Musician9 said:

P prefers jamming with Maroon 5 and The Bangles and never once sat in with high-calibre players,

frog shit