BartVanHemelen said:

Mumio said:

rogifan said:

Btw, Elisa Fiorillo says no unfinished music should be be released from the vault. Is she in favor of altering history too?

rogifan said:

BartVanHemelen said:

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Oh please, dude used plenty of those "replacement" curse words. As if saying "heck" isn't the same intent as using "hell". Typical religious hypocrisy.

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I fail to see why we should respect the opinions of Prince circa 2008 WRT material he recorded in 1984.

Then don’t. But y’all’s beef is with him not me.

But you are advocating for music to be edited, censored or not released. That makes you beefworthy.

rogifan said:

Btw, Elisa Fiorillo says no unfinished music should be be released from the vault. Is she in favor of altering history too?

PRINCE. LEFT. NO. WILL.

THAT would be the ultimate crossing of Ts and dotting of Is.

She is feeling very personal about it because of how close she is. We should respect his work yes, but we shouldn't be dealing with it out of his own guilt or remorse or other restrictive issues.

SupaFunkyOrgangrinderSexy said:

rogifan said:

BartVanHemelen said: Then don’t. But y’all’s beef is with him not me.

But you are advocating for music to be edited, censored or not released. That makes you beefworthy.

SupaFunkyOrgangrinderSexy said:

rogifan said:

SupaFunkyOrgangrinderSexy said:

But you are advocating for music to be edited, censored or not released. That makes you beefworthy.

Show me one post where I ever advocated music to be edited or censored. I haven’t.

You keep saying that we should respect Prince's wishes and he did those things.

SupaFunkyOrgangrinderSexy said:

rogifan said:

Btw, Elisa Fiorillo says no unfinished music should be be released from the vault. Is she in favor of altering history too?

Bless her heart, however Prince said himself someone will release it, he probably will not be able to.


Second, I agree 100% Prince would not have wanted some tacky hologram of him on stage. Tyka...stop the madness boo.

he never said I dont want unfinished music released....we all can agree we would not want it touched ..just released as is

[Edited 8/23/17 11:40am]

BartVanHemelen said:

rogifan said:

Why is reading comprehension so difficult? Curse words and dirty (in a sexual nature) are two different things. Prince didn’t take the sex out of his music but he did stop cursing

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Oh please, dude used plenty of those "replacement" curse words. As if saying "heck" isn't the same intent as using "hell". Typical religious hypocrisy.

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I fail to see why we should respect the opinions of Prince circa 2008 WRT material he recorded in 1984.

You fail to see why you should respct the opinions of the person who created the music? As if there is some existential 'Prince' that still exists in 1984 who didn't age and change his mind about who he was and what he did in the 80's?

Humans live and experience things that cause them to change their minds about what they've said and done or created. That is a God given right each of us has. Now Prince's work is up for whomever to make whatever decision on it but the sentiment that we shouldn't give a fuck about Prince's opinion of himself and his work as a 57 year old man is probably the greatest insult to him one could possibly utter.

I'm PRETTY SURE they were PROUD of their cursing music even as they edited and mubbled the words and all that. Dude was nothing, if not a contradiction. Release the music as it was recorded, no changes. The censoring is misguided. Why did he stop cursing again? WHYDFML (oooh yeah).

[Edited 8/25/17 16:02pm]

Polo1026 said:

rogifan said:

Polo1026 said:

You fail to see why you should respct the opinions of the person who created the music? As if there is some existential 'Prince' that still exists in 1984 who didn't age and change his mind about who he was and what he did in the 80's?

Humans live and experience things that cause them to change their minds about what they've said and done or created. That is a God given right each of us has. Now Prince's work is up for whomever to make whatever decision on it but the sentiment that we shouldn't give a fuck about Prince's opinion of himself and his work as a 57 year old man is probably the greatest insult to him one could possibly utter.

As Prince would say: Exactly!

but you could see that Prince was becoming more relaxed about it all the further away he got from his conversion. I beleive some of those restrictive beliefs were starting to loosen if not get ready to fall away.

SoulAlive said:

well... I'm not sure. I do love what some people did with his music. Wether it was Wendy & Lisa in the Revolution era, the way drums were changed in the Rainbow Children era, hell, even some things with 3rd Eye Girl or Ian Boxhill's take on the recent nearly released songs...

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This might be controversial, but why not have outsiders take some of Prince's unfinished songs and see what they do with it? As long as you also release what they started out with, I have no problem with it. (similar to what was done to some Michael Jackson tracks)

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Prince changed his mind repeatedly and frustratingly, often without seeming to think things through. (and sometimes he surprised with deep insights) He died without leaving a will and the estate is trying to sell the rights to the vault in one go. I wish I had the money to buy it and then go through the process of catalogueing, restoring and, yes, finishing stuff. Wether it should only be era specific people (they changed too, maybe they're no longer the right fit?) or engineers or new and hit generating people... I don't know.

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There's a constant in Prince's work. He always pushed himself and he always experimented with things (sometimes musically, sometimes with business, sometimes with new ways to be an asshole, sometimes with new ways to help people), so why can't his work be played with and experimented with? It might not always work, but sometimes it might be wonderful. Just like the output of Prince himself. It will definitely honour the spirit of his work.

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Now, at the same time, get a curator and bring deluxe editions of all his albums with extra tracks and get era specific releases with only vault music... but don't exclude the option to "finish" some things.

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It's no longer possible to have Prince do promotion or live shows, so the marketing will have to be done differently, but I'm sure there are examples of things that worked. Work needs to be done to keep his current fanbase happy and at the same time, the general public and new audiences also need to be catered to. If there is no money coming in, then Paisley Park and the vault are doomed.

SupaFunkyOrgangrinderSexy said:

Much like how our history should not be erased, neither should Prince's music with profanity. It is who we were at that time, and it is who he was at that time. Knowing what got us to where we are, and what got Prince to where he was, the experiences, good and bad, are important.

rogifan said:

SupaFunkyOrgangrinderSexy said:

but you could see that Prince was becoming more relaxed about it all the further away he got from his conversion. I beleive some of those restrictive beliefs were starting to loosen if not get ready to fall away.

\no I don’t see where he ever became relaxed about swearing. And as far as sexual content/innuendo when did he ever give that up? Though as I said in another thread during one of the P&M after show parties he made the DJ turn off Head. Someone is going to have to make these decisions and judgement calls but I think profanity is an easy one. And I’ll bet most of the songs in the vault don’t even contain profanity.

It is such a ridiculous argument because sex out of wedlock is surely WORSE on the morailty meter than cursing. It is all so stupid. Either you follow your morality all the way or just shut up about it.

Polo1026 said:

BartVanHemelen said:

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Oh please, dude used plenty of those "replacement" curse words. As if saying "heck" isn't the same intent as using "hell". Typical religious hypocrisy.

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I fail to see why we should respect the opinions of Prince circa 2008 WRT material he recorded in 1984.

You fail to see why you should respct the opinions of the person who created the music? As if there is some existential 'Prince' that still exists in 1984 who didn't age and change his mind about who he was and what he did in the 80's?

Humans live and experience things that cause them to change their minds about what they've said and done or created. That is a God given right each of us has. Now Prince's work is up for whomever to make whatever decision on it but the sentiment that we shouldn't give a fuck about Prince's opinion of himself and his work as a 57 year old man is probably the greatest insult to him one could possibly utter.

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Why would the opinions he held in 2016 be more relevant than the ones he held in 2006, 1996 or 1986? Especially considering his untimely death.

leadline said:

SupaFunkyOrgangrinderSexy said:

rogifan said:

kingricefan said:

I think that the fans should have access to any song that Prince recorded while under contract with WB if it's in WB 'vault,' whether or not it contains profanity, but only up to the point when Prince decided to stop using the profanity in his songs. Otherwise, it's like taking all of the profanity out of something like a book that was published years ago and republishing a new edition with no profanity. It's not the artist's vision at the time of creation, is it? Those words were put in there for a reason, otherwise they wouldn't have been there in the first place.

Disagree. If WCF had been on Purple Rain and it was left off or curse words edited out I could understand but that’s not the case here. If it’s a previously unreleased song (bootlegs don’t count) then not releasing it isn’t rewriting history. When Prince stopped using profanity he also stopped performing any songs that contained profanity. My position is if WB decides to remaster other albums leave them as is but when it comes to previously unreleased music then release stuff that doesn’t contain profanity.

Didn't prince once say his raunchiest stuff (not sure if that's the word he used, it's as close as I can remember right now) was unrleased and that people would have to wait until after he's gone to hear it?

rogifan said:

kingricefan said:

We agree to disagree then. Prince stopped using profanity-laden songs but that didn't stop people from going out and buying the 1999 album and hear him say 'I sincerely wanna f*ck the taste out of your mouth', did it? Prince didn't tell WB to stop selling those albums from his past, did he? Those songs were all recorded and played on radio long before he gettisoned his use of profanity and yet they were still available to the fans for purchase. Not releasing the songs with profanity isn't rewriting history, but it is EDITING history. I don't want someone (WB executive or family member) deciding what version of a song we get to hear that Prince recorded at a time when he thought it was okay for him to record it as is. No one should edit or alter the musical history of Prince.

[Edited 8/21/17 13:28pm]

How is not releasing something editing it? What if Prince left instructions that said don’t release anything from the vault EVER. Would that be editing history? Just because music is in the vault doesn’t mean the public has a right to hear it.

Except he said the exact opposite, he specifically said the martial in the vault would be released after he's gone.

Polo1026 said:

BartVanHemelen said:

.

Oh please, dude used plenty of those "replacement" curse words. As if saying "heck" isn't the same intent as using "hell". Typical religious hypocrisy.

.

I fail to see why we should respect the opinions of Prince circa 2008 WRT material he recorded in 1984.

You fail to see why you should respct the opinions of the person who created the music? As if there is some existential 'Prince' that still exists in 1984 who didn't age and change his mind about who he was and what he did in the 80's?

Humans live and experience things that cause them to change their minds about what they've said and done or created. That is a God given right each of us has. Now Prince's work is up for whomever to make whatever decision on it but the sentiment that we shouldn't give a fuck about Prince's opinion of himself and his work as a 57 year old man is probably the greatest insult to him one could possibly utter.

But the music recorded in the 80s represents the 80s version of Prince, he recorded music later in his life that represents who he was then. Editing or censoring any of it (not releasing a song because of it's contents is censoring it) loses part of that recorded history. History that Prince specifially said multiple times would be released after he's gone.

rogifan said:

SupaFunkyOrgangrinderSexy said:

It is such a ridiculous argument because sex out of wedlock is surely WORSE on the morailty meter than cursing. It is all so stupid. Either you follow your morality all the way or just shut up about it.

Take that up with Prince not me.

I take it up with you because you keep pushing the position that songs with curse words should not be released "per Prince's wishes".

prince wanted to release everything he recorded .. he constantly bitched about not being able to release as much as he wanted .. when he dropped wb he couldn't get anyone to release more than one disk at a time .. npgmc had all sorts of nuggets .. bootlegs .. random collabs remixes new songs ...

prince used to bitch about how contracts were bullshit and made it impossible to collaborate with some people .. now look at the mess that made with boxil or whomever else worked with him .. even warner and universal and the estate seem to have a huge contractual mess to figure out ..

prince decided not to curse on stage .. fans were bringing kids .. he is appealing to an older generation with kids and maturity .. these are the reasons for the what the ducks etc ...

prince dont care if you buy his old cursing music .. that just was not his current way of being but he was not trying to bann his old tunes

considering all of the above you can see this isn't really some moral dilema .. its far more practical .. he would want all his music heard .. maybe don't play the good pussy song for your 5 year old .. you know common sense .. but there is nothing to indicate he wouldn't want it all released as is at some point

and yes .. a will or the delete button would have clarified all that but who really cares .. we all swear .. even you pretend christians .. everything else is a matter of legality and business .. not a matter of him recording 7,000 songs that he would be mortified if anyone ever heard .. jesus .. who would do that ...no one