CooperC62057 said:

herb4 said:

Wait...are you calling ME an asshole? If so, guilty as charged on occassion. But I haven't been banned.

Oh, wait. No. I got you now. I think.

I'd say the forums are better overall that she's gone. She dominated every discussion, set every tone for every thread and was like a person at a party that wouldn't shut the fuck up no matter what the topic or whether she knew the knew the first thing about it. I THOUGHT the forums seemed less idiotic, spastic, obnoxious and slightly more chill but I couldn't put my finger on it, but now it makes sense. And to whoever said "don't pick on someone on someone who's not here to defend herself"...

Jesus Christ.

She damn near made a fucking CAREER out of posting insufferable noise 24/7 and had constant opportunies to "defend" herself from the deserved blowback she recieved. A lot of which was from from me. Like, how much of an obnoxious shitposter and how large does the signal to noise have to get before you get BANNED from this fucking place? Assuming that's what happened. Maybe I'll find out since I talk a lot of shit. I wouldn't worry about her. She can probably find a job in the Trump cabinet.

Moving on...

Prince grew addicted to painkillers over time, may or may not have had a liver problem that affected his appearance and health towards the end (I buy this theory) , and accidentally overdosed on some counterfeit pills that he didn't know were "laced" or "hot" and that he likely procured through nefarious means; probably througha trusted friend. It wasn't his fault and nobody intentionally murdered him.

He refused help and was left alone because that's how Prince fucking was and what he wanted. He always made his own rules and if you didn't follow them you were right out of his Paisley Planet. Period. He wasn't a "junkie" in any traditional or binary sense and, in all likelihood, his addiction grew very gradually over time. Doesn't make him weak, pathetic, a hypocrite, a loser or tarnish his legacy ONE BIT, no matter what your personal feelings about drug usage or anecdotal evidence to their obvious drawbacks. He accomplished more in 5 years than I have in my enitre lifetime and, IMO, shame on anyone who has to do mental backflips, self rationalize and seek out made up mysteries, conspiracies and "unanswered questions!!!" to make his death fit their predetermined worldview of who is and who is not a "hero" or a "loser" or whatever it is you think "righteous people" do. Or should do.

He lived human and he died human. Like we all do. Some of you folks here need to check yourself and realize he was just a man.

This. Before the ME released the Fentanyl overdose, I prayed that the cause of death would not come back as an opioid overdose and was crushed when it did. Having lived with and through the experience of a family member with an opioid addiction (who is now 3 years into recovery), I’ve seen first hand the devastation and effects of opioid addiction on the substance abuser and those close to them and I can tell you it is extremely difficult for everyone involved. I was devastated because in my mind, Prince was not just a “man” ..... he was my idol, and idols can do no wrong - they are perfect. So, slowly, reality set in. Some will disagree, but reading Mayte’s book humanized Prince for me - in my world I had fallen for all of the mystery he had created around himself and reading her story helped to lift that veil and bring me to the reality that he was a person just like any of us. That being said, early on I posted many times about addiction and became intimidated by LR’s constant badgering to the point that I stopped engaging in conversation here. I never left though, and know all of you by your “user names” and thoroughly enjoy reading the threads and watching the interaction. I just want to say that in my experience of dealing with the family member and through that, interacting with many other addicts, depression is extremely common. Look, these are good people who got caught up in something that they never intended. They didn’t wake up and think that today they are going to become an addict. Many begin this journey from physical pain of some degree. And, I believe that Prince was “old school” and in his mind, was not using “drugs” but using “medication”. Unfortunately, opioids don’t allow you to just stop and therein lies the “addiction”. Opioids cause thought processes to change - ask any addict in recovery and they will tell you stories of things they can’t recall clearly (even if they were functional), stories of how their reasoning was not always cognitive, how their pain actually increased and how LONG it took them to stand up and say I am an addict. Because in their mind, they are not. And those around them. Let me tell you, they go through it. Crazy, unexplainable behaviors which, especially if you have no hard evidence, leave you questioning if it’s your imagination gone wild because this is not “drug use” like you’ve been conditioned to expect. There is no “high off your ass” as LR used to describe it. It’s subtle and deceiving. They can appear totally normal. It’s in the unusual behavior and thought processes. Many dealing with this convince themselves that it can’t be drug related, that it must be a behavioral disorder like anxiety, depression, etc. My family member had me convinced he was bipolar. And for many they become enablers because they are trying to help and out of love. Others because they are in denial. I will say though, based on the photos and inventory of items found in Princes personal space, all the signs were there of his addiction and someone absolutely KNEW the truth. Whether they were in denial in their own minds, I cannot say and why they hadn’t reached the point where reality stepped in and they said no more will probably never be known. They did him no favors and assisted in his death. I look at the photos of Prince in his last months and can see it - that, is addiction. He had lost weight, his fro was unkempt, his makeup was sloppy, the clothes were somber and simple. I question if the man was bathing regularly - because, to be frank, personal hygeiene becomes unimportant. Honestly take a look at him - this was a man who was impeccable over his hair, make-up and style his entire life. And for the depression, yes, I’m sure he was. I believe when associates made the statements about the “whole story” it was in reference to something that may have happened in his personal life that we are not privy to. Who knows what that may be - Prince was coming into an age of reflection where people his age were passing away and you begin to look back as much as you look forward. It is a humbling time, and not all memories leave you feeling good about yourself. Combine that with his own realization of his addiction, although he probably denied it to others - those are some heavy realizations. I also just want to say that the ER doctor asked the question if he wanted to kill himself because a statement had been made, I believe by Judith, about depression. Doctors will routinely ask that question. If he had said yes, they would have held him involuntarily. If he had ever overdosed previously, he would have known that and would have said no because he was aware of that possibility. My family member announced to the doctor in ER that he wanted to kill himself and was immediately admitted to a facility after discharge from the ER. Sorry for the long post, just releasing my thoughts. Prince will still be my favorite artist of all time, I will remember the music; the performances and the entertainment but his passing will always be a reminder of the pain and sorrow of addiction and the reality of the end result.

Thank you from the bottom of my heart for this emotionally generous, on point, revealing and complex overview...I have tears in my eyes. This brilliant post could serve for all time as a summation and closure for what he probably was going through. I too have deep love for someone struggling with addiction...and you spoke to my personal feelings and experiences with clarity and depth. You have touched a place in my own pain re this issue that no one has been able to. Deepest appreciation.

I have been away for a few days and wanted to clarify my sentiments. I do in fact, feel Prince had a serious addiction to opiates. This may have been an intermittent issue for him for many years. In my opinion, there is no shame in this. He had so little support and love from his family as a child and young adult and was still able to lead an extraordinary life. I think one of his greatests traits was his courage. His cousin Chazz said in one of his early interviews, he was concerned that Prince was out there on his own. How stressful it must have been to "cross-over" to a larger audience, to play in massive stadiums in his early to mid-20's, to continually open himself to critiques both from critics and fans, to deal with the vississitudes of fame etc., I think the opiates offered comfort and relief both emotionally and physically.

I have no "horse in this race" as to how he died. I personally think he had a serious addiction as well as an underlying health "issue".( There was a profile photo of Prince wearing his Prince cap, sitting on his piano bench during one of his P&M tours. He was smiling but alarmingly skeletal. It looked like he was missing one of his molars as well.) That is the photo which solidified my "take" on his condition.

I have read the investigative results from start to finish and also know that we have been given superficial information re: the autopsy results.

I would just like to gently suggest that we are open to the idea that he was dealing with something more difficult than addiction alone. I see this stance as a sign of respect for a man who was stoic and private and would never have shared his vulnerabilties with us.

IMHO we need to be patient as the truth comes out in dribs and drabs, much like panning for gold; there will be little nuggets of information that feel "true" over time. And,I would not look to the family for the truth.

We are all frustrated and craving closure and as a reult I am concerned we are coming to early conclusions. I seem to have a need to understand the man in his entirety and do not feel I am there yet.

I agree with you. Well said.

Bodhitheblackdog said:

CooperC62057 said:

herb4 said: This. Before the ME released the Fentanyl overdose, I prayed that the cause of death would not come back as an opioid overdose and was crushed when it did. Having lived with and through the experience of a family member with an opioid addiction (who is now 3 years into recovery), I’ve seen first hand the devastation and effects of opioid addiction on the substance abuser and those close to them and I can tell you it is extremely difficult for everyone involved. I was devastated because in my mind, Prince was not just a “man” ..... he was my idol, and idols can do no wrong - they are perfect. So, slowly, reality set in. Some will disagree, but reading Mayte’s book humanized Prince for me - in my world I had fallen for all of the mystery he had created around himself and reading her story helped to lift that veil and bring me to the reality that he was a person just like any of us. That being said, early on I posted many times about addiction and became intimidated by LR’s constant badgering to the point that I stopped engaging in conversation here. I never left though, and know all of you by your “user names” and thoroughly enjoy reading the threads and watching the interaction. I just want to say that in my experience of dealing with the family member and through that, interacting with many other addicts, depression is extremely common. Look, these are good people who got caught up in something that they never intended. They didn’t wake up and think that today they are going to become an addict. Many begin this journey from physical pain of some degree. And, I believe that Prince was “old school” and in his mind, was not using “drugs” but using “medication”. Unfortunately, opioids don’t allow you to just stop and therein lies the “addiction”. Opioids cause thought processes to change - ask any addict in recovery and they will tell you stories of things they can’t recall clearly (even if they were functional), stories of how their reasoning was not always cognitive, how their pain actually increased and how LONG it took them to stand up and say I am an addict. Because in their mind, they are not. And those around them. Let me tell you, they go through it. Crazy, unexplainable behaviors which, especially if you have no hard evidence, leave you questioning if it’s your imagination gone wild because this is not “drug use” like you’ve been conditioned to expect. There is no “high off your ass” as LR used to describe it. It’s subtle and deceiving. They can appear totally normal. It’s in the unusual behavior and thought processes. Many dealing with this convince themselves that it can’t be drug related, that it must be a behavioral disorder like anxiety, depression, etc. My family member had me convinced he was bipolar. And for many they become enablers because they are trying to help and out of love. Others because they are in denial. I will say though, based on the photos and inventory of items found in Princes personal space, all the signs were there of his addiction and someone absolutely KNEW the truth. Whether they were in denial in their own minds, I cannot say and why they hadn’t reached the point where reality stepped in and they said no more will probably never be known. They did him no favors and assisted in his death. I look at the photos of Prince in his last months and can see it - that, is addiction. He had lost weight, his fro was unkempt, his makeup was sloppy, the clothes were somber and simple. I question if the man was bathing regularly - because, to be frank, personal hygeiene becomes unimportant. Honestly take a look at him - this was a man who was impeccable over his hair, make-up and style his entire life. And for the depression, yes, I’m sure he was. I believe when associates made the statements about the “whole story” it was in reference to something that may have happened in his personal life that we are not privy to. Who knows what that may be - Prince was coming into an age of reflection where people his age were passing away and you begin to look back as much as you look forward. It is a humbling time, and not all memories leave you feeling good about yourself. Combine that with his own realization of his addiction, although he probably denied it to others - those are some heavy realizations. I also just want to say that the ER doctor asked the question if he wanted to kill himself because a statement had been made, I believe by Judith, about depression. Doctors will routinely ask that question. If he had said yes, they would have held him involuntarily. If he had ever overdosed previously, he would have known that and would have said no because he was aware of that possibility. My family member announced to the doctor in ER that he wanted to kill himself and was immediately admitted to a facility after discharge from the ER. Sorry for the long post, just releasing my thoughts. Prince will still be my favorite artist of all time, I will remember the music; the performances and the entertainment but his passing will always be a reminder of the pain and sorrow of addiction and the reality of the end result.

Thank you from the bottom of my heart for this emotionally generous, on point, revealing and complex overview...I have tears in my eyes. This brilliant post could serve for all time as a summation and closure for what he probably was going through. I too have deep love for someone struggling with addiction...and you spoke to my personal feelings and experiences with clarity and depth. You have touched a place in my own pain re this issue that no one has been able to. Deepest appreciation.

Would like to echo the deep appreciation. Your writing is so thoughtful and full of insights. Thanks, too, to others who have shared their experience as people affected by illness, as musicians, etc., etc.

peggyon said:

I have been away for a few days and wanted to clarify my sentiments. I do in fact, feel Prince had a serious addiction to opiates. This may have been an intermittent issue for him for many years. In my opinion, there is no shame in this. He had so little support and love from his family as a child and young adult and was still able to lead an extraordinary life. I think one of his greatests traits was his courage. His cousin Chazz said in one of his early interviews, he was concerned that Prince was out there on his own. How stressful it must have been to "cross-over" to a larger audience, to play in massive stadiums in his early to mid-20's, to continually open himself to critiques both from critics and fans, to deal with the vississitudes of fame etc., I think the opiates offered comfort and relief both emotionally and physically.

I have no "horse in this race" as to how he died. I personally think he had a serious addiction as well as an underlying health "issue".( There was a profile photo of Prince wearing his Prince cap, sitting on his piano bench during one of his P&M tours. He was smiling but alarmingly skeletal. It looked like he was missing one of his molars as well.) That is the photo which solidified my "take" on his condition.

I have read the investigative results from start to finish and also know that we have been given superficial information re: the autopsy results.

I would just like to gently suggest that we are open to the idea that he was dealing with something more difficult than addiction alone. I see this stance as a sign of respect for a man who was stoic and private and would never have shared his vulnerabilties with us.

IMHO we need to be patient as the truth comes out in dribs and drabs, much like panning for gold; there will be little nuggets of information that feel "true" over time. And,I would not look to the family for the truth.

We are all frustrated and craving closure and as a reult I am concerned we are coming to early conclusions. I seem to have a need to understand the man in his entirety and do not feel I am there yet.

It's always possible that a person can have multiple serious conditions, especially as we get older. Also, health conditions can affect the potential for other health conditions. For example, as I mentioned before, addiction makes diagnosis with other conditions more likely, and it can affect the course and treatment of other conditions. Vice versa to all that, as well. I noted how I think there are comments in document interviews that might lead doctors to investigate the possibility of depression diagnosis.

People often have multiple conditions with varying degrees of seriousness. I do think it's important to consider the information in the investigation documents re: descriptions of medical reports and other things that may shed light.

I think it's possible that Prince had another serious condition. Also, I think it's worth asking something. If the story went that a person died from a different serious medical condition, like cancer or a heart attack, would people find the story so unsatisfactory? Would they feel as much of a need for a larger story, for information about other medical conditions the person may have had? Why or why not?

Peggyon, I really appreciate your way with words, and I honestly don't want to be difficult. I, myself, am usually curious about larger stories. Very likely more so than you.I often want to know them. For better or worse, I'm "nosy." : ) I'm just asking if the story were different, would there be the same degree of dissatisfaction and longing for more?

[Edited 5/31/18 9:11am]

[Edited 5/31/18 9:20am]

[Edited 5/31/18 9:33am]

[Edited 5/31/18 9:40am]

[Edited 5/31/18 10:00am]

herb4 said:

Mumio said:

Don't be such a jealous harpy over laurarichardson. If you had one ounce of integrity you wouldn't be so desperate to pick on someone who is no longer on the site to defend herself.

[Edited 5/30/18 10:15am]

Why is she no longer on the site? It takes an awful lot of repeated assholishness to get banned around here.

no, it don't take much which is why i was really surprised how she lasted so long. I've been banned twice, both times defending musical icons and what i said wasn't that bad. I only came back because the man died, if he was still alive, i'd only come here maybe once a week and even then, only to see what Prince might be up to. I'm a longer time member of a boxing board, almost everyone there for as long as I has been banned, and I've never had a single problem. Different types of folks I guess.

These are just my intuitions.

Just to play Devil's Advocate: Why are so many adamantly opposed to the suggestion of an underlying health issue? I feel it is very emotionally-laden here.

funk, aren't you one of the ones who claim he had a serious illness too? not wanting to cause you any problems here, just reminding you what you said. I'm not disagreeing with what you wrote though. The major revelation of this thread recently was that we "almost lost him in 2010-11", that's a new one that was never heard on here pre-death, that i'm aware of. How they hush some of this stuff up is amazing, especially with tmz and all the rodents scurrying around celebs.

Krystalkisses said:

funksterr said:

I don't think that is necessarily the wrong way of looking at it, but there is no way he didn't have pain issues too. I also think the depression is rooted in some other things and control is rooted in all of that. With that said, it 's still not ven as simple as just that, from what I've, ahem, heard over the years.

I've been, in the fan community forever, since PML, since AOL, etc. I talked to um, somebody (wink) about these issues, to the point that... IDK, I just felt he was handling all of it, like it was a joke and for a very long time. There were some people in the know, on the inside (shit a bunch of them on them BANISHED ONES too who knew what was up) back then that really wanted the best for him, but by the time he passed.... all that remained were, well JH's statement to investigators kind of speaks for itself no? 'Aye, NO BLOODTEST mane'. I hated every one of them at the time he was still alive, for that type of shit. I said before it worked similar online: he say 'the sky is red' and they say 'the sky is red', he say 'up is down' and they say 'up been down muffaka don't you know??" NPG baby! 'Yeah people who used to be down with the npg, but now when they come around to the concerts, they stand around in the back, because they know what they said' Un huh, and cut to him OD'D laying dead by the elevator. Famous last words. Another one: I'd like to thank everyone for their concern, but I've got it all under contro--- yadayadaydada 'wiff an accurate understanding of God's lllllaaaawwwww.... Reva-la-tion.

The cover up been going on. I think the biggest concern people had on the inside was having to go, SELL INSURANCE, or something if they got on Prince bad side. And that's sad, because all they really had to do the week before he passed was sound the alarm online, and he would have been alright, imo. We mighta patched him up a time or two before in the past 'You da greatest mane, the world needs you'. It was never that hard. Honestly the magic word was L.O.V.E. 'We love you' 'Those who love me without condition, this is MY WEALTH/ All understand and all stand under this affirmation now/By the power invested in me BY GOD/All negativity bows/All negativity bows'... That's not rooted in TAFKAP is it? It's a factor in why I knew what was up in those FINAL YEARS. What they had that we didn't is IRREFUTABLE PROOF of an OD that he couldn't spin his way out of. He had to have thought it was fukked up that he found himself right back where he started after the drama of the plane incident: trapped in his own secrecy and web of: Aye, get freeky, let ya head bob! wwhhho you gonna blame when 'nem spyders get next to you'.

Someday I will talk about it. I'm still thinking it through though, because it's all truly his own fault, and I don't really want to blame anybod else. Maybe that one piece of chickn mf. 'It all MAKES SENSE'. Did ir really 'do? Imean basicaly The G.O.A.T, err, The Pope just OD'd ('right in front of yo' azz!/ she helped me once again), but it all makes SO MUCH sense that you ahhh fugg it ('a loop there's a loop, there's a loop, uhn)

Wow. Thank you for all that. The picture is becoming so much more clear. Hopefully one day everyone can be truthful and stop the smoke and mirror show and all of this can be utilized to help others or prevent others from making the same mistakes. Vanity and Pride are sins for a reason. [Edited 5/30/18 10:54am]

what never made sense to LR or I was that he kept the mask from slipping well enough that most of us knew nothing about the drug abuse, that's not easy to do, it just isn't. Elvis didn't do it, MJ didn't do , no one did it but Prince somehow did outside of the one rumour in 2011, which i took seriously at the time because I knew it was possible, I heard nothing. Maybe the barring all concert footage, pics and shit was so people couldn't see any possible signs, still, people should have seen more, we all should have really. It doesn't make that much sense yet. And yes, we've all been around this a million times now. Some of the folks close to him say they saw nothing, others say they are lying, we'll be putting it together for a very long time. Hell, as I mentioned, Priscilla just came out and said Elvis committed suicide, it's a blatant lie for attention, so "the truth" is not such an easy thing to get.

fortuneandserendipity said:

Mumio said:

Don't be such a jealous harpy over laurarichardson. If you had one ounce of integrity you wouldn't be so desperate to pick on someone who is no longer on the site to defend herself. But that's how cowards like yourself always behave so no surprise there. Nothing like a good verbal beat-down from a woman like laura, is there? I know it provided plenty of amusement for many here. It's pretty clear she isn't missing you or the others who are turning this forum into a hater's paradise.

[Edited 5/30/18 10:15am]

But she was the resident drug expert, remember? She was so sure no such person could function on a high level because she's a scholar on the subject. And you and others agreed with her. When actually the problem you've both got is practically ZERO emotional intelligence. Ask yourself why you consider me, bod, herb and others, haters? You would probably benefit from some learned buddhist sayings, ya know to learn more about life.

Really you have to be dense to think we're here because we hate Prince; that we so hate the fact his music and live performances have bettered our lives, that we've got nothing better to do with our time? Go and bother Bart van whatever his name is if you're attracted to that energy.

fortuneandserendipity said:

ThatWhiteDude said:

If you mean Da Vinci, he was 67

You're right. I read somewhere he was 57. Damn. But when you look at this diagram maybe 57 for a musician isn't so bad

...

there was some 'average age of death" for rock musicians that i saw, it was 57.

Astasheiks said:

Bodhitheblackdog said:

OMG, Please tell me we're not in Woo Woo Land again...

"On April 14, 2016, while flying back to Minnesota from a concert in Atlanta, investigators think Prince suffered an opioid overdose after unwittingly taking a counterfeit Vicodin pill that was laced with fentanyl. He was resuscitated with Narcan at an airport in Illinois, Metz said."

Prince Rogers Nelson died at his estate in Chanhassen, Minn., on April 21, 2016, after unknowingly taking a counterfeit Vicodin pill that actually contained the far more potent opioid fentanyl, Carver County Atty. Mark Metz said at a televised news conference, marking the end of a two-year investigation into Prince's death.

"Prince thought he was taking Vicodin and not fentanyl," Metz said, saying the fentanyl-laced pills Prince took were "an exact imitation" of Vicodin pills. Metz said officials had found no evidence of a "sinister motive" or "intent" to kill Prince.

http://www.latimes.com/nation/la-na-prince-criminal-charges-20180419-story.html

Now where did these pills come from??? Where ever those pills came from, I'm saying its possible that that person or other people involved with that person were hoping P would OD!!!

it's possible, (as i said, it's the least possible scenario but is possible) I hope they don't chew you out too bad for saying it. When you think about it, people do murder people, i could see someone baiting the man, knowing how strung out he was and leaving all that temptation around him knowing the result. It's like leaving oreo cookies around me and expecting there to be any left the next day.

I realize that Herbie, I do, Bruce Lee was told not to eat cannabis because of an allergic reaction, so what does he do? He goes and eats it about a month and a half later and dies. It just makes you question logic, but addicts don't go by logic I guess. It's also hard to conjure how men who overcome, who make a life of overcoming can be so stupid and die so needlessly and foolishly. that never fits. never. I see homeless people in my city in the same span of time I've known of Prince and been a fan and they are still wandering around begging change, those kinds of things don't make sense but it's life and not everything comes in neat tidy packages that we like.

herb4 said:

Bodhitheblackdog said:

[Snip - luv4u]

Wait...are you calling ME an asshole? If so, guilty as charged on occassion. But I haven't been banned.

Oh, wait. No. I got you now. I think.

I'd say the forums are better overall that she's gone. She dominated every discussion, set every tone for every thread and was like a person at a party that wouldn't shut the fuck up no matter what the topic or whether she knew the knew the first thing about it. I THOUGHT the forums seemed less idiotic, spastic, obnoxious and slightly more chill but I couldn't put my finger on it, but now it makes sense. And to whoever said "don't pick on someone on someone who's not here to defend herself"...

Jesus Christ.

She damn near made a fucking CAREER out of posting insufferable noise 24/7 and had constant opportunies to "defend" herself from the deserved blowback she recieved. A lot of which was from from me. Like, how much of an obnoxious shitposter and how large does the signal to noise have to get before you get BANNED from this fucking place? Assuming that's what happened. Maybe I'll find out since I talk a lot of shit. I wouldn't worry about her. She can probably find a job in the Trump cabinet.

Moving on...

Prince grew addicted to painkillers over time, may or may not have had a liver problem that affected his appearance and health towards the end (I buy this theory) , and accidentally overdosed on some counterfeit pills that he didn't know were "laced" or "hot" and that he likely procured through nefarious means; probably througha trusted friend. It wasn't his fault and nobody intentionally murdered him.

He refused help and was left alone because that's how Prince fucking was and what he wanted. He always made his own rules and if you didn't follow them you were right out of his Paisley Planet. Period. He wasn't a "junkie" in any traditional or binary sense and, in all likelihood, his addiction grew very gradually over time. Doesn't make him weak, pathetic, a hypocrite, a loser or tarnish his legacy ONE BIT, no matter what your personal feelings about drug usage or anecdotal evidence to their obvious drawbacks. He accomplished more in 5 years than I have in my enitre lifetime and, IMO, shame on anyone who has to do mental backflips, self rationalize and seek out made up mysteries, conspiracies and "unanswered questions!!!" to make his death fit their predetermined worldview of who is and who is not a "hero" or a "loser" or whatever it is you think "righteous people" do. Or should do.

He lived human and he died human. Like we all do. Some of you folks here need to check yourself and realize he was just a man.

Laura used to really get on my nerves years ago, you couldn't say anything honestly critical about P without her rushing to his defense. But I learned to like her and respect her and don't we all wish we had a ride or die motherfucker in our lives? I don't and I'm smart enough to know it. Those kinds are rare, good bad or indifferent.

Bodhitheblackdog said:

herb4 said:

Wait...are you calling ME an asshole? If so, guilty as charged on occassion. But I haven't been banned.

Oh, wait. No. I got you now. I think.

I'd say the forums are better overall that she's gone. She dominated every discussion, set every tone for every thread and was like a person at a party that wouldn't shut the fuck up no matter what the topic or whether she knew the knew the first thing about it. I THOUGHT the forums seemed less idiotic, spastic, obnoxious and slightly more chill but I couldn't put my finger on it, but now it makes sense. And to whoever said "don't pick on someone on someone who's not here to defend herself"...

Jesus Christ.

She damn near made a fucking CAREER out of posting insufferable noise 24/7 and had constant opportunies to "defend" herself from the deserved blowback she recieved. A lot of which was from from me. Like, how much of an obnoxious shitposter and how large does the signal to noise have to get before you get BANNED from this fucking place? Assuming that's what happened. Maybe I'll find out since I talk a lot of shit. I wouldn't worry about her. She can probably find a job in the Trump cabinet.

Moving on...

Prince grew addicted to painkillers over time, may or may not have had a liver problem that affected his appearance and health towards the end (I buy this theory) , and accidentally overdosed on some counterfeit pills that he didn't know were "laced" or "hot" and that he likely procured through nefarious means; probably througha trusted friend. It wasn't his fault and nobody intentionally murdered him.

He refused help and was left alone because that's how Prince fucking was and what he wanted. He always made his own rules and if you didn't follow them you were right out of his Paisley Planet. Period. He wasn't a "junkie" in any traditional or binary sense and, in all likelihood, his addiction grew very gradually over time. Doesn't make him weak, pathetic, a hypocrite, a loser or tarnish his legacy ONE BIT, no matter what your personal feelings about drug usage or anecdotal evidence to their obvious drawbacks. He accomplished more in 5 years than I have in my enitre lifetime and, IMO, shame on anyone who has to do mental backflips, self rationalize and seek out made up mysteries, conspiracies and "unanswered questions!!!" to make his death fit their predetermined worldview of who is and who is not a "hero" or a "loser" or whatever it is you think "righteous people" do. Or should do.

He lived human and he died human. Like we all do. Some of you folks here need to check yourself and realize he was just a man.

GREAT comments re LR and as for the last bolded, once upon a time you said

”Some of these loons think Prince never had to wipe himself because all he ever shat was incense and rainbows.”

I am VERY jealous I didn't write such a kick ass sentence!

Missed you!!!

[Edited 5/30/18 15:06pm]

peggyon said:

These are just my intuitions.

Just to play Devil's Advocate: Why are so many adamantly opposed to the suggestion of an underlying health issue? I feel it is very emotionally-laden here.

Thanks for taking what I said in such a good spirit. : )


I think P may well have had health issues in addition to his addiction.

I have a family member who was bipolar and told years ago, by AA, to go off his lithium so he could be drug free. Very bad advice. When you are experiencing a health problem, there can be a need to consider your big picture, for sure. Sometimes, as in this case, in defiance of revered organizations. As for which condition is underlying, it's often not possible to say. Most important thing is, of course, to get appropriate help for both.

I agree that there are strong reactions here. I guess that led me to wondering about how things might be awry in terms of perception of medical conditions, and if a sense of that might underlie some of the strong reactions.

To that thought, it's probably more common than not for people, upon learning of a person's death, to not have anywhere near full knowledge of that person's medical/health information. As people age, they are more and more likely to have multiple conditions, sometimes serious.

I, for one, am taken aback by the idea that a story of an addiciton-related death can generate relatively more longing for a larger picture of a person's health, whereas stories attributing death to heart attack or cancer generate relatively more acceptance of limited information, accompanied by statements of compassion and respect. But maybe that idea isn't true.

Is it? I don't know.

[Edited 5/31/18 10:50am]

[Edited 5/31/18 10:51am]

peggyon said:

These are just my intuitions.

Just to play Devil's Advocate: Why are so many adamantly opposed to the suggestion of an underlying health issue? I feel it is very emotionally-laden here.

it's group think, be careful they'll jump your bones peggy.

peggyon said:

These are just my intuitions.

Just to play Devil's Advocate: Why are so many adamantly opposed to the suggestion of an underlying health issue? I feel it is very emotionally-laden here.

Because there is nothing in the investigation files that suggests it.

MMJas said:

MMJas said:

peggyon said:

These are just my intuitions.

Just to play Devil's Advocate: Why are so many adamantly opposed to the suggestion of an underlying health issue? I feel it is very emotionally-laden here.

Because there is nothing in the investigation files that suggests it.

Because, IMO, trying to make it real that he died of something other than addiction seems like more denial of the obvious and an almost passive-aggressive way of labeling him BAD bc he could not.stop.taking.drugs...for whatever reason. Who knows how many precious lives could be saved if the fam and estate went big and opened treatment and recovery centers in his name. Talk about a crowning legacy.

Strawberrylova123 said:

PeteSilas said:

peggyon said:

These are just my intuitions.

Just to play Devil's Advocate: Why are so many adamantly opposed to the suggestion of an underlying health issue? I feel it is very emotionally-laden here.

it's group think, be careful they'll jump your bones peggy.

i told you peggy, they'll carve you up like a thanksgiving turkey.

PeteSilas said:

fortuneandserendipity said:

You're right. I read somewhere he was 57. Damn. But when you look at this diagram maybe 57 for a musician isn't so bad

...

there was some 'average age of death" for rock musicians that i saw, it was 57.

They're supposed to suffer more anxiety, depression issues than average. Not such a stretch to say it has to do with the pressure of performing.

fortuneandserendipity said:

MMJas said:

peggyon said:

These are just my intuitions.

Just to play Devil's Advocate: Why are so many adamantly opposed to the suggestion of an underlying health issue? I feel it is very emotionally-laden here.

Because there is nothing in the investigation files that suggests it.

Yep, nothing at all.

PennyPurple said:

Strawberrylova123 said:

PennyPurple said:

Yep, nothing at all.

I was shocked to see that prince blood pressure was very high in his vital shit from dr S

I didn't think it was very high, like it was out of control or something.

PeteSilas said:

disch said:

I think bring really famous is detrimental to your health. Humans are social animals and need social connections and community and fame really makes those social connections very hard. - Prince apparently spent a lot of time online and I wonder if one reason is because he could interact as an equal with others when he was anonymous. It’s a sad thing to think about that he might not have been getting enough if that primal human connection in his “real life.” fortuneandserendipity said:

They're supposed to suffer more anxiety, depression issues than average. Not such a stretch to say it has to do with the pressure of performing.

I scan my computer looking 4 a site
Somebody 2 talk 2, funny and bright (Oh)
I scan my computer looking 4 a site
Make believe it's a better world, a better life (A better life)

I got no mail, my computer

I told them I don't wanna see a doctor unless he's lonely 2
Every Sunday night, instead of doing what I usually do I..

Emancipation/ My Computer

[Edited 5/31/18 13:32pm]

PennyPurple said:

disch said:

I think bring really famous is detrimental to your health. Humans are social animals and need social connections and community and fame really makes those social connections very hard. - Prince apparently spent a lot of time online and I wonder if one reason is because he could interact as an equal with others when he was anonymous. It’s a sad thing to think about that he might not have been getting enough if that primal human connection in his “real life.” fortuneandserendipity said:

They're supposed to suffer more anxiety, depression issues than average. Not such a stretch to say it has to do with the pressure of performing.

I never would have thought P bothered with this site, but like you say he was probably lonelier than people imagine. Hearsay indicates he was here quite a lot. He even appeared on one of Tame's infamous 'poem' (ode to Prince) threads. haha