independent and unofficial
Prince fan community
Welcome! Sign up or enter username and password to remember me
Forum jump
Forums > Prince: Music and More > Article worth reading. Brings up good points
« Previous topic  Next topic »
Page 3 of 5 <12345>
  New topic   Printable     (Log in to 'subscribe' to this topic)
Reply #60 posted 08/18/16 3:47pm

laurarichardso
n

fortuneandserendipity said:



laurarichardson said:


lwr001 said:
https://www.minnpost.com/mental-health-addiction/2016/06/jennifer-matesa-writer-addiction-prince-was-out-there-his-own [Edited 8/18/16 8:07am] Last week, when the Midwest Medical Examiner’s Office released its official report, concluding that Prince had died of self-administered fentanyl, a powerful synthetic opioid painkiller, I recalled a conversation I’d had back in 2014 with Jennifer Matesa, blogger, recipient of a SAMHSA Voice Awards Fellowship, and author of “The Recovering Body: Physical and Spiritual Fitness for Living Clean and Sober.” In our earlier conversation, Matesa had described her own addiction to fentanyl, and the long and painful process she endured to get the drug out of her system. Then, I paid a visit to Guinevere Gets Sober, Matesa’s popular recovery blog, where I read her personal and compassionate post about Prince, and I knew we had to talk. I gave Matesa a call at her Pittsburgh home earlier this week, and we had a wide-ranging conversation about my favorite musician’s dangerous addiction, his untimely death and about what may have motivated him to use opiates in the first place. The interview has been edited and trimmed. MinnPost: What inspired you to write about Prince on your blog? Jennifer Matesa: As a creative person and a former addict, I have an affinity with Prince. Creative types tend to drive themselves past certain limits. Prince was a physically small man. He was smaller than I am. He spent the majority of his life jumping and dancing around on stage wearing high heels with a heavy guitar strapped on his chest. You can’t expect to do that for 30 years without damaging your body or injuring your psyche. When Prince died in April, at first some people said he was taking Percocet [acetaminophen and oxycodone]. But when I read that they had to give him a save shot when his plane made an emergency landing in Moline, I said, “There was no way he was just taking Percocet. ... He was probably taking a single-entity opioid, and it was probably pretty strong.” I know my drugs. MP: So you’re theorizing that Prince’s addiction started a long time before he died? JM: I’ve read that he was on strong opioids for 25 or 30 years. If that’s so, that means that he probably produced most of the body of his work while on opioids. There are files of photos of him where his pupils are pinned (abnormally constricted). I’ve looked it up online and this goes way, way back. Pinned pupils are the one sign of opioid abuse that a user can’t hide. Photos of Prince, even in low light, show that his pupils are pinned. MP: Clearly, I’m a deluded Minnesotan. I always thought that Prince was sober because he was famous for living such a clean lifestyle. I was sad for me to hear that he was addicted to opioids. Jennifer Matesa Jennifer Matesa JM: I think it is interesting that you say that. What is the cultural prejudice that drives your unwillingness to think that your beloved artist could be a stone junkie? I don’t use words like “junkie” lightly. I used to call myself a junkie. A person can be addicted and still be an artist. They can be addicted and still be an amazing person. MP: Are people ever prescribed fentanyl for hip pain? Could Prince have been getting the drug legally from his physician? JM: Where he got the drug doesn’t matter. The fact is that Prince’s tox screen at the end of his life said that he had fentanyl in his bloodstream. He overdosed on fentanyl. That’s it. I almost overdosed on fentanyl a few times. It [is scary]. MP: How did you end up taking fentanyl? JM: I didn’t start out with fentanyl. I have migraines and fibromyalgia. I started out with codeine during my pregnancy. Then, after I stopped breastfeeding, I switched to Vicodin [acetaminophen and hydrocodone]. When I went to a pain clinic in my hometown of Pittsburgh, I was given pure hydrocodone. Then I moved to OxyContin [oxycodone] and then eventually to fentanyl. By 2005, I was on straight fentanyl patches. I was also given fentanyl lollypops for free. They would give you coupons to take to the pharmacy. I became addicted through my prescribers. It was a particular moment in medical history when physicians were prescribing opioids for all kinds of conditions. MP: But fentanyl is so potent. I thought it was usually reserved for people who are actively dying. JM: That’s not always the case in the United States. Once, when I was traveling overseas, I ran out of fentanyl patches. I went to a pharmacist, who said, “We only give those to people with cancer.” But in this country we give powerful painkillers like that to a lot of people who do not have a fatal disease. Fentanyl is the most potent painkiller. You can’t start on it. It could kill you if you did. You’d have to be taking other opioids for a while first. It is pharmacologically different from other opioids. It is fat-soluble. That means it crosses the blood-brain barrier quickly. That’s part of the reason that fentanyl deaths are increasing in this country. They are not nearly at the level of other opioid-based drugs like heroin, but they are happening. The Federal Drug Abuse Warning Network says that it is very hard for EMS personnel to get to fentanyl victims quickly enough because the drug works so fast. MP: You just said you almost overdosed on fentanyl a few times. How did that happen? JM: I almost overdosed on fentanyl because I took too much. I didn’t go to a hospital. I was lucky I survived. I abused my drugs. I was prescribed adhesive patches that were intended to be placed directly on the skin. But I got to a point where I’d cut my patches into small pieces and stick them to the inside of my cheek so the fentanyl would enter my system faster. I’d do this when I had run out of the drug for a few days before I could fill a new prescription. I’d be in withdrawal, and I figured out that it was a faster way to get the drug into my system. When the drug entered my bloodstream that way, it would spike the levels in my blood. I clearly remember lying in bed at night and feeling that my breathing was slowing. I’d wonder to myself, “Is my body going to remember to breathe?” Sometimes I’d keep myself awake because I didn’t have a way to reverse the effects of the drug. MP: This sounds frightening. What did it feel like? JM: The feeling of respiratory depression is really scary. It is beyond your control. It is almost as if you are lying down and someone is stacking bricks on your chest. You can’t breathe. I am very fortunate that I didn’t die. If you write in your column that I told you I cut the patch into pieces, make sure to say it can kill you. It is lethal. MP: I know that this question may be going too far, but I’m still going to ask it: When you experienced that feeling of respiratory depression, were you ever at the point where you just thought, “Maybe I should surrender to this?” If you’d rather not answer, I’d respect that. JM: Actually, it’s a really great question, because so many people are overdosing these days and a lot of the discussion about addiction is being driven around whether people who fatally overdose actually do it on purpose. I personally think that a lot or even most of these overdoses are accidents. People don’t actually want to die. They either have taken heroin that is spiked with a drug that is stronger than they thought it was, or they take an opioid with alcohol or a benzodiazepine and that makes it fatal. Those few times when I experienced respiratory depression, I didn’t want to die. I had a young child and I wanted to stay alive for him. One of the reasons I got sober was because I wanted to be present for my son and for other loved ones in my life. Then, as I started to get better, I realized that I had things I wanted to do in life that might actually help other people and I needed to stay alive and sober in order to do that. MP: You still suffer from migraines and fibromyalgia. How do you do to treat your pain now? JM: I use exercise and meditation. I use appropriate diet. I use nonaddictive medication to get rid of the headaches. These are all things that I’ve written about in my book. What I’ve tried to do to treat my pain is to take better care of my body. I have to understand my limits. I cannot dig in the garden for eight hours. I have to pay attention to my pain and take care of it and not just numb it. MP: Do you think Prince was numbing his pain? JM: How do I know what Prince was really doing? There are ways in which creative people get afraid that the creativity will someday leave them. That’s what drives the anxiety and sometimes the use. I know it worked that way for me. MP: That sounds like a much bigger problem than straight-up addiction. JM: In this country you are not supposed to suffer emotional pain. That is not the American way. We are supposed to have these easygoing, carefree lives. But every life comes with unhappiness and struggle. The way we get through that is community. In the case of Prince, we’re talking about a person who had this really tough childhood, yet he had this extraordinary talent. Then he proves himself and then he becomes super-famous and wealthy. That is a recipe for isolation. What kind of community does a person have when he lives in a compound? What kind of web of love and trust and friendship does a person have when he is that famous and recognizable? In so many ways Prince was out there on his own. [Edited 8/18/16 8:07am] [Edited 8/18/16 8:10am]

/\ I am sorry she lost me as his pupils looked pinned. She could tell that from picture. If had been on these things for 30 he would have been dead as s doornail a long time ago,

Not true, many users have taken these substances for 30+ years and they're still here. It's not that unusual.


-- I am assuming those people are under a doctor care do you think Prince was under a doctor's care for 30 years and in pain and still mobile? Even people who take this suffer from the side effects and these people you talk about were not working at Prince's pace. See the side effect http://www.webmd.com/drug...al/details
  - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #61 posted 08/18/16 3:49pm

laurarichardso
n

RachB65 said:

fortuneandserendipity said:



laurarichardson said:


lwr001 said:
https://www.minnpost.com/mental-health-addiction/2016/06/jennifer-matesa-writer-addiction-prince-was-out-there-his-own [Edited 8/18/16 8:07am] Last week, when the Midwest Medical Examiner’s Office released its official report, concluding that Prince had died of self-administered fentanyl, a powerful synthetic opioid painkiller, I recalled a conversation I’d had back in 2014 with Jennifer Matesa, blogger, recipient of a SAMHSA Voice Awards Fellowship, and author of “The Recovering Body: Physical and Spiritual Fitness for Living Clean and Sober.” In our earlier conversation, Matesa had described her own addiction to fentanyl, and the long and painful process she endured to get the drug out of her system. Then, I paid a visit to Guinevere Gets Sober, Matesa’s popular recovery blog, where I read her personal and compassionate post about Prince, and I knew we had to talk. I gave Matesa a call at her Pittsburgh home earlier this week, and we had a wide-ranging conversation about my favorite musician’s dangerous addiction, his untimely death and about what may have motivated him to use opiates in the first place. The interview has been edited and trimmed. MinnPost: What inspired you to write about Prince on your blog? Jennifer Matesa: As a creative person and a former addict, I have an affinity with Prince. Creative types tend to drive themselves past certain limits. Prince was a physically small man. He was smaller than I am. He spent the majority of his life jumping and dancing around on stage wearing high heels with a heavy guitar strapped on his chest. You can’t expect to do that for 30 years without damaging your body or injuring your psyche. When Prince died in April, at first some people said he was taking Percocet [acetaminophen and oxycodone]. But when I read that they had to give him a save shot when his plane made an emergency landing in Moline, I said, “There was no way he was just taking Percocet. ... He was probably taking a single-entity opioid, and it was probably pretty strong.” I know my drugs. MP: So you’re theorizing that Prince’s addiction started a long time before he died? JM: I’ve read that he was on strong opioids for 25 or 30 years. If that’s so, that means that he probably produced most of the body of his work while on opioids. There are files of photos of him where his pupils are pinned (abnormally constricted). I’ve looked it up online and this goes way, way back. Pinned pupils are the one sign of opioid abuse that a user can’t hide. Photos of Prince, even in low light, show that his pupils are pinned. MP: Clearly, I’m a deluded Minnesotan. I always thought that Prince was sober because he was famous for living such a clean lifestyle. I was sad for me to hear that he was addicted to opioids. Jennifer Matesa Jennifer Matesa JM: I think it is interesting that you say that. What is the cultural prejudice that drives your unwillingness to think that your beloved artist could be a stone junkie? I don’t use words like “junkie” lightly. I used to call myself a junkie. A person can be addicted and still be an artist. They can be addicted and still be an amazing person. MP: Are people ever prescribed fentanyl for hip pain? Could Prince have been getting the drug legally from his physician? JM: Where he got the drug doesn’t matter. The fact is that Prince’s tox screen at the end of his life said that he had fentanyl in his bloodstream. He overdosed on fentanyl. That’s it. I almost overdosed on fentanyl a few times. It [is scary]. MP: How did you end up taking fentanyl? JM: I didn’t start out with fentanyl. I have migraines and fibromyalgia. I started out with codeine during my pregnancy. Then, after I stopped breastfeeding, I switched to Vicodin [acetaminophen and hydrocodone]. When I went to a pain clinic in my hometown of Pittsburgh, I was given pure hydrocodone. Then I moved to OxyContin [oxycodone] and then eventually to fentanyl. By 2005, I was on straight fentanyl patches. I was also given fentanyl lollypops for free. They would give you coupons to take to the pharmacy. I became addicted through my prescribers. It was a particular moment in medical history when physicians were prescribing opioids for all kinds of conditions. MP: But fentanyl is so potent. I thought it was usually reserved for people who are actively dying. JM: That’s not always the case in the United States. Once, when I was traveling overseas, I ran out of fentanyl patches. I went to a pharmacist, who said, “We only give those to people with cancer.” But in this country we give powerful painkillers like that to a lot of people who do not have a fatal disease. Fentanyl is the most potent painkiller. You can’t start on it. It could kill you if you did. You’d have to be taking other opioids for a while first. It is pharmacologically different from other opioids. It is fat-soluble. That means it crosses the blood-brain barrier quickly. That’s part of the reason that fentanyl deaths are increasing in this country. They are not nearly at the level of other opioid-based drugs like heroin, but they are happening. The Federal Drug Abuse Warning Network says that it is very hard for EMS personnel to get to fentanyl victims quickly enough because the drug works so fast. MP: You just said you almost overdosed on fentanyl a few times. How did that happen? JM: I almost overdosed on fentanyl because I took too much. I didn’t go to a hospital. I was lucky I survived. I abused my drugs. I was prescribed adhesive patches that were intended to be placed directly on the skin. But I got to a point where I’d cut my patches into small pieces and stick them to the inside of my cheek so the fentanyl would enter my system faster. I’d do this when I had run out of the drug for a few days before I could fill a new prescription. I’d be in withdrawal, and I figured out that it was a faster way to get the drug into my system. When the drug entered my bloodstream that way, it would spike the levels in my blood. I clearly remember lying in bed at night and feeling that my breathing was slowing. I’d wonder to myself, “Is my body going to remember to breathe?” Sometimes I’d keep myself awake because I didn’t have a way to reverse the effects of the drug. MP: This sounds frightening. What did it feel like? JM: The feeling of respiratory depression is really scary. It is beyond your control. It is almost as if you are lying down and someone is stacking bricks on your chest. You can’t breathe. I am very fortunate that I didn’t die. If you write in your column that I told you I cut the patch into pieces, make sure to say it can kill you. It is lethal. MP: I know that this question may be going too far, but I’m still going to ask it: When you experienced that feeling of respiratory depression, were you ever at the point where you just thought, “Maybe I should surrender to this?” If you’d rather not answer, I’d respect that. JM: Actually, it’s a really great question, because so many people are overdosing these days and a lot of the discussion about addiction is being driven around whether people who fatally overdose actually do it on purpose. I personally think that a lot or even most of these overdoses are accidents. People don’t actually want to die. They either have taken heroin that is spiked with a drug that is stronger than they thought it was, or they take an opioid with alcohol or a benzodiazepine and that makes it fatal. Those few times when I experienced respiratory depression, I didn’t want to die. I had a young child and I wanted to stay alive for him. One of the reasons I got sober was because I wanted to be present for my son and for other loved ones in my life. Then, as I started to get better, I realized that I had things I wanted to do in life that might actually help other people and I needed to stay alive and sober in order to do that. MP: You still suffer from migraines and fibromyalgia. How do you do to treat your pain now? JM: I use exercise and meditation. I use appropriate diet. I use nonaddictive medication to get rid of the headaches. These are all things that I’ve written about in my book. What I’ve tried to do to treat my pain is to take better care of my body. I have to understand my limits. I cannot dig in the garden for eight hours. I have to pay attention to my pain and take care of it and not just numb it. MP: Do you think Prince was numbing his pain? JM: How do I know what Prince was really doing? There are ways in which creative people get afraid that the creativity will someday leave them. That’s what drives the anxiety and sometimes the use. I know it worked that way for me. MP: That sounds like a much bigger problem than straight-up addiction. JM: In this country you are not supposed to suffer emotional pain. That is not the American way. We are supposed to have these easygoing, carefree lives. But every life comes with unhappiness and struggle. The way we get through that is community. In the case of Prince, we’re talking about a person who had this really tough childhood, yet he had this extraordinary talent. Then he proves himself and then he becomes super-famous and wealthy. That is a recipe for isolation. What kind of community does a person have when he lives in a compound? What kind of web of love and trust and friendship does a person have when he is that famous and recognizable? In so many ways Prince was out there on his own. [Edited 8/18/16 8:07am] [Edited 8/18/16 8:10am]

/\ I am sorry she lost me as his pupils looked pinned. She could tell that from picture. If had been on these things for 30 he would have been dead as s doornail a long time ago,

Not true, many users have taken these substances for 30+ years and they're still here. It's not that unusual.



Yes but could they have done what P did onstage for years dancing play various instruments, write prolifically and sleep very little? I have some experience with opiates both legal n illegal and i would think he couldnt have done all that
for 30 yrs without it getting out of control long before now..

/// No he could not have. Read about the side effects http://www.webmd.com/drug...al/details
  - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #62 posted 08/18/16 3:53pm

lwr001

laurarichardson said:

RachB65 said:



Yes but could they have done what P did onstage for years dancing play various instruments, write prolifically and sleep very little? I have some experience with opiates both legal n illegal and i would think he couldnt have done all that
for 30 yrs without it getting out of control long before now..

/// No he could not have. Read about the side effects http://www.webmd.com/drug...al/details

In the real world. People get high daily and are successful. There is a way to do just that with minimal risk
  - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #63 posted 08/18/16 4:17pm

justalongtimef
an

The pupil thing is silly. Prince and I have close to the same color eyes. I can tell you that people with light colored eyes it's easier to see out pupils. She wrong on that and anyone with light that has taken as many pictures a Prince and the light that they use to take pictures of him for sure will show small pupils.

  - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #64 posted 08/18/16 4:37pm

laurarichardso
n

lwr001 said:

laurarichardson said:


/// No he could not have. Read about the side effects http://www.webmd.com/drug...al/details

In the real world. People get high daily and are successful. There is a way to do just that with minimal risk

--/ What about the side effects of the drugs !!! I am not even talking about being high!!! How was he on stage for 3 hours and during after shows going back to record music and basically doing a 48 hours sessions without pissing himself or craping his pants. I know he waved a magic wand and none of the side effects ever had effect on him in a 30 year period. Know one is saying he was not taking this stuff shit he died because of it but it is not within the realm of possibility. Can I believe he had a puff of weed and I can believe he liked wine but too many people who knew him some going back to childhood are saying repeatly that he was not a recreational drug. The fact that none want to acknowledge that he had pain it is better that he was just a doper. Even when the facts are not there.
[Edited 8/18/16 16:39pm]
  - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #65 posted 08/18/16 8:25pm

rogifan

laurarichardson said:

lwr001 said:


In the real world. People get high daily and are successful. There is a way to do just that with minimal risk

--/ What about the side effects of the drugs !!! I am not even talking about being high!!! How was he on stage for 3 hours and during after shows going back to record music and basically doing a 48 hours sessions without pissing himself or craping his pants. I know he waved a magic wand and none of the side effects ever had effect on him in a 30 year period. Know one is saying he was not taking this stuff shit he died because of it but it is not within the realm of possibility. Can I believe he had a puff of weed and I can believe he liked wine but too many people who knew him some going back to childhood are saying repeatly that he was not a recreational drug. The fact that none want to acknowledge that he had pain it is better that he was just a doper. Even when the facts are not there.
[Edited 8/18/16 16:39pm]


Wait so now P was taking this stuff to get high? And doing it for 30 years without anyone knowing....or everyone knows and they'be just covered for him all these years? confused I'd love to know who all these successful people are getting high every day. Maybe hippies on a commune? lol
Paisley Park is in your heart
#PrinceForever 💜
  - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #66 posted 08/18/16 10:44pm

sonshine

avatar
This article is old news. It's already been hashed out. The subject in the interview has the benefit of real life experience but it's ballsey of her to make the assumptions she does considering she never even met Prince. So all in all its hard to give much weight to her opinions. In fact her know it all attitude really turned me off. Everyone is different. Every case s unique. These are not one size fits all situations. Each individual's experience with opioid issues is not exactly like hers or anyone else's.
It's a hurtful place, the world, in and of itself. We don't need to add to it. We all need one another. ~ PRN
  - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #67 posted 08/19/16 12:46am

LBrent

rogifan said:

laurarichardson said:


--/ What about the side effects of the drugs !!! I am not even talking about being high!!! How was he on stage for 3 hours and during after shows going back to record music and basically doing a 48 hours sessions without pissing himself or craping his pants. I know he waved a magic wand and none of the side effects ever had effect on him in a 30 year period. Know one is saying he was not taking this stuff shit he died because of it but it is not within the realm of possibility. Can I believe he had a puff of weed and I can believe he liked wine but too many people who knew him some going back to childhood are saying repeatly that he was not a recreational drug. The fact that none want to acknowledge that he had pain it is better that he was just a doper. Even when the facts are not there.
[Edited 8/18/16 16:39pm]


Wait so now P was taking this stuff to get high? And doing it for 30 years without anyone knowing....or everyone knows and they'be just covered for him all these years? confused I'd love to know who all these successful people are getting high every day. Maybe hippies on a commune? lol


Seriously.

It amazes me that people don't understand the difference between addiction to get high and dependency on a prescribed medication.

Sheesh
  - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #68 posted 08/19/16 12:56am

Bassette

Dear morningsong, thank u 4 xpressing my thoughts! I agree.

morningsong said:

This same article again where somebody is trying to cut and paste their experience on somebody they didn't know and never had a real conversation with. Using a handful of photographs as some kind of circumstantial evidence that they are quite knowledgeable about another person's habits. Bullsh*t! Any fool can do that. Go to the picture thread and you'll see this man's history laid out before and you still won't know jack about him and his daily life.

  - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #69 posted 08/19/16 1:04am

RachB65

lwr001 said:

laurarichardson said:


/// No he could not have. Read about the side effects http://www.webmd.com/drug...al/details

In the real world. People get high daily and are successful. There is a way to do just that with minimal risk


You seem pretty determined to portray him as a long time junkie. For this to b the case than he would have been a huge hypocrite to tout a healthy and clean lifestyle yet be doing opiates for 3 decades...He would have also looked like shit for a very long time but he did not...
Like i said, in REAL LIFE ive had experience with opiates n know others who have been stone cold junkie and still others who use them for pain management. Theres no way hes been a dopehead for 30+ yrs. Perhaps he took something when he injured himself onstage or whatever but any longterm use or abuse did not begin in the 80s. My opinion.
That article is old, i read it awhile ago. While she makes some good points its obvious shes projecting and also reading tabloid rags as gospel. The bit about the pupils was thoroughly discussed here n dismissed. And i one time checked out everyone's pupils at my job one day, afternoon, indoors, not overly lit and seems everyone had small pupils(none of us were on opiates)...any kind of light, such as from cameras n the lights used will constrict pupils.
[Edited 8/19/16 1:14am]
[Edited 8/19/16 1:15am]
[Edited 8/19/16 1:16am]
"Almost all art is trying to become an anaesthetic and at the same time a healing session drawing up the magical electrics.”
  - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #70 posted 08/19/16 5:32am

fortuneandsere
ndipity

lwr001 said:

laurarichardson said:
/// No he could not have. Read about the side effects http://www.webmd.com/drug...al/details
In the real world. People get high daily and are successful. There is a way to do just that with minimal risk

People routinely take other medications to negate side effects from the main medication. If a drug has upper effects it's often taken with another drug that acts as a downer, and vice versa. There's also such a thing as a high-functioning heroin addict. I've met them, worked with them, they're amazing people and they hold down jobs. Sleeping pills, anti-histamines can give people alzheimer's. Wanna doubt that too?

Some people's inability to hold two different ideas in their head concurrently is amazing.

The world's problems like climate change can only be solved through strategic long-term thinking, not expediency. In other words all the govts. need sacking!

If you can add value to someone's life then why not. Especially if it colors their days...
  - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #71 posted 08/19/16 6:05am

laurarichardso
n

fortuneandserendipity said:

lwr001 said:

laurarichardson said: In the real world. People get high daily and are successful. There is a way to do just that with minimal risk

People routinely take other medications to negate side effects from the main medication. If a drug has upper effects it's often taken with another drug that acts as a downer, and vice versa. There's also such a thing as a high-functioning heroin addict. I've met them, worked with them, they're amazing people and they hold down jobs. Sleeping pills, anti-histamines can give people alzheimer's. Wanna doubt that too?

Some people's inability to hold two different ideas in their head concurrently is amazing.

Once again if you take the time to read about pain meds especially Fentanyl. Many of the drugs you can take to help with the side effects cannot be taken as they have a bad interactions with the pain meds.

I am not going to waste my time listing the meds you cannot take to help you with the side effects because I already put up the link. I find it sad that you can eaisly find out the many number of people who are dying from these pain meds some of whom are under a doctor's care that there are people advocating for them.

Better living thru drug use. Unfuckingbelivable.

  - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #72 posted 08/19/16 6:09am

laurarichardso
n

RachB65 said:

lwr001 said:
In the real world. People get high daily and are successful. There is a way to do just that with minimal risk
You seem pretty determined to portray him as a long time junkie. For this to b the case than he would have been a huge hypocrite to tout a healthy and clean lifestyle yet be doing opiates for 3 decades...He would have also looked like shit for a very long time but he did not... Like i said, in REAL LIFE ive had experience with opiates n know others who have been stone cold junkie and still others who use them for pain management. Theres no way hes been a dopehead for 30+ yrs. Perhaps he took something when he injured himself onstage or whatever but any longterm use or abuse did not begin in the 80s. My opinion. That article is old, i read it awhile ago. While she makes some good points its obvious shes projecting and also reading tabloid rags as gospel. The bit about the pupils was thoroughly discussed here n dismissed. And i one time checked out everyone's pupils at my job one day, afternoon, indoors, not overly lit and seems everyone had small pupils(none of us were on opiates)...any kind of light, such as from cameras n the lights used will constrict pupils. [Edited 8/19/16 1:14am] [Edited 8/19/16 1:15am] [Edited 8/19/16 1:16am]

Yes he would have been a hypocrite and people would have something to say about it a long time ago. Even people who were on drugs back in the day had good things to say about him not using drugs with exception of Rick James.

George Clinton - In his book

Rick James - In his book

Teena Marie - Talked about the two of them being the only ones on tour who did not use drugs.

Vanity - Who was a drug addict talked about him never doing drugs.

Jump-Offs - Some of whom should be bitter. Lots of sex no drugs. Would drop a chick over drugs.


  - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #73 posted 08/19/16 6:25am

wavesofbliss

laurarichardson said:

Yes he would have been a hypocrite and people would have something to say about it a long time ago. Even people who were on drugs back in the day had good things to say about him not using drugs with exception of Rick James.

George Clinton - In his book

Rick James - In his book

Teena Marie - Talked about the two of them being the only ones on tour who did not use drugs.

Vanity - Who was a drug addict talked about him never doing drugs.

Jump-Offs - Some of whom should be bitter. Lots of sex no drugs. Would drop a chick over drugs.


+1. :: prince had a longterm dependancy but WAS NOT a lifelong druggie!

Prince #MUSICIANICONLEGEND
  - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #74 posted 08/19/16 6:34am

fortuneandsere
ndipity

laurarichardson said:

fortuneandserendipity said:

People routinely take other medications to negate side effects from the main medication. If a drug has upper effects it's often taken with another drug that acts as a downer, and vice versa. There's also such a thing as a high-functioning heroin addict. I've met them, worked with them, they're amazing people and they hold down jobs. Sleeping pills, anti-histamines can give people alzheimer's. Wanna doubt that too?

Some people's inability to hold two different ideas in their head concurrently is amazing.

Once again if you take the time to read about pain meds especially Fentanyl. Many of the drugs you can take to help with the side effects cannot be taken as they have a bad interactions with the pain meds.

I am not going to waste my time listing the meds you cannot take to help you with the side effects because I already put up the link. I find it sad that you can eaisly find out the many number of people who are dying from these pain meds some of whom are under a doctor's care that there are people advocating for them.

Better living thru drug use. Unfuckingbelivable.

You have issues and you need to calm down. Fentanyl does not preclude safe use of certain other drugs. Caffeine is a drug. So is nicotine. I've just mentioned it but I will reiterate for your benefit. People can survive and function well enough on opiates. Just because you haven't met them or don't know of any doesn't mean they don't exist. Also, you took my comment out of context and ran with it, like you appear to do here often. Congratulations.

For the record I am anti drugs including the psychoactive ones prescribed by doctors. I don't believe they lead to better living at all.

The world's problems like climate change can only be solved through strategic long-term thinking, not expediency. In other words all the govts. need sacking!

If you can add value to someone's life then why not. Especially if it colors their days...
  - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #75 posted 08/19/16 6:45am

kidsherriff

avatar

The article has a lot of very fair points APART FROM the bit about photos for the last 30 years showing evidence of constricted pupils.

Constricted pupils are a result of flash photography or artificial and direct lighting so in those circumstances even Mother Theresa would look like a junkie.

The fact of the matter is however, there are literally thousands of images where Prince's eyes show no evidence of pupil constriction so this whole historic junkie theory is a red herring!

  - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #76 posted 08/19/16 6:54am

leadline

avatar

wavesofbliss said:

laurarichardson said:

Yes he would have been a hypocrite and people would have something to say about it a long time ago. Even people who were on drugs back in the day had good things to say about him not using drugs with exception of Rick James.

George Clinton - In his book

Rick James - In his book

Teena Marie - Talked about the two of them being the only ones on tour who did not use drugs.

Vanity - Who was a drug addict talked about him never doing drugs.

Jump-Offs - Some of whom should be bitter. Lots of sex no drugs. Would drop a chick over drugs.


+1. :: prince had a longterm dependancy but WAS NOT a lifelong druggie!


How could you state so factually that Prince had a longterm dependancy? The fact is we do NOT know that. What we do know is that his actions over the decades would dictate otherwise, people close to him accounts over the years speak contrary to this as well. There is absolutely nothing you could come up with to show the contrary to that imo.

[Edited 8/19/16 6:56am]

"You always get the dream that you deserve, from what you value the most" -Prince 2013
  - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #77 posted 08/19/16 7:09am

laurarichardso
n

fortuneandserendipity said:



laurarichardson said:




fortuneandserendipity said:



People routinely take other medications to negate side effects from the main medication. If a drug has upper effects it's often taken with another drug that acts as a downer, and vice versa. There's also such a thing as a high-functioning heroin addict. I've met them, worked with them, they're amazing people and they hold down jobs. Sleeping pills, anti-histamines can give people alzheimer's. Wanna doubt that too?

Some people's inability to hold two different ideas in their head concurrently is amazing.




Once again if you take the time to read about pain meds especially Fentanyl. Many of the drugs you can take to help with the side effects cannot be taken as they have a bad interactions with the pain meds.



I am not going to waste my time listing the meds you cannot take to help you with the side effects because I already put up the link. I find it sad that you can eaisly find out the many number of people who are dying from these pain meds some of whom are under a doctor's care that there are people advocating for them.



Better living thru drug use. Unfuckingbelivable.



You have issues and you need to calm down. Fentanyl does not preclude safe use of certain other drugs. Caffeine is a drug. So is nicotine. I've just mentioned it but I will reiterate for your benefit. People can survive and function well enough on opiates. Just because you haven't met them or don't know of any doesn't mean they don't exist. Also, you took my comment out of context and ran with it, like you appear to do here often. Congratulations.

For the record I am anti drugs including the psychoactive ones prescribed by doctors. I don't believe they lead to better living at all.


---- I have not typed one thing that is not true the proof is out there and so are the deaths and lawsuits. You compared nicotine and caffeine to pain meds. Nothing else to say about your thought process.
  - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #78 posted 08/19/16 7:32am

rogifan

LBrent said:

rogifan said:



Wait so now P was taking this stuff to get high? And doing it for 30 years without anyone knowing....or everyone knows and they'be just covered for him all these years? confused I'd love to know who all these successful people are getting high every day. Maybe hippies on a commune? lol


Seriously.

It amazes me that people don't understand the difference between addiction to get high and dependency on a prescribed medication.

Sheesh

For me it's simple. If this was for pain management there's no way the guy was in chronic pain for 30 years. And if it was for recreational use we have next to no examples of anyone seeing him take this stuff or seeing him in public where he appeared to be under the influence of anything. Seems highly unlikely to me that he'd be able to do all of this in secret for decades without any side effects or behavioral changes that people would notice. The physical changes people noticed didn't really start until (late) 2014.

One question I have is were prescription painkillers a big thing in the 80s or even 90s? OxyContin wasn't approved by the FDA until 1995, Fentanyl not until 1998. Seems to me the approval of OxyContin is what really started this whole painkiller addiction crisis.
Paisley Park is in your heart
#PrinceForever 💜
  - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #79 posted 08/19/16 7:41am

sunset3121

leadline said:

wavesofbliss said:

+1. :: prince had a longterm dependancy but WAS NOT a lifelong druggie!


How could you state so factually that Prince had a longterm dependancy? The fact is we do NOT know that. What we do know is that his actions over the decades would dictate otherwise, people close to him accounts over the years speak contrary to this as well. There is absolutely nothing you could come up with to show the contrary to that imo.

[Edited 8/19/16 6:56am]

As I said earlier, these 2 have the same size pupils under the same conditions. What does this say about his long term dependancy? Where exactly is this evidence of long term dependancy or addiction. If there is evidence I'll hear it until then I'm fed up of all the speculation stated as fact.

http://cdn.pinknews.co.uk/images/2016/05/prince-1.jpg

  - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #80 posted 08/19/16 7:59am

laurarichardso
n

rogifan said:

LBrent said:



Seriously.

It amazes me that people don't understand the difference between addiction to get high and dependency on a prescribed medication.

Sheesh

For me it's simple. If this was for pain management there's no way the guy was in chronic pain for 30 years. And if it was for recreational use we have next to no examples of anyone seeing him take this stuff or seeing him in public where he appeared to be under the influence of anything. Seems highly unlikely to me that he'd be able to do all of this in secret for decades without any side effects or behavioral changes that people would notice. The physical changes people noticed didn't really start until (late) 2014.

One question I have is were prescription painkillers a big thing in the 80s or even 90s? OxyContin wasn't approved by the FDA until 1995, Fentanyl not until 1998. Seems to me the approval of OxyContin is what really started this whole painkiller addiction crisis.

--- No they were not. As fans we did not hear anything about his hip problem until 2008. We know from the Ebony article he had surgery in 2009. I firmly believe he was in pain management and things went bad for him. I am amazed that still people do not believe it. His own cousin said he was in pain and looked like he was going to cry in that interview. It is just not enough for some people. Why the lack of sympathy or empathy?
  - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #81 posted 08/19/16 8:01am

leadline

avatar

double post

[Edited 8/19/16 8:05am]

"You always get the dream that you deserve, from what you value the most" -Prince 2013
  - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #82 posted 08/19/16 8:05am

leadline

avatar

sunset3121 said:

leadline said:


How could you state so factually that Prince had a longterm dependancy? The fact is we do NOT know that. What we do know is that his actions over the decades would dictate otherwise, people close to him accounts over the years speak contrary to this as well. There is absolutely nothing you could come up with to show the contrary to that imo.

[Edited 8/19/16 6:56am]

As I said earlier, these 2 have the same size pupils under the same conditions. What does this say about his long term dependancy? Where exactly is this evidence of long term dependancy or addiction. If there is evidence I'll hear it until then I'm fed up of all the speculation stated as fact.

http://cdn.pinknews.co.uk/images/2016/05/prince-1.jpg




Exactly, folks just seem to want to create their own narrative, make it fact, and then base all other premises off those "so called facts". Like I said before, who needs tabloids with some of the posts found here. Common sense is cleary not very common.

"You always get the dream that you deserve, from what you value the most" -Prince 2013
  - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #83 posted 08/19/16 8:31am

Mintchip

avatar

I loved this article. Fascinating stuff.

.

I notice that addiction, as a topic, becomes more interesting to people once they go through it themselves. Til then, it's very much "the other", to be avoided.

.

I think there will always be a murky cloud around Prince's death. For one thing, addicts have secret lives. Family, close friends, coworkers; they're kept out. The few people who know the truth are other addicts and dealers, who no one would ever believe in the first place.

.

For another thing, this is Prince. I think he wrote "The Question of U" about himself.

.

So what is the answer 2 the question of u
What do I look 4, what shall I do?
Which way do I turn when I'm feeling lost?
If I sell my soul, now what will it cost?
Must I become naked? No image at all?
Shall I remain upright? Or get down and crawl?

All of the questions in my life will be answered
When I decide which road 2 choose
What is the answer 2 the question of u?

  - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #84 posted 08/19/16 8:43am

wavesofbliss

leadline said:

wavesofbliss said:

+1. :: prince had a longterm dependancy but WAS NOT a lifelong druggie!


How could you state so factually that Prince had a longterm dependancy?

because you don't need outpatient care for withdrawl symptoms due to short -term dependacy. it has been established that he was either in care or seeking care for severe withdrawl. his dependancy probably started around the time of his surgergy(confirmed by scars and said to have happened around 2010). as i have said before 5-6 yrs on pain meds would be considered a long-term dependency.

::: what part of the stuff we know are u having trouble with? all signs point to a dependencey and withdrawl that turned fatal. not sure how u could read it differently or do u just need to believe something else? confused

edited for spelling

[Edited 8/19/16 8:45am]

Prince #MUSICIANICONLEGEND
  - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #85 posted 08/19/16 8:47am

rogifan

wavesofbliss said:



leadline said:




wavesofbliss said:



+1. :: prince had a longterm dependancy but WAS NOT a lifelong druggie!




How could you state so factually that Prince had a longterm dependancy?



because you don't need outpatient care for withdrawl symptoms due to short -term dependacy. it has been established that he was either in care or seeking care for severe withdrawl. his dependancy probably started around the time of his surgergy(confirmed by scars and said to have happened around 2010). as i have said before 5-6 yrs on pain meds would be considered a long-term dependency.








::: what part of the stuff we know are u having trouble with? all signs point to a dependencey and withdrawl that turned fatal. not sure how u could read it differently or do u just need to believe something else? confused



edited for spelling

[Edited 8/19/16 8:45am]


What signs and when was his hip surgery confirmed?
Paisley Park is in your heart
#PrinceForever 💜
  - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #86 posted 08/19/16 8:50am

leadline

avatar

wavesofbliss said:

leadline said:


How could you state so factually that Prince had a longterm dependancy?

because you don't need outpatient care for withdrawl symptoms due to short -term dependacy. it has been established that he was either in care or seeking care fro severe withdrawl. his dependancy probably started around the time of his surgergy(confirmed by scars and said to have happened around 2010). as i have said before 5-6 yrs on pain meds would be considered a long-term dependency.

::: what part of the stuff we know are u having trouble with? all signs point to a dependencey and withdrawl that turned fatal. not sure how u could read it differently or do u just need to believe something else? confused


There are no signs that point to that, only assumptions and folks creating scenrios off those assumptions that have no basis in reality. If you want to believe the stuff you read here ,and what you have been spoon fed by the media blindly, that is your perogative, and you are not alone.

"You always get the dream that you deserve, from what you value the most" -Prince 2013
  - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #87 posted 08/19/16 9:20am

wavesofbliss

rogifan said:

wavesofbliss said:

because you don't need outpatient care for withdrawl symptoms due to short -term dependacy. it has been established that he was either in care or seeking care for severe withdrawl. his dependancy probably started around the time of his surgergy(confirmed by scars and said to have happened around 2010). as i have said before 5-6 yrs on pain meds would be considered a long-term dependency.

::: what part of the stuff we know are u having trouble with? all signs point to a dependencey and withdrawl that turned fatal. not sure how u could read it differently or do u just need to believe something else? confused

edited for spelling

[Edited 8/19/16 8:45am]

What signs and when was his hip surgery confirmed?

eek autopsy; flu symptoms and calling specialists. or do u think that dr kornfield and son are making it up. maybe they they just showed up that morning to see the PR motorbike..... of course they did.

++ logical conclusions are not assumptions.

Prince #MUSICIANICONLEGEND
  - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #88 posted 08/19/16 9:22am

babynoz

leadline said:

wavesofbliss said:

because you don't need outpatient care for withdrawl symptoms due to short -term dependacy. it has been established that he was either in care or seeking care fro severe withdrawl. his dependancy probably started around the time of his surgergy(confirmed by scars and said to have happened around 2010). as i have said before 5-6 yrs on pain meds would be considered a long-term dependency.

::: what part of the stuff we know are u having trouble with? all signs point to a dependencey and withdrawl that turned fatal. not sure how u could read it differently or do u just need to believe something else? confused


There are no signs that point to that, only assumptions and folks creating scenrios off those assumptions that have no basis in reality. If you want to believe the stuff you read here ,and what you have been spoon fed by the media blindly, that is your perogative, and you are not alone.



Agreed.

In the absense of any new information for months I can't see why the same assumptions, theories, rumors, conjecture and assumptions keep getting rehashed on multiple threads ad nauseum.

Dependency, for example, can develop over a period of weeks or months. It does not have to be years.

Similarly, the ailment that caused his problems around '09 is not necessarily what happened in 2015 or thereabouts? It could have been some new source of pain, we do not know.

There are still too many unknowns to be making any kind of definitive statements.

It gets rather bizarre when people are so insistent on a particular agenda while lacking so many details.

Prince, in you I found a kindred spirit...Rest In Paradise.
  - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #89 posted 08/19/16 9:28am

wavesofbliss

leadline said:

wavesofbliss said:

because you don't need outpatient care for withdrawl symptoms due to short -term dependacy. it has been established that he was either in care or seeking care fro severe withdrawl. his dependancy probably started around the time of his surgergy(confirmed by scars and said to have happened around 2010). as i have said before 5-6 yrs on pain meds would be considered a long-term dependency.

::: what part of the stuff we know are u having trouble with? all signs point to a dependencey and withdrawl that turned fatal. not sure how u could read it differently or do u just need to believe something else? confused


There are no signs that point to that, only assumptions and folks creating scenrios off those assumptions that have no basis in reality. If you want to believe the stuff you read here ,and what you have been spoon fed by the media blindly, that is your perogative, and you are not alone.

eek u 2 huh? there are plenty of signs that point in exactly that direction but if u can read them, cool. cool

:: ur spoon fed comments are telling. if someone who has verifiable proof to the contrary of what i said AND they've called u to share it, please fill us in!! you can blindly disregard things that are largey indisputable if u like, that is your perogative, and you are not alone.

: logical conclusions are not assumptions.

Prince #MUSICIANICONLEGEND
  - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Page 3 of 5 <12345>
  New topic   Printable     (Log in to 'subscribe' to this topic)
« Previous topic  Next topic »
Forums > Prince: Music and More > Article worth reading. Brings up good points