As a person, she's a total sweetheart, but if her influence was what drove the sounds of those albums, then I'd have to hold that against her

TRC is one of my least favorite Prince albums, and as soon as Prince and Manuela broke up, we got the best album he's made this century to me, the utterly brilliant 3121.

I think her influence was more in the realm of how he dealt with his fans. For some reason, his relationship seemed to allow him to connect. The Celebrations -- especially the one in 2002 -- and the online pesence were a real step forward. And the minute they started moving apart, all of that ended and he was back to suing people.

She's certainly slept her way to a semi-notable life.

Blixical said:

JoeyCococo said:

She now seems like a spec on Prince's path and I really doubt she defines herself by her time with Prince but, I will say that her influence was subtle but very deep. For longtime time fans, I would also say it was very GOOD!! I briefly knew her as she got into the Prince world. I lost touch with her by the time NPs was rolling out but I feel certain she made the very organic Rainbow Children happen. I know this meant a lot to Prince b/c of all the religious messaging but the music being so raw after years of him supplementing his live shows with taped vocals and other bad stuff- we get an accoustic album in 1997, Rainbow in 2000 and a piano album in2001!! All of this on manuela's time. This is why I say - all the unhappy we lost track- I know she had a HUGE hand in all of this that I mentioned. I ah e no proof but am sure. Remember the proposed rumoured album Echos and Whispers? This is for long time followers:). It was rumoured and supposed to be an acoustic offering. There was also an album. Allen 'heart' but none ever came out. After his Lovesexy piano solos there was always talk and hope of a piano album- this is back in the late 80s and early 90s whe ne head also set to do MTV Unplugged. It did not happen- it did however, when Mani took over:) Thanks to the girl from Don Mills:)

That certainly would explain my stedfast aversion and repulsion of TRC.

There were always rumours that she was behind the Grammy performance in 2004 and the full-scale media blitz for Musicology and its tour. Prince doesn't have to pander to the mainstream, but an artist of hist talent and stature shouldn't be relegated to culty has-been status (which is where he was heading from 2000-2004). If she got him back on the pedestal he deserves to be on, then I'm glad she was around.

JoeyCococo said:

Blixical said:

She's certainly slept her way to a semi-notable life.

Silly comment- We are Canadian- much more subtle. I don't pretend to know her anymore but it has been way over 10 years and we have never heard her say anything sensational. In fact, she's been as private as Prince has been. Do you really think she has nothing of interest to say after being married to the man?? Anyway- someone else reminded me, she is also responsible for the ONA fan meets. Her influence was definite.

I didn't say anything about that.
I said she slept her way to a semi-notable life.

Mostly because, she slept her way to a semi-notable life.

HatrinaHaterwitz said:

JoeyCococo said:

She now seems like a spec on Prince's path and I really doubt she defines herself by her time with Prince but, I will say that her influence was subtle but very deep. For longtime time fans, I would also say it was very GOOD!! I briefly knew her as she got into the Prince world. I lost touch with her by the time NPs was rolling out but I feel certain she made the very organic Rainbow Children happen. I know this meant a lot to Prince b/c of all the religious messaging but the music being so raw after years of him supplementing his live shows with taped vocals and other bad stuff- we get an accoustic album in 1997, Rainbow in 2000 and a piano album in2001!! All of this on manuela's time. This is why I say - all the unhappy we lost track- I know she had a HUGE hand in all of this that I mentioned. I ah e no proof but am sure. Remember the proposed rumoured album Echos and Whispers? This is for long time followers:). It was rumoured and supposed to be an acoustic offering. There was also an album. Allen 'heart' but none ever came out. After his Lovesexy piano solos there was always talk and hope of a piano album- this is back in the late 80s and early 90s whe ne head also set to do MTV Unplugged. It did not happen- it did however, when Mani took over:) Thanks to the girl from Don Mills:)

That certainly would explain my stedfast aversion and repulsion of TRC.

I don't care for the album too. Too long and boring.
But, I don't get why some folks absolutely hate it.

Then again, I don't understand why some folks hate Planet Earth.

I briefly spoke with her when she was still just in charge of little things, ca.1998, and I agree that she made Prince a bit more fan-friendly (the 2002 celebration at Paisley Park, the online presence in those days , the ONA tour and soundchecks, the songs performed during that tour etc.etc.).

In hindsight, the Rainbow Children album is not that bad at all, I´ve always liked the music and still dislike some of the lyrics but then again the album´s lyrics are not ALL that controversial except for two or three songs. I mean, Last December, She Loves Me 4 Me, Mellow, Everywhere, Sensual Everafter could be on any other album without raising eyebrows, and I never had a big problem with political songs like Family Name or Avalanche, though I disagree with the Jewish names part in the lyrics because the Jews did not choose those names mentioned in the song, but I digress.

-.

It´s strange that Prince, despite being with Manuela for such a long time only wrote a few songs dedicated to her considering that they were even married.

And I don´t regard The Truth as a Manuela-inspired album. I´d still consider it part of the Mayte era.

Militant said:

As a person, she's a total sweetheart, but if her influence was what drove the sounds of those albums, then I'd have to hold that against her

TRC is one of my least favorite Prince albums, and as soon as Prince and Manuela broke up, we got the best album he's made this century to me, the utterly brilliant 3121.

Well, theoretically, that is STILL her influence then, isn´t it? Maybe he wanted to prove a point to her or send a message or whatever, or it was his way of coping with the breakup.

Why do you dislike TRC that much? The sound of the album is still unmatched, the production is superb and the controversial lyrics don´t even make up 50% of the album. What´s bad is VERY bad but not everything on it is that bad...or is it?

(I prefer 3121 over TRC but still.....TRC has some great music and great songs on it.)

Blixical said:

Then again, I don't understand why some folks hate Planet Earth.

That's like saying you don't understand why some folks hate Arms of Orion.

Blixical said:

steakfinger said:

Blixical said:

HatrinaHaterwitz said:

That certainly would explain my stedfast aversion and repulsion of TRC.

I don't care for the album too. Too long and boring.
But, I don't get why some folks absolutely hate it.

Then again, I don't understand why some folks hate Planet Earth.

Boring is a good description. I also found it to be quite sanctimoniously pretentious. I'm certain it wasn't like that only because of her influence, but if she was indeed a contributing factor also - then that certainly explains a lot.

KoolEaze said:

Militant said:

As a person, she's a total sweetheart, but if her influence was what drove the sounds of those albums, then I'd have to hold that against her

TRC is one of my least favorite Prince albums, and as soon as Prince and Manuela broke up, we got the best album he's made this century to me, the utterly brilliant 3121.

Well, theoretically, that is STILL her influence then, isn´t it? Maybe he wanted to prove a point to her or send a message or whatever, or it was his way of coping with the breakup.

Why do you dislike TRC that much? The sound of the album is still unmatched, the production is superb and the controversial lyrics don´t even make up 50% of the album. What´s bad is VERY bad but not everything on it is that bad...or is it?

(I prefer 3121 over TRC but still.....TRC has some great music and great songs on it.)

Oh, it absolutely was. Back making pop music, songs like "Lolita", and "Fury" is a very obviously about her... and the presence of Tamar all over the album, who was certainly more than just a protege, didn't she kiss him at the Brit Awards performance with Wendy and Lisa, or maybe I'm remembering wrong, but I'm convinced they were together.

I dislike TRC for much the same reasons as a few other members such as Hatrina have posted. I find it boring, a little too preachy, a little too pretentious. Plus the Darth Vader voice, and Wedding Feast, lol.

I don't really like the organic production sound. It's not that interesting to me. I much prefer when Prince uses drum machines and synthesizers compared to live drums and horns. I prefer him singing about sex than singing about scripture. I prefer his electro funk pop to his jazz. And when he's done jazz before, I like it when he includes his signature sounds. Madhouse is the kind of jazz I dig from Prince. TRC (and NEWS) are not.

With a couple of exceptions, for me the album doesn't pulse. It doesn't groove. It doesn't feel contemporary, it feels like muzak at times, just background stuff. There's no urgency. The lyrics don't connect with me, primarily I think because they just feel like he took a few JW bible concept and ran with them.

I've tried to give the record a fair shake and it just doesn't do much for me. There are several albums that get a bad rep around this place that I FAR prefer to TRC.

I prefer The Chocolate Invasion, The Slaughterhouse, New Power Soul, Rave Un2, 20TEN...... These are all albums that I still listen to a lot. But I never find myself wanting to listen to TRC.

Manuela was very significant.. just look at all she did for Eric Benet's career..

GoldenParachute said:

Blixical said:

I didn't say anything about that.
I said she slept her way to a semi-notable life.

Mostly because, she slept her way to a semi-notable life.

I wonder if she were a man, if you would define her by her abilities in bed. Manuela is educated and achieved on her own accord. Equating her success to her value in the sack is really unfair and seems like typical chauvinism. And Im a guy

She's basically to Prince what Stedman is to Oprah, if that makes y'all feel better.

GoldenParachute said:

We really don't know much about their relationship because it wasn't as public as Mayte's and his. He obviously really loved her. He married her! And when the divorce came, I read that it wasn't what Prince wanted. If Manuela would have never filed for divorce, it's possible that they'd still be married. I think her influence was not as noticeable outright but it was probably more profound than even Mayte's influence on Prince. We just didn't see it.

No he didn't want the divorce and he didn't want something else: Children. No they would not have been married by now. That's why she is with Eric Benet and now has two daughters. She just recently had her second child. I think that was main reason for her filing her divorce.

[Edited 10/26/14 11:03am]

steakfinger said:

Blixical said:

Then again, I don't understand why some folks hate Planet Earth.

That's like saying you don't understand why some folks hate Arms of Orion.

oh no

Manuela's irrelevant as far as I'm concerned. It appears as though she contributed absolutely nothing other than a great break-up song ('Fury').

She didn't even pretend to be a protege. I doubt she had any influence on TRC at all.

All I know is that Mani is a beautiful woman and I commend her for keeping their relationship private. I think she was more beautiful than Mayte but that is just my opinion. Sad that P didn't want the divorce. I always wanted them to stay together.

I don't know much about Manuela, but The Rainbow Children is one of my top ten favorite Prince albums.

Militant said:

Militant said:

didn't she kiss him at the Brit Awards performance with Wendy and Lisa, or maybe I'm remembering wrong, but I'm convinced they were together.

He kissed her on the cheek during Purple Rain (a la the movie when he kisses the weeping Wendy).

Always struck me as odd when Wendy was right there on stage with a guitar, but then nobody apart from us die-hards even noticed W&L were up there. My personal take is that it was pre-meditated/planned/rehearsed and he did it as an homage to that movie moment or to make his usual point about not repeating what's already been done.

But yes, possibly Tamar was more than just a protege, word on the street though was that Prince was still Manuela's man

Praxis said: