Mumio said:

artist76 said:

"he had a dangerously low red blood cell count, meaning he was sick" -- ??

Anemia, we don't know why right now. Could be iron deficiency due to diet, could be something more serious.

Eileen said:

artist76 said:

"he had a dangerously low red blood cell count, meaning he was sick" -- ??

Anemia, we don't know why right now. Could be iron deficiency due to diet, could be something more serious.

OK, I just looked up possible causes of low RBC on mayoclinic and a couple other online health sites, and a lot of those look scary. So I'm "hoping" it was his diet - being vegetarian, plus overworking.

Man, I need to go to sleep now and take a break for a few days!

Eileen said:

artist76 said:

"he had a dangerously low red blood cell count, meaning he was sick" -- ??

Anemia, we don't know why right now. Could be iron deficiency due to diet, could be something more serious.

There are a lot of possibilities, some of which will only fuel the rumours. Anti-retroviral drugs for HIV and chemotherapy can cause a low RBC. Of course, iron deficiency and vitamin deficiency could also be responsible. There is also a possibility of kidney disease and one of the possible side effects of long term Percocet use is kidney failure.

Basically it could be a myriad of things which is only going to fuel the rumours and start new ones. I really wish this "news" was not revealed right now because it just adds fuel to the fire.

NYT as posted in the other thread:

http://www.nytimes.com/20...-says.html

http://prince.org/msg/7/424973

Eileen said:

NYT as posted in the other thread:

http://www.nytimes.com/20...-says.html

http://prince.org/msg/7/424973

saw that and got a kick out of one of the other articles listed where prince asked his keyboardist who was having trouble remembering songs "are you a genius" the guy said "no" Prince said "well, I am a genius and i don't have a problem remembering so write it down". Gonna miss that sassiness that he always had like the time he told RS "people ask if I'm getting too big for my britches, I wish they'd understand that always thought I was bad".

Hmmm. Emailed a friend of mine earlier with some thoughts and now see TMZ has posted almost the same thing, so I'll just paste my comments here:

It was posted that it's a felony to travel across state lines with narcotics that aren't prescribed to you. Ouch. It's doubtful that Good Samaritan Law grants immunity for that, it mainly applies to activities encompassing the scene of the emergency.

Also, the MN GS law has this exception: "unless the person acts in a willful and wanton or reckless manner in providing the care, advice, or assistance."

And "does not apply to a person rendering emergency care, advice, or assistance during the course of regular employment, and receiving compensation or expecting to receive compensation for rendering the care, advice, or assistance."

The more you read about his last hours, the sadder it gets. What Prince was going through, mirrors what my mum went through with pain killers, except we just managed to get to her before it was too late. It hits home for me , why he died. Prince was just trying to stay being Prince! Still trying to lead from the front. Be the strong one, leading the crew in paisley park, the bands his friends, the lot. It makes his death more upsetting. He was trying to do the right things. Just trying to manage the pain so he could carry on being Prince.

Eileen said:

artist76 said:

"he had a dangerously low red blood cell count, meaning he was sick" -- ??

Anemia, we don't know why right now. Could be iron deficiency due to diet, could be something more serious.

Amongst the numerous side effect of Percocet (addiction being of course one of them) these are also listed (and rated as severe):

• Decreased Neutrophils a Type of White Blood CellSevere
• Decreased White Blood CellsSevere
• Deficiency of Granulocytes a Type of White Blood Cell
• low white or red blood cell count
  
• Anemia

Source: http://www.webmd.com/drug...ideeffects

http://www.eopiates.com/percocet/percocet-side-effects.html

So that doesn't necessarily mean his death was related to a disease. I personnally believe it was the use of Percocet, taken for whatever initial reason, that ultimately led him to his worsening condition. Remember that the media is very good at linking unrelated facts together and lead the public into follow their own logic. It is important to research every given piece of information, and use caution in our thinking.

[Edited 5/5/16 1:56am]

removed, I see your addition about RBC thanks.

[Edited 5/5/16 1:54am]

See previous post further up (edited).

[Edited 5/5/16 2:19am]

ABC News writes: "Local authorities told ABC News that the feds' involvement is largely due to the fact they need to be able to investigate what happened involving Prince in other states. Of particular interest: the emergency landing his plane made in Illinois the week before his death."

PeteSilas said:

JenniferJoy said:

It's gonna tear us all up if we continue to speculate about what could have/should have been done to prevent his tragic death. The plane incident after the ATL show was Prince's wake up call. It was truly a gift that he was able to be resuscitated and given a second chance. The fact that this Dr in CA didn't get the call from Prince's camp until the Wednesday night, six days after the OD, tells me that either Prince or his team did not truly recognize the urgency of the situation. If Prince did not wish to stay hospitalized or have staff available 24/7 during this critical period (cuz' we all know if he had wanted it *clap clap* it would’ve been done), who is ultimately responsible?

I think that many of us have always projected super human qualities to Prince. Perhaps he was guilty of this himself. In the end, I'm sorry to say, whatever transpired was his destiny. =(

a lot of it has to do with his always being alone really. He really didn't have much in the way of supportive family, ever. Kicked out on the streets, abandoned. Much like James Brown, it made him supercompetent and incredibly successful and built their characters, they also didn't know how to do things any other way. When you see human beings as unreliable to begin with, you aren't real eager to be at their mercy. I see it as a situation where he was between the devil and the deep blue sea. at least at this point, barring more info.

Very true this. I was in charge of my family at a young age (early teens) after my mother left and it shaped me tremendously. I totally lost my trust in people and became a control freak. Everything needs to be done my way and I do not trust people, still to this day, to do anything for me. It puts a tremendous strain on me. I'm very sucessful at my job and have raised a lovely family of my own.
I think in Prince's case he was convinced he could handle it all.

Suzanne said:

Reply #530 posted 05/04/16 1:25pm

Suzanne

PeteSilas said: RiotPaisley said: clairew1975 said: HIPAA laws would have prevented anyone else from knowing his situation unless he wanted someone to know. From what I understand - they give Narcan just in case. It's possible his people had no idea why he was unresponsive so they gave him the narcan. His people may have been frazzled and didn't even know that's what they gave him. So he gets to the hospital, tells everyone to leave the room- that's his right under HIPAA and only he knows what is going on. However, someone was making arrangements for the Cali Doctor allegedly... So there was at least one person who knew something was going on. I've been wondering what Will Smiths role in this is... Maybe he knew the doctor in Cali and Prince reached out to him? Can we be careful when reposting with quotes please. I did not actually say any of the above. My original post is missing from this thread.... "rights" are a joke really, I hate hospitals too and would rather just die than be stuck in one. You have no privacy in a hospital and who feels like telling people to back up every two seconds? I say this as a guy who watched two loved ones die while I was too beat down to ask for privacy. Nah.. this actually sounds like a whole lot of BS to me...... or an ad for the treatment center. There was NO NEED for this public statement by the Drs. attorney. Regardless of the article or not. If they are a repubable place, there is no need for this dog and pony show. I am certainly not blaming anyone, but they were quick to release this info as soon as they thought their "public perception" would be tarnished. Perhaps if the good Dr's son took a dang Uber like everyone else in the world, Prince would not have been alone... GIVE ME A BREAK. Everyone leave to go pick up a Dr? PLEASE ... something else went down and everyone knows it. I wonder if they called the scripts in for Prince at that Walgreens adn they are playing CYA.... something stinks with this story..

sonshine said:

vandeluca said:

Thanks for sharing..

I have been saying this from the first murmurs about this tragedy being related to opiates. The withdrawl is brutal and for the individual on these pills it quickly becomes more about avoiding coming down than getting high. No matter if he was an addict or dependent or whatever he was no junkie. I can assure you no one wants to live that life if they have a choice. It's a horrible situation to be in, a horrible burden, and a horrible way to exist having your entire life revolve around the pills. My heart aches for him and what he was going thru for quite some time apparently. I wish he would have asked for help sooner. It's an incredibly hard habit to break but with his resources he had a better chance than most. Which leads me to believe he felt he wouldn't be the same creative genius without the pills. Perhaps they gave him the courage he needed to be who he was, or who he thought we all needed him to be. It's obvious he had some emotional scars from his childhood that were never dealt with appropriately. He like most other addicts turned to drugs to numb the pain. That's just my two cents but in the end I believe it goes back a long time and is much more complicated than we will ever really understand. None of it matters now anyway except as a lesson to others - both addicts and their caregivers.

I'm not sure you understand what kind of medicatian we are talking about here. It's not drugs to get high.

funksterr said:

EVERYBODY who helped Prince acquire illegal prescriptions and drugs should be charged. STUPIDITY and 'just following the Boss's orders' are poor excuses.

Has this been confirmed?

funksterr said:

headtripparade said:

SoulAlive said: Okay, let's assume these "yes men" do stand up to someone like Prince. What makes you think for one second that he wouldn't fire them on the spot? So he fires his whole team because they tried to control him and tell him what to do and tell him what he doesn't want to hear and he ends up alone anyway. And they couldn't hang around because at that point they'd be fired and therefore trespassing on his property and he could call the police should he so choose. This grand intervention of his entire team taking his health into consideration and doing the right thing just doesn't exist. You cannot rule an individual by compulsion, Prince or not. [Edited 5/4/16 18:30pm]

I don't care about their jobs and careers or whatever. The scenario you descibe is exactly why there should be charges. You have allegations of people doing things waaaay outside the law, and outside the boundaries of good sense, just to keep their hook-up with the global superstar. Screw 'em.

Allegation or speculation?

paulludvig said:

funksterr said:

EVERYBODY who helped Prince acquire illegal prescriptions and drugs should be charged. STUPIDITY and 'just following the Boss's orders' are poor excuses.

Has this been confirmed?

Not that I've seen, however one presumes that there must have been some evidence of Prince being in possession of pills that weren't validly prescribed, otherwise I don't know why the cops would have raided a Walgreens or how they would have gotten a search warrant to do so.

psychodelicide said:

Eileen said:

This is certainly not evidence and may have been entirely invented. There was a comment left on one of the TMZ articles from someone who posted very specific details about the prescriptions that were picked up at Walgreens. I won't paste it here, but the poster listed multiple prescriptions each for Percocet, Loratab, Ambien, and Xanax.

Dang!

They don't make Lortab anymore.

beachy said:

endiadj said:

This is so infuriating! I had read the rumors of drug usage before, Cat giving him X, the od story from the twins, the step-brother claims of drug use, etc., but i brushed them off cause people in his life said he lived a clean life, they never saw him do drugs, etc. But, here we are now after his death guessing what drugs he od'ed on. I never thought this would be the last impression Prince would leave with us. It's turned into a free for all. I hate it for him. I hate it!

I hate it when people lump all drugs together as bad. Taking prescription pills to sleep or manage pain is completely different from taking recreational drugs to party or feel good. Maybe Prince tried X once or twice but he did not party with drugs. He needed prescription pills to function. People who have never been in his circumstances don't understand it because they function normally without medication.

Co-sign. I have a bulging disc and arthritis in my back and hip. When it "flares", I can barely walk. I janked it particularly bad one time and couldn't sleep for close o two months. I could only sleep on one side of my body and whenever I moved, I'd wake up. It was agony. I had to use a walker. Went to the ER even.

Most doctors I went to accused me of faking and drug seeking. They're so gun shy about prescribing these things thanks to DEA crack downs and rescheduling. What happens is that people who need them are demonized as junkies and the people who got overprescribed and hooked on them have turned to heroin as a cheaper and easier way to avoid withdrawal.

Chalk up another victory for the "war on drugs" and our stupid health system.

Now that a high profile celebrity has succumbed to them, expect even tougher legislation and opportunistic politicians sponsoring "The Prince Act" which will only make the problem worse. The heroin epedemic in this country is a direct result of overprescribing these meds and the subsequent overreaction and crackdown by the DEA.

herb4 said:

beachy said:

I hate it when people lump all drugs together as bad. Taking prescription pills to sleep or manage pain is completely different from taking recreational drugs to party or feel good. Maybe Prince tried X once or twice but he did not party with drugs. He needed prescription pills to function. People who have never been in his circumstances don't understand it because they function normally without medication.

Co-sign. I have a bulging disc and arthritis in my back and hip. When it "flares", I can barely walk. I janked it particularly bad one time and couldn't sleep for close o two months. I could only sleep on one side of my body and whenever I moved, I'd wake up. It was agony. I had to use a walker. Went to the ER even.

Most doctors I went to accused me of faking and drug seeking. They're so gun shy about prescribing these things thanks to DEA crack downs and rescheduling. What happens is that people who need them are demonized as junkies and the people who got overprescribed and hooked on them have turned to heroin as a cheaper and easier way to avoid withdrawal.

Chalk up another victory for the "war on drugs" and our stupid health system.

Now that a high profile celebrity has succumbed to them, expect even tougher legislation and opportunistic politicians sponsoring "The Prince Act" which will only make the problem worse. The heroin epedemic in this country is a direct result of overprescribing these meds and the subsequent overreaction and crackdown by the DEA.

Very well put. This could potentially have been an opportunity to look at the wider issues of under-prescribing much needed drugs for sufferers of chronic pain, and ongoing care for such sufferers; it could be an opportunity to revisit the broader approach to dealing with drug issues (not only "addiction" which has turned into a meaningless self-serving moral crusade, rather than a concerted effort to understand the nature of addiction, but also "dependence" which is entirely different but usually lumped together with addiction by lazy journalists and the imbecilic "moral majority"); but sadly it'll be used by politicians of all allegiances to further prop up a failing/failed system.

Everything you say about the US is equally relevant here in the UK. The blind leading the blind.

who are all these people who are 'extremely close to the investigation' and are just

leaking stuff to the press left right and center? do the press pay so much that they
willingly put their job on the line to sell a story?

IstenSzek said:

paulludvig said:

sonshine said:

vandeluca said: I have been saying this from the first murmurs about this tragedy being related to opiates. The withdrawl is brutal and for the individual on these pills it quickly becomes more about avoiding coming down than getting high. No matter if he was an addict or dependent or whatever he was no junkie. I can assure you no one wants to live that life if they have a choice. It's a horrible situation to be in, a horrible burden, and a horrible way to exist having your entire life revolve around the pills. My heart aches for him and what he was going thru for quite some time apparently. I wish he would have asked for help sooner. It's an incredibly hard habit to break but with his resources he had a better chance than most. Which leads me to believe he felt he wouldn't be the same creative genius without the pills. Perhaps they gave him the courage he needed to be who he was, or who he thought we all needed him to be. It's obvious he had some emotional scars from his childhood that were never dealt with appropriately. He like most other addicts turned to drugs to numb the pain. That's just my two cents but in the end I believe it goes back a long time and is much more complicated than we will ever really understand. None of it matters now anyway except as a lesson to others - both addicts and their caregivers.

I'm not sure you understand what kind of medicatian we are talking about here. It's not drugs to get high.

.

It is a drug that gets you high. Medication like Percocet (oxycodone) is an opioid, similar to heroin in its effects including a "high", and one can develop dependence and withdrawal symptoms if used for extended periods of time. It can cause death if the dose is too high because it slows your breathing. That's why all pain medication needs to be closely monitored by a medical doctor.

spastic78 said:

headtripparade said:

Per the official incident report from the sheriff, responders were dispatched at 9:43 and the ambulance arrived at 9:48. It only took them 5 minutes to respond, not 19.

I'm looking at the official transcript from Carver County Prince Investigation . Times were not released other than death. And to me it's clear that there is no EMT personnel there administering CPR or anything until right before 10:07. The sheriffs report doesn't state a time of arrival either but did administer CPR. Something is not right though. Change is tiny. Police are everywhere especially in that area. Why didn't the two others provide CPR? Why didn't they know the address? [Edited 5/4/16 20:01pm]

other reports state that he was already dead and rigor mortis had set in

FunkiestOne said:

tmo1965 said:

I personally don't think that they should press any charges on the Dr's son. I believe that they got the DEA involved because the son travelled across state lines with narcotics that were not prescribed to him with the intent of giving them to Prince or having the Minneapolis dr give them to him. It's felony and I hope they don't mess this guy's whole future up over this.

.

Yes that woudl be so wrong, but a lot of people in law enforcment (esp the DEA) have no morality and it's all about getting more "collars" and throwing as many people in prison as possible...a few joints or pills or a pound of heroin...it's all the same to them.

Unfortunately, there were a lot of laws broken, to help Prince out, if thats what this was.
*(See these comments:

"Still, Andrew's lawyer defends that his client should be granted immunity from any criminal charges since he was acting as a "good samaritan." Supposedly, there is a Minnesota state law that gives protection to people who might be involved in a drug related crime IF they dial 911. It's said that the purpose of this law is to make sure that wrongdoers will help those in trouble without fear of prosecution.

However the person is no longer immune from facing legal action if, when they call for help, they were intending to get paid for dialing 911. It's currently unconfirmed if Andrew and/or his father were hired to assist Prince during his time of need.

Not to mention, it is illegal to bring drugs across state lines — so if Andrew's dad DID prescribe drugs to Prince, that is a total no-no. "
On the flip side - we also have a prominent Dr., his son and attorney, scrambling to make sure they are not charged, so the facts of the case, may be interpretted to do that. We may never know what went down. We also don't know if/how this "appointment" came to be.

If they were planning an intervention, this is surely not the right path to go and charge those trying to get him help. I feel so sad because blaming people, pointing fingers, aren't going to solve anything. Prince is no longer with us, he can't speak on this, the people who tried to help him, are fighting off any legal issues for being culpable. This is why Professionals steer away from bending the rules for ANYONE.

When they do try to administer help, and something goes south, the are the first to get blamed. Its the Law enforcements job to get a "collar". Period end of story. Everyone is doing their "jobs".

Its so sad to think that all this "job" stuff is getting in the way of the truth. The truth is, what we KNOW is Prince was sick, unwell, turned to whatever, and had a bad set of circumstance relating to his heatlh. NONE of us should blame his staffers, Drs. or who ever, for doing thier job, but i am pissed off. I know I've been on the receiving end of a person who was heavily addicted to Oxy, due to a car accident, and became a mess. A professional executive, who lost his family, his career and money, as a result of perscription medicene being abused. He got in too deep. Which MAY have happened here. I know during the time I witnessed him slipping, I tried my hardest, to help him. The way he treated me was horrible, and he didn't want help, he was trying to manage. He "got by" functioning at least 7 years before he started to show signs of slipping. I saw the signs, many others did too, but turned a blind eye. I refused to do that, and I was fired. We remained friends because he knew my intentions. He's dead now too. After he died everyone was all.. you tried.. I wish I tried...

headtripparade said:

I just read the report from Channel 5 that was posted up thread and if it's true and they're able to be getting scraps from his blood tests, can't we assume that the tox report is back and we should get the news any time?

Even if the report is completed, I dont think they will release it until the investigtion surrounding the events have been completed. Besides, I think we all know how he died and the toxicology report will probably just confirm that. What I want to know, and I imagine most fans do, is why did he die? What led to it? Not just what happened those last few days or weeks, but when it all actually started.

Rebeljuice said: