Is the re recorded version the one from the B-Sides album from the Purple Rain era' is it was intended to be included in that album, because it sounds less mechanical than the material in PR, it sounds like a later era song.

214 said:

Is the re recorded version the one from the B-Sides album from the Purple Rain era' is it was intended to be included in that album, because it sounds less mechanical than the material in PR, it sounds like a later era song.

It was released as the b side to Let's Pretend We're Married so no it wasn't intended for Purple Rain.

More info.

Aerogram said:

214 said:

Is the re recorded version the one from the B-Sides album from the Purple Rain era' is it was intended to be included in that album, because it sounds less mechanical than the material in PR, it sounds like a later era song.

It was released as the b side to Let's Pretend We're Married so no it wasn't intended for Purple Rain.

More info.

I know that but then it was re recorded

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Although it was released as the B-side to a '1999' album single, 'Let's Pretend We're Married', it was recorded during approximately the same set of [mid-September 1983] sessions at Sunset Sound that included mixing and overdubbing on 'Computer Blue', and the recording of 'The Beautiful Ones'.

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As to the 'less mechanical' nature of the production, I believe the song was downmixed and overdubbed in a step-by-step process, yielding what became the released studio version of it. I believe it was initially tracked as a more 'straight-forward' effort (referring to the 1983 version here, not the Controversy-1999 transitional period 1981 demo), however.

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I believe this manner of production is what got us the '1999' album version of 'Something in the Water (Does Not Compute)', and also, the final verison of 'When Doves Cry'.

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[Edited 9/23/15 18:10pm]

imprimis said:

Although it was released as the B-side to a '1999' album single, 'Let's Pretend We're Married', it was recorded during approximately the same set of [mid-September 1983] sessions at Sunset Sound that included mixing and overdubbing on 'Computer Blue', and recording 'The Beautiful Ones'.

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As to the 'less mechanical' nature of the production, I believe the song was downmixed and overdubbed in a step-by-step process, yielding what became the released studio version of it. I believe it was initially tracked as a more 'straight-forward' effort (referring to the 1983 version here, not the Controversy-1999 transitional period 1981 demo), however.

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I believe this manner of production is what got us the 1999 album version of 'Something in the Water (Does Not Compute)', and also, the final verison of 'When Doves Cry'.

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[Edited 9/23/15 18:09pm]

Interesting did not know that.

Irresistible Bitch is surely one of my all time faves.

It would also appear that additional PR album/project work was occurring during this same time, including, at a minimum, overdubs to 'Purple Rain', the orchestration to 'Purple Rain', and overdubbing to 'Electric Intercourse'.

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Studio overdub/rework dates for 'I Would Die 4 U' and 'Baby I'm a Star' are not known, but, as both appear in their familiar completed form (although slightly extended) on an early November 1983 vinyl test pressing, and were both built from some of the basic tracks of the August 3rd, 1983 First Avenue benefit performance, it seems plausible that these were also completed during approximately this same set of sessions as well.

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[Edited 9/23/15 18:27pm]

214 said:

Is the re recorded version the one from the B-Sides album from the Purple Rain era' is it was intended to be included in that album, because it sounds less mechanical than the material in PR, it sounds like a later era song.

It would still technically be the 1999 era

Listen 2 Cloreen Baconskin (Morris Day on drums) the beat is very similar

Yes Wendy Melvoin was officially in the band and vocally on Irresistable Bitch(but she was also on Free) I think it feels just as much as a 1999 piece. 1999 always had a dangerous feel to the music, darker. It sounds like night time.

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I don't think the Bside release sound mechanical at all. Just darker. The song sounds like the image of Prince on the bed with the watercolors in the 1999 album sleave. Not mechanical at all, but dangerous. The other studio cut feels playfull, and sounds like it could have been made for Morris Day(in that voice like Chocolate, Coffee & Coccain)

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Feel U Up has the same effect. The unreleased early version sound much like Irresistable Bitch unrel version. I love the dangerous darker feel of the released version of Irresistable Bitch.

OldFriends4Sale said:

214 said:

Is the re recorded version the one from the B-Sides album from the Purple Rain era' is it was intended to be included in that album, because it sounds less mechanical than the material in PR, it sounds like a later era song.

It would still technically be the 1999 era

Listen 2 Cloreen Baconskin (Morris Day on drums) the beat is very similar

Yes Wendy Melvoin was officially in the band and vocally on Irresistable Bitch(but she was also on Free) I think it feels just as much as a 1999 piece. 1999 always had a dangerous feel to the music, darker. It sounds like night time.

.
I don't think the Bside release sound mechanical at all. Just darker. The song sounds like the image of Prince on the bed with the watercolors in the 1999 album sleave. Not mechanical at all, but dangerous. The other studio cut feels playfull, and sounds like it could have been made for Morris Day(in that voice like Chocolate, Coffee & Coccain)

.

Feel U Up has the same effect. The unreleased early version sound much like Irresistable Bitch unrel version. I love the dangerous darker feel of the released version of Irresistable Bitch.

But for me it sounds more like PR than 1999 era, i mean the released version, and yes it has a darker feeling like something dangerous, especially the ending with the chorus: everybody dance, everybody dance

214 said:

OldFriends4Sale said:

It would still technically be the 1999 era

Listen 2 Cloreen Baconskin (Morris Day on drums) the beat is very similar

Yes Wendy Melvoin was officially in the band and vocally on Irresistable Bitch(but she was also on Free) I think it feels just as much as a 1999 piece. 1999 always had a dangerous feel to the music, darker. It sounds like night time.

.
I don't think the Bside release sound mechanical at all. Just darker. The song sounds like the image of Prince on the bed with the watercolors in the 1999 album sleave. Not mechanical at all, but dangerous. The other studio cut feels playfull, and sounds like it could have been made for Morris Day(in that voice like Chocolate, Coffee & Coccain)

.

Feel U Up has the same effect. The unreleased early version sound much like Irresistable Bitch unrel version. I love the dangerous darker feel of the released version of Irresistable Bitch.

But for me it sounds more like PR than 1999 era, i mean the released version, and yes it has a darker feeling like something dangerous, especially the ending with the chorus: everybody dance, everybody dance

You guys have me listening 2 a 1999 era playlist now lol
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actually If you listen to All the Critics Love U in NY, Let's Pretend We're Married, Irresistable Bitch, Nasty Girls, Automatic, Purple Music, Drive Me Wild, Lady Cab Drive, Something In the Water...
U hear how it sound just like 1999 music.
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Purple Rain actually has more instruments from finger cymbals, violins, viola, cellos, some other sound like orchestrations, I think it has a lighter feel than the 1999 music. Possible because it has more full band tracks that give it a different sound. I actually never thought Purple Rain sounded mechanical at all.

In terms of being 'mechanical', I believe the OP might have meant it that PR placed a greater emphasis on by-the-numbers cross-over pop tropes, and that there was a decided emphasis on the drum effects (although they tend to be more accomplished than on the '1999' album, especially in stacking Linn with live drumming, continuing and building on our expectations from the previous album).

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However, the released 'Irresistible Bitch' is a Purple Rain-era (although not necessarily ever flagged for that or any other given project) song appearing on a '1999' single's B-side. It was recorded on September 15th, 1983. It found a home on vinyl in that very late stage of marketing the '1999' album late 1983 into very early 1984.

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IR is much less predictible in the structure of its composition, it almost has a sensibility about it that resembles the Prince of the late mid-80s, the drum compression is different from what we've heard on other tracks of its era, but its production is otherwise couched in, and the emphasis on cold electronic funk firmly anchors it back to, 1983.

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[Edited 9/23/15 20:53pm]

Thx to Imprimis for his contributions

As for the OP's question YES as stated above IB's released version was from PR era sessions but NO it wasn't ever considered for the album.

The OP may not now it but Prince records a lot of things inb a continuous recording/overdubbing process and not every single song is originally intended to a specific project, nor even destined to ever be released.

imprimis said:

In terms of being 'mechanical', I believe the OP might have meant it that PR placed a greater emphasis on by-the-numbers cross-over pop tropes, and that there was a decided emphasis on the drum effects (although they tend to be more accomplished than on the '1999' album, especially in stacking Linn with live drumming, continuing and building on our expectations from the previous album).

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However, the released 'Irresistible Bitch' is a Purple Rain-era (although not necessarily ever flagged for that or any other given project) song appearing on a '1999' single's B-side. It was recorded on September 15th, 1983. It found a home on vinyl in that very late stage of marketing the '1999' album late 1983 into very early 1984.

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IR is much less predictible in the structure of its composition, it almost has a sensibility about it that resembles the Prince of the late mid-80s, the drum compression is different from what we've heard on other tracks of its era, but its production is otherwise couched in, and the emphasis on cold electronic funk firmly anchors it back to, 1983.

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Good information.
But I think the OP means mechanical, as in sound. 214 considers Purple Rain music to be more mechanical.

Even though Prince wanted to makes something big by this point, I strongly believe the music was specific for the Purple Rain movie, not really to stress by-the-numbers cross-over pop

I don't think 'Pop' is mechanical.
I think the only song on that album with some emphasis on reaching a broad audience was Purple Rain.

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Yes Purple Rain has more live drumming vs drum machine. More combinations of live drumming and drum machines.

1. Let's Go Crazy -Bobby Z on drums/linn

2. Take Me With U -Bobby Z on drums

3. the Beautiful Ones -Prince on linn/drums

4. Computer Blue -Bobby Z on drums/linn

5. Darling Nikkie -Prince on drums

6. When Doves Cry -Prince on linn/drums

7. I Would Die 4 U - Bobby Z on drums

8. Baby I'm a Star -Bobby Z on drums

9. Purple Rain -Bobby Z on drums

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It is hard at times to seperate whether a song is from this era or that era in that intermediate period where he is focusing more on a new album/project.

Wonderful Ass was recorded in 1983, most people for a long time assumed it was a Dream Factory outtake, but according to Susan Rogers it was made for consideration in Purple Rain. Yet it could easily mesh with 1999 music. Flows well with Do Yourself a Favour.

I think Irresistable Bitch sounds more like 1999 album music than Purple Rain. They did a good job of making it sound like 1999 music. His vocals especially have that smoldering, sometimes distant feel more familiar with 1999 music than the more clear upfront voice I hear on Purple Rain music. The drumming is a direct mirror of Morris Day's drummning on Cloreen Bacon Skin.

* your last paragraph especially is very insightful.

I actually never thought of it in the sense of being Purple Rain era influenced as 214 and U have spotlighted.

While specific recording dates for Irresistible Bitch are not known, it was initially recorded in sequence with Feel U Up in late 1981 at Prince's Kiowa Trail Home Studio, Chanhassen, MN, USA.

It was later re-recorded at Sunset Sound, Hollywood, CA, USA on 15 September, 1983 (five days before The Beautiful Ones).

-PrinceVault

I wouldn't imagine that Prince viewed his studio work as beholden to a specific image or sound, especially at this moment in his career. That evolved naturally, and the albums or related projects drew selections from the available work. I can't imagine that, when he re-recorded IR, he thought 'let's make this sound specifically like the last album'. It is just where he happened to be at that moment in 1983, which wasn't necessarily too far away from either 1999 or PR.

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The 'Dreams'/PR soundtrack in its very conception originated in selecting from backlogged work (from what is purported to have been ~300+ completed tracks recorded during the 3 or 4 years proceeding Magnoli's listening through them in mid-1983). 'Purple Rain', 'Baby I'm a Star', at a minimum, are known to precede the existence of this project. 'Computer Blue' allegedly evolved from Warehouse rehearsals/jam sessions of 'Automatic' in early/mid 1983.

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Other tracks eventually appearing on the album may not have been specifically written for the film project or its related album, but rather chosen to be developed into fully fledged songs and/or put to good use in time for later revisions of the script and filming ('G-Spot' [which appears in one draft], and perhaps 'I Would Die 4 U', or even 'Let's Go Crazy'). 'When Doves Cry', I believe, was borne of Magnioli's request to have Prince write an instrumental for the outtake montage sequence in the film (which began with the idea-sketch of 'Traffic Jam'). This was after principal photography and during editing of the film, obviously, and with respect to its original intended purpose, was not likely originally meant to appear on the album itself. The end product obviously was such a marvellous track that it had to be incorporated on the album, and Prince obviously recognized its hit potential during tracking when he developed that sketch into a full vocal effort and spent considerable time mixing to arrive at the song we all know and [presumably] cherish. I can't say whether or not 'The Beautiful Ones' was written or recorded specifically for the film; 'Electric Intercourse' is not as compelling a track, and is too similar to 'Purple Rain' (same Oberheim patches, Wendy's guitar effect racks, fade-out cooing ending, Yamaha electric piano-driven), and this new ballad that touches on similar themes may have just fit the spot. After all this, when it became clear that the album (if not also the film), was poised for high commercial success (and, for that very purpose would be limited to a single LP), and after Magnoli included 'Take Me with U' in the film (which had been recorded during post-production), the next logical decision was to shorten CB further and move TMWU over to the soundtrack.

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As for PR having a broader range of instruments, that is true in respect of the orchestral overdubs to 'Purple Rain', and 'Take Me with U' (which is obviously a late addition, recorded Winter 1984 and moved over from the Apollonia 6 album). The remaining tracks are a less callow continuation of the production standards that characterize his output beginning around mid-1982. It isn't until sometime in about mid-1984 that he appears to have begun markedly stepping away from the purple paradigm, and about late Summer 1984 before we can say that there is a shift in production worthy to be described as its own proper era.

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[Edited 9/24/15 9:22am]

Is the Unreleased version of Irresitible Bitch on the Work Bootlegs?

Are you guys saying that the 12inch version B-side is different that the one on the Bside Compilation Disc in terms of.... not only longer but a different recording???

jaimestarr79 said:

Is the Unreleased version of Irresitible Bitch on the Work Bootlegs?

Are you guys saying that the 12inch version B-side is different that the one on the Bside Compilation Disc in terms of.... not only longer but a different recording???

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No, the B-side version is the one and only released version (if you disregard the live performance on P&R Live 1985), and the only version we have of that particular recording. There is a late 1981 "suite" of an early demo of 'Irresistible Bitch' and 'Feel U Up', separately recorded from and neither of which shares are any tracks with their eventual released counterparts.

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I do believe, however, that the released version of 'Irresistible Bitch' was reached in mixing, in large part, and that the song may have been laid down in the studio more conventionally.

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[Edited 9/24/15 9:29am]

cool thanks for clearing that up. I love the song!!!

Are there many alternate versions of songs from the era of including and between.... 1999 and purple rain???

This is my favorite Era.

jaimestarr79 said:

Are there many alternate versions of songs from the era of including and between.... 1999 and purple rain???

This is my favorite Era.

.

We have, at a minimum, the following circulating among average collectors:

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* An alternate 1982 demo/version of 'Something in the Water (Does Not Compute)' (alleged to have been recorded after the album version, but I find that claim spurious)

* An alternate mix of 'DMSR'

* An alternate, extended edit/mix of 'Delirious'

* More the one edit of Jill Jones' 'Mia Bocca' (official, based largely in P's late Summer 1982 recording, Clare Fischer overdubs circa late 1985/1986)

* 'Baby You're a Trip' (1982 original, and a 1984/1985 overdubbed version with W&L backing vocals)

* Boom, Boom (Can't U Feel The Beat Of My Heart) (Originating in a late 1982 demo likely for V6's unrealized second album; Jill Jones versions, of course, overdubbed in 1985 and heavily reworked in 1989)

* My Baby Knows (Originating in a late 1982 demo likely for V6's unrealized second album; Jill Jones versions, of course, overdubbed in 1985 and heavily reworked in 1989)

* Extraloveable

* An early 1983 demo of 'Wonderful Ass'

* 'Wet Dream Cousin'

* One or more mixes of 'We Can Fu*k'

* A early/mid 1983 studio version of 'Possessed'

* 'Cloreen Baconskin' (official)

* A full-length 'Modernaire' (official)

* 'Vibrator' and isolated dialogue vocal tracks

* A rough mix with Vanity vocals of 'Sex Shooter'

* An alleged snippet of P's early demo for the Time's 'Velvet Kitty Kat'

* P's version of Chocolate

* One or more mixes of 'My Summertime Thang' (although modified in 1989/1990)

* An all-studio version of 'The Bird'

* Promise to Be True (Originating in a Spring/Summer 1983 recording, likely intended for a second V6 album; Bonnie Raitt's heavily reworked/overdubbed 1987 verison being the circulating one at present time)

* P's own version of 'G-Spot'

* A brief interpretation/section of what is alleged to be 'Wednesday' during a 1983 piano rehearsal recording

* At least two live rehearsal recordings, and one live performance recording of 'Electric Intercourse'

* 'Climax'

* A late 1983 live instrumental rehearsal/jam of 'Can't Stop This Feeling I Got'

* A slightly extended 'I Would Die 4 U'

* A slightly extended 'Baby I'm a Star'

* A slightly extended 'The Beautiful Ones'

* A late 1983 11+ minute studio rough-mix of 'Purple Rain'

* 'Dance' and 'Red' mixes (official) of 'Sugar Walls'

* Multiple edits/mixes/takes of 'Computer Blue'

* Two or three alternate edits/mixes of 'Erotic City'

* An extended version of 'Take Me with U'

* An instrumental of a 1984 studio version of 'Possessed'

* 'Traffic Jam'

* A6's 'Manic Monday'

* An instrumental of a 1984 version of 'Lust U Always' (which the version submitted to Robert Palmer and recorded by him in late 1987 was based on) (More than likely post-PR film release/pre-PR tour, late Summer/early Fall 1984, however, but exact recording dates unknown)

.

As for alternate versions of songs from this period, beyond what is currently known or circulating, I would speculate that there are many. There are likely other outtakes yet to be uncovered, although limited in number (especially after mid-1983), and alternate versions and outtakes known to exist but not [widely] circulating.

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[Edited 9/24/15 11:47am]

imprimis said:

jaimestarr79 said:

Are there many alternate versions of songs from the era of including and between.... 1999 and purple rain???

This is my favorite Era.

.

We have, at a minimum, the following circulating among average collectors:

.

* An alternate 1982 demo/version of 'Something in the Water (Does Not Compute)' (alleged to have been recorded after the album version, but I find that claim spurious)

* An alternate mix of 'DMSR'

* An alternate, extended edit/mix of 'Delirious'

* More the one edit of Jill Jones' 'Mia Bocca' (official, based largely in P's late Summer 1982 recording, Clare Fischer overdubs circa late 1985/1986)

* 'Baby You're a Trip' (1982 original, and a 1984/1985 overdubbed version with W&L backing vocals)

* Boom, Boom (Can't U Feel The Beat Of My Heart) (Originating in a late 1982 demo likely for V6's unrealized second album; Jill Jones versions, of course, overdubbed in 1985 and heavily reworked in 1989)

* My Baby Knows (Originating in a late 1982 demo likely for V6's unrealized second album; Jill Jones versions, of course, overdubbed in 1985 and heavily reworked in 1989)

* Extraloveable

* An early 1983 demo of 'Wonderful Ass'

* 'Wet Dream Cousin'

* One or more mixes of 'We Can Fu*k'

* A early/mid 1983 studio version of 'Possessed'

* 'Cloreen Baconskin' (official)

* A full-length 'Modernaire' (official)

* 'Vibrator' and isolated dialogue vocal tracks

* A rough mix with Vanity vocals of 'Sex Shooter'

* An alleged snippet of P's early demo for the Time's 'Velvet Kitty Kat'

* P's version of Chocolate

* One or more mixes of 'My Summertime Thang' (although modified in 1989/1990)

* An all-studio version of 'The Bird'

* Promise to Be True (Originating in a Spring/Summer 1983 recording, likely intended for a second V6 album; Bonnie Raitt's heavily reworked/overdubbed 1987 verison being the circulating one at present time)

* P's own version of 'G-Spot'

* A brief interpretation/section of what is alleged to be 'Wednesday' during a 1983 piano rehearsal recording

* At least two live rehearsal recordings, and one live performance recording of 'Electric Intercourse'

* 'Climax'

* A late 1983 live instrumental rehearsal/jam of 'Can't Stop This Feeling I Got'

* A slightly extended 'I Would Die 4 U'

* A slightly extended 'Baby I'm a Star'

* A slightly extended 'The Beautiful Ones'

* A late 1983 11+ minute studio rough-mix of 'Purple Rain'

* 'Dance' and 'Red' mixes (official) of 'Sugar Walls'

* Multiple edits/mixes/takes of 'Computer Blue'

* Two or three alternate edits/mixes of 'Erotic City'

* An extended version of 'Take Me with U'

* An instrumental of a 1984 studio version of 'Possessed'

* 'Traffic Jam'

* A6's 'Manic Monday'

* An instrumental of a 1984 version of 'Lust U Always' (which the version submitted to Robert Palmer and recorded by him in late 1987 was based on) (More than likely post-PR film release/pre-PR tour, late Summer/early Fall 1984, however, but exact recording dates unknown)

.

As for alternate versions of songs from this period, beyond what is currently known or circulating, I would speculate that there are many. There are likely other outtakes yet to be uncovered, although limited in number (especially after mid-1983), and alternate versions and outtakes known to exist but not [widely] circulating.

.

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[Edited 9/24/15 11:47am]

Thanks Imprimis!!! You really know your stuff. I need to find some of these out takes. I have a couple of these already. I need to get busy on this.

I would love to have a CD of all alternate versions of the Purple Rain and 1999 albums.

Are there any boots that are packaged also alternate albums out there that focus on these 2 albums?

Like the Dream Factory is an excellent alternate version of Sign o' the Times Cd.

(i'm not asking for them....just want to know if they exist)

Don't forget that the released version of IB starts with Prince on drums and ends with Morris on drums. I would have never thought of that until it was discussed online, but you can hear it if you listen, especially in the fills near the end.