homesquid said:

djchitown said:

I feel hurt and betrayed that he lied to us about his addiction and intimate relationships with women I went to PP on Sunday. I understand that he had to lie about so much of what he was doing because he would have been disassociated from the Jehovah Witnesses organization. But does anyone know when was the last time he visited a Kingdom Hall? Also is there a transcript of the interview that the police had with Larry Graham?

As a former JW (don't ask) I think your feelings are completely reasonable. But let's be real. Prince was someone who didn't stick to anything long and I don't mean just his marriages and sexual partners lol. I'm vegan and he claimed to be vegan and before you know it he's talking about making egg omeletes on a talk show. I learned to take his claims, beliefs, etc...with a grain of salt. As long as he didn't come out as a racist, Nazi, etc... I stopped cariing. I was a mega fan until about 1996 and I love a lot of his music still.

It's a pity he lied to all his brothers and sisters by fornicating like he always did pre-JW and after. That's Prince tho'. The guy had a massive ego and did whatever he wanted. Like it or not. There were times I kinda admired the man Prince (when he went vegan for example) but I was let down too many times to count and I learned to not invest emotionally in the artist but rather only the art.

To all you arseholes bashing djchitown it's YOU who need to grow the eff up. Just because youre hiding behind a computer doesn't mean you can treat others poorly...

Thank you for your post.

purplefam99 said:

homesquid said:

As a former JW (don't ask) I think your feelings are completely reasonable. But let's be real. Prince was someone who didn't stick to anything long and I don't mean just his marriages and sexual partners lol. I'm vegan and he claimed to be vegan and before you know it he's talking about making egg omeletes on a talk show. I learned to take his claims, beliefs, etc...with a grain of salt. As long as he didn't come out as a racist, Nazi, etc... I stopped cariing. I was a mega fan until about 1996 and I love a lot of his music still.

It's a pity he lied to all his brothers and sisters by fornicating like he always did pre-JW and after. That's Prince tho'. The guy had a massive ego and did whatever he wanted. Like it or not. There were times I kinda admired the man Prince (when he went vegan for example) but I was let down too many times to count and I learned to not invest emotionally in the artist but rather only the art.

To all you arseholes bashing djchitown it's YOU who need to grow the eff up. Just because youre hiding behind a computer doesn't mean you can treat others poorly...

Thank you for your post.

I say good goddamn for him for not being a good JW, some people think he tried too hard by not having the surgery because of the backwards blood beliefs. but what do any of us know, someone mentioned in one of the links on here that he was disfellowshipped I never, never heard that, anyone know of any facts to that?

also depends on what you call a vegan and how strict they are, i have some east indian friends who wouldn't let me eat fried chicken in their house. yet, they eat eggs, then, i have a brother who will eat chicken/fish, dairy products but won't touch beef or pork. People are fucking wierd with their diets and it gets to be a pain in the ass, why can't people go back to just eating what they used to. I know we treat animals horribly and that's a good reason but it' still a pain in the ass when I can't eat the food I want.

violetcrush said:

homesquid said:

As a former JW (don't ask) I think your feelings are completely reasonable. But let's be real. Prince was someone who didn't stick to anything long and I don't mean just his marriages and sexual partners lol. I'm vegan and he claimed to be vegan and before you know it he's talking about making egg omeletes on a talk show. I learned to take his claims, beliefs, etc...with a grain of salt. As long as he didn't come out as a racist, Nazi, etc... I stopped cariing. I was a mega fan until about 1996 and I love a lot of his music still.

It's a pity he lied to all his brothers and sisters by fornicating like he always did pre-JW and after. That's Prince tho'. The guy had a massive ego and did whatever he wanted. Like it or not. There were times I kinda admired the man Prince (when he went vegan for example) but I was let down too many times to count and I learned to not invest emotionally in the artist but rather only the art.

To all you arseholes bashing djchitown it's YOU who need to grow the eff up. Just because youre hiding behind a computer doesn't mean you can treat others poorly...

I disagree iwith much of what you say here. Prince was, in fact, a Vegetarian from c. 1990 until his death. There was a point where he went Vegan, but as many others have admitted, the Vegan diet is limiting and can be difficult to adhere to. However, he never strayed from the Vegetarian diet, and always supported the animal rights movement. Many people in this world, as they go through life, look for and find various pathways, and they venture in and out of different phases. This is very normal, and is how people change and grow. There are also many "regular" folks who have had multiple marriages, and/or a long string of sexual partners. None of this should matter with regard to Prince and his music.

*

Prince spoke about these things in public usually because he was asked direct questions in interviews about anything and everything involving his personal life. Or, his viewpoints were often found in his songs.

*

Again, to quote Prince during his interview with Larry King when asked if he thinks people should have a right to know about his personal life: "my music is what you come to the party for. If I give you something more, then that's me giving you something. If you seek something more then it seems that there is something lacking within yourself".

PeteSilas said:

purplefam99 said:

Thank you for your post.

I say good goddamn for him for not being a good JW, some people think he tried too hard by not having the surgery because of the backwards blood beliefs. but what do any of us know, someone mentioned in one of the links on here that he was disfellowshipped I never, never heard that, anyone know of any facts to that?

No, I believe it was confirmed that he had attended a service at KH in March 2016. I have no doubt they were lenient on him in many ways because of his celebrity status and how much attention it brought to the group. Religion is very hypocritical that way. One of the Pastor's of my tiny Lutheran church that I attended as a child gave specal attention to those who gave the most money. And let's not even get into the Catholic mess.

*

Bottom line is that Prince lived in a fish bowl - everyone wanting a look into his personal life. He was damned if he did, and damned if he didn't. He had some fans praising his JW affiliation, and others blasting him for it. People here talk about his big ego and the womanizing. Well, who fed that ego, and fueled the womanizing?? Fans. Fans and girls who lined up to get in his pants. Not just regular concert groupies, but also actresses, models, etc. An inflated ego is a bit inevitable, I think. It sort of comes with the territory. Most celebrities have some level of ego that is larger than regular folks.

*

There is no question that in his last couple of years here he was reflecting on some of this, and understanding things he could have done better. You hear this in his song The Breakdown:

*

Listen to me closely as the story unfolds
This could be the saddest story ever been told
I used to want the house with the biggest pool
Looking back now I just feel like a fool

*

I used to throw the party every New Year's Eve
First one intoxicated, last one to leave
Waking up in places that you would never believe
Give me back the time, you can keep the memories

[Edited 10/13/18 14:52pm]

you can still attend if you've been disfellowshipped but no one can talk to you, but, i don't think he was disfellowshipped. and ya, it's the public who makes heroes out of these people, it doesn't do them much good either, celebs are often known to act like jackasses wherever they go, it's not all their fault, if you've ever felt the rush of an audience (I have) it can burn the wiring in your brains out if you're not level headed. I also think it's addictive, Prince ruined his body because he not only was a workaholic but he was also most likely addicted to performing, i've felt it, only my ego isn't that big. I've walked away from things if I felt it wasn't good for me, even if i got the ego stroked, fuck the ego.

violetcrush said:

PeteSilas said:

I say good goddamn for him for not being a good JW, some people think he tried too hard by not having the surgery because of the backwards blood beliefs. but what do any of us know, someone mentioned in one of the links on here that he was disfellowshipped I never, never heard that, anyone know of any facts to that?

No, I believe it was confirmed that he had attended a service at KH in March 2016. I have no doubt they were lenient on him in many ways because of his celebrity status and how much attention it brought to the group. Religion is very hypocritical that way. One of the Pastor's of my tiny Lutheran church that I attended as a child gave specal attention to those who gave the most money. And let's not even get into the Catholic mess.

*

Bottom line is that Prince lived in a fish bowl - everyone wanting a look into his personal life. He was damned if he did, and damned if he didn't. He had some fans praising his JW affiliation, and others blasting him for it. People here talk about his big ego and the womanizing. Well, who fed that ego, and fueled the womanizing?? Fans. Fans and girls who lined up to get in his pants. Not just regular concert groupies, but also actresses, models, etc. An inflated ego is a bit inevitable, I think. It sort of comes with the territory. Most celebrities have some level of ego that is larger than regular folks.

*

There is no question that in his last couple of years here he was reflecting on some of this, and understanding things he could have done better. You hear this in his song Breakdown:

*

Listen to me closely as the story unfolds
This could be the saddest story even been told
I used to want the house with the biggest pool
I've been missing out I just feel like a fool

*

I used to throw the party at the New Year's Eve
First one intoxicated, last one to leave
Waking up in places that you would never believe
Give me back the time, you can keep the memories

PeteSilas said:

you can still attend if you've been disfellowshipped but no one can talk to you, but, i don't think he was disfellowshipped. and ya, it's the public who makes heroes out of these people, it doesn't do them much good either, celebs are often known to act like jackasses wherever they go, it's not all their fault, if you've ever felt the rush of an audience (I have) it can burn the wiring in your brains out if you're not level headed. I also think it's addictive, Prince ruined his body because he not only was a workaholic but he was also most likely addicted to performing, i've felt it, only my ego isn't that big. I've walked away from things if I felt it wasn't good for me, even if i got the ego stroked, fuck the ego.

violetcrush said:

No, I believe it was confirmed that he had attended a service at KH in March 2016. I have no doubt they were lenient on him in many ways because of his celebrity status and how much attention it brought to the group. Religion is very hypocritical that way. One of the Pastor's of my tiny Lutheran church that I attended as a child gave specal attention to those who gave the most money. And let's not even get into the Catholic mess.

*

Bottom line is that Prince lived in a fish bowl - everyone wanting a look into his personal life. He was damned if he did, and damned if he didn't. He had some fans praising his JW affiliation, and others blasting him for it. People here talk about his big ego and the womanizing. Well, who fed that ego, and fueled the womanizing?? Fans. Fans and girls who lined up to get in his pants. Not just regular concert groupies, but also actresses, models, etc. An inflated ego is a bit inevitable, I think. It sort of comes with the territory. Most celebrities have some level of ego that is larger than regular folks.

*

There is no question that in his last couple of years here he was reflecting on some of this, and understanding things he could have done better. You hear this in his song Breakdown:

*

Listen to me closely as the story unfolds
This could be the saddest story even been told
I used to want the house with the biggest pool
I've been missing out I just feel like a fool

*

I used to throw the party at the New Year's Eve
First one intoxicated, last one to leave
Waking up in places that you would never believe
Give me back the time, you can keep the memories

Agreed - it is the public, media, and fans who both worhsip and villainize celebrities on their whim, regardless of what is really happening in their private lives.

*

Yes, it's been said by many, and even Prince himself, that he loved and craved being on stage. In a 1998 interview with the press in Spain he was asked, "Do you become someone else when you are on stage in front of a huge crowd?" His response was, "no, not someone else - just a bigger, better version of myself" Makes a lot of sense really. Here is a very introverted, socially awkward, very controlling guy - which is a difficult combination in face-to-face interaction, but on stage, he is standing way above everyone, looking down, and controlling everything that happens.

violetcrush said:

PeteSilas said:

you can still attend if you've been disfellowshipped but no one can talk to you, but, i don't think he was disfellowshipped. and ya, it's the public who makes heroes out of these people, it doesn't do them much good either, celebs are often known to act like jackasses wherever they go, it's not all their fault, if you've ever felt the rush of an audience (I have) it can burn the wiring in your brains out if you're not level headed. I also think it's addictive, Prince ruined his body because he not only was a workaholic but he was also most likely addicted to performing, i've felt it, only my ego isn't that big. I've walked away from things if I felt it wasn't good for me, even if i got the ego stroked, fuck the ego.

violetcrush said:

No, I believe it was confirmed that he had attended a service at KH in March 2016. I have no doubt they were lenient on him in many ways because of his celebrity status and how much attention it brought to the group. Religion is very hypocritical that way. One of the Pastor's of my tiny Lutheran church that I attended as a child gave specal attention to those who gave the most money. And let's not even get into the Catholic mess.

*

Bottom line is that Prince lived in a fish bowl - everyone wanting a look into his personal life. He was damned if he did, and damned if he didn't. He had some fans praising his JW affiliation, and others blasting him for it. People here talk about his big ego and the womanizing. Well, who fed that ego, and fueled the womanizing?? Fans. Fans and girls who lined up to get in his pants. Not just regular concert groupies, but also actresses, models, etc. An inflated ego is a bit inevitable, I think. It sort of comes with the territory. Most celebrities have some level of ego that is larger than regular folks.

*

There is no question that in his last couple of years here he was reflecting on some of this, and understanding things he could have done better. You hear this in his song Breakdown:

*

Listen to me closely as the story unfolds
This could be the saddest story even been told
I used to want the house with the biggest pool
I've been missing out I just feel like a fool

*

I used to throw the party at the New Year's Eve
First one intoxicated, last one to leave
Waking up in places that you would never believe
Give me back the time, you can keep the memories

yes pete, workaholic is a badge that is brandished like an honor, when stripped away it is an addiction like all others, the fallout has similarities.

PeteSilas said:

you can still attend if you've been disfellowshipped but no one can talk to you, but, i don't think he was disfellowshipped. and ya, it's the public who makes heroes out of these people, it doesn't do them much good either, celebs are often known to act like jackasses wherever they go, it's not all their fault, if you've ever felt the rush of an audience (I have) it can burn the wiring in your brains out if you're not level headed. I also think it's addictive, Prince ruined his body because he not only was a workaholic but he was also most likely addicted to performing, i've felt it, only my ego isn't that big. I've walked away from things if I felt it wasn't good for me, even if i got the ego stroked, fuck the ego.

I think Bruce Springsteen said he fought depression when he was off tour.

I guess all of that adulation could affect a person. Bruce, though, struck me as having more insight into the phenomenon.

purplefam99 said:

PeteSilas said:

you can still attend if you've been disfellowshipped but no one can talk to you, but, i don't think he was disfellowshipped. and ya, it's the public who makes heroes out of these people, it doesn't do them much good either, celebs are often known to act like jackasses wherever they go, it's not all their fault, if you've ever felt the rush of an audience (I have) it can burn the wiring in your brains out if you're not level headed. I also think it's addictive, Prince ruined his body because he not only was a workaholic but he was also most likely addicted to performing, i've felt it, only my ego isn't that big. I've walked away from things if I felt it wasn't good for me, even if i got the ego stroked, fuck the ego.

yes pete, workaholic is a badge that is brandished like an honor, when stripped away it is an addiction like all others, the fallout has similarities.

Yes, purplefam99 - he lost a lot in life by being addicted to work/recording/performing. There was an associate from the early 90's, who was with him in a historic area of Europe. She said that after his concert/after show he wanted to go around the city/village and take pictures. They stopped in front of a beautiful historic church to take his picture. She said in that moment while he was standing by himself at 3:00 in the morning in this beautiful place, she realized how alone he was, and how lonely he must feel. Very sad

*

But, again, he wrote all of this in his songs - Solo, There Is Lonely, So Dark, etc. Steve Parke also talked about a song that he recorded called Mind Blow, with the lyric, "it's so quiet I can hear my hair grow". Even with all that he accomplished and all of the success, he was still a very lonely guy.

bruce believes it is genetic, his father was paranoid schizophrenic I read. Bruce also spent a lot of time and money in therapy which, well, honestly, i have absolutely no faith in but if there's money and someone wants it, they'll sell you anything.

peggyon said:

PeteSilas said:

you can still attend if you've been disfellowshipped but no one can talk to you, but, i don't think he was disfellowshipped. and ya, it's the public who makes heroes out of these people, it doesn't do them much good either, celebs are often known to act like jackasses wherever they go, it's not all their fault, if you've ever felt the rush of an audience (I have) it can burn the wiring in your brains out if you're not level headed. I also think it's addictive, Prince ruined his body because he not only was a workaholic but he was also most likely addicted to performing, i've felt it, only my ego isn't that big. I've walked away from things if I felt it wasn't good for me, even if i got the ego stroked, fuck the ego.

I think Bruce Springsteen said he fought depression when he was off tour.

I guess all of that adulation could affect a person. Bruce, though, struck me as having more insight into the phenomenon.

PeteSilas said:

bruce believes it is genetic, his father was paranoid schizophrenic I read. Bruce also spent a lot of time and money in therapy which, well, honestly, i have absolutely no faith in but if there's money and someone wants it, they'll sell you anything.

peggyon said:

I think Bruce Springsteen said he fought depression when he was off tour.

I guess all of that adulation could affect a person. Bruce, though, struck me as having more insight into the phenomenon.

Yeah, well, therapy only works as long as the client is willing to work on it. Springsteen was willing to work on his problem and manage it to the best of his ability...

purplethunder3121 said:

PeteSilas said:

bruce believes it is genetic, his father was paranoid schizophrenic I read. Bruce also spent a lot of time and money in therapy which, well, honestly, i have absolutely no faith in but if there's money and someone wants it, they'll sell you anything.

Yeah, well, therapy only works as long as the client is willing to work on it. Springsteen was willing to work on his problem and manage it to the best of his ability...

Playing Devil's Advocate, though Prince and Bruce were peers, Prince may have thought it would be weak to admit to his fan-base that he was anything less than potent/strong. He was also a show-man and probably wanted to keep the magic/mystery happening and the blood,sweat and tears hidden.

Bruce had a wife and 3 kids who probably kept it real, plus he had responsibilities to them.

And, culturally is is OK to admit to therapy in the white community.

I get the feeling that Prince was more of a "Damn the Torpedos" kind of guy and willing to put it all into the music/persona/mystery, though it certainly contributed to his death. (The strong, amazing guy with little vulnerability schtick).

This is not a criticism, love both artists.

purplethunder3121 said:

PeteSilas said:

bruce believes it is genetic, his father was paranoid schizophrenic I read. Bruce also spent a lot of time and money in therapy which, well, honestly, i have absolutely no faith in but if there's money and someone wants it, they'll sell you anything.

Yeah, well, therapy only works as long as the client is willing to work on it. Springsteen was willing to work on his problem and manage it to the best of his ability...

can only speak about my own self i've done it, it's horrible, they get in your head and start fucking around, maybe it works for some people but i don't see how, let sleeping demons lie if you're just going to make it worse.

peggyon said:

purplethunder3121 said:

Yeah, well, therapy only works as long as the client is willing to work on it. Springsteen was willing to work on his problem and manage it to the best of his ability...

Playing Devil's Advocate, though Prince and Bruce were peers, Prince may have thought it would be weak to admit to his fan-base that he was anything less than potent/strong. He was also a show-man and probably wanted to keep the magic/mystery happening and the blood,sweat and tears hidden.

Bruce had a wife and 3 kids who probably kept it real, plus he had responsibilities to them.

And, culturally is is OK to admit to therapy in the white community.

I get the feeling that Prince was more of a "Damn the Torpedos" kind of guy and willing to put it all into the music/persona/mystery, though it certainly contributed to his death. (The strong, amazing guy with little vulnerability schtick).

This is not a criticism, love both artists.

Totally agree with you. I'm not criticizing Prince either; just an observation for what it's worth. (about two cents lol)

PeteSilas said:

purplethunder3121 said:

Yeah, well, therapy only works as long as the client is willing to work on it. Springsteen was willing to work on his problem and manage it to the best of his ability...

can only speak about my own self i've done it, it's horrible, they get in your head and start fucking around, maybe it works for some people but i don't see how, let sleeping demons lie if you're just going to make it worse.

chuckle...let sleeping demons lie...one way of looking at it.

[Edited 10/14/18 19:09pm]

purplethunder3121 said:

peggyon said:

Playing Devil's Advocate, though Prince and Bruce were peers, Prince may have thought it would be weak to admit to his fan-base that he was anything less than potent/strong. He was also a show-man and probably wanted to keep the magic/mystery happening and the blood,sweat and tears hidden.

Bruce had a wife and 3 kids who probably kept it real, plus he had responsibilities to them.

And, culturally is is OK to admit to therapy in the white community.

I get the feeling that Prince was more of a "Damn the Torpedos" kind of guy and willing to put it all into the music/persona/mystery, though it certainly contributed to his death. (The strong, amazing guy with little vulnerability schtick).

This is not a criticism, love both artists.

Totally agree with you. I'm not criticizing Prince either; just an observation for what it's worth. (about two cents lol)

also, i don't know that prince didn't do therapy, there were rumours tthat he dabbled in it, i think the "dr. everything" might have been some hollywood therapist, i heard that at least once. And, Springsteen probably was more open to it but I also read that Ray Mancini, italian boxer, had a hard time with family counseling, his ex-wife said something to the efffect of "given his culture, i'm more proud of how he went through it than anything else he did" italians are suppossed to keep secrets.

PeteSilas said:

purplethunder3121 said:

Totally agree with you. I'm not criticizing Prince either; just an observation for what it's worth. (about two cents lol)

also, i don't know that prince didn't do therapy, there were rumours tthat he dabbled in it, i think the "dr. everything" might have been some hollywood therapist, i heard that at least once. And, Springsteen probably was more open to it but I also read that Ray Mancini, italian boxer, had a hard time with family counseling, his ex-wife said something to the efffect of "given his culture, i'm more proud of how he went through it than anything else he did" italians are suppossed to keep secrets.

I think religion and perforing were Prince's therapy. He seemed to look for answers there, or at least comfort. I believe Susan Rogers stated that when she suggested that he might have depression and therapy could help he did not respond well. She said she thought he felt that was wrong.

*

Regarding Prince, unlike Bruce, wanting to keep up his showman appearance and hide any emotional issues or weakness - I think the epitome of that was his refusal to publicly acknowledge or speak of his son's death . I know it was a privacy issue for him, and he had the Emancipation album to promote, but that Oprah interview was/is hard to watch.

i did read somewhere a reference to a ahollywood shrink in the 80's who was either recommended or Prince went to, again, i can't be sure because I read so much of this shit and hear so many podcasts I can't even keep all the info straight. I do remember susan saying prince thought being depressed was a sin. And sure, black people aren't heavy on therapy, i am not saying they should or shouldn't be because I doubt it helps anyway, there is a lot of historical trauma which needs to be dealt with by black people and by my Indian people, it is needed, i just don't believe help exists, not really, i've got more experience with "therapy" than probably 95 percent of the people out there and it only made my life worse, believe me. someone else who ony talks to you cause they get paid, usually white and therefore dismissive of everything about your experience and arrogant and with a false confidence in what they know? it's useless.

violetcrush said:

PeteSilas said:

also, i don't know that prince didn't do therapy, there were rumours tthat he dabbled in it, i think the "dr. everything" might have been some hollywood therapist, i heard that at least once. And, Springsteen probably was more open to it but I also read that Ray Mancini, italian boxer, had a hard time with family counseling, his ex-wife said something to the efffect of "given his culture, i'm more proud of how he went through it than anything else he did" italians are suppossed to keep secrets.

I think religion and perforing were Prince's therapy. He seemed to look for answers there, or at least comfort. I believe Susan Rogers stated that when she suggested that he might have depression and therapy could help he did not respond well. She said she thought he felt that was wrong.

*

Regarding Prince, unlike Bruce, wanting to keep up his showman appearance and hide any emotional issues or weakness - I think the epitome of that was his refusal to publicly acknowledge or speak of his son's death . I know it was a privacy issue for him, and he had the Emancipation album to promote, but that Oprah interview was/is hard to watch.

PeteSilas said:

i did read somewhere a reference to a ahollywood shrink in the 80's who was either recommended or Prince went to, again, i can't be sure because I read so much of this shit and hear so many podcasts I can't even keep all the info straight. I do remember susan saying prince thought being depressed was a sin. And sure, black people aren't heavy on therapy, i am not saying they should or shouldn't be because I doubt it helps anyway, there is a lot of historical trauma which needs to be dealt with by black people and by my Indian people, it is needed, i just don't believe help exists, not really, i've got more experience with "therapy" than probably 95 percent of the people out there and it only made my life worse, believe me. someone else who ony talks to you cause they get paid, usually white and therefore dismissive of everything about your experience and arrogant and with a false confidence in what they know? it's useless.

violetcrush said:

I think religion and perforing were Prince's therapy. He seemed to look for answers there, or at least comfort. I believe Susan Rogers stated that when she suggested that he might have depression and therapy could help he did not respond well. She said she thought he felt that was wrong.

*

Regarding Prince, unlike Bruce, wanting to keep up his showman appearance and hide any emotional issues or weakness - I think the epitome of that was his refusal to publicly acknowledge or speak of his son's death . I know it was a privacy issue for him, and he had the Emancipation album to promote, but that Oprah interview was/is hard to watch.

That's interesting. Where?

PeteSilas said:

i did read somewhere a reference to a ahollywood shrink in the 80's who was either recommended or Prince went to, again, i can't be sure because I read so much of this shit and hear so many podcasts I can't even keep all the info straight. I do remember susan saying prince thought being depressed was a sin. And sure, black people aren't heavy on therapy, i am not saying they should or shouldn't be because I doubt it helps anyway, there is a lot of historical trauma which needs to be dealt with by black people and by my Indian people, it is needed, i just don't believe help exists, not really, i've got more experience with "therapy" than probably 95 percent of the people out there and it only made my life worse, believe me. someone else who ony talks to you cause they get paid, usually white and therefore dismissive of everything about your experience and arrogant and with a false confidence in what they know? it's useless.

violetcrush said:

I think religion and perforing were Prince's therapy. He seemed to look for answers there, or at least comfort. I believe Susan Rogers stated that when she suggested that he might have depression and therapy could help he did not respond well. She said she thought he felt that was wrong.

*

Regarding Prince, unlike Bruce, wanting to keep up his showman appearance and hide any emotional issues or weakness - I think the epitome of that was his refusal to publicly acknowledge or speak of his son's death . I know it was a privacy issue for him, and he had the Emancipation album to promote, but that Oprah interview was/is hard to watch.

the majority of therapist are white and while they seek to understand and treat the depression outsie their own cultures, it is hinged on so many other factors that certainly in the recent past their efforts

have been rendered to the "useless" realm in the eyes and minds of some AA. I think this why the music is so powerful amoung

AA people it was almost always used a way to uplift and relieve the soul. Music was the therapy.

it was and is the partner to the AA experience without it, well i shudder to think. It has been as effective as a therapist that lacks the cultural standpoint of which to understand fully the multi faceted depression that may hover over the AA and the experience.

Wow,Purplefam, thanks for your insights. I did not know that music served that purpose in the AA community to that extent.

I am guilty of pushing therapy, but I am white and like you and Pete say, most therapists are white. Though I have to say I have had to run through many therapists to find the right one.

I think what you say is true, though largely well-intentioned, there would be a tone-deafness present.

And, as Pete mentioned there is so much historical trauma that cannot possibly be understood by a white person, no matter how empathetic. So, how could Prince find someone he trusted, who knew about the vississitudes of fame as well as the fall-out from his upbringing, racism etc.?

Though I knew about this intellectually, both you and Pete have helped to understand more deeply.

Thank you.

purplefam99 said:

PeteSilas said:

i did read somewhere a reference to a ahollywood shrink in the 80's who was either recommended or Prince went to, again, i can't be sure because I read so much of this shit and hear so many podcasts I can't even keep all the info straight. I do remember susan saying prince thought being depressed was a sin. And sure, black people aren't heavy on therapy, i am not saying they should or shouldn't be because I doubt it helps anyway, there is a lot of historical trauma which needs to be dealt with by black people and by my Indian people, it is needed, i just don't believe help exists, not really, i've got more experience with "therapy" than probably 95 percent of the people out there and it only made my life worse, believe me. someone else who ony talks to you cause they get paid, usually white and therefore dismissive of everything about your experience and arrogant and with a false confidence in what they know? it's useless.

the majority of therapist are white and while they seek to understand and treat the depression outsie their own cultures, it is hinged on so many other factors that certainly in the recent past their efforts

have been rendered to the "useless" realm in the eyes and minds of some AA. I think this why the music is so powerful amoung

AA people it was almost always used a way to uplift and relieve the soul. Music was the therapy.

it was and is the partner to the AA experience without it, well i shudder to think. It has been as effective as a therapist that lacks the cultural standpoint of which to understand fully the multi faceted depression that may hover over the AA and the experience.

Also remember that 'race' is just a construct. Everyone under those labels does not fit the subjective issue or experiences.

Don't just assume people of African ancestry are ' traumatized', broken, needing help etc
.
I don't like how PoC are being painted as tortured mentally spiritually emotionally traumatized child like people and white people are just these people devoid of empathy and are all healthy wealthy and know nothing of poverty ethnic hardships or prejudice.

.

Sometimes, I feel discriminated against, but it does not make me angry. It merely astonishes me. How can any deny themselves the pleasure of my company? It's beyond me.

-Zora Neale Hurston

peggyon said:

Wow,Purplefam, thanks for your insights. I did not know that music served that purpose in the AA community to that extent.

I am guilty of pushing therapy, but I am white and like you and Pete say, most therapists are white. Though I have to say I have had to run through many therapists to find the right one.

I think what you say is true, though largely well-intentioned, there would be a tone-deafness present.

And, as Pete mentioned there is so much historical trauma that cannot possibly be understood by a white person, no matter how empathetic. So, how could Prince find someone he trusted, who knew about the vississitudes of fame as well as the fall-out from his upbringing, racism etc.?

Though I knew about this intellectually, both you and Pete have helped to understand more deeply.

Thank you.

purplefam99 said:

the majority of therapist are white and while they seek to understand and treat the depression outsie their own cultures, it is hinged on so many other factors that certainly in the recent past their efforts

have been rendered to the "useless" realm in the eyes and minds of some AA. I think this why the music is so powerful amoung

AA people it was almost always used a way to uplift and relieve the soul. Music was the therapy.

it was and is the partner to the AA experience without it, well i shudder to think. It has been as effective as a therapist that lacks the cultural standpoint of which to understand fully the multi faceted depression that may hover over the AA and the experience.

purplefam99 said:

PeteSilas said:

i did read somewhere a reference to a ahollywood shrink in the 80's who was either recommended or Prince went to, again, i can't be sure because I read so much of this shit and hear so many podcasts I can't even keep all the info straight. I do remember susan saying prince thought being depressed was a sin. And sure, black people aren't heavy on therapy, i am not saying they should or shouldn't be because I doubt it helps anyway, there is a lot of historical trauma which needs to be dealt with by black people and by my Indian people, it is needed, i just don't believe help exists, not really, i've got more experience with "therapy" than probably 95 percent of the people out there and it only made my life worse, believe me. someone else who ony talks to you cause they get paid, usually white and therefore dismissive of everything about your experience and arrogant and with a false confidence in what they know? it's useless.

the majority of therapist are white and while they seek to understand and treat the depression outsie their own cultures, it is hinged on so many other factors that certainly in the recent past their efforts

have been rendered to the "useless" realm in the eyes and minds of some AA. I think this why the music is so powerful amoung

AA people it was almost always used a way to uplift and relieve the soul. Music was the therapy.

it was and is the partner to the AA experience without it, well i shudder to think. It has been as effective as a therapist that lacks the cultural standpoint of which to understand fully the multi faceted depression that may hover over the AA and the experience.

That is actually the use of music for the human race, just expressed differently via the many cultures of this earth and our society.

.

You see a difference in certain AA communities and individuals when you listen to music of say the 70s and 80s vs a lot of the ganstar rap and latter musics that really don't uplift and how it affects peoples lifestyles.

.

Music throught our history

1 to pass the time to relax heal

2. insight anger or war

3. express grief

4. to worship a god or diety channel spirits dark or light

5. to set a mood for lust or sex

6. celebrations of all sorts

my take is simple, a lot of help is need, it's not in existence. Will it come? I don't think so, i'm in a city where everyday I see people on the streets, white/black most of them I can assume were from poor places, had abusive upbringings, black and Indian have the other stuff to deal with ontop of this country just being a cruel place to live. It's blatant and in your fucking face when illegal immigrants and refugees will gladly be accepted into workplaces where a lot of other people won't. I understand why, no one wants to deal with hundreds of years of bottled up issues in a worker but it's not right and I don't think it'll ever be addressed. But it's understandable how people get angry about it.

peggyon said:

Wow,Purplefam, thanks for your insights. I did not know that music served that purpose in the AA community to that extent.

I am guilty of pushing therapy, but I am white and like you and Pete say, most therapists are white. Though I have to say I have had to run through many therapists to find the right one.

I think what you say is true, though largely well-intentioned, there would be a tone-deafness present.

And, as Pete mentioned there is so much historical trauma that cannot possibly be understood by a white person, no matter how empathetic. So, how could Prince find someone he trusted, who knew about the vississitudes of fame as well as the fall-out from his upbringing, racism etc.?

Though I knew about this intellectually, both you and Pete have helped to understand more deeply.

Thank you.

purplefam99 said:

the majority of therapist are white and while they seek to understand and treat the depression outsie their own cultures, it is hinged on so many other factors that certainly in the recent past their efforts

have been rendered to the "useless" realm in the eyes and minds of some AA. I think this why the music is so powerful amoung

AA people it was almost always used a way to uplift and relieve the soul. Music was the therapy.

it was and is the partner to the AA experience without it, well i shudder to think. It has been as effective as a therapist that lacks the cultural standpoint of which to understand fully the multi faceted depression that may hover over the AA and the experience.

OldFriends4Sale said:

That is actually the use of music for the human race, just expressed differently via the many cultures of this earth and our society.

.

You see a difference in certain AA communities and individuals when you listen to music of say the 70s and 80s vs a lot of the ganstar rap and latter musics that really don't uplift and how it affects peoples lifestyles.

.

Music throught our history

1 to pass the time to relax heal

2. insight anger or war

3. express grief

4. to worship a god or diety channel spirits dark or light

5. to set a mood for lust or sex

6. celebrations of all sorts

YEP

PeteSilas said:

endiadj said:

PeteSilas said:

you can still attend if you've been disfellowshipped but no one can talk to you, but, i don't think he was disfellowshipped. and ya, it's the public who makes heroes out of these people, it doesn't do them much good either, celebs are often known to act like jackasses wherever they go, it's not all their fault, if you've ever felt the rush of an audience (I have) it can burn the wiring in your brains out if you're not level headed. I also think it's addictive, Prince ruined his body because he not only was a workaholic but he was also most likely addicted to performing, i've felt it, only my ego isn't that big. I've walked away from things if I felt it wasn't good for me, even if i got the ego stroked, fuck the ego.

People who aren't celebs act like jackasses.

i think you know what i mean but in case you don't, feeding the ego in that way doesn't help people really. The way we make modern day gods out of people really isn't good for them or us. the feeling that they are better than common folk and thus they can drug and rape them like cosby did, not to say he didn't have a problem deep in him from before he was a celeb, but just the place he was put and how he was able to get away with so much. it can't be easy, everyone in your face all the time, putting you in position of either being nice or being an asshole, which one guy who claimed to have been around famous people said they "either become real nice or real abusive". It's not good for the soul. Lionel Richie said after Prince died, when asked why these guys have problems and he said that it wasn't that the problem was created by fame as such but that the resources you get, the freedom you get makes those issues run rampant and "it'll kill you". There was a native american author, sherman alexie, who's career is probably over because of the me too crap, he went around harassing women, nothing really that bad like these other assholes but the timings all bad for that right now, anyway, he had a reputation for being verbally abusive to his own people and threatening Indian people's careers, this all came out about 8 months ago and overnight, all those fans he had abandoned him and his own want nothing to do with him, that's not a good position to be in and cosby had the same problems, he was abusive to his own people and now he has no one to help him. You have to really fuck up to get black people to abandon you, as one of MJ"s old bodyguards said "black people are the most forgiving people on the planet". Bill has few people speaking up for him now that he needs it. Alex Haley said it best that fame was "like riding a tiger, that you have the danger of being thrown off and being eaten". He'd seen it of course with Malcolm X and he had his own issues.

[Edited 10/15/18 17:50pm]

As a white person, I cannot imagine what people of color go through just to get through the day. I go any place I want to, I never fear being stopped by police (unless I am speeding), and I most certainly don't have to watch my back 24/7. What Prince went through - racially - we shall never know. I cannot even be sure that, after he was famous, that he didn't endure discrimination. But I have felt his trauma stemmed from his parents and his childhood and that informed his actions for his entire life.

1Sasha said:

As a white person, I cannot imagine what people of color go through just to get through the day. I go any place I want to, I never fear being stopped by police (unless I am speeding), and I most certainly don't have to watch my back 24/7. What Prince went through - racially - we shall never know. I cannot even be sure that, after he was famous, that he didn't endure discrimination. But I have felt his trauma stemmed from his parents and his childhood and that informed his actions for his entire life.

I'm a PoC too and I go any place I want to, never fear being stopped by the police(unless I'm speeding) so far 3 times and ran a red light by mistake, but never got a dig on my license. Last stop for speeding was on Easter 2018, going 15-20 over, he didn't give me a ticket at all.

and I don't have to watch my back 24/7.
.
I do say though that women, no matter where have to always be more careful.

.

but that bold part there...truth. And I think we all can relate whether from a small degree to larger than Prince how families can jag us our whole lives.