novabrkr said:

dodger said:

Neversin said:

The record was done as a true live band effort with minimal overdubs...
Then it got pressed, "quality control" rejected it and then it got shuffled/re-recorded/overdubbed/polished way too much and released...

Neversin.

[Edited 9/30/14 3:25am]

What about the track list, was that changed?

"Screw Driver" and "Live Out Loud" were dropped for whatever reason, it's not like there isn't enough space on the disc (save for the LP of course...)

Neversin.

TheEnglishGent said:

novabrkr said:

"Way Back Home" suite then that's fine too, but too much of the material on the records just doesn't sound like Prince or why someone that listens to Prince would actually spend money on music).

The problem for Prince is that the people who spend money on stuff because they listen to Prince are a dying breed, so he needs to branch out if he wants the sales.

So you honestly think a song like "Aintturninround" is what sells more copies of PE?

Might be a bit different thing for AOA, of course, but there are quite a few production choices on that record I could see getting changed to something that's truer to his own style without it making the record appear any less commercial (for example, is that "air horn" sound at the start of AOC really going to sell more copies of the album?).

robertgeorgeakabob said:

novabrkr said:

Not really.

I have no doubts the records would have been better with Hannah as just a background singer and Joshua not doing much else than maybe an occasional Roland drum machine beat. What's bad about the records are exactly the parts where he is allowing them to "shine".

(edit - ok, Hannah on "Whitecaps" isn't bad and if Josh has indeed done large chunks of the "Way Back Home" suite then that's fine too, but too much of the material on the records just doesn't sound like Prince or why someone that listens to Prince would actually spend money on music).

[Edited 9/30/14 4:40am]

I disagree. AOA is classic Prince. He's being playful at last, and revealing a vulnerable honesty in tracks like Way Back Home. It makes a refreshing change from the stoic, nothing bothers me persona he's adopted over the years. I think it's safe to say that Prince's flirtation with JW dogma is done with, which bodes well for the future.

There's no proof whatsoever that the change in lyrical themes has something to do with the Weltons. Based on the more recent interviews they seem to share Prince's interest in religion and that's quite likely one of the reasons why he's become personal friends with both.

Nothing wrong with Prince being more like his old self on records, of course.

novabrkr said:

TheEnglishGent said:

The problem for Prince is that the people who spend money on stuff because they listen to Prince are a dying breed, so he needs to branch out if he wants the sales.

So you honestly think a song like "Aintturninround" is what sells more copies of PE?

Might be a bit different thing for AOA, of course, but there are quite a few production choices on that record I could see getting changed to something that's truer to his own style without it making the record appear any less commercial (for example, is that "air horn" sound at the start of AOC really going to sell more copies of the album?).

I thought we were talking baout AOA. You are right about Plectrum. If ain'tturninround was the worst one on there it wouldn't be so bad thoug. I'm looking at you Boytrouble and Whitecaps.

cbarnes3121 said:

ludwig said:

I don't have a problem with the girls, but the Josh Welton production ist horrible. I hate it with a passion. AOC and Funknroll remix are unlistenable.

i agree with u 100% josh production is amatuer u can find the sounds he use on presets on most keyboards he didnt really put my thought or creativity in2 what he was doing and why do prince trust these people so much but when he had talented people in the past like wendy,lisa.andre cymone jimmy jam and terry lewis he didnt wanna share production credits? this is the first cd prince has ever put out that i have no intion on purchasing

I hate to break it to you, but Prince uses presets. All the time. The damned sword shoowsh sound on '7' is straight off the Korg M-1. As someone who has used keyboards and kept up with them since the late 80s, I hear nothing but presets in Prince's music.

I don't care. It still sounds good to me. Who gives a shit?

That's like complaining about a classical album because they just keep using those same old strings sounds.

Neversin said:

dodger said:

What about the track list, was that changed?

"Screw Driver" and "Live Out Loud" were dropped for whatever reason, it's not like there isn't enough space on the disc (save for the LP of course...)

Neversin.

Screwdriver would have been good but dropping Live Out Loud was a good call.

robertgeorgeakabob said:

Prince is always best when he opens himself up to mere mortals' input. Half Prince's problems stem from not listening to enough music that isn't mainstream.

My comment follows on from this pretty much.

I think the problem Prince has had in recent years is that by doing everything himself, he essentially lives in his own little cocoon doing his own thing, when the rest of the world is listening to something else.

By allowing others to provide input to his work, it is more likely to allow for something to be created which sounds fresher and more in tune with what the world is listening to.

There is no doubt Prince is a damn fine producer. But I think perhaps, his desire to have total control over his output, how it is recorded, how it is released and how it is marketed, has in actual fact suffocated the Prince brand rather than allow it to prosper. As talented as Prince is, having a good team around him will always enhance the results achieved with his music output.

Neversin said:

TheEnglishGent said:

What happened to plectrum?

The record was done as a true live band effort with minimal overdubs...
Then it got pressed, "quality control" rejected it and then it got shuffled/re-recorded/overdubbed/polished way too much and released...

Neversin.

[Edited 9/30/14 3:25am]

Hahahahaha!

And that's a fact, I presume.

Militant said:

Josh's production is awesome. He's done a great job.

Agreed.

Some people just seem to be recycling their criticisms of Kirk Johnson's productions, but these objections don't apply to Josh.

There is no way 'AOA' sounds 'plastic'. Then again, there are some here who say that every time Prince makes an electronic r&b song.

Ok, let's take a few steps back here.

How exactly do you know what parts on the record Josh produced? Why are people attributing what they think is good about the record to him? The record is still mainly produced by Prince himself, as far as I can tell from the instrumentation and arrangements on the record. The "Funknroll" remix is quite different sounding from most of the other tracks and that's the only thing we know for certain was done by Josh. Many of the tracks on the record were apparently recorded ages ago, so he most likely had no input on them.

steakfinger said:

cbarnes3121 said:

i agree with u 100% josh production is amatuer u can find the sounds he use on presets on most keyboards he didnt really put my thought or creativity in2 what he was doing and why do prince trust these people so much but when he had talented people in the past like wendy,lisa.andre cymone jimmy jam and terry lewis he didnt wanna share production credits? this is the first cd prince has ever put out that i have no intion on purchasing

I hate to break it to you, but Prince uses presets. All the time. The damned sword shoowsh sound on '7' is straight off the Korg M-1. As someone who has used keyboards and kept up with them since the late 80s, I hear nothing but presets in Prince's music.

I don't care. It still sounds good to me. Who gives a shit?

That's like complaining about a classical album because they just keep using those same old strings sounds.

if u dont care why comment or say what prince does ??? so easy to speak against what prince do to defend somebody. u can go back on artist like john blackwell and they will say how prince might use a preset sound or something but mix it/layer it with a real instrument where u can barely tell the difference, the sounds on this new prince cd is too cheesy and immature if prince did it shame on him bhut he saying he trusted josh so well that he not even on some songs its all josh

cbarnes3121 said:

steakfinger said:

I hate to break it to you, but Prince uses presets. All the time. The damned sword shoowsh sound on '7' is straight off the Korg M-1. As someone who has used keyboards and kept up with them since the late 80s, I hear nothing but presets in Prince's music.

I don't care. It still sounds good to me. Who gives a shit?

That's like complaining about a classical album because they just keep using those same old strings sounds.

if u dont care why comment or say what prince does ??? so easy to speak against what prince do to defend somebody. u can go back on artist like john blackwell and they will say how prince might use a preset sound or something but mix it/layer it with a real instrument where u can barely tell the difference, the sounds on this new prince cd is too cheesy and immature if prince did it shame on him bhut he saying he trusted josh so well that he not even on some songs its all josh

Well, Josh has helped Prince produce his best received album in decades, so I guess we'll be hearing more of him. I certainly hope so. There's a new direction suggested by 'Way Back Home' and 'Affirmation 3' I'd love to hear explored in greater depth.

dbpdexter said:

You really think Josh had a big input on the album?Prince has had people co produce albums/songs before this isn't new.In reality Prince is producing them producing him.I think he is just giving him some shine to help him out in his career.Prince doesn't need a producer and if somebody were to ACTUALLY produce a PRINCE album then it wouldn't be a PRINCE album.

I agree. One of the 3EG girls said in a recent interview that Prince wrote all the songs for the (Plec) album. They doubtless helped with throwing ideas in and experimenting with different arrangements. She also said that he had the final say (or words to that effect). It is likely that Prince penned all the songs for AOA too, and Josh (and the other producer; I forget his name) had some input. Ultimately, Prince (in my opinion) has to have the final say in everything, at least where his music is concerned.

robertgeorgeakabob said:

Does anybody really picture a scenario where the Weltons ever said, "No Prince, let's do it like this"? Really?

Weltons : "Prince, we promise you, the kids will love it."

Prince : "Lasers and chipmunk voices?"

Weltons : "It's the future"

JudasSmile said:

dbpdexter said:

You really think Josh had a big input on the album?Prince has had people co produce albums/songs before this isn't new.In reality Prince is producing them producing him.I think he is just giving him some shine to help him out in his career.Prince doesn't need a producer and if somebody were to ACTUALLY produce a PRINCE album then it wouldn't be a PRINCE album.

I agree. One of the 3EG girls said in a recent interview that Prince wrote all the songs for the (Plec) album. They doubtless helped with throwing ideas in and experimenting with different arrangements.

Plectrum Electrum was written by Donna Grantis, originally titled "Elektra". And Anotherlove is a cover version of an Alice Smith song.

ludwig said:

JudasSmile said:

I agree. One of the 3EG girls said in a recent interview that Prince wrote all the songs for the (Plec) album. They doubtless helped with throwing ideas in and experimenting with different arrangements.

Plectrum Electrum was written by Donna Grantis, originally titled "Elektra". And Anotherlove is a cover version of an Alice Smith song.

Ahh, yes I forgot about the cover version.

novabrkr said:

Ok, let's take a few steps back here.

How exactly do you know what parts on the record Josh produced? Why are people attributing what they think is good about the record to him? The record is still mainly produced by Prince himself, as far as I can tell from the instrumentation and arrangements on the record. The "Funknroll" remix is quite different sounding from most of the other tracks and that's the only thing we know for certain was done by Josh. Many of the tracks on the record were apparently recorded ages ago, so he most likely had no input on them.

Good point! Some are really going overboard with this - claiming that Josh not only produced, but also wrote most of the song on AOA

My guess is that Josh is the resident pro tools guy, helping Prince with modern equipment and technology. You can be an excellent musician and composer, which I believe Prince still is, without knowing how to operate the lates gear.

WBH is an example of this, I think. It's very much a Prince song to my ears, but the drums and sybth loops may have been programmed by Josh. It's still a Prince song.

paulludvig said:

novabrkr said:

Ok, let's take a few steps back here.

How exactly do you know what parts on the record Josh produced? Why are people attributing what they think is good about the record to him? The record is still mainly produced by Prince himself, as far as I can tell from the instrumentation and arrangements on the record. The "Funknroll" remix is quite different sounding from most of the other tracks and that's the only thing we know for certain was done by Josh. Many of the tracks on the record were apparently recorded ages ago, so he most likely had no input on them.

Good point! Some are really going overboard with this - claiming that Josh not only produced, but also wrote most of the song on AOA

My guess is that Josh is the resident pro tools guy, helping Prince with modern equipment and technology. You can be an excellent musician and composer, which I believe Prince still is, without knowing how to operate the lates gear.

WBH is an example of this, I think. It's very much a Prince song to my ears, but the drums and sybth loops may have been programmed by Josh. It's still a Prince song.

I don't think Josh actually wrote any of the songs from scratch. Quotes from interviews have suggested that there are a couple of tracks on which he is responsible for all the instriuments and Prince isn't playing anything. Probably Funknroll and U Know is my guess. It sounds to me like he had a hand in every track to some degree.

mightycow said:

dbpdexter said: