MMJas said:

I do not have all the answers I just have thought about this all a bit. We now know that Prince had scripts written for him in Kirk's name. Do you really think this is the first time in his life he did this?

Think about it. If he had surgery, was in the hosptial in 2015, 2014 and was in the hospital on the 20th as well as that 65k medical expense on his inventory report he has been treated by a doctor and probaly under an assumed name. I am sure he has Rx written for him before the 7th under other names for goodness sake he traveled under a different name.

I doubt anyone had the ablity to force Prince to do anything. These withdrawals are very bad and if he wanted to make the Atlanta concert he had to get something from the doctor. Stop giving KJ so much credit because if he was begging and pleading for Prince to get help he might have taken the time to explain this to the police instead of telling tall tales.

Did Prince distrust docs when he had surgery on his hip? Do we know he distrusted doctors or was he just being a man because I do not know any men that willing want to go to a doctor for anything. Some of them will go if they are dying of pain and maybe if certain equiptment is not working. I also suspect that he has some old wack fashioned ideas about doctors feeling on all over his wife bascially being paranoid that something freaky was going to happen.

Why do you think some guy refuse to get prostate exam? They do not want to be touched and grabbed on.

NotACleverName said:

You are, apparently, the only org member with ALL the answers so, you tell me why the man didn't have a general care physician? A family doc of his own. It was because he didn't trust too many folks. The ONLY reason he even went to Dr. S is because KJ had previously utilized his services and recommended him to Prince. And I bet Kirk had to do an extreme amount of fancy footwork to even get Prince to consider Dr. S. Do you not recall his distrust of doctors during Mayte's pregnancy? Have you forgotten about that? Additionally, I think the fact that the people "around" him sought outside help with regard to this entire scenario, is proof that they were painfully aware they didn't possess "any medical knowledge". laurarichardson said:

We have no idea about his willingness to accept advice but we know he went willing to see Dr. S and it appears he was trying to withdraw so I do not believe all of this was about not listening not that people around would have any medical knowledge.

[Edited 4/25/17 10:59am]

zenarose said:

MMJas said:

Dr. S could have been that doctor. He could have waited for Prince and decided to take the blood results himself since it was an urgent matter and Prince not showing up for that follow up appointment probably meant he was not taking rehab/treatment seriously. Just some thoughts.

It could have been Dr. S, we don't know. Notice though that in the media reports that the Doctor on standby was an "UN NAMED" Doctor. The search warrant didn't mention another MD, so possibly another false report or possibly protecting another potential witness, ect. I think there has been so much false and misleading information put out RE: OFFICIALLY UNOFFICIAL SOURCES. Like my Nanny used to say..... "Tryin' to find the truth is sometimes like pickn' fleas off a chicken's butt"

Some of the stuff from the unnamed source I believe was bull. I do not think there was another doctor at the scence. Six people at PP Kirk, Meron, two paramedics, Andrew, and Dr. S.

Which begs the question who was going to administer the Subxone that you supposely need a license to administer. No one would have known what they were doing and Prince may not have been any better off.

Give me the autopsy report and I can figure it out from there.

1Sasha said:

Give me the autopsy report and I can figure it out from there.

Exactly!

laurarichardson said:

And the doctor Prince mentioned on Saturday night - was he or she ever identified? Why did he need to have a doctor present?

1Sasha said:

zenarose said:

1Sasha said:

And the doctor Prince mentioned on Saturday night - was he or she ever identified? Why did he need to have a doctor present?

Nope, not that I know of. But the person in attendance that night stated that P just kept on and on about him. ???? I think that is strange.

That is indeed strange, for many reasons. Prince, being the private person that he was, would know that there would be speculation regarding his health if he publicaclly went on and on about a dcotor.
Unless he had already decided to go into rehab and knew that it would all came out, somehow, so he was trying to be one step ahead.

Quite frankly, after the plane incident and the whole "don't believe the papers", this public praising of a doctor sounds very strange.

zenarose said:

laurarichardson said:

Some of the stuff from the unnamed source I believe was bull. I do not think there was another doctor at the scence. Six people at PP Kirk, Meron, two paramedics, Andrew, and Dr. S.

Which begs the question who was going to administer the Subxone that you supposely need a license to administer. No one would have known what they were doing and Prince may not have been any better off.

LAURA: the media said the Dr on standby was never there. So what it seemed to me was that he (the standby MD) was waiting for a call from the folks at PP to let him know to come and do the evaluation. He never got that call. Do you remember that? I cant post links as my phone has a life of its own. 😣

No I just remember some of the papers saying some other doctor was at PP. It would not surprise if differnent media outlets were saying different things just make more confusion.

I wonder if the police know who the stand by doctor was?

laurarichardson said:

MMJas said:

zenarose said:

1Sasha said: Nope, not that I know of. But the person in attendance that night stated that P just kept on and on about him. ???? I think that is strange.

That is indeed strange, for many reasons. Prince, being the private person that he was, would know that there would be speculation regarding his health if he publicaclly went on and on about a dcotor.
Unless he had already decided to go into rehab and knew that it would all came out, somehow, so he was trying to be one step ahead.

Quite frankly, after the plane incident and the whole "don't believe the papers", this public praising of a doctor sounds very strange.

He supposely said everybody give my doctor a hand for helping me out. He is a great guy.

Remember this was the next day maybe he had taken the withdrawals meds and did actually feel better or knew he was going to have to make a decision about going into a hosptial soon.

He might also thought that Dr. S was really helping him.

Hatrina: Hey, I'm just as confused as you are, so join the club!

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All the reports are stating that Kirk only got meds for Prince one time! But, yet the affidavit says otherwise. (see link below)

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Dr. S. states that he never wrote Rx's for Prince in Kirk Johnson's name, but yet the affidavit says otherwise. (see link below)

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http://www.spin.com/2017/...documents/

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http://people.com/music/p...er-claims/

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HatrinaHaterwitz said:

cloveringold85 said:

How is that even possible when this is on page 4 of the released Search Warrant for Kirk's cell phone?

During a search warrant executed at Paisley Park on 4/21/2016 (the day Prince was found deceased), a suitcase was found in Prince’s bedroom next to his bed. Among the items inside that suitcase were prescription pill bottles in the name of Johnson. A closer examination of those pill bottles revealed that not all the pills inside the containers were the pills listed on the prescription. One of the pill bottles, a Vitamin D bottle, was found to contain the controlled substance Ondanselron Hydrochloride.

A second prescription bottle, said to contain Ondansetron, was found to contain the controlled substance Acetaminophen/oxycodone hydrochloride. The date those medications were prescribed to Johnson, according to the pill bottles, was 4/7/2016. The medications were prescribed by Dr. Schulenberg.

[Edited 4/24/17 19:37pm]

LOVESYMBOLNUMBER2 said:

I don't get why it was so hard to formulate an effective plan. They lived in the world of rock and roll, where mega stars are f*cked up all the time and go to exclusive totally private rehab. Kirk had be around 30 years, in all that time he had never been around or heard stories of other stars and musicians in similar circumstances. If any group of people would have some inroads to rehab you would think this would be them. It is really astonishing what a shit show of a plan they developed. Even the hookers at the bunny ranch new how to save Lamar Odom, once again for me it does not compute

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I agree! And, what a shit show it was! Amazing how Prince's army have the ability to plan events, tributes, merchandising, elaborate tours and promotions but don't have the ability or common sense to pick up the phone and simply dial 911 or call a local doctor/treatment facility. It's not rocket science! It's a lot easier to get him to a local treatment facility, than it is to call some looney doctor in California who never even personally met with Prince, and even worse, send your med student son who never met Prince either and quite frankly doesn't know jack squat! Shaking my damn head at all this damn nonsense!

We dont know whether P agreed to go into rehab.

Dr. K's center "Recovery Without Walls" is an out-patient

treatment center so P wasnt going into an in-patient treatment facility.

cloveringold85 said:

LOVESYMBOLNUMBER2 said:

I don't get why it was so hard to formulate an effective plan. They lived in the world of rock and roll, where mega stars are f*cked up all the time and go to exclusive totally private rehab. Kirk had be around 30 years, in all that time he had never been around or heard stories of other stars and musicians in similar circumstances. If any group of people would have some inroads to rehab you would think this would be them. It is really astonishing what a shit show of a plan they developed. Even the hookers at the bunny ranch new how to save Lamar Odom, once again for me it does not compute

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I agree! And, what a shit show it was! Amazing how Prince's army have the ability to plan events, tributes, merchandising, elaborate tours and promotions but don't have the ability or common sense to pick up the phone and simply dial 911 or call a local doctor/treatment facility. It's not rocket science! It's a lot easier to get him to a local treatment facility, than it is to call some looney doctor in California who never even personally met with Prince, and even worse, send your med student son who never met Prince either and quite frankly doesn't know jack squat! Shaking my damn head at all this damn nonsense!

From that interview Kirk did not seem that smart to me.

MMJas said:

cloveringold85 said:

.

Laura: I agree. He comes across as cold-hearted. The part that got me upset is when the interviewer said that people want someone to be prosecuted for Prince's death and KJ's response was: "That is their problem".

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What a thing to say to all his grieving fans and loved ones. After he said that, I changed my opinion of him.

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I don't know if that inteview was heavily-edited or what, but he did not come across as showing any compassion. All he wanted to do was talk about the Anniversary Tribute at PP. I'm sure his attorney is telling him to keep a tight lip too! No doubt.

Now that was cold. And defensive, I guess. Because even if Kirk does not see this as his problem, even if he knows that Prince got those pills illegally without him knowing and for that reason he feels he is in no way responsible, in my opinion he should still be kicking himself for not noticing, not being there, not doing more. The person always feels they should/could have done more. That's the first thing most people say when someone dies from a tragedy like this: I wish I could have done more, I wish I had noticed something was wrong. So saying outright "that's their problem" sounds to me quite defensive. Jmo.

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MMJ: How could he not see this as his problem when the Rx's were found with his name on them? Even if Prince did get those bad pills on his own, Kirk still needs to take accountability that he played a part in Prince's dependency/addiction. How can he turn a blind eye to that?

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Maybe he feels to blame or that he should have done more and is being defensive, like you said?

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Yes, when we lose a loved one, we always feel like we could have done more. I felt that way when I lost my Mother and I just lost my beloved Dog of 14.5 years in December. I will always feel like I could have done more because that's what happens when you love someone and care about them so much.

ISaidLifeIsJustAGame said:

We dont know whether P agreed to go into rehab.

Dr. K's center "Recovery Without Walls" is an out-patient

treatment center so P wasnt going into an in-patient treatment facility.

So he would have been receiving the same treatment he was receiving from Dr. S. Withdrawal meds and weening.

TheEnglishGent said:

MMJas said:

So what about the withdrawal medication prescribed by Doctor S? And all those prescritions(4?) that apparently were filled in one week? There was no trace of anything else in his system?

The released autopsy report was just for cause of death, so nothing else being listed doesn't mean nothing else was in his system. The full report would probably show this but we're never going to see that so will never know.

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Exactly. We will never know the whole truth because P's family will never release the full autopsy report. I think MN law is 30-years from now it can be public, but that's a might long time from now!

cloveringold85 said:

TheEnglishGent said:

The released autopsy report was just for cause of death, so nothing else being listed doesn't mean nothing else was in his system. The full report would probably show this but we're never going to see that so will never know.

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Exactly. We will never know the whole truth because P's family will never release the full autopsy report. I think MN law is 30-years from now it can be public, but that's a might long time from now!

We will never see the full report. I honestly think those pills had messed him bad but it is okay because in the end it is the privacy he always wanted to have and he is getting it.

laurarichardson said:

PurpleDiamonds1 said:

Mumio said: Phaedra has conflicting dates with when she worked with Prince. She has been caught lying, and had settled out of court recently with the Estate. She was one of three people with Prince at the WB meeting to get his masters back And some questioned if she may have been Ps POA.

She is trying to say she stopped working for him in 2015. Yet her name appears as the manager of the LLC for registration in Ca in January of 2016 and she is the one that contacted the real estate agent about buying the purple house in January of 2016. Now media reports are that she contacted Dr. K in April of 2016 and that she might have been his POA on the Tidal deal.

Why is she lying and trying to back away from her employment with Prince? Where did the payments in April and November that Tidal sent to Prince go since Breamer/McMillian claim only one payment of $750,000.00 was paid?

With the WSJ article today and the taped phone converstation with Koppelmen in the court papers yesterday who cannot see the number of vultures involved. I am sorry if Prince was dealing with withdrawals he was not on his boss game so I believe people took advantage. I believe numerous people are still taking advantage to get money. More stuff is going to come out and you will see more was going on then just drug issues.

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So true, Laura. Prince got used in his life and now in his death. So sad. These greedy vultures just keep coming out of nowhere. They all have blood on their hands.

LOVESYMBOLNUMBER2 said:

"First of all, it's unethical to prescribe a medication for someone you haven't seen. It's also unethical to prescribe across state lines if the patient is residing in another state. And if you're not licensed here, you're practicing medicine in Minnesota without a license and that's illegal," Willenbring said. Willenbring is founder and CEO of Alltyr Clinic in St. Paul, which offers addiction treatment including buprenorphine. The drug is available in Minnesota, so there was no reason to bring it from California, he said. "I assume this was done because of the wish for anonymity, but that doesn't excuse it," Willenbring said. "It could well have been illegal for his son to be transporting medication that was not prescribed for him. ... I think there's a clear legal infraction there, no matter what." Two Minneapolis attorneys also questioned Kornfeld carrying the drug across state lines. Fabian Hoffner, who represents doctors in licensing matters, called it "highly unusual that a physician would send drugs with his son, or anyone" to Minnesota for them then to be given through a doctor. Dozens of doctors are authorized to prescribe buprenorphine in Minnesota, including Willenbring and his colleagues. Federal law limits doctors to 100 patients, but Willenbring said he isn't at the limit. "I could have driven to Paisley Park from my office in 20 minutes. I would have been happy to do so," he said. Mauzy said Prince's representatives told Howard Kornfeld that the singer was "dealing with a grave medical emergency." He declined Wednesday to detail the emergency. Asked what Kornfeld should have done if told Prince's condition was an emergency, Willenbring said: "If it's an emergency, call 911 for God's sake. Don't send your pre-med son on a redeye."

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Lovesymbol: THANK YOU!! This is what I've been trying to say, but no one listens to reason!

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I read that exact article you are speaking about. And, what Willenbring said is what any ethical and moral doctor would say! And, people are arguing about this "privacy" bullshit -- give me a damn break already! Doctor's have to obide by privacy and confidentiality laws and they cannot discuss any treatment of any patient! And, this does not matter if you are Prince or just a regular Joe on the street! There was no reason from Prince's clan to contact a doctor in California. Period!!

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And you know the sad part about all of this, is that if Prince's inner circle chose PLAN A (which would have been a helluva lot easier), instead of PLAN B -- he most likely would still be with us!!

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Who the hell cares if you picked up the phone and got Prince into a local treatment facility against his will. So what? So, he will be upset with you, but you just might have SAVED HIS LIFE, and he would be thanking you later!

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LOVESYMBOLNUMBER2 said:

disch said:

I think it's all irrelevant because Prince was definitely dead by the time Andrew's plane landed and likely dead before it even took off from San Fran.

But prince was not dead when dr korn was called and then implemented the dumbest intervention plan I have ever heard of, so you think that is irrelevant, lots of us do not

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Lovesymbol: Amen to that!!

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Prince was still ALIVE when all their little "planning" was going on.

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Actually, breaking federal laws and unethical behavior is VERY relevant to Prince's death!!

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Help came too late.......where's the accountability?

PennyPurple said:

Prince wasn't even Dr. K's patient. They hadn't even examined him, seen him, or laid hands on him.

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Prince hadn't even accepted going thru their treatment program. They never met with Prince.

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None of this is the Kornfields fault. If Princes crew were so worried they should've called 911 or got him to the drug treatment place right up the road.

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Penny: But you must understand, that Dr. K and Dr. S were both communicating with each other and well-aware of Prince's condition, so they both have to take some responsibility here, do you not agree?

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Am I the only person (well, besides a few others here) that see's there is a ethical and moral responsibility that these doctor's need to uphold?

cloveringold85 said:

Agree. Just the thought of this makes me as angry in 2017 as it did in 2016 and probably will in 2018 and beyond.

laurarichardson said:

cloveringold85 said:

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I agree! And, what a shit show it was! Amazing how Prince's army have the ability to plan events, tributes, merchandising, elaborate tours and promotions but don't have the ability or common sense to pick up the phone and simply dial 911 or call a local doctor/treatment facility. It's not rocket science! It's a lot easier to get him to a local treatment facility, than it is to call some looney doctor in California who never even personally met with Prince, and even worse, send your med student son who never met Prince either and quite frankly doesn't know jack squat! Shaking my damn head at all this damn nonsense!

From that interview Kirk did not seem that smart to me.

.

Personally, I dont care for the guy. I just can't believe that Prince had these blood suckers, leeching off of him!!

laurarichardson said:

cloveringold85 said:

.

Exactly. We will never know the whole truth because P's family will never release the full autopsy report. I think MN law is 30-years from now it can be public, but that's a might long time from now!

We will never see the full report. I honestly think those pills had messed him bad but it is okay because in the end it is the privacy he always wanted to have and he is getting it.

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When you are no longer on this earth, there is no right to privacy. Sounds blunt, but it's the God's honest truth. And, when there is a homicide investigation, there is no right to privacy. All cards should be on the table for all to see. Doesn't matter if you are famous or not.

cloveringold85 said:

laurarichardson said: