babynoz said:

Paraphrasing a number of posts: "Why does it bother people so much that Prince did this song, if it is not your cup of tea, just hit skip..."

The reason I am bothered by Prince choosing to do this song in particular is that it shows a total lack of intellectual curiosity on his part. As an artist spirituality has been a part of his music from the start. It was his challenging of what it meant to be a spiritual being, (one could believe in god and yet have fun every mother fucking night) the spiritual tension he brought to his music, that is what in part made him so compelling.

This song is the antithesis of Sexuality and Lady Cab Driver. It lacks tension, it lacks insight, it is simple proselytizing.

Sure I can and will skip this song, but that is not the point. The point to me is that Prince has sunk to a new low. Covering a song by a third rate christian musician that's theme revolves around an intellectually bankrupt question, is far below what he was once capable of. I expect more of him because he has led me to think as such.

This song is lazy and simplistic. And seems to me to indicate a mind that is in a continuous state of closing it's self off from the world of ideas and thinking. Which is certainly the death of an artist. It is as if one were to find Picasso painting over Guernica, replacing it with a big basket spilling over with kittens and balls of yarn.

babynoz said:

lust said:

I agree. Folks are free to beleive whatever they want and sing about it BUT if that includes calling people who don't share those beliefs "simple minded" then expect blow back. It cuts both ways.

He called people a lot worse than that in the song F.U.N.K. and y'all loved it.

Double standards.

I haven't read through every post yet, and only spot checked this one, so I'm not sure what the context is of this exchange.

However, that being said, I didn't like FUNK at all. I mean, it's better than this mess, but I found FUNK to be b-side fodder at best.

babynoz said:

I really want Prince to just drop acid, convert to anti-theism and curse his ass off on record.

This religious bullshit isn't working out for him very well these days.

SchlomoThaHomo said:

lezama said:

What if the "simple minded" comment wasn't in reference to people who didnt share a persons faith, but to people who didnt ask questions.. those who just think that life is about working, shopping, growing old and dying? Thats how I listen to it, at least.. What if its about the search, not the destination? P & H are not from the same strand of christianity, and he's also said things in praise of Islam before if I recall correctly. What if he cares less what your particular answer is and more about you seeking to question the greater significance of life? What if thats why he changed cross to truth? To be religiously pluralistic?

Well Prince thinks, "it's better to be a follower than a leader," and that one should "surrender" to "The Truth," which is the New World Translation of the Holy Bible, according to him. I think that's a pretty narrow view. I do like your interpretation, though.

Its kind of hard to keep up, because there's also the new agey vibe of the message in AOA which lead to several threads questioning his JW status. I think that even if he tried to be a strict literalist of any religion, his mind wouldn't let him. He's always been naturally just all over the place with everything. He's musically, religiously, and aesthetically ADHD. Which is partly why Ive always liked him as an artist.

Blixical said:

I really want Prince to just drop acid, convert to anti-theism and curse his ass off on record.

This religious bullshit isn't working out for him very well these days.

What if he dropped acid and became a pantheist instead?

purplethunder3121 said:

SuperSoulFighter said:

SchlomoThaHomo said:

Yes. And I think it's incredibly simple-minded (and ironic) for the writer to presume that someone who doesn't share her faith isn't deep.

I agree, but the atheists make the same mistake: using words like "irrational" "no evidence" or "non-existant" is also a way of calling everybody who does believe in God stupid. As somebody said in P&R somewhere: absence of evidence is not evidence of absence. Plus everbody who thinks humans are rational beings is fooling themselves. We're ruled by impulses, emotions, gut feelings... Rationality is only a small part of our thinking.

Rationality is the mother of all invention. It invented the wheel, the printing press, the combustion engine, the TV, Light bulb, telephone, computer, smartphone, tablet, medication, surgery etc etc.... Rationality took us out of the trees. Rationality modernised our world. Hardly a small part of our thinking.

if he's going this direction i wish he'd do his OWN music. ie rainbow children was great.

this is so very very bad. the writing/lyrics are 4th grade little girl journal lyrics. cingey-cringey cringey.

whats next? i hear creed needs a lead singer. (gahhhhh, i know i know i'll show myself out, thanks)

Prince is trolling us. There is no way he can be serious. He's fukkin' with us for criticizing AOA and Josh and not making Plectrum Electurm a hit. Prince is sooo very thin-skinned and the evidence of this goes back to the early 80's music. He overreacts when people don't like his moves. That's all this is. Componding his mistakes, by doubling down on them, in response to fan backlash to his substandard material. Typical Prince. Next up: the return of Tony M.

jwar said:

Why all the hate and bitterness? Why is there no appreciation?

If you don't like it, OK. As a Christian, I'm not crazy about the song, but I like the questions that it raises. Does the world really need another variation of DMSR? Do we really need more crude / dirty lyrics?

Let's just please stop trying to put people (Prince included) into a box.

As a side note: I'm more concerned with the lyric that was changed and the reasons for it. Changing "cross", the central message of Christianity, to generic "truth" is a bad decision. BAD decision.

But it's not generic--it just allows someone who rejects the "cross" as the means of Jesus' execution (but still accepts some form of his messianic, salvific role) to sing the line. It doesn't make the song generic, just lets Prince (and others who accept Witness arguments about the word "stauros") sing the line.

purplethunder3121 said:

babynoz said:

LOL...not me, I'm here for the show.


[img:$uid]http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y240/delivertheword/gifs/5nucdk_zpsz8gyhpkm.gif[/img:$uid]

funksterr said:

Prince is trolling us. There is no way he can be serious. He's fukkin' with us for criticizing AOA and Josh and not making Plectrum Electurm a hit. Prince is sooo very thin-skinned and the evidence of this goes back to the early 80's music. He overreacts when people don't like his moves. That's all this is. Componding his mistakes, by doubling down on them, in response to fan backlash to his substandard material. Typical Prince. Next up: the return of Tony M.

[img:$uid]http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y240/delivertheword/gifs/flaminghead-runner.gif[/img:$uid]

Blixical said:

I really want Prince to just drop acid, convert to anti-theism and curse his ass off on record.

This religious bullshit isn't working out for him very well these days.

If only...

Prince esta muerto (Prince is dead) and the well is dry. Even the re-treads are subpar.

[Edited 3/13/15 17:02pm]

lust said:

datdude said:

the point i am making is about CONTENT and partiality. though most God haters here are too unaware and proud in their unbelief to admi it, a HUGE part of why they hate this song is because of its content. its been countless threads about him ditching his faith and how "we" want/need nasty Prince back. I don't need a post of the other song i referenced lyrics to make a point i WASN'T making.

a childish cliche that fits nicely with the sentiment in the song. You're clearly the target audience for such drivel. People who don't beleive in God, don't hate God. You understand that if I said I don't believe in Ganesh, Vishnu, Zeus and Thor that if I then said I hate them, that would be an absurd concept. Come on. It's pretty simple stuff.

Okay, I assume there are people on the board that do believe in all of those--they all do have living believers who aren't flat out crazy. I get your point (and agree with it), but I doubt you're going to get anywhere with it--and there's an obvious difference in most Christians' minds: those other deities "obviously don't exist" (I'm as uncertain about their existence as I am about capital G Oh Dee's--not in the mood for a name argument), while the one they're talking about DOES (and if you're an atheist, that really just means you don't believe in that God, because OBVIOUSLY no one's talking about those other ones).

.

As to having a problem with religious content--I spend a remarkable amount of my reading time in religious matters considering that I am pretty much agnostic. I'm very interested in where the human mind has gone once it starts thinking along the lines of the divine; being about God isn't the problem with this song's lyrics for me. It's that it's extremely empty, and impressed with its own concept of its cleverness. Do they expect anyone to respond "By golly, I'd never thought of that? What if I'm wrong? Huh. Wow. That changes everything"? Tell me your story, explore what faith means for you, fine--great. But don't act like people must be incredibly stupid (oh, sorry, "simpleminded) because they disagree with you about something that ultimately you believe in for subjective reasons.

.

I hate neither the song or God. I just don't particularly care for the song, nor its arguments for conversion.

Strong minds ask What If and make up their own mind. You know the mind 'God' gave them to use. (Supposedly)


What if you just said, I DONT KNOW. Because you know THAT is the truth really. No one knows. Thats the only truth..... is that no one knows.

Im comfortable in the TRUTH of I DONT KNOW.

I can't form a belief - I dont know if theres a God.

I can believe that the sun is coming up tomorrow.

I can believe that darkness will fall tonight.

I can believe I will die and pass from this earth.

I can believe in honoring my experience in this human form.

I can believe something somehow created all this, and at least science gives me reasons to take on belief.

So my truth is I DONT KNOW if there's a God. I'm okay with not knowing.

Its like if I ask you.... Do you believe in Flerp?

What's Flerp?

EXACTLY. NO ONE KNOWS.

In fact I might say this is the only one singular universal truth.

No one knows if there's a God.

NO ONE.

Believe in whatever you like. But no one knows.

[Edited 3/13/15 21:26pm]

lust said:

^How dare you blaspheme the mighty Flerp (may her name be praised) Flerp hater.

Peace & be Flerp.

I think people are misinterpretting the 'simple minded friends' line. I really don't think it's a dig at atheists.

.

I think the verses are supposed to be spoken from the point of view of the non-believer, and the chorus is the rebuttal from the believer.

.

Here's the verse in question, for reference:

.
What if you dig
Way down deeper than your simple-minded friends
What if you dig?
What if you find
A thousand more unanswered questions down inside
That's all you find?

.

It's a non-believer asking a believer what would happen if the believer were more critical of their faith than the usual "simple-minded" christian. Wouldn't the believer discover that their religion didn't really answer anything? What if all the believer found was "a thousand more unanswered questions"?

.

It's supposed to be read as the atheists being condescending to the christians, not the other way around.

.

...yeah, these lyrics aren't good.

[Edited 3/13/15 22:28pm]

in my experience, it's typically some atheists who would view blind faith believers as being simple minded. A typical atheist argument against religion goes something like, "if you thought critically about your religion even a little bit you'd find that it doesn't make sense." The song is addressing this kind of argument against christianity.

.

The next bit of lyrics is more clear:

.

What if you pick apart the logic
And begin to poke the holes

.

It's the nonbeliever asking the believer what would happen if the believer realizes that christianity is inconsistent.

.

The believer's rebuttal is of course, "yeah well, if I'm right then that's awesome, isn't it?"

Different opinions....!?


I am really surprised about all the negativity here....

To me, "What If", the song is in same category as another religious cover: "One Of Us" (1996).

I love "What If" as much as I love "AnotherLove" on Plectrum.

And to say the truth..... imo: this song "What If" is a lot better than most of Plectrum,



Thanks to Prince & 3EG.... "What If" is another classic, "imho".... I don't care that most of you Orgers are trashing it... I am loving it...

Ps. I am not a religious person myself, I just find the song: beautiful.

[Edited 3/14/15 3:25am]

^3 awful tracks!

I love it!

funkomatic said:

^3 awful tracks!

It's cool to be negative, gives u a feeling of power to trash something... right?

I wonder what u do like then..

Sure different opinions.

thedance said: