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Thread started 10/16/18 6:36pm

Mikado

Best of Musicology & 3121?

I remember thinking after 3121 came out that if you combined the best of it (Lolita, Fury, Black Sweat, etc.) with the best of Musicology (Cinnamon Girl, If Eye Was the Man in Ur Life, The Marry King, etc.) you would have one great album.

If you had the ability to combine the best of both (say, 10-12 songs) what songs would you chose?

A certain kind of mellow.
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Reply #1 posted 10/16/18 8:24pm

TrivialPursuit

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I always said that Musicology, 3121, & Planet Earth shaken down into one CD would make one of the best Prince albums in however long.

This experience will cover courtship, sex, commitment, fetishes, loneliness, vindication, love, and hate.
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Reply #2 posted 10/17/18 10:28am

damosuzuki

i actually listened to both albums for the first time in a good while this morning.

musicology has never thrilled me that much. it's always seemed very staid & tamped down & conventional. it's fine, perfectly listenable, but there's very little on it that excites me, and if i hadn't felt the need to give it one more listen for the prince album poll i'm participating in, i really wouldn't have given it a listen.

3121 on the other hand, is an absolute cracker of an album to my ears. he sounds inspired & committed & excited. except for fury (so bland compared to that snl version, of course) & two tracks near the end that fell off a bit for me (b, l & b & the dance) i think it's just about a perfect latterday prince record.

the only thing i would bring in from musicology is reflection, which to me is the only really distinctive song on that album, & would probably still work as a pleasant final track.

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Reply #3 posted 10/17/18 10:47am

TrivialPursuit

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damosuzuki said:


Musicology has never thrilled me that much. It always seemed very staid & tamped down & conventional. It's fine, perfectly listenable, but there's very little on it that excites me.

3121 on the other hand, is an absolute cracker of an album to my ears. He sounds inspired & committed & excited. ...two tracks near the end that fell off a bit for me ("Beautiful, Loved & Blessed" & "The Dance") .

The only thing i would bring in from Musicology is "Reflection", which to me is the only really distinctive song on that album, & would probably still work as a pleasant final track.


This all sums up how I feel about both albums. I always seemed to be in the minority with not being overly thrilled with Musicology. 3121 and even Planet Earth had bangers on it. PE had a story to tell, but 3121 does feel fun and inspired. I agree about "the Dance" but it is a better version than the NPGMC version. It feels like it belongs on Planet Earth, which had moodier tracks.

As a footnote with "Fury": Part of Prince's problem during this time (from 2004-2010) was his overt need to flatten the production. There's little reverb, everything sounds flat and average; some have called it acrylic which I fully endorsed. "Fury" is a good example of how an otherwise great song was hampered by the production. The reason albums like Diamonds and Pearls and prince have so much appeal is that they were band recordings for the most part. There was a band feel to them. And while I'm not sure how much of the band played on any 3 of these records or not, the final mix is what kind of spoils the fun of songs like "Fury". Put a rocker like "Fury" against an equally rousing bop like "Endorphinmachine" and the production alone is glaring. Songs like "Fury" almost demand a live setting for the recording. But - I don't totally hate the album version. I do feel like I'm missing out on something better having seen live performances on SNL and the Brits.

This experience will cover courtship, sex, commitment, fetishes, loneliness, vindication, love, and hate.
http://bit.ly/1D3FG2U
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Reply #4 posted 10/17/18 11:07am

DarkKnight1

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with the exception of life o the party, I dont think are many, if any, throw away tracks on those albums. Im fine with all 3 as is. Especially 3121. Love that album.

(Insert something clever here)
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Reply #5 posted 10/17/18 11:08am

mtlfan

I have all three and never reach for them. In fact, I haven't played Planet Earth through twice. Maybe this is my loss. I liked the other two well enough. IMO 3121 is the best, and I think he found some new territory. A single disc, maybe even a double album compiling all of them would be a compulsively listenable if not exactly groundbreaking collection of bangers and ballads. Just leave off "Life o' the Party."

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Reply #6 posted 10/17/18 11:18am

mtlfan

And kick it off with F.U.N.K.

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Reply #7 posted 10/17/18 11:32am

Genesia

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DarkKnight1 said:

with the exception of life o the party, I dont think are many, if any, throw away tracks on those albums. Im fine with all 3 as is. Especially 3121. Love that album.


I agree. No way in hell I'd bust those albums up and combine to "make a better one." (As if.) 3121 is beautifully cohesive.

Once upon a time, children, there was a thing known as a "concept album" - and 3121 is a prime example. More than a collection of random tracks, a concept album had songs organized around a central theme. In the case of 3121, it was the idea of a house party - a Prince house party, specifically – and the fun and personalities and undercurrents you'll find there.

I don't know how Planet Urf got into this discussion, but it isn't one of my favorites, so I'm just going to stick with the original point of the thread.

(I love that Prince was still thinking in terms of albums in 2006. And even eight years later, with Art Official Age.)

We don’t mourn artists because we knew them. We mourn them because they helped us know ourselves.
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Reply #8 posted 10/17/18 1:20pm

luvsexy4all

add musicology and 3121 to make a great album..planet earth should remain as is

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Reply #9 posted 10/17/18 2:32pm

Moonbeam

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damosuzuki said:

i actually listened to both albums for the first time in a good while this morning.

musicology has never thrilled me that much. it's always seemed very staid & tamped down & conventional. it's fine, perfectly listenable, but there's very little on it that excites me, and if i hadn't felt the need to give it one more listen for the prince album poll i'm participating in, i really wouldn't have given it a listen.

3121 on the other hand, is an absolute cracker of an album to my ears. he sounds inspired & committed & excited. except for fury (so bland compared to that snl version, of course) & two tracks near the end that fell off a bit for me (b, l & b & the dance) i think it's just about a perfect latterday prince record.

the only thing i would bring in from musicology is reflection, which to me is the only really distinctive song on that album, & would probably still work as a pleasant final track.


I agree with your overall assessment. Someone said it here once that Musicology feels like it was conceived in a boardroom. It is perfectly listenable, but not that exciting. I do love the title track and a few others, but if I'm going for a latter-day Prince album that is an attempt to court the mainstream, I'll go for Rave Un2 the Joy Fantastic before I'll go for Musicology.

3121 is indeed an absolute delight. I do love "Fury" despite it not living up to that fiery SNL performance. For me, it's the best Prince album released after The Gold Experience.

Feel free to join in the Prince Album Poll 2018! Let'a celebrate his legacy by counting down the most beloved Prince albums, as decided by you!
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Reply #10 posted 10/17/18 2:33pm

Moonbeam

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damosuzuki said:

for the prince album poll i'm participating in


Thanks for the plug of the poll! Anyone interested here can join the fun if you want. My signature has details of how to participate.

Feel free to join in the Prince Album Poll 2018! Let'a celebrate his legacy by counting down the most beloved Prince albums, as decided by you!
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Reply #11 posted 10/17/18 4:20pm

damosuzuki

Moonbeam said:

damosuzuki said:

for the prince album poll i'm participating in


Thanks for the plug of the poll! Anyone interested here can join the fun if you want. My signature has details of how to participate.

i'm budgeting my time for the next two weeks to cram in as many associated artist albums as i can.

though i don't know if i have it in me to actually listen to bria's album - still unplayed almost 10 years after i bought it!

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Reply #12 posted 10/17/18 7:32pm

Moonbeam

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damosuzuki said:

Moonbeam said:


Thanks for the plug of the poll! Anyone interested here can join the fun if you want. My signature has details of how to participate.

i'm budgeting my time for the next two weeks to cram in as many associated artist albums as i can.

though i don't know if i have it in me to actually listen to bria's album - still unplayed almost 10 years after i bought it!

I listened to it for the first time ever a few weeks ago. I imagine it will be another 9+ years before I play it again...

Feel free to join in the Prince Album Poll 2018! Let'a celebrate his legacy by counting down the most beloved Prince albums, as decided by you!
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Reply #13 posted 10/18/18 8:06am

Wlcm2thdwn3

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cool

How long do u wanna be loved? Is forever enough, is forever enough?
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Reply #14 posted 10/18/18 7:14pm

thedoorkeeper

From Musicology:
Musicology
On The Couch
Dear Mister Man
Call My Name
The Marrying Kind
If Eye Was The Man In It Life
What Do U Want Me 2 Do

From 3121:
3121
Te Amo Corazan
The Dance
Love
The Word
Black Sweat
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Reply #15 posted 10/18/18 9:26pm

RODSERLING

Mikado said:

I remember thinking after 3121 came out that if you combined the best of it (Lolita, Fury, Black Sweat, etc.) with the best of Musicology (Cinnamon Girl, If Eye Was the Man in Ur Life, The Marry King, etc.) you would have one great album.



If you had the ability to combine the best of both (say, 10-12 songs) what songs would you chose?



What IS thé point of it, since 3121 and Musicology are both very good albums ?
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Reply #16 posted 10/20/18 9:27am

ufoclub

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TrivialPursuit said:

I always said that Musicology, 3121, & Planet Earth shaken down into one CD would make one of the best Prince albums in however long.



don’t forget that some of “20ten” also fits into this era. There is some great stuff on all those albums. As people in the music biz say... and there is filler padding out the killer.

But fans will always disagree on what is cool and what is not.
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Reply #17 posted 10/20/18 10:30am

luvsexy4all

filter out all the crap from 2010-2016 and he's just as good as he's ever been...and u would still have enough albums for one a year

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Reply #18 posted 10/21/18 7:45am

bonatoc

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About SNL's Fury: there is an over, overcompressed version out there, and it's just what the performance needs. The official SNL video pales in comparison. This übercompressed version can be found on the "Road to 3121" bootleg, and I think one of the video platforms has it.

The Colors R brighter, the Bond is much tighter
No Child's a failure
Until the Blue Sailboat sails him away from his dreams
Don't Ever Lose, Don't Ever Lose
Don't Ever Lose Your Dreams
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Reply #19 posted 10/21/18 9:56am

violetcrush

TrivialPursuit said:

damosuzuki said:


Musicology has never thrilled me that much. It always seemed very staid & tamped down & conventional. It's fine, perfectly listenable, but there's very little on it that excites me.

3121 on the other hand, is an absolute cracker of an album to my ears. He sounds inspired & committed & excited. ...two tracks near the end that fell off a bit for me ("Beautiful, Loved & Blessed" & "The Dance") .

The only thing i would bring in from Musicology is "Reflection", which to me is the only really distinctive song on that album, & would probably still work as a pleasant final track.


This all sums up how I feel about both albums. I always seemed to be in the minority with not being overly thrilled with Musicology. 3121 and even Planet Earth had bangers on it. PE had a story to tell, but 3121 does feel fun and inspired. I agree about "the Dance" but it is a better version than the NPGMC version. It feels like it belongs on Planet Earth, which had moodier tracks.

As a footnote with "Fury": Part of Prince's problem during this time (from 2004-2010) was his overt need to flatten the production. There's little reverb, everything sounds flat and average; some have called it acrylic which I fully endorsed. "Fury" is a good example of how an otherwise great song was hampered by the production. The reason albums like Diamonds and Pearls and prince have so much appeal is that they were band recordings for the most part. There was a band feel to them. And while I'm not sure how much of the band played on any 3 of these records or not, the final mix is what kind of spoils the fun of songs like "Fury". Put a rocker like "Fury" against an equally rousing bop like "Endorphinmachine" and the production alone is glaring. Songs like "Fury" almost demand a live setting for the recording. But - I don't totally hate the album version. I do feel like I'm missing out on something better having seen live performances on SNL and the Brits.

I imagine that Fury, if recorded live with the original NPG (Sonny, Michael and Tommy), would be quite the rocking song. Definitely much better versions on SNL and the Brit awards.

*

Seems that Prince was going for radio play during this period, so may be the reason for the "flattened" production? I just watched his interview with Matt Lauer to promote the release of Muiscology, he stated it is a "pop record", made for fans who might not be into the NPGMC music.

*

He also met with the two guys from the indie radio station in LA to talk to them about getting radio play, and gave them the PE album to play on their station.

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Reply #20 posted 10/21/18 10:02am

violetcrush

bonatoc said:

About SNL's Fury: there is an over, overcompressed version out there, and it's just what the performance needs. The official SNL video pales in comparison. This übercompressed version can be found on the "Road to 3121" bootleg, and I think one of the video platforms has it.

Is the better sounding version anywhere on YT??

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Reply #21 posted 10/21/18 10:54am

violetcrush

My pics for Best Of:


Musicology:

*

A Million Days (intrigued that it was recorded in 1995 and the music expresses his feelings of loss and regret. Love it.)

What Do You Want Me To Do

On The Couch

Reflection (prefer Prince and Wendy's live version on Tavis Smiley though)

*

3121:

*

Te Amo Corazon

Black Sweat

Fury (live versions)

The Dance

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Reply #22 posted 10/21/18 11:12am

databank

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Genesia said:

DarkKnight1 said:

with the exception of life o the party, I dont think are many, if any, throw away tracks on those albums. Im fine with all 3 as is. Especially 3121. Love that album.


I agree. No way in hell I'd bust those albums up and combine to "make a better one." (As if.) 3121 is beautifully cohesive.

Once upon a time, children, there was a thing known as a "concept album" - and 3121 is a prime example. More than a collection of random tracks, a concept album had songs organized around a central theme. In the case of 3121, it was the idea of a house party - a Prince house party, specifically – and the fun and personalities and undercurrents you'll find there.

I don't know how Planet Urf got into this discussion, but it isn't one of my favorites, so I'm just going to stick with the original point of the thread.

(I love that Prince was still thinking in terms of albums in 2006. And even eight years later, with Art Official Age.)

I agree too. While there are always songs that I favor over others, I always take albums as a whole and judge them for not just the sum of their parts. So those threads, while fun, never did it for me. Of course Prince was toying with configs for a while before getting settled on a tracklist for an album, so each album could have been different, but each album is a statement of sorts. I've always had doubts about the concept of concept albums because IMHO any properly crafted album by any artist is cohesive, and therefore more than a compilation of random songs randomly put together, so IDK if any P album was more of a concept album than any other, but each was a statement. Hell, even Crystal Ball, for the apparent mess that it was, was in fact carefully crafted into a record that, IMHO, flows incredibly well for 2 hours and a half.

A COMPREHENSIVE PRINCE DISCOGRAPHY (work in progress ^^): https://sites.google.com/...iscog/home
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Reply #23 posted 10/21/18 12:02pm

violetcrush

databank said:

Genesia said:


I agree. No way in hell I'd bust those albums up and combine to "make a better one." (As if.) 3121 is beautifully cohesive.

Once upon a time, children, there was a thing known as a "concept album" - and 3121 is a prime example. More than a collection of random tracks, a concept album had songs organized around a central theme. In the case of 3121, it was the idea of a house party - a Prince house party, specifically – and the fun and personalities and undercurrents you'll find there.

I don't know how Planet Urf got into this discussion, but it isn't one of my favorites, so I'm just going to stick with the original point of the thread.

(I love that Prince was still thinking in terms of albums in 2006. And even eight years later, with Art Official Age.)

I agree too. While there are always songs that I favor over others, I always take albums as a whole and judge them for not just the sum of their parts. So those threads, while fun, never did it for me. Of course Prince was toying with configs for a while before getting settled on a tracklist for an album, so each album could have been different, but each album is a statement of sorts. I've always had doubts about the concept of concept albums because IMHO any properly crafted album by any artist is cohesive, and therefore more than a compilation of random songs randomly put together, so IDK if any P album was more of a concept album than any other, but each was a statement. Hell, even Crystal Ball, for the apparent mess that it was, was in fact carefully crafted into a record that, IMHO, flows incredibly well for 2 hours and a half.

Yes, I guess my list above is more about which are my favorites rather than combining songs from each on to one album. Prince often stated in interviews that he looked at albums as a "book" that should be listened to from beginning to end. Crystal Ball was definitely a "mash up" of unreleased tracks from the 80's and 90's, but I'm sure he planned the placement.

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