I am going to have to challenge you and a few other conspiracy theorist here a bit.

A.) You said he probably wasn't a drug addict earlier in this thread, that pill taking for pain wasn't the same as drug addiction. Okay, then why did they have to land the plane in Moline? And why did Dr. S and Kirk even look into pain/drug management treatment?

B.) Why would a drug taker with chronic pain going through withdrawal symptoms who was slowly being poisoned only take one vicodin that night? ONe? He probably wouldn't think one would be enough to deal with pain or whatever he was going through.

C.) Did the warrant not prove you wrong when earlier in the thread you stated that there were 5 percocet bottles with Kirk's pills. The reality is that there was only one prescription within the last year prescribed to Kirk. The rest of the stuff was anti-anxiety and nausea medicine and various street pills inside of kirk's older bottles (presumably the bottles from prescriptions of previous years) and vitamin and aspirin bottles? I assumed that Prince had a stash of street drugs hidden away that he turned to that night for whatever reason.

d.) why would P's symptoms have to be poisoning?--if he had been taking pain pills since at least 2009, the loss of weight and an appetite are common symptoms of liver damage and drug abuse.

e.) those up in arms about Kirk's visit to Switzerland. Do you honestly think a Swiss bank would just let his personal assistant take his will out. Also, wills are drawn up by lawyers are they not? Also, his MOntreux concerts were because he kept his will there? What? I imagine P had Switzerland connections because he kept his money there. But I imagine there were personal connections that developed as well in Switzerland. There are lots of reasons for Kirk to have gone there...to hook up with he and Prince's European friends? Its telling that he was legally allowed to leave the country.

f.) as for Kirk originally being uncooperative...he was used to protecting P's privacy and was probably a bit scared that he had given P prescription pills that P used when he overdosed on the plane and he may not have known about P's other stash. The cops have looked into his involvement and obviously don't think its enough to warrant his arrest. LIke I said, I would think that Kirk before the doctor called the paramedics would have hidden any paper trail to himself (the pill bottles with his name) if he was heavily involved in P's acquisition of killer pain pills or if he was involved in poisoning him. If he was poisoning him, he would have let him die on the plane and would't have reached out to pain specialist and drug treatments.

I still contend that Kirk and Meron did not know the full extent of the stuff P was taking or where he was getting it from. Yes, they had free reign but it didn't mean he let them dig through his closets etc. As for how he got the street drugs, I wonder if the cops looked at P's old cell phone before he got rid of it due to it being hacked. Also, I seriously doubt Prince would send emails stating "Get me some drugs,". Odds are his hook-ups would have been cryptic and disguised as something else--like he would email a sound guy or someone like that and meet up with them somewhere to discuss something "professional" and really he was just picking up his pain pills--which is probably the reason the police are struggling to find out what happened. If Kirk were doing it all for him, , it would probably be easier to track down his involvement. Like I said, at one point, Kirk probably got him pain pills (thus the older prescription bottles) and then for some reason or another he stopped. And then about three months before P's death, Prince's health took a turn (for whatever reason, drugs, pain whatever) and he got Kirk to get him Vicodin and a pain doctor. the night of the plane incident, Prince probably took too much because he probably wasn't getting enough relief from those pills. At some point maybe Kirk figured out that P had probably (iin the past) been taking something else but didn't know he still had some stashed away. Kirk suspected that P would probably go about sneaking it again so steps were taken for addiction and pain treatment. But the night of his death, he might have left P thinking that anti-anxiety and anti-nausea pills were all that were at PP,

muleFunk said:

The contents were not dissolved.

They didn't find multiple pills in his stomach.

[Edited 10/1/17 10:54am]

[Edited 10/1/17 11:25am]

[Edited 10/1/17 11:28am]

Who said this?

muleFunk said:

The contents were not dissolved.

They didn't find multiple pills in his stomach.

I am not advocating that P was a fentanyl abuser but I would just like to clarify that fentanyl doesnt stay in the your body long enough for someone to state whether someone was not a long time user.

I know he was in pain as early as Rainbow Children, probably before (source - Kevin Smith's famous Prince story). I'm no doctor, but I suspect a big driver were all those James Brown jazz splits he used to do.
If you watch, he's kind of doing it wrong. You're suppose to mostly use your back leg and push off your hand to get back up. You have to sell it to make it look smooth. He looks like he just muscled his way back up rather than doing it right, which probably put unbelievable strain on his knees and hips. Check out some youtube videos of how to do it right, then watch some videos of Prince doing it.

herb4 said:

If I'm reading some of you right, you're saying that since Prince was unusual, so the usual rules do not apply, ergo: the chance of something out of the ordinary is more likely. Is that correct?

I can see that angle and entertain the possibility but, ultimately, we're all human and I think a LOT of what Prince cultivated was illusion built from purple smoke and peach tinted paisley etched mirrors so we tend to think of him as super human. I'm not suggesting that he was a phony (Not at ALL. He was singularly unique and brilliant), merely making the case that what he allowed to be projected or known was so selectively shared, and what WAS shared was usually centered around whatever made him look as cool as possible or showcased his otherwordly talent, that it was almost impossible to really KNOW him, and that what we were allowed to SEE was largely what he WANTED us to.

He seemed to want it that way and I can't say that I blame him. We all want the world to see our best side. We're ALL like that. He was just better at it than most of us are. He was better at most things than we are and I appluad the hell out of him for creating and carving out a life and a world of his own where he hardly had to answer to anyone and could do what he wished.

Who wouldn't want that? But who has the balls and the skill?

But he was human and often metnioned in his interviews how he was "just like everybody else" and never thought of himself as weird or different. It's hard to perceive him that way but he cultivated such an iconic image and was so driven doing it. He had his own fucking logo for crying out loud.

I think he was in a lot pain; physically as well as emotionally. Opioids also numb mental anguish - for most people anyway - and quite often induce euphoria in the user, enhancing a sense of well being, self assuredness and confidence while reducing inhibition. They can oddly give you energy since they relieve you of your tension and have a calming effect, particularly in social settings.

Sound like anyone you know?

There's a reason these things are addictive and their power does not discriminate between the famous and the infamous, nor the rich from the poor. The common from the sublime.

Shit...I didn't mean to rant like that.

Thank you Herb4, for saying what I've believed all along. You're aces in my book

ISaidLifeIsJustAGame said:

fortuneandserendipity said:

I agree as well. The problem with drugs is that they do sometimes help people feel better... to calm people, to relieve pain etc. Unfortunately, its an affliction that is bound to destroy the abuser but is also really hard to know how to treat due to its immediate benefits (especially where chronic pain and social anxiety are concerned) and the cunning way over-achievers like Prince could hide their addiction through eccentricity and workaholic tendencies. . I do believe at times his vulnerabilities were defintely apparent but they were cryptic and hard to pin down. Another thing occurred to me while re-reading the search warrants. There were only a few ways to get ahold of Prince -- you had to know his private email, had have the contact info of his current staff and have his land line number at his hones. He had no cell phone so if he was traveling and you didn't have one of handler's numbers you werent' gonna get ahold of him. If you (as an former inner circle associate) decided to travel all the way to Paisley, there is no way of knowing if you would get to even talk to him. Would he be in town, would he allow you in, would he give you the run-around if he did? He had to invite you in and if he was too fearful to do so, how do you help him? Sadly, Prince destroyed himself through shame and fear and too much isolation and not enough life outside of music and because his inner circle were clueless about how to help a stubborn, secretive man like himself maintain his dignity and privacy while getting better and finding an emotional, physical and psychological balance at the same time. The privacy and dignity were going to eventually have to take a hit if he was really going to get the help he needed.

SpinsterSister said:

herb4 said:

If I'm reading some of you right, you're saying that since Prince was unusual, so the usual rules do not apply, ergo: the chance of something out of the ordinary is more likely. Is that correct?

I can see that angle and entertain the possibility but, ultimately, we're all human and I think a LOT of what Prince cultivated was illusion built from purple smoke and peach tinted paisley etched mirrors so we tend to think of him as super human. I'm not suggesting that he was a phony (Not at ALL. He was singularly unique and brilliant), merely making the case that what he allowed to be projected or known was so selectively shared, and what WAS shared was usually centered around whatever made him look as cool as possible or showcased his otherwordly talent, that it was almost impossible to really KNOW him, and that what we were allowed to SEE was largely what he WANTED us to.

He seemed to want it that way and I can't say that I blame him. We all want the world to see our best side. We're ALL like that. He was just better at it than most of us are. He was better at most things than we are and I appluad the hell out of him for creating and carving out a life and a world of his own where he hardly had to answer to anyone and could do what he wished.

Who wouldn't want that? But who has the balls and the skill?

But he was human and often metnioned in his interviews how he was "just like everybody else" and never thought of himself as weird or different. It's hard to perceive him that way but he cultivated such an iconic image and was so driven doing it. He had his own fucking logo for crying out loud.

I think he was in a lot pain; physically as well as emotionally. Opioids also numb mental anguish - for most people anyway - and quite often induce euphoria in the user, enhancing a sense of well being, self assuredness and confidence while reducing inhibition. They can oddly give you energy since they relieve you of your tension and have a calming effect, particularly in social settings.

Sound like anyone you know?

There's a reason these things are addictive and their power does not discriminate between the famous and the infamous, nor the rich from the poor. The common from the sublime.

Shit...I didn't mean to rant like that.

Thank you Herb4, for saying what I've believed all along. You're aces in my book

[Edited 10/1/17 18:57pm]

purplerabbithole said:

SpinsterSister said:

herb4 said:

If I'm reading some of you right, you're saying that since Prince was unusual, so the usual rules do not apply, ergo: the chance of something out of the ordinary is more likely. Is that correct?

I can see that angle and entertain the possibility but, ultimately, we're all human and I think a LOT of what Prince cultivated was illusion built from purple smoke and peach tinted paisley etched mirrors so we tend to think of him as super human. I'm not suggesting that he was a phony (Not at ALL. He was singularly unique and brilliant), merely making the case that what he allowed to be projected or known was so selectively shared, and what WAS shared was usually centered around whatever made him look as cool as possible or showcased his otherwordly talent, that it was almost impossible to really KNOW him, and that what we were allowed to SEE was largely what he WANTED us to.

He seemed to want it that way and I can't say that I blame him. We all want the world to see our best side. We're ALL like that. He was just better at it than most of us are. He was better at most things than we are and I appluad the hell out of him for creating and carving out a life and a world of his own where he hardly had to answer to anyone and could do what he wished.

Who wouldn't want that? But who has the balls and the skill?

But he was human and often metnioned in his interviews how he was "just like everybody else" and never thought of himself as weird or different. It's hard to perceive him that way but he cultivated such an iconic image and was so driven doing it. He had his own fucking logo for crying out loud.

I think he was in a lot pain; physically as well as emotionally. Opioids also numb mental anguish - for most people anyway - and quite often induce euphoria in the user, enhancing a sense of well being, self assuredness and confidence while reducing inhibition. They can oddly give you energy since they relieve you of your tension and have a calming effect, particularly in social settings.

Sound like anyone you know?

There's a reason these things are addictive and their power does not discriminate between the famous and the infamous, nor the rich from the poor. The common from the sublime.

Shit...I didn't mean to rant like that.

Thank you Herb4, for saying what I've believed all along. You're aces in my book

Herb4...Blessings for this eloquence, sensitivity and truth...people here need to read this post again...and again.

Yep.

Do you really want to think that Prince's friend of 30 years (whose family P hanged out with) and who is beloved by other Purple staff members and NPG members killed him or callously enabled him to die from drug abuse--and that no one cares that he did so. I want to believe that it wasn't the case because that notion really sucks. The benefit of the doubt is not as far-fetched as the conspiracy theory crap stating that WB killed him or his sister hired Kirk to kill him. If that is the case, what took them so damn long? He pubically was seen popping pills in 2009? They could have killed him then. If P was such a bastard to be around why didn't KJ spike his drugs years ago or poison him or just get him whatever drugs he pleased (leading to an even earlier death.)

YOu don't last with Prince that long just as a "yes man". After all, a yes man is not super human--eventually he will fail after saying "yes" one too many times and still not being able to deliver. People lasted with Prince by finding a balance. Steve Parke said an interesting thing....he said you didn't say "no" (presumably because P thought it was a defeatist attitude), you stated exactly what would probably need to be done in order to execute his request and if the process seemed too difficult or unattainable, then Prince himself would say "yeah, that's not going to work, we will have to do something else". So either KJ had successfully found that balance in the past but was just unable to do so at the end or KJ was completely in control of Prince from the beginning. He would have had to have been P's drug supplier, his controller, his isolator. Prince would have had to have been a prisoner of his in a way--kept doped up and misleed into thinking that Kirk was giving into his demands for his own good and out of love/loyalty. . What a tragic thing if that were the case.

[Edited 10/1/17 19:14pm]

[Edited 10/1/17 19:36pm]

purplerabbithole said:

He's a lawyer and he wasn't always in P's life. Plus Londell is not supported by many in the family or the "Purple Army" anymore. Cousins is a total douche and Prince discovered that years ago.. Duane was mentally ill, drug addicted, and P had a restraining order against him (so he definitely was able to detect Duane's problems years ago.) Plus, stealing bootlegs doesn't equate to killing P. The folks who sold his checkbooks didn't last for 30 years with P. Yes, he was used and stolen from but not from anyone who lasted for 30 FRIGGING YEARS!!! Once you get attention for working with P, you get a boost career-wise at least for a little while--Why endure years of being with this bastard prince that you guys are intent on presenting him as??...What kind of torture would that be? --Since apparentely no one in the "Purple Army" believed that Prince had any merits other than his fame, money and the favors he offered in exchange for loyalty, damn that is one mass conspiracy we have in place. Hundreds of people presenting prince as more than just a meal ticket to the media...Damn' how well executed? Yes, the fame and opportunities are enticing, but to stick it out for 30 years with almost anyone is great feat and Kirk Johnson did that. And for those 30 years to just be presented as the time in which the ultimate Yes Man kissed P's ass and allowed him to die is something I am not ready to do right now when I can find any other explanation that makes sense. ANd there are other explanations that make as much sense as the most cynical ones. Here is the problem I have with conspiracy theories, they don't factor in human falliabity, mistakes, misunderstanding, self-justifications and the mixed feelings people have for one another. THere are too clear cut good guys and bad guys.

laurarichardson said:

purplerabbithole said:

Yep.

Do you really want to think that Prince's friend of 30 years (whose family P hanged out with) and who is beloved by other Purple staff members and NPG members killed him or callously enabled him to die from drug abuse--and that no one cares that he did so. I want to believe that it wasn't the case because that notion really sucks. The benefit of the doubt is not as far-fetched as the conspiracy theory crap stating that WB killed him or his sister hired Kirk to kill him. If that is the case, what took them so damn long? He pubically was seen popping pills in 2009? They could have killed him then. If P was such a bastard to be around why didn't KJ spike his drugs years ago or poison him or just get him whatever drugs he pleased (leading to an even earlier death.)

YOu don't last with Prince that long just as a "yes man". After all, a yes man is not super human--eventually he will fail after saying "yes" one too many times and still not being able to deliver. People lasted with Prince by finding a balance. Steve Parke said an interesting thing....he said you didn't say "no" presumably because P thought it was a defeatist attitude, you stated exactly what would probably need to be done in order to execute his request and if the process seemed too difficult or unattainable, then Prince himself would say "yeah, that's not going to work, we will have to do something else". So either KJ had successfully found that balance in teh past but was just unable to do so at the end or KJ was completely in control of Prince from the beginning. He would have had to have been P's drug supplier, his controller, his isolator. Prince would have had to have been a prisoner of his in a way--misleed into thinking that Kirk was giving into his demands for his own good and out of love/loyalty. . What a tragic thing if that were the case.

[Edited 10/1/17 19:14pm]

Would you have thought that a lawyer that claimed to be a friend would come back Out of the shadows and try and rip off the estate? Guess what this actually happened.

[Edited 10/1/17 19:49pm]

[Edited 10/1/17 19:54pm]

herb4 said:

Do drug addicts (ashamed of their addiction)not hide their addictions. Do you seriously think P was going to tell people he had a drug problem he needed to kick before he could continue touring?

I do wonder what the tests were for that Dr. S was getting. But they may very well be tests of his liver--which might have been damaged due to drug usage after Dr. S suggested getting the tests when P was not keeping food down, getting paler, and was losing weight. Are you suggesting that the medical board didn't take away Dr. S's license because of a grand conspiracy. No maybe its because no one could prove that Dr. S didnt intend for those prescriptions to be Kirks. Its BS (they were obviously for P) but unless it can be proven, it don't mean shit. Other than that, Dr. S. did nothing illegal.

Why is 65K so high for drug addicted, chronic-pain suffering, middle-aged rock star?

I must ask. Do you think P was murdered or already sick from something else or a combination of all three?

laurarichardson said:

herb4 said:

Yeah, I doubt very highly that Prince ever intentionally took fentanyl.

And before anyone starts, no, I don't think anyone slipped it to him either. Sounds like he was masking his addcition by placing pills in vitamin and Alleve bottles (which is common for addicts) and, since they all appeared the same, couldn't recognize the fake ones. The drug tests seem to bare this out becasue if he was a regular user, it would have shown up.

However, to whoever it was that suggested the Narcan shot would have wiped out a positive test: no it wouldn't. It doesn't work like that and only alleviates the effects of an opioid OD. It's not a magic shot that flushes all signs of drugs out of your body and if anything it seems it'd make a positive drug test MORE likely.

https://forums.studentdoctor.net/threads/will-narcan-make-a-urine-drug-screen-negative.899036/

https://www.justanswer.co...ative.html

Why do you think the Atlanta promoter said that Prince told her he was not feeling a 100% and to hold off on announcing the rest of the shows until he went back to see his doctor. Do drug addicts gave to go to a doctor to be told they are drug addicts? Why did Prince tell Andrian Crutchfield he was not feeling 100% and that he was canceling the aftershow in Atlanta and that he would speak to his doctor and let him know about additional shows? How come in the Minneapolis area we have no reports of other people dying from Prince's combo but the same combo is now being used as a death penalty drug in Nevada? Why was a drug addict seeing a doctor for joint pain who had no specialization in addition mgnt. How come Dr. S is still practicing med despite writing scripts for Prince under Kirk's name? How come Andrew us not in jail? How come contracts Prince had are being challenged so UMG a company he did not want to do business with anymore can get all the work? Why did the drug addict have 65k for illness on his inventory sheet Was the 65k for illegal drugs. The answer is money stop acting like the vultures have not pounced on this estate from the minute Prince died.

[Edited 10/1/17 20:13pm]

Do drug addicts (ashamed of their addiction)not hide their addictions. Do you seriously think P was going to tell people he had a drug problem he needed to kick before he could continue touring?

He could try and hide it all he wanted to but these drugs have side effects and I am not sure how Prince would have been able to not have any of the side effects of the drugs. Not one single person who worked with him has side anything about him being out of it or woozy from drugs or alcohol. Estates cannot sue for defamation so people are free to say whatever they like. Why are we not hearing anything?

I watched his last show. He did not have one misstep that entire show. I have watched at least one show going back to Musicology. Prince never missed a step on stage how is that possible if he was abusing these drugs the whole time?

I do wonder what the tests were for that Dr. S was getting. But they may very well be tests of his liver--which might have been damaged due to drug usage after Dr. S suggested getting the tests when P was not keeping food down, getting paler, and was losing weight. Are you suggesting that the medical board didn't take away Dr. S's license because of a grand conspiracy.

I am glad you are wondering because no one else seems to think that there is anything odd about someone who is suppose to be strung out on drugs telling at least two people he was not sure what was wrong and he was going to check with his doctor.

Do drug addicts have to check with their doctor to know they are drug addicts? It would not have been test to go to rehab because he spent the night before Andrew came alone so any test for entering rehab would have had to be conducted again immedialty before entering the rehab facility and once again Dr. S said he was seeing Prince for joint management not addiction management so why would have been giving him any test for entering rehab.

If losing weight and not keeping food down are the side effects of pain meds Prince would not have been pondering what was wrong and he certainly would not have put concerts on hold because he would have already known what was wrong. Do you realize at least one of those shows was going to be a 20k arena? He was putting a lot of money on hold and I do not think it was because of drugs. Plenty of rock stars take drugs and keep right on going with their shows since the need money to keep taking drugs.

Are you suggesting that the medical board didn't take away Dr. S's license because of a grand conspiracy. No maybe its because no one could prove that Dr. S didnt intend for those prescriptions to be Kirks. Its BS (they were obviously for P) but unless it can be proven, it don't mean shit. Other than that, Dr. S. did nothing illegal.

Why is 65K so high for drug addicted, chronic-pain suffering, middle-aged rock star

I think the medical board did not take away Dr. S license because he was treating Prince for an illness and it was not for drug addiction. I think if the family pushed Dr S could be in a lot of trouble for admitting he wrote Rxs in Kirk’s name for Prince despite the fact that the Rx’s were not pain meds. Writing any Rx pain meds or no is illegal and if the family wanted to push Dr. S could be in a lot of trouble. The same thing happened with Elvis the family pushed law enforcement to go after the doctor who prescribed those pills to Elvis. The ball is in Prince’ family court right now but I think they are fearful of what information concerning Prince’s health might come out and I think that is the real reason Dr. S is not in any trouble. No one is pushing to go after him because if someone pushed he would be in a lot of trouble. So no conspiracy.

As far as Kirk. Dr. S said he never wrote any pain meds for Prince but he did write them for Kirk with no direction for those pills to go anyone else. He is not responsible for whatever Kirk did with those pills once he picked up the RX.

Kirk is reasonable for the pills being in with Prince’s things as his name is own the bottle. You the person whose name appears on the bottle are responsible for the contents of the bottle. Did Kirk forget were he put a whole bottle of pain meds at a time when he had a boss who was seeing a doctor for joint pain? We need to stop cup caking for associates who may have been enablers.

I think Prince used these drugs for a long time for pain and at some point in the past he had an Rxs. Not sure when he started to increase his usage or when he went off the books but you can see a drastic change from pictures of him in the fall of 2015 to his tour in Australia in January of 2016 along with the comments by the chefs about his change in eating habits and demeanor.

I think he may have been dealing with illness and he may not have been aware of what he was taking toward the end. I do not see a guy who had his underwear custom made buying drugs from some random person he got them from someone he trusted and something went wrong.

I do not see a private person like Prince complaining about not feeling well to random people unless he really did not know why he was not feeling well like he would normally feel taking these meds.

I think his last visit to Dr. S was to help with his drug issues but to also find out what exactly was wrong other then drug and joint problems.

purplerabbithole said:

Do drug addicts (ashamed of their addiction)not hide their addictions. Do you seriously think P was going to tell people he had a drug problem he needed to kick before he could continue touring?

I do wonder what the tests were for that Dr. S was getting. But they may very well be tests of his liver--which might have been damaged due to drug usage after Dr. S suggested getting the tests when P was not keeping food down, getting paler, and was losing weight. Are you suggesting that the medical board didn't take away Dr. S's license because of a grand conspiracy. No maybe its because no one could prove that Dr. S didnt intend for those prescriptions to be Kirks. Its BS (they were obviously for P) but unless it can be proven, it don't mean shit. Other than that, Dr. S. did nothing illegal.

Why is 65K so high for drug addicted, chronic-pain suffering, middle-aged rock star?

I must ask. Do you think P was murdered or already sick from something else or a combination of all three?

laurarichardson said:

herb4 said: Why do you think the Atlanta promoter said that Prince told her he was not feeling a 100% and to hold off on announcing the rest of the shows until he went back to see his doctor. Do drug addicts gave to go to a doctor to be told they are drug addicts? Why did Prince tell Andrian Crutchfield he was not feeling 100% and that he was canceling the aftershow in Atlanta and that he would speak to his doctor and let him know about additional shows? How come in the Minneapolis area we have no reports of other people dying from Prince's combo but the same combo is now being used as a death penalty drug in Nevada? Why was a drug addict seeing a doctor for joint pain who had no specialization in addition mgnt. How come Dr. S is still practicing med despite writing scripts for Prince under Kirk's name? How come Andrew us not in jail? How come contracts Prince had are being challenged so UMG a company he did not want to do business with anymore can get all the work? Why did the drug addict have 65k for illness on his inventory sheet Was the 65k for illegal drugs. The answer is money stop acting like the vultures have not pounced on this estate from the minute Prince died.

[Edited 10/1/17 20:13pm]

muleFunk said:

fortuneandserendipity said:

Yup, I believe he knew fentanyl was in those pills, not just opiates in general. Dr Drew claimed it said on the bag 'contains fentanyl'. Don't know if that's been corroborated, but factor in the fact that he had OD'd less than a week before, and the amount of fentanyl allegedly in his bloodstream post-mortem, and the 'accident' theory becomes harder to believe. Even if it were an accident, he well knew the risks.

If that was true he would have had patches of Fentanyl lying around.

He didn't.

Not true. Many fentanyl addicts don't bother with the patches. There are plenty of pills around, contained in bags marked 'contains fentanyl'. That, according to Dr Drew. But there are also many pills, which illegitimately contain it, as in not marked.

Fentanyl is just like every other opiate, just a lot stronger. Same metabolic pathway, same agonist action, you just take less of it because of its potency.

Also long term use would have shown in the toxicology screen .

It didn't.

Which toxicology screen? Are you talking the autopsy, and could that reliably determine long-term use of fentanyl?! Bear in mind how quickly fentanyl is cleared from the bloodstream, as well as the organs.

Showed only Fentanyl use was on April 20/21.

When was the blood test given precisely in that month of April? Prince saw Dr S at the beginning of April as well. Was the blood test administered then? We don't know. We have no record of when that blood test was actually taken. I had a full spectrum blood test a few years back, for which a couple of test results took more than a month to come back.

Someone said that the simplest answer is the truth.

Yah, I said that.

Simplest answer here is that someone gave him these pills in Atlanta because they showed up supposedly in his bags from the Atlanta trip that were still packed 5 days later. Well the investigation started in Atlanta........ nothing there no counterfeit Watson tablets killing folk in Atlanta. Let's go to Minn. ..... Still no Watson's killing people.

DEA goes into PP looking for computer information yet damn near 2 years later nothing found.

Kirk Johnson and Dr. S may have been getting percocet to Prince but that's not what killed him and you can't link these pills back to anyone in the area.

You're pointing in the direction of homicide right there. Anyone even gravitating in that direction, I feel sorry for.

More Occam's Razor to say that what killed him was very close in nature to what kills a lot of people, either from fentanyl addiction, or from any manner of opiate addiction: OD, usually unwillful. But in P's case, not necessarily.

inspite of ourselves, none of us really know. Any possibility you think of seems to exclude others that conflict with this or that, the only common denominator is he is dead. As I said earlier I hope we don't go the way of the JFK assasination.

purplerabbithole said:

Do drug addicts (ashamed of their addiction)not hide their addictions. Do you seriously think P was going to tell people he had a drug problem he needed to kick before he could continue touring?

I do wonder what the tests were for that Dr. S was getting. But they may very well be tests of his liver--which might have been damaged due to drug usage after Dr. S suggested getting the tests when P was not keeping food down, getting paler, and was losing weight. Are you suggesting that the medical board didn't take away Dr. S's license because of a grand conspiracy. No maybe its because no one could prove that Dr. S didnt intend for those prescriptions to be Kirks. Its BS (they were obviously for P) but unless it can be proven, it don't mean shit. Other than that, Dr. S. did nothing illegal.

Why is 65K so high for drug addicted, chronic-pain suffering, middle-aged rock star?

I must ask. Do you think P was murdered or already sick from something else or a combination of all three?

laurarichardson said:

herb4 said: Why do you think the Atlanta promoter said that Prince told her he was not feeling a 100% and to hold off on announcing the rest of the shows until he went back to see his doctor. Do drug addicts gave to go to a doctor to be told they are drug addicts? Why did Prince tell Andrian Crutchfield he was not feeling 100% and that he was canceling the aftershow in Atlanta and that he would speak to his doctor and let him know about additional shows? How come in the Minneapolis area we have no reports of other people dying from Prince's combo but the same combo is now being used as a death penalty drug in Nevada? Why was a drug addict seeing a doctor for joint pain who had no specialization in addition mgnt. How come Dr. S is still practicing med despite writing scripts for Prince under Kirk's name? How come Andrew us not in jail? How come contracts Prince had are being challenged so UMG a company he did not want to do business with anymore can get all the work? Why did the drug addict have 65k for illness on his inventory sheet Was the 65k for illegal drugs. The answer is money stop acting like the vultures have not pounced on this estate from the minute Prince died.

[Edited 10/1/17 20:13pm]

Showed only Fentanyl use was on April 20/21.

When was the blood test given precisely in that month of April? Prince saw Dr S at the beginning of April as well. Was the blood test administered then? We don't know. We have no record of when that blood test was actually taken. I had a full spectrum blood test a few years back, for which a couple of test results took more than a month to come back.

----------

He had test done with Dr. S the day before he died. Dr S was bring those test results to Prince. The ME and police know what those test were for and what was in Prince's blood. The ME said he was not a long term user and that is the reason they said accidentle. No one can prove he knew what was in the pills and we do not know what Dr. S test were for or what is in Dr. S 's notes from Prince's medical file.

You are not a wealthy person so yes your test took weeks. Dr. S was bringing test results to Prince. Stop thinking he was just like everybody else.

I believe that medical file would explain a lot. And he supposely o.d on Percocet and nothing as mentioned Percocet being found at Paisley Park at all. So what risk would he have know if he thought he was taking the Hydrocone.

fortuneandserendipity said:

muleFunk said:

fortuneandserendipity said:

Yup, I believe he knew fentanyl was in those pills, not just opiates in general. Dr Drew claimed it said on the bag 'contains fentanyl'. Don't know if that's been corroborated, but factor in the fact that he had OD'd less than a week before, and the amount of fentanyl allegedly in his bloodstream post-mortem, and the 'accident' theory becomes harder to believe. Even if it were an accident, he well knew the risks.

If that was true he would have had patches of Fentanyl lying around.

He didn't.

Not true. Many fentanyl addicts don't bother with the patches. There are plenty of pills around, contained in bags marked 'contains fentanyl'. That, according to Dr Drew. But there are also many pills, which illegitimately contain it, as in not marked.

Fentanyl is just like every other opiate, just a lot stronger. Same metabolic pathway, same agonist action, you just take less of it because of its potency.

Also long term use would have shown in the toxicology screen .

It didn't.

Which toxicology screen? Are you talking the autopsy, and could that reliably determine long-term use of fentanyl?! Bear in mind how quickly fentanyl is cleared from the bloodstream, as well as the organs.

Showed only Fentanyl use was on April 20/21.

When was the blood test given precisely in that month of April? Prince saw Dr S at the beginning of April as well. Was the blood test administered then? We don't know. We have no record of when that blood test was actually taken. I had a full spectrum blood test a few years back, for which a couple of test results took more than a month to come back.

Someone said that the simplest answer is the truth.

Yah, I said that.

Simplest answer here is that someone gave him these pills in Atlanta because they showed up supposedly in his bags from the Atlanta trip that were still packed 5 days later. Well the investigation started in Atlanta........ nothing there no counterfeit Watson tablets killing folk in Atlanta. Let's go to Minn. ..... Still no Watson's killing people.

DEA goes into PP looking for computer information yet damn near 2 years later nothing found.

Kirk Johnson and Dr. S may have been getting percocet to Prince but that's not what killed him and you can't link these pills back to anyone in the area.

You're pointing in the direction of homicide right there. Anyone even gravitating in that direction, I feel sorry for.

More Occam's Razor to say that what killed him was very close in nature to what kills a lot of people, either from fentanyl addiction, or from any manner of opiate addiction: OD, usually unwillful. But in P's case, not necessarily.

[Edited 10/2/17 7:31am]

Well, not totally disagreeing Laura (P might have been scared for health because something else was wrong.) but I think you didn't catch what I was saying about Kirk. I do think he gave P pills from his own stash of oxycodone etc in the past and that P still had the bottles. (I say it had to have been from the past because there are no other prescription of KJ's in Minnesota records). One could argue that KJ should not have been doing that, but it doesn't mean he didn't want to help P when shit really hit the fan later on. Probably at one point, P just reused the bottles. Whether he knew about P storing other shit in those bottles is impossible to know but since he left him alone that night after having invested his time in saving his life on a plane, getting him a rehab doctor, taking him to Walgreens for anti-anxiety and anti-nausea medicine, and then later looking for him to find him dead with KJ's own pill bottles laying about (and he didn't even try to dispose of the bottles after the fact) . All that (to me) points to a guy who didn't know P still had those bottles until after his death.

P was a control freak but he was also human. I imagine he was ocassionally unorganized; if P was dealing with illness and a drug problem, he might have lost a bit of the control he was so fond of.

laurarichardson said:

Do drug addicts (ashamed of their addiction)not hide their addictions. Do you seriously think P was going to tell people he had a drug problem he needed to kick before he could continue touring?

He could try and hide it all he wanted to but these drugs have side effects and I am not sure how Prince would have been able to not have any of the side effects of the drugs. Not one single person who worked with him has side anything about him being out of it or woozy from drugs or alcohol. Estates cannot sue for defamation so people are free to say whatever they like. Why are we not hearing anything?

I watched his last show. He did not have one misstep that entire show. I have watched at least one show going back to Musicology. Prince never missed a step on stage how is that possible if he was abusing these drugs the whole time?

I do wonder what the tests were for that Dr. S was getting. But they may very well be tests of his liver--which might have been damaged due to drug usage after Dr. S suggested getting the tests when P was not keeping food down, getting paler, and was losing weight. Are you suggesting that the medical board didn't take away Dr. S's license because of a grand conspiracy.

I am glad you are wondering because no one else seems to think that there is anything odd about someone who is suppose to be strung out on drugs telling at least two people he was not sure what was wrong and he was going to check with his doctor.

Do drug addicts have to check with their doctor to know they are drug addicts? It would not have been test to go to rehab because he spent the night before Andrew came alone so any test for entering rehab would have had to be conducted again immedialty before entering the rehab facility and once again Dr. S said he was seeing Prince for joint management not addiction management so why would have been giving him any test for entering rehab.

If losing weight and not keeping food down are the side effects of pain meds Prince would not have been pondering what was wrong and he certainly would not have put concerts on hold because he would have already known what was wrong. Do you realize at least one of those shows was going to be a 20k arena? He was putting a lot of money on hold and I do not think it was because of drugs. Plenty of rock stars take drugs and keep right on going with their shows since the need money to keep taking drugs.

Are you suggesting that the medical board didn't take away Dr. S's license because of a grand conspiracy. No maybe its because no one could prove that Dr. S didnt intend for those prescriptions to be Kirks. Its BS (they were obviously for P) but unless it can be proven, it don't mean shit. Other than that, Dr. S. did nothing illegal.

Why is 65K so high for drug addicted, chronic-pain suffering, middle-aged rock star

I think the medical board did not take away Dr. S license because he was treating Prince for an illness and it was not for drug addiction. I think if the family pushed Dr S could be in a lot of trouble for admitting he wrote Rxs in Kirk’s name for Prince despite the fact that the Rx’s were not pain meds. Writing any Rx pain meds or no is illegal and if the family wanted to push Dr. S could be in a lot of trouble. The same thing happened with Elvis the family pushed law enforcement to go after the doctor who prescribed those pills to Elvis. The ball is in Prince’ family court right now but I think they are fearful of what information concerning Prince’s health might come out and I think that is the real reason Dr. S is not in any trouble. No one is pushing to go after him because if someone pushed he would be in a lot of trouble. So no conspiracy.

As far as Kirk. Dr. S said he never wrote any pain meds for Prince but he did write them for Kirk with no direction for those pills to go anyone else. He is not responsible for whatever Kirk did with those pills once he picked up the RX.

Kirk is reasonable for the pills being in with Prince’s things as his name is own the bottle. You the person whose name appears on the bottle are responsible for the contents of the bottle. Did Kirk forget were he put a whole bottle of pain meds at a time when he had a boss who was seeing a doctor for joint pain? We need to stop cup caking for associates who may have been enablers.

I think 65k tells us he had other problems then just pain pills. I am sorry even people with Rx for these things can suffer organ damage from taking them over the long haul. Read about Walter Payton and his liver disease from taking pain pills which were prescribed to him by NFL doctors.

I think Prince used these drugs for a long time for pain and at some point in the past he had an Rxs. Not sure when he started to increase his usage or when he went off the books but you can see a drastic change from pictures of him in the fall of 2015 to his tour in Australia in January of 2016 along with the comments by the chefs about his change in eating habits and demeanor.

I think he may have been dealing with illness and he may not have been aware of what he was taking toward the end. I do not see a guy who had his underwear custom made buying drugs from some random person he got them from someone he trusted and something went wrong.

I do not see a private person like Prince complaining about not feeling well to random people unless he really did not know why he was not feeling well like he would normally feel taking these meds.

I think his last visit to Dr. S was to help with his drug issues but to also find out what exactly was wrong other then drug and joint problems.

purplerabbithole said:

Do drug addicts (ashamed of their addiction)not hide their addictions. Do you seriously think P was going to tell people he had a drug problem he needed to kick before he could continue touring?

I do wonder what the tests were for that Dr. S was getting. But they may very well be tests of his liver--which might have been damaged due to drug usage after Dr. S suggested getting the tests when P was not keeping food down, getting paler, and was losing weight. Are you suggesting that the medical board didn't take away Dr. S's license because of a grand conspiracy. No maybe its because no one could prove that Dr. S didnt intend for those prescriptions to be Kirks. Its BS (they were obviously for P) but unless it can be proven, it don't mean shit. Other than that, Dr. S. did nothing illegal.

Why is 65K so high for drug addicted, chronic-pain suffering, middle-aged rock star?

I must ask. Do you think P was murdered or already sick from something else or a combination of all three?

[Edited 10/1/17 20:13pm]

purplerabbithole said:

Well, not totally disagreeing Laura (P might have been scared for health because something else was wrong.) but I think you didn't catch what I was saying about Kirk. I do think he gave P pills from his own stash of oxycodone etc in the past and that P still had the bottles. (I say it had to have been from the past because there are no other prescription of KJ's in Minnesota records). One could argue that KJ should not have been doing that, but it doesn't mean he didn't want to help P when shit really hit the fan later on. Probably at one point, P just reused the bottles. Whether he knew about P storing other shit in those bottles is impossible to know but since he left him alone that night after having invested his time in saving his life on a plane, getting him a rehab doctor, taking him to Walgreens for anti-anxiety and anti-nausea medicine, and then later looking for him to find him dead with KJ's own pill bottles laying about (and he didn't even try to dispose of the bottles after the fact) . All that (to me) points to a guy who didn't know P still had those bottles until after his death.

P was a control freak but he was also human. I imagine he was ocassionally unorganized; if P was dealing with illness and a drug problem, he might have lost a bit of the control he was so fond of.

laurarichardson said:

Do drug addicts (ashamed of their addiction)not hide their addictions. Do you seriously think P was going to tell people he had a drug problem he needed to kick before he could continue touring?

He could try and hide it all he wanted to but these drugs have side effects and I am not sure how Prince would have been able to not have any of the side effects of the drugs. Not one single person who worked with him has side anything about him being out of it or woozy from drugs or alcohol. Estates cannot sue for defamation so people are free to say whatever they like. Why are we not hearing anything?

I watched his last show. He did not have one misstep that entire show. I have watched at least one show going back to Musicology. Prince never missed a step on stage how is that possible if he was abusing these drugs the whole time?

I do wonder what the tests were for that Dr. S was getting. But they may very well be tests of his liver--which might have been damaged due to drug usage after Dr. S suggested getting the tests when P was not keeping food down, getting paler, and was losing weight. Are you suggesting that the medical board didn't take away Dr. S's license because of a grand conspiracy.

I am glad you are wondering because no one else seems to think that there is anything odd about someone who is suppose to be strung out on drugs telling at least two people he was not sure what was wrong and he was going to check with his doctor.

Do drug addicts have to check with their doctor to know they are drug addicts? It would not have been test to go to rehab because he spent the night before Andrew came alone so any test for entering rehab would have had to be conducted again immedialty before entering the rehab facility and once again Dr. S said he was seeing Prince for joint management not addiction management so why would have been giving him any test for entering rehab.

If losing weight and not keeping food down are the side effects of pain meds Prince would not have been pondering what was wrong and he certainly would not have put concerts on hold because he would have already known what was wrong. Do you realize at least one of those shows was going to be a 20k arena? He was putting a lot of money on hold and I do not think it was because of drugs. Plenty of rock stars take drugs and keep right on going with their shows since the need money to keep taking drugs.

Are you suggesting that the medical board didn't take away Dr. S's license because of a grand conspiracy. No maybe its because no one could prove that Dr. S didnt intend for those prescriptions to be Kirks. Its BS (they were obviously for P) but unless it can be proven, it don't mean shit. Other than that, Dr. S. did nothing illegal.

Why is 65K so high for drug addicted, chronic-pain suffering, middle-aged rock star

I think the medical board did not take away Dr. S license because he was treating Prince for an illness and it was not for drug addiction. I think if the family pushed Dr S could be in a lot of trouble for admitting he wrote Rxs in Kirk’s name for Prince despite the fact that the Rx’s were not pain meds. Writing any Rx pain meds or no is illegal and if the family wanted to push Dr. S could be in a lot of trouble. The same thing happened with Elvis the family pushed law enforcement to go after the doctor who prescribed those pills to Elvis. The ball is in Prince’ family court right now but I think they are fearful of what information concerning Prince’s health might come out and I think that is the real reason Dr. S is not in any trouble. No one is pushing to go after him because if someone pushed he would be in a lot of trouble. So no conspiracy.

As far as Kirk. Dr. S said he never wrote any pain meds for Prince but he did write them for Kirk with no direction for those pills to go anyone else. He is not responsible for whatever Kirk did with those pills once he picked up the RX.

Kirk is reasonable for the pills being in with Prince’s things as his name is own the bottle. You the person whose name appears on the bottle are responsible for the contents of the bottle. Did Kirk forget were he put a whole bottle of pain meds at a time when he had a boss who was seeing a doctor for joint pain? We need to stop cup caking for associates who may have been enablers.

I think 65k tells us he had other problems then just pain pills. I am sorry even people with Rx for these things can suffer organ damage from taking them over the long haul. Read about Walter Payton and his liver disease from taking pain pills which were prescribed to him by NFL doctors.

I think Prince used these drugs for a long time for pain and at some point in the past he had an Rxs. Not sure when he started to increase his usage or when he went off the books but you can see a drastic change from pictures of him in the fall of 2015 to his tour in Australia in January of 2016 along with the comments by the chefs about his change in eating habits and demeanor.

I think he may have been dealing with illness and he may not have been aware of what he was taking toward the end. I do not see a guy who had his underwear custom made buying drugs from some random person he got them from someone he trusted and something went wrong.

I do not see a private person like Prince complaining about not feeling well to random people unless he really did not know why he was not feeling well like he would normally feel taking these meds.

I think his last visit to Dr. S was to help with his drug issues but to also find out what exactly was wrong other then drug and joint problems.

"he might have lost a bit of the control he was so fond of..." ya think? this is the understatement of the century...

All that (to me) points to a guy who didn't know P still had those bottles until after his death.

Or a willing enabler who was too stupid to cover his tracks. At the end of the day he is responsible for those bottles. Now a days you the Rx holder are responsible diposting of remaining medication and not suppose to leave it around as well as getting rid of the bottles.

Prince should not have had any bottles with Kirk's name on them and if Kirk ever picked those bottles up from the Pharmacy it was his responsiblity to keep track of them.

I also am tired of this control freak stuff. What grown ass adult does not want to be in control of their life and business? He was the boss of his world and I do not see him being anymore controling then other people at his level. If things get screwed up it was all going to fall on his head.

purplerabbithole said:

Well, not totally disagreeing Laura (P might have been scared for health because something else was wrong.) but I think you didn't catch what I was saying about Kirk. I do think he gave P pills from his own stash of oxycodone etc in the past and that P still had the bottles. (I say it had to have been from the past because there are no other prescription of KJ's in Minnesota records). One could argue that KJ should not have been doing that, but it doesn't mean he didn't want to help P when shit really hit the fan later on. Probably at one point, P just reused the bottles. Whether he knew about P storing other shit in those bottles is impossible to know but since he left him alone that night after having invested his time in saving his life on a plane, getting him a rehab doctor, taking him to Walgreens for anti-anxiety and anti-nausea medicine, and then later looking for him to find him dead with KJ's own pill bottles laying about (and he didn't even try to dispose of the bottles after the fact) . All that (to me) points to a guy who didn't know P still had those bottles until after his death.

P was a control freak but he was also human. I imagine he was ocassionally unorganized; if P was dealing with illness and a drug problem, he might have lost a bit of the control he was so fond of.

laurarichardson said:

Do drug addicts (ashamed of their addiction)not hide their addictions. Do you seriously think P was going to tell people he had a drug problem he needed to kick before he could continue touring?

He could try and hide it all he wanted to but these drugs have side effects and I am not sure how Prince would have been able to not have any of the side effects of the drugs. Not one single person who worked with him has side anything about him being out of it or woozy from drugs or alcohol. Estates cannot sue for defamation so people are free to say whatever they like. Why are we not hearing anything?

I watched his last show. He did not have one misstep that entire show. I have watched at least one show going back to Musicology. Prince never missed a step on stage how is that possible if he was abusing these drugs the whole time?

I do wonder what the tests were for that Dr. S was getting. But they may very well be tests of his liver--which might have been damaged due to drug usage after Dr. S suggested getting the tests when P was not keeping food down, getting paler, and was losing weight. Are you suggesting that the medical board didn't take away Dr. S's license because of a grand conspiracy.

I am glad you are wondering because no one else seems to think that there is anything odd about someone who is suppose to be strung out on drugs telling at least two people he was not sure what was wrong and he was going to check with his doctor.

Do drug addicts have to check with their doctor to know they are drug addicts? It would not have been test to go to rehab because he spent the night before Andrew came alone so any test for entering rehab would have had to be conducted again immedialty before entering the rehab facility and once again Dr. S said he was seeing Prince for joint management not addiction management so why would have been giving him any test for entering rehab.

If losing weight and not keeping food down are the side effects of pain meds Prince would not have been pondering what was wrong and he certainly would not have put concerts on hold because he would have already known what was wrong. Do you realize at least one of those shows was going to be a 20k arena? He was putting a lot of money on hold and I do not think it was because of drugs. Plenty of rock stars take drugs and keep right on going with their shows since the need money to keep taking drugs.

Are you suggesting that the medical board didn't take away Dr. S's license because of a grand conspiracy. No maybe its because no one could prove that Dr. S didnt intend for those prescriptions to be Kirks. Its BS (they were obviously for P) but unless it can be proven, it don't mean shit. Other than that, Dr. S. did nothing illegal.

Why is 65K so high for drug addicted, chronic-pain suffering, middle-aged rock star

I think the medical board did not take away Dr. S license because he was treating Prince for an illness and it was not for drug addiction. I think if the family pushed Dr S could be in a lot of trouble for admitting he wrote Rxs in Kirk’s name for Prince despite the fact that the Rx’s were not pain meds. Writing any Rx pain meds or no is illegal and if the family wanted to push Dr. S could be in a lot of trouble. The same thing happened with Elvis the family pushed law enforcement to go after the doctor who prescribed those pills to Elvis. The ball is in Prince’ family court right now but I think they are fearful of what information concerning Prince’s health might come out and I think that is the real reason Dr. S is not in any trouble. No one is pushing to go after him because if someone pushed he would be in a lot of trouble. So no conspiracy.

As far as Kirk. Dr. S said he never wrote any pain meds for Prince but he did write them for Kirk with no direction for those pills to go anyone else. He is not responsible for whatever Kirk did with those pills once he picked up the RX.

Kirk is reasonable for the pills being in with Prince’s things as his name is own the bottle. You the person whose name appears on the bottle are responsible for the contents of the bottle. Did Kirk forget were he put a whole bottle of pain meds at a time when he had a boss who was seeing a doctor for joint pain? We need to stop cup caking for associates who may have been enablers.

I think 65k tells us he had other problems then just pain pills. I am sorry even people with Rx for these things can suffer organ damage from taking them over the long haul. Read about Walter Payton and his liver disease from taking pain pills which were prescribed to him by NFL doctors.

I think Prince used these drugs for a long time for pain and at some point in the past he had an Rxs. Not sure when he started to increase his usage or when he went off the books but you can see a drastic change from pictures of him in the fall of 2015 to his tour in Australia in January of 2016 along with the comments by the chefs about his change in eating habits and demeanor.

I think he may have been dealing with illness and he may not have been aware of what he was taking toward the end. I do not see a guy who had his underwear custom made buying drugs from some random person he got them from someone he trusted and something went wrong.

I do not see a private person like Prince complaining about not feeling well to random people unless he really did not know why he was not feeling well like he would normally feel taking these meds.

I think his last visit to Dr. S was to help with his drug issues but to also find out what exactly was wrong other then drug and joint problems.

ISaidLifeIsJustAGame said:

Who said this?

muleFunk said:

The contents were not dissolved.

They didn't find multiple pills in his stomach.

I am not advocating that P was a fentanyl abuser but I would just like to clarify that fentanyl doesnt stay in the your body long enough for someone to state whether someone was not a long time user.

So this doesn't add up: What illegal pill contains [God-knows-how-many-times-the-dose]?
Do legal and medical authorities have stats on illegal Fentanyl?
What's the worst capacity (pardon my french) a single illegal pill can hold?
Did Prince just happen to come across the most potent shit circulating on the streets?

Would'n't a drug dealer or conveyor for an international, important public figure
make sure the shit is über-clean, because the consumer is an international, important public figure,
and if shit hits the fan, repercussion are worse than the usual low-life common people overdose?

So someone, at some point, took the risk of buying something lethal instead of something if not legit,
at least something that is somewhat checked (trust me, a dealer doesn't want his customer dead — what's the point?)
to someone (Prince) s.he knew was a regular consumer.
In France, you can be sure the best lawyer would go with "non-assistance à personne en danger" and "homicide involontaire",
with arguments way sharper than Occazzion's blade, or whatever the fuck is his name.

laurarichardson said:

herb4 said:

Yeah, I doubt very highly that Prince ever intentionally took fentanyl.

And before anyone starts, no, I don't think anyone slipped it to him either. Sounds like he was masking his addcition by placing pills in vitamin and Alleve bottles (which is common for addicts) and, since they all appeared the same, couldn't recognize the fake ones. The drug tests seem to bare this out becasue if he was a regular user, it would have shown up.

However, to whoever it was that suggested the Narcan shot would have wiped out a positive test: no it wouldn't. It doesn't work like that and only alleviates the effects of an opioid OD. It's not a magic shot that flushes all signs of drugs out of your body and if anything it seems it'd make a positive drug test MORE likely.

https://forums.studentdoctor.net/threads/will-narcan-make-a-urine-drug-screen-negative.899036/

https://www.justanswer.co...ative.html

Why do you think the Atlanta promoter said that Prince told her he was not feeling a 100% and to hold off on announcing the rest of the shows until he went back to see his doctor?


Do drug addicts gave to go to a doctor to be told they are drug addicts?


Why did Prince tell Andrian Crutchfield he was not feeling 100% and that he was canceling the aftershow in Atlanta and that he would speak to his doctor and let him know about additional shows?


How come in the Minneapolis area we have no reports of other people dying from Prince's combo but the same combo is now being used as a death penalty drug in Nevada?


Why was a drug addict seeing a doctor for joint pain who had no specialization in addition mgnt?


How come Dr. S is still practicing med despite writing scripts for Prince under Kirk's name?


How come Andrew is not in jail?


How come contracts Prince had are being challenged?


Making it so UMG a company he did not want to do business with anymore can get all the work? Why did the drug addict have 65k for illness on his inventory sheet?


Was the 65k for illegal drugs?

The answer is money> Stop acting like the vultures have not pounced on this estate from the minute Prince died.
[Edited 10/2/17 5:08am]

All puzzling, but this one... Palme d'Or.

i agree generally laura, with age i know that there is always a resident control freak anywhere you go, someone has got to just be an overbearing bully, it wasn't just Prince, it's an american thing i think. Americans are generally obnoxious assholes.

laurarichardson said:

All that (to me) points to a guy who didn't know P still had those bottles until after his death.

Or a willing enabler who was too stupid to cover his tracks. At the end of the day he is responsible for those bottles. Now a days you the Rx holder are responsible diposting of remaining medication and not suppose to leave it around as well as getting rid of the bottles.

Prince should not have had any bottles with Kirk's name on them and if Kirk ever picked those bottles up from the Pharmacy it was his responsiblity to keep track of them.

I also am tired of this control freak stuff. What grown ass adult does not want to be in control of their life and business? He was the boss of his world and I do not see him being anymore controling then other people at his level. If things get screwed up it was all going to fall on his head.

purplerabbithole said:

Well, not totally disagreeing Laura (P might have been scared for health because something else was wrong.) but I think you didn't catch what I was saying about Kirk. I do think he gave P pills from his own stash of oxycodone etc in the past and that P still had the bottles. (I say it had to have been from the past because there are no other prescription of KJ's in Minnesota records). One could argue that KJ should not have been doing that, but it doesn't mean he didn't want to help P when shit really hit the fan later on. Probably at one point, P just reused the bottles. Whether he knew about P storing other shit in those bottles is impossible to know but since he left him alone that night after having invested his time in saving his life on a plane, getting him a rehab doctor, taking him to Walgreens for anti-anxiety and anti-nausea medicine, and then later looking for him to find him dead with KJ's own pill bottles laying about (and he didn't even try to dispose of the bottles after the fact) . All that (to me) points to a guy who didn't know P still had those bottles until after his death.

P was a control freak but he was also human. I imagine he was ocassionally unorganized; if P was dealing with illness and a drug problem, he might have lost a bit of the control he was so fond of.

And remember: there isn't a single doped up rock star junkie,
in Minnesotta or elsewhere's,
that would have performed like in Atlanta (randomly: 45'00'').

Now you can tell me Prince is Extraordinaire all thou whilst,
something does not compute.

So can we forget the junkie argument 4 ever, please?

purplerabbithole said:

I agree as well. The problem with drugs is that they do sometimes help people feel better... to calm people, to relieve pain etc. Unfortunately, its an affliction that is bound to destroy the abuser but is also really hard to know how to treat due to its immediate benefits (especially where chronic pain and social anxiety are concerned) and the cunning way over-achievers like Prince could hide their addiction through eccentricity and workaholic tendencies. . I do believe at times his vulnerabilities were defintely apparent but they were cryptic and hard to pin down. Another thing occurred to me while re-reading the search warrants. There were only a few ways to get ahold of Prince -- you had to know his private email, had have the contact info of his current staff and have his land line number at his hones. He had no cell phone so if he was traveling and you didn't have one of handler's numbers you werent' gonna get ahold of him. If you (as an former inner circle associate) decided to travel all the way to Paisley, there is no way of knowing if you would get to even talk to him. Would he be in town, would he allow you in, would he give you the run-around if he did? He had to invite you in and if he was too fearful to do so, how do you help him? Sadly, Prince destroyed himself through shame and fear and too much isolation and not enough life outside of music and because his inner circle were clueless about how to help a stubborn, secretive man like himself maintain his dignity and privacy while getting better and finding an emotional, physical and psychological balance at the same time. The privacy and dignity were going to eventually have to take a hit if he was really going to get the help he needed.

SpinsterSister said:

Thank you Herb4, for saying what I've believed all along. You're aces in my book

[Edited 10/1/17 18:57pm]

laurarichardson said:

Prince should not have had any bottles with Kirk's name on them
and if Kirk ever picked those bottles up from the Pharmacy it was his responsiblity to keep track of them.

True, and true again.

they say americans consume, what was it? 80 percent of the worlds drugs and we're only a 6 of the worlds population, i have to think there are other reasons than pain. something to do with how we live, it's not natural. It fucks peoples heads up with shame too, i've seen it totally fuck a close friends head up, then he projected all the guilt on the outside world, got paranoid, even acted like i was the worst human on the planet, i hate drugs and nothing i've seen makes me feel different. I don't tel people what to do, i just state how i feel about them and these addicts attack me because they feel guilty. Maybe it would be better if we had the conditions they do in other countries where we couldn't even get a lot of the drugs we do, would save a lot of lives. realy though, i don't know the answer, all i know is that i don't want to take anything unless it's really necessary and has a valid reason behind it and even then i'll feel ambiguous about it.

HOw many times do I have to say this...KURT did enable the prescription pills to be used by P...right or wrong. I do not however believe he necessarily had anything to do with the harder illegal drugs. If Kurt gave Prince the bottles of percocet a year and a half or two years before he died (the last year of P's life, Kurt had no registered prescriptions other than the one in Moline) (bottle and all), is he going to go back to a grown man and his boss and say "hey, P, give me back that empty bottle of percocet once you are done with them.., I am afraid you might eventually put some street drugs in them." You can enable up to a point in order help someone to relieve pain or because its your "job" ..it doesn't mean you have enabled Prince to buy dangerous black market pills. You probably think he enabled it the whole way through. I don't necessarily think so. I believe that those pills being in Aleve, vitamin and prescription pills bottles even around a private residence (at which everyone employee signs a NDA) indicates that Prince was hiding them from everyone. Enabling is a complicated thing. Relationships between grown-ass males is a complicated thing. Relationships between grown ass males when one is a boss and an eccentric, secretive rock star is even more complicated. But assuming that a man with 30 years of friendship with P (who saved his life ona a plane, was seeking out treatment and took him to get medicine to help his withdrawal symptoms) was not trying to find a balance between respecting his strong-willed boss's decisions for himself and looking out for his strong-willed boss (whilst still remaining in his job and thus in his life) is a bit unfair (to both P and KJ)> . I would like to hear his justification....but I am not going to assume that Kurt is the equivlaent of Prince's own personal stepin-fetchit just because it fits some rocknroll, celebrity cliche. He made mistakes where P was concerned. But its a tough spot.

laurarichardson said:

All that (to me) points to a guy who didn't know P still had those bottles until after his death.

Or a willing enabler who was too stupid to cover his tracks. At the end of the day he is responsible for those bottles. Now a days you the Rx holder are responsible diposting of remaining medication and not suppose to leave it around as well as getting rid of the bottles.

Prince should not have had any bottles with Kirk's name on them and if Kirk ever picked those bottles up from the Pharmacy it was his responsiblity to keep track of them.

I also am tired of this control freak stuff. What grown ass adult does not want to be in control of their life and business? He was the boss of his world and I do not see him being anymore controling then other people at his level. If things get screwed up it was all going to fall on his head.

purplerabbithole said:

Well, not totally disagreeing Laura (P might have been scared for health because something else was wrong.) but I think you didn't catch what I was saying about Kirk. I do think he gave P pills from his own stash of oxycodone etc in the past and that P still had the bottles. (I say it had to have been from the past because there are no other prescription of KJ's in Minnesota records). One could argue that KJ should not have been doing that, but it doesn't mean he didn't want to help P when shit really hit the fan later on. Probably at one point, P just reused the bottles. Whether he knew about P storing other shit in those bottles is impossible to know but since he left him alone that night after having invested his time in saving his life on a plane, getting him a rehab doctor, taking him to Walgreens for anti-anxiety and anti-nausea medicine, and then later looking for him to find him dead with KJ's own pill bottles laying about (and he didn't even try to dispose of the bottles after the fact) . All that (to me) points to a guy who didn't know P still had those bottles until after his death.

P was a control freak but he was also human. I imagine he was ocassionally unorganized; if P was dealing with illness and a drug problem, he might have lost a bit of the control he was so fond of.

[Edited 10/2/17 9:27am]