PennyPurple said:

Camileyun said:

SkipperLove said:

According to Sheila, he was on pills during the 2011 tour. Yes, the surgery was successful. But this was some high impact dancing.

Link to article about recommended exercises after hip surgery. It says low impact...I wouldn't call what prince was doing low impact or easy on the hips. How could he do it without some assistance?

https://www.arthritis-hea...y-recovery..on the pain thread, (which I will remain on from this point on while discussing pain.), I posted 4 different dance clips on 2011.

Living with a Hip Replacement

After recovery, a patient should continue an exercise routine to keep the hip muscles strong and flexible. Physicians typically recommend low impact aerobic activities such as walking, bicycling (or stationary biking), and swimming or pool therapy.

• See Ways to Get Exercise When... Arthritis

Even after a successful recovery, a replacement hip will typically be less flexible than a healthy, natural hip. For example, while hip replacement surgery improves most patients’ ability to put on shoes and socks, some patients may still need a reaching tool to do so. Other activities that might stress the hip, such as sitting cross-legged on the floor (“Indian style”), may remain difficult to perform.

• See “When Can I…?” Answ...t Patients

Despite limitations of the new hip, most patient expectations are met. One study found that more than 87% of the expectations set by patients were met post-surgery. Additionally, 90% or more of patients said their expectations were completely met when it came to eliminating medications, relieving nighttime pain, improving the ability to walk, and improving their ability work and participate in recreational or social activities.

Camileyun said:

SkipperLove said:

He danced more in 2011 Welcome to America Tour than he did many years prior.. Not sure what that indicates, but he went from just standing in 2009 during performances to 2 minute dance solos with pop-n-lock hip girations in 2011, eventually back to limited motion, and finally mostly the piano. Could hip pain be masked by the drugs he was already on?

It indicates to me that his hip surgery was successful and he had a new lease on life.

[Edited 8/2/18 22:17pm]

I'm not really surprised P didn't follow doctor's orders He did ride his bike, though.
Before he had the surgery, he probably medicated himself until he couldn't take it anymore, had the surgery, was given meds for recovery, and was well on his way to addiction. I don't believe he had enough pain after recovery to justify such potent narcotics. Don't forget, opiods can exacerbate pain and he was on a slippery slope.

June7 said:

As requested, please continue this discussion here.

To review Part 11, go here.

[I started this thread as an extension of the already posted parts 1 thru 11. I was asked by an Orger to do so, as the other one was due to self lock soon. As someone who has not only gone through the loss of our beloved, Prince, I recently suffered the loss of my youngest son, Alex. I understand the importance of talking these things out. It is because of this that the thread has been continued and not left to die out. But, in talking about this very touchy and horribly sad topic, there will be emotion and attitude mixed in. This is normal - but, we as adults still must keep in mind our pain and suffering is not only reserved for us alone, no ... we must remember that we are all dealing with this in our own way. Any rudeness, bitterness towards other members, disgusting and/or baiting posts will be dealt with extremely harshly. I will not tolerate such behavior on this thread - we're better than that. Any reports of violations in this manner will be handled, and not in a lighthearted way, but harshly. Please don't test me on this. Other than that, please discuss this topic with the idea that Prince's family is reading this, because they are. And post with the sensitivity you'd want if this were your sibling or uncle or friend. Thank you - June7]

sending you much love from one parent to another. Cannot begin to imagine what you are going through.x. Thank you for keeping this thread open.

this is such a hard thread to read. Just as my grief turns to acceptance a bunch of new info comes up & it starts over..& of course someone from the so caled inner circle always appears annonomously to add fuel to the fire.

Just wish ALL the info came out at once, everyone who knoew what went down ALL spoke at once & then...maybe then we can start to grive properly & eventually reach some closure?

June7 said:

As requested, please continue this discussion here.

To review Part 11, go here.

[I started this thread as an extension of the already posted parts 1 thru 11. I was asked by an Orger to do so, as the other one was due to self lock soon. As someone who has not only gone through the loss of our beloved, Prince, I recently suffered the loss of my youngest son, Alex. I understand the importance of talking these things out. It is because of this that the thread has been continued and not left to die out. But, in talking about this very touchy and horribly sad topic, there will be emotion and attitude mixed in. This is normal - but, we as adults still must keep in mind our pain and suffering is not only reserved for us alone, no ... we must remember that we are all dealing with this in our own way. Any rudeness, bitterness towards other members, disgusting and/or baiting posts will be dealt with extremely harshly. I will not tolerate such behavior on this thread - we're better than that. Any reports of violations in this manner will be handled, and not in a lighthearted way, but harshly. Please don't test me on this. Other than that, please discuss this topic with the idea that Prince's family is reading this, because they are. And post with the sensitivity you'd want if this were your sibling or uncle or friend. Thank you - June7]

Camileyun said:

June7, please accept my sincere condolences on your loss, and may you find peace and comfort in your memories of your precious Alex. God bless. [Edited 8/3/18 8:14am]

Beautifully put, Camileyon....I share your sentiments for June7..

paulludvig said:

Bodhitheblackdog said:

Thanks for sharing your professional expertise with us. Anyone who thinks Prince just took opioids for hip pain needs to read these words over slowly and carefully and think about them for a bit, IMO.

The point is you don't have hip surgery if you don't have pain to start with.

I think this will always be the splitting point among fans. The degree of pain he was actually suffering. Seems the ones he may have been close enough to talk to about that kind of intimate information will never talk and the ones who would talk he wasn't intimate enough with them to share that type of information.

PennyPurple said:

Camileyun said:

Thank you, Penny for posting those interviews and refreshing my memory about what Sheila discussed with KJ. Who else would tell her about P passing in his bedroom if not Meron. This was the day he died, she was going to go to the people who were there...she covered for Meron in her interview because she was being protective. In that case, it could very well be true! [Edited 7/31/18 17:01pm]

Sheila talked to KJ several times, on 4/21 around 2 am she was calling KJ and this was before they even knew P had passed.

Omarr even stated that it was Sheila and KJ who planned the service.

The LE really seem to just be going through the motions. After reading Crystal's and Theo's interviews, how can you not subpeona Phaedra, Meron and KJ.

Rev said:

The LE really seem to just be going through the motions. After reading Crystal's and Theo's interviews, how can you not subpeona Phaedra, Meron and KJ.

I know. I can't figure it out. Why did they wait so long to interview people, and the ones that should of been interviewed hasn't.

Rev said:

PennyPurple said:

Sheila talked to KJ several times, on 4/21 around 2 am she was calling KJ and this was before they even knew P had passed.

Omarr even stated that it was Sheila and KJ who planned the service.

The LE really seem to just be going through the motions. After reading Crystal's and Theo's interviews, how can you not subpeona Phaedra, Meron and KJ.

The police cannot force people to be interviewed.

ISaidLifeIsJustAGame said:

Rev said:

The LE really seem to just be going through the motions. After reading Crystal's and Theo's interviews, how can you not subpeona Phaedra, Meron and KJ.

The police cannot force people to be interviewed.

I know I thought they could. That it was illegal or something not to submit to a police interview.

I just cannot get my head around how he could be on that many drugs AND still manage to perform to a such stellar standard & with THAT voice so perfectly in tact until the end? I guess we can safely conclude that he took drugs to get through the intense / crippling pain & to keep on working & NOT for kicks?

PURPLEIZED3121 said:

I just cannot get my head around how he could be on that many drugs AND still manage to perform to a such stellar standard & with THAT voice so perfectly in tact until the end? I guess we can safely conclude that he took drugs to get through the intense / crippling pain & to keep on working & NOT for kicks?

I don't think he was in crippling pain, I'm not saying he didn't have any pain, just not crippling pain.

My opinion is that he dabbled in drugs on and off for years, which is supported in Maytes book with the wine incident, and where her pain pills would go missing. The XTC incident with the Black Album, things that Mani has said, Dr. D, and what his sister and Duane actually said about the cocaine. There are too many incidents there where we as fans thought it was BS, that actually might not be BS.

As far as his hip, Yes I think it caused him pain, I imagine he was on pain pills before his hip surgery, he was probably getting the scripts from his Dr. it sounds like he's never been off of them since that surgery. After that surgery I doubt he was in crippling pain, the surgery fixed that. I think Skipper posted some links that show him on stage after that surgery and he was performing really good on that hip.

I don't think that some of you understand how addictive these drugs are. You start taking them for pain and you can't stop. Your body needs more and more because the body builds up a tolerance you don't get high from it, because you are tolerant to it.

It's in the documents and even Crystal said, he was on drugs and everyone knew it, that's why she quit because it got so bad.

He even OD in 2011,2013 (?) There can not be any denial that he wasn't on drugs.

He was 57, no doubt his joints hurt, no doubt he had some hand pain, I'm 55 and I sure can't do what I used to do, and my hands hurt on some days too.

He started the P&M tour, which was brilliant, 1 man show, just him and the piano. No jumping around on stage, laid back, easy peasy.

I also think that the drugs stopped working for him and he needed something stronger and that's when he turned to fentanyl. He had those pills seperated, he knew which was which. The Welton's commented that they never saw him take anything stronger then Advil........his drugs were hidden in Bayer bottle, Advil bottle, Vit C bottles.....it leads me to believe that he was taking them in front of people, but people just thought he was taking what the bottles were labeled as.

He told the Dr he wasn't in any pain, you can see him not having a problem walking into the Drs office. I do imagine after he did his stage stunts that yeah his bones were probably sore.

I think some here are in denial and can't get over the fact that the man was on drugs and it makes them feel better to think that he was in crippeling pain.

These are very addictive drugs, why do you think that the opioid crisis is so huge in this country?

Also, those Narcan shots sent him on a downward spiral, took most of, if not all the drugs out of his system, so when he started dosing again at the same level as he had before the shots, well that's not good. Add the high level of fentanyl in there because they came from some idiots on the street and there you have it. Even if he didn't have those Narcan shots, he wasn't long for this world with the high dose of fentanyl.

[Edited 8/3/18 16:56pm]

Thank You for your wise overview, Penny. You have drilled down deep and long into this saga and I trust your judgement and opinions because I know they have been formed by looking through the lens of your own unfortunate experiences with your husbands' medically necessary need for pain meds.You have been so generous in sharing it all with us as the picture of Prince's sad demise pulls into focus.

[Edited 8/3/18 17:18pm]

Bodhitheblackdog said:

Thank You for your wise overview, Penny. You have drilled down deep and long into this saga and I trust your judgement and opinions because I know they have been formed by looking through the lens of your own unfortunate experiences with your husbands' medically necessary need for pain meds.You have been so generous in sharing it all with us as the picture of Prince's sad demise pulls into focus.

[Edited 8/3/18 17:18pm]

I hope I explained it better this time.

PennyPurple said:

laytonian said:

Time for an information reset. That Dr D crap. Anyone who really read the investigative reports knows that LE looked into his claims. They even asked Manuela if P took drugs for stagefright. Not only did she deny it, but she gave him the name of the woman who was his contact during the marriage. The man lived to perform. Soundchecks, concerts, aftershows. Dr D is full of shit. Like the fake AIDS report and murder conspiracies here. . If you don't know, read the files. Don't make stuff up. The ME report said two scars (left hip, lower right leg). At some point in other files we learn about surgery to remove wisdom teeth. .

I referenced the 'hip pain' because it seems like that is where everybody focus is on.

The hip scar, ankle scar, and wisdom teeth have all been discussed before. We are on part 12 now, if you hadn't noticed.

I don't think Dr. D is as full of shit as you think he is.

I don't think I mentioned stage fright, but again Mani confirmed he used when she gave them the woman's name...correct?

So what's made up?

PennyPurple said:

laytonian said:

Time for an information reset. That Dr D crap. Anyone who really read the investigative reports knows that LE looked into his claims. They even asked Manuela if P took drugs for stagefright. Not only did she deny it, but she gave him the name of the woman who was his contact during the marriage. The man lived to perform. Soundchecks, concerts, aftershows. Dr D is full of shit. Like the fake AIDS report and murder conspiracies here. . If you don't know, read the files. Don't make stuff up. The ME report said two scars (left hip, lower right leg). At some point in other files we learn about surgery to remove wisdom teeth. .

I referenced the 'hip pain' because it seems like that is where everybody focus is on.

The hip scar, ankle scar, and wisdom teeth have all been discussed before. We are on part 12 now, if you hadn't noticed.

I don't think Dr. D is as full of shit as you think he is.

I don't think I mentioned stage fright, but again Mani confirmed he used when she gave them the woman's name...correct?

So what's made up?

Prince was more awkward on stage early on and I can believe he had stage fright. It took a long time for him to engage with an audience. I would not be surprised if he took drugs to assist with that.

Dr D had so much intimate information that has always rung true to me.

peggyon said:

laytonian said:

Camileyun said:

Just as an aside, the woman that Mani said was P 's contact is a very beautiful, successful woman, and sooo P 's type. Wonder what was going on there. LE gave the DEA her name and they said they did not have her name as a contact in their system (pg. 169). That's it? If you're not already in their system, you're good?
Maybe Mani had another reason to mention her name?


There's a pic of the woman mani mentioned?

Strawberrylova123 said:

Camileyun said:

Just as an aside, the woman that Mani said was P 's contact is a very beautiful, successful woman, and sooo P 's type. Wonder what was going on there. LE gave the DEA her name and they said they did not have her name as a contact in their system (pg. 169). That's it? If you're not already in their system, you're good?
Maybe Mani had another reason to mention her name?


There's a pic of the woman mani mentioned?

laytonian said:

Time for an information reset. That Dr D crap. Anyone who really read the investigative reports knows that LE looked into his claims. They even asked Manuela if P took drugs for stagefright. Not only did she deny it, but she gave him the name of the woman who was his contact during the marriage. The man lived to perform. Soundchecks, concerts, aftershows. Dr D is full of shit. Like the fake AIDS report and murder conspiracies here. . If you don't know, read the files. Don't make stuff up. The ME report said two scars (left hip, lower right leg). At some point in other files we learn about surgery to remove wisdom teeth. .

The thing is hydrocodone seems to have been, prior to 2014, considered a lower level legal opiod. I see that people are really working hard to try to insist that Prince was using recreationally. But I don't see how. Mayte was married to Prince in the 90s, he died of addiction in 2016, that's 20 years later still trying to get hydrocodone strength pills. Dr D. stated that Prince was using since the 80s, so now we are at 30 years ago. We all know for a fact that people develope a resistant to drug strengths after long term use. Addicts are not casual users, they tend to use frequently, if not daily. Opiods can cause addiction with as little as 2 weeks use, so it happens in no time at all. How does one remain getting the same high, if one is to assume it was all recreational, 20 to 30 years down the line with frequent use as an addict?

Sounds to me, it is highly possible he injured himself a long time ago, maybe the 90s. Nobody in the medical community was seriously checking for addiction problems with a low level opiod. I'm sure Prince was more trusting and assumed it was okay. That's when the addiction may have started, and along the way has had very long periods of going without the pill. Therefore his body never developed a high tolerance from long-term use. He may have had times of falling off the wagon and then getting back on again, hence a couple of overdoses spread out over these decades. Plus, there is evidence he was cutting pills. Now we don't know if he was taking a half a pill at a time or a pill and a half at a time. I highly double reaching anywhere over 3 at a time since he willing admit to the Dr. he took 2 why not admit to 3 if he were literally popping them by the hand full just to get high.

ISaidLifeIsJustAGame said:

Rev said:

The LE really seem to just be going through the motions. After reading Crystal's and Theo's interviews, how can you not subpeona Phaedra, Meron and KJ.

The police cannot force people to be interviewed.

Maybe, I watch too many detective tv shows? It seems like that more could "have" been done within the law. It was an illegal transaction at one point, that killed someone. It was time to turn it up to "11"

Camileyun said:

Just as an aside, the woman that Mani said was P 's contact is a very beautiful, successful woman, and sooo P 's type. Wonder what was going on there. LE gave the DEA her name and they said they did not have her name as a contact in their system (pg. 169). That's it? If you're not already in their system, you're good? Maybe Mani had another reason to mention her name?

Every woman around Prince was beautiful. That's nothing new. Meron is drop dead gorgeous.

stacy littlejohn ??

[Edited 8/3/18 20:18pm]

Strawberrylova123 said: