peggyon said:

SkipperLove said:

Can I ask you a question (seeing as you are a medical professional), other than dislocation due to improper exercise, are there any other pain issues that can pop up after hip replacements especially in an active man? I just did some reading about how high impact or strenous exercise can dislocate the hip.

Also, another question when Prince emailed KJ about canceling the chiropactor because "it went back in place", could he be talking about his hip dislocation popping back into place or would that be impossible without a doctor?

Thank YOU.

By the time Prince had his total hip replacement in 2010, he was no longer performing as acrobatically and he was 52 as well. Some hips can dislocate right after surgery but most patients receive physical therapy and follow instructions as to avoid that with proper range of motion and increasing strengthening exercises. Part of my job is to teach these patients what to expect prior to and post-surgery so I am very familiar with it. Also, most folks do not wait until they were as symptomatic as Prince to have the surgery. There are very few post-op problems and they would be evaluated especially for someone of Prince's stature.

Our hip patients go home the same day. It is not a difficult surgery.

This is why I scratch my head about the years of hip pain?

Thanks for sharing your professional expertise with us. Anyone who thinks Prince just took opioids for hip pain needs to read these words over slowly and carefully and think about them for a bit, IMO.

Mumio said:

benni said:

Thank you. I wanted to see where you were getting that from, because Billy Sparks stated that he had hip surgery and very specifically that it was not a hip replacement, back after Prince passed in 2016.

On page 143 of the DEA files, Prince answered "none" to the question of surgical history. Interesting, yes?

But they did find an invoice for the Mayo Clinic, didn't they? For the hip surgery?

benni said:

Mumio said:

On page 143 of the DEA files, Prince answered "none" to the question of surgical history. Interesting, yes?

Mumio, can you post that? But yes, very interesting. If it was an outpatient type of thing, he may not have seen it as a surgery. I always forget to list those things on questionaires at doctor's offices, too, and when I mention I have a vena cava filter in place or had 3 stents implanted....they say, "We don't see that listed under your surgeries." oops

I would and did try to but it wouldn't take for some reason. Maybe if Penny is still on she could do it? I saw that she'd done others so she might have another source to use.

Mumio said:

benni said:

Mumio, can you post that? But yes, very interesting. If it was an outpatient type of thing, he may not have seen it as a surgery. I always forget to list those things on questionaires at doctor's offices, too, and when I mention I have a vena cava filter in place or had 3 stents implanted....they say, "We don't see that listed under your surgeries." oops

I would and did try to but it wouldn't take for some reason. Maybe if Penny is still on she could do it? I saw that she'd done others so she might have another source to use.

I'll try but I can't seem to post anything from the Carver County files. I have better luck going to the NY Times article where they posted the files and it lets me copy and paste.

Bodhitheblackdog said:

peggyon said:

By the time Prince had his total hip replacement in 2010, he was no longer performing as acrobatically and he was 52 as well. Some hips can dislocate right after surgery but most patients receive physical therapy and follow instructions as to avoid that with proper range of motion and increasing strengthening exercises. Part of my job is to teach these patients what to expect prior to and post-surgery so I am very familiar with it. Also, most folks do not wait until they were as symptomatic as Prince to have the surgery. There are very few post-op problems and they would be evaluated especially for someone of Prince's stature.

Our hip patients go home the same day. It is not a difficult surgery.

This is why I scratch my head about the years of hip pain?

Thanks for sharing your professional expertise with us. Anyone who thinks Prince just took opioids for hip pain needs to read these words over slowly and carefully and think about them for a bit, IMO.

Bodhi, many of my elderly clients I work with them after the surgery, after they've returned home. As I've said, I have seen quite a few of my elderly clients still dealing with pain after hip replacement surgery. I do have some that have no complications from it, but I have others that continue to have problems. As with everything, it's a very individual thing. I can't say Prince continued to have problems, because I wasn't in his life. But I also can't say that he didn't continue to have problems either, because again, I wasn't in his life. She can share the stories of those successes she has seen, but to imply that it is true for every one that has that kind of surgery is not being honest. Hip replacement surgery is found to be effective 90 to 95% of the time, which means it is not effective 5 to 10% of the time. We have no way of knowing if Prince fell in that successful group or if he was in the 5 to 10% of those in which his surgery was not effective. I tend to think he was in the later group since it was reported he continued to have pain. Others would rather believe that he had no pain and was just using the pain pills because he was addicted. I would rather think of Prince as someone trying to deal with his symptoms in the best way possible, than to imagine him as just another drug addicted superstar. But that is just me.

PennyPurple said:

Mumio said:

I would and did try to but it wouldn't take for some reason. Maybe if Penny is still on she could do it? I saw that she'd done others so she might have another source to use.

I'll try but I can't seem to post anything from the Carver County files. I have better luck going to the NY Times article where they posted the files and it lets me copy and paste.

Penny, it's from the DEA files. And thank you for trying.

It won't let me paste it either. But it is there in the DEA report that 'Surgical History "None".

benni said:

Bodhitheblackdog said:

Thanks for sharing your professional expertise with us. Anyone who thinks Prince just took opioids for hip pain needs to read these words over slowly and carefully and think about them for a bit, IMO.

Bodhi, many of my elderly clients I work with them after the surgery, after they've returned home. As I've said, I have seen quite a few of my elderly clients still dealing with pain after hip replacement surgery. I do have some that have no complications from it, but I have others that continue to have problems. As with everything, it's a very individual thing. I can't say Prince continued to have problems, because I wasn't in his life. But I also can't say that he didn't continue to have problems either, because again, I wasn't in his life. She can share the stories of those successes she has seen, but to imply that it is true for every one that has that kind of surgery is not being honest. Hip replacement surgery is found to be effective 90 to 95% of the time, which means it is not effective 5 to 10% of the time. We have no way of knowing if Prince fell in that successful group or if he was in the 5 to 10% of those in which his surgery was not effective. I tend to think he was in the later group since it was reported he continued to have pain. Others would rather believe that he had no pain and was just using the pain pills because he was addicted. I would rather think of Prince as someone trying to deal with his symptoms in the best way possible, than to imagine him as just another drug addicted superstar. But that is just me.

I am trying to say that I think Prince had many alternatives to treat his pain other than heavy use of narcotics which lead to addiction;Surgery would be one example.There are so many options in this day and age and many don't carry a stigma. Of course there are rare complications with this surgery but he did not walk like one of those folks.He seemed to walking at a very brisk pace in that last photo. Folks with severe hip pain really hobble, so I feel that surgery was successful.

PennyPurple said:

It won't let me paste it either. But it is there in the DEA report that 'Surgical History "None".

And Medical History also says "None"

ETA: here's a link for anyone who wants to look https://assets.documentcl...-Files.pdf (pg 50 of the pdf or page 143 of the document)

[Edited 8/2/18 20:50pm]

PennyPurple said:

It won't let me paste it either. But it is there in the DEA report that 'Surgical History "None".

Penny, do you have a link at the very least? I had deleted all those links and stopped looking at it all. I just felt that it was too invasive into Prince's life and I just couldn't look at that stuff any more.

He probably did write "none" but his autopsy report stated he had a scar on his hip. (just one scar though--if I recall). So some kind of surgery was done.

benni said:

PennyPurple said:

It won't let me paste it either. But it is there in the DEA report that 'Surgical History "None".

Penny, do you have a link at the very least? I had deleted all those links and stopped looking at it all. I just felt that it was too invasive into Prince's life and I just couldn't look at that stuff any more.

benni said:

PennyPurple said:

It won't let me paste it either. But it is there in the DEA report that 'Surgical History "None".

Penny, do you have a link at the very least? I had deleted all those links and stopped looking at it all. I just felt that it was too invasive into Prince's life and I just couldn't look at that stuff any more.

https://assets.documentcl...-Files.pdf

Here you go Benni! The copys that they gave aren't very readable, very light and hard to decipher.

I think P just wanted to get out of there. Did you all see his signature..Damn, it was completely unreadable.

Mumio said:

PennyPurple said:

It won't let me paste it either. But it is there in the DEA report that 'Surgical History "None".

And Medical History also says "None"

SkipperLove said:

He probably did write "none" but his autopsy report stated he had a scar on his hip. (just one scar though--if I recall). So some kind of surgery was done.

Yes, he did have a scar and they found a statment from Mayo Clinic where he had some sort of surgery done.

benni said:

Bodhitheblackdog said:

Thanks for sharing your professional expertise with us. Anyone who thinks Prince just took opioids for hip pain needs to read these words over slowly and carefully and think about them for a bit, IMO.

Bodhi, many of my elderly clients I work with them after the surgery, after they've returned home. As I've said, I have seen quite a few of my elderly clients still dealing with pain after hip replacement surgery. I do have some that have no complications from it, but I have others that continue to have problems. As with everything, it's a very individual thing. I can't say Prince continued to have problems, because I wasn't in his life. But I also can't say that he didn't continue to have problems either, because again, I wasn't in his life. She can share the stories of those successes she has seen, but to imply that it is true for every one that has that kind of surgery is not being honest. Hip replacement surgery is found to be effective 90 to 95% of the time, which means it is not effective 5 to 10% of the time. We have no way of knowing if Prince fell in that successful group or if he was in the 5 to 10% of those in which his surgery was not effective. I tend to think he was in the later group since it was reported he continued to have pain. Others would rather believe that he had no pain and was just using the pain pills because he was addicted. I would rather think of Prince as someone trying to deal with his symptoms in the best way possible, than to imagine him as just another drug addicted superstar. But that is just me.

benni: Thank you for your gentle and rational amplification and reiteration of the stats. I stand corrected.

On the short autopsy report, it was also mentioned a 2nd scar near his lower right ankle.

SkipperLove said:

He probably did write "none" but his autopsy report stated he had a scar on his hip. (just one scar though--if I recall). So some kind of surgery was done.

benni said:

Penny, do you have a link at the very least? I had deleted all those links and stopped looking at it all. I just felt that it was too invasive into Prince's life and I just couldn't look at that stuff any more.

PennyPurple said:

benni said:

Penny, do you have a link at the very least? I had deleted all those links and stopped looking at it all. I just felt that it was too invasive into Prince's life and I just couldn't look at that stuff any more.

https://assets.documentcl...-Files.pdf

Here you go Benni! The copys that they gave aren't very readable, very light and hard to decipher.

Okay, one thing to keep in mind is that they often get a lot of that information upon admission. When Prince was taken to the ER he was not able to answer any of those questions, so they would have gotten the admitting information, including medical history or surgical history from Kirk or Judith. I doubt either of them would have given too much information on Prince, knowing how private he was, and they probably weren't thinking very clearly at that time either. I doubt seriously they would have gone back, after the crisis had passed, to get clarification on some of that information. They never have on me, any way. When I ruptured my spleen, my ex-husband gave them all of my admitting information, including medical history and previous surgeries. They never did go back and ask me anything about it. As the doctor's were working on me, they pulled my ex out to the business office to get all that information.

I think I've seen where Cat G said he actually broke his ankle.

NotACleverName said:

Francis77 said:

The lawsuit makes the family look bad, in my opinion. The hospital saved his life that night. Prince refused further treatment. Why they would sue the hospital, I can't imagine. It makes them look greedy. If anything they should sue the Sheriff's office who made available to the public such intimate, private photos of Prince's home and of him, dead on the floor. Sue them!

The family cannot sue the LE agencie/s that investigated Prince's death. These criminal investigation docs/info were released to the public based on some law or act already in place. I'm not exactly sure what that is...maybe ISLIJAG can help clarify?

The family would need to file a civil lawsuit.

In civil lawsuits the police have "qualified immunity"

I just want to say....this thread has gone haywire.

Sorry wrong spot... meant to post on pain thread. Damn, I wish I could detele. Sorry, rhis is the 3rd time I have done this in a day. Sorry about font but I cam't get it big again for some reason/

[Edited 8/2/18 21:50pm]

SkipperLove said:

According to Sheila, he was on pills during the 2011 tour. Yes, the surgery was successful. But this was some high impact dancing.

Link to article about recommended exercises after hip surgery. It says low impact...I wouldn't call what prince was doing low impact or easy on the hips. How could he do it without some assistance?

https://www.arthritis-hea...y-recovery..on the pain thread, (which I will remain on from this point on while discussing pain.), I posted 4 different dance clips on 2011.

Camileyun said:

SkipperLove said:

He danced more in 2011 Welcome to America Tour than he did many years prior.. Not sure what that indicates, but he went from just standing in 2009 during performances to 2 minute dance solos with pop-n-lock hip girations in 2011, eventually back to limited motion, and finally mostly the piano. Could hip pain be masked by the drugs he was already on?

It indicates to me that his hip surgery was successful and he had a new lease on life.

[Edited 8/2/18 22:17pm]

SkipperLove said:

Who of the Paisley Park people is related to the County Inn & Suites at 591 West 78th street, Chanhassen, MN?

.

See https://kstp.com/news/dea...M.facebook for backgrounds.

Camileyun said:

Bodhitheblackdog said:

paulludvig said:

udo said:

Who of the Paisley Park people is related to the County Inn & Suites at 591 West 78th street, Chanhassen, MN?

.

See https://kstp.com/news/dea...M.facebook for backgrounds.

That's the place where Meron had a reserved room all the time and where Judith Hill stayed also.