perfume said:

I teach kids 'on the spectrum' and I'm inclined to say no, but I've never spent time with him, so I wouldn't say. Also, I'm not a doctor, and doctors/psychologists, etc officially diagnose. I've always thought he was a genius, kinda like Da Vinci -- he did everything masterfully and prodigiously. So maybe what looks, 'spectrummy' as we say in my business, lol, could simply be the way his genius presented.

Da Vinci is speculated to have had all kinds of emotional issues. I think a lot of this stuff can be put down to running out of lithium. Popular culture knows nothing of this, but there is solid theory to it and it would explain the phrase 'thin line between genius and madness'. Basically if you use a lot of brainpower during the day or have a really crappy diet, you're going to be low in lithium. It's not so much a drug as a natural brain mineral.

Angelsoncrack said:

Genesia said:

Seriously? He had a shit ton of facial movement.

Honestly...

?? Autistic people do have facial movement lol.

Actually, re the facial movement 'thing', if you think about it, his facial expressions TENDED to be highly exaggerated / dramatic when he was performing - on stage - basically playing the role of 'Prince the Entertainer'.
>
If you compare that to his being in interview situations, where he had to come out of performance mode, and engage in one-on-one, 'normal' dialogue, it was evident he found it more difficult (although, of course, there are exceptions - generally later interviews, when he is in conversation with interviewers with whom he is friendly / comfortable / has known for quite some time). I'm not sure how to describe it, aside from saying he seemed very self-contained.
>
He did seem to grow into his skin as he got older - but, certainly, those earlier interviews or awards ceremonies, there is a man for whom there is a big disconnect between the 'safety' of showmanship, and the social awkwardness / reluctance to 'be seen as himself'. He clearly found having to sit and talk, face to face, far more 'exposing' than being on stage, showing his backside! He didn't like to make eye contact; he kept speaking to a minimum and used a (controlled) monotone; his mouth would barely twitch, lol...
>
Perhaps he was just shy; perhaps he really DID have a split personality type thing going on (after all, he himself said he did), or perhaps he was on the Asperger's spectrum - there is evidence to support it, as there is evidence to support alternative assessments of his character...Safe to say, he was very COMPLEX!

Wow, I feel like y'all been talking about a completely different person altogether than Prince. Just watch the interviews with Travis Smiley (i think that's his name), or Jay Leno (for contrast). And as was said by Genesia, he had tons of facial expressions - though not sure why this was mentioned as if specific to AS - I worked with autistic kids and many do too)! I would say it's one of the things thats most recognisable about Prince (see what I did there?). I think he was just great at comparmentalizing himself - the song writer vs performer vs business man/arranging/producer vs regular dude who likes to take in a Lakers game once in a while. Many of us have multiple facets to themselves, don't think it's something to over analyze to a pulp though....

i have never noticed any signs what so ever

Dibblekins said:

Angelsoncrack said:

?? Autistic people do have facial movement lol.

Actually, re the facial movement 'thing', if you think about it, his facial expressions TENDED to be highly exaggerated / dramatic when he was performing - on stage - basically playing the role of 'Prince the Entertainer'.
>
If you compare that to his being in interview situations, where he had to come out of performance mode, and engage in one-on-one, 'normal' dialogue, it was evident he found it more difficult (although, of course, there are exceptions - generally later interviews, when he is in conversation with interviewers with whom he is friendly / comfortable / has known for quite some time). I'm not sure how to describe it, aside from saying he seemed very self-contained.
>
He did seem to grow into his skin as he got older - but, certainly, those earlier interviews or awards ceremonies, there is a man for whom there is a big disconnect between the 'safety' of showmanship, and the social awkwardness / reluctance to 'be seen as himself'. He clearly found having to sit and talk, face to face, far more 'exposing' than being on stage, showing his backside! He didn't like to make eye contact; he kept speaking to a minimum and used a (controlled) monotone; his mouth would barely twitch, lol...
>
Perhaps he was just shy; perhaps he really DID have a split personality type thing going on (after all, he himself said he did), or perhaps he was on the Asperger's spectrum - there is evidence to support it, as there is evidence to support alternative assessments of his character...Safe to say, he was very COMPLEX!

However, even when he was young he did not have problems talking to people once he felt comfortable. Dick Clark recognised this:

"Clark remembered it vividly. "He didn't talk to me," the "Bandstand" host said 15 years after the fact. "I've always said that was one of the most difficult interviews I've ever conducted, and I've done 10,000 musician interviews."

Was it Prince? Was it Clark? Was it the moment?

"No, that's the nature of the man," said Clark, who had since worked with Prince a few times on "The American Music Awards."

"He's an extraordinary performer and not a particularly verbose one in public conversation. Though once you're off-camera, he's like everybody else -- very normal. It's like all of the mystery people in entertainment. Michael Jackson's not a communicator in public but in the privacy of a room, he's like everybody else: He talks. And Prince is the same."

The huge difference in him when he is (ahh, was ) comfortable with people would lead me to guess it is not AS.

Look at the eye contact and interaction with Maria in this one:

Life O' The Party On The Road with Prince and the NPG. (from 3 mins) (2004)

He enjoyed putting her on the spot!

And he seemed fairly comfortable here to say he was talking to a stranger with a camera on him:

rare 1997-98 prince and larry graham interview for the bbc ozone

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N6H8rKE9ydU

LonelyStarfish said:

darkroman said:

I'd say NO because a key symptom of Asperger Syndrome is to have suicidal tendancies.

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Princed lived too long to have had this.

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You're chatting absolute waffle. I have high functioning aspergers and other mental health disorders so i know what I'm talking about. I have never attempted suicide but i do get consumed by thoughts of my own mortality sometimes. I question life and it's purpose if there is no afterlife. I'm not saying P also had aspergers but a lot of his lyrics shows he too thought about death a lot. There are so many insensitive and uneducated people in here. [Edited 6/29/16 8:38am]

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I've worked in Special Education for 20 years and NO not all people ''on the spectrum'' or who have been diagnosed with Aspergers has suicidal tendencies, i''ve actually never known any of them (whom i've worked with or are related to) even attempt suicide but as i have said before, not everyone is the same...thats why we say ''on the spectrum'' because its a verrrrry wide spectrum. Of course, some may have those tendency (depression, anxiety, ocd, add, etc.) but you could easily find that in any physical/emotional/mental issue any person may have just as much.

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[Edited 6/29/16 18:30pm]

[Edited 6/29/16 18:31pm]

FullLipsDotNose said:

CROWNS1 said:

My child who has Cerebral Palsy was also diagnosed with Pervasive Developmental Disorder. At some point he was diagnosed as Aspergers but within the CP diagnosis, some can have traits that mirror aspergers/autism. In any case, he has a memory like an elephant, and counts the days every week until we go to the wrecka stow where he knows artists the employees have never heard of. He is very social as well. So...I don't have to go to autism speaks, but thanks for the advice.

The reason why the site is bad is that it's run by people that don't have autism and neither do they let autists on committee. They also believe autism is curable and it should be cured, regardles of what we, autists, think about it.

-

Your son's memory is a great trait! It's one of the best things that come with the diagnosis

Hate that. Kinda like our local Goodwill that don't hire handicapped people. Alot of folks don't get it. They seem to think that someone with Aspergers doesn't make eye contact, or have a social life. Perhaps they confuse Aspergers with Autism. Thanks for the info on the website.

GeniusLuv said:

I work with Autistic children in a specialized program in an Elementary school and the Asperger students i have (who are mainstreamed) have truly special skills and a true infinity for music and one did have seizures as well starting at a very young age, he also had perfect pitch.

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He is in Middle School now and has true musical skills, very technical and mathematical gifts as well, which is usually the case in my experience with Aspergers.

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I also have a student this year (going into 2nd grade) who also has a special gift as an artist and draws incredibly well, again very technical in his abilities and his undeniable knowledge of the solar system and outer space..i marvel at his many gifts as well.

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[Edited 6/28/16 16:18pm]

I also work with autistic geniuses. They are like old people trapped in a child's body. I have one who draws elephants doing what elephants do, drinking, sleeping, walking, whatever. Incredible because he has never seen an elephant in real life. He's 5. He does it obsessively and they are beautiful! Like you would train for years to draw like this kid can. Have you heard them called the indigo children? Indigo like purple???

If Prince was aspergers that would explain a lot.

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Being aspergers isn't bad thing.

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One thing that does point away from Aspergers is the fact that Prince was such a great dancer, so very coordinated and athletically inclined.

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[Edited 6/30/16 1:07am]

QueenofCardboard said:

If Prince was aspergers that would explain a lot.

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Being aspergers isn't bad thing.

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One thing that does point away from Aspergers is the fact that Prince was such a great dancer, so very coordinated and athletically inclined.

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[Edited 6/30/16 1:07am]

Not necessarily...

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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OnmK4rjkeSg

The only thing Prince suffered from, and explains all of his traits and "weirdness", is genius. Genius is both a gift and a burden and Prince suffered and excelled in his genius all the time. What is it they say? Genius is on the verge of insanity.

I suspect not. Aspies tend not to ride motorcycles from what I hear.

vladimir said:

I know one on here. She very different than Prince.

Bunsterdk said:

It's very amusing to read the many misconceptions here about people with asperges. And I mean that in the most friendly manner possible. As I mentioned, I have asperges and adhd and I love being with people, talk for hours with anyone remotely interesting one on one or in small groups, absolutely hate speaking in public, am a natural dancer, incorporating every beat in my body without really being able to tell you how, love performing, can write texts that paint a picture again without really understanding how. It just comes to me and I have to write it down. I write for a living, but used to sing, dance and play music in an attempt at making it my livelihood till I decided I didn't want what comes with that life. I have an extremely high energy level and problems sleeping at night, often sleeping better if I lay down during the day. Any of this sound familiar? I do have problems with social contact, but not even to the extent of freezing up completely as Prince did with Clark. Poor kid, like a deer in headlights. And I have been on national television, but it was pre-recorded interviews so not directly comparable. My best friend is kinda freaked out a little after Prince died because none of us really saw a lot of footage of him before since the early videos, and our mannerisms, facial expressions, the way we use our eyes etc are to a large extent identical, even if we don't look alike as such. And I didn't pick them up from him as I didn't know he did that. It's in many ways like finding a twin you didn't know you had. We both see things in grids, patterns etc etc. I have been diagnosed properly by professionals and have no doubts as to the validity of my diagnoses. Not saying this proves anything re Prince, just saying nothing mentioned here rules it out. Oh, and I am 51 and nothing indicates I won't make it to 57. Oh oh.. AND my all-time pre-Prince favourite colour is the exact same purple. That proves it. Prince had asperges, too.. LOL [Edited 6/30/16 3:04am]

If you don't mind me asking, what would be behaviours that you think are key to an Asperger diagnsosis?

The teens with Aspergers that I know of don't freeze up on public speaking and don't appear particularly shy to others (although I know they can feel uncomfortable and some seek out adult company so that others teens might say they are loners). They seem to enjoy social contact, seem to have the same energy levels as other kids but I don't know any that really enjoy team sports (unless you include social computer gaming in that). What I notice is that they don't read social cues very well and misread other people more frequently than most (both in positive and negative ways - they may interpret an innocent action as malicious (and responds slowly to an explanation otherwise) or fail to notice slights so they think everything is going great (even when big hints are being dropped that it is not). I have never noticed poor eye contact but neither have I seen any of them play the staring game that Prince was playing with Maria - mind games don't seem to be their thing. Oh, and I would say they are more cautious to try risky new things than the average person.

I don't know enough people with the diagnosis well enough to comment and these observations may just be particular to the people I know so I do wonder what you think the key characterisitics would be?

[Edited 6/30/16 10:29am]

My 20 year old son is diagnosed Asperger's. Many of his mannerisms remind me of Prince. He has a monotone way of speaking that's very quiet and low. He gets very nervous in front of people and has a hard time conversating. In fact, just yesterday I asked him what time he had to be to work and instead of saying, "4," he silently just raied 4 fingers (Prince, American Band Stand style). Having said all that, he's also very musically talented. He plays drums, guitar, bass, a little percussion and a little bit of keyboards. He also sings and writes songs all of the time. He lives and breathes music. All, self-taught too. Even though he can hardly look anyone in the eye when face to face, he has performed in front of his school a couple years ago for the talent show. He just recently sang and played guitar at our anniversary party. He's all about performing.

Ever since he was diagnosed, I've saw some of the same traits in Prince. People want to make fun of Prince for acting strange in earlier interviews or think it was just an act on his part, but I truly believe he could perform on stage like a master, but froze when talking to people.

Asperger's wasn't really talked about until just the last 10-15 years. If Prince did in fact have this, he probably wouldn't have known. One thing I learned is that Asperger's isn't an abnormality, just a different way of thinking.

SuzyHomemaker said:

My 20 year old son is diagnosed Asperger's. Many of his mannerisms remind me of Prince. He has a monotone way of speaking that's very quiet and low. He gets very nervous in front of people and has a hard time conversating. In fact, just yesterday I asked him what time he had to be to work and instead of saying, "4," he silently just raied 4 fingers (Prince, American Band Stand style). Having said all that, he's also very musically talented. He plays drums, guitar, bass, a little percussion and a little bit of keyboards. He also sings and writes songs all of the time. He lives and breathes music. All, self-taught too. Even though he can hardly look anyone in the eye when face to face, he has performed in front of his school a couple years ago for the talent show. He just recently sang and played guitar at our anniversary party. He's all about performing.

Ever since he was diagnosed, I've saw some of the same traits in Prince. People want to make fun of Prince for acting strange in earlier interviews or think it was just an act on his part, but I truly believe he could perform on stage like a master, but froze when talking to people.

Asperger's wasn't really talked about until just the last 10-15 years. If Prince did in fact have this, he probably wouldn't have known. One thing I learned is that Asperger's isn't an abnormality, just a different way of thinking.

But Prince wasn't like that around his family, friends, band etc. The 4 fingers was an incident of stage fright on his first first TV interview (I'm guessing it sounded better to say it was planned than he was scared of talking). When you hear the 1978 tape of him messing around in the studio with Nadeara he is not quiet, low or monotone with her. He seemed relaxed and playful.

Umm...Hell No I can appreciate orgers sharing stories about their loved one's struggles, but no I dont see any of this looking like Prince. He was a musical genius and we all know that when someone is that talented about something whether its music or art, etc it is extreme. Yes in the beginning he was shy, but what artist isnt shy and clumsy in the beginning of their careers.

[Edited 6/30/16 11:19am]

I was diagnosed as a teenager. Some of the things I used to do as a child are not present anymore, but they were really "aspy".

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For example, I had a problem interacting with my grandad when I was at kindergarten and we were in the bus (public transport), I think we were travelling somewhere... Because I found it weird to be at school and at the same time talking to my grandad who just happened to get on and go shopping (or whatever else).

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I'm an adult now. I take things very literally, can't understand irony or trolling at times, am overly sensitive, get socially tired after a while (when a party starts at 8 I leave before 12 cause I feel like I've enjoyed myself enough), find some simple things disgusting (like certain food packages), am obsessed with some things and have some odd habits.

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And I'm a perfectionist.

fortuneandserendipity said:

I know one on here. She very different than Prince.

Prince was also very different from all the neurotypical/non-spectrum people I've ever known. Therefore, he definitely was not neurotybpical.

People with Asperger and other forms of autism vary tremendously. Honestly, unless we knew what was in his head, how he actually felt in various situations, what his sensory reactions were to things--in other words, unless we were able to have him be right in front of us, being completely open and honest about his experiences living on this planet, we can't know. I will say that there is nothing from what I know about both Asperger syndrome and the public statements by Prince and those who knew him (and his own public behavior) that would in any way preclude him being a person with Asperger's. Looking at him from within my own head and my own experience, it is easy to see what he's doing and saying as being similar to my life. That said, maybe he wasneurotypical, and the people saying "He was just shy" or "He was guarded because of his childhood" or "He was playing the mysterious role" are right. Or people might be reading him through their own NT lenses. But I've already admitted I don't know and my interpretation's shaped by my own experience of the world.

spastic78 said:

What is known is that Prince was Gifted & Talented and that he was diagnosed with epilepsy as a child and supposedly his seizures stopped before he was a teenager. Gifted & Talented people generally suffer from over-excitabilities as defined by Dabrowski. These over-excitabilities include sensory sensitivity, synesthesia, hyper-attention, physical activity (fidgety), social awkwardness and a host of of other "symptoms" that over-lap with Autism. Does this mean that G&T people are on the spectrum? No. But it does suggest that they are not neuro-typical. Epileptics remain epileptics for life though seizures may have stopped. Epilepsy is defined neurologically (brain-wave patterns differ during seizures) but it is also very much a social disorder as well. The stigma attached to seizures -Ranging from "it's the devil inside of you" to "you're weird" is enough to cause any child to develop social anxiety as well as a desire to control their environment. As a result, many epileptics appear to have autistic symptoms too. A child who is both G&T and Epileptic will quickly adopt the necessary social skills that will enable them to thrive. Often times they'll over-compensate and strive for perfection though be constantly worried that someone will pierce the veil/illusion hence the need to control others as well as remain distant. If this child is the abandoned by the maternal role model/mother then the child may never be able to accept love or trust anyone and thus will channel his energies into his talents with religious fervor. Of course, this then leads to more social issues and speculation. It's interesting to me that Prince only admitted to epilepsy in 2009 and yet was willing to embrace autism.

He had brought up epilepsy in lyrics as far back as 1992 in "The Sacrifice of Victor"--and I'm not aware of any public statements from him regarding spectrum issues.

As to whether GAT folks are on the spectrum--obviously you can say "excitabilities" are "symptoms" of GAT--but tons of GAT folks don't have them. I tend to feel, as many do, that it's not symptoms that overlap, but that many people in one category are also in the other as well (but it's hardly a majority either way--most people are one or the other or neither). My GAT daughter really doesn't show any of these "excitabilities", and cannot understand what we're talking about, or make sense of her Aspie cousin, for example. My wife and I, both also GAT, do exhibit them, to the point that they largely define and direct our lives and interactions.

I think what you say about epilepsy is interesting, especially since Prince did consider it significant enough to mention in "The Sacrifice of Victor," which while not exactly straight autobiography does draw from his own life in a much more personal details way than anything else I can think of in his work.

sunset3121 said:

Bunsterdk said:

sunset3121 said:

If you don't mind me asking, what would be behaviours that you think are key to an Asperger diagnsosis?

The teens with Aspergers that I know of don't freeze up on public speaking and don't appear particularly shy to others (although I know they can feel uncomfortable and some seek out adult company so that others teens might say they are loners). They seem to enjoy social contact, seem to have the same energy levels as other kids but I don't know any that really enjoy team sports (unless you include social computer gaming in that). What I notice is that they don't read social cues very well and misread other people more frequently than most (both in positive and negative ways - they may interpret an innocent action as malicious (and responds slowly to an explanation otherwise) or fail to notice slights so they think everything is going great (even when big hints are being dropped that it is not). I have never noticed poor eye contact but neither have I seen any of them play the staring game that Prince was playing with Maria - mind games don't seem to be their thing. Oh, and I would say they are more cautious to try risky new things than the average person.

I don't know enough people with the diagnosis well enough to comment and these observations may just be particular to the people I know so I do wonder what you think the key characterisitics would be?

[Edited 6/30/16 10:29am]

I wouldn't know as I'm sure there are many, but the things mentioned here as arguments against the diagnosis just don't rule it out. That's all I'm saying. Most people know very little about this and it shows in the arguments listed against. I know someone with asperges who is very good at the staring game. He will use it to intimidate as he's a big guy. It doesn't rule it out either. The fact that Prince got involved with this particular cause might tell us something, but only a trained health professional who has actually spoken with him about this could determine if it is indeed the case or not.

I am not thinking Aspergers precludes staring - I am sure I have seen them stare. It was the social game he was playing that just did not remind me of the AS kids.

Rebeljuice said:

The only thing Prince suffered from, and explains all of his traits and "weirdness", is genius. Genius is both a gift and a burden and Prince suffered and excelled in his genius all the time. What is it they say? Genius is on the verge of insanity.

sunset3121 said:

ForeverPaisley said:

Rebeljuice said:

The only thing Prince suffered from, and explains all of his traits and "weirdness", is genius. Genius is both a gift and a burden and Prince suffered and excelled in his genius all the time. What is it they say? Genius is on the verge of insanity.

neither here nor there really. He was what he was. Sounds like he suspected he had some form of Aspergers, and if that is what prompted him to play the benefit shows, then it was a good thing, regardless of whether he had it or not.

I used to think he may be dyslexic (based on that part from UTCM) but not with that handwriting. Maybe ADHD or ADD. There is also something somewhat newish called Nonverbal Learning Disability. Some are advocating for NLD and ADHA to be added to the spectrum but I do not think that is necessary if anything some things need to be removed.

and just small issue the DSMV removed Asperger's.