PeteSilas said:

TrcikyChristopher said:

I've shared everything I am able to share without compromising my multiple sources. I'm only hoping that the charade ends soon. It's getting ridiculous at this point. 10 threads deep and 2 years in, and we're here discussing something that could easily be put to rest by a press release or interview. It's really that simple.

Instead, we're just unnecessarily tiptoeing around shit while arguing about half-assed "new" releases because they're too busy arguing among themselves.

It's a damned shame.

Well, i do have hope that prince wasn't JUST a drug addict, I really do hope if he had to die, it was really something serious that he couldn't have avoided. Out of all the guys who were my heroes, there were a couple i couldn't see ever falling prey to drugs, Prince was one, Bruce Lee is another, both were done in by drugs along with the rest. Prince and Bruce were like supermen to me, that's a lot to expect out of anyone but they set that bar themselves. I do hope Prince had cancer or something and that it comes out soon.

Totally could have been avoided or staved off.

Pete , people are living longer with cancer now that we have stem cells , and immunotherapy ...how would u feel if he did have cancer but refused treatment?

80tomato said:

Pete , people are living longer with cancer now that we have stem cells , and immunotherapy ...how would u feel if he did have cancer but refused treatment?

kidnap him and waterboard him until he changed his mind.

what makes you so sure? did he have some condition like MS or something? If he had cancer, death is always a possiblility.

TrcikyChristopher said:

PeteSilas said:

Well, i do have hope that prince wasn't JUST a drug addict, I really do hope if he had to die, it was really something serious that he couldn't have avoided. Out of all the guys who were my heroes, there were a couple i couldn't see ever falling prey to drugs, Prince was one, Bruce Lee is another, both were done in by drugs along with the rest. Prince and Bruce were like supermen to me, that's a lot to expect out of anyone but they set that bar themselves. I do hope Prince had cancer or something and that it comes out soon.

Totally could have been avoided or staved off.

PeteSilas said:

what makes you so sure? did he have some condition like MS or something? If he had cancer, death is always a possiblility.

TrcikyChristopher said:

Totally could have been avoided or staved off.

Death from any illness is always a possibility but can easily turn into just a probability under the right circumstances and proper influences.

PeteSilas said:

what makes you so sure? did he have some condition like MS or something? If he had cancer, death is always a possiblility.

TrcikyChristopher said:

Totally could have been avoided or staved off.

Boy, here we go again. It almost seems it's a requirement of Prince fandom that one adopts certain beliefs/behaviors like paranoia, secrecy, smug know-it-all-ness, being in the 'inner circle', control ('I know what really happened and you don't naa naa naa.') manipulation ('I know what really happened...' etc.)...it's exhausting...

TrcikyChristopher said:

PeteSilas said:

what makes you so sure? did he have some condition like MS or something? If he had cancer, death is always a possiblility.

Death from any illness is always a possibility but can easily turn into just a probability under the right circumstances and proper influences.

Wowie-Zowie...JUST LIKE LIFE!!!

TrcikyChristopher said:

PeteSilas said:

what makes you so sure? did he have some condition like MS or something? If he had cancer, death is always a possiblility.

Death from any illness is always a possibility but can easily turn into just a probability under the right circumstances and proper influences.

are you the same person as Funksterr?

Bodhitheblackdog said:

PeteSilas said:

what makes you so sure? did he have some condition like MS or something? If he had cancer, death is always a possiblility.

Boy, here we go again. It almost seems it's a requirement of Prince fandom that one adopts certain beliefs/behaviors like paranoia, secrecy, smug know-it-all-ness, being in the 'inner circle', control ('I know what really happened and you don't naa naa naa.') manipulation ('I know what really happened...' etc.)...it's exhausting...

I'm not in any inner circle. I'm not manipulating anyone nor am I being smug or paranoid. I'm stating what's been told to ME by multiple sources within the confines of what I am allowed to discuss. Believe what you want or just wait 28 fucking years because no one in the inner circle who knows what actually happened will open their mouths publically and would rather keep everyone guessing under the guise of "Prince's privacy" but most likely because, as someone alluded to earlier, money talks.

[Edited 5/16/18 21:52pm]

PeteSilas said:

TrcikyChristopher said:

Death from any illness is always a possibility but can easily turn into just a probability under the right circumstances and proper influences.

are you the same person as Funksterr?

No. I don't even know who that is.

Aye, Aye, Aye.

All this grasping at air only reinforces the speculation.

TrcikyChristopher said:

PeteSilas said:

are you the same person as Funksterr?

No. I don't even know who that is.

well, you're saying the same things he did, i hope it all comes out someday if there is anything to come out. to be honest, I never did feel like the drugs were the only factor, it's not just simple denial with me, it's just that Prince was always Prince, meaning, very demanding, exacting, meticulous, even Meron Bekure in her FB post said how demanding prince was and how it created "a whole new Meron" which is something people have said going back to the time. Then we have the performances which were about as good as humanly possible, none of the fucked up, slopply, lazy shit we see out of most of our drugged out rock stars, name a star who has od'd and more than likely there have been occasion(s) where they are onstage fucking up, either because they are high or because of the effect of the drugs (like whitneys ruined voice) prince showed none, i repeat, none of that, that is the reason people have a hard time reconciling this shit.

PeteSilas said:

TrcikyChristopher said:

No. I don't even know who that is.

well, you're saying the same things he did, i hope it all comes out someday if there is anything to come out. to be honest, I never did feel like the drugs were the only factor, it's not just simple denial with me, it's just that Prince was always Prince, meaning, very demanding, exacting, meticulous, even Meron Bekure in her FB post said how demanding prince was and how it created "a whole new Meron" which is something people have said going back to the time. Then we have the performances which were about as good as humanly possible, none of the fucked up, slopply, lazy shit we see out of most of our drugged out rock stars, name a star who has od'd and more than likely there have been occasion(s) where they are onstage fucking up, either because they are high or because of the effect of the drugs (like whitneys ruined voice) prince showed none, i repeat, none of that, that is the reason people have a hard time reconciling this shit.

That's the thing. He was never "drugged up" (at least publicly), and everything he was doing was his attempt to deal with something in a restricted way. That's the main reason he never got the actual hip replacement(s). As I stated before, all it really takes is a simple statement. A simple interview. None of this "I knew 2 years before he passed" (which, coincidentally was the year of the release of a very personal album) but not elaborating.

The fact of the matter is that Prince hid a LOT of his life away from even some of the people closest to him and that led us here because I'm pretty sure that not even Kirk knew the extent of what was going on. He was only trying to help the best way he knew how, as fucked up his methods may or may not have been.

In my opinion, the handful of people in the circle who say they know what happened are just playing footsies with each other (and maybe even us) to line their pockets in the meantime.

PeteSilas said:

TrcikyChristopher said:

No. I don't even know who that is.

well, you're saying the same things he did, i hope it all comes out someday if there is anything to come out. to be honest, I never did feel like the drugs were the only factor, it's not just simple denial with me, it's just that Prince was always Prince, meaning, very demanding, exacting, meticulous, even Meron Bekure in her FB post said how demanding prince was and how it created "a whole new Meron" which is something people have said going back to the time. Then we have the performances which were about as good as humanly possible, none of the fucked up, slopply, lazy shit we see out of most of our drugged out rock stars, name a star who has od'd and more than likely there have been occasion(s) where they are onstage fucking up, either because they are high or because of the effect of the drugs (like whitneys ruined voice) prince showed none, i repeat, none of that, that is the reason people have a hard time reconciling this shit.

The most Profound words that Ive read from you Pete

I have been meaning to mention this for awhile. I am an RN and have worked extensively with people undergoing hip and knee replacements, usually related to osteoarthritis. Prince probably had traumatic arthritis from years of extreme dancing and jumping etc. I wanted to reassure you that the vast majority of folks feel great after a somewhat painful or uncomfortable recovery of 6-8 weeks. If his other hip hurt alot, I would guess he would have had it replaced as well. The last picture of him walking into the appt with Dr Shulenberg with Kurt showed a strong, even gait with no limping and no cane.

I have been an RN for 30+ years, the other half of which was in the ICU where one sees many types of severe illnesses. Sometimes, one gets a sense of underlying issues.I do not feel that Prince only had an addiction. Addicts tend to be thin, but he was wasting fairly quickly. This is an just an intuition I am having difficulty shaking. I know his labs were essentially normal but something tells me there is more to this story. I know this may upset some folks. It is not my intention. IMHO, it is not coincidence that this thread is so long. There is a need for closure.

TrcikyChristopher said:

I'm not in any inner circle. I'm not manipulating anyone nor am I being smug or paranoid. I'm stating what's been told to ME by multiple sources within the confines of what I am allowed to discuss. Believe what you want or just wait 28 fucking years because no one in the inner circle who knows what actually happened will open their mouths publically and would rather keep everyone guessing under the guise of "Prince's privacy" but most likely because, as someone alluded to earlier, money talks.

[Edited 5/16/18 21:52pm]

Ignore that one. The jealousy is strong

I love your directness and humor Pete!

peggyon said:

I love your directness and humor Pete!

disch said:

I couldn't say -- when someone develops a dependence or addiction, they need to take the drugs (and more of them) to stave off debilitating withdrawal symptoms (things like vomiting, anxiety etc -- the kind of stuff he was complaining of Dr S and what Dr S prescribed drugs on 4/20 to combat). Dependence/addiction itself introduces another set of physical issues in addition to possible underlying pain issues.

-

What still is confusing to me is why if the physical pain was incapacitating, he didn't address it with a doctor (Dr S or someone else). Wouldn't this have been the very first thing he told Dr S when he first met with him?

MMJas said:

I hear what you're saying. However, the fact the he was taking high dosages shows that he was becoming tolerant and feeling the pain still, right?

[Edited 5/16/18 13:46pm]

So why take a high dosage to become unconscious? It seems it was natural for him to do that. Sleep issues? He never slept much, could he also suffer from extreme insomnia in his latter years? So why not tell the doctor also?

Didn't Kirk contact some doctor regarding Prince's hip pain? I seem to remember that...

[Edited 5/17/18 2:39am]

cloveringold85 said:

MMJas said:

Which means he was in pain, right? And he was used to blacking out whilst taking pain medication. Isn't that of real concern? It probably means the pain was heavy and he had to black out to stop feeling it. It's not like you take a painkiller for a headache and then continue working or doing whatever you were doing. He regarded it as normal to black out. I would be really scared of suffocating in vomit, for instance....

.

Yes, and we don't even know how many times he came close to being in that "black out" state and near overdose.

.

It's almost like an alcoholic who needs to drink more and more to get the same effect and feeling no pain, until the point of blacking-out.

.

Sad.

Many times, if you consider Kirk's comment at the hospital "we can't keep doing this". What is "this"? Taking him to the hospital unconscious? Trying to wake him up after he dozed off? Hiding his problem? What?

Bodhitheblackdog said:

cloveringold85 said:

.

And, this is what I've been saying all along; why didn't Dr. Schulenberg contact the family and tell them that Prince needs to get into treatment, ASAP?? Was he too afraid to tell Prince this?? I'm sure Dr. Schulenberg knows well-qualified addiction specialist in MN.

.

We will never know "why".

WHY? Because it's the LAW to protect patient privacy...duh.I'm not sure that spilling the beans re the health of an adult to 'family members' OR ANY OTHER SENTIENT BEING lines up with HIPPA Privacy protections....would you want your private medical information shared with a half-sibling, for example, with whom you had no contact and who had never been in your home? Would you want your struggles with addiction shared with your not-too-bright sister who had drug addiction issues of her own? I mean, where would such a violation end? Would it be OK to tell Rolling Stone or TMZ just so those entities could light a fire under Prince? Unless someone is specifically named as a health care representative...they are not entitled to ANY medical information about an individual....and that goes for a spouse. Get real.This sounds like the drival posted by some orgers to the effect that if they had been around, they would have kidnapped Prince and taken him, against his will, to a hospital. Hey, while you're at it...why not sexually molest him in the car on the way over? I mean, you're a fan, right???You can do no wrong.

[Edited 5/16/18 15:13pm]

Exactly. Even more so when that person is Prince.,

Morgaine said:

Bodhitheblackdog said:

I still think there was a vibe of 'let's protect the hometown hero' about this whole"investigation" in that 'accident' sounds so much more innocent and less violent that 'suicide.' It's also puzzling to me that given the expertise of the ME re Fent she still saw the MASSIVE, almost without precendant levels of Fent in his system as accidental rather than the result of a purposeful act.

I think in a misguided spasm of caring they were trying to protect his reputation.

I agree but would also add that I believe there are details they know that they are not releasing that led them to the idea if accidental OD from the beginning.

What could that possibly be?

Bodhitheblackdog said:

TrcikyChristopher said:

I've said plenty in previous posts without being very cryptic or specific.

It just bothers me to no end that this need to safeguard Prince's privacy at all costs (either by Prince himself or those in the know) not only inadvertently caused his passing, but continues the narrative that our dear Prince just happened to accidentally die from an overdose for no other reason than pain - and then allow pictures and video to be publically displayed - all in the name of said privacy and narrative.

If the narrative is inaccurate or offensive it's up to the family to speak out. I'm actually astounded that not one of them has spilled the beans...yet. The 'real story' must be quite a shocker...But, I'm sure if some entity came up with enough money, we would know it all.

Tyka is writing a book. And if she does decide to include unknown info, it will sell like hot cakes. And she knows it. Perhaps that is why she is not saying much.

TrcikyChristopher said:

Bodhitheblackdog said:

Boy, here we go again. It almost seems it's a requirement of Prince fandom that one adopts certain beliefs/behaviors like paranoia, secrecy, smug know-it-all-ness, being in the 'inner circle', control ('I know what really happened and you don't naa naa naa.') manipulation ('I know what really happened...' etc.)...it's exhausting...

I'm not in any inner circle. I'm not manipulating anyone nor am I being smug or paranoid. I'm stating what's been told to ME by multiple sources within the confines of what I am allowed to discuss. Believe what you want or just wait 28 fucking years because no one in the inner circle who knows what actually happened will open their mouths publically and would rather keep everyone guessing under the guise of "Prince's privacy" but most likely because, as someone alluded to earlier, money talks.

[Edited 5/16/18 21:52pm]

Is that why certain investigation documents were not released? To protect his privacy due to stuff mentioned in them?

So you are saying people who knowexactly what happened are keeping quiet about it because they were paid to keep quiet? But before you said:
"I'm only hoping that the charade ends soon. It's getting ridiculous at this point. 10 threads deep and 2 years in, and we're here discussing something that could easily be put to rest by a press release or interview. It's really that simple." So do you expect someone to talk or not?

TrcikyChristopher said:

PeteSilas said:

well, you're saying the same things he did, i hope it all comes out someday if there is anything to come out. to be honest, I never did feel like the drugs were the only factor, it's not just simple denial with me, it's just that Prince was always Prince, meaning, very demanding, exacting, meticulous, even Meron Bekure in her FB post said how demanding prince was and how it created "a whole new Meron" which is something people have said going back to the time. Then we have the performances which were about as good as humanly possible, none of the fucked up, slopply, lazy shit we see out of most of our drugged out rock stars, name a star who has od'd and more than likely there have been occasion(s) where they are onstage fucking up, either because they are high or because of the effect of the drugs (like whitneys ruined voice) prince showed none, i repeat, none of that, that is the reason people have a hard time reconciling this shit.

That's the thing. He was never "drugged up" (at least publicly), and everything he was doing was his attempt to deal with something in a restricted way. That's the main reason he never got the actual hip replacement(s). As I stated before, all it really takes is a simple statement. A simple interview. None of this "I knew 2 years before he passed" (which, coincidentally was the year of the release of a very personal album) but not elaborating.

The fact of the matter is that Prince hid a LOT of his life away from even some of the people closest to him and that led us here because I'm pretty sure that not even Kirk knew the extent of what was going on. He was only trying to help the best way he knew how, as fucked up his methods may or may not have been.

In my opinion, the handful of people in the circle who say they know what happened are just playing footsies with each other (and maybe even us) to line their pockets in the meantime.

This is a heartbreaking thread. Pete, I am on the same page on you in terms of praying that our heroes never went down like 'that'.

Trciky - dude I hope you aren't just playing with our emotions here. Surely if there was anything medical it would have come out in the Carver county reports? I still maintain the balloons released at the end of each 3EG gig by him [Black, White & Purple] were hugely symbolic [he did everything with a hidden meaning]. I saw him at Leeds UK on that tour , front row & he looked awful, in pain & angry..truly heartbreaking to see.

Trciky - your input is intriguing BUT many of us regained some level of closure in terms of cause of death ie he messed up on self medicating & trying to control his own pain. If you have anything definitive isn't best you just say it & be done?

Bodhitheblackdog said:

TrcikyChristopher said:

I've said plenty in previous posts without being very cryptic or specific.

It just bothers me to no end that this need to safeguard Prince's privacy at all costs (either by Prince himself or those in the know) not only inadvertently caused his passing, but continues the narrative that our dear Prince just happened to accidentally die from an overdose for no other reason than pain - and then allow pictures and video to be publically displayed - all in the name of said privacy and narrative.

If the narrative is inaccurate or offensive it's up to the family to speak out. I'm actually astounded that not one of them has spilled the beans...yet. The 'real story' must be quite a shocker...But, I'm sure if some entity came up with enough money, we would know it all.

I am atually dreading Tykas book!

PURPLEIZED3121 said:

Bodhitheblackdog said:

If the narrative is inaccurate or offensive it's up to the family to speak out. I'm actually astounded that not one of them has spilled the beans...yet. The 'real story' must be quite a shocker...But, I'm sure if some entity came up with enough money, we would know it all.

I am atually dreading Tykas book!

So am I.

I know Laura has apparently been banned, but she had been a proponent of a chronic/terminal underlying condition, and I agreed with her. Many people chastised her severely when she said it, but this man had been planning his demise for over a year. Addicts don't do that, as a rule, If the family would release the autopsy report, our speculation would end. JMO

TrcikyChristopher said:

80tomato said:

why not fill us in with what u know?

I've shared everything I am able to share without compromising my multiple sources. I'm only hoping that the charade ends soon. It's getting ridiculous at this point. 10 threads deep and 2 years in, and we're here discussing something that could easily be put to rest by a press release or interview. It's really that simple.

Instead, we're just unnecessarily tiptoeing around shit while arguing about half-assed "new" releases because they're too busy arguing among themselves.

It's a damned shame.

Thank you, TrcikyChristopher. You sharing confirms what I was told, too. And I agree, those that know need to come out with the whole story. I think some were just "prepared" and weren't given a lot of details, if any, but others were given the whole story. They could put the speculation to rest.

benni said: