GustavoRibas said:

Musician9 said:

Steve Vai, not Eddie, jammed at Paisley Park and of course not with P, it was Michael B. and a couple of others. P prefers jamming with Maroon 5 and The Bangles and never once sat in with high-calibre players, only those within his little sphere.

and sorry, but precisely how would P even begin to keep up? This has been discussed before and it's crazy talk, the levels between their skills is immense and Eddie would have to play far slower and less complex than he's used to.(...)

.

I LOVE Eddie and he and Hendrix were the most influential EVER, but honestly, I dont see no point in trying to compare Eddie with Prince. Both geniuses, for different reasons.

.

And I agree that Prince avoided jamming with top musicians. He preferred people he could teach and influence.

.
And I strongly disagree about the ´slower and less complex´. Ok, Eddie could play faster than Prince, but his phrasing wasnt THAT sophisticated. Mostly pentatonic stuff with some tapping. Prince was more versatile. He could play funky stuff, bluesy and even some jazzy stuff (ok, not pure jazz). And on several instruments.

.

It´s interesting that they never seemed to meet, given the fact that they made huge success in the same era, and were in the same record label.

[Edited 2/16/19 19:03pm]

Prince was an awesome guitar player and especially considering all the other stuff he did ... multi instrumentals, performance /dance, producer, singer etc etc, but EVH imo definitly a better and more innovative guitarist for sure, def more innovative in the context of developing how the electric guitar can be played and used in songs. But having said that EVH , didnt do all the other stuff Pince did , so this really isnt like comparing just 2 guys that were simply guitarists. Prince was really good guitar player, but its true I think sometimes he gets hailed as more of a Guitar G, than he really was in comparison to some other players , but its amazing how good he was considering all other stuff he did and was also really good at.

PeteSilas said:

rdhull said:

Is it the Pat Smear incident?

now now, we don't need to be bringing gynecological terms into it.

Musician9 said:

Eddie was indeed drunk and all he said to Cobain was "could I borrow the Mexican's guitar", nothing more.

As for P, he preferred to jam with inferior souls like Maroon 5, that travesty of a band. He never entered a situation out of his league, too bad, he could've learned and alot.

This goes back to Michael Jackson upstaging him at the James Brown concert, completely embarrassed himself. Like Quincy said, Prince had 6 years of experience versus Michael's 25 or so. He neither danced nor played the guitar, just looked out of place and unable to improvise. From that moment on he never shared the stage unless it was a controolled environment or uber-rehearsed. Other so-called lesser talents do it off the cuff all the time, jam with their heroes without missing a note, although he did once jam with a no name band in an LA hotel lobby.

fun fact: Eddie laid down the Beat It solo in 20 minutes, got paid with a 6 pack, turned down credit, and lost millions in royalties or at least getting paid for the session. Then Thriller prevents 1984 from going number 1 on the album charts.

...all he said to Cobain was "could I borrow the Mexican's guitar", nothing more. Oh yeah that's totally ok, just needed that guitar real bad huh?

I guess Miles Davis and Stevie Wonder don't count. Or Tom Petty, Steve Winwood and Jeff Lynne either.

[Edited 2/19/19 8:58am]

Well, let's face it, Miles Davis - he's no Eddie Van Halen

RichardS said:

Well, let's face it, Miles Davis - he's no Eddie Van Halen

one thing that's ironic and not true was that both claimed that Jimi wasn't an influence at some point. big head motherfucers.

poppys said:

Musician9 said:

Eddie was indeed drunk and all he said to Cobain was "could I borrow the Mexican's guitar", nothing more.

As for P, he preferred to jam with inferior souls like Maroon 5, that travesty of a band. He never entered a situation out of his league, too bad, he could've learned and alot.

This goes back to Michael Jackson upstaging him at the James Brown concert, completely embarrassed himself. Like Quincy said, Prince had 6 years of experience versus Michael's 25 or so. He neither danced nor played the guitar, just looked out of place and unable to improvise. From that moment on he never shared the stage unless it was a controolled environment or uber-rehearsed. Other so-called lesser talents do it off the cuff all the time, jam with their heroes without missing a note, although he did once jam with a no name band in an LA hotel lobby.

fun fact: Eddie laid down the Beat It solo in 20 minutes, got paid with a 6 pack, turned down credit, and lost millions in royalties or at least getting paid for the session. Then Thriller prevents 1984 from going number 1 on the album charts.

...all he said to Cobain was "could I borrow the Mexican's guitar", nothing more. Oh yeah that's totally ok, just needed that guitar real bad huh?

I guess Miles Davis and Stevie Wonder don't count. Or Tom Petty, Steve Winwood and Jeff Lynne either.

[Edited 2/19/19 8:58am]

Carlos Santana, Larry Graham, Sheryl Crow, Dave Grohl also top notch musicians. Throw in Lenny Kravitz too

milesb said:

poppys said:

...all he said to Cobain was "could I borrow the Mexican's guitar", nothing more. Oh yeah that's totally ok, just needed that guitar real bad huh?

I guess Miles Davis and Stevie Wonder don't count. Or Tom Petty, Steve Winwood and Jeff Lynne either.

[Edited 2/19/19 8:58am]

Carlos Santana, Larry Graham, Sheryl Crow, Dave Grohl also top notch musicians. Throw in Lenny Kravitz too

Nope. I'll give you Dave Grohl and Larry Graham. Carlos Santana hasn't improved since his first record. Santana as a band brought a latin/rock fusion to prominence, but as a player Carlos has not kept up. Not at all. Sheryl Crow is not a top-notch musician. She can sing and strum some chords. She can play the rudimentary basslines her music requires. Lenny Kravitz is silly. He's not a bad musician, but calling him top-notch is a BIG stretch.

joyinrepetition said:

EVH was a great player in his younger days and that's what his legend is living off now. I saw a recent video of EVH and he sounded like pure horse shit! Prince actually got better as he got older because he made a conscious effort to do so whereas EVH seemed to be content and stopped working to get better. I'm sure many guitar enthusiast will agree with that. As for Vai, the dude is a pure freak! Vai is always experimenting and trying new things to stay at the top. They were/are all great for the style of music they play. BTW Vai loved Prince. [Edited 2/19/19 5:50am]

Prince did nothing but decline as a lead guitarist from the early 90s on. He did a lot, so it's not a diss, but it is a fact. He DID, however, improve as a rhythm guitarist. As a bassist he constantly improved, too. Lead guitar and drums were not his thing later on. EVH does suck now. Totally agree on that.

milesb said:

poppys said:

...all he said to Cobain was "could I borrow the Mexican's guitar", nothing more. Oh yeah that's totally ok, just needed that guitar real bad huh?

I guess Miles Davis and Stevie Wonder don't count. Or Tom Petty, Steve Winwood and Jeff Lynne either.

[Edited 2/19/19 8:58am]

Carlos Santana, Larry Graham, Sheryl Crow, Dave Grohl also top notch musicians. Throw in Lenny Kravitz too

prince jammed with a lot og high calibre musicians.Denis Chambers was at Paisley jamming with Prince

steakfinger said:

joyinrepetition said:

EVH was a great player in his younger days and that's what his legend is living off now. I saw a recent video of EVH and he sounded like pure horse shit! Prince actually got better as he got older because he made a conscious effort to do so whereas EVH seemed to be content and stopped working to get better. I'm sure many guitar enthusiast will agree with that. As for Vai, the dude is a pure freak! Vai is always experimenting and trying new things to stay at the top. They were/are all great for the style of music they play. BTW Vai loved Prince. [Edited 2/19/19 5:50am]

Prince did nothing but decline as a lead guitarist from the early 90s on. He did a lot, so it's not a diss, but it is a fact. He DID, however, improve as a rhythm guitarist. As a bassist he constantly improved, too. Lead guitar and drums were not his thing later on. EVH does suck now. Totally agree on that.

funny, i always thought he got better, i admittedly don't know much about guitar playing but those who do have said he used a lot of whammy shit in the 90's and got better later. as with anything prince related, opinions are like assholes.

steakfinger said:

milesb said:

Carlos Santana, Larry Graham, Sheryl Crow, Dave Grohl also top notch musicians. Throw in Lenny Kravitz too

Nope. I'll give you Dave Grohl and Larry Graham. Carlos Santana hasn't improved since his first record. Santana as a band brought a latin/rock fusion to prominence, but as a player Carlos has not kept up. Not at all. Sheryl Crow is not a top-notch musician. She can sing and strum some chords. She can play the rudimentary basslines her music requires. Lenny Kravitz is silly. He's not a bad musician, but calling him top-notch is a BIG stretch.

ya, i thought mentioning lenny was a joke, nothing impressive about the guy. Hell, even TTD who wasn't really a great instrumentalist was at least in the neighborhood as an artist and Prince played with him.

PeteSilas said:

steakfinger said:

Nope. I'll give you Dave Grohl and Larry Graham. Carlos Santana hasn't improved since his first record. Santana as a band brought a latin/rock fusion to prominence, but as a player Carlos has not kept up. Not at all. Sheryl Crow is not a top-notch musician. She can sing and strum some chords. She can play the rudimentary basslines her music requires. Lenny Kravitz is silly. He's not a bad musician, but calling him top-notch is a BIG stretch.

ya, i thought mentioning lenny was a joke, nothing impressive about the guy. Hell, even TTD who wasn't really a great instrumentalist was at least in the neighborhood as an artist and Prince played with him.

No worries. I still stand by it though. Both Sheryl and Lenny are multi-instrumentalist song writers. We're not just talking bass and guitar either. I think Prince recognised how talented they are, and that's why he reached out to them. Their work will stand the test of time imo.

Wow thanks a ton for the insight guys Learned a lot (like Vai was at Paisley Park?) The part about Prince only jamming with lower tier than himself musicians, is something I have noticed his whole career (not the miles sessionsc obviously) but the musicians he picked to play with him (with the exception of Michael Bland) were never really up there in the stratosphere the way a say, vinnie coliuta or a Frank Gambale. Also in regards to EVH racism thing, both Him and Alex are half Chinese-Malaysian so they're familiarity with bigotry growing up in CA is well known. As far as the Pat Smear mexican comment the only source for that was Kurt cobain himself talking to an MTV reporter. No one else witnessed it. I see no reason why Kurt would lie, however his dislike for an kind of Macho 80s rock aesthetic was well known and he dragged Van Halen concerts as being dumb in several other interviews. Also EVH did a song with LL Cool J a few years back. Was fucked on drugs for awhile but apprently is relatively chilled out now. Huge head though.

drfunkentstein said:

Wow thanks a ton for the insight guys Learned a lot (like Vai was at Paisley Park?) The part about Prince only jamming with lower tier than himself musicians, is something I have noticed his whole career (not the miles sessionsc obviously) but the musicians he picked to play with him (with the exception of Michael Bland) were never really up there in the stratosphere the way a say, vinnie coliuta or a Frank Gambale.

Also in regards to EVH racism thing, both Him and Alex are half Chinese-Malaysian so they're familiarity with bigotry growing up in CA is well known. As far as the Pat Smear mexican comment the only source for that was Kurt cobain himself talking to an MTV reporter. No one else witnessed it. I see no reason why Kurt would lie, however his dislike for an kind of Macho 80s rock aesthetic was well known and he dragged Van Halen concerts as being dumb in several other interviews. Also EVH did a song with LL Cool J a few years back. Was fucked on drugs for awhile but apprently is relatively chilled out now. Huge head though.

So Miles Davis is the only person mentioned you think is better than Eddie Van Halen? SMDH. Ridiculous.

Parsing what is ok and not ok about racist comments, REALLY? It's all wrong no matter who is saying it.

Your question was asked and answered. Isn't there an EVH website you can stan on?

ya, he was dutch malaysian or somesuch thing which doesn't preclude him from hating black people or mexicans if that's what he did. I remember a teacher of mine telling me about how the hawaiians hate black people, made no sense to me whatsoever but he was there to see it and i wasn't. Prince had fine musicians work for him, probably better than him, didn't the solo on Three chains o' gold come from Levi? Dr. Fink was better on keys in terms of his soloeing and runs, maybe not harmonically or anything directly song related, on drums sheila was better, michael bland was better etc.., etc..,

poppys said:

drfunkentstein said:

Wow thanks a ton for the insight guys Learned a lot (like Vai was at Paisley Park?) The part about Prince only jamming with lower tier than himself musicians, is something I have noticed his whole career (not the miles sessionsc obviously) but the musicians he picked to play with him (with the exception of Michael Bland) were never really up there in the stratosphere the way a say, vinnie coliuta or a Frank Gambale.

Also in regards to EVH racism thing, both Him and Alex are half Chinese-Malaysian so they're familiarity with bigotry growing up in CA is well known. As far as the Pat Smear mexican comment the only source for that was Kurt cobain himself talking to an MTV reporter. No one else witnessed it. I see no reason why Kurt would lie, however his dislike for an kind of Macho 80s rock aesthetic was well known and he dragged Van Halen concerts as being dumb in several other interviews. Also EVH did a song with LL Cool J a few years back. Was fucked on drugs for awhile but apprently is relatively chilled out now. Huge head though.

So Miles Davis is the only person mentioned you think is better than Eddie Van Halen? SMDH. Ridiculous.

Parsing what is ok and not ok about racist comments, REALLY? It's all wrong no matter who is saying it.

Your question was asked and answered. Isn't there an EVH website you can stan on?

this thread went south quickly......Clapton said Prince was the best guitar player...but i think he meant as far as all the different sounds

The EVH Pat Smear incident regarding tossing around the word 'Mexican' wasnt the incident *I* meant. At the same event I believe, he was questioning Pat's ethnicity to his face in a callous ingorant racist manner from what was reported.

rdhull said:

The EVH Pat Smear incident regarding tossing around the word 'Mexican' wasnt the incident *I* meant. At the same event I believe, he was questioning Pat's ethnicity to his face in a callous ingorant racist manner from what was reported.

if we're going to hold stuff against drunks, then we have to get clapton and elvis costello too, both said stupid shit when they were drunk. How much responsibility do we give a drunk? I don't know, I know this though, the people that do get drunk often regret the things they did afterwards so that should tell us something.

cobain? fuck him, he started shit with all the previous bands just because he thought he was cooler.

http://home.earthlink.net...cle08.html
.
Jennifer: I heard he was asking Kurt to let him come on stage and play "Eruption," but Kurt said, "no," and Eddie said, "C'mon, let me play the Mexican's guitar," referring to you.
.
Pat: I told Krist [Novoselic], I thought we should let him play with us. But he said no because we'd never get him off the stage. When I walked up to Eddie, he was talking to Krist. I just saw the back of his head so I didn't know who he was. And Krist goes, "Oh Eddie, you haven't met Pat. He's our new guitar player." Eddie turns around and sees me, but he
doesn't say hello or anything. He just say's, "Oh no, not a dark one."
At first I thought he was kidding. But he kept asking me, "What are you? Are you like a Raji or something? Are you Mexican?" Then he kept saying
to Kurt," C'mon let me play the Mexican's guitar." I was horrified!
.
Jeff: Is he the El Duce of Metal?
.
Pat: [Laughs] Eddie Van Halen is the perfect example for me of not wanting to meet your heroes 'cause you'll be disappointed. I hear he's
sober now. I blame that incident totally on the alcohol. I've done a lot of bad things when I was drunk, too.
.
Jeff: I don't think you're coming from a judgmental place at all.
.
Pat: I was just shocked. I was thinking, "God, Eddie Van Halen hates me.

[Edited 2/21/19 15:10pm]

PeteSilas said:

rdhull said:

The EVH Pat Smear incident regarding tossing around the word 'Mexican' wasnt the incident *I* meant. At the same event I believe, he was questioning Pat's ethnicity to his face in a callous ingorant racist manner from what was reported.

if we're going to hold stuff against drunks, then we have to get clapton and elvis costello too, both said stupid shit when they were drunk. How much responsibility do we give a drunk? I don't know, I know this though, the people that do get drunk often regret the things they did afterwards so that should tell us something.

cobain? fuck him, he started shit with all the previous bands just because he thought he was cooler.

In this thread *I'm* talking about EVH. Costello calling Ray a blind nword and Clapton with his racist tone regrdig immigration in England can be disucssed further elsewhere but nobpdy has excused any of it from what Ive ever heard of. And Im not holdong ANYTHING against anybody here, someone mentioned racial things regarding EVH and I mentioned the time it happened

WhisperingDandelions said:

http://home.earthlink.net...cle08.html
.
Jennifer: I heard he was asking Kurt to let him come on stage and play "Eruption," but Kurt said, "no," and Eddie said, "C'mon, let me play the Mexican's guitar," referring to you.
.
Pat: I told Krist [Novoselic], I thought we should let him play with us. But he said no because we'd never get him off the stage. When I walked up to Eddie, he was talking to Krist. I just saw the back of his head so I didn't know who he was. And Krist goes, "Oh Eddie, you haven't met Pat. He's our new guitar player." Eddie turns around and sees me, but he
doesn't say hello or anything. He just say's, "Oh no, not a dark one."
At first I thought he was kidding. But he kept asking me, "What are you? Are you like a Raji or something? Are you Mexican?" Then he kept saying
to Kurt," C'mon let me play the Mexican's guitar." I was horrified!
.
Jeff: Is he the El Duce of Metal?
.
Pat: [Laughs] Eddie Van Halen is the perfect example for me of not wanting to meet your heroes 'cause you'll be disappointed. I hear he's
sober now. I blame that incident totally on the alcohol. I've done a lot of bad things when I was drunk, too.
.
Jeff: I don't think you're coming from a judgmental place at all.
.
Pat: I was just shocked. I was thinking, "God, Eddie Van Halen hates me.

[Edited 2/21/19 15:10pm]

Ya, thats the incident. I guess the Mexican statement ws also part of it, my bad.

PeteSilas said:

rdhull said:

The EVH Pat Smear incident regarding tossing around the word 'Mexican' wasnt the incident *I* meant. At the same event I believe, he was questioning Pat's ethnicity to his face in a callous ingorant racist manner from what was reported.

if we're going to hold stuff against drunks, then we have to get clapton and elvis costello too, both said stupid shit when they were drunk. How much responsibility do we give a drunk?

I mean, uh, unless they were physically forced to drink by some outside force shouldn't we place *all* responsibility on the drunk? Or is alcohol simply the universal cop-out? I order a round and all responsibility is eroded?

WhisperingDandelions said:

PeteSilas said:

if we're going to hold stuff against drunks, then we have to get clapton and elvis costello too, both said stupid shit when they were drunk. How much responsibility do we give a drunk?

I mean, uh, unless they were physically forced to drink by some outside force shouldn't we place *all* responsibility on the drunk? Or is alcohol simply the universal cop-out? I order a round and all responsibility is eroded?

that's your take and a respectable one, i was just asking the question, but i will say this to indicate my opinion, i hate alcohol, fucking hate it, nothing more damaging in my opinion.

The ONLY time Prince and EVH have been associated was in '84 when people were going around saying that it was EVH playing the guitar solos in Let Go Crazy.

Well that escalated quickly 😂😂😂😂 I am in no way excusing EVH's racist language towards Pat Smear. I will say the man was screwed up for years and years on drugs/alcohol and was quite abrasive to everyone around him at that point (anti-semitic and homophobic jokes were directed at David Lee roth around 93, same time as Pat Smear incident) I think Prince and Eddie could have really made some incredibly forward thinking music together if you consider P's futuristic vision of sound up until around 95 ish and Eddie futuristic concept of guitar at the time. They were on Warner Bros. all throughout the 80s shame it didn't happen. Though, knowing the VH brothers supposed Homophobia towards Dave, P's percevied effeminity might've been a stumbling block.

callimnate said:

The ONLY time Prince and EVH have been associated was in '84 when people were going around saying that it was EVH playing the guitar solos in Let Go Crazy.

did prince ever play the solo live as good as it was on record? I've never heard it. Prince was amazing even in the 80's people were saying he was one of the worlds great guitarists but really, does it even matter how fast you can play and how many tricks you can pull off? I think it's more impressive that he had a body of work that spanned thousands of tunes, i read in sammy hagars book that eddie was struggling to finish one song for months because he was so fucked up.