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Thread started 01/19/16 10:13am

AnonymousFan

What is the The Sacrifice of Victor (song) about?

I read the lyrics, but I can't figure it out. I mean, I know it's supposed to be about his childhood and hope and all that, but I don't get the rest of it.

Ex.

"I know joy live 'round the corner

One day I'll visit her, I'm gonna

When she tell me everything

That's when the angels sing

That's when the victory is sho 'nuff"

What does that mean? Who and what does Joy symbolize? What is the metaphor here? Why is she telling him everything? What is everything?

?

"If the only thing that tells me is father time

Then sacrifice is the mother sublime"

?

"A little more important than ripple and weed"

?

"Sell it, don't tell it, don't tell me"

?

"When I reach my destination

My name will be Victor"

?

Most importantly: WHY DO WE SACRIFICE? WHAT ARE WE SACRIFICING?

Human sacrifice? Animal sacrifice? Personal sacrifice? Collective sacrifice?

I don't get it! What is he saying? What is this song about on the next level (literary/poetic)? What is it?

[Edited 1/19/16 10:13am]

[Edited 1/19/16 10:15am]

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Reply #1 posted 01/19/16 10:20am

nextedition

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Wasn't this around the time he considered Prince dead? I always assumed it was about that.

I really don't know much about the lyrics.

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Reply #2 posted 01/19/16 11:41am

BobGeorge909

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:sigh:

Gimmie a couple hours for this bowl to wear off and I'll get back to ya.
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Reply #3 posted 01/19/16 2:12pm

mikeyaddict

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He was a huge fan of One Foot in the Grave back in the day. Massive. He heard that the main character played by Richard Wilson was going to be killed off, and did not believe it. The song was inspired by that show and the feelings it evoked for him at the time.

Comin str8 outta Preston...
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Reply #4 posted 01/19/16 2:18pm

funksterr

It's Prince's autobiography.

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Reply #5 posted 01/19/16 3:22pm

Raajput

It would have been boring if he hadnt at least been a little cryptic!

The only cryptic part for me back as a kid in '92 was working out what he was saying in that delivery, P isnt the easiest to work out at times without the lyrics to hand. Listen to the bit about Dr King was killed and the streets, they started burning....it becomes obvious what the sacrifice is about...

AnonymousFan said:

I read the lyrics, but I can't figure it out. I mean, I know it's supposed to be about his childhood and hope and all that, but I don't get the rest of it.

Ex.

"I know joy live 'round the corner

One day I'll visit her, I'm gonna

When she tell me everything

That's when the angels sing

That's when the victory is sho 'nuff"

What does that mean? Who and what does Joy symbolize? What is the metaphor here? Why is she telling him everything? What is everything?

?

"If the only thing that tells me is father time

Then sacrifice is the mother sublime"

?

"A little more important than ripple and weed"

?

"Sell it, don't tell it, don't tell me"

?

"When I reach my destination

My name will be Victor"

?

Most importantly: WHY DO WE SACRIFICE? WHAT ARE WE SACRIFICING?

Human sacrifice? Animal sacrifice? Personal sacrifice? Collective sacrifice?

I don't get it! What is he saying? What is this song about on the next level (literary/poetic)? What is it?

[Edited 1/19/16 10:13am]

[Edited 1/19/16 10:15am]

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Reply #6 posted 01/19/16 4:27pm

RJOrion

Its about Prince
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Reply #7 posted 01/20/16 4:38am

databank

avatar

AnonymousFan said:

I read the lyrics, but I can't figure it out. I mean, I know it's supposed to be about his childhood and hope and all that, but I don't get the rest of it.

Ex.

"I know joy live 'round the corner

One day I'll visit her, I'm gonna

When she tell me everything

That's when the angels sing

That's when the victory is sho 'nuff"

What does that mean? Who and what does Joy symbolize? What is the metaphor here? Why is she telling him everything? What is everything?

?

"If the only thing that tells me is father time

Then sacrifice is the mother sublime"

?

"A little more important than ripple and weed"

?

"Sell it, don't tell it, don't tell me"

?

"When I reach my destination

My name will be Victor"

?

Most importantly: WHY DO WE SACRIFICE? WHAT ARE WE SACRIFICING?

Human sacrifice? Animal sacrifice? Personal sacrifice? Collective sacrifice?

I don't get it! What is he saying? What is this song about on the next level (literary/poetic)? What is it?

[Edited 1/19/16 10:13am]

[Edited 1/19/16 10:15am]

What is sacrifice? The first line shows that there's no definitive answer to that question.

.

Church if u will

Please turn 2 the book of Victor

We like 2 start at the top if u don't mind
.
I was born on a blood stained table

Cord wrapped around my neck

Epilectic 'til the age of 7 Liner notes on the booklet say "true", and P confirmed that he was epileptic until 7 in a TV interview in 2009

I was sure heaven marked the deck To me this seems even though life was harsh Prince saw an ace in his game, but I'm not sure

.

I know joy lives 'round the corner

One day I'll visit her I'm gonna

When she tell me everything

That's when the angels sing

That's when the victory is sho 'nuff Seems to confirm my reading of the previous line, also on that 2009 TV show P says he doesn't remember it but his mom later told him that when he was 7 he claimed an angel appeared and claimed that he'd be fine and from that point on he never suffered a seizure again

.

Mama held up her baby 4 protection

From a man with a strap in his hand

Ask the Victor 'bout pain and rejection

U think he don't when he do understand It seems things didn't go well with his stepfather

.
1967 in a bus marked public schools

Rode me and a group of unsuspecting political tools

Our parents wondered what it was like

2 have another color near

So they put their babies together

2 eliminate the fear This is about the end of segregation in the US and P experimenting it as a child

.
Never understood my old friends laughing Liner notes say "MD & A", most likely Morris and André

They got high when everything else got wrong I don't think they were getting high at 10, but most likely this means later, as teenagers, they worried more about mundane pleasureq than about serious topics

Dr. King was killed and the streets

They started burnin' Reference to the murder of MLK and the ensuing riots

When the smoke was cleared, their high was gone

Education got important, so important 2 Victor

A little more important than ripple and weed

Bernadette the lady, she told me This is Bernadette Anderson, André's mom, who allowed P to stay at her home and told him he had to get his high school degree before doing only music, liner notes say "Thank u"

"Whatever u do son, a little discipline is what u need"

.
Hey Wendy, how come we... Not sure about that Wendy reference, it's from an online lyrics site and IDK why P would talk to Wendy here eek

'scuse me y'all

We don't don't mean 2 take up yo time

But we got something

heavy on our minds

Sometimes, u gotta leave the one u love Might xplain the Wendy reference?

Around the corner, there's another sacrifice

But u got 2 do the best u can y'all

Say u got 2 go through it

U got 2 go through it all

Lord I might get tired

but I, I've got 2 keep on

Walkin' down this road

When I reach my destination

My name will be Victor "Victor" as in "he who holds the victory"

.

When all is said and done I'd say Prince does what he very often does: he mixes-up personal and political issues (he does the same in countless songs, for example Crystal Ball) to put his own humanity in the perspective of the whole human race. The sacrifice symbolizes several things:

Hard work to reach your goals instead of wasting on's time with mundane joys (we saw where that led Morris or Rick James)

Favoring a metaphysical, divine happiness over earth pleasures

P's own struggle from a middle class black child from a broken family to superstardom

And on a broader scale the long, hard struggle Blacks had to go thru in the USA to gain their civil rights, at the cost of riots, police beatings and MLK's death (MLK is a good symbol of sacrificing yourself to a cause, because his activism led to his death).

.

Hope this helps smile

A COMPREHENSIVE PRINCE DISCOGRAPHY (work in progress ^^): https://sites.google.com/...iscog/home
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Reply #8 posted 01/20/16 5:52pm

4everyours

Hate to say it, but for all of the anti-religion folks that came out of the woodwork with TRC, this song seems to me to be about our journey to Heaven and the sacrifices or trials that people may face. The line that really seems to be clear is the one "ask the victor about pain and rejection, think he don't when he do understand". To me, this is referring to Jesus and that he felt pain and rejection like humans but in the end, through His sacrifice, he was the Victor. Now, everyone's sacrifices and trials might be different, but the ones in the song are ones Prince identified with in his life. Joy or Heaven is "just around the corner", sound familiar, Grafitti Bridge, and one day he hopes to get there.

Anyway, just my thoughts/interpretation and it did not hit me until just a couple of years ago. But now, seems pretty clear. Kinda like when Star Fish and Coffee was explained in the autistic child theory and then it seemed pretty clear.

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Reply #9 posted 01/21/16 1:51pm

funksterr

4everyours said:

Hate to say it, but for all of the anti-religion folks that came out of the woodwork with TRC, this song seems to me to be about our journey to Heaven and the sacrifices or trials that people may face. The line that really seems to be clear is the one "ask the victor about pain and rejection, think he don't when he do understand". To me, this is referring to Jesus and that he felt pain and rejection like humans but in the end, through His sacrifice, he was the Victor. Now, everyone's sacrifices and trials might be different, but the ones in the song are ones Prince identified with in his life. Joy or Heaven is "just around the corner", sound familiar, Grafitti Bridge, and one day he hopes to get there.

Anyway, just my thoughts/interpretation and it did not hit me until just a couple of years ago. But now, seems pretty clear. Kinda like when Star Fish and Coffee was explained in the autistic child theory and then it seemed pretty clear.

Not a bad take. One thing about Prince, his songs sometimes seem to be about multiple things simultaneously.

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Reply #10 posted 01/21/16 3:37pm

AnonymousFan

4everyours said:

Hate to say it, but for all of the anti-religion folks that came out of the woodwork with TRC, this song seems to me to be about our journey to Heaven and the sacrifices or trials that people may face. The line that really seems to be clear is the one "ask the victor about pain and rejection, think he don't when he do understand". To me, this is referring to Jesus and that he felt pain and rejection like humans but in the end, through His sacrifice, he was the Victor. Now, everyone's sacrifices and trials might be different, but the ones in the song are ones Prince identified with in his life. Joy or Heaven is "just around the corner", sound familiar, Grafitti Bridge, and one day he hopes to get there.

Anyway, just my thoughts/interpretation and it did not hit me until just a couple of years ago. But now, seems pretty clear. Kinda like when Star Fish and Coffee was explained in the autistic child theory and then it seemed pretty clear.

What's the autistic child theory?

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Reply #11 posted 01/21/16 3:46pm

dbpdexter

It's simple what the sacrifice of victor is about.It's about overcoming obstacles even when the odds are stacked against you and coming out the victor.It's about discipline and courage even when life throws you a curve and showing people you can when they say you can't.

AKA PDEXTER
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Reply #12 posted 01/21/16 6:51pm

IstenSzek

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mikeyaddict said:

He was a huge fan of One Foot in the Grave back in the day. Massive. He heard that the main character played by Richard Wilson was going to be killed off, and did not believe it. The song was inspired by that show and the feelings it evoked for him at the time.

i see what you did there lol

"i do not believe it!"

smile

that show was hysterical.

and true love lives on lollipops and crisps
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Reply #13 posted 01/22/16 2:54pm

4everyours

AnonymousFan said:

4everyours said:

Hate to say it, but for all of the anti-religion folks that came out of the woodwork with TRC, this song seems to me to be about our journey to Heaven and the sacrifices or trials that people may face. The line that really seems to be clear is the one "ask the victor about pain and rejection, think he don't when he do understand". To me, this is referring to Jesus and that he felt pain and rejection like humans but in the end, through His sacrifice, he was the Victor. Now, everyone's sacrifices and trials might be different, but the ones in the song are ones Prince identified with in his life. Joy or Heaven is "just around the corner", sound familiar, Grafitti Bridge, and one day he hopes to get there.

Anyway, just my thoughts/interpretation and it did not hit me until just a couple of years ago. But now, seems pretty clear. Kinda like when Star Fish and Coffee was explained in the autistic child theory and then it seemed pretty clear.

What's the autistic child theory?

Read this story and this explaned things a bit: cool story!!

Exclusive story from Housequake.com.
Susannah Melvoin about writing Starfish & Coffee.
"I remember Minneapolis vividly. The air smells of water and earth and the lakes that spread throughout the city become deserted of people. I loved it and I loved what was to become an extremely beautiful time in my life. I can narrow down one particular day in 1986 that was particularly special: the day I wrote Starfish and Coffee with Prince.
Sitting around the kitchen table would be Prince, his engineer Susan Rogers, and myself. It was a time Susan and myself spent every day with Prince recording or keeping each other company. Prince and I spent many hours together, either in the studio working or driving around Minneapolis talking to each other and listening to music. We talked about our histories and our secrets, and on a couple of occasions I told him stories of a 12 year-old girl I had known named Cynthia Rose.
My sister Wendy and I knew Cynthia intimately because we shared six years together in a classroom, plus a bus ride to school with her. It was on these bus rides that I got to know Cynthia.
Cynthia never had much interest outside of her own personal space, so watching her was an unedited version of what was going on her head. I’m certain if Cynthia were in school today, she’d still be as interesting and extraterrestrial as she was back then. I think Cynthia was dropped off from another world. A world filled with extraordinary images. Images only Cynthia knew the meaning behind.
Her favorite number for many years was the number 12. I knew this because she’d rock back and forth in her seat asking you if you knew what her favorite number was for the day. It was always a shock to her that anyone knew that her favorite number was 12. I’d say, "I think it’s twelve, right Cynthia?” She was totally amazed and joyous that I had guessed it right. I mean, who'd have guessed it?
I’d watch how she would ecstatically experience the world. Cynthia would tell you over and over again how amazing and meaningful the number 12 was. I’d ask her "why?" The answer never changed. It was always "because it makes me happy," said as she etched a huge happy face with her finger on the damp foggy bus window. Most of those bus rides Cynthia sat rocking in her seat, gently repeating her favorite number.
Cynthia would also tell me what she had for breakfast, and every day it was the same: Starfish and PEE PEE! I never understood the combo meal. And frankly nobody else could, either. This seemed like the deal breaker for most kids. More importantly, the kids in our class had no interest in how Cynthia came to get her morning breakfast! I thought it was tender and funny and I listened to her tell me anything she wanted to say, whether it was firmly planted on earth or from her planet of tender-hearted people who love numbers and draw smiley faces on foggy bus windows.
Sixth grade was the last year our class was to be together and it was the first bus ride of that year that I noticed something was different about Cynthia. She sat quietly in her seat staring out of the window. When we arrived at school, and as the bus pulled into the lot, Cynthia turned my way, looked me in the eyes and asked me if I wanted to know something special. I couldn’t wait!
We stepped outside of the bus and walked a couple of feet when she leaned into me and said, "Do you want to know what my favorite number is!?” I said, "it's twelve, right?" Cynthia’s answer? "It's TWENTY!" Then, in her beautiful martian like way, she smiled into her hands and said, "because it really makes me happy!” And she ran off in her Groucho Marx, Martian kind of way, repeating the number 20.
That year turned out to be a very funny year for Cynthia and myself. On one occasion I happened to leave class for a visit to the ladies room. I’m about to walk out of the bathroom when I hear the sound of water splashing and giggling coming from one of the stalls. I somehow had a feeling it was Cynthia Rose, the giggle sounded unattached to a real person. It sounded naive and desperate, almost like the sound of crying into a jacket-muffled and hysterical.
So, as I knocked on the stall door I asked if it was Cynthia. More giggles, no answer. I looked under the stall and saw Cynthia’s shoes. Right as I asked her what she doing in there, she threw the stall door open. There she was with a big red apple in between her teeth, soaking wet hair and face. She took a bite of the apple and said, "I’m was bobbing for apples in the toilet. It's so much fun!"
I was horrified by what she was doing. Cynthia looked at me in what was to be the last time we would have eye to eye contact. She became long-faced and reflective, something I’d never seen from her. Cynthia took my hand as I grabbed as many paper towels as I could gather to dry her off. Without a peep, she looked at my hands as they dried her hands.
This is the story about the exceptional Cynthia Rose, who was just one of twenty five kids- Kevin, Christopher, Wendy, Sharon and Susannah just to name a few of us- who spent everyday together for six years. For those six years we started off every day greeting Ms. Kathleen at her classroom door. We’d be in line outside the classroom. She'd open the door, and one by one we would greet her and shake her hand and walk to our seats for just another day at school. And all of us were ordinary. All of us, except for Cynthia Rose.
This is a true story I would tell Prince every so often when asked about it. We both agreed that she was worth writing about, this tender- hearted girl. We both wondered if Cynthia Rose was still living and still number drunk, and if it still made her happy.
One fall afternoon in Minnesota I was at Prince's kitchen table when he came up the stairs from his studio, sat next to me and asked if I would to tell him the whole story of Cynthia Rose again. A few hours later he asked me if I’d write it down for him.
On that afternoon when Prince asked if I’d write down this story, I had no idea what was about to transpire downstairs in his studio. Prince requested that I not go downstairs until he was finished with the track. But just before he went back downstairs, he sat down at the table and said to me “the Pee Pee's gotta go.” Then asked if coffee was doable instead. "Yes, yes, yes. Of course."
Ten hours later Susan came upstairs to get me. I walked into the studio and Prince was standing at the console with a tired, gentle smile on his face. He said, "Here it is."
The rest is history.
Susannah
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Reply #14 posted 01/23/16 2:49am

Denniscool

Sacrifice of ego so joy/love will overcome pain and leave you nameless in a symbolic way.
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Reply #15 posted 01/23/16 8:34am

SchlomoThaHomo

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Agreed that it's his autobiography about overcoming obstacles, and making personal sacrifices to achieve greatness.

Sidenote: I never noticed the "Hey, Wendy," line before. Cool find, and I wonder what the meaning is behind it.

Another sidenote: Remember when he changed his name the following year, and claimed he would soon reveal how to pronounce the symbol? And the strong rumor was that his name would actually be Victor, because if you break up the symbol it spells Victor? As a kid, I thought it was a really cool idea, considering the final line of the song. Then, I heard WLOL (MPLS radio station) introduce, "Blue Light," the new single from Victor and the New Power Generation, and it didn't seem so cool anymore. lol

"That's when stars collide. When there's space for what u want, and ur heart is open wide."
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Reply #16 posted 01/23/16 8:46am

iZsaZsa

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SchlomoThaHomo said:

Agreed that it's his autobiography about overcoming obstacles, and making personal sacrifices to achieve greatness.

Sidenote: I never noticed the "Hey, Wendy," line before. Cool find, and I wonder what the meaning is behind it.

Another sidenote: Remember when he changed his name the following year, and claimed he would soon reveal how to pronounce the symbol? And the strong rumor was that his name would actually be Victor, because if you break up the symbol it spells Victor? As a kid, I thought it was a really cool idea, considering the final line of the song. Then, I heard WLOL (MPLS radio station) introduce, "Blue Light," the new single from Victor and the New Power Generation, and it didn't seem so cool anymore. lol


That's cute. I can't find the "r".
What?
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Reply #17 posted 01/23/16 8:50am

iZsaZsa

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iZsaZsa said:

SchlomoThaHomo said:

Agreed that it's his autobiography about overcoming obstacles, and making personal sacrifices to achieve greatness.

Sidenote: I never noticed the "Hey, Wendy," line before. Cool find, and I wonder what the meaning is behind it.

Another sidenote: Remember when he changed his name the following year, and claimed he would soon reveal how to pronounce the symbol? And the strong rumor was that his name would actually be Victor, because if you break up the symbol it spells Victor? As a kid, I thought it was a really cool idea, considering the final line of the song. Then, I heard WLOL (MPLS radio station) introduce, "Blue Light," the new single from Victor and the New Power Generation, and it didn't seem so cool anymore. lol


That's cute. I can't find the "r".

Found it. smile
What?
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