The thing with Prince Bios is that the 80s really have been done to death. Until such time as Prince decides to tell his own version of events.

Many books gloss over the early 90s when infact he had an awful lot going on. I found Alex Hann's book to be the most in depth of what I've read but he talks about the "decline" when Prince was still throwing out international hit singles.

From 2000 onwards, I've not read any book that offered much insight as to what Prince was doing.

Anyone got a vault book to sell?

BartVanHemelen said:

Thizz said:

One of you said Possessed is a must read and the other said Possessed is one to avoid

That's a stark contrast . . what's your reasoning?

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One of us required fans to like AOA, and said we weren't good fans if we didn't. Hint: it wasn't me.

For someone who has made endless amounts of posts telling people to "STOP MAKING THINGS UP", you sure like to do the same.

Hint - I never said that. What I was said was that I didn't understand how fans wouldn't be excited about the first new Prince album in 4 years. Not even remotely close to the same thing.

Anyway.... that one example pales in comparison to the fact that you've spent 20 years shitting on everything Prince does, like clockwork. Even when 90% of the org loves a song, like "Free Urself", here comes Bart to piss on everybody's parade! How you imagine to still be taken seriously is beyond me.

KingSausage said:

I also found Thorne's book to be an entertaining read, despite being almost entirely information I already knew. I think it's because it wasn't so chock full of errors like many other Prince books.

This is something that appeals to me as well. I still have barely scratched the surface, but, it's obvious that Thorne knows his subject and has done the research. I get annoyed when reading a book on Prince and continually come across factually incorrect information. Not opinions, mind you, but flat out false/incorrect statements. That damn Toure book was sloppy. Some of his mistakes could be fixed by simply looking through albums to make sure songs were attributed to correct albums. I'm always thinking the authors need someone that checks the facts against The Vault or at least PrinceVault.com. If they're not going to do the research that Per & team have done they should at least utilize that research more, no?

Thizz said:

callimnate said:

HUH!!?

Why would THAT be a surprise (or a comparison) to you???

There's a lot of books about Tupac . . a lot

And just like with Prince, many aren't worth bothering with. I'd take "Resurrection", "The Rose That Grew From Concrete", for a more general Death Row book it'd be Ronin Ro's "Have Gun Will Travel". The photo book that Gobi (who's a friend of mine) and Afeni made.... "Rebel For The Hell of It" was OK too.

I dislike the books that focus on his death like the one Cathy Scott did or the "Murder Rap" book. Those are total trash IMO.

There's many Tupac books, but I don't think anyone's really nailed THE definitive one yet. There's a LOT of untold stories that still don't appear in any book. When I made by Tupac documentary for the BBC, this became obvious quite quickly when talking to people that knew him.

Militant said:

Thizz said:

There's a lot of books about Tupac . . a lot

And just like with Prince, many aren't worth bothering with. I'd take "Resurrection", "The Rose That Grew From Concrete", for a more general Death Row book it'd be Ronin Ro's "Have Gun Will Travel". The photo book that Gobi (who's a friend of mine) and Afeni made.... "Rebel For The Hell of It" was OK too.

I dislike the books that focus on his death like the one Cathy Scott did or the "Murder Rap" book. Those are total trash IMO.

There's many Tupac books, but I don't think anyone's really nailed THE definitive one yet. There's a LOT of untold stories that still don't appear in any book. When I made by Tupac documentary for the BBC, this became obvious quite quickly when talking to people that knew him.

There's that Tupac Legacy book witht he pull out stuff . . typical to those boxed books that most legendary artists have now . . Prince should probably look into putting one of those out - I think the people here would absolutely love that

Ones you missed

The book by Frank Alexander (RIP) . . that's a great book

Then there's the one his childhood friend made "Back in the Day" I believe it's called, a great read

In the Studio . . I also enjoyed that one

The one I undoubtedly will not recommend is Holler if You Hear Me by Michael Eric Dyson, in which he basically uses Tupac to as an example to talk about the moral fabric of America

Thizz said:

Militant said:

And just like with Prince, many aren't worth bothering with. I'd take "Resurrection", "The Rose That Grew From Concrete", for a more general Death Row book it'd be Ronin Ro's "Have Gun Will Travel". The photo book that Gobi (who's a friend of mine) and Afeni made.... "Rebel For The Hell of It" was OK too.

I dislike the books that focus on his death like the one Cathy Scott did or the "Murder Rap" book. Those are total trash IMO.

There's many Tupac books, but I don't think anyone's really nailed THE definitive one yet. There's a LOT of untold stories that still don't appear in any book. When I made by Tupac documentary for the BBC, this became obvious quite quickly when talking to people that knew him.

There's that Tupac Legacy book witht he pull out stuff . . typical to those boxed books that most legendary artists have now . . Prince should probably look into putting one of those out - I think the people here would absolutely love that

Ones you missed

The book by Frank Alexander (RIP) . . that's a great book

Then there's the one his childhood friend made "Back in the Day" I believe it's called, a great read

In the Studio . . I also enjoyed that one

The one I undoubtedly will not recommend is Holler if You Hear Me by Michael Eric Dyson, in which he basically uses Tupac to as an example to talk about the moral fabric of America

Yeah, I have Legacy - that one's great.

Agreed on Dyson's book - not that interesting.

I have read most of them and try to own as many as possible. Usually when this topic comes up, I give very fulsome answers. Here I will be brief.

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The ones I really love is Prince a Pop Life by Dave Hill (1989), DMSR The first decade by Per Nilsen (1998), Behind the Music and the Masks by Ronin Ro (2011) and of course Prince a Documentary by Per nilsen.

.

I like the following, Slave to the Rhythm (Liz Jones), Prince - Matt Thorne (Great but exhausting), Prince by Geoff Brown, Chaos Disorder and Revolution by Jason ? (I have it but can't be bothered getting it off the shelf!!!), Possessed by Alex Hahn (A book that grinds the axe) and Imp of the Perverse by Barney Hoskins.

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Don't like and Can't stand, The Toure book, one called Thief in the Temple, Prince by Steven Ivory, and Prince's own godawful 21nights.

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Have not read "Days of Wild" but would love to get it, same with The Vault. Have read the 1984 book Inside the Purple Reign by John Bream too.

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The books you guys have discussed are the best as well (A documentary, DMSR, Matt Thorne one and The Vault). But I must add Ronin Ro's book to that list. It's one of my favourites and I read it often.

[img:$uid]http://i1081.ph.../img:$uid]

Some of my purple rack 4 you all

[Edited 10/17/15 3:00am]

Prince: In His Own Words
21 Nights (not sure if that counts)
Purple Reign: TAFKAP
Prince: Inside the Music and the Masks
Prince: Life & Times
Possessed
I Would Die 4 U
DMSR: The First Decade
Prince: Chaos, Disorder and Revolution
Prince (Matt Thorne)

Some of my collection and my opinions

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[img:$uid]http://i1081.ph.../img:$uid]

Ancient 80s stuff, most was bought in the early mid 1990s as I got into Prince and is in POOR condition unfortunately.

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Prince - Steven Ivory 1985 very lightweight paper back that emerged from Purple Rain fame. Funny photos, but very cheap. Surprised as Ivory is a writer for Rock and Soul, true teeny bopper stuff 3/10

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Imp of the Perverse 1988 - Much better, cool book and some cool photos, true 80s zaniness, came out with the era of Black Album. 7/10

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A pop Life 1989 (1990 2nd edition) - Excellent book, my copy cost $2 in 1994 and survived a flood in 2001 so a bit wet in parts. Still a great read, a real good look at his 80s output and some glowing reviews of Lovesexy and the idea that Fargnoli would manage him forever when in reality he was to be axed.9/10.

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Next the 90s books I have.

Anyone read this? I think I'll pick it up next if it's any good.

NorthC said:

Maybe I've read a different version of Thorne's book than Bart. Because there is really only a few pages about the 21 Nights in London.

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Oh please, dude describes EVERY GODDAMN GIG.

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The great thing about Thorne's book is that he discusses Prince's music up to the 3rdEyeGirl era, making it the most up to date book about the man.

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Except that there's nothing about the last 10/15 years that's insightful.

[img:$uid]http://i1081.ph.../img:$uid]

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Prince - A Documentary 2nd edition 1993 - A classic read, great detail and chronological. Well loved as I bought it back in 1995 (These photos are old from 2011) 10/10

.

Prince by Geoff Brown 1995 - Cute little CD book that has each album reviewed song by song from For You to Come and Black Album. Great and opinionated, also great mass of Dirty Mind era photos 8/10. Bought this brand new back in 1995.

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Slave to the Rhythm 1998 Liz Jones, fairly good book that focussed on the 1995 -1997 period with his truggles with WB and the death of Baby Gregory, good reviews and interviews 8/10

TheDigitalGardener said:

databank said:

liz Jones' Slave 2 The Rythm

If my memory is correct, this book is a chronological mess, it's been a long time though. I may read it again.

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It's basically a compilation of news clippings, centered around Jones' interview with Prince from the Emancipation release promo event where Prince did 30/40 interviews, most of which are interchangable because Prince merely repeats the same promo BS over and over again. Most of the book wasn't even Jones' work, IIRC.

djThunderfunk said:

TheDigitalGardener said:

This is a useful ist of books http://www.princevault.co...bliography

Holy WOW!! I've got about 20 of these but had no idea there were so many I still don't have...

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Most of them you don't need. Plenty of thinly disguised rewrites of Per Nilsen's work with lotsa pictures, for instance.

Bambi82 said:

Anyone read this? I think I'll pick it up next if it's any good.

Me, its alright quite funny, he refers to Prince as a sex salamander humping like a dry hyena for sex by the time of Dirty mind. He divides his career into 4 play lists of 12 or 13 songs each making 50 songs, very interesting the song choices (Not just predictable hits, but a true mix).

It came out in 2005 and I bought it in 2008, 7/10.

Militant said:

BartVanHemelen said:

.

One of us required fans to like AOA, and said we weren't good fans if we didn't. Hint: it wasn't me.

For someone who has made endless amounts of posts telling people to "STOP MAKING THINGS UP", you sure like to do the same.

Hint - I never said that. What I was said was that I didn't understand how fans wouldn't be excited about the first new Prince album in 4 years. Not even remotely close to the same thing.

Anyway.... that one example pales in comparison to the fact that you've spent 20 years shitting on everything Prince does, like clockwork. Even when 90% of the org loves a song, like "Free Urself", here comes Bart to piss on everybody's parade! How you imagine to still be taken seriously is beyond me.

.

Thank you for proving my point: 90% of the Org (an increasingly smaller group of people BTW) loves a song, so I'm wrong for not caring about it. Note that when AOA was released suddenly a lot of people downgraded those "fantastic" albums they claimed Prince had released post-1995.

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Oh, and you don't prove me wrong by repharsing what you said back then. Prove me wrong by linking to that thread and quoting your exact words.

[img:$uid]http://i1081.ph.../img:$uid]

1998 - now modern books.

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DMSR 1998 Per Nilsen - one of the finest books written about Prince, goes up to 1987 only though, riveting read and a good focus on truths rather than gossip. 10/10

.

Jason Draper thing (2009), okay but nothing new, a bit play it safe and boring - 6/10

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Ronin Ro, Music and the Masks, another fine read with a couple of silly typos, but otherwise looks under the surface and a engaging read 9/10

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Matt Thorne - Prince 2012 - A very detailed Musical biography, very detailed and a bit boring in parts, but Thorne is the true fan and he even reviews outakes and boots amking it essential 9/10.

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Bart, Slave to the Rhythm is a bit patchy, but the appendix of reviews is great and he interviewed Sharon and Lorna, which is a plus.

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Also own Mathew Carcieri one, but have not shown it (Discussed above) and Princes 21 nights, I give 4/10 as a vanity photobook and a 1/10 for anything else.

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Do not own Possessed 8/10, but really want a copy, rare and out of print now?.

SoulAlive said:

.

Undoubtedly great indeed, but it's a damn shame it is so out of date. It's a damn shame Prince screwed his fans so much, because instead we could have up to date Uptown publications that are in print and easy to obtain (as ebooks). Real shame that PrinceVault doesn't allow people to easily submit improvements. Then again, considering the total bust the Org's Princepedia was and is, it is clear to me that most P fans care only about their own damn selves and don't give back to the community.

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Just compare to the NIN community where there is a fantastic wiki and numerous other sites providing fantastic information, including mirrors of long gone versions of the nin.com website. But they don't have an artist actively battling them, of course.

Adorecream said:

I have read most of them and try to own as many as possible. Usually when this topic comes up, I give very fulsome answers. Here I will be brief.

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The ones I really love is Prince a Pop Life by Dave Hill (1989), DMSR The first decade by Per Nilsen (1998), Behind the Music and the Masks by Ronin Ro (2011) and of course Prince a Documentary by Per nilsen.

.

Ro's book is horrible, filled with errors like claiming Prince was still recording TBA in December 1987.

BartVanHemelen said:

Adorecream said:

I have read most of them and try to own as many as possible. Usually when this topic comes up, I give very fulsome answers. Here I will be brief.

.

The ones I really love is Prince a Pop Life by Dave Hill (1989), DMSR The first decade by Per Nilsen (1998), Behind the Music and the Masks by Ronin Ro (2011) and of course Prince a Documentary by Per nilsen.

.

Ro's book is horrible, filled with errors like claiming Prince was still recording TBA in December 1987.

Yeah he made some daft mistakes, but I still enjoy it, I get the feeling he was studying Prince more rather than writing it like a true fan. I think the Do Me Baby error is worse though.

Just bought Matt Thorne's book , says it's a updated version.

[Edited 10/17/15 5:02am]

I've only ever read the manuscript to Prince's unreleased 1992 autobiography.

Alex Hahn's book was predicted on its cliché title (rise and fall) so it has not aged well due to the arc of its very conventional narrative.

Prince deserves a well-written book by a real writer and should be warts and all but with far more intellectual scope that has been achieved so far. The books available tend to be either well-researched but poorly written, or better written but poorly researched. Some achieved mediocrity in both terms.

My least favorite is probably the one where the author analyzes religious imagery, that was a little too specialized and I've completely forgotten the title. It was interesting, mind you, it's just that there's such a thing as too much of a good thing.

Guitarhero said:

NorthC said:

Guitarhero said:

Just bought Matt Thorne's book , says it's a updated version.

[Edited 10/17/15 5:02am]

If it mentions the release of Plec and AOA, then yes, it is. (And also the version I have.) [Edited 10/17/15 7:45am]

Yes it does, so i have the right one thanks

BartVanHemelen said:

Militant said:

For someone who has made endless amounts of posts telling people to "STOP MAKING THINGS UP", you sure like to do the same.

Hint - I never said that. What I was said was that I didn't understand how fans wouldn't be excited about the first new Prince album in 4 years. Not even remotely close to the same thing.

Anyway.... that one example pales in comparison to the fact that you've spent 20 years shitting on everything Prince does, like clockwork. Even when 90% of the org loves a song, like "Free Urself", here comes Bart to piss on everybody's parade! How you imagine to still be taken seriously is beyond me.

.

Thank you for proving my point: 90% of the Org (an increasingly smaller group of people BTW) loves a song, so I'm wrong for not caring about it. Note that when AOA was released suddenly a lot of people downgraded those "fantastic" albums they claimed Prince had released post-1995.

.

Oh, and you don't prove me wrong by repharsing what you said back then. Prove me wrong by linking to that thread and quoting your exact words.

The onus of proof isn't on me, buddy. It's on you. That's how it works. You're the one accusing me of something, so that's on you to prove it.

Why don't you do what you love to do and provide the source of me saying that? What's that other thing you say a lot - "Use the org search function?".... So go do that and find my post. You won't, because you know damn well I didn't say what you claim I said.

Try harder next time.